817: The Cavalry Is Not Coming - This American Life
You are using an outdated browser.
您正在使用过时的浏览器。
Please upgrade your browser or activate Google Chrome Frame to improve your experience.
请升级您的浏览器或激活 Google Chrome 浏览器内嵌框架以改善您的体验。
Sign up for a free Life Partners trial, and you can watch the video “A Night of Stories and Improv.”
注册免费试用《Life Partners》，您可以观看视频“故事与即兴表演之夜”。
00:00 00:00 Transcript Share This American Life Life Partners How to Listen Episodes Recommended About Overview Staff Announcements Fellowships Jobs Music Make Radio On The Road FAQ Submissions Merch Contact Us Our Other Shows Merch Follow Us Life Partners Subscribe to our newsletter Full episode Toggle Audio and Transcript Sync Transcript | Episode #817 | December 1, 2023 817: The Cavalry Is Not Coming Note: This American Life is produced for the ear and designed to be heard.
00:00 00:00 文字记录 分享此 美国生活 生活伙伴 如何收听 剧集 推荐 关于 概述 员工公告 奖学金 工作 音乐 在路上制作电台 常见问题解答 提交 商品 联系我们 我们的其他节目 商品 关注我们 生活伙伴 订阅我们的时事通讯 整集 切换音频和文字记录同步 文字记录 | 内容第 817 集 | 2023 年 12 月 1 日 817：骑兵不会来 注：《美国生活》是为耳朵而制作的，旨在让人们听到。
If you are able, we strongly encourage you to listen to the audio, which includes emotion and emphasis that's not on the page.
如果可以的话，我们强烈建议您收听音频，其中包括页面上没有的情感和重点。
Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors.
文字记录是使用语音识别软件和人工转录员结合生成的，可能包含错误。
Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print.
请在印刷版引用前检查相应的音频。
Prologue: Prologue Ira Glass
序言：序言 艾拉·格拉斯
Saddam Sayyaleh begins each day with a 6 AM walk around Cairo.
萨达姆·萨亚拉 (Saddam Sayyaleh) 每天早上 6 点都会在开罗周围散步。
It's the only 30 minutes of his day he gets to himself, before emails and meetings and the chaos of his enormously stressful job begins.
这是他一天中仅有的 30 分钟独处时间，之后就要开始处理电子邮件、开会以及开始他压力巨大的工作带来的混乱。
His job?
他的工作？
Right now, he's in charge of getting trucks filled with humanitarian aid into Gaza during the current war.
目前，他负责在当前战争期间将装满人道主义援助的卡车运送到加沙。
He does this for a big American non-profit, called ANERA, that's sent aid into Gaza for decades.
他为一家名为 ANERA 的美国大型非营利组织做这件事，该组织几十年来一直向加沙提供援助。
But since the war, every day, there are bottlenecks and logistical challenges, with all the different governments and agencies and militaries and aid groups involved.
但自战争以来，每一天都存在瓶颈和后勤挑战，所有不同的政府、机构、军队和援助团体都参与其中。
I talked to him at the end of a very long day of this, and-- I don't know, maybe this is a sign of his diplomatic skills-- he seemed so calm, so chill, that I couldn't not ask him about it.
在漫长的一天结束后，我与他进行了交谈，而且——我不知道，也许这是他外交技巧的标志——他看起来很平静，很冷静，我无法不问他这件事。
It is.
这是。
(LAUGHING) I have to tell you, like, I learned the hard way to hold myself together.
（笑）我必须告诉你，我学会了如何让自己保持镇定。
I think I'll break down after things ease up, but now, I can't.
我想事情缓和之后我会崩溃，但现在，我不能。
[LAUGHS] So I'm just keeping it-- I'm keeping it together.
[笑]所以我只是保留它——我把它放在一起。
I talked to Saddam twice, just before the recent ceasefire between Israel and Hamas and then during the ceasefire.
我与萨达姆谈过两次话，一次是在以色列和哈马斯最近停火之前，一次是在停火期间。
I was interested in talking to him, because the stakes of any pause in fighting seem so high for aid workers like him.
我有兴趣与他交谈，因为对于像他这样的救援人员来说，任何暂停战斗的风险似乎都很高。
Before the ceasefire, so little humanitarian aid was actually making it into Gaza-- an average of only 55 trucks a day, according to the UN.
在停火之前，实际上进入加沙的人道主义援助非常少——据联合国称，平均每天只有 55 辆卡车。
Remember, at that point already, 1.7 million people in Gaza were displaced from their homes.
请记住，当时加沙已有 170 万人流离失所。
Doctors had been operating without anesthesia.
医生在没有麻醉的情况下进行了手术。
They didn't have painkillers and basic medicines.
他们没有止痛药和基本药物。
Food and water were in short supply.
食物和水供应短缺。
A pause in fighting would mean a chance to finally get stuff through, and I wanted to know how he was preparing and what he hoped would happen.
战斗的暂停意味着最终有机会解决问题，我想知道他准备得怎么样以及他希望发生什么。
And the answer was, about his preparations, his team in Gaza was going around, doing what they had basically been doing for weeks-- trying to figure out what the greatest needs were, like, for instance, in the schools and other buildings that are now the main shelters for over a million people in Gaza.
答案是，关于他的准备工作，他在加沙的团队正在四处走动，做他们几周来基本上一直在做的事情——试图找出最大的需求是什么，例如，学校和其他建筑现在是加沙超过一百万人的主要避难所。
These are incredibly overcrowded-- people sleeping on the ground everywhere.
这些地方非常拥挤——到处都有人睡在地上。
Like, just to give you a bit of an image, women are sleeping inside the rooms inside the school shelter, and the men are sleeping in the yard of the school.
就像，只是给你一个形象，女人睡在学校避难所内的房间里，男人睡在学校的院子里。
But also, a lot of families are on the streets, and it's winter.
而且，现在是冬天，很多家庭都流落街头。
It's freezing.
天很冷。
And that's when our team in Gaza was like, we need tents, we need mattresses, we need blankets.
就在那时，我们在加沙的团队就想，我们需要帐篷，我们需要床垫，我们需要毯子。
And that's what I've been doing here.
这就是我一直在这里所做的事情。
And immediately, we started procurement of tents in Egypt.
我们立即开始在埃及采购帐篷。
Like, the first thing I did is I went to this sports shop at Decathlon, like the sports shop.
就像，我做的第一件事就是去了迪卡侬的这家体育用品店，就像体育用品店一样。
And I told them, like, how many tents do you have?
我告诉他们，比如，你们有多少个帐篷？
Because they're like-- they're for camping.
因为它们就像——它们是用来露营的。
They're already there.
他们已经在那里了。
We can procure immediately.
我们可以立即采购。
But they didn't buy these tents, because there was a problem with them.
但他们没有购买这些帐篷，因为它们有问题。
And to explain the problem, I should remind you that even before this war, for years now, Israel has controlled nearly everything that went in and out of Gaza.
为了解释这个问题，我应该提醒大家，即使在这场战争之前，多年来，以色列已经控制了几乎所有进出加沙的东西。
Gaza is surrounded by a giant fence.
加沙被巨大的栅栏包围。
As part of that, Israel restricted specific certain metals and chemicals and fabrics from entering Gaza, because they said they didn't want them to fall into Hamas's hands and get turned into weapons against Israel or find some military use.
作为其中的一部分，以色列限制特定的某些金属、化学品和织物进入加沙，因为他们表示不希望这些物品落入哈马斯手中并变成针对以色列的武器或找到一些军事用途。
There's an official list of restricted stuff.
有一份受限制物品的官方清单。
Like with a tent, is the fabric-- there are certain type of fabrics that are not allowed.
就像帐篷一样，面料也是如此——有些类型的面料是不允许的。
And then, we were like, OK, so it has materials that is not allowed.
然后，我们就想，好吧，所以它有不允许的材料。
So we need to design our own tents.
所以我们需要设计自己的帐篷。
And then, we needed to find a vendor who is willing to produce tents on certain specifications from scratch, immediately.
然后，我们需要立即找到愿意从头开始生产特定规格帐篷的供应商。
Like, I mean, this vendor-- I met him on the same day.
就像，我是说，这个供应商——我在同一天见到了他。
And then, I go back to him after four hours, and I tell him, I need 2,000 tents next week.
然后，四个小时后我回到他身边，告诉他，下周我需要 2,000 个帐篷。
And then, immediately, six workshops in Cairo-- they start producing these tents.
然后，开罗的六个车间立即开始生产这些帐篷。
Next week.
下周。
So maybe in time for the ceasefire, maybe not.
所以也许能及时停火，也许不能。
We were talking two days before the ceasefire started.
我们在停火开始前两天进行了交谈。
But Saddam's organization, ANERA, had a whole bunch of other stuff that was ready to go and enter Gaza.
但萨达姆的组织 ANERA 拥有一大堆其他东西，准备进入加沙。
And there's only one place to do that-- the Rafah crossing from Egypt into Gaza.
只有一个地方可以做到这一点——从埃及进入加沙的拉法过境点。
And Saddam said the trucks could be delayed there for days while Egyptian and Israeli officials each inspect the trucks to make sure that they are, in fact, filled with humanitarian aid.
萨达姆表示，这些卡车可能会在那里耽搁几天，而埃及和以色列官员都会检查这些卡车，以确保它们确实装满了人道主义援助物资。
It is never clear how many of these trucks will make it through or if any will get through.
目前尚不清楚这些卡车中有多少辆能够通过，或者是否有一辆能够通过。
Israel used to do these inspections at a big checkpoint, called Kerem Shalom, that was fully equipped to handle lots of inspections.
以色列过去常常在一个名为凯雷姆沙洛姆的大型检查站进行这些检查，该检查站设备齐全，可以处理大量检查。
But that checkpoint has been closed since the war started.
但自战争开始以来，该检查站就已关闭。
The Rafah crossing just isn't set up for a high volume of trucks.
拉法过境点不适合大量卡车通过。
And Saddam and other people trying to get humanitarian aid into Gaza understand all of that, but still do not understand the delays they see from day-to-day.
萨达姆和其他试图向加沙提供人道主义援助的人了解这一切，但仍然不明白他们每天看到的延误。
It seems arbitrary to them.
对他们来说这似乎是任意的。
Just yesterday, 79 trucks got in.
就在昨天，有 79 辆卡车驶入。
But to give you a comparison, on a normal day before the war, it would have been 500 trucks a day.
但为了给你一个比较，在战前的正常一天，每天会有 500 辆卡车。
Like, it's shocking that only 79 trucks yesterday got in.
令人震惊的是，昨天只有 79 辆卡车进入。
Yeah.
是的。
Saddam Sayyaleh And some days, there were zero trucks going in.
萨达姆·萨亚勒（Saddam Sayyaleh） 有时，零辆卡车驶入。
Saddam, like, why are so few trucks getting through?
萨达姆，为什么卡车这么少通过？
So this is a question ANERA have been asking all along.
这是 ANERA 一直在问的问题。
We can't find the answer.
我们找不到答案。
We don't know the answer.
我们不知道答案。
We reached out repeatedly to Israeli authorities to find out why more trucks aren't getting through the one checkpoint that they've allowed into Gaza.
我们多次与以色列当局联系，以了解为什么更多的卡车没有通过他们允许进入加沙的一个检查站。
But we never got a reply.
但我们从未得到回复。
Once Saddam's trucks, full of aid, get into Gaza, they faced another problem before the ceasefire when we first talked.
当萨达姆的卡车满载援助物资进入加沙时，我们第一次交谈时，他们在停火之前面临着另一个问题。
Other trucks inside Gaza were supposed to take the aid to where it needed to go inside Gaza, and those trucks needed fuel.
加沙境内的其他卡车本应将援助物资运送到加沙境内需要前往的地方，而这些卡车需要燃料。
Fuel had been lacking for over two weeks.
燃料已经短缺两个多星期了。
Like, there's no fuel inside Gaza.
就像，加沙境内没有燃料。
So ANERA have been very creative.
所以 ANERA 非常有创意。
Like, we've been using trolleys.
就像，我们一直在使用手推车。
We've been using livestock, donkeys, horses, to deliver the aid.
我们一直使用牲畜、驴、马来提供援助。
Wait, wait, wait, you're using horses and donkeys to deliver international aid?
等等，等等，你用马和驴来运送国际援助？
This is what is needed.
这就是所需要的。
Imagine there is no fuel.
想象一下没有燃料。
Imagine the size of Gaza.
想象一下加沙的面积。
So the ceasefire started the day after Thanksgiving, though, obviously, that is not how the participants viewed that particular date.
因此，停火是在感恩节后的第二天开始的，但显然，参与者并不是这样看待这个特定日期的。
The number of trucks crossing into Gaza with humanitarian aid roughly tripled.
携带人道主义援助进入加沙的卡车数量大约增加了两倍。
I talked to Saddam again on the seventh day of the ceasefire-- the last day.
我在停火的第七天——最后一天——再次与萨达姆交谈。
He told me his organization, ANERA, got more aid delivered in those seven days than it had in the two months of war before that.
他告诉我，他的组织 ANERA 在这 7 天内获得的援助比之前两个月的战争中提供的援助还要多。
That's actually what makes me really sad, is that we can get more and more aid in, but these inspections, delays-- as of November 29, at least 572 trucks were waiting on the road connecting the Egyptian and Israeli crossing, for the Israeli inspection of each truck takes hours.
这实际上让我非常难过，就是我们可以得到越来越多的援助，但是这些检查、延误——截至11月29日，至少有572辆卡车在连接埃及和以色列过境点的道路上等待，因为以色列对每辆卡车的检查需要几个小时。
Not yet.
还没有。
Not yet.
还没有。
Ira Glass Production delays, he said.
他说，Ira Glass 生产延迟。
Quality issues.
质量问题。
He's hoping they'll be ready next week.
他希望他们下周就能准备好。
A day after that conversation, the ceasefire ended.
谈话一天后，停火结束。
Now, it's unclear exactly what it's going to be like next week and whether he's going to be able to get stuff through.
现在，还不清楚下周会是什么样子，以及他是否能够完成任务。
The first night the war resumed, my coworker, one of our producers Miki Meek and I, spoke with Juliette Touma, Director of Communications at UNRWA, UN Palestine Refugee Agency, which runs the shelters across Gaza that are housing now over a million people.
战争重新开始的第一个晚上，我和我的同事、制片人之一米基·米克 (Miki Meek) 与联合国巴勒斯坦难民署近东救济工程处通讯主任朱丽叶·图马 (Juliette Touma) 进行了交谈，该机构负责管理加沙各地的避难所，目前已容纳超过一百万人。
That is, by the way, the UN agency that's had more of its staff killed than any UN mission in any conflict in the history of the United Nations.
顺便说一句，在联合国历史上的任何冲突中，这个联合国机构的工作人员遇难人数比任何联合国特派团都多。
There's been 111 deaths in Gaza since October.
自10月以来，加沙已有111人死亡。
Juliette Touma said that no trucks entered Gaza that first day, not one, after the pause in the war.
朱丽叶特·图玛表示，战争暂停后的第一天，没有卡车进入加沙，没有一辆卡车进入加沙。
So no humanitarian assistance, no fuel, no cooking gas, has come into Gaza today, and the bombardments and the airstrikes from the Israeli forces have continued across the Gaza Strip, including in the South.
因此，今天没有人道主义援助、燃料、烹饪用气进入加沙，以色列军队的轰炸和空袭仍在加沙地带继续，包括南部地区。
The supplies that you were able to deliver during the pause-- do you guys have any sort of estimate for how long the supplies you have can last?
你们在暂停期间能够提供的物资——你们对你们拥有的物资能持续多久有什么估计吗？
Is it days?
是几天吗？
Is it weeks?
是几周吗？
It's usually days.
一般都是几天吧
I don't think it's weeks.
我不认为这是几周。
What are you hearing from staff who are in Gaza today?
您今天从加沙的工作人员那里听到了什么？
Fear, concern.
恐惧、担忧。
We are back to square zero, which is really, really not good.
我们又回到了零，这真的非常不好。
I mean, our colleagues-- many of them were displaced themselves.
我的意思是，我们的同事——他们中的许多人自己也流离失所了。
Many have lost loved ones, lost property, including homes.
许多人失去了亲人、财产，包括房屋。
Do you have any sense-- today, nothing got through.
你有没有感觉——今天什么都没发生。
Do you have any sense of what the days are going to be like ahead of-- how much aid is going to get through?
你是否知道未来的日子会是什么样子——需要多少援助？
So it's day by day.
就这样一天天过去了。
Juliette Touma Mm-hmm.
朱丽叶当玛 嗯嗯。
And well, sometimes, even hour by hour, I would say.
好吧，有时，甚至每小时，我会说。
There's so much uncertainty out there, so much.
那里有太多的不确定性，太多了。
And everything they've been able to get into Gaza is nowhere close to what's actually needed.
他们能够进入加沙的一切都与实际需要相去甚远。
The needs are so immense.
需求是如此巨大。
Today, on our program, what happens when people desperately need help, need rescue.
今天，在我们的节目中，当人们迫切需要帮助、需要救援时会发生什么。
And the cavalry simply cannot rush in and save the day and fix everything.
而骑兵根本无法冲进去挽救局面并解决一切问题。
When that happens, people get ingenious.
当这种情况发生时，人们就会变得聪明起来。
People invent little solutions.
人们发明了一些小解决方案。
People do that thing where you stop thinking about the big picture.
当你不再考虑大局时，人们就会做这样的事情。
Because the big picture is way too grim.
因为大局太严峻了。
And you just do the next task in front of you, and then the next one after that, and the next one after that, hoping it all helps, at least a little.
你只需做你面前的下一个任务，然后是下一个任务，再然后是下一个任务，希望这一切都有帮助，至少有一点帮助。
It is a very particular kind of experience.
这是一种非常特殊的体验。
From WBEZ Chicago, it's This American Life.
来自芝加哥 WBEZ 的《This American Life》。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Stay with us.
留在我们身边。
Act One, Serious as a Heart Attack.
第一幕，严重得像心脏病发作。
So let's kick things off with this man, who's trying to do something that is so hard to do, and he knows very well that it is completely up to him.
因此，让我们从这个人开始吧，他正在尝试做一些很难做到的事情，而且他非常清楚这完全取决于他。
The cavalry is not coming, and he's figuring out how to hang on and make the best of things.
骑兵不会来，他正在考虑如何坚持下去并充分利用一切。
He talked to Nancy Updike.
他与南希·厄普代克交谈。
It's just normal now in America for people to start a GoFundMe campaign if they have medical bills.
现在在美国，如果人们有医疗费用，发起 GoFundMe 活动已经很正常了。
The insane bills have become routine, so the insane DIY process of raising the money has also become routine.
疯狂的账单已经成为家常便饭，因此疯狂的DIY筹集资金的过程也成为家常便饭。
You'd be insane not to.
不这么做你就疯了。
But several weeks ago, I saw a new development in the field-- new to me, anyway.
但几周前，我看到了该领域的新发展——无论如何，这对我来说是新的。
The CEO of a hospital had started a GoFundMe campaign to try and save the hospital.
一家医院的首席执行官发起了一项 GoFundMe 活动，试图拯救这家医院。
It's called Bucktail Medical Center, and the CEO is Tim Reeves.
它叫巴克泰尔医疗中心，首席执行官是蒂姆·里夫斯。
Tim says dire things in a calm voice.
蒂姆用平静的声音说出可怕的话。
When we got on the phone and I asked him how quickly the hospital might close, he said--
当我们通电话时，我问他医院多久会关闭，他说——
I've put aside, in different accounts, enough money for one payroll.
我在不同的账户里存了足够的钱来支付一份工资。
Trying to keep that two-week payroll in reserve, I hope, buys us two weeks.
我希望，尝试保留两周的工资可以为我们赢得两周的时间。
But I can't guarantee that.
但我不能保证这一点。
Bucktail Medical Center, this hospital, is a small single-story concrete building serving a bit more than 3,000 people in Renovo, Pennsylvania.
Bucktail 医疗中心是宾夕法尼亚州雷诺沃市的一栋小型单层混凝土建筑，为 3,000 多人提供服务。
It's the middle north-ish part of the state-- a lot of big forests and hunting land around there.
这是该州的中北部地区——周围有很多大森林和狩猎场。
Bucktail is the only hospital in the county.
Bucktail 是该县唯一的医院。
It's got a community clinic, 24-hour emergency room, ambulance service, 16 beds for acute care, and a small on-site nursing home.
这里有社区诊所、24 小时急诊室、救护车服务、16 个急症护理床位以及一个小型疗养院。
The next-closest hospital is 40 miles away.
最近的医院距此 40 英里。
The next-closest emergency room is 34 miles away.
下一个最近的急诊室距此 34 英里。
And 34 miles is not an unbearably long ride, except for somebody having an emergency.
34 英里并不是一段难以忍受的长途旅程，除非有人遇到紧急情况。
We have a local guy.
我们有一个当地人。
Our nursing staff know, when they see him pull into our parking lot, they call life flight, because they know that he's having a heart attack.
我们的护理人员知道，当他们看到他把车开进我们的停车场时，他们称之为生命飞行，因为他们知道他心脏病发作了。
The only time he shows up is when he's having a heart attack.
他唯一一次出现是在他心脏病发作的时候。
He is not going to make it down the road.
他不会在这条路上成功。
We have a fair population of rattlesnakes here.
我们这里有相当多的响尾蛇。
Yeah.
是的。
So we had a person come in with a rattlesnake bite on his hand.
所以我们找了一个手上被响尾蛇咬伤的人进来。
It spanned almost the entire width of his hand, so it was a big snake.
几乎占据了他整个手掌的宽度，是一条大蛇。
Yikes.
哎呀。
Tim Reeves I always have two doses of anti-venom on hand, and a dose is four vials.
蒂姆·里夫斯 我手头上总是有两剂抗蛇毒血清，一剂是四瓶。
So we got them the first four vials, put him in a helicopter, flew him out.
所以我们给他们拿了前四瓶，把他放进直升机，然后把他带出去。
He got, like, 28 more vials of anti-venom.
他又得到了 28 瓶抗蛇毒血清。
If we were not here, that guy would be dead.
如果我们不在这里，那家伙就死了。
He would not have survived the trip to Lockhaven.
他不可能在洛克海文之旅中幸存。
When Tim takes a break from worrying about patients, he thinks about his staff-- 85 people who would lose jobs if the hospital closed.
当蒂姆暂时摆脱对病人的担忧时，他会想到他的员工——如果医院关闭，他们将失去 85 名工作人员。
The hospital is one of the bigger employers in that half of the county.
该医院是该县那半个地区最大的雇主之一。
So how does a hospital get to the point where they're setting up a GoFundMe to stay in business?
那么，医院是如何发展到通过 GoFundMe 来维持业务的呢？
A few months ago, Bucktail was hit with a couple of big financial setbacks, one after another.
几个月前，Bucktail 接连遭遇了几次重大财务挫折。
There were some federal money that didn't come through that they'd been counting on, also some money the state says it overpaid them and now wants to take back.
有一些他们一直指望的联邦资金没有到位，还有一些钱是州政府说多付给他们的，现在想收回。
Those two hits put the hospital over $600,000 in the hole.
这两次袭击使医院损失了超过 60 万美元。
Add to that all the things that can make it hard to keep any small rural hospital open-- small patient population and none of the specialties that can bring in a lot of money, like cardiac care, neurology.
除此之外，所有小型乡村医院都难以维持开放——患者人数少，而且没有可以带来大量资金的专业，如心脏护理、神经内科。
Also, insurance doesn't cover Bucktail's costs.
此外，保险不承担 Bucktail 的费用。
Most of the hospital's patients are on Medicare or Medicaid.
医院的大多数患者都享受医疗保险或医疗补助。
The hospital breaks even with Medicare patients.
医院与医疗保险患者收支平衡。
Medicaid-- they lose money.
医疗补助——他们赔钱。
But they also lose money on private insurance, because small hospitals don't have the leverage to negotiate decent reimbursement rates the way big hospitals do.
但他们在私人保险上也赔了钱，因为小医院没有能力像大医院那样协商体面的报销率。
Tim says Bucktail needs $1.5 million to make it through the fiscal year.
蒂姆表示，Bucktail 需要 150 万美元才能度过本财年。
He and the leadership team at Bucktail have drawn up a plan they believe can stabilize the hospital in the long term.
他和 Bucktail 的领导团队制定了一项他们认为可以长期稳定医院的计划。
But the short-term lack of money is clobbering them.
但短期的资金短缺正在让他们陷入困境。
And so, Tim is open to any idea about how to get money-- any idea, any amount of money.
因此，蒂姆对任何关于如何赚钱的想法持开放态度——任何想法，任何金额。
The GoFundMe, which has raised about $16,000, was a board member's idea.
GoFundMe 是一位董事会成员的创意，已筹集了约 16,000 美元。
The board is all volunteers who live in the community.
董事会由居住在社区的所有志愿者组成。
The staff of the hospital is pitching in.
医院工作人员正在全力救治。
Our staff are looking for ways to do fundraisers.
我们的员工正在寻找筹款活动的方法。
Right now, they're working in conjunction with one of the local fire departments to do a Bingo with $1,000 cash prize.
目前，他们正在与当地消防部门合作举办宾果游戏，并获得 1,000 美元的现金奖励。
They've gone out and they've gotten sponsors to put up the money for that prize as well as money to donate towards the facility.
他们已经出去，并得到了赞助商的资助，为该奖项提供资金，并为该设施捐款。
All that money will come to us.
所有这些钱都会归我们所有。
Our sewage authority has offered not to bill us for the next three months.
我们的污水处理部门已提出在接下来的三个月内不向我们收费。
The water company is not going to bill us for the next couple of quarters.
自来水公司不会在接下来的几个季度向我们收取费用。
We had a company that donated two new tires installed on our ambulance.
我们有一家公司捐赠了两个安装在我们救护车上的新轮胎。
And these are because of calls that you're making or calls that other people on staff are making or a combination?
这些是因为您正在拨打的电话还是其他员工正在拨打的电话，还是两者兼而有之？
Tim has an Excel spreadsheet that's a list of everything he and the leadership team are working on to try and save the hospital.
蒂姆有一个 Excel 电子表格，其中列出了他和领导团队为拯救医院所做的一切工作。
Tim checks it every day, adds ideas, updates.
蒂姆每天都会检查它，添加想法、更新。
It's 40 rows long and counting.
它有 40 行长并且还在不断增加。
I'm just going to read a few.
我只想读几本。
"Line 3, implement CT." The hospital bought a CAT scan machine, because patients have been going elsewhere to get CAT scans, and Bucktail wants to keep those patients.
“3号线，实施CT。”医院购买了一台 CAT 扫描机，因为患者已经去其他地方进行 CAT 扫描，而巴克泰尔希望保留这些患者。
"Line 35, Oak Ridge Lumber." Years ago, someone donated a bunch of land to the hospital, the side of a mountain.
“35 号线，橡树岭木材公司。”几年前，有人捐了一堆地给医院，在山的一边。
A lumber company recently asked Tim if they could drive through that land to reach other land where they were going to cut down trees for lumber.
一家木材公司最近询问蒂姆，他们是否可以开车穿过那片土地，到达其他土地，在那里他们要砍伐树木以获取木材。
And Tim said, hey, see if you want to buy any of our trees on our land for lumber.
蒂姆说，嘿，看看你是否想购买我们土地上的树木作为木材。
We will sell them to you.
我们会将它们卖给您。
"Line 20, Electronic Sign." This is part of an effort to get more patients in the door.
“20号线，电子标牌。”这是让更多患者就诊的努力的一部分。
Where the hospital is located physically is kind of off the beaten path.
医院所在的位置有点偏僻。
If you drive through the middle of Renovo, unless you know where the hospital's at, you won't see it.
如果你开车穿过里诺沃市中心，除非你知道医院在哪里，否则你不会看到它。
The sign is not for locals.
该标志不适合当地人。
The hospital's been in that location for decades.
医院在那个地方已经存在了几十年了。
It's for out-of-towners.
这是给外地人的。
We have thousands of camps, private camps, up here.
我们这里有数千个营地、私人营地。
People will come in for hunting season or fishing season or for summer vacations or-- to get away for a weekend or whatever it is.
人们会在狩猎季节、钓鱼季节、暑假或周末外出度假或其他任何时间来这里。
So the electronic sign, we hope, is a way that we can start to convey some of that information to people that are driving through the middle of town.
因此，我们希望电子标牌能够成为我们向驾车穿过市中心的人们传达一些信息的一种方式。
An electronic sign, Bingo, donated tires, lumber, a GoFundMe.
电子标牌、Bingo、捐赠轮胎、木材、GoFundMe。
I feel like this is one of those local TV stories about a plucky person who is trying to solve, through sheer gumption, a problem they shouldn't even have.
我觉得这是当地电视故事之一，讲述的是一个勇敢的人试图通过纯粹的进取心解决一个他们根本不应该遇到的问题。
Like, look, this hero is walking eight miles each way to a job, because there's no public transportation where he lives.
就像，看，这位英雄每趟工作都要步行八英里，因为他住的地方没有公共交通。
How great is this guy?
这家伙到底有多厉害？
The biggest chunk of money Tim's gotten so far is an advance on a payment the hospital is supposed to get next year-- $189,000-- a lot of money, unless you're trying to run a hospital.
蒂姆到目前为止得到的最大一笔钱是医院明年应收到的预付款——189,000 美元——这笔钱很大，除非你想经营一家医院。
Sleep is difficult.
睡眠很难。
There are many, many days when I get home and I'm just emotionally exhausted.
有很多很多天，当我回到家时，我只是精神上疲惫不堪。
Are you getting any sleep?
你睡得着吗？
Tim Reeves Some.
蒂姆·里维斯 一些。
The day before Thanksgiving, I got Tim's weekly email update that he sends out to a bunch of people.
感恩节前一天，我收到了蒂姆发送给一群人的每周更新电子邮件。
It said, quote, "We had a meeting with the staff this afternoon at 3 o'clock.
引述称，“今天下午 3 点，我们与工作人员举行了会议。
The meeting today was more difficult than meetings we've had in the past.
今天的会议比我们过去举行的会议更加困难。
Likewise, this is the most difficult update I have provided.
同样，这是我提供的最困难的更新。
Until today, I've been able to report that the next payroll is covered.
直到今天，我才能够报告下一份工资已经支付。
I could not provide that assurance today."
今天我无法提供这样的保证。”
He said he had no idea how they could continue providing services past December 1.
他说他不知道他们如何在 12 月 1 日之后继续提供服务。
He said, quote, "We are out of time without some temporary support." I thought about an earlier conversation I'd had with Tim.
他说，“如果没有临时支持，我们已经没有时间了。”我想起了之前我和蒂姆的一次谈话。
We were on the phone, and I was looking over a copy of a letter he'd sent to elected officials, laying out what's happening at Bucktail.
我们正在通电话，我正在查看他写给民选官员的一封信的副本，信中列出了巴克泰尔发生的事情。
One line stopped me short.
一行字让我突然停了下来。
I just got to the line where you say, "I have personally provided the facility with an interest-free loan." Oh, my goodness, Tim.
我刚刚到了你说的那一行，“我亲自为该设施提供了无息贷款。”哦，天哪，蒂姆。
The only people that know are the people in the business office who had to process it and the board of directors.
唯一知道的人是业务办公室中必须处理该问题的人员和董事会。
Is she worried about that?
她担心这个吗？
Tim Reeves Is she worried about it?
蒂姆·里夫斯 她担心吗？
Yes.
是的。
Am I worried about it?
我担心吗？
Yeah.
是的。
But it was necessary to get over a hurdle.
但必须克服一个障碍。
Oh, my goodness.
哦，我的天啊。
Oh, my goodness.
哦，我的天啊。
I mean, if the hospital goes under, would you get that back?
我的意思是，如果医院破产了，你能把钱拿回来吗？
I want to be optimistic that we're going to find a solution.
我想乐观地认为我们会找到解决方案。
I asked myself a little while ago, if I had to make that decision again, would I make the same decision?
不久前我问自己，如果让我再做一次这个决定，我还会做出同样的决定吗？
And the answer is, yes.
答案是，是的。
This week, payroll is due.
本周，工资到期了。
At the last minute, the hospital managed to expedite an insurance reimbursement, and they will be able to pay the staff after all.
最后一刻，医院设法加快了保险报销，终于可以给员工发工资了。
What that means for Tim is, he's got another two-week increment to work on Plan A, fighting to keep the hospital open.
这对蒂姆来说意味着，他还有两周的时间来执行 A 计划，努力保持医院的开放。
But he's had to add a line to the spreadsheet for Plan B.
但他必须在电子表格中为 B 计划添加一行。
It's line 48, "Closure."
这是第 48 行，“Closure”。
Nancy Updike is a senior editor on our program.
南希·厄普代克是我们节目的高级编辑。
Coming up-- OK, sure, there are places where people hope that the federal government is going to swoop in with millions of dollars and fix everything.
即将到来——好吧，当然，人们希望联邦政府投入数百万美元介入并解决所有问题。
But what if you are the federal government?
但如果你是联邦政府呢？
What do you hope for then?
那你还指望什么呢？
Answers from some actual federal employees-- that's in a minute from Chicago Public Radio when our program continues.
一些实际联邦雇员的回答——当我们的节目继续进行时，芝加哥公共广播电台将立即给出答案。
It's This American Life.
这就是美国生活。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Each week on our show, we choose a theme, bring you a variety of different kinds of stories on that theme.
我们的节目每周都会选择一个主题，为您带来有关该主题的各种不同类型的故事。
Today's show-- "The Cavalry Is Not Coming"-- stories about all the things you do-- some of them clever, some of them angry-- when you realize that no one is going to show up to rescue you.
今天的节目——“骑兵不会来”——讲述当你意识到没有人会出现来拯救你时，你所做的所有事情的故事——其中一些是聪明的，一些是愤怒的。
We have arrived at act two of our program.
我们已经进入了计划的第二幕。
Act Two, Give Me Your Tired, Your Poor, Your Huddled Masses-- Or Don't.
第二幕，把你们疲惫的、贫穷的、挤在一起的群众交给我——或者不要。
So if you want to immigrate to the United States from another country, OK, there are a bunch of ways to do that.
因此，如果您想从另一个国家移民到美国，可以，有很多方法可以做到。
But the big one for people wanting to cross from the southern border into the United States is the asylum program.
但对于想要从南部边境进入美国的人来说，最重要的是庇护计划。
For most people, that is the only legal pathway if they want to stay here.
对于大多数人来说，如果他们想留在这里，这是唯一合法的途径。
Asylum means not just coming here to get a better job or have a better life in some way.
庇护不仅仅意味着来到这里找到更好的工作或以某种方式过上更好的生活。
They have to show that they are running from some kind of danger or persecution back home.
他们必须证明他们正在逃离家乡的某种危险或迫害。
This all comes out of post-World War II idealism-- this law, this idea that the United States can and should give refuge to people fleeing oppression.
这一切都源于二战后的理想主义——这项法律、这种美国可以而且应该为逃离压迫的人们提供庇护的想法。
Under President Trump, as you probably remember, it became a lot harder to get asylum.
您可能还记得，在特朗普总统的领导下，获得庇护变得更加困难。
We did a story back then during his administration about the people who do the first screenings of asylum applicants at the United States Citizenship and Immigration Services, USCIS.
我们在他执政期间做了一个故事，讲述了美国公民及移民服务局（USCIS）对庇护申请人进行首次筛选的人员。
These people are asylum officers.
这些人是庇护官员。
And back then, they told us that from their point of view, President Trump was keeping out all kinds of people who should have been allowed into the country.
当时，他们告诉我们，从他们的角度来看，特朗普总统将各种本应被允许进入该国的人拒之门外。
And they said they yearned for some cavalry to ride in, some new president, to change things, save the day.
他们说，他们渴望一些骑兵，一些新总统，来改变现状，拯救世界。
Now, of course, they have a new president in Joe Biden.
当然，现在他们有了一位新总统乔·拜登。
And things have not gone the way these officials hoped for.
但事情并没有像这些官员所希望的那样发展。
One of our producers, Nadia Reiman, talked to a whole different bunch of USCIS officials recently-- these are people who work in the asylum and refugee branches-- and got this window into the whole immigration system that you don't usually get.
我们的制作人之一纳迪亚·雷曼（Nadia Reiman）最近与一群完全不同的美国移民局官员进行了交谈 - 这些人在庇护和难民部门工作 - 并获得了这个通常无法获得的进入整个移民系统的窗口。
Here's Nadia.
这是纳迪亚。
Let me start the story the way we have to start so many asylum stories-- by explaining what the hell the people who work in these jobs actually do.
让我以我们开始许多庇护故事的方式来开始这个故事——解释从事这些工作的人到底做了什么。
The ones I talked to were all asylum officers at some point, and here's what that looks like.
我采访过的人都曾经是庇护官员，情况是这样的。
They sit in an office, on the phone for hours with asylum seekers and an interpreter on the line.
他们坐在办公室里，与寻求庇护者和一名翻译通电话几个小时。
They're asking questions, hearing brutal stories from people who recently crossed the border about what they're fleeing-- Venezuelan political activists escaping the government, Cameroonians fleeing violence, Salvadoran families escaping gangs.
他们提出问题，听到最近越过边境的人们讲述他们正在逃离的残酷故事——委内瑞拉政治活动家逃离政府，喀麦隆人逃离暴力，萨尔瓦多家庭逃离帮派。
The officers have to determine whether the migrants they're talking to could get legal protection here under US law and whether they could face harm, or even death, if they got sent back to their home country.
官员们必须确定与他们交谈的移民是否可以根据美国法律在这里获得法律保护，以及如果他们被遣返回国是否会面临伤害，甚至死亡。
It's not for the faint of heart, but it is more for the bleeding-heart crowd than the enforcement crowd.
它不适合胆小的人，但它更适合那些热血沸腾的人群，而不是执法人群。
These aren't the tough-guy cops you often find in the border patrol.
这些不是你在边境巡逻中经常看到的硬汉警察。
Lots of them worked for the Peace Corps, lots of people with an immigration law background or human rights.
他们中的许多人为和平队工作，许多人具有移民法背景或人权背景。
They understand that their decisions in these cases can dictate whether someone lives or dies, and every one of them I've ever talked to feels the weight of that.
他们明白，他们在这些情况下的决定可能决定一个人的生死，我采访过的每个人都感受到了这一点的重要性。
It's a moral duty to them, not just a 9-to-5.
这对他们来说是一种道德责任，而不仅仅是朝九晚五。
After four years of President Trump dismantling the asylum and refugee programs and calling their work a con, they felt desperate for a change.
四年来，特朗普总统废除了庇护和难民计划，并称他们的工作是骗局，他们迫切希望做出改变。
And then, in the months before the 2020 election, in a random press event, Joe Biden caught their ear for the first time because of the way he started talking about asylum seekers.
然后，在 2020 年大选前的几个月，在一次随机的新闻发布会上，乔·拜登第一次引起了他们的注意，因为他开始谈论寻求庇护者的方式。
We're going to restore our moral standing in the world and our historic role as a safe haven for refugees and asylum seekers and those fleeing violence and persecution.
我们将恢复我们在世界上的道德地位，以及我们作为难民和寻求庇护者以及逃离暴力和迫害者的安全避难所的历史作用。
My Lord, we've never-- we've never made asylum seekers stay-- seek asylum outside the United States of America.
法官大人，我们从来没有——我们从来没有让寻求庇护者留下来——在美利坚合众国之外寻求庇护。
Making asylum seekers wait outside the US-- that's a Trump policy that these USCIS workers hated.
让寻求庇护者在美国境外等待——这是这些移民局工作人员讨厌的特朗普政策。
To them, this was a signal, like Biden was nodding at them, paying attention to their corner of the sandbox.
对他们来说，这是一个信号，就像拜登在向他们点头，注意他们在沙箱的角落。
When Joe Biden won, their hopes were modest.
当乔·拜登获胜时，他们的希望并不大。
They knew immigration was never one of his big issues.
他们知道移民从来都不是他的大问题之一。
But hey, at least he'd set things back on a better course.
但是，嘿，至少他让事情回到了更好的轨道上。
Well, at least, we'll go back to what we had in the Obama administration.
好吧，至少，我们会回到奥巴马政府时期。
We're going to return to normalcy.
我们将恢复正常。
We're going to return to an immigration system that's bad in many ways but we're not going to go out of our way to hurt people.
我们将回到一个在很多方面都很糟糕的移民制度，但我们不会不遗余力地伤害人们。
That's an asylum officer I'm going to call Mark-- not his real name, also not his real voice.
我要称呼这位庇护官员为马克——不是他的真名，也不是他的真实声音。
You'll hear voice actors instead of the immigration officials themselves, imitating their voices and inflections as closely as possible.
您会听到配音演员而不是移民官员本人，尽可能模仿他们的声音和语调。
Because these folks are not supposed to talk to the press.
因为这些人不应该与媒体交谈。
They could get fired.
他们可能会被解雇。
That's also why I can't tell you a lot about Mark or any of the others you'll hear.
这也是为什么我不能告诉你很多关于马克或你会听到的其他人的信息。
What I can say is that Mark is precise and overall kind of a curmudgeon.
我能说的是，马克是个严谨的人，但整体上却是个脾气暴躁的人。
Once Biden won, Mark says he and his colleagues expected that pretty early on, he'd end something called Title 42.
马克说，一旦拜登获胜，他和他的同事们很早就预计，他会结束所谓的“第 42 条”法案。
Title 42 was a public health order that had basically closed the southern border to prevent the spread of COVID.
第 42 条是一项公共卫生命令，基本上关闭了南部边境，以防止新冠病毒传播。
It allowed US border officers to expel migrants back into Mexico with no legal formalities, no questions asked, hours after they were caught.
它允许美国边境官员在移民被捕数小时后，无需办理任何法律手续，无需提出任何问题，即可将他们驱逐回墨西哥。
The Trump administration put it in place when the pandemic hit.
特朗普政府在疫情爆发时将其落实到位。
Asylum and refugee officers thought this was illegal, because it prevented people from even being able to ask for asylum.
庇护和难民官员认为这是非法的，因为它甚至阻止人们申请庇护。
Mark and his coworkers were like, easy.
马克和他的同事们都很轻松。
Trump activated it.
特朗普激活了它。
Biden could just deactivate it.
拜登可以将其停用。
The person I talked to who was the most optimistic about the whole thing is a USCIS official I'm going to call George.
与我交谈过的对整个事情最乐观的人是一位美国移民局官员，我称之为乔治。
He's been at the agency through many administrations.
他曾在该机构任职过多届政府。
He watches the first weeks of the Biden administration roll by-- nothing.
他看着拜登政府的头几周过去了——什么也没有。
But George wasn't bothered.
但乔治并不在意。
I actually-- I ran into a co-worker, and we were like, oh, you know, these advocates are all mad that we haven't ended Title 42 yet.
事实上，我遇到了一位同事，我们当时就想，哦，你知道，这些倡导者都很生气，因为我们还没有结束 Title 42。
And I'm like, we at least need a few weeks to plan it out, right?
我想，我们至少需要几周的时间来计划，对吧？
Like, I understand they can't do it immediately, but they'll do it soon enough.
就像，我知道他们不能立即做到这一点，但他们很快就会做到。
It will be fine.
会没事的。
So.
所以。
So how did it go?
那么进展如何呢？
George Not well, Nadia Reiman.
乔治 不太好，纳迪亚·雷曼。
Not well.
不太好。
[LAUGHS] Yeah.
[笑]是的。
I would say I started to get-- started to get very concerned and very suspicious around the first time they had the opportunity to end Title 42, and they decided to extend it.
我想说，当他们第一次有机会结束第 42 条时，我开始变得非常担心和怀疑，并且他们决定延长它。
This was back in 2021, around August.
那是在 2021 年 8 月左右。
Back then, we had a huge wave of people showing up at the border.
当时，我们边境出现了一大群人。
Lots of them thought, OK, Trump's gone.
很多人都想，好吧，特朗普走了。
Biden sounds more friendly.
拜登听起来更友好。
Maybe now, I have a chance to get in.
也许现在，我有机会进去了。
By keeping Title 42, President Biden could keep them from crossing into the US.
通过保留 Title 42，拜登总统可以阻止他们进入美国。
And every USCIS official I talked to heard the same story George did about why the administration made that choice.
我采访过的每一位美国公民及移民服务局官员都听到了乔治关于政府为何做出这一选择的同样的故事。
Political operators at the White House became convinced that it was bad for the president for the TV to show what would be characterized as chaos at the border.
白宫的政治操作者开始相信，电视上展示边境混乱的情况对总统来说是不利的。
I asked the White House if this is why the president kept Title 42 going, and not public health concerns.
我问白宫这是否是总统保留第 42 条的原因，而不是出于公共卫生考虑。
They said it was the CDC's call, not the president's.
他们说这是疾病预防控制中心的电话，而不是总统的电话。
The USCIS workers I talked to didn't buy this.
我采访过的美国公民及移民服务局工作人员并不买账。
In fact, George remembers how the Biden administration doubled down on this argument when the ACLU sued the government over Title 42.
事实上，乔治还记得当美国公民自由联盟 (ACLU) 就《宪法》第 42 条起诉政府时，拜登政府是如何在这一论点上加倍努力的。
And then, you had them making these absurd public statements that were parroting the things the Trump administration was saying about Title 42, which Democrats laughed at and dismissed when Trump was in office, but when they-- you know, oh, we have nothing to do with this.
然后，他们发表了这些荒谬的公开声明，重复了特朗普政府关于第 42 条的言论，民主党人在特朗普执政时嘲笑并驳回了这些言论，但当他们——你知道，哦，我们与这件事无关。
This is a CDC order.
这是疾病预防控制中心的命令。
This is related to public health, not immigration, you know.
你知道，这与公共卫生有关，与移民无关。
Keeping Title 42 going as long as they did was a "what the hell" moment for the USCIS workers, a turning point.
对于美国公民及移民服务局的工作人员来说，维持第 42 条规定的时间是一个“见鬼”的时刻，也是一个转折点。
Seeing all these people trying to seek asylum stuck outside our borders because of Title 42 made these workers feel angry and lonely, like they were the only witnesses to a bridge collapsing while everyone else looked the other way.
看到所有这些试图寻求庇护的人因为第 42 条而被困在我们的境外，让这些工人感到愤怒和孤独，就像他们是桥梁倒塌的唯一目击者，而其他人却视而不见。
This next person, I'll call Lisa.
下一个人，我会叫丽莎。
She works in refugee services.
她在难民服务部门工作。
She was also the only official who didn't swear during her interview.
她也是唯一一位在接受采访时没有说脏话的官员。
I mean, I stopped talking about it with my friends and family, to be honest.
我的意思是，说实话，我不再与朋友和家人谈论这件事。
You did?
你做到了吗？
Lisa Yeah.
丽莎 是的。
Because all it does is work-- all it would do is work me up into a frenzy of frustration.
因为它所做的一切都是工作——它所做的一切就是让我陷入极度的沮丧之中。
And they can only listen to it for so much, especially when they all, too, are under this illusion that, oh, but isn't it so much better?
他们只能听这么多，尤其是当他们也都处于这种幻觉之下时，哦，但这不是更好吗？
Oh, we understand and remember how horrible it was under the Trump administration.
哦，我们理解并记得特朗普政府统治下的情况是多么可怕。
But isn't it so much better?
但这样不是好很多吗？
And you want to say, like, yeah, it's better.
你想说，是的，这样更好。
We're not under full-level destruction attack, but also, promises were made, and they're not happening, and people are still living in refugee camps on the southern side of the border, and no one is doing anything to help them.
我们没有受到全面破坏攻击，而且，我们已经做出了承诺，但它们并没有实现，人们仍然生活在边境南侧的难民营中，没有人做任何事情来帮助他们。
[SIGHS] You just-- you feel like you can't talk to the regular world about it anymore.
[叹气]你只是——你觉得你不能再与普通世界谈论这件事了。
In the end, it took President Biden over a year to try to end Title 42.
最终，拜登总统花了一年多的时间才试图结束第 42 条。
And when he did it, Texas sued and stopped him.
当他这样做时，德克萨斯州起诉并阻止了他。
Title 42 remained in place until May of this year.
第 42 条一直有效到今年 5 月。
It was there through half of President Biden's term.
在拜登总统任期的一半时间里，这种情况一直存在。
So in those first two years of the Biden administration, lots of people were being turned away at the border.
因此，在拜登政府执政的头两年，很多人在边境被拒之门外。
But at the same time, incredibly, lots of other people were being allowed in-- mostly Venezuelans and Cubans, Nicaraguans, some Haitians.
但与此同时，令人难以置信的是，许多其他人被允许入境——主要是委内瑞拉人和古巴人、尼加拉瓜人，还有一些海地人。
More than a million migrants were allowed into the US in two years.
两年内超过一百万移民获准进入美国。
So why did this happen?
那么为什么会发生这种情况呢？
Take Venezuela, for example.
以委内瑞拉为例。
The US didn't have good diplomatic relationships with Venezuela, so we couldn't fly Venezuelans back to their country when they showed up at the border.
美国与委内瑞拉没有良好的外交关系，因此当委内瑞拉人出现在边境时，我们无法将他们送回自己的国家。
And Mexico didn't want them waiting on their side, which meant the Biden administration was stuck.
墨西哥不希望他们站在自己一边，这意味着拜登政府陷入困境。
They had to figure out what to do.
他们必须弄清楚该怎么做。
And the solution they came up with for Venezuela and all these countries was temporary.
他们为委内瑞拉和所有这些国家提出的解决方案是暂时的。
All the immigrants that came in, the more than a million-- most are here on temporary permits, officially allowed to stay for a while until things in their home countries cool down.
所有进来的移民，超过一百万，大多数都持有临时许可证，官方允许他们停留一段时间，直到他们祖国的局势降温。
At first, this was kind of an ad-hoc thing the Biden administration did, a bit under the radar, just to relieve pressure at the border.
起初，这是拜登政府临时做的事情，有点低调，只是为了缓解边境压力。
There had been dangerous overcrowding at border patrol stations.
边境巡逻站出现了拥挤不堪的危险。
Later, this became a more official program they proudly point to as proof that they stand up for humanitarian ideals.
后来，这成为一个更加正式的计划，他们自豪地指出，作为他们捍卫人道主义理想的证据。
But one of the officials I talked to pointed out temporary status can funnel a lot of people away from getting asylum, which is permanent.
但我采访过的一位官员指出，临时身份可能会让很多人无法获得永久庇护。
Whatever their intentions, by January of this year, the Biden administration had made two main parallel tracks for immigrants.
无论他们的意图是什么，到今年一月，拜登政府已经为移民制定了两条主要的平行轨道。
Tons of people coming in with temporary statuses, tons of others kept out by Title 42.
大量的人以临时身份进来，还有大量的人被第 42 条拒之门外。
And that's when the CDC announced the public health crisis was officially over.
就在那时，疾病预防控制中心宣布公共卫生危机正式结束。
Title 42 had to end, which is great news for these USCIS workers, right?
Title 42 必须终止，这对这些 USCIS 工人来说是个好消息，对吧？
Just what they've been waiting for.
这正是他们一直在等待的。
As they sit in their offices, they wonder what the plan is, how they're supposed to handle what may be large numbers of new asylum applicants.
当他们坐在办公室里时，他们想知道计划是什么，应该如何处理可能大量的新庇护申请者。
The last day of Title 42 keeps looming closer and closer, and these workers are hearing nothing.
第 42 条的最后一天越来越近，但这些工人却什么也没听到。
Then, some rumblings.
然后，一些隆隆声。
And then, when I heard that they were going to drop a new rule, I was like, of course they are.
然后，当我听说他们要放弃一项新规则时，我想，他们当然会放弃。
The new rules spelled out, for the first time, how the Biden administration wanted to run asylum at the southern border for now-- an original policy of their own to handle the crowds of people they expected would cross the border once Title 42 ended.
新规则首次阐明了拜登政府目前希望如何在南部边境提供庇护——这是他们自己的一项原创政策，旨在应对他们预计在第 42 条结束后将跨越边境的人群。
The rule is called CLP, which stands for Circumvention of Lawful Pathways.
该规则称为 CLP，代表“规避合法途径”。
The rule was not just any rule.
该规则不仅仅是任何规则。
It's like a Swiss Army knife, many different rules all rolled into one.
它就像一把瑞士军刀，将许多不同的规则融为一体。
But the part that jumped out to these USCIS workers the most is that under the rule, in order to even apply for asylum, you have to show that you already applied for asylum and got denied in at least one country you've passed through before getting to the US.
但这些移民局工作人员最关心的一点是，根据规定，为了申请庇护，你必须证明你已经申请庇护，并且在你到达美国之前至少经过一个国家被拒绝。
So if you came up from South America, you went through Panama, then Costa Rica, then Nicaragua, then Honduras, then El Salvador, then Guatemala, then Mexico, you would have to apply for asylum and be denied in at least one of those.
因此，如果您来自南美洲，经过巴拿马，然后是哥斯达黎加，然后是尼加拉瓜，然后是洪都拉斯，然后是萨尔瓦多，然后是危地马拉，然后是墨西哥，您将必须申请庇护，并且至少在其中一项申请被拒绝。
If you don't have proof of this, you are not eligible for asylum here.
如果您没有证明，您就没有资格在这里获得庇护。
Doesn't matter what you're fleeing in your home country.
不管你在祖国逃离什么。
Your government could be actively trying to kill you and your family because you're a political activist.
你的政府可能会因为你是一名政治活动家而积极试图杀死你和你的家人。
Clear-cut asylum claim-- not relevant anymore.
明确的庇护申请——不再相关了。
You basically won't get asylum in the US, because these other countries didn't reject you first.
你在美国基本上得不到庇护，因为其他国家并没有先拒绝你。
The USCIS workers I talked to were floored by this.
与我交谈过的美国移民局工作人员对此感到震惊。
They were like, whoa, that's basically something President Trump tried to put in place, but the court struck it down quickly, said it was illegal.
他们说，哇，这基本上是特朗普总统试图实施的措施，但法院很快就驳回了它，称这是非法的。
And now, here was president Biden bringing it back-- or something that looked a lot like it.
现在，拜登总统把它带回来了——或者看起来很像它的东西。
It was mind-blowing.
这真是令人兴奋。
It's the same.
是一样的。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah, they tweaked it around the corners, and the people who had to work on writing that rule-- I mean, jeez.
是的，他们在各个角落进行了调整，而那些必须努力编写该规则的人——我的意思是，天哪。
Like, I can't even imagine, to be the one who was told, yeah, we did that rule, and we know that it's illegal, but let's try this one.
就像，我什至无法想象，成为那个被告知的人，是的，我们遵守了这条规则，我们知道这是非法的，但让我们尝试一下这个。
[CHUCKLES]
[笑声]
At this point, George takes out a thick book, very official-looking.
这时，乔治拿出一本厚厚的书，看上去很正式。
It's a bound copy of the Immigration and Nationality Act he just happened to have around the house, you know, as one does.
这是一份《移民和国籍法》的装订本，他恰好在家里放着，你知道，就像一个人一样。
I mean, let's just read the asylum statute, right?
我的意思是，让我们读一下庇护法规，对吧？
"Any alien who is physically present in the United States or who arrives in the United States, whether or not--"
“任何身在美国或抵达美国的外国人，无论是否——”
Basically, this says anyone who arrives here in any way, legally or illegally, can apply for asylum.
基本上，这意味着任何以任何方式（合法或非法）抵达这里的人都可以申请庇护。
And so what Circumvention of Lawful Pathways says is, yeah, sure, you can-- you can apply, but we're going to say you're ineligible.
所以，规避合法途径说的是，是的，当然，你可以——你可以申请，但我们会说你没有资格。
I reached out to one of the administration officials who oversees the CLP-- Assistant Secretary for Immigration and Border Policy, Blas Nunez-Neto.
我联系了负责监督 CLP 的一位政府官员——负责移民和边境政策的助理部长布拉斯·努涅斯-内托 (Blas Nunez-Neto)。
I asked him how CLP is different from President Trump's asylum ban, which had been ruled illegal.
我问他 CLP 与特朗普总统的庇护禁令有何不同，特朗普总统的庇护禁令已被裁定为非法。
The Trump administration approach to this was to impose a categorical ban on asylum at the land border.
特朗普政府对此的做法是明确禁止在陆地边境提供庇护。
He's saying their ban was categorical.
他说他们的禁令是明确的。
It applied to everyone, no exceptions.
它适用于每个人，无一例外。
So we're not denying asylum categorically to anybody at the land border, and that's just a fact and something that is important for your audience to understand.
因此，我们并不是断然拒绝向陆地边境的任何人提供庇护，这只是一个事实，对于观众来说理解这一点很重要。
What we have done is, essentially, create what we call a rebuttable presumption.
从本质上讲，我们所做的是创造了我们所说的可反驳的推定。
And that's important, because it is, in fact, rebuttable, and that means that people who cross between the ports of entry and have a compelling reason why they needed to do that can rebut the presumption, and we're seeing many people do that in practice.
这很重要，因为它实际上是可反驳的，这意味着穿越入境口岸并有令人信服的理由为什么需要这样做的人可以反驳这一推定，我们看到很多人在实践中这样做。
"A rebuttable presumption"-- that means CLP starts off assuming you are ineligible for asylum.
“可反驳的推定”——这意味着 CLP 一开始就假设您没有资格获得庇护。
But don't worry, you can prove it wrong.
但别担心，你可以证明它是错误的。
You can rebut, like, immediately, right there on the spot, when you talk to an asylum officer.
当您与庇护官员交谈时，您可以立即当场反驳。
Prove it wrong, and then, poof, it's gone.
证明它是错的，然后，噗，它就消失了。
Doesn't apply to you anymore.
不再适用于你。
There's a list of ways to rebut the rule.
有一系列反驳该规则的方法。
First, it doesn't apply to unaccompanied minors or if you're sick and you need medical care.
首先，它不适用于无人陪伴的未成年人或者您生病并且需要医疗护理。
That's an exception.
这是一个例外。
Or if you're being trafficked-- another thing that negates the rule.
或者，如果你被贩卖——这是另一件违反规则的事情。
Or if you're in imminent danger, if someone is actively trying to kill you there at the border-- that's an exception for, quote, "extreme and imminent threat to life or safety," which all sounds reasonable enough.
或者，如果你处于迫在眉睫的危险之中，如果有人在边境积极试图杀死你——这是一个例外，引用“对生命或安全的极端和迫在眉睫的威胁”，这一切听起来都很合理。
But the officers I spoke with and people I talked to who work with migrants along the border-- they all say it's really, really, ridiculously difficult to get one of these exceptions or rebuttals.
但与我交谈过的官员和在边境与移民打交道的人——他们都说，要获得这些例外或反驳是非常非常困难的。
An attorney I talked to from the Texas Civil Rights Project says she's known of cases where the medical emergency rebuttal is so hard to get, it takes so long, that migrants have gotten sicker and sicker and have died waiting for it.
我采访过的一位来自德克萨斯州民权项目的律师表示，她知道一些案例，医疗紧急反驳是如此难以获得，而且需要很长时间，以至于移民的病情越来越严重，甚至在等待的过程中死去。
Mark says that when he's interviewing asylum seekers and trying to apply these CLP rules, he doesn't like where it leads him and who he ends up rejecting.
马克说，当他采访寻求庇护者并尝试应用这些 CLP 规则时，他不喜欢这些规则将他引向何方以及最终拒绝了谁。
The consequences of getting things wrong-- the stakes are extremely high.
出错的后果——风险极高。
When you get it wrong, people will die.
一旦搞错了，人就会死。
And it's not hyperbole.
这并不夸张。
That's not being hysterical.
这并不是歇斯底里。
That is a fact.
这是事实。
It is life-or-death decisions, every single one of them.
每一个决定都是生死攸关的决定。
You cannot afford to get them wrong.
您不能犯错。
And what CLP does is it forces you to make incorrect decisions.
而CLP所做的就是迫使你做出错误的决定。
And you have to take that seriously.
你必须认真对待这一点。
The latest numbers from the government tell us that only 16% of asylum seekers who were caught crossing the border were able to prove they qualified for one of the CLP exceptions or rebuttals, which means 84% were not able to prove it.
政府的最新数据告诉我们，在跨境被捕的寻求庇护者中，只有 16% 能够证明自己符合 CLP 例外或反驳的条件之一，这意味着 84% 的人无法证明这一点。
They could be deported.
他们可能会被驱逐出境。
Many USCIS workers complained to leadership about this from the start.
许多移民局工作人员从一开始就向领导层抱怨此事。
That's why they hated CLP.
这就是他们讨厌CLP的原因。
The response, according to George?
根据乔治的反应？
Oh, I know some of you may disagree with this rule, and it may make you feel uncomfortable, blah, blah, blah, and this is the job.
哦，我知道你们中的一些人可能不同意这个规则，这可能会让你感到不舒服，等等，等等，这就是工作。
And then, they'll say, you can always quit.
然后，他们会说，你可以随时退出。
But they really don't care.
但他们真的不在乎。
They really-- they're really channeling their inner Martin Lawrence, saying, don't let the doorknob hit you where the dog should have bit you.
他们真的——他们真的在传达内心的马丁劳伦斯，说，不要让门把手撞到狗应该咬你的地方。
At the end of the day, like, they're not interested in your moral or legal objections.
归根结底，他们对你的道德或法律反对意见不感兴趣。
Shut the fuck up, put your head down, and do what you're told.
闭嘴，低下头，按照别人告诉你的去做。
I think if the administration were telling the story of CLP, they wouldn't start with the new restrictions on asylum at the border.
我认为，如果政府要讲述 CLP 的故事，他们就不会从对边境庇护的新限制开始。
They'd probably emphasize a different part of the rule.
他们可能会强调规则的不同部分。
It's a whole new way they're enticing people to cross at the official border stations in an orderly way, instead of something more dangerous like wading across a river or walking through the desert.
他们以一种全新的方式吸引人们有序地通过官方边境站，而不是像涉水过河或穿越沙漠那样更危险的事情。
It's an app.
这是一个应用程序。
Yes, they have an app.
是的，他们有一个应用程序。
It's called CBP1, and the government has big hopes for it.
它被称为 CBP1，政府对它寄予厚望。
When the Biden administration rolled out CLP, they announced that this app was the way everyone on the southern border should apply for asylum.
当拜登政府推出 CLP 时，他们宣布这个应用程序是南部边境的每个人都应该申请庇护的方式。
This was going to be the new system.
这将是新系统。
You can get an appointment to enter the US, and it assigns you a port of entry to show up to at a specific time.
您可以预约进入美国，它会为您分配一个在特定时间到达的入境口岸。
Like, come to Matamoros on October 30 at 6:00 PM.
比如，10 月 30 日下午 6:00 来马塔莫罗斯。
And as an incentive to encourage you to use the app, if you download it and use it and you come in and ask for asylum, all the other CLP rules that keep people out-- they don't apply to you.
作为鼓励您使用该应用程序的激励措施，如果您下载并使用它，然后进来寻求庇护，则所有其他将人们拒之门外的 CLP 规则都不适用于您。
Like, it doesn't matter whether you ask for asylum in other countries before you got here.
就像，你在来到这里之前是否在其他国家申请庇护并不重要。
You don't need to be in a medical emergency or have someone chasing you, threatening your life.
您不需要遇到医疗紧急情况或有人追赶您，威胁您的生命。
It's like a golden ticket.
这就像一张金票。
Use the app.
使用该应用程序。
Apply for asylum.
申请庇护。
Period.
时期。
And I know how bonkers this sounds.
我知道这听起来有多疯狂。
On the one hand, President Biden created this weird Trumpy policy that makes it practically impossible to even ask for asylum in some ways.
一方面，拜登总统制定了这种奇怪的特朗普政策，使得在某些方面几乎不可能寻求庇护。
But on the other hand, you can sidestep all of that and just come into the United States if you have a phone and can download an app.
但另一方面，如果你有手机并且可以下载应用程序，你可以避开所有这些，直接进入美国。
This has been described as a carrot-and-stick approach.
这被描述为胡萝卜加大棒的方法。
They want to reward people for using the CBP1 app and coming in through official ports of entry, and they want to penalize everyone else.
他们想要奖励那些使用 CBP1 应用程序并通过官方入境口岸入境的人，并惩罚其他所有人。
And having an app does seem smart.
拥有一个应用程序似乎确实很聪明。
Migrants all have phones.
移民都有电话。
They use apps all the time.
他们一直使用应用程序。
But I'm sure this next part will not surprise you.
但我确信下一部分不会让您感到惊讶。
The app didn't work so well.
该应用程序运行得不太好。
From the very start of CLP this past May, it went off the rails.
中电自今年五月成立以来，就一直偏离轨道。
First of all, there were not a lot of appointments available-- about 750 a day for the whole border.
首先，预约的数量并不多——整个边境每天大约有 750 个。
So migrants would wait for the appointments to open up, try to get one, and the app would crash.
因此，移民会等待预约开放，尝试预约，但应用程序就会崩溃。
There were error messages that people didn't understand that prevented people from making appointments, like one that just said, "fraud," that continues to this day.
有一些人们不理解的错误消息阻止了人们进行预约，比如刚才说的“欺诈”，这种情况一直持续到今天。
One review of the app just reads, "This app is crap," though half the reviews seem to be right-wing trolls posting things like "open-door policy, thanks, Brandon," or "come on in, front-row VIP seats for all the drug-smuggling, human-trafficking criminals that need a new stomping ground."
该应用程序的一篇评论只是写道，“这个应用程序很糟糕”，尽管一半的评论似乎是右翼巨魔，发布了诸如“门户开放政策，谢谢布兰登”或“进来吧，所有毒品走私、人口贩运犯罪分子需要新的立足点的前排 VIP 座位”。
When the app did work, there were the wait times.
当应用程序运行时，需要等待一段时间。
A woman who works at a shelter in Reynosa told me she talked to a family that had been waiting for four months for their appointment.
一位在雷诺萨避难所工作的女士告诉我，她与一个已经等待预约四个月的家庭进行了交谈。
Same with Matamoros and Tijuana.
马塔莫罗斯和蒂华纳也是如此。
The problem with waiting, besides that it sucks to wait, is that the cartels are at the border, looking to rob and kidnap asylum seekers who are stuck there.
等待的问题除了等待很糟糕之外，还在于卡特尔就在边境，想要抢劫和绑架被困在那里的寻求庇护者。
So many people just make a run for it without their golden ticket.
很多人没有金票就只是跑去。
They cross the border anywhere they can.
他们尽可能地越过边境。
Mark laid out for me a pretty typical case that he says he gets often.
马克向我展示了一个非常典型的案例，他说他经常遇到这种情况。
For example, you're hanging out in Mexico.
例如，您在墨西哥闲逛。
You're planning on getting your CBP1 appointment, but they get snapped up every day, so you're waiting around.
您正计划进行 CBP1 预约，但它们每天都被抢购一空，所以您只能等待。
And then, in the month that you're waiting in Matamoros or wherever else, you get kidnapped, held for ransom.
然后，在你在马塔莫罗斯或其他地方等待的那个月，你被绑架，被勒索赎金。
They make calls to your family members, using your cell phone, asking for however much money.
他们用你的手机给你的家人打电话，索要多少钱。
Otherwise, they're going to kill you.
否则，他们会杀了你。
Your family scrounges up whatever they can get to pay them.
你的家人想尽一切办法来支付工资。
They pay them.
他们付钱给他们。
You get released.
你被释放了。
You get dumped off on the side of the road somewhere.
你被扔在路边的某个地方。
And you now have no money, because they've robbed you.
而你现在没有钱了，因为他们抢了你。
They've taken all your travel documents.
他们拿走了你所有的旅行证件。
They've taken everything that you had with you.
他们拿走了你身上的一切。
So how are you going to support yourself in this border town while you wait to get a CBP1 appointment on the phone that you no longer have?
那么，当您等待通过您不再使用的电话进行 CBP1 预约时，您将如何在这个边境小镇养活自己呢？
So you decide, I can't do this anymore.
所以你决定，我不能再这样做了。
I got to cross into the United States.
我必须越境进入美国。
Mark asked me, did I think that migrant was in extreme danger, enough to get a rebuttal to the CLP rules and be allowed to apply for asylum?
马克问我，我是否认为移民处于极度危险之中，足以反驳 CLP 规则并被允许申请庇护？
It sounds like it, yeah.
听起来是这样，是的。
Mark Well, yeah, that's not how it works.
马克：嗯，是的，事情不是这样的。
That person is not eligible for that rebuttal, because you have to demonstrate that your life or safety was in imminent danger at that exact moment when you cross into the United States.
该人没有资格进行反驳，因为您必须证明，当您进入美国时，您的生命或安全正面临迫在眉睫的危险。
So unless that cartel or whoever kidnapped you is nipping on your heels as you dive into the water, you are not eligible for that rebuttal.
因此，除非那个卡特尔或绑架你的人在你潜入水中时紧追不舍，否则你没有资格进行反驳。
This is a USCIS worker I will call Joanna.
这是一名美国公民及移民服务局工作人员，我称之为乔安娜。
She's been doing this job for a while.
她从事这项工作已经有一段时间了。
It's sort of like this whole, completely nonsensical idea that you have to be actually running through the desert and trying to wage your way across the Rio Grande while bullets are flying over your head.
这有点像整个、完全荒谬的想法，你必须真正跑过沙漠，并试图在子弹从你头顶飞过的情况下穿过格兰德河。
Right?
正确的？
I mean, it's just-- I feel like these laws and ideas are written by people who have watched way too many World War II movies.
我的意思是，我觉得这些法律和想法是由看过太多二战电影的人制定的。
[LAUGHS] Or, like, too many episodes of Narcos or something.
[笑]或者，就像《毒枭》的剧集太多了之类的。
Yeah, yeah, too many episodes of Narcos or, like-- I don't know.
是的，是的，《毒枭》的剧集太多了，或者，就像——我不知道。
But, like, that's not-- that's not how it works.
但是，事情不是这样的。
Stepping back and looking at the big picture, most of the people entering from our southern border are not using the CBP1 app.
退后一步，纵观全局，大多数从我们南部边境入境的人都没有使用 CBP1 应用程序。
In October, it was about 188,000 people who got caught between ports of entry, versus about 44,000 who used the app, which means most people face the restrictive rules that make it so hard to ask for asylum.
10 月份，约有 188,000 人在入境口岸被困，而使用该应用程序的人数约为 44,000 人，这意味着大多数人面临限制性规则，导致申请庇护变得非常困难。
The USCIS officials we spoke to said, under President Biden, the way CLP is written, it sounds like there are all these ways you can still apply for asylum.
我们采访的美国移民局官员表示，在拜登总统的领导下，CLP 的书写方式似乎仍然可以通过所有这些方式申请庇护。
But in practice, it's just as bad as it was under President Trump.
但实际上，情况与特朗普总统领导下的情况一样糟糕。
Because CLP denies so many people the chance at asylum at all.
因为 CLP 根本剥夺了很多人获得庇护的机会。
I asked Assistant Secretary Nunez-Neto if President Biden's policy is just as restrictive as President Trump's.
我问助理国务卿努涅斯-内托，拜登总统的政策是否与特朗普总统的政策一样严格。
Well, we are doing is a completely different and balanced approach to this issue that, again, includes an unprecedented expansion in lawful pathways and processes for people to come to the country while, at the same time, putting some common-sense constraints on the ability to claim asylum at the border for individuals at the land border between ports of entry who don't have a compelling reason why they needed to cross unlawfully between our ports of entry.
嗯，我们正在采取一种完全不同且平衡的方法来解决这个问题，其中包括前所未有地扩大人们进入该国的合法途径和程序，同时，对那些在入境口岸之间的陆地边界上没有令人信服的理由为什么需要在我们的入境口岸之间非法穿越的个人在边境申请庇护的能力施加一些常识性的限制。
But in practice, what we're hearing on the ground is that people who-- that it's incredibly hard to prove the exceptions and rebuttals, that people that try to prove an exception or rebuttal that has to do with medical emergencies, for example, have died waiting for such an exception or a rebuttal.
但在实践中，我们在实地听到的是，人们很难证明例外和反驳，例如，那些试图证明与医疗紧急情况有关的例外或反驳的人，已经在等待这样的例外或反驳时死去了。
And doesn't it, in effect, at the end-- doesn't it disqualify a lot of people from even asking for asylum?
事实上，到最后，这难道不是让很多人失去了寻求庇护的资格吗？
Hey, just really quick-- I'm so sorry.
嘿，快点——我很抱歉。
I need to interrupt.
我需要打断一下。
Are we still on the record here?
我们还在这里记录吗？
At that point, Assistant Secretary Nunez-Neto's press person interrupted us.
这时，助理国务卿努涅斯-内托的新闻人员打断了我们。
They'd agreed to answer only one question about CLP on the record.
他们同意只公开回答一个有关 CLP 的问题。
I saw this as a normal followup to clarify.
我认为这是一个正常的后续澄清。
They disagreed.
他们不同意。
They said they were limited on what they could say because of ongoing lawsuits about the rule.
他们表示，由于有关该规则的诉讼仍在继续，因此他们能说的话受到限制。
The key phrase in what he said was "a balanced approach." Administration officials I've talked to say that this mish-mash of new rules and exceptions to those rules and everything else I've described-- they say, when you put it all together, you'll see them trying to balance the humanitarian principles they say they hold dear, with the fact that they need to weed out dubious asylum claims.
他所说的关键词是“平衡的方法”。与我交谈过的政府官员说，这种新规则和这些规则的例外情况以及我所描述的其他内容的混杂——他们说，当你把所有这些放在一起时，你会看到他们试图在他们所珍视的人道主义原则与他们需要清除可疑的庇护申请的事实之间取得平衡。
I think what's happening is, there's a humanitarian crisis, so many people arriving at the border, and a backlog of nearly 3 million immigration cases already, that the administration had to figure out something to do with the tens of thousands of people showing up each week.
我认为正在发生的事情是，存在人道主义危机，这么多人抵达边境，而且已经积压了近 300 万个移民案件，政府必须想出办法来处理每周数以万计的人出现。
And they're scared of looking soft on immigration, but they also don't want to be anti-immigrant.
他们害怕在移民问题上显得软弱，但他们也不想反移民。
They don't think of themselves as anti-immigrant.
他们并不认为自己是反移民者。
So they ended up with this contradictory hodgepodge, letting in over a million people for humanitarian reasons, but that's just temporary relocation, or setting up CLP rules that are both deeply restrictive and surprisingly unrestrictive.
所以他们最终得到了这个矛盾的大杂烩，出于人道主义原因允许超过一百万人入境，但这只是暂时的搬迁，或者制定了既严格限制又令人惊讶地不受限制的中电规则。
Of course it's a mess.
当然是一团糟。
CLP is currently being challenged in court in two separate federal cases.
CLP 目前在两起单独的联邦案件中在法庭上受到质疑。
The ACLU is suing the Biden administration in both, saying that CLP makes it too hard for people to apply for asylum, in violation of the law.
美国公民自由联盟 (ACLU) 在这两起案件中起诉拜登政府，称 CLP 使人们申请庇护变得过于困难，违反了法律。
The Asylum Officers' Union has filed two amicus briefs, one for each of the lawsuits, saying they agree.
庇护官员联盟已提交两份非当事人意见陈述，针对每一项诉讼各一份，并表示同意。
They represent about 1,000 asylum officers.
他们代表大约 1,000 名庇护官员。
Assistant Secretary Nunez-Neto told me the administration is confident the rule is legal.
助理国务卿努涅斯-内托告诉我，政府有信心这项规则是合法的。
There's one phrase that one of the officers, Joanna, used that stuck with me.
其中一位警官乔安娜（Joanna）说过的一句话让我印象深刻。
She said, "the Overton window has shifted," which means the window of political acceptability has changed.
她说，“奥弗顿窗口已经改变”，这意味着政治可接受性的窗口已经改变。
The goalposts have moved, because of Trump's strategy on asylum, where the goal, according to Joanna, was to kill the asylum program.
由于特朗普的庇护策略，目标已经发生了变化，据乔安娜说，其目标是终止庇护计划。
Allow no one in.
不准任何人进入。
Give no protection.
不给予任何保护。
And when the Biden administration created CLP, Joanna thinks they co-signed on the idea of, let's just not anymore, just with a different tone.
当拜登政府创建 CLP 时，乔安娜认为他们共同签署的想法是，我们不再这样了，只是用不同的语气。
Like, if you look at it, now that you have seen the Biden administration in action in asylum, what things are you like, yes, this is-- they actually have made some changes, here's where it's different, and here is where it's the same as how it was under Trump?
就像，如果你看一下，现在你已经看到了拜登政府在庇护方面的行动，你喜欢什么，是的，这是——他们实际上做了一些改变，这就是不同的地方，这就是与特朗普领导下的情况相同的地方？
OK, well, they don't pull babies away from mothers' arms.
好吧，他们不会把婴儿从母亲的怀抱中拉开。
So I guess you get a sticker or a cookie.
所以我猜你会得到一张贴纸或一块饼干。
Yay for you.
为你欢呼。
They talk about it differently.
他们的说法不同。
Yeah, that's really important.
是的，这真的很重要。
Democrats don't call countries "shithole countries." They just-- they treat them like shithole countries.
民主党人不会称这些国家为“粪坑国家”。他们只是——他们把他们当作狗屎国家一样对待。
But I think with the Biden administration, you have a pretense at protection that the Trump people didn't do.
但我认为，拜登政府假装提供保护，而特朗普人却没有这样做。
There's something just like, ugh, right?
有一些东西就像，呃，对吧？
Do you think it's worse than it was under Trump?
你认为现在的情况比特朗普执政时期更糟糕吗？
I mean, it's very bad and very similar.
我的意思是，这非常糟糕而且非常相似。
But it's a different kind.
但它是另一种。
So do you know what's-- what is worse?
那么你知道什么是更糟糕的吗？
Someone who's direct in doing something bad or someone who dresses up a little nicer and puts a better face on it but still does pretty much the same thing?
一个直接干坏事的人，或者一个穿得好一点、脸上表现得更好但仍然做几乎同样的事情的人？
I think we'll look back on the first two years of the Biden administration and the future and identify this as an inflection point when we just kind of, like, stop the pretense of having an asylum system that comports with our legal obligations under international and federal law.
我认为我们将回顾拜登政府的头两年和未来，并将其视为一个转折点，那时我们只是停止假装拥有符合国际和联邦法律规定的法律义务的庇护制度。
Maybe that's the real bipartisan agreement at this point.
也许这才是目前两党真正达成的协议。
This system that we built to function as our own idealistic cavalry to protect people who are fleeing for their lives-- both parties seem to have decided that we don't need to do that anymore.
我们建立的这个系统是为了充当我们自己的理想主义骑兵来保护逃命的人们——双方似乎都决定我们不再需要这样做了。
Instead of looking at why you're coming to the US and judging that on its merits, now, we'll block you because of how you came to the US, whether you use the CBP1 app, whether you ask for asylum from countries along the way.
现在，我们不会考虑你为什么来美国并根据其优点来判断，而是会因为你如何来到美国、是否使用 CBP1 应用程序、是否向沿途国家寻求庇护而阻止你。
If you're the most vulnerable, the most in need of rescuing, our asylum system, as it stands, may no longer save you.
如果你是最脆弱、最需要救援的人，我们现有的庇护系统可能不再能拯救你。
Nadia Reiman is an editor on our program.
纳迪亚·雷曼 (Nadia Reiman) 是我们节目的编辑。
Julia Preston helped us out as a consulting editor on this story.
朱莉娅·普雷斯顿（Julia Preston）作为这个故事的咨询编辑帮助我们。
Our program was produced today by Miki Meek.
今天我们的节目由 Miki Meek 制作。
The people who put together today's show include James Bennett the Second, Phia Bennin, Susan Burton, Sean Cole, Michael Comite, Andrea López Cruzado, Cassie Howley, Valerie Kipnis, Seth Lind, Stowe Nelson, Katherine Rae Mondo, Alissa Shipp, Alix Spiegel, Laura Starecheski, Lilly Sullivan, Christopher Swetala, Marisa Robertson-Textor, Matt Tierney, and Diane Wu.
今天节目的制作人包括 James Bennett the Second、Phia Bennin、Susan Burton、Sean Cole、Michael Comite、Andrea López Cruzado、Cassie Howley、Valerie Kipnis、Seth Lind、Stowe Nelson、Katherine Rae Mondo、Alissa Shipp、Alix Spiegel、Laura Starecheski、Lilly Sullivan、Christopher Swetala、Marisa Robertson-Textor、Matt蒂尔尼和黛安·吴。
Our managing editor is Sarah Abdurrahman.
我们的总编辑是萨拉·阿卜杜拉赫曼 (Sarah Abdurrahman)。
Our senior editor is David Kestenbaum.
我们的高级编辑是大卫·凯斯滕鲍姆。
Our executive editor is Emanuele Berry.
我们的执行编辑是 Emanuele Berry。
Voice actors for our asylum story in act two-- Evan Jonigkeit, Jake Lacy, Hannah Gross, and Abby Elliot.
第二幕中庇护故事的配音演员是埃文·乔尼基特 (Evan Jonigkeit)、杰克·莱西 (Jake Lacy)、汉娜·格罗斯 (Hannah Gross) 和艾比·埃利奥特 (Abby Elliot)。
Special thanks today to Alaa Mostafa, Sabrina Hyman, Michael Knowles from the USCIS Employees Union, the Migration Policy Institute, Aaron Reichlin-Melnick, Hollie Webb, Kassandra Gonzalez, Dana Leigh Marks, Erin Heeter, Michael Mascari, Kathryn Mattingly, and Lee Gelernt.
今天特别感谢来自美国移民局雇员工会、移民政策研究所的 Alaa Mostafa、Sabrina Hyman、Michael Knowles、Aaron Reichlin-Melnick、Hollie Webb、Kassandra Gonzalez、Dana Leigh Marks、Erin Heeter、Michael Mascari、Kathryn Mattingly 和 Lee Gelernt。
Our website-- thisamericanlife.org, where you can stream our archive of over 800 episodes for absolutely free.
我们的网站 -- thisamericanlife.org，您可以在这里免费观看我们的 800 多集档案。
Also, there is merch for the podcast-slash-public-radio-loving nerds in your life and your holiday shopping needs.
此外，还有适合您生活中的播客斜杠公共广播爱好者和假日购物需求的商品。
Again-- thisamericanlife.org.
再次——thisamericanlife.org。
This American Life is delivered to public radio stations by PRX, the Public Radio Exchange.
《美国生活》由公共广播电台 PRX 向公共广播电台播出。
Thanks, as always, to our show's co-founder, Mr. Torey Malatia.
一如既往地感谢我们节目的联合创始人 Torey Malatia 先生。
You know, some woman was flirting with him in a bar last weekend.
你知道，上周末有一个女人在酒吧里和他调情。
She asked if he wanted to go home with her.
她问他是否愿意和她一起回家。
He gave her a blank stare.
他茫然地瞪了她一眼。
She asked if he had protection.
她问他是否有保护。
He said, of course.
他说，当然。
I always have two doses of anti-venom on hand.
我手头上总是有两剂抗蛇毒血清。
I'm Ira Glass, back next week with more stories of this American life.
我是艾拉·格拉斯，下周回来，带来更多关于美国生活的故事。
This American Life is produced in collaboration with WBEZ Chicago and delivered to stations by PRX The Public Radio Exchange.
《This American Life》与 WBEZ Chicago 合作制作，并由 PRX 公共广播电台传送到各电台。