Introduction to Political Philosophy Lecture 4 | Introduction to Political Philosophy

Chapter 1.

第一章。

Introduction [00:00:00] Professor Steven Smith: There is one person in here, I don't know who it is, and you will not know who it is yet, but there is one person in here for whom the reading of Plato's Republic will be the most important intellectual experience you have at Yale.

简介 [00:00:00] 史蒂文·史密斯教授：这里有一个人，我不知道他是谁，你也不会知道他是谁，但是这里有一个人，对他来说，阅读柏拉图的《理想国》将是你在耶鲁大学最重要的智力经历。

It is a book that one of you will go back to time and time again and it will stick with you forever.

这是一本你们中的人会一次又一次地回顾的书，它将永远伴随着您。

What I would like you to do is to remember this and four years from now, when most of you are ready to graduate, if that one person in here would email me and let me know who it is, okay?

我希望你们做的就是记住这一点以及四年后，当你们大多数人准备毕业时，如果这里的那个人能给我发电子邮件并让我知道他是谁，好吗？

Maybe it will be you.

也许会是你。

Maybe?

或许？

Possibly.

可能吧。

Or you.

或者你。

Okay.

好的。

This is the book that started it all.

这就是这本书的开始。

The Apology , the Crito , these are warm-ups to the big theme, to the big book, the Republic .

《道歉》、《克里托》，这些都是大主题、大书《理想国》的热身。

Every other book in this political science that has since been written, beginning with Aristotle's Politics and moving on to the present day is, in one way or another, an answer, a response to Plato's Republic .

从亚里士多德的《政治学》开始一直到今天，这一政治学领域的每一本其他著作都以某种方式对柏拉图的《理想国》做出了回答和回应。

It started the whole thing.

整个事情就这样开始了。

The first and most obvious thing to say about the Republic is that it is a long book.

关于《理想国》，首先要说的也是最明显的一点是，它是一本很长的书。

Not the longest book you will ever read, but long enough.

这不是你读过的最长的书，但也足够长了。

In fact, in part, because of this, we are only reading approximately half the book, the first five books, to be more specific.

事实上，部分正因为如此，我们只阅读了大约一半的书，更具体地说，是前五本书。

The first five books that deal with and culminate in the best city, Plato's ideal city, what he calls Kallipolis, the just city, the beautiful city, ruled by philosopher-kings.

前五本书讨论了最好的城市，柏拉图的理想城市，他所说的卡利波利斯，公正的城市，美丽的城市，由哲学家国王统治。

The second half of the book turns in somewhat different, certainly equally important directions, but would take us much more time than the time we have allotted to deal with.

本书的后半部分转向了有些不同、当然同样重要的方向，但会花费我们比我们分配的时间更多的时间。

So you will read that on your own.

所以你将自己阅读。

You can take another course, what have you.

你可以参加另一门课程，你有什么。

The Republic is a very perplexing book, you will find out.

《理想国》是一本非常令人费解的书，你会发现的。

Its meaning will not be evident to you on a first reading.

第一次阅读时，您不会明白它的含义。

It may not be clear to you on a tenth reading, unless you approach it with the proper questions and the proper frame of mind.

除非你以正确的问题和正确的心态来阅读第十遍，否则你可能会不清楚。

So let's start by asking a simple question.

让我们首先问一个简单的问题。

What is the Republic about?

共和国是关于什么的？

What does this book deal with?

这本书讲什么内容？

This is a question that has perplexed and divided readers of Plato almost from the beginning.

这个问题几乎从一开始就让柏拉图的读者感到困惑和分裂。

Is it a book about justice, as the subtitle of the book suggests?

正如书名所暗示的那样，这是一本关于正义的书吗？

Is it a book about what we today might call moral psychology and the right ordering of the human soul, which is a prominent theme addressed in this work?

这是一本关于我们今天所说的道德心理学和人类灵魂的正确秩序的书，这是本书所讨论的一个突出主题吗？

Is it a book about the power of poetry and myth, what we would call the whole domain of culture to shape souls and to shape our societies?

这是一本关于诗歌和神话的力量的书，我们称之为塑造灵魂和社会的整个文化领域？

Or is it a book about metaphysics and the ultimate structure of being, as certainly many of the later books of the Republic suggest?

或者它是一本关于形而上学和存在的终极结构的书，正如《共和国》后来的许多书籍所暗示的那样？

The theory of the forms, the image of the divided line and so on and so on.

形式理论、分界线意象等等。

Of course, it is about all of these things and several others as well.

当然，它涉及所有这些事情以及其他一些事情。

But at least at the beginning, when we approach the book, we should stay on its surface, not dig at least initially too deeply.

但至少在开始时，当我们接触这本书时，我们应该停留在表面上，至少一开始不要挖掘得太深。

As one of the great readers of Plato of the last century once said, "Only the surface of things reveals the essence of things." The surface of the Republic reveals that it is a dialogue.

正如上世纪柏拉图的一位伟大读者所言：“只有事物的表面才能揭示事物的本质”。 《共和国》表面上透露出这是一场对话。

It is a conversation.

这是一次对话。

We should approach the book, in other words, not as we might a treatise, but as we might approach a work of literature or drama.

换句话说，我们不应像对待一篇论文那样对待这本书，而应像对待一部文学或戏剧作品那样对待这本书。

It is a work comparable in scope to other literary masterworks-- Hamlet, Don Quixote, War and Peace , others you might think of.

这是一部在范围上可与其他文学杰作相媲美的作品——《哈姆雷特》、《堂吉诃德》、《战争与和平》以及你可能想到的其他作品。

As a conversation, as a dialogue, it is something the author wants us to join, to take part in.

作为一种对话，作为一种对话，这是作者希望我们加入、参与的事情。

We are invited to be not merely passive onlookers of this conversation, but active participants in that dialogue that takes place in this book over the course of a single evening.

我们被邀请不仅是这场对话的被动旁观者，而且是本书在一个晚上发生的对话的积极参与者。

Perhaps the best way to read this book is to read it aloud, as you might with a play, to yourself or with your friends.

也许阅读本书的最佳方式是大声朗读，就像朗读戏剧一样，给自己或与朋友一起朗读。

Let's go a little further.

让我们更进一步。

The Republic is also a utopia, a word that Plato does not use, was not coined until many, many centuries later by Sir Thomas More.

理想国也是一个乌托邦，柏拉图没有使用过这个词，直到许多世纪后托马斯·莫尔爵士才创造了这个词。

But Plato's book is a utopia.

但柏拉图的书是一个乌托邦。

It is a kind of extreme.

这是一种极端。

He presents an extreme vision of politics.

他展现了一种极端的政治视野。

He presents an extreme vision of the polis .

他呈现了城邦的极端景象。

The guiding thread of the book is the correspondence, and we will look at this in some length and you will discuss it in your sections, no doubt.

本书的主线是通信，我们将详细讨论这一点，毫无疑问，您将在您的章节中讨论它。

The guiding thread of the book is the correspondence, the symmetry between the parts of the city and the parts of the soul.

这本书的主线是城市各部分与灵魂各部分之间的对应和对称。

Discord within the city, just as discord within the soul, is regarded as the greatest evil.

城市内部的不和，正如灵魂内部的不和一样，被视为最大的罪恶。

The aim of the Republic is to establish a harmonious city, based on a conception of justice that, so to speak, harmonizes the individual and society, how to achieve that.

共和国的目标是建立一个和谐城市，其基础是正义观念，可以说，和谐个人与社会，如何实现这一目标。

The best city would necessarily be one that seeks to produce the best or highest type of individual.

最好的城市必然是一个致力于培养最好或最高类型的个人的城市。

Plato's famous answer to this is that this city--any city--will never be free of conflict, will never be free of factional strife until, in his famous formula, kings become philosophers and philosophers become kings.

柏拉图对此的著名回答是，这座城市——任何城市——永远不会摆脱冲突，永远不会摆脱派系冲突，直到按照他著名的公式，国王成为哲学家，哲学家成为国王。

The Republic asks us to consider seriously, what would a city look like ruled by philosophers?

《理想国》要求我们认真思考，一个由哲学家统治的城市会是什么样子？

In this respect, it would seem to be the sort of perfect bookend to the Apology .

从这方面来说，这似乎是《道歉》的完美书挡。

Remember, the Apology viewed the dangers posed to philosophy and the philosopher and the philosophical life from the city.

请记住，《申辩》从城市角度看待哲学、哲学家以及哲学生活所面临的危险。

The Republic asks us, what would a city be like if it were ruled by Socrates or someone like him?

《理想国》问我们，如果一座城市由苏格拉底或像他这样的人统治，会是什么样子？

What would it be like for philosophers to rule?

哲学家统治会是什么样子？

Such a city would require, so Socrates tells us throughout the opening books, the severe censorship of poetry and theology, the abolition of private property and the family, at least among the guardian class of the city, and the use of selected lies and myths, what would today probably be called ideology or propaganda, as tools of political rule.

苏格拉底在整本书中告诉我们，这样的城市需要对诗歌和神学进行严格的审查，废除私有财产和家庭（至少在城市的守护阶级中），并使用选定的谎言和神话（今天可能被称为意识形态或宣传）作为政治统治的工具。

It would seem that far from utopia, the Republic represents a radical dystopia, a satire, in some sense, of the best polity.

共和国似乎与乌托邦相去甚远，它代表着一种激进的反乌托邦，在某种意义上是对最好政体的讽刺。

In fact, much of modern political science is directed against Plato's legacy.

事实上，现代政治学的大部分内容都是针对柏拉图的遗产的。

The modern state, as we have come to understand it, is based upon the separation of civil society from governing authority.

正如我们所理解的，现代国家是建立在公民社会与统治权威分离的基础上的。

The entire domain of what we call private life separated from the state.

我们所说的私人生活的整个领域与国家分离。

But Plato's Republic recognizes no such separation or no such independence for a private sphere.

但柏拉图的《理想国》不承认私人领域存在这种分离或独立。

For this reason, Plato has often been cast as a kind of harbinger of the modern totalitarian state.

因此，柏拉图经常被视为现代极权主义国家的先驱。

A famous professor at a distant university was said to have begun his lectures on the Republic by saying, "Now we will consider Plato, the fascist." This was, in fact, the view popularized by one of the most influential books about Plato written in the last century, a book written by a Viennese émigré by the name of Karl Popper, who in the very early 1950s, right at the height of the Cold War and of course the end of the conclusion of the Second World War, wrote a book called The Open Society and Its Enemies .

据说，远方一所大学的一位著名教授在关于《理想国》的讲座开始时说道：“现在我们将考虑法西斯主义者柏拉图。”事实上，这是上个世纪关于柏拉图最有影响力的著作之一所普及的观点，这本书是由维也纳移民卡尔·波普尔（Karl Popper）写的，他在 20 世纪 50 年代初，正值冷战最激烈的时期，当然还有第二次世界大战结束时，写了一本名为《开放社会及其敌人》的书。

He wanted to know what were the causes or who was responsible for the experiences of totalitarianism, both in Stalin's Russia and in Hitler's Germany.

他想知道斯大林统治下的俄罗斯和希特勒统治下的德国的极权主义经历的原因是什么，或者是谁造成的。

In the course of this inquiry, he concluded that not only Hegel and Marx were important in that particular genealogy, but this went back to Plato as well, Plato principally.

在这一探究过程中，他得出的结论是，不仅黑格尔和马克思在这一特定谱系中很重要，而且这也可以追溯到柏拉图，主要是柏拉图。

Plato, who Popper accuses in a passionate, albeit not very well written book, accuses Plato of being the first to establish a kind of totalitarian dictatorship.

波普尔在一本热情洋溢、虽然写得不是很好的书中指责柏拉图，指责柏拉图是第一个建立极权主义独裁统治的人。

Is that true?

这是真的吗？

Plato's Republic is, we will discover as you read, a republic of a very special kind.

当你阅读时，我们会发现柏拉图的《理想国》是一个非常特殊的理想国。

It is not a regime like ours devoted to maximizing individual liberties, but it is one that puts the education of its citizens, the education of its members, as its highest duty.

它不是一个像我们这样致力于最大化个人自由的政权，而是一个将公民教育、成员教育作为其最高职责的政权。

The Republic , like the Greek polis , was a kind of tutelary association.

共和国，就像希腊城邦一样，是一种监护协会。

Its principal good, its principal goal, was the education of citizens for positions of public leadership and high political responsibilities.

它的主要利益和主要目标是教育公民担任公共领导职位和承担高级政治责任。

It is always worthwhile to remember that Plato was, above all, a teacher.

永远值得记住的是，柏拉图首先是一位老师。

He was the founder of the first university, the Academy, the Platonic Academy, where we will find out later Aristotle came to study, among many others--Aristotle being but the most famous.

他是第一所大学——柏拉图学院——柏拉图学院的创始人，后来我们会发现亚里士多德也曾到那里学习——亚里士多德只是其中最著名的一个。

Plato was the founder of this school.

柏拉图是这个学派的创始人。

This, in turn, spawned other philosophical schools throughout the Greek world and later, the Roman world.

这反过来又在整个希腊世界以及后来的罗马世界催生了其他哲学流派。

With the demise of Rome, in the early Christian centuries, these philosophical academies, these philosophical schools, were absorbed into the medieval monasteries.

随着罗马的灭亡，在早期的基督教世纪中，这些哲学学院，这些哲学流派，被吸收到中世纪的修道院中。

These, in turn, became the basis of the first European universities in places like Bologna, Paris, Oxford.

这些反过来又成为博洛尼亚、巴黎、牛津等地第一批欧洲大学的基础。

These were, in turn, later transplanted to the New World and established in towns like Cambridge and, of course, New Haven.

这些后来又被移植到新世界，并在剑桥等城镇建立，当然还有纽黑文。

We can say today that this university is a direct ancestor of the platonic republic of Plato's Academy.

今天我们可以说，这所大学是柏拉图学院柏拉图共和国的直接祖先。

We are all here the heirs of Plato.

我们都是柏拉图的继承人。

Think of that.

想想看。

Without Plato, no Yale.

没有柏拉图，就没有耶鲁。

We would not be here today.

我们今天不会在这里。

I think that is a fact.

我认为这是事实。

Just ponder that for a moment.

请思考一下。

In fact, let me even say a little more about this.

事实上，让我再多说一点。

The institutional and educational requirements of Plato's Republic share many features with a place like Yale.

柏拉图理想国的制度和教育要求与耶鲁这样的地方有许多共同之处。

For example, in both the Platonic Kallipolis, the just city, as well as this place, men and women--men and women--are selected at a relatively early age because of their capacities for leadership, for courage, for self-discipline, and responsibility.

例如，在柏拉图式的卡利波利斯这座正义之城以及这个地方，男人和女人——男人和女人——在相对较早的时候就被选中，因为他们具有领导能力、勇气、自律和责任感。

They spend several years living together, eating together in common mess halls, exercising together, and studying together, of course, far from the oversight of their parents.

他们一起生活了好几年，一起在公共食堂吃饭，一起锻炼，一起学习，当然，远离父母的监督。

The best of them are winnowed out to pursue further study and eventually assume positions of public leadership and responsibility.

他们中最优秀的人被筛选出来继续深造，并最终担任公共领导和责任职位。

Throughout all of this, they are subjected to a course of rigorous study and physical training that will lead them to adopt prominent positions in the military and other branches of public service.

在整个过程中，他们接受严格的学习和体能训练，这将使他们在军队和其他公共服务部门担任重要职务。

Does this sound at all familiar to you?

这听起来很熟悉吗？

It should.

它应该。

Let me put it another way.

让我换一种说法。

If Plato is a fascist, what does that make you?

如果柏拉图是法西斯主义者，那你又是什么？

Plato, of course, is an extremist.

柏拉图当然是一个极端主义者。

He pushes his ideas to their most radical conclusions.

他把他的想法推向了最激进的结论。

That's what it is to be a philosopher.

这就是成为一名哲学家的意义。

But he is also defining a kind of school.

但他也在定义一种学校。

He regards the Politea or the Republic , because that is the original Greek title of the book, Politea or regime.

他提到了《Politea》或《共和国》，因为这是这本书的希腊原文标题“Politea”或“政权”。

He regards the politea as a school whose chief goal is preparation for guidance and leadership of a community.

他认为波利迪亚学校的主要目标是为社区的指导和领导做好准备。

If you don't believe me about this, maybe you will consider the words of Jean-Jacques Rousseau, one of the great readers of Plato's Republic .

如果你不相信我的话，也许你会考虑一下柏拉图《理想国》的伟大读者之一让·雅克·卢梭的话。

Rousseau wrote in his Emile , "To get a good idea of public education," he says, "read Plato's Republic .

卢梭在他的《爱弥儿》中写道，“要更好地了解公共教育，”他说，“阅读柏拉图的《理想国》。

It is not a political treatise, as those who merely judge books by their title think, but it is the finest, most beautiful work on education ever written." Rousseau.

这不是一篇政治论文，正如那些只根据书名来判断书籍的人所认为的那样，但它是有史以来最优秀、最美丽的教育著作。”卢梭。

So, there we go.

那么，我们开始吧。

Let's now peek into the book itself.

现在让我们来看看这本书本身。

Just peek.

只是看一眼。

We won't go too far.

我们不会走得太远。

Let's start with the first line.

让我们从第一行开始。

Who remembers what the first line is?

谁记得第一行是什么？

Oh, come on.

哦，来吧。

You should know this.

你应该知道这一点。

You're looking at the book.

你正在看书。

You're cheating.

你在作弊。

"I went down to the Piraeus." I went down to the Piraeus.

“我去了比雷埃夫斯港。”我去了比雷埃夫斯港。

Why does Plato begin with this line?

柏拉图为何以这句话开头？

There's a story that I heard.

我听说过一个故事。

I'm not sure if it's altogether true, but it's a good story, at least, about the famous German philosopher Martin Heidegger, who said that on his first teaching of the Republic , he went through the whole book, taught the whole book in one seminar, one semester.

我不确定这是否完全正确，但至少这是一个关于著名德国哲学家马丁·海德格尔的好故事，他说，在他第一次讲授《理想国》时，他通读了整本书，在一个学期的一次研讨会上讲授了整本书。

The last time he taught it, the final time he taught it, he never got beyond the first sentence, "I went down to the Piraeus." What does it mean?

上次他教它时，最后一次他教它时，他从来没有超出第一句话：“我去了比雷埃夫斯港。”这是什么意思？

Why does he begin with this?

他为什么要从这个开始呢？

"I went down," a going down.

“我跌倒了”，跌倒了。

The Greek word for this is catabasis .

希腊语中的这个词是“catabasis”。

"I had made a descent."

“我已经下降了。”

There is a book by a famous contemporary to Plato.

有一本与柏拉图同时代的著名人物写的书。

It's a man named Xenophon, who wrote a book called the Anabasis .

这是一个名叫色诺芬的人，他写了一本叫做《远征记》的书。

The anabasis means a going up, an ascent.

anabasis 的意思是上升、上升。

But Plato begins this dialogue with this stigma.

但柏拉图以这种耻辱开始了这段对话。

"I went down." The descent to the Piraeus.

“我下去了。”下降到比雷埃夫斯港。

It is clearly modeled on Odysseus' descent to Hades in the Odyssey .

它显然是按照《奥德赛》中奥德修斯下降到哈迪斯的。

In fact, the work is a kind of philosophical odyssey that both imitates Homer, but also anticipates other great odysseys of the human mind, works by those like Cervantes or Joyce.

事实上，这部作品是一种哲学奥德赛，既模仿了荷马，又预示了塞万提斯或乔伊斯等人的其他人类思想的伟大奥德赛。

The book is full, you will see, of a number of descents and ascents.

你会发现，这本书充满了许多下降和上升的内容。

The most famous climb upward, although we will not actually read these parts for this class, concerns the climb to the divided line, the famous image of the divided line in Book VI, and the ascent to the world of the imperishable forms.

最著名的攀登，虽然我们不会在这堂课上真正阅读这些部分，但涉及攀登分界线，第六卷中著名的分界线图像，以及上升到不朽形式的世界。

Then, in the last book of the Republic , Book X, there is, once again, a descent to the underworld, to the world of Hades.

然后，在《共和国》的最后一本书《第十卷》中，再次降临到地下世界，地狱的世界。

The work is not, in a sense, written simply as a sort of timeless philosophical treatise, but as a dramatic dialogue with a setting, a cast of characters and a firm location in time and place.

从某种意义上说，这部作品并不是简单地作为一种永恒的哲学论文而写，而是作为与背景、人物阵容和固定时空地点的戏剧性对话。

Let's say a little more about that time and place already indicated in the sentence, "I went down to the Piraeus." Plato was born in 427, which is four years after the commencement of the Peloponnesian War.

让我们多说一点“我去了比雷埃夫斯”这句话中已经表明的时间和地点。柏拉图出生于 427 年，即伯罗奔尼撒战争爆发四年后。

He was a young man of 23 when the democracy in Athens was defeated.

当雅典的民主制度被击败时，他才 23 岁。

He was only 28 when the restored democracy executed his friend and teacher, Socrates, in 399.

公元 399 年，恢复的民主政体处决了他的朋友兼老师苏格拉底时，他年仅 28 岁。

Almost immediately after the trial of Socrates, Plato left Athens and traveled extensively throughout the Greek world.

苏格拉底受审之后，柏拉图几乎立即离开雅典，周游希腊世界。

Upon his return, he established this school at Athens he called the Academy, for the training of philosophers, statesmen, and legislators.

返回后，他在雅典建立了这所学校，他称之为学院，用于培训哲学家、政治家和立法者。

Plato lived a long time.

柏拉图活了很长一段时间。

He lived until the age of 80.

他活到了80岁。

Except for two expeditions to Sicily, where he went at the request of Dionysius to help try to establish a philosophical kingship in Syracuse, he remained in Athens teaching and writing.

除了两次远征西西里岛（他应狄奥尼修斯的请求前往西西里岛，试图帮助在锡拉丘兹建立哲学王权）之外，他一直留在雅典教学和写作。

The Republic belongs to that period of Plato's work after his return to Athens, after the execution of Socrates.

《理想国》属于柏拉图在苏格拉底被处决之后返回雅典之后的著作时期。

The dominant feature of Plato's political theory, David Grene, a great reader of Plato, has said is "the root and branch character of the change it advocates and existing institutions." Plato's desire for a kind of radical makeover, of Athenian and Greek political institutions and cultures, grew out of his experience of political defeat and despair.

柏拉图的忠实读者戴维·格伦（David Grene）曾说过，柏拉图政治理论的主要特征是“它所倡导的变革和现有制度的根本和分支特征”。柏拉图对雅典和希腊政治制度和文化进行彻底改造的愿望源于他政治失败和绝望的经历。

The utopianism of the book is, in many ways, the reverse side of the sense of profound disillusionment that he felt at the actual experience of the Athenian polis .

这本书的乌托邦主义在很多方面都是他在雅典城邦的实际经历中所感受到的深刻幻灭感的反面。

This was not only true of his experience at home, but of his failed efforts to turn Dionysius' kingship in Sicily into a successful example of philosophical rule.

这不仅适用于他在国内的经历，也适用于他将狄奥尼修斯在西西里岛的王权转变为哲学统治的成功范例的失败努力。

In fact, we have--and I want to read to you in just a moment--a lengthy transcript of Plato's own account of why he came to write the Republic .

事实上，我们有——我想马上读给你们听——柏拉图自己关于他为什么要写《理想国》的叙述的长篇记录。

One thing, of course, you note in the Republic , is that Plato is nowhere present.

当然，你在《理想国》中注意到的一件事是，柏拉图根本不存在。

He is not a participant in his own dialogue.

他不是自己对话的参与者。

He is the author, but not the participant.

他是作者，但不是参与者。

We don't know precisely what Plato thought, but we are helped, at least, by a kind of intellectual autobiography that he wrote and that we still have, in what is conventionally referred to as The Seventh Letter.

我们并不确切地知道柏拉图的想法，但至少，我们得到了他所写的一种知识分子自传的帮助，而我们仍然拥有这种自传，即通常所说的《第七封信》。

Plato wrote a series of letters that we have.

柏拉图写了一系列我们现在拥有的信件。

People have argued over the authenticity of them, although I think by now it is established that they are his.

人们对它们的真实性争论不休，尽管我认为现在已经确定它们是他的。

In the most famous of these letters, the lengthy seventh one, he gives us, again, something of an autobiography and tells us a little bit about why he came to write this book.

在这些信中最著名的一封，即冗长的第七封信中，他再次给我们提供了一本自传，并告诉我们一些关于他为什么要写这本书的信息。

Isn't this amazing that 2,000-2,500 years ago, we still have the letters of the man who wrote this book?

2000-2500 年前，我们仍然保存着写这本书的人的信件，这不是很神奇吗？

Let me read to you what Plato says about how he came to write this book.

让我给你们读一下柏拉图所说的他是如何写这本书的。

"When I was a young man," he said--and this is written as he is very old.

“当我还是个年轻人的时候，”他说——这是因为他已经很老了而写下的。

"When I was a young man, I felt as yet many young men do.

“当我还是个年轻人的时候，我和很多年轻人一样有这种感觉。

I felt at the very moment I attained my majority I should engage in public affairs.

我觉得在我成年的那一刻我就应该参与公共事务。

And there came my way an opportunity that I want to tell you about.

我想告诉你一个机会。

The democratic constitution, then loudly decried by many people, was abolished.

当时受到许多人强烈谴责的民主宪法被废除。

And the leaders of the revolution set themselves up as a government of 30 men with supreme authority."

革命领导人建立了一个由 30 人组成的拥有最高权力的政府。”

He's referring to the Tyranny of the Thirty that existed after the Athenian defeat.

他指的是雅典战败后存在的三十人暴政。

"Some of these men [some of the members of the Thirty], you must understand, were relatives of mine and well known to me.

“你必须明白，这些人中的一些人（三十人组的一些成员）是我的亲戚，而且我很熟悉。

And what is more, they actually invited me at once to join them, as though politics and I were a fit match.

更重要的是，他们竟然立刻邀请我加入他们，好像我和政治很般配一样。

I was very young then and it is not surprising that I felt as I did.

那时我还很年轻，我有这样的感觉并不奇怪。

I thought that the city was then living a kind of life which was unjust and that they would bend it to a just one and so administer it more justly.

我认为这座城市当时过着一种不公正的生活，他们会将其转变为公正的生活，从而更加公正地管理它。

So I eagerly watched to see what they would do.

所以我急切地观察着他们会做什么。

And you must know, as I looked on, I saw those men in a short time make the former democracy look like a golden age."

你一定知道，正如我所看到的，我看到那些人在短时间内让前民主国家看起来像一个黄金时代。”

He is referring to his relatives, men like Critias and Charmides, who turned Athenian politics into a tyranny and, which he says, makes the "democracy look like a golden age." Let me continue in Plato's words.

他指的是他的亲戚，像克里蒂亚斯和查米德斯这样的人，他们将雅典政治变成了暴政，他说，这让“民主看起来像一个黄金时代”。让我继续用柏拉图的话来说。

"I looked at this, you see, and at the men who were in politics, at the laws and customs.

“你看，我观察了这个，观察了政治人物、法律和习俗。

And the more I looked and the older I grew, the more difficult it seemed to me to administer political affairs justly.

我看得越多，年纪越大，我觉得公正地管理政治事务就越困难。

For you cannot do so without friends and comrades you can trust.

因为如果没有可以信任的朋友和同志，你就无法做到这一点。

In such men it was not easy to find.

在这样的人身上很难找到。

For the city, you see, no longer lived in the fashion and ways of our fathers.

你看，这座城市不再以我们父辈的时尚和方式生活。

Eager as I had once been to go into politics, as I look at these things and saw everything taking any course at all with no direction or management, I ended up feeling dizzy.

尽管我曾经渴望从政，但当我看到这些事情时，看到一切都在毫无方向、没有管理的情况下，我最终感到头晕。

I did not abandon my interest in politics to discover how it might be bettered in other respects, and I was perpetually awaiting my opportunity.

我并没有放弃对政治的兴趣去探索如何在其他方面改进它，而且我一直在等待机会。

But at last, I saw that as far as all states now existing are concerned, they are all badly governed.

但最后我发现，就现在所有的国家而言，它们都是治理不善的。

For the condition of their laws is bad almost past cure, except for some miraculous accident.

因为他们的法律状况糟糕得几乎无法治愈，除非有一些奇迹般的事故。

So I was compelled to say, in praising true philosophy, that it was from it alone that was able to discern any justice.

因此，在赞扬真正的哲学时，我不得不说，只有从哲学中才能辨别出任何正义。

And so I said that the nations of the world will never cease from trouble until either the true breed of philosophers shall come to political office or until that of the rulers shall, by some divine law, take the pursuit of philosophy."

所以我说，世界各国将永远不会停止烦恼，直到真正的哲学家获得政治职位，或者直到统治者根据某种神圣的法则开始追求哲学。”

There you see in that wonderful and a kind of probing self-examination of his early motives and expectations, you see the disillusionment of the older Plato looking on what the Tyranny had done.

在那里，你可以看到他对早期动机和期望的奇妙和探索性的自我审视，你可以看到年长的柏拉图在看待暴政所做的事情时的幻灭。

But also looking at the states, the nations of his time, seeing their management, seeing their decay and conflict and saying and suggesting that no justice will ever be expected until, as he says at the end, kings become philosophers and philosophers kings, a direct reference to the Republic .

但也要看看他那个时代的国家和民族，看看他们的管理，看到他们的衰败和冲突，并表示并暗示，除非国王成为哲学家，哲学家成为国王，否则永远不会有正义，正如他最后所说，这直接指的是共和国。

This little autobiography, goes on at considerably greater length, I should say.

我应该说，这本小自传的篇幅要长得多。

But this provides a kind of introduction, as it were, to the Republic .

但这可以说是对共和国的一种介绍。

We have in Plato's own words here, the way he viewed politics and his reasons for his political philosophy.

我们在这里用柏拉图自己的话说，他看待政治的方式以及他的政治哲学的理由。

Yet, in many respects, if the Republic was the result of comprehensive despair and disillusionment with the prospects of reform, the dialogue itself points back to an earlier moment in Plato's life and the life of the city of Athens.

然而，在许多方面，如果《理想国》是对改革前景全面绝望和幻灭的结果，那么对话本身就指向了柏拉图生活和雅典城生活的早期时刻。

This remarkable letter was written when Plato was very old, approximately 50 years after the trial and execution of Socrates.

这封非凡的信是在柏拉图年事已高的时候写下的，即苏格拉底受审和处决大约 50 年后。

But the action of the Republic takes place long before the defeat of Athens, before the rise of the Thirty and the execution of Athens [correction: should have said Socrates].

但共和国的行动早在雅典被击败之前就发生了，早在三十人的崛起和雅典的处决之前[更正：应该是苏格拉底说的]。

It refers to that period that Plato says in the letter looked like "a golden age, when many things seemed possible." That brings us back to the opening, the descent to the Piraeus.

它指的是柏拉图在信中所说的那个看起来像“黄金时代，许多事情似乎都是可能的”时期。这让我们回到开头，下降到比雷埃夫斯港。

The action of the dialogue begins at the Piraeus, the port city of Athens, somewhere around the year 411, during what was called the Peace of Nicias, that is to say, the peace that endured a kind of respite, truce that was established during the fighting between Sparta and Athens.

对话的行动始于公元 411 年左右的雅典港口城市比雷埃夫斯，当时称为《尼西亚斯和约》，也就是说，在斯巴达和雅典之间的战斗期间建立了某种喘息和休战的和平。

At the very beginning of the dialogue, we see Socrates and his friend Glaucon.

在对话的一开始，我们看到了苏格拉底和他的朋友格劳孔。

What are they doing?

他们在做什么？

What are they doing?

他们在做什么？

Do you remember?

你是否记得？

What are they doing at the very beginning?

他们一开始在做什么？

Professor Steven Smith: Right.

史蒂文·史密斯教授：对。

Let me put it a slightly--yes, they are walking back to Athens from the Piraeus.

让我稍微说一下——是的，他们正在从比雷埃夫斯步行回雅典。

But maybe to put it a slightly different way, they're trolling the waterfront.

但也许换个稍微不同的方式来说，他们是在海滨闲逛。

What is the Piraeus?

什么是比雷埃夫斯港？

It is the harbor of Athens.

这是雅典的港口。

What do you expect from harbors?

您对港口有何期望？

What are harbor cities like?

港口城市是什么样的？

What do you find down at harbors?

你在港口发现了什么？

Professor Steven Smith: Water, yeah.

史蒂文·史密斯教授：水，是的。

They're seedy, aren't they?

他们很肮脏，不是吗？

You find various kinds of disreputable and maybe unseemly things going on there.

你会发现那里发生了各种声名狼藉甚至不体面的事情。

We are forced to ask ourselves: What are Socrates and Glaucon doing there?

我们不得不问自己：苏格拉底和格劳孔在那里做什么？

Why are they there together?

他们为什么在一起？

What are they doing?

他们在做什么？

What do they expect to find?

他们期望找到什么？

These seem to be questions that immediately come to mind.

这些似乎是立即浮现在脑海中的问题。

We learn shortly afterwards that they have taken this descent to the Piraeus to view a festival, a kind of carnival.

不久之后我们得知，他们下降到比雷埃夫斯港是为了观看一个节日，一种狂欢节。

It sounds like something one might expect to see in a Fellini film.

这听起来像是人们期望在费里尼的电影中看到的东西。

A kind of carnival, a carnivale , a Mardi Gras, where a festival is going on.

一种狂欢节，狂欢节，狂欢节，正在举行节日。

What's more, a new goddess is being introduced into the pantheon of deities.

更重要的是，一位新的女神正在被引入众神万神殿中。

This seems to suggest that--referring back to the Apology , that it is not Socrates, but the Athenians who innovate, who create and introduce new deities.

这似乎表明——回到《申辩》，创新的不是苏格拉底，而是雅典人，他们创造并引入了新的神灵。

Socrates remarks that the Thracians, the display of the Thracians, put on a good show, showing that his own perspective is not simply bound by that of a city.

苏格拉底评论说，色雷斯人，色雷斯人的展示，上演了一场精彩的表演，表明他自己的观点不仅仅局限于一座城市的观点。

It suggests, from the beginning, a kind of loftiness and impartiality of perspective characteristic of the philosopher, but not necessarily the citizen.

它从一开始就暗示着一种哲学家所特有的崇高和公正的观点，但不一定是公民的特征。

On their way back from this festival, from this carnival, on their way back they're accosted, you remember.

你记得，在他们从这个节日、这个狂欢节回来的路上，在他们回来的路上，他们被搭讪。

They're accosted by a slave who's been sent on by Polemarchus and his friends and who orders Socrates and Glaucon to wait.

波勒马库斯和他的朋友派来的一名奴隶向他们搭话，并命令苏格拉底和格劳孔等待。

"Polemarchus orders you to wait," the slave says.

“波勒马库斯命令你等待，”奴隶说道。

He orders you to wait.

他命令你等待。

He is coming up behind you.

他正来到你身后。

Just wait.

等等。

"Of course we'll wait," Glaucon replies.

“我们当然会等，”格劳孔回答道。

When Polemarchus and his friends arrive, we find that his friends include Adeimantus, who is Glaucon's brother and Niceratus, who is the son of Nicias, the general who has just brokered the peace that they are now enjoying.

当波勒马库斯和他的朋友到达时，我们发现他的朋友包括格劳孔的兄弟阿德曼图斯和尼西亚斯的儿子尼克拉图斯，尼西亚斯将军刚刚促成了他们现在享受的和平。

That's the famous Peace of Nicias.

这就是著名的尼西亚斯和平。

They challenge Socrates.

他们挑战苏格拉底。

"Stay with us or prove stronger." Stay with us or prove stronger.

“留在我们身边，或者证明自己更强大。”留在我们身边或证明自己更强大。

"Could we not persuade you?" Socrates asked.

“我们就不能说服你吗？”苏格拉底问道。

"Could we not persuade you to let us go?" "Not if we won't listen," Polemarchus says.

“我们就不能劝你放我们走吗？” “如果我们不听的话就不会，”波勒马库斯说。

Instead, they reach a compromise.

相反，他们达成了妥协。

But Socrates and Glaucon come with Polemarchus and the others to the home of Polemarchus' father, where dinner will be provided for them, and later, a return to the festival where there will be a horseback race.

但苏格拉底和格劳孔与波勒马库斯和其他人一起来到波勒马库斯父亲的家，在那里为他们提供晚餐，然后返回节日，在那里举行赛马比赛。

"It seems," Glaucon says, "we must stay." And Socrates concurs.

“看来，”格劳孔说，“我们必须留下来。”苏格拉底也同意这一点。

Why does the book begin with this, let's say, opening gambit?

为什么这本书要以此开场？

Is it simply a ruse to get the reader's attention in some sense or to rope you in with some promise of what's to follow?

从某种意义上来说，这仅仅是为了吸引读者的注意力，还是为了让你对接下来的内容做出一些承诺？

Already from the very opening lines we see in this a clue to the theme that is going to follow.

从一开始我们就已经看到了接下来主题的线索。

Who has the title to rule?

谁有统治权？

Is it Polemarchus and his friends who claim to rule by strength of numbers?

是波勒马库斯和他的朋友们声称以人数优势进行统治吗？

"Can we persuade you?" "Not if we don't listen," he says.

“我们能说服你吗？” “如果我们不听，就不会，”他说。

Or Socrates and Glaucon, who hope to rule by the powers of reason, speech, and argument?

或者苏格拉底和格劳孔，他们希望通过理性、言语和辩论的力量来统治？

Can we convince you?

我们能说服你吗？

Can we persuade you?

我们能说服你吗？

Can democracy that expresses the will of the majority, the will of the greater number be rendered compatible with the needs of philosophy and the claims to respect only reason and a better argument?

表达大多数人意志、更多人意志的民主能否与哲学的需要以及只尊重理性和更好的论证的主张相一致？

That seems to be the question already posed in this opening scene.

这似乎是开头场景中已经提出的问题。

Can a compromise be reached between the two?

两者之间能否达成妥协？

Can the strength of numbers, as well as respect for reason and a better argument be, in some sense, harmonized?

在某种意义上，数字的力量、对理性的尊重和更好的论据能否协调一致？

Can they be brought together?

他们可以聚集在一起吗？

Is the just city, perhaps, that Socrates will later consider, a combination of these two--of both force and persuasion?

苏格拉底后来考虑的正义之城也许是这两者的结合——武力和说服力的结合？

That will be something left to see.

这将是有待观察的事情。

But I think you can see the big themes of the book already very present in the opening scene of the dialogue.

但我认为你可以在对话的开头场景中看到这本书的大主题。

The first book is really a kind of preamble to everything that follows.

第一本书实际上是后续所有内容的序言。

Okay?

好的？

Are you with me so far on this?

到目前为止你同意我的观点吗？

Let's talk a little bit about the participants in this dialogue.

我们来谈谈这次对话的参与者。

It is a dialogue.

这是一场对话。

It has a fairly large number of characters, although only a relatively few number of them speak in the book.

它的人物数量相当多，尽管书中说话的人相对较少。

Yet, it's something very important, as we would want to know in any play or novel or movie.

然而，这是非常重要的，正如我们在任何戏剧、小说或电影中都想知道的那样。

We want to note something about the particular people who inhabit this dinner party that Socrates and Glaucon have been promised.

我们想指出一些关于参加苏格拉底和格劳孔所承诺的晚宴的特定人物的事情。

Who are they and what do they represent?

他们是谁？他们代表什么？

There is Cephalus, who we will see very quickly, the father of Polemarchus and whose home they are attending.

我们很快就会见到克法洛斯，他是波勒马科斯的父亲，他们现在正在他家中。

The venerable paterfamilias , the venerable father of the family.

德高望重的家长，德高望重的父亲。

Polemarchus, his son, a solid patriot who defends not only his father's honor, but that of his friends and fellow citizens.

他的儿子波勒马库斯是一位坚定的爱国者，不仅捍卫他父亲的荣誉，而且捍卫他的朋友和同胞的荣誉。

We will also see Thrasymachus, a cynical intellectual who rivals Socrates as an educator of future leaders and statesmen.

我们还将看到色拉叙马科斯，一位愤世嫉俗的知识分子，他是未来领导人和政治家的教育家，可与苏格拉底相媲美。

Of course, it is the exchange between Socrates and Thrasymachus that is one of the most famous moments of the book.

当然，苏格拉底和色拉叙马霍斯之间的交流是书中最著名的时刻之一。

There is, in the first set of dialogues, a distinct hierarchy of characters, you might say, who we see later on express those distinctive features of the soul and the city.

你可能会说，在第一组对话中，人物有着明显的层次结构，我们稍后会看到他们表达了灵魂和城市的独特特征。

Cephalus, we learn, has spent his life in the acquisitive arts.

我们得知，克法勒斯一生都在追求艺术。

That is to say, he's a businessman.

也就是说，他是一个商人。

He's been concerned with satisfying the needs of his body and making money.

他一直关心满足身体的需要和赚钱。

He represents what will later be called in the Republic the appetitive part of the soul, the appetites.

他代表了后来在共和国中被称为灵魂的欲望部分，即欲望。

Polemarchus, whose name actually means "warlord." Think of that.

Polemarchus，其名字的实际意思是“军阀”。想想看。

The warlord is preoccupied with questions of honor and loyalty.

军阀全神贯注于荣誉和忠诚问题。

He tells us, to get a little bit ahead of ourselves, that justice is helping your friends and harming your enemies.

他告诉我们，稍微超前一点，正义就是帮助你的朋友，伤害​​你的敌人。

He seems to represent what Plato or Socrates will later call the spirited part of the soul, something that we want to return to.

他似乎代表了柏拉图或苏格拉底后来所说的灵魂的精神部分，这是我们想要回归的东西。

Thrasymachus, a visiting sophist, seeks to teach and educate, anticipating what the Republic will call the rational soul, the rational part of the soul.

特拉西马科斯是一位来访的诡辩家，他致力于教学和教育，并预见到共和国将称之为理性灵魂，即灵魂的理性部分。

Each of these figures, in many ways, prefigure the relatively superior natures of those who come later in the dialogue.

这些人物中的每一个都在很多方面预示了对话中后来出现的人的相对优越的本性。

The two brothers, Glaucon and Adeimantus, whose exchange with Socrates occupies, for the most part, the rest of the dialogue from Book Two onward, the two brothers who, incidentally, are the brothers of Plato.

格劳孔和阿德曼图斯两兄弟与苏格拉底的交流占据了第二卷以后其余对话的大部分内容，顺便说一句，这两兄弟也是柏拉图的兄弟。

I should say, to my knowledge, we know nothing more about Glaucon and Adeimantus from history, but Plato put them into his dialogue.

我应该说，据我所知，我们从历史上对格劳孔和阿德曼图斯一无所知，但柏拉图把他们写进了他的对话录中。

They will always be remembered as the two brothers in the dialogue.

他们作为对话中的两兄弟将永远被人们铭记。

Again, they seem to represent something quite different.

同样，它们似乎代表着完全不同的东西。

Bear this in mind as you are reading the book, because it is easy to kind of forget who's talking and what they represent.

在阅读本书时请记住这一点，因为很容易忘记谁在说话以及他们代表什么。

Adeimantus is, we will find, the kind of hedonistic and pleasure-seeking brother.

我们会发现，阿德曼图斯是那种享乐主义、追求享乐的兄弟。

Glaucon, whose name means something like "gleaming", "shining," is the fierce and war-like of the two brothers.

格劳孔（Glaucon）这个名字的意思是“闪闪发光”、“闪亮”，是两兄弟凶猛好战的象征。

Of course, there is the philosophically-minded Socrates.

当然，还有有哲学头脑的苏格拉底。

Again, each of them seems to represent, in a superior way, the key components of the human soul, the appetitive, the war-like or spirited, and the rational.

同样，它们中的每一个似乎都以一种更优越的方式代表了人类灵魂的关键组成部分：欲望、好战或精神以及理性。

Together, these figures form a kind of microcosm of humanity.

这些人物共同构成了人性的缩影。

Each of the participants in the dialogue represents one of the specific classes or groups that will eventually occupy the just city to which Plato or Socrates gives the name Kallipolis, the beautiful city.

对话中的每个参与者都代表了特定的阶级或群体之一，他们最终将占据这座正义的城市，柏拉图或苏格拉底将其命名为卡利波利斯，这座美丽的城市。

Alright?

好吧？

In the five minutes or so that remain, let's just talk for a moment about the first conversation with the head of the family, Cephalus.

在剩下的五分钟左右的时间里，我们先来谈谈与族长克法勒斯的第一次谈话。

We don't need to look at this at great length.

我们不需要详细地研究这个问题。

You can, I'm sure in your sections, you might want to talk about the arguments a little more specifically that are used in these first three sets of conversations between Cephalus, Polemarchus, and Thrasymachus.

我确信在你的章节中，你可能想更具体地讨论克法洛斯、波勒马科斯和色拉西马科斯之间前三组对话中使用的论点。

The question, more importantly-- the question, I don't know that it's more importantly, but the question that I want us to examine a little bit here in the time remaining is what, again, these characters represent.

更重要的是，这个问题，我不知道哪个更重要，但我希望我们在剩下的时间里稍微研究一下这些字符代表什么。

Cephalus, as his name implies, Cephalus.

Cephalus，顾名思义，Cephalus。

What does that mean?

这意味着什么？

Do you know?

你知道吗？

Head, yes, Cephalus, head, the head of the household, but also clearly the claims of age, of tradition, of family.

头，是的，Cephalus，头，一家之主，但也清楚地表明了年龄、传统和家庭的主张。

At the beginning of the dialogue when Polemarchus brought his friends back to the house, we see the aged father, Cephalus.

对话一开始，当波勒马库斯带着他的朋友们回到家时，我们看到了年迈的父亲克法洛斯。

He is just returning from prayer.

他刚从祷告中回来。

He has just returned from performing certain acts of ritual sacrifice.

他刚刚完成某些祭祀活动回来。

He greets Socrates, in many ways, as a long, lost friend.

在很多方面，他都将苏格拉底视为一位久违的朋友。

Perhaps you have had this experience yourself, always a slightly uncomfortable one.

也许你自己也有过这样的经历，总是有点不舒服。

When you bring a group of your friends back to your house, you're expecting to have a good time, and your grandparent is there and says, "Oh, it's so good to see a bunch of young people.

当你带着一群朋友回到你家时，你期待着度过一段愉快的时光，而你的祖父母在那里说：“哦，很高兴看到一群年轻人。

I want to talk with you." It's always a slightly uncomfortable moment, you might say.

我想和你谈谈。”你可能会说，这总是一个有点不舒服的时刻。

We all have experienced this kind of thing.

我们都经历过这样的事情。

Everybody knows it from either end.

每个人都知道这一点。

I'm not a grandparent, thank god.

感谢上帝，我不是祖父母。

But I feel the same thing often when my son brings his friends, maybe that I've known for a long time.

但当我儿子带他的朋友来时，我经常有同样的感觉，也许我已经知道很长时间了。

"Oh, how are you doing?" and they want to get away.

“哦，你怎么样？”他们想要逃脱。

Socrates does something rather abrupt.

苏格拉底做了一件相当突然的事。

"Tell me, Cephalus, what's it like to be so old?" "What is it like to be like you?" "Do you still feel the need for sex?" Can you imagine saying that to someone's grandfather?

“告诉我，克法勒斯，这么老了感觉如何？” “像你一样是什么感觉？” “你还觉得需要性吗？”你能想象对某人的祖父说这句话吗？

It gives you a little idea of the character of Socrates.

它让您对苏格拉底的性格有一些了解。

Cephalus is so happy.

塞法拉斯真是太高兴了。

"Oh, thank god I'm past that," he says.

“哦，感谢上帝，我已经过去了，”他说。

"Thank god I no longer feel this erotic desire.

“感谢上帝，我不再感受到这种色情欲望。

At my old age, I can spend my time--" "When I was a young man, that's all I did.

当我年老时，我可以度过我的时光——” “当我年轻的时候，我就这么做了。

I was thinking about sex all the time and when I wasn't thinking about that, I was making money.

我一直在考虑性，当我不考虑这个的时候，我就在赚钱。

But now I've had my fill of both and I can spend my later years, the twilight of my life, turning to the things about the gods, performing sacrifices commanded by the gods."

但现在我已经两样都满足了，我可以在晚年、晚年的时候，转向有关神的事情，进行神所吩咐的祭祀。”

Why does Plato begin this way?

柏拉图为什么要这样开始呢？

Well, Cephalus is, as should be clear, the very embodiment of the conventional, in both senses of that term.

嗯，应该清楚的是，从该术语的两种意义上来说，Cephalus 都是传统的体现。

He's not a bad man, by any means.

无论如何，他都不是一个坏人。

But he is a thoroughly unreflective one.

但他是一个完全不反思的人。

In attacking Cephalus as he does, Socrates attacks the embodiment of conventional opinion, the Nomos supporting the city.

在攻击克法洛斯时，苏格拉底攻击了传统观点的化身，即支持这座城市的诺莫斯人。

Note the way Socrates manipulates the dialogue, the conversation.

注意苏格拉底操纵对话、谈话的方式。

Cephalus says that the pious man, the just man practices justice by sacrificing to the gods.

克法洛斯说，虔诚的人、正义的人通过向诸神献祭来实践正义。

Socrates turns that into the statement that justice means paying your debts and returning what is owed to you.

苏格拉底将其转化为正义意味着偿还你的债务并归还欠你的东西。

Cephalus, in an easygoing manner, agrees and then Socrates says, "What would you think about returning a weapon that you had borrowed from a friend or someone who was in a very depressed"--we might say a depressed "frame of mind.

克法洛斯以一种随和的方式表示同意，然后苏格拉底说：“如果归还你从朋友或处于非常抑郁状态的人那里借来的武器，你会怎么想？”——我们可以说“情绪低落”。

Would that be just?

这样就公平了吗？

How do you explain that?

你怎么解释？

Would you do that if justice means paying your debts and giving back to each what is owed?" At that moment, Cephalus excuses himself from the dialogue and says, rather abruptly, "I have to go out and continue my sacrifices in the garden." Socrates, in other words, has broken the bond of tradition and traditional authority that holds the ancient city and the ancient family together.

如果正义意味着偿还债务并偿还所欠的一切，你会这样做吗？”就在这时，克法勒斯退出了对话，并相当突然地说：“我必须出去，继续在花园里进行我的牺牲。”换句话说，苏格拉底打破了将古城和古老家族维系在一起的传统和传统权威的纽带。

Cephalus is banished from the dialogue.

克法勒斯被排除在对话之外。

Tradition is banished and we never hear another word about it for the next 400 or so pages.

传统被驱逐了，在接下来的 400 页左右的时间里我们再也没有听到任何关于它的字眼。

That's the way Socrates begins this dialogue, or that's the way Plato has Socrates begin it.

这就是苏格拉底开始对话的方式，或者说，这就是柏拉图让苏格拉底开始对话的方式。

We'll look a little more at some of these in our class for next time and then move into the characters of Adeimantus and Glaucon.

下次我们会在课堂上更多地了解其中的一些内容，然后再讨论阿德曼图斯和格劳孔的角色。

Anyway, start your reading.

不管怎样，开始你的阅读吧。

Continue your reading.

继续阅读。

Your sections are going on this week, so enjoy yourselves.

你的部分本周将继续，所以尽情享受吧。