883: Call Your Parents - This American Life
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00:00 00:00 Transcript Share This American Life Life Partners How to Listen Episodes Recommended About Overview Staff Announcements Fellowships Jobs Music Make Radio On The Road FAQ Submissions Merch Contact Us Our Other Shows Merch Follow Us Life Partners Subscribe to our newsletter Full episode Toggle Audio and Transcript Sync Transcript | Episode #883 | March 20, 2026 883: Call Your Parents Note: This American Life is produced for the ear and designed to be heard.
00:00 00:00 文字记录 分享此 美国生活 生活伙伴 如何收听 剧集 推荐 关于 概述 员工公告 奖学金 工作 音乐 在路上制作电台 常见问题解答 提交 商品 联系我们 我们的其他节目 商品 关注我们 生活伙伴 订阅我们的时事通讯 整集 切换音频和文字记录同步 文字记录 | 内容第 883 集 | 2026 年 3 月 20 日 883：给你的父母打电话 注意：《美国生活》是为耳朵而制作的，旨在让人们听到。
If you are able, we strongly encourage you to listen to the audio, which includes emotion and emphasis that's not on the page.
如果可以的话，我们强烈建议您收听音频，其中包括页面上没有的情感和重点。
Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors.
文字记录是使用语音识别软件和人工转录员结合生成的，可能包含错误。
Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print.
请在印刷版引用前检查相应的音频。
Prologue: Prologue Ira Glass From WBEZ Chicago, it's This American Life.
序言：序言 来自 WBEZ 芝加哥的 Ira Glass，这就是美国生活。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
So when I was 36 years old, the year I started This American Life, my relationship with my parents was not the greatest.
所以当我36岁的时候，也就是我开始《This American Life》的那一年，我和父母的关系并不是最好的。
I'd been working at NPR since I was 19, and they were not into it-- at all.
我从 19 岁起就在 NPR 工作，但他们根本不感兴趣。
They were not into public radio.
他们不喜欢公共广播。
They were not into me working in public radio.
他们不喜欢我在公共广播电台工作。
They saw public radio as this, like, sad little backwater.
他们把公共广播看作是一个悲伤的小死水。
When they would listen to All Things Considered and Morning Edition, which were shows I was working at, I remember they would complain like, why are the stories so long?
当他们听我正在制作的《All Things Thought》和《Morning Edition》时，我记得他们会抱怨，为什么故事这么长？
They especially did not like that I wasn't making much money.
他们特别不喜欢我赚的钱不多。
I did not make much money.
我没赚多少钱。
They were both people raised in families where there was never any money.
他们都是在没有钱的家庭中长大的。
And they really organized their lives to get themselves firmly into the middle class.
他们确实组织了自己的生活，让自己坚定地跻身中产阶级。
And they really did not understand why I didn't want to make money.
他们真的不明白我为什么不想赚钱。
And then also, there had been a period in my early 20s when I was kind of judgy about certain choices that they were making, and I hurt their feelings.
而且，在我 20 岁出头的时候，有一段时间我对他们所做的某些选择有点挑剔，我伤害了他们的感情。
And by my 30s, I tried to make amends and fix that, but it still wasn't quite right between us.
到了三十多岁，我试图弥补并解决这个问题，但我们之间的关系仍然不太对劲。
And really, I felt pretty distant from them.
说实话，我感觉自己离他们很遥远。
They did not hide the fact that they disapproved of pretty much all my life choices, and I didn't feel a lot of patience for that disapproval.
他们并没有隐瞒这样一个事实：他们不赞成我几乎所有的人生选择，而我对这种反对并没有太多耐心。
And I didn't have a combative relationship with them, but it was just distant.
我和他们之间并没有什么好斗的关系，但也只是疏远而已。
I would go a month or two all the time without talking to them.
我会一两个月不跟他们说话。
And they were busy people, but I am sure this hurt their feelings.
他们都是忙碌的人，但我确信这伤害了他们的感情。
We talked about it later in our lives.
我们在后来的生活中谈论过它。
And then I started the radio show.
然后我开始广播节目。
I have to say, the single most surprising thing that happened in my life because of the radio show is that it fundamentally changed things between me and my parents.
我不得不说，由于广播节目，我一生中发生的最令人惊讶的事情是它从根本上改变了我和父母之间的关系。
It healed things in a way I had not suspected could ever happen.
它以一种我从未想过会发生的方式治愈了事情。
And what I'm going to do today is I'm going to play you four of those conversations that I had on the air with my parents.
今天我要做的就是给你们播放我和父母在广播中的四段对话。
I'm going to talk about that change.
我要谈谈这个变化。
A lot of the change happened, I think, because I was just including them in this big project I was doing.
我认为发生了很多变化，因为我只是将它们纳入了我正在做的这个大项目中。
I would have them on the show, and they were part of this project that meant so much to me.
我会让他们出现在节目中，他们是这个项目的一部分，这对我来说意义重大。
They were on the show five times in the first year that we were on the air.
我们播出的第一年，他们就上节目五次。
Really, it wasn't even the first year.
确实，这甚至不是第一年。
It was just, like, the first eight months.
这只是前八个月。
And we just got into a rhythm of that, and they really liked it.
我们刚刚进入了这样的节奏，他们真的很喜欢它。
They liked the attention from me.
他们喜欢我的关注。
They liked being on the air.
他们喜欢在广播中。
They each, but especially my mom, had a kind of performy, hammy side.
他们每个人，尤其是我妈妈，都有一种表演、哈米的一面。
I'll play you some of these.
我会给你播放其中一些。
I think you'll be able to hear that.
我想你会听到的。
And I never asked them about this, but I think they also liked what a kind of public sort of affirmation it was of them as parents.
我从来没有问过他们这个问题，但我认为他们也喜欢这种对他们作为父母的公开肯定。
Like, oh, see, we're a nice family.
就像，哦，看，我们是一个很好的家庭。
Like, see, they were good parents.
就像，看，他们是好父母。
And it really did change things between us.
它确实改变了我们之间的事情。
My parents are both dead now, and it still kind of floors me as this lucky thing in my life that I just stumbled into.
我的父母现在都去世了，但这仍然让我感到震惊，因为我刚刚偶然发现了我生命中的幸运之事。
And so what I'm going to do today is play some of their appearances on the radio show, and maybe jump in, just a little, here and there, to point out things that I am noticing.
所以我今天要做的就是在广播节目中播放他们的一些表演，也许会插话，只是一点点，在这里和那里，指出我注意到的事情。
And there's one that I'm going to play at the end.
最后我要演奏一首曲子。
This is a conversation with my mom that's still-- honestly, it makes my skin crawl today the way it did the day we recorded it.
老实说，这是我和妈妈的一次对话，今天仍然让我起鸡皮疙瘩，就像我们录制它那天一样。
This whole episode today, the way this came about is that about a year ago, we started doing these bonus episodes that we put out in our podcast feed.
今天的整个剧集，大约一年前，我们开始制作这些在播客提要中发布的奖励剧集。
And so I'm constantly trying to think of behind-the-scenes stuff to share with listeners in these bonus episodes.
因此，我不断尝试思考在这些奖励剧集中与听众分享的幕后故事。
And that led me back to relisten to these old interviews with my parents.
这让我重新聆听了对父母的旧采访。
And then a couple of weeks ago, I put these four interviews into a bonus episode.
几周前，我将这四次采访放入了奖励剧集中。
And honestly, it came out so nicely that we thought we should put this out as an actual regular episode of our show, one that anybody could hear.
老实说，它的效果非常好，我们认为我们应该将其作为我们节目的实际常规剧集，任何人都可以听到。
And so that's what you're hearing right now.
这就是你现在听到的。
And where I want to start things, this first excerpt is from an episode that we did called "Adult Children." This is the fourth time I had one of my parents on the radio show.
我想从这里开始，第一个摘录来自我们制作的名为“成人儿童”的剧集。这是我第四次让我的父母参加广播节目。
This is May 1996, which means that my mom, in this recording, is younger than I am right now.
这是 1996 年 5 月，这意味着在这段录音中，我妈妈比我现在年轻。
She is 60 years old in this recording.
这段录音中她已经60岁了。
And I picked this one to begin because it's one that directly addresses the actual tensions between my parents and their three children, though, as you'll hear, it addresses them in kind of a light way that does not get too deep or heavy.
我选择这个作为开始，因为它直接解决了我父母和他们的三个孩子之间的实际紧张关系，不过，正如你会听到的，它以一种轻松的方式解决了他们，不会变得太深或太沉重。
But you can also feel that there's something real under the surface, I think.
但我认为你也能感觉到表面之下有一些真实的东西。
OK, so I'm going to start this with the opening of that episode, where I tell a little story, very brief story, that kind of sets up the interview that then will happen with my mom.
好的，所以我将从该集的开头开始，我会讲一个小故事，非常简短的故事，这为随后将与我妈妈进行的采访做好了准备。
Here we go.
开始了。
Well, when I picked up the phone, it was my mom.
嗯，当我拿起电话时，是我妈妈打来的。
And it had been about a month since we had spoken.
自从我们谈话以来已经过去了大约一个月。
And as usual, that was my fault.
和往常一样，那是我的错。
Anyway, she said that she had been invited to speak with a group of women at the local Hadassah, the Jewish Women's Organization.
不管怎样，她说她被邀请与当地犹太妇女组织哈达萨的一群妇女交谈。
My mom's a therapist in the Jewish suburbs outside Baltimore.
我妈妈是巴尔的摩郊外犹太郊区的一名治疗师。
And these Hadassah women have this group that meets regularly.
这些哈达萨妇女有这个定期聚会的小组。
All of them are women in their-- somewhere-- I guess--
他们都是女性，在她们的——某个地方——我猜——
I'm just going to jump in again here in 2026.
2026 年我将再次加入这里。
I am reading this in such a heavy way.
我正在以如此沉重的方式读这篇文章。
[LAUGHS] Hearing it now, I am really trying to milk the drama out of this.
[笑]现在听到这个消息，我真的很想从中汲取戏剧性。
Anyway, back to 1996 me.
不管怎样，回到1996年的我。
All of them are women in their-- somewhere-- I guess in the late 40s to early 60s.
我猜他们都是 40 岁末到 60 岁出头的女性。
And when the group first started meeting, apparently, they discussed all sorts of stuff.
当小组第一次开始开会时，显然他们讨论了各种各样的事情。
It was wide-ranging.
它的范围很广。
But as time progressed, they realized there was only one topic they all really wanted to talk about, only one topic they all needed to talk about, and that was their relationships with their adult children.
但随着时间的推移，他们意识到他们真正想谈论的只有一个话题，他们都需要谈论的只有一个话题，那就是他们与成年子女的关系。
And at some point, that became the only thing the group discussed.
在某些时候，这成为小组讨论的唯一事情。
It became its official reason for existence.
它成为其存在的官方理由。
They had such trauma.
他们有过这样的创伤。
And they didn't know what to make of what was going on between them and their adult children.
他们不知道该如何理解他们和成年子女之间发生的事情。
And they invited my mom to lead a discussion on how to get along with your adult children.
他们邀请我妈妈主持一场关于如何与成年子女相处的讨论。
So as for preparation-- my mom's a big preparer, and she does research and looks up articles and calls experts.
至于准备工作——我妈妈是一个非常善于准备的人，她会做研究、查找文章并致电专家。
Anyway, as part of this preparation, she decided to call her own three adult children.
不管怎样，作为准备工作的一部分，她决定给自己的三个成年孩子打电话。
By the time she called me, my mom had already called my older sister, Randi, and she asked my sister what advice she would give the group.
当她打电话给我时，我妈妈已经给我姐姐兰迪打了电话，她问我姐姐会给这个小组什么建议。
Randi's advice was brief and to the point-- tell them to get a different leader.
兰迪的建议简短而切中要害——告诉他们换一个领导者。
Adult children.
成人儿童。
OK, so then what happens is that I explain, here's what we're doing on the show today.
好的，接下来我会解释一下，这就是我们今天在节目中要做的事情。
It's going to be an episode about adult children and their relationships with their adult parents.
这将是关于成年子女及其与成年父母的关系的一集。
And then-- as, then, I set up the interview with my mom, I say that I told my mom that I thought that my sister, Randi, had been maybe a little harsh in the way that she put things.
然后，当我安排对我妈妈的采访时，我说我告诉我妈妈，我认为我姐姐兰迪的说话方式可能有点严厉。
Can I say something?
我可以说句话吗？
Ira Glass I was just going to say, feel free to amend or correct.
Ira Glass 我只是想说，请随意修改或更正。
Yes, when I told your sister what you said, she said, oh, well, I was just kidding.
是的，当我告诉你姐姐你说的话时，她说，哦，好吧，我只是开玩笑。
I didn't mean to be mean.
我无意刻薄。
Oh.
哦。
Mom So I don't want her to be blasphemed off.
妈妈 所以我不想让她受到亵渎。
All right.
好的。
Now, but you're a professional psychologist now.
现在，你现在是一名职业心理学家了。
Don't you think often-- don't you think that there was a note of hostility in what she said?
你不常想——你不觉得她的话里带着敌意吗？
Oh, absolutely.
哦，绝对是。
Ira Glass OK.
艾拉·格拉斯 好的。
There, you see.
在那里，你瞧。
Absolutely.
绝对地。
Ira Glass And you and I can agree.
Ira Glass 你和我都同意。
And frankly, she's not on the phone.
坦白说，她没有接电话。
[LAUGHS] And--
[笑]还有——
If my sister Randi is listening to this bonus episode, please just forgive me.
如果我的妹妹兰迪正在听这个额外的剧集，请原谅我。
I didn't mean to-- or I guess I did mean to-- throw you under the bus.
我不是故意的——或者我想我确实是故意的——把你扔到公共汽车下。
OK, let's keep going.
好吧，我们继续吧。
So Mom, so the thing I wanted to ask you about is-- OK, so you had this seminar with all these--
所以妈妈，所以我想问你的是——好的，所以你举办了这个研讨会，其中包括所有这些——
It wasn't a seminar.
这不是研讨会。
It was a discussion group.
这是一个讨论组。
Discussion-- the discussion group, excuse me.
讨论——讨论组，不好意思。
And I was the facilitator.
我是协调人。
Ira Glass And how many women was it?
Ira Glass 有多少位女性？
Mm-hmm.
嗯嗯。
Ira Glass Now, if you had to characterize in a phrase people's relationships with their children, would you describe them as being very good, somewhat OK, generally kind of yucky?
艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass）：现在，如果你必须用一个短语来描述人们与孩子的关系，你会把他们描述为“非常好”、“有点好”、“通常有点令人讨厌”吗？
I mean, how would you describe it?
我的意思是，你会如何描述它？
I would say that there were a lot of people whose dreams haven't been realized, whose expectations haven't been met, and so there's a sense of disappointment, although there were some people there who were pleased with all aspects.
我想说，有很多人的梦想没有实现，他们的期望没有得到满足，所以有一种失望感，尽管也有一些人各方面都很满意。
And then of course, the question was, well, why are you here?
当然，问题是，你为什么在这里？
[LAUGHS]
[笑]
To gloat?
幸灾乐祸？
Was that the answer?
这就是答案吗？
To gloat and show you pictures of grandchildren?
幸灾乐祸地给你看孙子的照片？
Oh, a little bit.
哦，有一点。
Ira Glass A little bit, yeah, OK.
Ira Glass 有一点，是的，好的。
But--
但是——
More to connect with the other women, I suppose.
我想更多的是与其他女性联系。
But these are the criteria for satisfaction.
但这些都是满意度的标准。
Do you want to hear them?
你想听听他们的声音吗？
Quickly.
迅速地。
Mom Whether their children were married.
妈妈 他们的孩子是否结婚了。
"Quickly." I'm so rude to my own mother.
“迅速地。”我对自己的母亲太无礼了。
Move it along, Mom.
妈妈，快点走吧。
Quickly.
迅速地。
Mom Whether their children were married.
妈妈 他们的孩子是否结婚了。
Yes.
是的。
Mom So that having single children was a disappointment.
妈妈，所以有独生子女是一件令人失望的事。
I'm just going to make a little checklist here, taking into account my own--
我只想在这里列出一个小清单，考虑到我自己的情况——
Whether their children lived close by or far away.
他们的孩子住得近还是远。
God, I'm shooting 0 for 2 so far.
天啊，到目前为止我的投篮命中率是 2 投 0 。
Keep going.
继续前进。
All right.
好的。
Whether their children appreciated them.
他们的孩子是否欣赏他们。
[LAUGHS]
[笑]
I'm one for three.
我是一对三。
Mom Whether they had grandchildren.
妈妈 他们是否有孙子。
Somebody announced that one of their children was pregnant with the first grandchild.
有人宣布他们的一个孩子怀上了第一个孙子。
Everybody went, oh, and they clapped, you know?
每个人都去了，哦，他们鼓掌，你知道吗？
So that's the epitome.
所以这就是缩影。
Yeah.
是的。
Mom Whether their children were successful in their lives.
妈妈 他们的孩子在生活中是否成功。
How much they liked their child's spouse and got along with them.
他们是多么喜欢自己孩子的配偶，和他们相处得多么融洽。
You told me on the phone earlier something interesting about this.
你之前在电话里告诉过我一些有趣的事情。
I'm just going to drop, like, I-- at this point in my life, I was 36, 37, and I had no spouse and was deeply uninterested in having children.
我要放弃了，就像，我——在我生命的这个阶段，我已经36岁、37岁了，我没有配偶，对生孩子也非常不感兴趣。
And this was not something that my parents were too pleased about, either of those things, and a point of discussion now and then.
这并不是我父母太高兴的事情，也不是时不时讨论的话题。
You told me on the phone earlier something interesting about this.
你之前在电话里告诉过我一些有趣的事情。
Yes, I told you that there were several people there who did not like their child's choice of a partner at the time that they got married, but had grown to love them very much, and in some cases, even liked them better than their own child.
是的，我告诉你，那里有几个人在结婚时不喜欢孩子选择的伴侣，但后来却非常爱孩子，有的甚至喜欢孩子胜过自己的孩子。
See, now, I wonder if that is because there is an inherent tension between children and their adult parents, that the child sometimes wants to be treated as the child and sometimes wants to be treated as an independent adult.
现在，我想知道这是否是因为孩子和成年父母之间存在固有的紧张关系，孩子有时希望被视为孩子，有时希望被视为独立的成年人。
And for the parent, it's pretty much a hellish guessing game.
对于父母来说，这几乎是一场地狱般的猜谜游戏。
And then-- yeah?
然后——是吗？
Yeah, a lot of people talked about walking on eggshells, and how can I-- several people said, well, how-- what's the right way to give advice?
是的，很多人都谈到如履薄冰，我该如何——有几个人说，嗯，如何——给出建议的正确方式是什么？
And of course, the answer is, you don't give advice unless somebody asks you for it.
当然，答案是，除非有人要求你提供建议，否则你不会提供建议。
Yeah, Mom.
是的，妈妈。
[LAUGHS] Can I just say, from 2026, that was definitely not the standard practice in our own family, to wait until somebody asked for advice, for advice to be given.
[笑]我只能说，从 2026 年开始，等到有人寻求建议、寻求建议时，这绝对不是我们家庭的标准做法。
And no disrespect in saying that, just a factual statement there.
这么说并没有不尊重的意思，只是一个事实陈述。
Do you think that this relationship is harder, the relationship between adult children and their parents, is harder on the parents than on the children?
你是否认为这种关系更难，成年子女和父母之间的关系，对父母来说比对孩子更困难？
Yes, because the parents have a dream of how they thought it was going to be, and it seldom matches the dream.
是的，因为父母有一个他们想象的梦想，但它很少与梦想相符。
That was definitely true of my mom and my dad and me.
我的妈妈、爸爸和我都是如此。
They definitely-- I was not living the dream at all.
他们肯定——我根本没有实现梦想。
Anyway, back to the tape.
无论如何，回到磁带。
One person said that her children are all single, all live far away.
一位人士称，她的孩子们都是单身，都住得很远。
And she said she and her husband are very lonely.
她说她和她的丈夫都很孤独。
And what's happened, the good part is that they've gotten much closer to each other because they realize that they're all that they have.
所发生的事情，好的部分是他们彼此之间的距离变得更加接近，因为他们意识到他们就是他们所拥有的一切。
Right.
正确的。
All right, well, Dr. Glass, I'm afraid that this would be about all the time we have for this particular segment of our radio show.
好吧，格拉斯博士，恐怕这将是我们广播节目这一特定部分的全部时间。
Look, I'm glad for any time I can get with my children.
听着，我很高兴能和孩子们在一起。
All right.
好的。
Touché.
触摸。
My mom, Shirley Glass, a therapist in Baltimore.
我的妈妈雪莉·格拉斯 (Shirley Glass) 是巴尔的摩的一名治疗师。
Coming up--
即将到来——
I have to say, I'm so-- I like that she gets the last word.
我不得不说，我非常——我喜欢她拥有最后的发言权。
OK, so that is the fourth time I had one of my parents on the show.
好吧，这是我第四次让我的父母出现在节目中。
The reason, I have to say, that we had my parents on the air so much in the first year of the show was because it was such reliable material.
我不得不说，我的父母在节目第一年就如此频繁地出现在节目中，是因为它的材料非常可靠。
I had heard Howard Stern talking to his parents on the air-- which, if you have ever heard that, it was some of the most enjoyable stuff he ever did.
我曾听到霍华德·斯特恩在广播中与他的父母交谈——如果你听过的话，那是他做过的最令人愉快的事情之一。
It was just very funny and very complicated emotionally.
这非常有趣，而且情感上非常复杂。
Sometimes it would get genuinely tense between him and his parents.
有时他和父母之间的关系会变得非常紧张。
Like, the real relationships really happened on the air.
就像，真正的关系真的发生在广播中。
He was so good at that.
他在这方面非常擅长。
And there's just something inherently entertaining about hearing some radio host who supposedly is the king of the show-- he's been running the show, this adult running the show-- and their parents just come on, and they don't give a crap.
听到某个广播主持人被认为是节目之王，他一直在主持节目，这个成年人在主持节目，而他们的父母只是来了，他们根本不在乎。
You know what I mean?
你知道我的意思？
Like, they really try to get the last word.
就像，他们真的想得到最后的发言权。
And so the staff, we just knew, like, oh, what if we fill this with-- could you talk to your parents?
所以工作人员，我们只是知道，哦，如果我们填写这个怎么办——你能和你的父母谈谈吗？
And it was just always good material.
这总是很好的材料。
And so the very first time my mom or dad were on the show was the very first episode.
所以我妈妈或爸爸第一次出现在节目中是第一集。
We hadn't named the show This American Life yet.
我们还没有将这部剧命名为《美国生活》。
At the time, the show was called Your Radio Playhouse.
当时，该节目被称为“你的广播剧场”。
And you'll hear in the first minute or two here, I'm cutting in and narrating from the studio, but that's me back in 1995 doing that.
你会在头一两分钟听到，我正在录音室插话并进行旁白，但那是我在 1995 年做的。
That's not me today.
今天那不是我。
If I want to jump in at some point today, I will say explicitly it's today, it's 2026 me talking.
如果我今天想在某个时刻插话，我会明确地说是今天，我说的是 2026 年。
OK, here we go.
好的，我们开始吧。
Good morning, Glass Jacobson Associates.
早上好，格拉斯雅各布森联合公司。
Hey, is Barry there?
嘿，巴里在吗？
Secretary Pardon me?
秘书请原谅我？
Is Barry there?
巴里在吗？
Secretary Yes, he is.
秘书 是的，他是。
He's on another call.
他正在接另一个电话。
Do you wish to hold?
你想持有吗？
Or I could take a message, or you can leave one on his voicemail.
或者我可以留言，或者你可以在他的语音信箱中留言。
Uh-huh.
嗯嗯。
Ira Glass Anyway, so I thought I would call my parents in Baltimore and ask for advice on this, our first evening of our brand-new radio show, Your Radio Playhouse.
不管怎样，我想我应该给巴尔的摩的父母打电话，征求有关我们全新广播节目《你的广播剧场》的第一晚的建议。
Can I leave a message with you?
我可以给你留言吗？
Or is it better to use his voicemail?
还是使用他的语音信箱更好？
It doesn't matter.
没关系。
I'll put it right on his voicemail.
我会把它放到他的语音信箱里。
OK, let's do.
好吧，我们开始吧。
Secretary OK, hold on, please.
秘书 好的，请稍等。
Relax Ira Glass This is the story of my childhood right there.
放松一下 Ira Glass 这就是我童年的故事。
Dad is a little too busy to talk, but there's the recording of Frank Sinatra when needed.
爸爸有点太忙了，没时间说话，但需要时可以听弗兰克·辛纳屈 (Frank Sinatra) 的录音。
How are you doing?
你好吗？
Mom Fine.
妈妈很好。
Can you hold on a second?
你能等一下吗？
Sure.
当然。
This is what it's like with my parents.
我和父母的相处就是这样。
You can never-- they're so busy.
你永远不能——他们太忙了。
Call them.
打电话给他们。
Put on hold.
搁置一下。
[SIGHS]
[叹气]
When I call my little sister-- she works at Disney.
当我打电话给我的妹妹时——她在迪士尼工作。
And so there's always-- there's Disney music.
所以总是有迪士尼音乐。
But they're playing on the hold system.
但他们正在等待系统。
But there's a lot of Disney music, and there's a lot of it that peo--
但是有很多迪士尼音乐，而且有很多是人们——
Yeah.
是的。
Ira Glass Listen, can I record a quick conversation with you about something?
Ira Glass 听着，我可以录制一段与你的简短对话吗？
What about?
又怎样呢？
Ira Glass Well, you know the new show goes on the air this week.
艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass）嗯，你知道新节目本周将播出。
Yeah.
是的。
Ira Glass And as part of the show, we were thinking about having me call around to different people and get advice from them.
Ira Glass 作为节目的一部分，我们正在考虑让我打电话给不同的人并从他们那里获取建议。
And I wanted to know if you would have any advice.
我想知道你是否有任何建议。
Mm.
毫米。
Do I have any advice?
我有什么建议吗？
Hmm.
唔。
Well, can I ask another question?
嗯，我可以再问一个问题吗？
You are such a pro.
你真是个专业人士。
[LAUGHS] Mom I'm saying that you're in danger of appealing to a narrow range of listeners if it becomes a little too-- I don't know what word to use.
[笑]妈妈，我是说，如果你的听众变得有点过分——我不知道该用什么词，那么你就有可能吸引一小部分听众。
I'm just going to jump in here in 2026, just to say like, there's no "Oh, the new show is happening.
我打算在 2026 年跳到这里，只是想说，不会有“哦，新剧正在上演。
Congratulations." Nothing.
恭喜你。”没有什么。
Like, her first comment is to question, are you sure you aren't going to screw this up?
就像，她的第一条评论是质疑，你确定你不会把事情搞砸吗？
Are you and Dad still worried about me making a living in public radio?
你和爸爸还在担心我靠公共广播谋生吗？
I mean, I know just for years, you were urging me to just get out and get basically any job in TV that I possibly could.
我的意思是，我知道多年来，你一直在敦促我离开并在电视上找到任何我可能找到的工作。
But now that I've got my own show, are you guys still worried, or do you feel like things are going OK?
但现在我有了自己的节目，你们还担心吗，还是觉得一切顺利？
Do you want me to get into television still?
你还想让我进入电视界吗？
Now that Hugh Grant is such a big star, and everybody who sees you or sees your picture thinks how much you look like Hugh Grant, that sort of fires up that TV thing again in me.
现在休·格兰特已经是一位大明星了，每个看到你或看到你照片的人都认为你长得很像休·格兰特，这又让我想起了电视上的事。
[LAUGHS]
[笑]
All right, I'm stopping the tape.
好吧，我要停止录像了。
This is me live.
这就是我的直播。
That was the tape.
那是磁带。
Only my mother could possibly believe this.
只有我妈妈才可能相信这一点。
Only a mother could pretty much believe this.
只有母亲才能相信这一点。
Other adults see me, and the thought that goes through their head is not Hugh Grant.
其他成年人看到我，他们脑子里闪过的想法不是休·格兰特。
The thought that goes through their head is tall Jew.
他们脑子里闪过的念头是高大的犹太人。
[LAUGHS] I think, well, gosh, wouldn't they want this wonderful, humanistic, intelligent reporter who looks like Hugh Grant?
[笑]我想，好吧，天哪，他们难道不想要这位看起来像休·格兰特的出色、人性化、聪明的记者吗？
The theme for this week is-- I'm just going to come in here now in 2026.
本周的主题是——我将在 2026 年来到这里。
This interruption is happening right now.
这种中断现在正在发生。
I have to say something else that hearing this recording reminds me of, and that is that when I look at pictures of my mom, it's just-- I just feel a sense of fondness for my mom.
我不得不说，听到这段录音让我想起了另一件事，那就是，当我看到我妈妈的照片时，我只是对我妈妈有一种喜爱之情。
But when you hear somebody's voice, it's so much more powerful.
但当你听到某人的声音时，它会变得更有力量。
Like, it's just like-- I feel like it's like she's alive, talking to me again.
就像，就像——我觉得她还活着，又跟我说话了。
And I'm having all the feelings that I had when she was alive.
我拥有她活着时的所有感受。
Like, really, as this tape was playing, beat by beat, moment by moment, I feel like I'm experiencing this conversation the same way I did 30 years ago.
就像，真的，当这盘磁带播放时，一个节拍一个节拍，一个时刻接着一个时刻，我感觉我正在经历这场对话，就像 30 年前一样。
Like, just-- yeah.
就像，只是——是的。
And pictures cannot do that.
而图片却做不到这一点。
The theme for this week is new beginnings.
本周的主题是新的开始。
Mm.
毫米。
Ira Glass And we have several stories of people telling about various ways in which their life began anew at some point.
艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass） 我们有几个故事，人们讲述了他们在某个时刻重新开始生活的各种方式。
Yeah, that's very interesting, because I just did an interview this morning with a newspaper reporter about romance--
是的，这很有趣，因为我今天早上刚刚接受了一位报纸记者关于浪漫的采访——
I'm just going to stop the tape again.
我要再次停止录像。
This is my own life.
这就是我自己的生活。
I call my mom for an interview, and it's not even her first interview of the day.
我打电话给我妈妈去面试，这甚至不是她今天的第一次面试。
I was lucky to get a booking.
我很幸运得到了预订。
She's a therapist, and sometimes she gets called by the papers and stuff.
她是一名治疗师，有时她会接到报纸之类的电话。
--and people's expectations about relationships.
——以及人们对人际关系的期望。
And one of the things I believe is that there are a lot of people who are good at beginnings, but they're not good at middles.
我相信的一件事是，有很多人在开始阶段表现出色，但在中期阶段却不擅长。
Which means what?
这意味着什么？
Mom It means that they like the beginning, where there's all this idealization and romantic projections.
妈妈这意味着他们喜欢开始，那里有所有这些理想化和浪漫的预测。
And the other person can be who they think they should be rather than who they are.
而对方可以是他们认为自己应该成为的人，而不是他们本来的样子。
And when they get to the middle phase--
当他们进入中期阶段时——
All right.
好吧。
I'm just gonna stop the tape.
我只是要停止录像。
All right, listen, all of you in the audience right now.
好吧，现在观众席上的各位，听着。
Let's just agree right now, it's the very beginning of our relationship.
我们现在就同意吧，这是我们关系的开始。
It's the very beginning of our radio relationship right now.
现在是我们广播关系的开始。
This is our little first little radio date.
这是我们的第一个小电台约会。
And I just don't want any idealizing.
我只是不想有任何理想化。
No idealizing.
没有理想化。
--is where there's more reality-based relationships.
——存在更多基于现实的关系。
They kind of run away from it because it's not as exciting.
他们有点逃避它，因为它不那么令人兴奋。
It's interesting that you say that, because actually, as we've approached the first show, I've realized that I am much more comfortable with the notion of everyday, workaday sort of radio work, and being on every week, and having pieces on the air.
你这么说很有趣，因为实际上，当我们接近第一场演出时，我意识到我对每天、工作日的广播工作、每周播出、播出一些片段的概念更加满意。
But the notion of saying, in a really big way, "OK, this is the beginning.
但以一种非常大的方式说，“好吧，这就是开始。
It's the beginning, and we're going to have a big beginning, or we're going to make an epic statement," I feel very uncomfortable with.
这是开始，我们将有一个伟大的开始，或者我们将做出一个史诗般的声明，”我对此感到非常不舒服。
I'm better, I think, at middles than at beginnings.
我认为，我在中期比在开始时表现更好。
Hmm.
唔。
That's good.
那挺好的。
That's good, because practically all of life is the middle.
这很好，因为几乎所有的生活都是中间的。
We have gotten so deep here.
我们已经在这里陷得太深了。
I never expected that it was going to-- that it was going to get so deep.
我没想到它会变得如此深入。
[LAUGHS] This is just-- I'm just very pleased at how deep this has gotten.
[笑]这只是——我对这件事已经变得如此深入感到非常高兴。
Now, you're sitting there.
现在，你坐在那里。
You're thinking, is he making fun of me?
你在想，他是在取笑我吗？
What's happening now?
现在发生什么事了？
Where are you?
你在哪里？
Right, right, right.
对，对，对。
Ira Glass No, I'm not.
艾拉·格拉斯 不，我不是。
I'm not, actually.
事实上我不是。
I'm not.
我不是。
I'm not.
我不是。
You have nothing to worry about.
您无需担心。
Depending on how you sound.
取决于你的声音。
Mom Since we're outside the Chicago listening area.
妈妈 因为我们在芝加哥监听区外面。
All right, well, that's my mom, Shirley Glass, speaking to us from Baltimore.
好吧，这是我妈妈雪莉·格拉斯在巴尔的摩对我们讲话。
I-- I don't think she's going to get a tape.
我——我不认为她会拿到磁带。
I do not think she's going to get a tape.
我不认为她会得到磁带。
All right, well, next on our little Playhouse stage--
好吧，接下来在我们的小剧场舞台上——
I'm pretty sure I actually did send her a tape.
我很确定我确实给她寄了一盘磁带。
[LAUGHS] Anyway, OK, so that is the first episode of our show from November 1995.
[笑] 不管怎样，好吧，这是我们 1995 年 11 月节目的第一集。
So my dad did come on the show also.
所以我爸爸也参加了演出。
It wasn't just my mom.
不仅仅是我妈妈。
And I'm going to play you some of that, including an old story about his very brief and very doomed career in radio, after a quick break.
在短暂休息后，我将向您播放其中的一些内容，其中包括一个关于他非常短暂且注定失败的广播职业生涯的老故事。
Stay with us.
留在我们身边。
It's This American Life.
这就是美国生活。
Today we're doing something different than usual.
今天我们要做一些与平常不同的事情。
I'm playing old interviews that I did on the program with my parents, which really did change my relationship with them in a fundamental way.
我正在播放我在节目中与父母进行的旧采访，这确实从根本上改变了我与他们的关系。
As I said earlier, today's program was originally made as a bonus episode of our show.
正如我之前所说，今天的节目最初是作为我们节目的附加节目而制作的。
Every two weeks or so, we try to put out these bonus episodes for our This American Life partners.
每隔两周左右，我们就会尝试为我们的《美国生活》合作伙伴推出这些奖励剧集。
And they're generally behind-the-scenes stuff, like what you're hearing today.
它们通常是幕后的东西，就像你今天听到的那样。
Anyway, so we turn now to my dad.
无论如何，我们现在转向我父亲。
The biggest story that I did with my dad is in an episode-- again, this is very early in the show.
我和父亲一起做的最重要的故事是在一集里——再说一次，这是节目的早期。
It's episode 14.
这是第14集。
It's February 1996.
现在是 1996 年 2 月。
It's like-- what is that-- four months after we started on the air.
就像——那是什么——我们开始播出四个月后。
I should say, this story, I'm just going to play straight through.
我应该说，这个故事，我就直接玩下去。
So when you hear me interrupting tape and stuff like that, that's actually happening in the original story.
所以当你听到我打断磁带之类的事情时，这实际上发生在原始故事中。
That's not today.
那不是今天。
We have arrived at Act Two of our program, "Baltimore."
我们已经到了节目《巴尔的摩》的第二幕。
We'd like to ask you this question, my friend.
我的朋友，我们想问你这个问题。
Do personal problems and worries have you down?
个人问题和忧虑是否让您感到沮丧？
Are you disturbed by business problems, marriage problems, or emotional problems?
您是否因事业问题、婚姻问题或情感问题而困扰？
See Mrs. K, reader and advisor.
参见读者兼顾问 K 女士。
Mrs. K, formerly of Europe, gives you a reading and answers all your questions for just $1, and you'll feel much better.
前欧洲人 K 女士只需 1 美元即可为您提供阅读材料并回答您的所有问题，您会感觉好多了。
You'll have a much better picture of where you're headed after you've talked with Mrs. K.
与 K 女士交谈后，您会对自己的前进方向有一个更好的了解。
The telephone number is Saratoga 7-2-7-5-3.
电话号码是萨拉托加 7-2-7-5-3。
But of course, no appointment is necessary.
但当然，不需要预约。
I'm just going to stop this tape right there.
我要把这盘磁带停在那里。
I have three things to say about this tape.
关于这盘磁带我有三件事要说。
Number one, "formerly of Europe?" Number two, of course, no appointment is necessary.
第一，“以前是欧洲的？”第二，当然，不需要预约。
She already knows you're coming.
她已经知道你要来了。
And number three, this is my father in 1956, three years before I was born.
第三，这是我 1956 年的父亲，也就是我出生前三年。
He's 23 years old.
他今年 23 岁。
And coming up right now, news about a wonderful appliance from Norman R.
现在即将推出有关 Norman R. 的一款出色设备的新闻。
Mitchell, just for the homemakers, as we said before.
米切尔，只是为了家庭主妇，正如我们之前所说的。
We're talking about an electric dryer.
我们正在谈论电动烘干机。
And my friend, if the lady in your house has her heart set on an electric dryer, here's some big news for you from Norman R.
我的朋友，如果你家里的那位女士一心想要一台电动烘干机，那么诺曼·R·诺曼 (Norman R.
Mitchell.
米切尔.
Right now, they are featuring the new 1957 Frigidaire Filtr-omatic Electric Dryer at an unbelievable low price.
现在，他们以令人难以置信的低价推出 1957 年新款 Frigidaire Filtr-omatic 电动烘干机。
My father started in radio when he was 19, the same age I was when I started.
我父亲 19 岁时就开始从事广播事业，我也是同龄开始从事广播事业。
He began at the college station at the University of Maryland, and after graduation, got a job spinning records at a commercial station in Baltimore.
他从马里兰大学学院开始，毕业后在巴尔的摩的一家商业电台找到了一份旋转唱片的工作。
Then he was drafted.
然后他被征召入伍。
And at the time of this particular recording, my father was actually in the Army, stationed in Virginia.
在录制这段特别的录音时，我父亲实际上正在军队服役，驻扎在弗吉尼亚州。
But he wanted a career in radio so badly that every Sunday morning, at the break of dawn, he would leave his wife and his five-month-old baby, my older sister, and drive up to Baltimore to do a four-hour program.
但他非常想从事广播事业，以至于每个周日早上，黎明时分，他都会离开妻子和五个月大的孩子，也就是我的姐姐，开车去巴尔的摩做一个四个小时的节目。
For over 18 years, thousands of folks just like yourselves here in town have relied on Norman R.
18 年来，镇上成千上万像你们一样的人一直信赖 Norman R.
Mitchell appliances for sincerity, service, and substantial savings-- three important musts for a successful business today.
米切尔电器提供真诚、服务和大量节省——当今企业成功的三个重要要素。
My dad's paycheck for this four-hour Sunday morning program was $5.88.
我父亲参加这个周日上午四个小时的节目的工资是 5.88 美元。
The most he ever made at a radio job was $90 a week.
他在电台工作中挣到的最高收入是每周 90 美元。
My friend, how would you like to get 21 beautiful greeting cards absolutely free?
我的朋友，您想完全免费获得 21 张精美贺卡吗？
Plus details on how easy it is to earn $35 to $50 a week selling Liberty Bell greeting cards.
另外还详细介绍了通过销售自由钟贺卡每周赚取 35 至 50 美元是多么容易。
When you were doing radio, what did you like about it?
当你做广播时，你喜欢它的什么？
What was the appeal of it for you?
它对你来说有什么吸引力？
It seemed easy to do.
这似乎很容易做到。
A certain amount of, I guess, notoriety.
我想，一定程度的恶名。
It's good for your ego.
这对你的自我有好处。
People know who you are.
人们知道你是谁。
I was a big man on campus at the University of Maryland.
我是马里兰大学校园里的大人物。
I didn't really know that.
我真的不知道。
I've been listening to the way that you do the announcement.
我一直在听你发布公告的方式。
You are relaxed, and yet you punch the main points, but you sound completely at ease, and you're convincing.
你很放松，但你却抓住了要点，但你听起来完全放松，而且你很有说服力。
You're doing ads for the hokiest products in the world, and you sound completely like you believe it.
你正在为世界上最古怪的产品做广告，而且你听起来完全就像你相信的那样。
What are some of the products?
有哪些产品？
I forgot about them.
我忘记了他们。
There's a lot of appliances.
有很多电器。
Dad Uh-huh.
爸爸 嗯嗯。
And then there's one reader and advisor named Mrs. K.
还有一位读者兼顾问，名叫 K 女士。
[LAUGHS] That's right.
[笑]没错。
I'd forgotten about her.
我已经忘记她了。
[LAUGHTER] Just show them to your relatives, friends, neighbors, and the folks you work with, and see how quickly they order.
[笑声] 只需将它们展示给您的亲戚、朋友、邻居和与您一起工作的人，看看他们订购的速度有多快。
You know, you're actually doing them a favor by saving them money on Christmas cards.
你知道，你为他们省了买圣诞卡的钱，实际上是在帮他们一个忙。
And such fine quality cards you've never seen in your life as Liberty Bell.
还有像自由钟这样品质优良的卡片，您一生中从未见过。
A lot of what it's like to be on the radio is just trying to sound relaxed when you're not.
很多时候，在广播中的感觉只是想让自己在不在广播中时听起来放松。
You're doing a show.
你在做秀。
You're not just talking to people.
你不只是在与人交谈。
And in some of these tapes, I can actually hear my father struggling to sound relaxed.
在其中一些录音带中，我实际上可以听到我父亲努力让自己的声音听起来很放松。
And these recordings give me this picture of him that I have never had in my life, really.
这些录音给了我这张他一生中从未有过的照片，真的。
He seemed so young and innocent, a guy in his 20s doing this thing that I know so intimately myself, just sitting in front of a microphone, trying to sound at ease, trying to sound like this relaxed old pro, not a care in the world.
他看起来如此年轻和天真，一个20多岁的小伙子在做着我自己非常熟悉的事情，只是坐在麦克风前，努力让自己听起来轻松自在，努力让自己听起来像个轻松的老专业人士，不关心这个世界。
Yes, now, you can have color in that kitchen of yours and really make it a true showplace for your family and your friends-- and make it a lot easier to work in, too, with color.
是的，现在，您可以为自己的厨房增添色彩，真正使其成为家人和朋友真正的展示场所，并且通过色彩也让工作变得更加容易。
And you can have this color in your kitchen all at the price of white.
您可以以白色的价格在厨房中拥有这种颜色。
And Force Frigidaire features the new 1957 Frigidaire refrigerators, ranges, washers, and dryers in four decorator colors at absolutely no extra cost to you.
Force Frigidaire 拥有 1957 年新款 Frigidaire 冰箱、系列、洗衣机和烘干机，有四种装饰颜色，完全无需您支付额外费用。
You have your choice of pink, yellow, green, or charcoal.
您可以选择粉色、黄色、绿色或木炭色。
This is just how long ago this happened.
这是多久以前发生的事情了。
They had not yet invented the idea of renaming the colors of appliances, things like avocado, lemon, eggshell.
他们还没有发明重新命名电器颜色的想法，比如鳄梨、柠檬、蛋壳。
Well, let's get on to that feature top tune of tomorrow, a brand-new release, one we think is going to be real big in the coming weeks and months all across the country and right here in Baltimore, too.
好吧，让我们来看看明天的重头戏，一个全新的版本，我们认为在未来几周和几个月内将在全国范围内非常受欢迎，在巴尔的摩也是如此。
This week, it goes to The Crew Cuts.
本周，《The Crew Cut》将上演。
Listen to their rendition of "Love in a Home."
听听他们演绎的“爱在家里”。
(SUBJECT) THE CREW Ira Glass Not long after he got out of the Army, my dad decided that radio was no way to make a living.
（主题）船员艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass）退伍后不久，我父亲就认为无线电不是谋生的方式。
And after a series of jobs, he decided to become a certified public accountant.
经过一系列工作后，他决定成为一名注册会计师。
He was a typical workaholic suburban dad, off to the office at 7:00 in the morning, back at 6:30 for dinner.
他是一个典型的工作狂郊区爸爸，早上 7:00 去办公室，6:30 回来吃晚饭。
Exhausted after that, he would sit in his yellow recliner in front of the TV and fall asleep.
疲惫不堪后，他会坐在电视机前的黄色躺椅上睡着。
He started his own business, struggled to establish it, worked lots of nights and weekends.
他开始了自己的事业，努力建立它，花了很多晚上和周末工作。
During tax season, from January to April 15, we would barely see him.
在报税季，从 1 月到 4 月 15 日，我们几乎见不到他。
Mm-hmm.
嗯嗯。
Ira Glass In our house, when I was growing up, was an old reel-to-reel tape recorder, a little consumer unit that my mother and my sisters and I would goof around on from time to time, recorded singing or telling stories.
艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass） 在我成长的过程中，我们家里有一台旧的卷轴式录音机，这是一个小型消费设备，我和我的母亲、姐妹们和我会时不时地在上面闲逛，录制歌曲或讲故事。
And while my mom appears on these tapes a lot, my father does not appear on them once.
虽然我妈妈经常出现在这些磁带上，但我父亲却一次也没有出现过。
He simply was not there to be recorded.
他只是不在那里被记录。
The only time he's mentioned on all of these tapes is this.
所有这些磁带中唯一一次提到他就是这一次。
I'm going to play this moment to you.
我要把这一刻演奏给你听。
My mother is cooing to my older sister, Randi, who's probably-- I don't know-- a year old, a year and a half old.
我的母亲正在对我的姐姐兰迪轻声细语，她可能——我不知道——一岁，一岁半。
Where's Barry?
巴里在哪里？
Ira Glass Barry's my dad.
艾拉·格拉斯·巴里是我的父亲。
Mm.
毫米。
Mom Daddy?
爸爸妈妈？
Where's Daddy?
爸爸在哪儿？
Did Daddy go bye-bye?
爸爸走了吗？
These days, my dad explains his decision to leave radio and become an accountant this way.
这些天，我父亲以这种方式解释了他离开广播电台并成为一名会计师的决定。
By that time, I had realized that radio was not for me.
到那时，我意识到广播不适合我。
And what happened would be a new program director would come in, and if you weren't the apple of that guy's eye, then you were out of a job.
发生的情况是，一位新的项目总监加入，如果你不是那个人的掌上明珠，那么你就会失业。
You gotta go start looking for a job again.
你得重新开始找工作了。
Even though that never happened to me, I could see it happening to other people, and I wanted to be in control of my own destiny.
尽管这从未发生在我身上，但我可以看到它发生在其他人身上，我想掌控自己的命运。
And I decided that it wasn't going to work out.
我决定这不会成功。
And that was-- Dad For me, that was not going to work out.
那就是——爸爸对我来说，那是行不通的。
Not at all.
一点也不。
[LAUGHS] Ira Glass It sounds like they are.
[笑] Ira Glass 听起来确实如此。
Well, all the stars are on record, and all the records star on the Sunday morning carousel.
嗯，所有的明星都在记录中，所有的记录明星都在周日早上的轮播中。
Coming up for you right now, our featured Top Tune of the Day, number one in the record stores we visited this week in Baltimore.
现在就为您带来我们精选的每日热门歌曲，它是我们本周在巴尔的摩参观的唱片店中排名第一的歌曲。
And judging by your cards and letters here at Win, it ranks very high.
从你在Win这里的卡片和信件来看，它的排名非常高。
The Prince of Wales himself, one Johnnie Ray, with "Just Walkin' in the Rain."
威尔士亲王本人，约翰尼·雷，与“Just Walkin' in the Rain”。
["JUST WALKIN' IN THE RAIN" BY JOHNNIE RAY]
[约翰尼·雷的《就在雨中行走》]
Now, the way a story like this usually ends is that I reveal that this is why I'm in radio-- to make good on my father's legacy, to live the dream that he never got to live.
现在，像这样的故事通常结束的方式是，我透露这就是我在广播中的原因——为了兑现我父亲的遗产，实现他从未实现的梦想。
But I have to say, the fact is, I never knew him as a radio DJ.
但我不得不说，事实是，我从来不知道他是一名电台 DJ。
I did not know that he had ever done radio the entire time I grew up.
我不知道他在我成长过程中一直从事广播工作。
It was never discussed.
这从未被讨论过。
The recordings of him doing this stuff were packed away in the basement.
他做这些事情的录音被打包在地下室里。
Nobody talked about it.
没有人谈论这件事。
I never thought of him as somebody who did anything but certified public accounting.
我从来不认为他除了注册会计师之外还从事其他任何工作。
If my mom ever mentioned this, I do not remember it.
如果我妈妈曾经提到过这件事，我不记得了。
And I certainly didn't grow up with any special feeling about radio.
我在成长过程中对广播当然没有任何特殊的感觉。
I could care less about radio.
我不太关心广播。
Like most Americans, my medium of choice was television.
像大多数美国人一样，我选择的媒体是电视。
I got my first job with National Public Radio in Washington when I was 19 years old.
19 岁时，我在华盛顿国家公共广播电台找到了第一份工作。
And at that point, I simply wanted a job in the media.
那时，我只是想在媒体找到一份工作。
If an ad agency-- I was, like, a freshman in college.
如果是一家广告公司——我就像是一名大学新生。
If an ad agency had hired me that summer, right now, I would probably be doing Bud Light commercials, you know?
如果那年夏天有一家广告公司雇用了我，现在我可能会拍百威淡啤的广告，你知道吗？
I could just see the whole thing laying out that way.
我可以看到整个事情就是这样展开的。
And in 1978, when I started working at NPR, my parents absolutely did not want me to do it.
1978 年，当我开始在 NPR 工作时，我的父母绝对不希望我这样做。
It wasn't even, like, a judgment call.
这甚至不是一个判断电话。
They were completely against it for the next, I want to say, 10 years.
我想说的是，他们在接下来的十年里完全反对它。
Maybe it was 15 years, really.
也许真的是15年了。
I mean, they simply saw it like the way most parents would.
我的意思是，他们只是像大多数父母一样看待它。
They saw it as impractical.
他们认为这是不切实际的。
They worried that I would never make any decent money, never be able to support a family-- essentially, the reasons that my father quit radio.
他们担心我永远赚不到像样的钱，永远无法养家糊口——本质上，这就是我父亲退出电台的原因。
When I first dug out these tapes of my father about a year ago, I asked my dad if he ever wished he could still do radio, and he was completely unenthusiastic about the idea.
大约一年前，当我第一次翻出父亲的这些磁带时，我问父亲是否希望自己还能做广播，他对这个想法完全不感兴趣。
In all my life, I had only seen his desire to be on the radio once.
在我的一生中，我只见过一次他想要上广播的愿望。
And this was actually a couple years ago.
这实际上是几年前的事了。
I was filling in as the guest host of Talk of the Nation, this daily call-in show NPR does out of Washington.
我当时担任美国国家公共广播电台 (NPR) 在华盛顿举办的每日热线节目《国家之声》的客座主持人。
I was doing that for half a year.
我就这样干了半年。
And my father had never seen me host a radio show.
我父亲从未见过我主持广播节目。
And he and my mom drove down to Washington from Baltimore to watch me do the show.
他和我妈妈从巴尔的摩开车到华盛顿来看我表演。
And before the show, he asked me if he could read the news.
演出前，他问我是否可以看新闻。
And at first, I thought he was joking.
起初，我以为他是在开玩笑。
And I don't remember exactly what I said back.
我也不记得我到底说了些什么。
I joked something back at him.
我跟他开了几句玩笑。
And then later, as we got closer to going on the air, he asked again, that he would like to read the newscast, the NPR newscast at the top of the hour at the beginning of the show.
后来，当我们快要播出时，他又问，他想看新闻广播，即节目开始时的整点 NPR 新闻广播。
And I realized he was serious, and I had to explain to him that I didn't have any authority over that, that the NPR newscasters, they wrote their own news, and they delivered it themselves.
我意识到他是认真的，我必须向他解释我对此没有任何权力，NPR 新闻播音员他们自己写新闻，然后自己发布。
Then a few months after that, he and I were talking about what he's going to do after he retires.
几个月后，我和他谈论他退休后要做什么。
He still works, still works long, long hours.
他仍然工作，仍然工作很长时间。
And he told me he's been thinking about doing a little bit of radio work again after he retires.
他告诉我，他一直在考虑退休后再次从事一些广播工作。
That is, if he can find some radio station or some radio program that could use him in some way.
也就是说，如果他能找到一些可以以某种方式利用他的广播电台或广播节目。
OK, it's me again in 2026.
好吧，2026 年又是我。
So not that long after that, just four months after that, I asked my dad to co-host the show with me for Father's Day, so he did get his chance to get back on the radio.
所以在那之后不久，就在四个月后，我邀请我爸爸在父亲节与我共同主持这个节目，所以他确实有机会重新回到电台。
This is an episode that we do rerun now and then.
这是我们不时重播的一集。
So I'm just going to play you a little snippet or two from this.
所以我只想给你们播放一两个片段。
I have the script.
我有剧本。
From WBEZ Chicago, it's This American Life, the Father's Day edition.
来自芝加哥 WBEZ 的《This American Life》父亲节版。
I haven't done this in 40 years.
我已经 40 年没有做过这样的事了。
It brings back all kinds of memories.
它带回了各种各样的回忆。
Now, you better explain to our radio listeners in what context you actually sat in front of a radio microphone, Dad.
现在，你最好向我们的广播听众解释一下你实际上是在什么情况下坐在广播麦克风前的，爸爸。
Well-- Ira Glass And then my dad kind of recaps what you already heard about his radio career.
嗯——艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass） 然后我爸爸回顾了一下你们已经听说过的关于他的广播事业的事情。
I'm just going to pick up now a little later.
我稍后再接。
And today for Father's Day, my co-host will be my own father, Barry Glass, certified public accountant.
今天的父亲节，我的共同主持人将是我自己的父亲巴里·格拉斯（Barry Glass），他是一名注册会计师。
I know.
我知道。
This is our little Father's Day adventure together.
这是我们一起度过的父亲节小冒险。
Our program today will have four acts.
我们今天的节目有四幕。
Act One, "Sandra Tsing Loh Finds Out That the World Sees Her Father Very Differently from the Way She Sees Him." Act Two, "Dad's Music." We have a story from writer Sherman Alexie.
第一幕，“陆珊卓发现世人对她父亲的看法与她对他的看法截然不同”。第二幕，“爸爸的音乐”。我们有作家谢尔曼·亚历克西的故事。
Act Three, "The Moment Dad Left." Act Four, "Reconciling with Dad," a story from playwright Beau O'Reilly.
第三幕，“爸爸离开的那一刻”。第四幕“与爸爸和解”，剧作家博·奥莱利的故事。
I just want to say, we did this at the beginning of all the episodes in that first year or two.
我只想说，我们在头一两年的所有剧集开始时就这样做了。
We would list each act and say what the act would be.
我们会列出每个行为并说明该行为是什么。
And then at some point-- I don't know how many years in it was-- I realized like, oh, we don't have to do that.
然后在某个时刻——我不知道有多少年了——我意识到，哦，我们不必这样做。
Like, if we do the beginning of the show right, people would just want to hear what's going to happen next.
就像，如果我们把节目的开头做得好，人们就会想听接下来会发生什么。
And they kind of don't even care what's coming up.
他们甚至不关心接下来会发生什么。
Like, all you just want to know is, I guess it's going to be good today.
就像，你只想知道的是，我想今天会很好。
And then listing the acts like he just did, it just feels like it doesn't mean that much.
再把他刚才的举动一一列举出来，就是感觉意义不大。
You know what I mean?
你知道我的意思？
Unless you're a fan of one of those people in particular.
除非你特别喜欢其中一个人。
But otherwise, no, we don't do that very much anymore.
但除此之外，不，我们不再这样做了。
I will say, my dad really, really liked being on the air.
我会说，我爸爸真的非常喜欢在广播中。
His friends heard him.
他的朋友们听到了他的声音。
That was a really nice thing.
这真是一件好事。
And it was just, like, acknowledging this part of his life that, honestly, I didn't know about when I was growing up.
这就像承认他生活中的这一部分，说实话，我在成长过程中并不知道这一点。
There's a thing that happened with me and my dad, and it happened on tape.
我和我爸爸发生了一件事情，它发生在磁带上。
And for the life of me, I have no idea where this recording is, and I wish I could find it.
对于我的一生，我不知道这段录音在哪里，我希望我能找到它。
And that is, when we were taping for some episode, we got into a very real conversation, and the tape just kept rolling.
也就是说，当我们录制某集时，我们进行了一次非常真实的对话，并且磁带一直在滚动。
And I don't remember how we got on it, but it was just-- it really was about, was he a good dad?
我不记得我们是怎么开始的，但这只是——这真的是关于，他是一个好爸爸吗？
And he was really asking in a real way.
他确实是在以真实的方式问。
And then I felt like, I will try to meet him in this moment.
然后我觉得，此刻我会尽力去见他。
And I had been in therapy for a while.
我已经接受治疗一段时间了。
And my dad, I will say, was a very well-intentioned dad who really did try to do his best.
我会说，我的父亲是一位非常善意的父亲，他确实尽力做到了最好。
But his dad left when he was four or five years old.
但他的父亲在他四五岁的时候就离开了。
He didn't grow up with a dad.
他不是在父亲的陪伴下长大的。
And he just didn't know what it would be to be a dad.
他只是不知道成为一名父亲会是什么样子。
He really was inventing it as he went along.
他确实是边走边发明的。
And he could be very-- he would just get angry at random stuff in ways that I really felt like I spent my childhood kind of dodging around and trying to anticipate and trying to read his moods.
他可能会因为一些随机的事情而生气，我真的觉得我的童年就是在躲闪、试图预测和解读他的情绪。
And basically, I said there were just-- I explained to him there were ways that he treated us that really affected the way that I treat everyone in the world today, and went into maybe a little more depth than I'm doing with you here right now, because you are not my father.
基本上，我说，我向他解释说，他对待我们的某些方式确实影响了我今天对待世界上每个人的方式，而且可能比我现在在这里对你所做的更深入一些，因为你不是我的父亲。
And I said it really-- it was hard.
我确实说过——这很难。
And I said, I've been in therapy.
我说，我一直在接受治疗。
I'm trying to change the way I am with other people, so I'm not so alert all the time to how they're going to treat me, and just trust people a little more.
我正在努力改变我与他人相处的方式，所以我不会一直那么警惕他们将如何对待我，而只是多信任别人一点。
And I just kind of laid out things in a way.
我只是以某种方式列出了事情。
And he heard this, and he paused.
他听到这句话，顿时停了下来。
And he said-- honestly, he said, like, the perfect thing.
他说——老实说，他说，这是完美的事情。
He paused, and he said, I'm so sorry.
他停顿了一下，说，我很抱歉。
That must have been so tough for you.
这对你来说一定很艰难。
And that must be so tough for you.
这对你来说一定很难。
And he said, look, I was doing my best.
他说，看，我正在尽力而为。
I didn't know.
我不知道。
I didn't have a dad.
我没有爸爸。
I didn't know how to do it.
我不知道该怎么做。
I really was trying.
我真的很努力。
And then we never talked about it again.
然后我们就再也没有谈论过这件事。
And we really-- honestly, all the drama between me and my dad for my whole childhood, I know this sounds like a complete exaggeration to say, this is true, but I swear, emotionally, for me anyway, it really felt like in one conversation that was maybe eight minutes long, it was completely resolved, because he did the simple thing of saying that he heard me and just said he was sorry and he was trying, which I believe completely.
老实说，我和我父亲之间整个童年的所有戏剧性事件，我知道这听起来完全夸张，这是真的，但我发誓，在情感上，无论如何，对我来说，真的感觉在一次大约八分钟长的谈话中，问题完全解决了，因为他做了一件简单的事情，说他听到了我的声音，只是说他很抱歉，他正在努力，我完全相信这一点。
And very much in contrast-- and again, my mom is dead, so it feels a little weird to just say things about her here on this show.
与此形成鲜明对比的是，我妈妈已经去世了，所以在这个节目中谈论她的事情感觉有点奇怪。
But I don't know.
但我不知道。
Why talk about this if I'm not going to be real?
如果我不想说实话，为什么还要谈论这个呢？
My mom was much more defensive, even though she was a therapist.
我妈妈的防御性要强得多，尽管她是一名治疗师。
If my sisters and I would try to talk to her about, you do this thing, and you kind of-- whatever it was, she just could not hear it.
如果我和我的姐妹们试图和她谈论，你做了这件事，而你——无论是什么，她就是听不到。
She really couldn't.
她实在做不到。
And I do think that part of that is the mom in most families is just doing so much work to just run everything, whereas my dad was pretty absent and off at work, that I think she was much more protective.
我确实认为，部分原因是大多数家庭中的妈妈只是做很多工作来管理一切，而我的爸爸却很少上班，而且我认为她更具保护性。
And it was really hard for her to hear that we might have criticisms.
听到我们可能有批评，她真的很难受。
But yeah, and really, it was up until she died.
但是，是的，实际上，直到她去世为止。
That stuff never got resolved.
那件事一直没有得到解决。
Whereas with my dad, it got resolved so quickly.
而我父亲的问题很快就得到了解决。
I think about that sometimes, of just like, of the two of them, she was by far the more psychologically aware.
我有时会想，在他们两个人中，她的心理意识要强得多。
She was a therapist.
她是一名治疗师。
But he just handled that moment with such grace.
但他以如此优雅的方式处理了那一刻。
Let's move on.
让我们继续吧。
Coming up, the interview with my mom that I was talking about earlier, which has all that stuff that still makes my skin crawl.
接下来是我之前谈到的对我妈妈的采访，其中的所有内容仍然让我起鸡皮疙瘩。
When you hear it, you can judge if I'm overreacting, which I may be.
当你听到它时，你可以判断我是否反应过度，我可能是。
I don't know.
我不知道。
You be the judge.
你来当法官吧。
That's in a minute from Chicago Public Radio, when our program continues.
芝加哥公共广播电台一分钟后我们的节目仍在继续。
It's This American Life.
这就是美国生活。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Today's show, "Call Your Parents." I'm playing interviews that I did with my parents back when they were alive, which I find is generally the best time to do interviews with people.
今天的节目是《给你的父母打电话》。我正在播放我父母在世时对他们进行的采访，我发现这通常是采访人们的最佳时机。
I don't know.
我不知道。
Call me crazy.
叫我疯子吧。
I'm going to close out this episode with one final story.
我将用最后一个故事来结束这一集。
This is from an episode of our show called "Double Lives." It is the 10th episode we've ever made.
这是我们节目“双重生活”中的一集。这是我们制作的第十集。
This is January 1996.
这是 1996 年 1 月。
And before I play this for you, I had an experience with this story recently that I really don't think I'll forget.
在我为你们播放这个之前，我最近对这个故事有过一段经历，我真的认为我不会忘记。
I just got married this year, and it's a new marriage.
我今年刚刚结婚，而且是新的婚姻。
And the first time I met my wife's mom, about a year and a half ago, I guess it was-- her mom has dementia and lives in assisted living.
大约一年半前，我第一次见到我妻子的妈妈，我想是——她的妈妈患有痴呆症，生活在辅助生活中。
And when I met her, my wife, Susanna, and I took her mom for a ride somewhere in the car.
当我遇见她时，我和我的妻子苏珊娜带着她妈妈开车去某个地方兜风。
And when we were in the car, Susanna had the idea to play her mom this next story that I'm going to play you, because her mom was a therapist, just like my mom was a therapist.
当我们在车里时，苏珊娜想到在下一个故事中扮演她的妈妈，我将扮演你，因为她的妈妈是一名治疗师，就像我妈妈是一名治疗师一样。
And we thought it could be a way that her mom could get a sense of my mom, which we thought her mom would like.
我们认为这可能是她妈妈了解我妈妈的一种方式，我们认为她妈妈会喜欢。
And also-- I don't know-- this is such a corny thing to say, but this is the closest thing we would ever get to the two of them meeting.
而且——我不知道——这话实在是太老套了，但这是我们最接近他们两个见面的事情了。
And so we played this story where you'll hear, you do get such a strong sense of my mom's personality.
所以我们播放了这个故事，你会听到，你确实对我妈妈的个性有如此强烈的感觉。
This is a good introduction to my mom.
这是对我妈妈的一个很好的介绍。
And Susanna's mom really liked it.
苏珊娜的妈妈非常喜欢它。
She laughed at the funny parts.
她看到有趣的部分就笑了。
She got exactly what the story is about, even if she doesn't remember this at all today.
她完全明白了这个故事的内容，即使她今天根本不记得了。
Anyway, it was nice to have a recording that could do that.
不管怎样，能有一个录音能做到这一点真是太好了。
And then of course, this is also the story that really makes me squirm.
当然，这也是真正让我局促不安的故事。
Anyway, a heads-up for parents listening with their kids, this next story acknowledges the existence of sex.
不管怎样，下一个故事承认了性的存在，给与孩子一起倾听的父母们提个醒。
Here we go.
开始了。
Our parents can surprise us with what they don't tell us, with what they don't talk about, especially when it comes to sex.
我们的父母可能会用他们不告诉我们的事情、不谈论的事情让我们感到惊讶，尤其是在性方面。
Recently, I had this experience.
最近，我就有这样的经历。
An ex-girlfriend was in the gym looking through a copy of a Marie Claire magazine, women's magazine, and there was an article in it on women's fantasies, their sexual fantasies-- what do your man's dirty daydreams reveal about what he wants from you?
一个前女友在健身房翻一本《嘉人》杂志，女性杂志，里面有一篇关于女性幻想、性幻想的文章——你的男人的肮脏白日梦揭示了他想从你那里得到什么？
In the article, six sexperts-- that was the word they used, "sexperts"-- reveal the six most common male sex fantasy scenarios.
在这篇文章中，六位性专家——他们用的词是“性专家”——揭示了六种最常见的男性性幻想场景。
So my ex-girlfriend is reading.
所以我的前女友正在读书。
And there, in the third paragraph, one of the sexperts turns out to be my mother.
在第三段中，其中一位性专家就是我的母亲。
Yeah?
是的？
Ira Glass So I'd like to do a little interview.
Ira Glass 所以我想做一个简短的采访。
OK.
好的。
Ira Glass OK.
艾拉·格拉斯 好的。
So Mom, can I read to you a quote from an article?
妈妈，我可以给你读一篇文章中的引言吗？
Of course.
当然。
Ira Glass OK.
艾拉·格拉斯 好的。
Here it is.
这里是。
"Your man wants a woman who excites him through her own excitement.
“你的男人想要一个能通过自己的兴奋让他兴奋的女人。
You could stimulate yourself while he watches, or let him participate by moving his hand to where you want it."
你可以在他看的时候刺激自己，或者让他把手移到你想要的地方来参与。”
Yeah?
是吗？
Ira Glass That's you being quoted in Marie Claire.
艾拉·格拉斯 (Ira Glass) 这是《嘉人》杂志上引用的你的话。
All I know is that Anaheed was at the gym, and she opens up Marie Claire to an article called "Men's Sexual Fantasies." And it says at the top, "Here, sexperts reveal the six most common scenarios.
我只知道阿纳希德在健身房，她向《嘉人》杂志打开了一篇名为“男人的性幻想”的文章。它在顶部说：“在这里，性专家揭示了六种最常见的情况。
Unlock the secret longings and psyches of the modern men who fantasize." And you basically are one of the sexperts.
解开现代男性幻想的秘密渴望和心灵。”而你基本上就是性专家之一。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah, I am.
是的，我是。
Ira Glass I didn't really know you were a sexpert.
艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass）：我真的不知道你是个性专家。
What did you think I was?
你以为我是什么？
Ira Glass [CHUCKLES] Just another Jewish mom and psychologist.
艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass）[轻笑]又一位犹太妈妈和心理学家。
Uh-huh.
嗯嗯。
Ira Glass So it wasn't like you were a sexpert and you were keeping it from your family?
艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass）：所以你并不是一个性专家，并且你对你的家人隐瞒了这件事？
You're talking about my family meaning my children, not my husband?
你说的是我的家庭，是指我的孩子，而不是我的丈夫？
Yeah.
是的。
Mom Because he knows that I'm a sexpert.
妈妈因为他知道我是性专家。
I'm just going to pause, OK?
我要暂停一下，好吗？
So I'm not a parent.
所以我不是父母。
OK?
可以吗？
Like, I don't have children of my own, so maybe I'm not the best judge about whether I would say that to my adult child.
比如，我没有自己的孩子，所以对于我是否会对我成年的孩子说这句话，我可能不是最好的判断者。
But I think I might not.
但我想我可能不会。
I don't know.
我不知道。
[LAUGHS] But my children always seem embarrassed if I discuss anything sexual.
[笑]但是如果我讨论任何与性有关的事情，我的孩子们总是显得很尴尬。
So therefore, I tend not to around them.
因此，我倾向于不围绕他们。
When would you try to discuss something sexual with us?
您什么时候会尝试与我们讨论性方面的问题？
I might make a joke or say something that had a sexual connotation, and I'd get this disapproval.
我可能会开个玩笑或者说一些带有性暗示的话，我会遭到这种反对。
No?
没有？
Ira Glass Yeah, actually, I mean, it doesn't affect me in any way to think that you and Dad would be sexual with each other.
艾拉·格拉斯：是的，事实上，我的意思是，你和爸爸发生性关系对我来说没有任何影响。
In fact, I even remember as a teenager understanding that and being kind of reassured by it.
事实上，我什至记得当我十几岁的时候就明白了这一点，并因此感到安心。
Does that make any sense?
这有什么意义吗？
It makes a little bit of sense, but it really doesn't cover all the situations, if I'm just telling a joke or talking about something-- somebody else.
它有一点道理，但它确实不能涵盖所有情况，如果我只是讲一个笑话或谈论其他人的事情。
And I think it has to do with boundaries, and I think it has to do with that children, even adult children, do not like to regard their parents' sexuality.
我认为这与界限有关，而且我认为这与孩子们，甚至是成年孩子，不喜欢考虑父母的性取向有关。
Hmm.
嗯。
You know something, you're actually convincing me.
你知道一些事情，你确实说服了我。
[LAUGHTER] Well, let's do a little scientific test.
[笑声] 好吧，让我们做一个小小的科学测试。
Can you think of a sexual joke?
你能想到一个性笑话吗？
You just tell one right now, and I'll tell you my reaction.
你现在就告诉一个，我会告诉你我的反应。
I can't think of one.
我想不出一个。
Ira Glass [LAUGHS] And you know what I'm feeling right now?
Ira Glass [笑]你知道我现在的感受吗？
I'm feeling a profound--
我有一种深刻的感受——
Oh, I heard a wonderful joke, but I don't even know if it's a joke or a story.
哦，我听到一个很好的笑话，但我什至不知道这是一个笑话还是一个故事。
This is something that might be true, that when Neil Armstrong walked on the moon, and he said, "One giant step for man and one--" what is it?
这可能是真的，当尼尔·阿姆斯特朗在月球上行走时，他说：“一个人和一个人迈出了一大步——”那是什么？
"One giant step for mankind," or whatever.
“人类迈出的一大步”之类的。
"One small step for man--" Mom Right, right.
“人类的一小步——”妈妈 对，对。
So that's it.
就是这样。
Right, "One small step for man, one giant step for mankind." And then he also said, "Good luck, Mr. Gorsky." And for years, people have been asking him what that meant.
没错，“个人的一小步，人类的一大步”。然后他还说：“祝你好运，戈尔斯基先生。”多年来，人们一直在问他这意味着什么。
And he would never tell them.
他永远不会告诉他们。
And then, this year, someone brought it up again.
然后，今年，有人再次提出这个问题。
What did you mean when you said, "Good luck, Mr. Gorsky"?
当你说“祝你好运，戈尔斯基先生”时，你是什么意思？
And he said, well, I can tell now because Mr. Gorsky died this year.
他说，好吧，我现在可以知道了，因为戈尔斯基先生今年去世了。
When I was a little boy, Mr. Gorsky was our next-door neighbor.
当我还是个小男孩的时候，戈尔斯基先生是我们的隔壁邻居。
And I was playing outside one day, and their bedroom window was open.
有一天我在外面玩，他们卧室的窗户开着。
And I heard Mrs. Gorsky say, oral sex?
我听到戈尔斯基夫人说，口交？
You want me to give you oral sex?
你想让我给你口交吗？
You'll get oral sex from me the day that boy next door walks on the moon.
当邻家男孩登上月球的那一天，你就会从我这里得到口交。
[LAUGHS] Ira Glass Well, now I'm examining my own feelings, and I have to say, I did get very nervous there, in a way that does not correspond, perhaps, with shrugging my shoulders at the notion of you having some sexual life and sexual thoughts.
[笑] Ira Glass 嗯，现在我正在审视自己的感受，我不得不说，我确实感到非常紧张，在某种程度上，也许与我对你有一些性生活和性想法耸耸肩的想法并不相符。
Yeah.
是的。
Ira Glass OK, I'm just going to jump in here live from the year 2026 to say, like, I've just been spending the last minute, I feel like I can feel my blood racing.
Ira Glass 好吧，我要从 2026 年开始现场直播说，就像，我刚刚度过了最后一分钟，我感觉我能感觉到我的血液在加速。
I just feel like my temperature has risen.
我只感觉我的体温升高了。
And I just feel like, what is happening?
我只是觉得，发生了什么事？
Like, what is happening?
就像，发生了什么事？
Is that wrong?
这是错误的吗？
Are you on my side?
你站在我这边吗？
Can I just say, also, like, she's getting this reaction out of me today, in 2026?
我也可以说，2026 年的今天，她从我身上得到了这种反应吗？
She's been dead for 20 years.
她已经去世20年了。
And still, she can get to me.
尽管如此，她还是能找到我。
I mean, I guess that's what it means to have parents.
我的意思是，我想这就是有父母的意义。
Yeah.
是的。
Ira Glass So let me read you some of your other quotes here.
艾拉·格拉斯 (Ira Glass) 那么，让我在这里读一下您的其他一些名言。
All right.
好吧。
Ira Glass In the fantasy of "man dominates woman," you're quoted as saying-- says Dr. Glass, quote, "In a caring relationship, it's certainly not abusive or unhealthy if the fantasy is played out in a light, teasing way." You're also quoted extensively in fantasy number five, "spontaneous encounter with a beautiful stranger." The key quote is this one, as far as I'm concerned-- "Go to a restaurant, and at first pretend you don't know each other, suggests Dr. Glass." Which when I read that, it actually explains some dinners I've had with you and Dad.
艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass） 在“男人主宰女人”的幻想中，格拉斯博士说，“在一段充满关爱的关系中，如果幻想以一种轻松、戏弄的方式进行，那当然不是虐待或不健康的。”你在第五部奇幻作品《与美丽的陌生人的自发邂逅》中也被广泛引用。就我而言，关键的引言是这样的——“去一家餐馆，首先假装你们不认识对方，格拉斯博士建议道。”当我读到这篇文章时，它实际上解释了我和你和爸爸一起吃的一些晚餐。
[LAUGHS] Ira Glass I thought, well, you didn't talk very much between the two of you.
[笑] Ira Glass 我想，嗯，你们两个之间没有聊太多。
So if you actually-- have you done this?
那么，如果你真的——你做到了这一点吗？
Have you gone to a restaurant with Dad and pretended you didn't know each other?
你有没有和爸爸一起去餐馆假装不认识？
No. Ira Glass No. But if you did, you're saying that--
不。艾拉·格拉斯 不。但如果你这样做了，你就是在说——
We've gone to restaurants with you and pretended we didn't know you.
我们和你一起去餐馆，假装不认识你。
[LAUGHS] Mom --let's say that your manner of dressing didn't exactly conform to the style--
[笑]妈妈——假设你的穿衣风格不太符合风格——
--and dress-- Ira Glass I think everybody-- you know.
——还有着装——艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass） 我想每个人——你知道。
--of the other people in the restaurant.
——餐厅里的其他人。
[LAUGHS] Mom Back when Daddy-- Daddy would look at you, and he would start popping Gelusil-- [LAUGHS]
[笑]妈妈回来的时候，爸爸会看着你，然后他会开始弹出Gelusil-[笑]
[LAUGHS] Mom --when we'd go out to eat.
[笑]妈妈——当我们出去吃饭的时候。
And I'd say, now, Barry, people are going to look at him, they're going to look at us, and they're going to know that we did not pick out his clothes.
我想说，现在，巴里，人们会看着他，他们会看着我们，他们会知道我们没有挑选他的衣服。
[LAUGHS]
[笑]
So now that I know that you're this big sexpert, do you have any sex advice for me?
既然我知道你是个性专家，你能给我什么性方面的建议吗？
I'll just say, in 2026, daring question.
我只想说，2026 年，这是一个大胆的问题。
So now that I know that you're this big sexpert, do you have any sex advice for me?
既然我知道你是个性专家，你能给我什么性方面的建议吗？
Find a nice girl and get married.
找一个漂亮的女孩然后结婚。
[LAUGHS]
[笑]
That's not sex advice.
这不是性建议。
Mom [LAUGHS] We always end up this way, don't we?
妈妈[笑]我们总是这样结束，不是吗？
With that particular advice.
有了这个特别的建议。
Yeah, that's-- I know.
是的，那是——我知道。
[LAUGHS] I know.
[笑]我知道。
I could ask you any question--
我可以问你任何问题——
That's right.
没错。
Ira Glass --and that would be the advice.
艾拉·格拉斯——这就是建议。
Well, that was the first rule of journalism you taught me.
嗯，这是你教给我的第一条新闻规则。
Is what?
是什么？
Mom No matter what they ask you, be sure to get your point in.
妈妈，无论他们问你什么，一定要表达你的观点。
[LAUGHS] When you were first being interviewed by people, this is what I told you to say.
[笑]当你第一次接受人们采访时，这就是我告诉你的。
Right.
对。
Ira Glass [LAUGHS] Well, I'm glad-- well, I'm glad we got to that, then.
Ira Glass [笑] 嗯，我很高兴——嗯，我很高兴我们能做到这一点。
My mom, Dr. Shirley Glass, in Baltimore.
我的妈妈雪莉·格拉斯博士在巴尔的摩。
I'd just say, hear how nicely we're getting along?
我只想说，听听我们相处得有多好？
We actually-- that's a really sweet conversation to have with your mom.
事实上，我们和你妈妈的谈话非常甜蜜。
And before these appearances on the radio, on the radio show, I just don't think that would have happened.
在这些出现在广播电台、广播节目之前，我认为这不会发生。
There's just something so-- we were so in a nice, friendly groove.
就是这样——我们的关系非常好、友好。
Even though we are kind of making little points with each other, it's just like a very lovely thing.
尽管我们之间有一些小问题，但这就像一件非常可爱的事情。
And it continued that way, more or less, until she died.
或多或少，这种情况一直持续到她去世。
And when we would see each other in real life, not just on the radio, we were more open with each other.
当我们在现实生活中而不只是在广播中见面时，我们彼此更加开放。
It was just easier.
这更容易。
They stopped telling me I was wasting my life in radio.
他们不再告诉我我在广播中浪费生命。
And I think, if I imagine it from their point of view, I think that after we did these things on the radio, they knew, when we see each other in real life, that I wasn't going to sit them down and question their choices, question them.
我认为，如果我从他们的角度想象，我认为在我们在广播中做了这些事情之后，他们知道，当我们在现实生活中见到对方时，我不会让他们坐下来质疑他们的选择，质疑他们。
Doing these stories on the radio, it's like we practiced getting along together nicely in public.
在广播中播放这些故事，就像我们练习在公共场合和谐相处一样。
I think that public act helped them get it into their heads that I really did accept them, and that the period of my life where I questioned them so much in my 20s was really long over.
我认为公共行为帮助他们认识到我确实接受了他们，而且我在 20 多岁的时候对他们提出如此多的质疑的时期已经结束了。
So that's how the radio show changed my life, or definitely one of the biggest ways.
这就是广播节目改变我生活的方式，或者绝对是最大的方式之一。
I think my dad would like that we got that song.
我想我爸爸会喜欢我们得到那首歌。
If you liked this episode of our program, like I said earlier, this was originally made as a bonus episode for our Life Partners.
如果您喜欢我们节目的这一集，就像我之前所说的那样，这最初是作为我们的生活伙伴的奖励剧集而制作的。
We've done over 20 of these.
我们已经做了 20 多个这样的事情。
And they're all like this.
他们都是这样的。
They're kind of like behind-the-scenes sort of stuff.
它们有点像幕后之类的东西。
Life Partners also get ad-free listening.
Life Partners 还可以获得无广告的聆听体验。
They get the special greatest hits archive of the show that appears in their podcast feed.
他们获得了出现在他们的播客提要中的节目的特别精选档案。
So when they want a good episode, they can just scroll through the podcast feed, and like, oh, there's a greatest hit.
因此，当他们想要观看精彩的剧集时，他们只需滚动浏览播客提要，然后就会想，哦，有一个最热门的节目。
If you sign up yourself, you get all that.
如果您自己注册，您就可以获得所有这些。
And most important, it helps us fund everything we're doing.
最重要的是，它帮助我们为我们正在做的一切提供资金。
At this point, Life Partners pay for a fourth of our budget.
此时，生活伙伴支付了我们预算的四分之一。
They are essential to us being able to spend the kind of time we do on all of the stories we bring you.
它们对于我们能够花大量时间来报道我们为您带来的所有故事至关重要。
If you're a regular listener, you perhaps can tell how long some of the stories must take to make.
如果您是一名普通听众，您也许可以知道某些故事需要多长时间才能完成。
To sign up, go to thisamericanlife.org/lifepartners, or you can sign up right in the Apple Podcast app.
要注册，请访问 thisamericanlife.org/lifepartners，或者您也可以直接在 Apple Podcast 应用程序中注册。
OK, so the people who helped put together today's program include Michal Comite, Seth Lind, Molly Marcello, Katherine Rae Mondo, Stowe Nelson, Ruthie Petitto, Anthony Roman, Ryan Rumery, Lilly Sullivan, Frances Swanson, Christopher Swetala, Nancy Updike, Julie Whitaker, and Diane Wu.
好的，帮助整理今天节目的人包括 Michal Comite、Seth Lind、Molly Marcello、Katherine Rae Mondo、Stowe Nelson、Ruthie Petitto、Anthony Roman、Ryan Rumery、Lilly Sullivan、Frances Swanson、Christopher Swetala、Nancy Updike、Julie Whitaker 和 Diane Wu。
Our managing editor is Sarah Abdurrahman.
我们的总编辑是萨拉·阿卜杜拉赫曼 (Sarah Abdurrahman)。
Our senior editor is David Kestenbaum.
我们的高级编辑是大卫·凯斯滕鲍姆。
Our executive editor, Emanuele Berry.
我们的执行编辑埃马努埃莱·贝里。
Special thanks today to my sister, Randi Murray, in San Francisco, the one other living person who gets today's program the way that I do.
今天特别感谢我在旧金山的姐姐兰迪·穆雷，她是另一位像我一样在世的人。
Thanks also to Mr. Gorsky, who does not exist and who Neil Armstrong did not mention on the moon.
还要感谢戈尔斯基先生，他并不存在，尼尔·阿姆斯特朗也没有在月球上提到过他。
Apparently, my mom got the joke from The Tonight Show.
显然，我妈妈从《今夜秀》中听到了这个笑话。
In other breaking news, a priest, a rabbi, Adolf Hitler, and a kangaroo did not walk into a bar together.
在其他突发新闻中，一名牧师、一名拉比、阿道夫·希特勒和一只袋鼠并没有一起走进酒吧。
This American Life is delivered to public radio stations by PRX, the Public Radio Exchange.
《美国生活》由公共广播电台 PRX 向公共广播电台播出。
Thanks, as always, to our program's co-founder, Mr. Torey Malatia.
一如既往地感谢我们项目的联合创始人 Torey Malatia 先生。
You know he's starting a new ice cream shop?
你知道他要开一家新冰淇淋店吗？
He is amazing at making ice cream, but just terrible at naming flavors.
他在制作冰淇淋方面很出色，但在命名口味方面却很糟糕。
You have your choice of pink, yellow, green, or charcoal.
您可以选择粉色、黄色、绿色或木炭色。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Back next week with more stories of This American Life.
下周我们将带来更多《美国生活》的故事。
This American Life is produced in collaboration with WBEZ Chicago and delivered to stations by PRX The Public Radio Exchange.
《This American Life》与 WBEZ Chicago 合作制作，并由 PRX 公共广播电台传送到各电台。