769: The Reluctant Explorer - This American Life

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00:00 00:00 Transcript Share This American Life Life Partners How to Listen Episodes Recommended About Overview Staff Announcements Fellowships Jobs Music Make Radio On The Road FAQ Submissions Merch Contact Us Our Other Shows Merch Follow Us Life Partners Subscribe to our newsletter Full episode Toggle Audio and Transcript Sync Transcript | Episode #769 | April 29, 2022 769: The Reluctant Explorer Note: This American Life is produced for the ear and designed to be heard.

00:00 00:00 文字记录分享此美国生活生活伙伴如何收听剧集推荐关于概述员工公告奖学金工作音乐在路上制作电台常见问题解答提交商品联系我们我们的其他节目商品关注我们生活伙伴订阅我们的时事通讯整集切换音频和文字记录同步文字记录 | 内容第 769 集 | 2022 年 4 月 29 日 769：不情愿的探险家注：《美国生活》是为耳朵而制作，旨在让人们听到。

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如果可以的话，我们强烈建议您收听音频，其中包括页面上没有的情感和重点。

Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors.

文字记录是使用语音识别软件和人工转录员结合生成的，可能包含错误。

Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print.

请在印刷版引用前检查相应的音频。

Prologue: Prologue Ira Glass So a little while back, this guy named Ken Irwin started reaching out to people here at This American Life.

序言：序言 Ira Glass 不久前，这个名叫 Ken Irwin 的人开始在《This American Life》中与人们接触。

Emanuele got a voicemail that was both very insistent and deeply apologetic.

伊曼纽尔收到了一封语音邮件，内容既非常坚持又深表歉意。

Hi, I'm so sorry for calling you.

你好，很抱歉给你打电话。

I'm just trying to get ahold of someone at This American Life or New York Times.

我只是想联系《美国生活》或《纽约时报》的某人。

I'm so sorry for interrupting you on your weekend.

很抱歉在周末打扰您。

Chloee got messages on LinkedIn saying, quote, "If you can give me five minutes to tell you what I know so far, I promise it's a crazy story."

克洛伊在领英上收到一条消息，引述道：“如果你能给我五分钟时间告诉你我到目前为止所知道的事情，我保证这是一个疯狂的故事。”

And today is about to be a million times crazier.

今天将会疯狂一百万倍。

Two weeks ago, my life was normal.

两周前，我的生活还很正常。

I literally was just working for Amazon.

我实际上只是在亚马逊工作。

I was a normal person.

我是一个正常人。

On Dana's voicemail, he said he was sure she was way too busy to call back herself.

在达纳的语音信箱中，他说他确信她太忙了，无法给自己回电话。

But he swore a factchecker could confirm everything he's saying.

但他发誓事实核查员可以证实他所说的一切。

Basically, I became a multimillionaire over the last week and a half, which is insane.

基本上，我在过去的一个半星期内成为了千万富翁，这太疯狂了。

And the story is so much crazier than what I'm even saying.

这个故事比我所说的要疯狂得多。

To Brian, this guy wrote on Twitter, "I have no idea where the story will go as I'm stuck in it trying to figure it out.

But I think you're exactly the type of person that could figure it out.

So they all passed that information to me.

Hi, this is Ken.

Ira Glass Hey, Ken.

This is Ira Glass from This American Life.

Nice to meet you.

Ken Erwin Thank you for calling.

I did not expect to be talking to you.

I'm so sorry for spamming your entire company.

Right off the bat, he asked me if I knew what NFTs are.

And I had a general idea that they're images and other things in the crypto world that people are selling to each other for a lot of money.

For now, can I say, that's all you need to know for this to make sense.

He told me that this all began for him two weeks before our conversation on August 22nd.

So the person named Adam McBride reached out.

If you Google him, he calls himself an NFT archaeologist.

I don't know how to describe him.

He has a podcast.

So he reached on LinkedIn and Gmail and basically told me, hey, if you're the owner of PixelMap, I need to talk to you immediately.

PixelMap was a website that Ken created in 2016.

He wants to tell me that basically, I could make a lot of money if I brought the site back up.

And I immediately assumed he was scamming me.

Because we all get emails like that all the time.

And the only reason I talked to him was he mentioned PixelMap.

The site has been down literally since 2017.

So I just wanted to know how he even knew that word.

Ken has made PixelMap just for fun and to teach himself a new programming language.

He's somebody who was always tinkering, inventing things, a hovercraft that could carry a dog.

He has three dachshunds and a fourth dog that he refers to as the randomly generated dog.

One of his recent projects, he used a 3D printer to create another, better 3D printer.

His real job was he worked for Amazon's web services company.

He was one of the lead engineers developing code for big companies like Snapchat and Pinterest.

He's 33, lives in Indiana.

As for PixelMap-- Ken Erwin You can see it.

Actually, you're going to think it looks stupid, probably.

But-- [LAUGHS]

This is the kind of self-deprecating remark I've learned that Ken does reflexively a lot.

But in this case, the PixelMap.io website does look kind of primitive when you first see it, like early 8-bit Nintendo or something.

It's a grid of tiles, a picture of 4,000 little tiles, and they're tiny.

Each is 16 by 16 pixels.

And the idea is anybody can buy the tiles, own them, and decorate them how they want.

So people have different cartoons in them and words they've posted.

When Ken created this back in 2016, barely anybody noticed or cared.

Maybe 20 or 30 people bought tiles.

Within a year, he was pretty much done with PixelMap.

So that is the project that this guy Adam McBride wanted to talk to him about.

And so the same day that Ken gets Adam's email, that afternoon, he gets on a Zoom with him.

He said basically what he does is he goes in and tries to find really old NFT projects and that he does it as a hobby and really enjoys doing it.

And he said that mine would be one of the earliest, even though 2016 is not that long ago.

In the NFT space, that's almost the oldest you can go.

And that I'm probably sitting on a ton of money and I don't realize it.

Sitting on a ton of money because in the crypto world, one kind of NFT that people get excited about and pay money for is what they call historic NFTs, the first NFTs that ever existed.

Ken tells Adam that's all great, what's an NFT?

Adam give him a quick primer.

And had it ever occurred to you that what you had made was an NFT?

No, because when I made it, there were no NFTs.

The only time I had heard of NFT since then, I had heard in the news that Steph Curry had one.

And I really hadn't even looked to see what an NFT was, which I know sounds really stupid.

I had truly completely forgotten about my site.

And I was saying, how much do you think I could get for it?

And he said, I've seen projects like this.

I had one that the developer got over 100,000.

But looking at yours, I think you could probably get 500 grand out of it.

And at that point, I thought he was really nice.

I didn't think there was any chance on earth of that actually happening.

[LAUGHS]

Ira Glass Adam McBride tells him, I can help you set this up and get it relaunched, and people will pay you gobs of money for the rest of those 4,000 tiles.

He said he knows a group of guys who love the early historic NFTs, like this one.

And they'll all talk it up on Twitter.

They'll encourage people to buy.

He says he's done this for a bunch of other old NFTs.

But Adam tells him there was one little snag.

Ken needs to lower the price of each tile.

That's because back in 2016, Ken set the price of each tile at 2 Ether.

Now, Ether-- I didn't know anything about this.

Ken I to explain this to me-- is the name of one of the big cryptocurrencies, like Bitcoin.

And 2 Ether back in 2016 was around 20 bucks.

The problem, Adam explained, was the value of Ether had blown up.

And 2 Ether these days was now more than $6,000, way too high for most people.

He said I would be a lot better off and a lot more successful if I would set all of them to 0.35 Eth.

0.35 Eth.

In other words, each image would cost 0.35 Ether, a third of an Ether-- at the time, around $1,000.

He told me he didn't really believe any of this was going to work anyway.

But he figured, what's he got to lose?

So Ken started knocking down the price of his 4,000 tiles, which actually took some time.

Because the way he wrote the original code, the original program for PixelMap, repricing each tile took a few minutes.

And had to do them by hand one at a time for hundreds and hundreds of tiles.

Now, he could have written code to automate that process.

But he said he wasn't thinking straight that particular week.

Because that week, his dad had a heart attack and went to the hospital for bypass surgery.

And so Ken was spending a lot of time at the hospital with his dad.

Adam was sending messages to the buyers, who were, quote, "pounding at the door." Hurry up, do them faster.

And some people were so impatient, they just paid the higher price, over $6,000 2 Ether, which leads to an obvious question.

Why lower the price if people were paying 2 Ethereum for them?

Because I'm a moron.

And he said that the whole reason that he was doing this big campaign-- I have no idea.

My wife-- she's not my wife, but I've been with her for 11 years.

She basically was like, if they're buying them at this, shouldn't we raise the price to 0.5 or 1 or just leave it at 2?

Like, it looks like they want it.

And I was like, no. It was not smart.

It was--

[LAUGHS] Ken Erwin I was worried that-- what if they all of a sudden disappear or change their mind?

I have no idea like why they want it, what's going on.

All I know is if we sell them right now, I had done the math.

I was like, we're looking at 2 million or more if we sell all of them.

And I've never had that kind of money.

Literally, all I could think about was like, I'm about to become a millionaire.

And then the weird part of the story started happening.

Wait, wait, the weird part of the story hasn't even happened yet?

Correct, yes.

Ira Glass What transpired next, he got a phone call that made him rethink everything that had happened to this point and look very differently at this guy Adam McBride, who seemed so nice and helpful at first.

He and I had a series of conversations over the course of weeks where all of this unfolded.

Basically, Ken started off like most of us, I think.

He hadn't been following this whole NFT thing, didn't know what they were.

And then suddenly, like, I don't know, somebody in a fairy tale who's transported to a strange new world where he learns he's a prince or a knight or something, Ken gets pulled into this crypto world where he finds he has all this cred, all this street cred as one of the first pioneers.

And once he's there, he starts to take a look around at the NFT world, sort of dazed.

Like, OK, you just made me a millionaire.

Who are you people?

And he does not like what he sees.

And then some other things happen after that, which you'll hear.

From WBEZ Chicago, it's This American Life.

I'm Ira Glass.

Seriously, stay with us.

Act One, Planet of the Apes.

OK, so Ken repriced his tiles, and things went even better than Adam McBride said they might.

He sold 3,000 tiles, earning him a total of $3.5 million.

And the amount of time that took from Adam's first email to $3.5 million, two days and six hours.

Six days after that, basically the first Monday that rolled around after he had all that money, he did what many people dream of doing if they hit the lottery or something.

He quit his job.

Not that he disliked his job.

Just the opposite, he says.

He really enjoyed his job.

But he wanted to devote his time to developing PixelMap in various ways.

Demand had pushed the price of PixelMap so high, $15,000 to $18,000 per tile.

He decided to keep 900 of them for himself.

But that's-- I'm not at the weird part of the story yet.

OK.

All right, so let's get to the weird part of the story.

So the weird part-- I mean, it's all weird.

But the part that changed that was this guy reached out to me and basically said, hey, I've seen some things concerning on the transactions of PixelMap.

I wanted to reach out and see if I can talk to you about it.

And he sounded like he was ticked off.

So I was like, sure.

I called him.

I've been talking to him literally every day since then.

The guy was calling from Australia.

He told him he'd been looking at all the PixelMap sales, which is not something that's hard to do.

Because every transaction with NFTs and with crypto is all public.

That's how crypto works.

And this guy was looking at the transactions, and the whole thing looked fishy to him.

Why, he asked, were you lowering the price of all the tiles when demand for them was so high?

He said he didn't know exactly what kind of ripoff Ken was running, but it made no sense.

He was positive it had to be a scam, or else I was a complete moron, like that's the only two options.

And I was like, I think I might be a moron then.

OK, CryptoPunks.

CryptoPunks are this big iconic NFT.

And they're these little cartoons.

They're like punks, like '80s punks with mohawks or dyed hair, all of them slightly different.

There are 10,000 of them.

Cute, easy to understand, and they caught on.

Celebrities bought them, Jay-Z, Serena Williams, Heidi Klum, Snoop Dogg.

And a big part of their value supposedly was that they were among the earliest NFTs anyone ever made.

And they were marketed that way, as the original NFT, the first NFT.

The average price of a CryptoPunk when Ken was talking to the guy in Australia, $300,000 to $400,000 each.

Each!

Guy in Australia was like, PixelMap is a year older than CryptoPunks.

And so--

There's absolutely no reason why yours wouldn't be worth even more than that.

You're sitting on not a couple of million, most likely several hundred million, unless you keep screwing up, essentially.

But he said that with, like, Australian words, which are less friendly.

What were the words he used?

Ken Erwin Like, you need to stop being a fucking idiot.

The guy from Australia said it didn't make sense to lower PixelMap's price at all.

Again, CryptoPunks are selling for $400,000.

And Ken was reducing PixelMap to $1,000.

And the guy in Australia had a prime suspect for who might be benefiting most from this odd behavior, for who might be behind all of it.

There was a bot, a bot that purchased 1,000 PixelMap tiles at the lowest price and then watched the price double and double again and again and again.

The bot, the bot was the biggest owner of PixelMap.

Whoever was behind the bot had made a ton of money.

I remember him saying, who do you think owns the bot?

Ken's first thought, Adam McBride.

After all, it was Adam McBride who talked him into doing this illogical thing of lowering the price.

But then he thought, did Adam McBride have that kind of money?

1,000 tiles cost more than a million dollars.

So he had another suspect, a rich guy, somebody who could be the money behind Adam McBride.

And I just want to say, I know that this is a very random name to be pulling out of the air and putting into the story.

But the rich guy Ken suspected was the president of the Philadelphia 76ers, Daryl Morey.

Daryl Morey who very publicly has talked about loving NFTs, and who Ken suspected because Adam showed him that Morey had bought a few tiles of PixelMap very early, even before Adam relaunched the site officially, before Adam told the world about it.

How did he know to do that?

Maybe he also created the bot to quietly snag an extra 1,000 tiles.

So I'm almost certain that it's either Adam or Daryl or a combination that got those.

I am trying to prove it.

But I don't know for sure.

It's just literally, those are the only two that would have known that early on.

Because the thousand were basically right at the very beginning.

And they had a right to get it.

But Adam told me-- he was specifically telling me the only way it would work is if I-- and I sound like a moron right now even saying this-- but to lower the price and making the mil as fast as possible.

I don't want to be rude, but it sounds like Adam probably asked you to lower the price so he could buy more of them.

Because he knew the price was going to go up.

Why not?

Ken Erwin So I'm basically still playing the stupid card because I'm trying to get proof of it.

There is the 0.01% chance that he didn't do-- I don't even know how it would be possible that it's not him.

But I want to know if it's him, or if it's him and Daryl, or who it is.

Ken, can I ask you, why be so mad at Adam?

You didn't know what you had.

He let you know.

He made you a millionaire.

And he's also on the internet making the market for you.

He's actually finding buyers for you.

He's talking it up.

He's making the whole thing happen.

Why shouldn't he make money?

Like, who cares he owns 1,000 of them?

You own 900 of them, and you'll make a lot of money.

You sound like my wife.

So [LAUGHS] no, so two reasons.

And one, I gave him a half million dollars as a thank you, because I went full moron.

I cannot tell you how bad that sucks that I did that.

But I am just adding that to the story.

OK, OK.

Ken Erwin But the other part of that, though, was when he was talking to me the first day, he told me, I'm not-- because I was like, there has to be something in it for you.

Why would you just do this?

And he told me he's basically doing it because he enjoys making people happy.

And if I want to reward him at the end of it, I can.

If not, he just likes to do it.

So part of it is him just lying outright and grabbing the thousand.

It's more about him just lying to me.

It's just not nice.

It was galling and sort of mindbending this guy who'd seemed like such a pal, so supportive, could have been playing him for a sucker all along, ripping him off at the exact moment he was making Ken richer than he'd ever imagined he'd be.

You don't have to know much about crypto to know that it is rife with scams of all kinds.

Ken wanted to figure out who was behind the bot.

Because he wanted to understand, what had just happened to him?

Was he like the rube who was so naive that he didn't even realize that his pocket was being picked?

What was real and what was not in this new world he suddenly found himself in?

We agreed to stay in touch.

Four days later, Ken texts me saying there's news.

And we get on the phone.

It's September 11th, his birthday.

We chat a little about how it's been kind of a weird birthday to have, most of his life.

But that's not the news.

He also has COVID, but it's a mild case.

That's also not the news.

And so what's new?

Well, he's been spending a lot of time trying to understand what's really happening with NFTs, especially with Adam McBride and the guys who buy these historic NFTs.

And he's convinced it's pretty ugly.

Yeah, it's not like a maybe.

I have proof out the ass-- sorry for language.

I have a lot of fucking proof.

They are doing this actively, project after project.

It's really fucking horrible what they're doing.

I don't think it's illegal.

I'm not saying any of it's illegal.

I think it's hugely wrong and unethical, but there's no laws about it.

But honestly, this is coming from the person that made the second NFT, if I have it right.

I don't think they should fucking exist.

He means NFTs.

Ken Erwin I think it's a horrible scam that's screwing over people, the whole thing.

Ken said that he sees everything that Adam McBride and his guys are doing because they've kind of adopted him and included him in their chat groups on Discord.

Discord, if you don't know, is a chat site.

Adam refers to the guys in his discord group as the apes.

And I had no idea what an ape was, other than a monkey.

It's just people that are ridiculously enthusiastic about NFTs.

And when they find out about one, they just go in and grab them like crazy.

That's called aping in.

Ape is a word that you actually hear a lot in the NFT world.

One big NFT is the Bored Apes Yacht Club.

To show me what is so horrible about what Adam's doing, Ken calls me back from his computer so he can share his screen.

Sorry it took me a while.

My microphone wasn't plugged in.

This is the moment I see him for the first time.

He's clean-cut with short hair, neatly trimmed beard, and the general vibe of the friendliest, most sincere tech support guy in the world.

For his job, he did his video calls in front of a green screen with a really nice microphone.

And that's what he has in this call.

He goes to open up Adam's discord group, NFT Archaeologist.

Here it is.

So this just happened.

So at 2:44 PM, just a few minutes ago, Adam said, "all right, everyone.

Please do not tweet or send this out to anyone.

请不要发推文或将其发送给任何人。

I want to keep this opportunity to this community only."

我只想把这个机会留给这个社区。”

And this is how he always does it.

他总是这样做。

This is what he did with PixelMap.

这就是他对 PixelMap 所做的事情。

I just didn't know the group yet.

我只是还不知道这个团体。

What Adam McBride is doing right here is he is rolling out another one of these historic NFTs.

Adam McBride 正在做的是，他正在推出另一项具有历史意义的 NFT。

This particular one is called Aether, A-E-T-H-E-R.

这个特殊的被称为以太，A-E-T-H-E-R。

It was created in 2018, two years after PixelMap.

它创建于 2018 年，即 PixelMap 两年后。

Like PixelMap, most people never noticed it back when it was created.

与 PixelMap 一样，大多数人在创建时从未注意到它。

But now Adam's going to help relaunch it the way that Adam relaunched PixelMap.

但现在 Adam 将像 Adam 重新启动 PixelMap 一样帮助重新启动它。

He'll get people to finally pay money for what are basically in this case virtual imaginary buildings in a virtual digital city.

他会让人们最终花钱购买虚拟数字城市中的虚拟想象建筑。

Ken and I read the conversation that's happening in the chat.

肯和我阅读了聊天中发生的对话。

McBride is telling the apes, let's all buy into this and get out there on Twitter and tell everybody we know to buy it as well.

麦克布莱德告诉猿类，让我们都相信这一点，并在 Twitter 上告诉我们认识的每个人也购买它。

So he's basically saying, go crazy on Aether, Ether.

所以他基本上是在说，为以太疯狂吧，以太。

I don't know how to say it.

我不知道该怎么说。

And to make this especially appealing to the apes, McBride says that he has negotiated with the guy who created Aether to offer Aether to his apes at a special low price, quote, "well below what I think they're going to sell for."

为了让这对猿类特别有吸引力，麦克布莱德说，他已经与创造以太的人进行了谈判，以特别低的价格向他的猿类提供以太，引用说，“远低于我认为他们会卖的价格。”

And to get the special low price, he tells them he's going to hold a live event on Discord at 9:00 AM Eastern time on Sunday.

为了获得特别低价，他告诉他们他将在东部时间周日上午 9:00 在 Discord 上举办一场现场活动。

The apes respond, Adam, that's a fantastic opportunity for us all.

猿类回应，亚当，这对我们所有人来说都是一个绝佳的机会。

Thanks for this, much appreciated.

谢谢你，非常感谢。

You're the GOAT, Adam.

你是山羊，亚当。

Sunday's the next day.

第二天就是周日了。

At 9:00 AM, the apes gather.

上午 9:00，猿类聚集。

So get ready.

所以准备好吧。

It's coming up at any second here, OK?

它随时都会出现，好吗？

That right there is the voice of Adam McBride in the Discord.

那就是《Discord》中亚当·麦克布莱德的声音。

You hear him, but you do not see him.

你听到他的声音，但你看不到他。

You see his screenshare as he clicks on various stuff.

当他点击各种内容时，您会看到他的屏幕共享。

And to give you a sense of the very happy Let's Make a Deal, take a look at what's behind the curtain vibe of the whole thing, here is the moment when he gave 50 of his apes the chance to sign up to buy Aether on the cheap for around $340.

为了让你感受到“让我们做一笔交易”非常快乐的感觉，看看整个事情的幕后氛围，这是他给 50 只猿类提供了以 340 美元左右的便宜价格购买 Aether 的机会的那一刻。

He told the apes a sign-up sheet was about to go live.

他告诉猩猩们一份报名表即将上线。

I am going to, in the next minute or so, make that public.

我将在接下来的一分钟左右将其公开。

And the first 50 of you guys who paste your name in there, we're going to give you a private sale link.

前 50 名将您的名字粘贴到其中的人，我们将为您提供一个私人销售链接。

So get ready.

所以准备好吧。

Get your stuff ready.

准备好你的东西。

I hope you're all ready right now.

我希望你们现在就准备好了。

Be ready.

做好准备。

So at some point in the next seconds, you guys tell me if you see the-- oh my god.

所以在接下来的某个时刻，你们如果看到——天哪，请告诉我。

Boom, ape-age.

繁荣，猿时代。

The sign-up has appeared, names start filling in.

报名已经出现，姓名开始填写。

You guys are fast.

你们真快啊

I see my man Curio Collector got in there.

我看到我的朋友古玩收藏家进来了。

Let's see who else got in the top for sure.

让我们看看还有谁能跻身榜首。

Chibbers got in there.

奇伯斯进去了。

Ugly Punky got in there for sure.

丑陋的朋克肯定进来了。

Bottom Bally, nice.

下巴利，不错。

Space Llama, good to see you, brother.

太空骆驼，很高兴见到你，兄弟。

He got in there for sure.

他肯定进去了。

I wanted to have some sort of ape-age possible.

我希望有某种猿类年龄的可能性。

I think ape-age is always appreciated and fun.

我认为猿猴时代总是值得欣赏和有趣的。

Man, I hope you guys enjoyed this.

伙计，我希望你们喜欢这个。

I definitely, I always enjoy this stuff.

我当然，我一直很喜欢这个东西。

And of course, I'm always available--

当然，我随时有空——

All this stuff that Adam McBride did, it was effective.

亚当·麦克布莱德所做的所有这些事情都很有效。

It pushed up the price of Aether.

它推高了以太的价格。

At some point in this, Ken took me to a site called Opensea, which is the big trading platform where people buy and sell NFTs.

在这个过程中的某个时候，Ken 带我访问了一个名为 Opensea 的网站，这是人们买卖 NFT 的大型交易平台。

And we watch as the apes descend from the trees and grab Aether.

我们看着猿猴从树上下来并抓住以太。

Yeah.

是的。

So see where it says-- see, two minutes, three minutes, four minutes, and see the price is going up.

所以看看上面写着——看，两分钟，三分钟，四分钟，看看价格在上涨。

It was 0.14 or whatever.

是 0.14 或其他什么。

There's one that just went for 3.9.

有一个刚买了3.9。

I guarantee it's going to be going crazy.

我保证它会变得疯狂。

By this evening, it's going to be crazy.

到了今天晚上，一切都会变得疯狂。

Actually, right now you should go buy Aether.

事实上，现在你应该去购买以太。

Because it's about to go up.

因为马上就要涨了。

[LAUGHS] Yeah.

[笑]是的。

I'm not saying to do that, but yeah, that's what's going to happen shortly.

我并不是说要这样做，但是，是的，这就是很快就会发生的事情。

I have to say, it is kind of amazing sitting there watching the numbers go up, knowing that this was as close to a sure thing as I would ever get.

我不得不说，坐在那里看着数字不断上升，我知道这已经是我所能得到的最接近确定的事情，这真是太神奇了。

It was like free money, right there.

这就像免费的钱，就在那里。

But I didn't buy anything.

但我什么也没买。

By Monday, the average price of Aether had risen from $2,000 to $5,000.

截至周一，以太币的平均价格已从 2,000 美元上涨至 5,000 美元。

That's in one day, it more than doubled.

一天之内，它就增加了一倍多。

And it also meant that the 50 apes who signed up on Adam's list for the special low price of $340, each of them now owned something worth $5,000.

这也意味着，以340美元的特低价格在亚当的名单上报名的50只猩猩，现在每只都拥有了价值5000美元的东西。

A little higher, yeah, a little bit better.

高一点，是的，好一点。

So those guys could just get out and they'll have just made out like bandits already.

所以那些家伙只要出去，他们就已经像土匪一样了。

Yes, yeah.

是的，是的。

Ira Glass So what Adam's doing is working.

Ira Glass：所以 Adam 所做的事情正在发挥作用。

Yes.

是的。

Ira Glass You just literally kind of rolled your eyes.

Ira Glass 你简直翻了个白眼。

No matter-- so the reason that I rolled my eyes is because it's a zero-sum thing.

没关系——所以我翻白眼的原因是因为这是一个零和的事情。

So someone's making money, no matter what.

所以不管怎么样，总有人在赚钱。

And when they do, that means someone's losing money.

当他们这样做时，就意味着有人在赔钱。

And basically, the earlier you are, the better it is.

基本上，越早越好。

If you know news before other people, basically, if you're one of these people, you're going to make out really well.

如果你比其他人先了解新闻，基本上，如果你是这些人中的一员，你就会表现得很好。

And lots of other people, Ken believes, will lose money.

肯相信，还有很多其他人会赔钱。

What we're seeing in his view is a classic pump and dump, something that if you did it in the stock market would be totally illegal.

在他看来，我们看到的是典型的拉高和抛售，如果你在股票市场上这样做，那将是完全非法的。

The apes get in early, talk up Aether on Twitter, encourage other people to buy, which pushes up the price.

猩猩们很早就介入，在 Twitter 上大肆宣传 Aether，鼓励其他人购买，从而推高了价格。

And in a couple of days when the price is at the highest, they sell, taking a quick and sizeable profit.

在价格最高的几天内，他们就会卖出，从而快速获得可观的利润。

Without the hype, the NFTs price falls.

如果没有炒作，NFT 的价格就会下跌。

And anybody left holding it takes a beating, loses money.

任何持有它的人都会受到打击，遭受损失。

In fact today, in the months since that day when Adam relaunched Aether, the price has plummeted.

事实上，从 Adam 重新推出 Aether 那天起的几个月里，价格已经暴跌。

It's now down as low as $900 some days, very different from those early, booming days when it was $5,000.

现在有时会跌至 900 美元，与早期繁荣时期的 5,000 美元大不相同。

And I don't think as many people as you think are going to make the money.

我不认为像你想象的那么多人会赚到钱。

Like, every ape in here is probably going to do OK.

就像，这里的每只猩猩可能都会过得很好。

But it's not going to be good for the people outside of it that hop on the train last.

但这对于最后跳上火车的外面的人来说并不好。

And that's what Ken thinks is kind of evil about the world of NFTs, why he thinks they're a scam and shouldn't exist.

这就是 Ken 认为 NFT 世界的邪恶所在，他认为 NFT 是一个骗局，不应该存在。

Seeing all this made me wonder if any of this is actually illegal.

看到这一切让我想知道这是否真的是非法的。

And I've now talked to a bunch of lawyers about it, lawyers who deal with NFTs and crypto and security fraud, including two who advise companies that release NFTs.

我现在已经和一群律师讨论过这个问题，他们是处理 NFT 以及加密货币和安全欺诈的律师，其中包括两名为发布 NFT 的公司提供咨询的律师。

And I described what I saw Adam McBride do in relaunching Aether.

我描述了我看到 Adam McBride 在重新启动 Aether 时所做的事情。

And all of them told me that NFTs are so new, the law is still pretty vague.

他们所有人都告诉我，NFT 太新了，法律仍然相当模糊。

There haven't been many lawsuits or much government enforcement in NFTs.

NFT 方面的诉讼或政府执法并不多。

But they pointed to two things that could be problematic.

但他们指出了两件事可能存在问题。

OK, first, if Adam and the apes were pumping and dumping-- specifically, if they were lying about Aether or about their own trading, that would be an issue.

好吧，首先，如果亚当和猿类在拉高和抛售——具体来说，如果他们在以太或他们自己的交易上撒谎，那将是一个问题。

Like if they were going onto Twitter and telling people that Aether is a great investment, worth seeking money into for the long run, but then if they themselves only held onto it for a few days until the price rose and then they sold it, that would be illegal.

就像他们在 Twitter 上告诉人们，以太币是一项伟大的投资，值得长期投资，但如果他们自己只持有几天，直到价格上涨，然后将其出售，那就是非法的。

That would be market manipulation.

这将是市场操纵。

The second thing the lawyers pointed to, transparency is key.

律师指出的第二件事是，透明度是关键。

If Adam was going out giving a special price to 50 people to generate buzz and excitement, that is a normal kind of promotion in lots of industries, one of the lawyers says.

一位律师表示，如果 Adam 出去向 50 人提供特价以引起轰动和兴奋，那么这在许多行业都是一种正常的促销活动。

He said that could be fine.

他说那可能没问题。

But the key to that being OK is that Adam would need to disclose it all publicly so that any possible investor can find out that some people got a special cheaper price.

但做到这一点的关键是，亚当需要公开披露这一切，以便任何可能的投资者都能发现有些人得到了特别便宜的价格。

If Adam didn't do that, he would be in danger of some investor, maybe somebody who lost money, later suing him over holding back that information.

如果亚当不这样做，他就会面临一些投资者（也许是赔钱的人）的危险，随后会因隐瞒信息而起诉他。

OK, so was Adam crossing the line into illegality with either of those things?

好吧，那么亚当在这两件事上是否已经越界了？

Ken still didn't have proof of that, either way.

不管怎样，肯仍然没有证据。

As for the bot, that mysterious bot that purchased 1,000 PixelMap tiles, a fourth of all the tiles, Ken started to worry that it was someone much more sinister than Adam behind the bot.

至于机器人，那个购买了 1,000 个 PixelMap 图块（占所有图块的四分之一）的神秘机器人，Ken 开始担心机器人背后的人比 Adam 更加险恶。

One day he texts me panicked about what he's learning about the bot, so scared about it that he doesn't know if he wants to go on the radio anymore.

有一天，他给我发短信，惊慌失措地告诉我他对机器人的了解，他非常害怕，以至于他不知道是否还想继续上广播。

I guess the short part is just I'm kind of freaked out.

我想简短的部分只是我有点害怕。

It's just it's so much bigger than what I-- the bot account that I was telling you about is just much, much bigger.

只是它比我告诉你的机器人帐户要大得多。

He sent me a screenshot that showed that the account had done nearly $2 billion in trades-- specifically, it's 1.84 billion-- since it was created 14 months before.

他给我发了一张屏幕截图，显示该账户自 14 个月前创建以来已完成近 20 亿美元的交易——具体来说，是 18.4 亿美元。

This is not some normal person.

这可不是什么正常人。

This is a legitimately smart probably group of bad people.

这是一群非常聪明的坏人。

It's a very well-organized thing.

这是一件组织得非常好的事情。

You don't think it's possible that it's just a bunch of investors--

你认为不可能只是一群投资者——

No. Ira Glass --Adam has assembled around him where it's like--

不。艾拉·格拉斯——亚当聚集在他周围，就像——

No. Ira Glass --100 people and together, they have a lot of money?

不，Ira Glass——100 个人，加起来，他们有很多钱？

I don't think he's sophisticated-- or, yes, he might be working for this group or something.

我不认为他很老练——或者，是的，他可能正在为这个团体或其他什么机构工作。

But I don't think he's smart enough to be like this.

但我不认为他聪明到会变成这样。

He wouldn't be doing what he was doing if he had this much money.

如果他有这么多钱，他就不会做他正在做的事情。

This is a totally different league of someone.

这是一个完全不同的联盟。

It could be like, the Russian mafia or something.

可能是俄罗斯黑手党之类的。

I know that sounds ridiculous.

我知道这听起来很荒谬。

But this is only one account.

但这只是一个帐户。

People that have that much money and are doing that type of behavior are not into people blowing the whistle on them.

那些有那么多钱并且做出这种行为的人不喜欢别人揭发他们。

Blowing the whistle, he means talking about them publicly on the radio.

吹哨子，他的意思是在广播中公开谈论他们。

I don't know.

我不知道。

There are no good movies where the person that plays me makes it to the end and has like a happy life.

没有哪部好电影能让扮演我的人走到最后并过上幸福的生活。

It's usually like, the person that's like me gets killed.

通常情况下，像我这样的人就会被杀。

Wait, there are whistleblower movies where the whistleblower makes it to the end and lives.

等等，有些吹哨人电影里，吹哨人能坚持到最后并活下来。

I don't know.

我不知道。

I literally don't have-- I don't have a fence-- not that a fence would stop anything.

我确实没有——我没有栅栏——栅栏不会阻止任何东西。

I have like, no-- I live in Indiana.

我想，不——我住在印第安纳州。

I'm probably the only person that doesn't have a gun in the state.

我可能是该州唯一没有枪的人。

I seriously legitimately feel like my name being on a story could result in me not existing, or my family.

我真的很合理地认为，我的名字出现在故事中可能会导致我或我的家人不存在。

I legitimately feel that way.

我有这样的感觉是合理的。

Wow.

哇。

Ken Erwin I'm not exaggerating.

肯·欧文我没有夸张。

That's how I feel.

我就是这样的感觉。

I tell him on the call, and later in email, that I respect any choice he makes.

我在电话中和后来的电子邮件中告诉他，我尊重他所做的任何选择。

And of course, it's fine if he drops out of the story.

当然，如果他退出故事也没关系。

But is he right about that 1.8 billion in trades?

但他关于 18 亿美元交易的说法正确吗？

Couldn't the bot just be making a ton of trades with a much smaller amount of money?

难道机器人不能用更少的资金进行大量交易吗？

Maybe the bot's even buying from itself to drive up the price of NFTs.

也许该机器人甚至会从自己那里购买以推高 NFT 的价格。

That's something that happens in the NFT world.

这就是 NFT 世界中发生的事情。

Ken emails back, says maybe I'm right but maybe not.

肯回邮件说，也许我是对的，但也许不是。

Though, he's getting a new tool that could tell us how much money is really behind all those trades so he could decide if he really thinks it's a criminal syndicate behind all this and get a better sense of how much risk there is for him.

不过，他得到了一个新工具，可以告诉我们所有这些交易背后到底有多少钱，这样他就可以决定他是否真的认为这一切背后是一个犯罪集团，并更好地了解他面临的风险有多大。

What he's getting is software developed by a company called Chainalysis.

他得到的是一家名为 Chainaanalysis 的公司开发的软件。

And it's usually used by governments and law enforcement and financial institutions to track who's doing what in NFTs and crypto.

它通常被政府、执法机构和金融机构用来追踪谁在 NFT 和加密领域做了什么。

It could tell Ken what the bot was buying and selling and to who, what other accounts it interacted with.

它可以告诉 Ken 机器人正在买卖什么，以及它与谁、与哪些其他帐户进行交互。

"I'm talking to the Chainalysis people today," Ken wrote me.

“我今天正在和 Chainaanalysis 的人交谈，”肯写信给我。

A few days pass while Ken uses the Chainalysis tool to look at who bought and sold PixelMap tiles, look at what the bot was doing.

几天过去了，Ken 使用 Chainaanalysis 工具查看谁购买和出售了 PixelMap 图块，看看机器人在做什么。

And then he texts me, "I have lots of updates.

然后他给我发短信说：“我有很多最新消息。

I was wrong about pretty much everything."

我几乎所有事情都错了。”

What he found, and my conversation with the bot-- or anyway, the guys behind the bot-- that's in a minute from Chicago Public Radio when our program continues.

他发现了什么，以及我与机器人的对话（或者无论如何，机器人背后的人），当我们的节目继续时，芝加哥公共广播电台将立即播出。

It's This American Life.

这就是美国生活。

I'm Ira Glass.

我是艾拉·格拉斯。

Today's program, The Reluctant Explorer.

今天的节目，不情愿的探险家。

We have the story of somebody who finds himself in this new world that he never asked to be part of.

我们有一个故事，讲述的是一个人发现自己身处这个他从未要求加入的新世界。

And he decides to take a look around to figure out the truth of what is going on.

他决定环顾四周，找出正在发生的事情的真相。

I came along for the ride.

我是来搭便车的。

We're right now in the middle of our story about Ken Erwin and PixelMap.

我们现在正在讲述 Ken Erwin 和 PixelMap 的故事。

And before we go further in that story, I'm thinking that this might be a good moment to explain what NFTs are in a little more detail for everyone who's gotten this far in our story and still actually does not know what they are.

在我们进一步讲述这个故事之前，我想现在可能是一个好时机，可以为每个已经了解了我们的故事但实际上仍然不知道 NFT 是什么的人更详细地解释一下 NFT 是什么。

So OK, NFTs, they're images or artwork or video clips, so basically that you can post online.

好吧，NFT，它们是图像、艺术品或视频剪辑，所以基本上你可以在网上发布。

The key thing that makes them an NFT is that someone can say they own it.

使它们成为 NFT 的关键是有人可以说他们拥有它。

And ownership is possible because a record of who owns the NFT gets stored on something called a blockchain.

所有权是可能的，因为谁拥有 NFT 的记录存储在称为区块链的东西上。

And lots of people know what a blockchain is, but lots of people do not.

很多人知道什么是区块链，但也有很多人不知道。

So I'm just going to say the blockchain is a set of computers that are all over the world, and they all store exactly the same data.

所以我只想说区块链是一组遍布世界各地的计算机，它们都存储完全相同的数据。

And anybody can look at that data.

任何人都可以查看这些数据。

They're like a public ledger that anybody can read.

它们就像任何人都可以阅读的公共分类帐。

So blockchains store the records of who owns which NFTs, who owns cryptocurrencies.

因此，区块链存储了谁拥有哪些 NFT、谁拥有加密货币的记录。

And right now, all kinds of people are inventing all kinds of things to throw up on the blockchain.

现在，各种各样的人正在发明各种各样的东西并扔到区块链上。

It's a messy, anarchic chaos, really.

这确实是一种混乱、无政府的混乱。

One end of things, you have the NBA selling videos of great dunks as NFTs, basically reinventing sports trading cards for the crypto world, very old school, very commercial.

一方面，NBA 将精彩扣篮视频作为 NFT 出售，基本上是为加密世界重新发明体育交易卡，非常老派，非常商业化。

At the other end, you have stuff like some people who burned a Banksy print and then sold a digital copy of the print, like a picture of the print, for way more than the original ever cost.

另一方面，有些人烧毁了班克斯的印刷品，然后出售该印刷品的数字副本，例如该印刷品的图片，其价格远远高于原版的价格。

That one was like a lot of crypto stuff in that it was kind of making fun of the whole idea that anybody would think that the NFT was worth anything.

这就像很多加密货币一样，它有点取笑任何人都会认为 NFT 有价值的整个想法。

The original Banksy print actually had this sentence as part of the image.

最初的班克斯印刷品实际上将这句话作为图像的一部分。

Quote, "I can't believe you morons actually buy this shit." So let's pick up our story where we left off.

引用：“我不敢相信你们这些白痴居然买了这个东西。”那么让我们从上次停下的地方继续我们的故事吧。

Act Two, In the Time of Chimpanzees, I was a Monkey.

第二幕，在黑猩猩时代，我是一只猴子。

So what have you figured out since we last spoke?

那么自从我们上次谈话以来你发现了什么？

Everything, literally everything.

一切，字面上的一切。

Yeah.

是的。

Do you want me to show you how I found out?

你想让我告诉你我是如何发现的吗？

Ken screenshares me so I can see how the Chainalysis software maps somebody's crypto transactions.

Ken 与我进行屏幕共享，这样我就可以看到 Chainaanalysis 软件如何映射某人的加密交易。

And I have to say, it is a very satisfying chart to look at, with dots of different colors and lines and arrows connecting them.

我不得不说，这是一个非常令人满意的图表，有不同颜色的点以及连接它们的线条和箭头。

It took him days to look into all these transactions.

他花了几天时间调查所有这些交易。

But when he did, he learned for once and for all, Adam was not the bot.

但当他这样做时，他彻底明白了，亚当不是机器人。

The rich guy he suspected, Daryl Morey, president of the 76ers, also not the bot.

他怀疑的那个有钱人，76人队总裁达里尔·莫雷，也不是机器人。

So who was the bot?

那么这个机器人是谁？

Ken started to look at everything the bot was doing.

肯开始观察机器人所做的一切。

And he found that whoever made the bot had not covered their tracks completely.

他发现无论是谁制造了这个机器人，都没有完全掩盖他们的踪迹。

Ken spotted this one address that the bot sent money to that was different from all the others.

肯发现机器人汇款的地址与其他地址不同。

Lucky because he also found the same address on a message board asking for fake Ether.

幸运的是，他还在留言板上找到了相同的地址，要求提供假以太币。

Yes, fake Ether.

是的，假以太币。

Programmers use fake Ether to test new pieces of code they're writing.

程序员使用假以太来测试他们正在编写的新代码。

You never do this with someone else's address.

你永远不会用别人的地址这样做。

You always do it with your own.

你总是用自己的方式去做。

I actually did this with my own.

我实际上是用我自己做的。

This address led Ken to an account on GitHub.

这个地址引导 Ken 在 GitHub 上建立了一个帐户。

GitHub is where pretty much everyone on the planet stores their source code.

GitHub 是地球上几乎每个人都存储源代码的地方。

There's other competitors.

还有其他竞争对手。

But Microsoft owns it now.

但现在微软拥有了它。

It's wonderful.

太棒了。

The GitHub account name was a pretty unusual name.

GitHub 帐户名是一个非常不寻常的名字。

And then Ken found a Twitter account with the same name.

然后肯发现了一个同名的 Twitter 帐户。

That Twitter user had to be the bot.

那个 Twitter 用户一定是机器人。

And he has an awesome little avatar.

他有一个很棒的小头像。

It's a Pikachu with a little headband belt thing.

这是一只带着小头带的皮卡丘。

And he looks a little angry.

而且他看起来有点生气。

So I said, I'm the creator of PixelMap.

所以我说，我是 PixelMap 的创建者。

I would love to talk to you if you have any time.

如果您有时间的话，我很乐意与您交谈。

And when I typed this, I was freaking out.

当我输入这个时，我吓坏了。

I was so excited.

我很兴奋。

Then I said, I'm relatively certain that you bought over 1,000 and just wanted to talk with you if you'd be open to that.

然后我说，我比较确定你买了 1000 多件，只是想和你谈谈，如果你愿意的话。

And then a smiley, because I was like-- my smiley was just like to not freak him out.

然后是一个笑脸，因为我的笑脸只是为了不吓到他。

Then the guy writes back.

然后那家伙回信了。

Ken Erwin So he said, hmm, interesting.

Ken Erwin 所以他说，嗯，有趣。

I'm curious, how did you come to this conclusion?

我很好奇，你是怎么得出这个结论的？

Which is a really good freaking question.

这是一个非常好的问题。

So I said, ah, I found your address connected to the bot account on both receiving and sending funds.

所以我说，啊，我发现你的地址在接收和发送资金时都连接到了机器人账户。

And then I added another smiley to keep it-- I didn't want him to think that I'm trying to threaten him or-- you know what I mean?

然后我又加了一个笑脸来保留它——我不想让他认为我试图威胁他或者——你知道我的意思吗？

Yeah.

是的。

Ken asked the guy how he found PixelMap and started buying so quickly.

Ken 问那家伙是如何找到 PixelMap 并如此迅速地开始购买的。

The guy says he saw Adam's tweet.

那家伙说他看到了亚当的推文。

And he asks again, how'd you find me on Twitter?

他又问，你是怎么在 Twitter 上找到我的？

With a little puzzle smiley.

带有一个小拼图笑脸。

Ken explains how he found him.

肯解释了他是如何找到他的。

So then I wanted confirmation, I wanted him to validate that I was right.

所以我想要确认，我想让他确认我是对的。

I said, ah, is it you?

我说啊，是你吗？

Did you get over 1,000?

你超过1000了吗？

No connection to Daryl or Adam other than his tweet?

除了他的推文之外，与达里尔或亚当没有任何联系？

And at this point I'm thinking that there is no connection, but I'm just double checking.

此时我认为没有任何联系，但我只是再次检查。

So he goes, yes, I own a lot of tiles but don't know who Daryl is.

所以他说，是的，我拥有很多瓷砖，但不知道达里尔是谁。

I saw this as a historical project and aped in.

我认为这是一个历史性的项目并模仿了它。

After that, it's very amicable.

之后就非常友好了。

They chat about collaborating maybe someday.

他们谈论也许有一天会合作。

The guy tells Ken he as a partner that he does all this with, tells him how to get in touch with the partner.

那家伙告诉肯，他作为合作伙伴，与他一起完成这一切，并告诉他如何与合作伙伴取得联系。

He and the partner also agreed to talk to me on the condition that I wouldn't give their real names or record their voices.

他和合伙人也同意与我交谈，但条件是我不能透露他们的真实姓名或录下他们的声音。

We did a session over Zoom.

我们通过 Zoom 进行了一次会议。

The two guys behind the bot are living in the mideast, both in their 20s.

机器人背后的两个人都住在中东，都是 20 多岁。

Though when they turned on the camera, one of them said, I know I don't look like I'm in my 20s.

不过，当他们打开摄像头时，其中一人说，我知道我看起来不像 20 多岁。

Crypto makes you age faster.

加密货币会让你变老得更快。

A week in crypto is like a year.

在加密货币领域，一周就像一年。

It's 24/7.

现在是 24/7。

A lot of things happen.

很多事情发生了。

They both got into crypto in 2016, 2017.

他们都在 2016 年、2017 年进入了加密货币领域。

One of them was making money selling digital weapons to gamers for games like Counter Strike Global Offensive, started doing a lot of those transactions in Bitcoin.

其中之一是向《反恐精英全球攻势》等游戏的玩家出售数字武器来赚钱，并开始用比特币进行大量此类交易。

And then Bitcoin blew up.

然后比特币就爆炸了。

They got into NFTs, were liquidators for decentralized finance sites, which is like being a crypto repo man.

他们进入了 NFT，成为去中心化金融网站的清算人，这就像成为一个加密货币回购人。

They just launched an NFT trading site of their own to compete with Opensea that they're calling Golom.

他们刚刚推出了自己的 NFT 交易网站，以与 Opensea 竞争，他们称之为 Golom。

They're big Lord of the Rings fans.

他们是《指环王》的忠实粉丝。

I asked them about the $1.84 billion in transactions.

我向他们询问了 18.4 亿美元交易的情况。

And they said they have about $100 million that they invest with, and they just spend that over and over.

他们说他们有大约 1 亿美元的资金用于投资，而且他们只是一遍又一遍地花掉这些钱。

They totally nerded out when we talked about PixelMap.

当我们谈论 PixelMap 时，他们完全厌烦了。

They've decorated a bunch of their tiles.

他们装饰了一堆瓷砖。

If you go to the PixelMap.io website, you can see where they combined a bunch of their tiles to write Golom and some others to write Donda.

如果您访问 PixelMap.io 网站，您可以看到他们将一堆图块组合起来写成 Golom，将其他图块组合起来写成 Donda。

They're big Kanye fans.

他们是 Kanye 的忠实粉丝。

This is all, can I say, very different from Ken imagined, that the bot was controlled by a murderous criminal syndicate or by somebody in league with Adam McBride, trying to swindle him.

我可以说，这与肯想象的完全不同，该机器人是由一个凶残的犯罪集团或与亚当·麦克布莱德勾结的人控制的，试图欺骗他。

It was definitely shocking.

这绝对是令人震惊的。

But probably impressed was the biggest thing.

但印象深刻可能是最重要的事情。

Impressed because when Ken found the first guy's GitHub account, he looked at the code he'd written.

印象深刻的是，当 Ken 找到第一个人的 GitHub 帐户时，他查看了他编写的代码。

And looking through his stuff, I was like, this guy's got some good code.

看着他的东西，我就想，这个人有一些很好的代码。

Like, just as a developer, he's a good dev, just super impressed.

就像，作为一名开发人员，他是一名优秀的开发人员，给人留下了深刻的印象。

So for me, I don't know.

所以对我来说，我不知道。

He's like one of my people.

他就像我的人之一。

Which, of course, was kind of reassuring in a small world, the monsters we imagine are not real sort of way.

当然，这在一个小世界里让人感到安心，我们想象的怪物并不是真实存在的。

But at the same time--

但与此同时——

I would honestly say there was some disappointment, which sounds weird-- I definitely did not want to get attacked by the Russian mafia.

老实说，我有些失望，这听起来很奇怪——我绝对不想受到俄罗斯黑手党的攻击。

But I really thought that I was going to blow the cover on this huge thing.

但我真的以为我会揭露这个巨大的事情。

And I thought that was going to be super cool.

我认为这会非常酷。

Yeah.

是的。

There's something exciting about the thought of like, I'm going to uncover a massive criminal syndicate.

想到我要揭露一个巨大的犯罪集团，我就感到很兴奋。

Or at least like, the president of the 76ers.

或者至少像76人队的主席。

Yeah, that's a cooler story.

是的，这是一个更酷的故事。

OK, so if the bot's not Adam and doesn't have anything to do with Adam, what was Adam's angle?

好吧，如果机器人不是 Adam 并且与 Adam 没有任何关系，那么 Adam 的角度是什么？

Why did he insist on lowering the price of PixelMap so much?

为什么他坚持要把PixelMap的价格降这么多？

Was he pumping and dumping PixelMap and other NFTs?

他是否在炒作和抛售 PixelMap 和其他 NFT？

And did he know that Ken suspected him of being this two-faced mastermind, up to no good?

他是否知道肯怀疑他是这个两面派的主谋，图谋不轨？

Never.

绝不。

I had no idea, literally no idea that he was suspecting me.

我不知道，真的不知道他在怀疑我。

This, of course, is Adam McBride.

这当然是亚当·麦克布莱德。

When we talked, I went into detail about all of the things that Ken had suspected him of.

当我们谈话时，我详细讲述了肯怀疑他的所有事情。

I read him quotes where Ken said that there was 0.01% chance that Adam wasn't deliberately ripping him off.

我读过他的话，肯说亚当有 0.01% 的可能性不是故意欺骗他。

Adam seemed truly amused by this.

亚当似乎真的对此感到好笑。

It's just crazy, man.

这太疯狂了，伙计。

[LAUGHS] It's crazy.

[笑]这太疯狂了。

But I get it.

但我明白了。

I understand his thought process.

我理解他的思维过程。

It makes sense.

这是有道理的。

But when I hear it, it's shocking.

但当我听到的时候，却很震惊。

I wouldn't have even thought about doing that.

我根本没想过要这么做。

I was surprised to learn when I talk to Adam that Adam got hooked on NFTs only six months before he pulled Ken into that world.

当我与 Adam 交谈时，我惊讶地发现 Adam 在将 Ken 引入那个世界的六个月前就迷上了 NFT。

Basically what happened is March of last year, a bunch of these, quote unquote, "historic, old NFTs were rediscovered and started making tons of money."

基本上发生的事情是去年 3 月，其中一堆，原话是这样的，“历史性的、旧的 NFT 被重新发现，并开始赚大钱。”

I mean, it just flipped the switch in my brain, like, holy cow.

我的意思是，它只是打开了我大脑中的开关，就像天哪。

It was literally like, oh my god, there's gold.

简直就像是，天哪，有金子。

Get your shovel.

拿起你的铲子。

Go dig.

去挖吧。

Because there's gold there.

因为那里有黄金。

All you got to do is go find it.

你所要做的就是去找它。

The next four months, he says he spent 10 hours a day searching for other early NFTs by googling phrases like digital collectibles, blockchain art, blockchain collectibles.

他说，接下来的四个月里，他每天花 10 个小时通过谷歌搜索数字收藏品、区块链艺术、区块链收藏品等短语来寻找其他早期的 NFT。

He found 15 or 20 old NFTs that seemed like they might work.

他发现了 15 或 20 个看起来可能有用的旧 NFT。

But most of them, he says there was some problem in the original programming or whatever they made them unsuitable to sell today.

但他说，大多数作品的原始编程存在一些问题，或者其他原因导致它们不适合今天出售。

He did find a few that were suitable.

他确实找到了一些合适的。

And then he and a friend found PixelMap.

然后他和一个朋友找到了 PixelMap。

And from the beginning, they thought it would be a big hit if they could just convince its creator to lower the price.

从一开始，他们就认为如果能说服其创造者降低价格，就会大受欢迎。

And the reason that they lowered it so much?

他们降低这么多的原因是什么？

Well, by that point, Adam had a little experience.

嗯，到那时，亚当已经有了一些经验。

And the one NFT relaunch I failed at, we set that price too high, and it failed.

我失败的一次 NFT 重新推出，我们把价格定得太高，结果失败了。

Which one was this?

这是哪一个？

Adam McBride It's called Etherization.

Adam McBride 这就是所谓的以太化。

So he made his best guess for PixelMap's price.

所以他对 PixelMap 的价格做出了最好的猜测。

And it worked out better than any NFT he's done before or since.

而且它的效果比他之前或之后所做的任何 NFT 都要好。

People just went nuts.

人们简直疯了。

Yeah, it was a rocket ship, a complete rocket ship.

是的，这是一艘火箭飞船，一艘完整的火箭飞船。

How many tiles did you buy?

你买了多少块瓷砖？

Adam McBride Three.

亚当·麦克布莱德三.

[LAUGHS] I'm an idiot.

[笑]我是个白痴。

I'm an idiot.

我是个白痴。

It's funny because I was more looking for the fame and recognition than the money.

这很有趣，因为我更寻求名誉和认可而不是金钱。

I don't even know what to say.

我什至不知道该说什么。

Yeah.

是的。

It was more about like, look at McBride.

更重要的是，看看麦克布莱德。

He rediscovered this.

他重新发现了这一点。

This is awesome.

这太棒了。

OK, to be clear, he did make a half million dollars off this, the money that Ken handed him as a thank you.

好吧，需要明确的是，他确实从中赚了 50 万美元，这是肯递给他作为答谢的钱。

But he didn't know that was going to happen.

但他不知道会发生这样的事。

Usually, he says, the NFT creators give him nothing.

他说，通常情况下，NFT 创造者不会给他任何东西。

And nobody's given him close to this much.

没有人给他这么多。

He does want to make money in NFTs.

他确实想通过 NFT 赚钱。

But what Adam McBride also wants, just as much, it seems, is that he wants to make historic NFTs a thing, get them respect, create a much larger community that's into them.

That's his angle.

这就是他的角度。

If he succeeds, yeah, he'll make money on all the historical NFTs that he owns personally.

是的，如果他成功了，他将从他个人拥有的所有历史 NFT 上赚钱。

But it's also now become kind of a personal mission for him.

但现在这也成为他的个人使命。

He wants historic NFTs to be remembered and valued.

他希望历史性的 NFT 能够被铭记和重视。

And for that reason, he's not pumping and dumping with his own NFTs.

出于这个原因，他不会用自己的 NFT 进行拉高和抛售。

There's no dumping.

没有倾销。

He's still holding on to his tiles of PixelMap and the other historic NFTs he's launched.

他仍然保留着 PixelMap 的图块以及他推出的其他具有历史意义的 NFT。

Ken actually looked at Adams transactions with the Chainalysis tool and confirmed that in all the transactions that he could find, Adam buys a few NFTs of each of his projects and then basically just holds onto them.

As for the other big feature of a pump and dump scheme, deception, I couldn't find any examples of Adam lying about the NFTs he promotes or making false promises about how much money people would make.

When it comes to the other concerns of the lawyers that I talked to about Adam and the way that he released that NFT Aether to 50 of his apes at a special low price-- just to remind you, they said, basically, if people were getting a lower price, Adam needed to disclose that to the world, to anybody who might be considering buying Aether.

当谈到我所采访的律师的其他担忧时，他们担心 Adam 以及他以特别低的价格向 50 只猩猩释放 NFT Aether 的方式——只是提醒你一下，他们说，基本上，如果人们得到更低的价格，Adam 需要向全世界披露这一点，向任何可能考虑购买 Aether 的人披露。

Well, I actually do do that.

嗯，我确实这么做了。

Like with Aether, it was on Twitter before we did any sort of giveaway or opportunity.

就像 Aether 一样，在我们提供任何形式的赠品或机会之前，它就已经在 Twitter 上出现了。

Anybody could have joined that Discord.

任何人都可以加入那个不和谐的行列。

Anybody could have gotten in.

任何人都可能进来。

We wanted more people in.

我们希望更多的人加入。

That's not true at all.

这根本不是真的。

After we talked, I went back and looked at Adam's tweets from back then.

聊完之后，我又回去看了 Adam 当时的推文。

And he never tweeted about the fact that you could get a really low price on Aether by coming to this event, or that he had held the event at all.

他从来没有在推特上说过参加这个活动可以获得非常低的以太价格，或者他根本没有举办过这个活动。

In fact, on Discord, he is saying to his followers things like, "Do not tweet or send this out, I want to keep this opportunity to this community only.

事实上，在 Discord 上，他对他的追随者说，“不要发推文或发送出去，我只想把这个机会留给这个社区。

Keep it on the down low." He did mention the giveaway in a post that he did on Medium after it happened.

保持低调。”事情发生后，他在 Medium 上发表的一篇帖子中确实提到了赠品。

So we got back on the line.

于是我们又重新上线了。

Hey, Ira, how you doing?

嘿，艾拉，你好吗？

Ira Glass I'm doing good.

艾拉·格拉斯我做得很好。

How are you doing?

你好吗？

Pretty good.

不错。

Memory is a funny thing, isn't it?

记忆是个有趣的东西，不是吗？

[LAUGHS]

[笑]

Indeed it is.

确实如此。

Adam McBride Oh, the webs we weave with our brain, man, it is funny.

亚当·麦克布莱德哦，我们用大脑编织的网，伙计，这很有趣。

He told me that when he went back and looked at what happened with Aether, he realized back then, he saw a chance to use the discounted NFTs to reward the people in his Discord, which he calls the Alpha Discord.

他告诉我，当他回头看看 Aether 发生的事情时，他意识到当时他看到了一个机会，可以使用打折的 NFT 来奖励他的 Discord 中的人们，他称之为 Alpha Discord。

Even though it's a public community, anybody can join it.

尽管它是一个公共社区，但任何人都可以加入。

At that point in time, people were like, why are we in the Alpha Discord if we're not getting any alpha?

那时，人们会想，如果我们没有获得任何阿尔法，为什么我们会处于阿尔法不和谐之中呢？

Alpha in the NFT world means special information, intel, stuff everybody else doesn't have yet.

NFT 世界中的 Alpha 意味着特殊信息、英特尔、其他人还没有的东西。

Right?

正确的？

Why are we here if you're not going to give us some awesome info?

如果您不打算给我们一些很棒的信息，我们为什么会在这里？

And so I was trying to reward people who were in there for a while.

所以我试图奖励那些在那里待了一段时间的人。

He told me that this was all in the spirit of creating a larger community of people who value these historic NFTs.

他告诉我，这一切都是为了创建一个更大的社区，由重视这些历史性 NFT 的人们组成。

In general, I have to say, the fact that Adam did not think to disclose this special giveaway that he did for the apes just shows how much he and so much of the NFT world is just making it up as they go along.

总的来说，我不得不说，Adam 并没有想到要透露他为猿类所做的这项特殊赠品，这一事实表明他和 NFT 世界的大部分人只是在胡编乱造。

Everyone is still figuring out what laws are going to apply to them.

每个人仍在弄清楚哪些法律将适用于他们。

Like, there was this moment when I was talking to Adam where I told him exactly how much disclosure the lawyers thought would be smart for him to do to avoid lawsuits.

就像，有那么一刻，当我和亚当交谈时，我确切地告诉他律师认为他应该披露多少信息以避免诉讼。

And it was news to Adam.

这对亚当来说是个新闻。

No, it's good advice.

不，这是个好建议。

And I hear it.

我听到了。

I think I've acted appropriately.

我认为我的行为是正确的。

I think intention matters.

我认为意图很重要。

So I feel pretty good about what I've done.

所以我对我所做的事情感觉很好。

Well, that's what all the criminals say.

嗯，所有的罪犯都是这么说的。

[LAUGHS] Well, we'll see.

[笑]好吧，我们拭目以待。

Come visit me in jail, Ira.

艾拉，来监狱探望我吧。

Will you please come visit me in jail?

你能来监狱探望我吗？

It's now been a half year since my initial phone calls with Ken, half a year where he's been traipsing around the NFT world that he found himself transported to.

距离我第一次和 Ken 通电话已经过去了半年，半年来他一直在 NFT 世界里闲逛，他发现自己被传送到了这个世界。

And he's acting more and more like a local, not exactly an ape yet, but definitely more ape-tolerant.

他的行为越来越像当地人，虽然还不完全是猿，但绝对更能容忍猿。

NFTs don't seem so evil to him anymore.

NFT 对他来说似乎不再那么邪恶了。

In fact, the exact thing that he thought was so terrible-- NFTs that get hyped, everybody piles on as the price rises, and then people sell and take a quick profit, leaving lots of losers in their wake-- he's now speculated like that himself, made money on a few things, lost money on others.

事实上，他认为的事情太可怕了——NFT 被炒作，随着价格上涨，每个人都在囤积，然后人们抛售并快速获利，留下大量亏损者——他现在自己也这样投机，在一些事情上赚钱，在另一些事情上赔钱。

He says with those NFTs, with most NFTs, he thinks, actually, everybody knows the price is going to go up for a little while and then crash.

他说，对于那些 NFT，对于大多数 NFT，他认为实际上每个人都知道价格会上涨一段时间，然后崩盘。

And everyone knows that, and everyone's just trying to time it.

每个人都知道这一点，每个人都在努力把握时机。

Time when they'll sell.

到时候他们就会卖掉。

Ken Erwin And if you time it right, then you do pretty well.

Ken Erwin 如果你把握得当，那么你会做得很好。

And it definitely feels like a game, sort of.

这绝对感觉像是一场游戏。

The more I am in the space, the more it feels like we're all kind of at a casino.

我在这个空间里呆得越多，就越感觉我们都在赌场里。

And because there aren't any rules, it's fair.

而且因为没有任何规则，所以这是公平的。

Everyone is doing this type of thing.

每个人都在做这种事情。

And I don't think there's anything morally wrong with it.

我不认为这在道德上有什么问题。

Oh my god, listen to you.

天哪，听你的。

Ken Erwin I don't think--

肯·欧文我不认为——

What changed him, exactly?

究竟是什么改变了他？

The whole NFT world started to look different to him the moment he realized he wasn't being scammed.

当他意识到自己没有被骗时，整个 NFT 世界开始变得不一样了。

Suddenly it didn't seem like he'd landed in a dark woods full of thieves trying to take advantage of him.

突然之间，他似乎不像是降落在一片充满小偷试图占他便宜的黑暗树林里。

Yeah, the reason why I was so angry until that point was I thought that it was an in-house, that I'd been lied to by Adam this entire time.

是的，直到那时我才如此生气，因为我认为这是内部人士，我一直被亚当欺骗。

And then to find out that he actually did a really good job of relaunching it and he actually was helping me--

然后发现他实际上在重新启动它方面做得非常好并且他实际上正在帮助我 -

Right.

对。

So you realized, oh, wait a second.

所以你意识到，哦，等一下。

Oh no, this stranger actually did something good for me.

哦不，这个陌生人居然为我做了件好事。

Yes, and he literally didn't charge me.

是的，他确实没有向我收费。

Like, yes, I tipped him.

就像，是的，我给了他小费。

But I know if he never existed and I somehow knew that I should relaunch PixelMap and list it, I would not have done as good of a job.

但我知道，如果他从未存在过，并且我以某种方式知道我应该重新启动 PixelMap 并将其列出，我就不会做得那么好。

I had no idea-- anything like that is not my skill set.

我不知道——类似的事情不是我的技能。

Yeah, no, he was legit.

是的，不，他是合法的。

Ken also met a bunch of developers like him, who weren't scammers.

肯还遇到了一群像他一样的开发人员，他们不是骗子。

They were just buying NFTs for fun.

他们购买 NFT 只是为了好玩。

It was like he found his people, and the whole NFT world seemed less ominous.

就好像他找到了自己的人民一样，整个 NFT 世界似乎也不再那么不祥了。

Not that he thinks very much of most NFTs, 99% of them, he thinks, are pretty much junk, either intended as junk to make a quick buck or just misconceived ideas in the first place.

并不是说他对大多数 NFT 评价很高，他认为其中 99% 的 NFT 几乎都是垃圾，要么是为了赚快钱的垃圾，要么就是一开始就被误解的想法。

Actually, this is not an unusual opinion.

事实上，这并不是一个不寻常的观点。

It was interesting to me that the biggest NFT enthusiasts that I talked to for this story, people who really love NFTs, they pretty much agreed with that.

对我来说有趣的是，我在这个故事中采访过的最大的 NFT 爱好者，那些真正热爱 NFT 的人，他们非常同意这一点。

Adam McBride says 99% of all NFTs released today will probably end up being worth nothing.

Adam McBride 表示，今天发布的所有 NFT 中 99% 最终可能会变得一文不值。

He says that most people probably should not get into NFTs right now.

他表示，大多数人现在可能不应该进入 NFT。

The Bot Guys put the number at 90% worthless.

Bot Guys 认为这个数字 90% 毫无价值。

I read that one of the big NFT moguls, Gary Vaynerchuk, predicted that 98% of NFTs would lose money.

我读到，NFT 大亨之一 Gary Vaynerchuk 预测 98% 的 NFT 都会亏损。

Ken's life these days, he's still in the same house he was before all this, a Victorian with turquoise shutters and gnomes and trinkets and dachshunds everywhere.

肯现在的生活，他仍然住在这一切之前的同一所房子里，一栋维多利亚时代的房子，到处都是绿松石百叶窗、侏儒、小饰品和腊肠犬。

He's paid off the mortgage with his PixelMap money, bought himself a nicer computer and a fancy sports car that now he thinks he's going to get rid of, paid over a million dollars in taxes.

他用 PixelMap 的钱还清了抵押贷款，给自己买了一台更好的电脑和一辆豪华跑车，现在他认为自己要扔掉它们，并缴纳了超过 100 万美元的税款。

I was like, is most of your money still in Ether, whose price goes up and down?

我当时想，你的大部分钱仍然是以太币吗？以太币的价格会上下波动吗？

And he explained that, no, he's converted more than half of it into regular US dollars, for safety's sake.

他解释说，不，为了安全起见，他将其中一半以上兑换成普通美元。

But he said that having all that money hasn't really changed much in a day-to-day way.

但他表示，拥有这么多钱并没有给日常生活带来太大改变。

He's working more than ever, he said, except now it's all on PixelMap.

他说，他的工作量比以往任何时候都多，只不过现在一切都在 PixelMap 上。

I feel like you're in this weird situation where most of your working life, you were actually doing things and developing code for big companies, Amazon and Snapchat, and people would use the code, like, it would do stuff all over the world.

我觉得你处于一种奇怪的境地，你的大部分工作生活实际上都是在为大公司、亚马逊和 Snapchat 做事和开发代码，人们会使用这些代码，就像它会在世界各地做事一样。

And then this thing that you build that's completely useless--

然后你建造的这个东西就完全没用了——

I hate you.

我恨你。

I'm just playing Ira Glass --that doesn't contribute to society really--

我只是在扮演艾拉·格拉斯——这对社会没有真正的贡献——

No, what you don't realize is I have been contributing to pointless causes my entire career.

不，你没有意识到我的整个职业生涯都在为毫无意义的事业做出贡献。

So when I worked at Salesforce, it was to help make sure that on Black Friday, you get spam emails from like, Best Buy and every other company.

因此，当我在 Salesforce 工作时，是为了帮助确保在黑色星期五，您会收到来自百思买和其他所有公司的垃圾邮件。

And that's like--

那就像——

So are you saying this idea of before you were a productive, contributing member of society is ridiculousness?

那么你是说，在你成为一个富有成效、有贡献的社会成员之前，这种想法是荒谬的吗？

I'm saying I was never a productive member.

我是说我从来都不是一个富有成效的成员。

But do you think about the fact that the thing that made you rich is this thing that doesn't--

但你有没有想过这样一个事实：让你变得富有的东西并不是——

It's very odd that I've written probably like a million-- I don't know how many lines, but a lot of lines of code, and PixelMap is 70 lines.

很奇怪的是，我写了大约一百万行——我不知道有多少行，但有很多行代码，而 PixelMap 有 70 行。

So it is very odd that 70 lines that I wrote for fun-- yes, it's very odd.

所以我为了好玩而写的 70 行很奇怪——是的，这很奇怪。

I think the best way I can describe it is it feels like I found a cheat code, like in a game, but for real life.

我认为我能描述它的最好方式是感觉就像我找到了一个作弊代码，就像在游戏中一样，但适用于现实生活。

Like, you type in the thing and then all of a sudden, your bank account isn't an issue.

就像，你输入了一些东西，然后突然之间，你的银行账户就不再是问题了。

It's very odd.

这很奇怪。

The time he spends working on PixelMap every day, a couple of hours of that is chatting on Discord with the people who own tiles.

他每天花在 PixelMap 上的时间，其中几个小时是在 Discord 上与拥有图块的人聊天。

But what's sucking up most of his time, Ken's designing a video game for the PixelMap site.

但 Ken 的大部分时间都在为 PixelMap 网站设计一款视频游戏。

He's paying a musician and an artist and a game developer and a project manager and doing lots of coding himself.

他雇佣了一名音乐家、一名艺术家、一名游戏开发人员和一名项目经理，并自己编写了大量代码。

He's always wanted to make a video game.

他一直想制作一款视频游戏。

And now he has the luxury of being able to spend as much time as he wants doing that.

现在他很幸运，可以随心所欲地花时间去做这件事。

He knows this video game is not going to make him any money.

他知道这个视频游戏不会给他带来任何钱。

But he just likes making stuff.

但他只是喜欢制作东西。

That's the impulse that led him to create PixelMap in the first place.

这就是最初促使他创建 PixelMap 的冲动。

Credits Ira Glass Well, our program was produced today by Michelle Navarro with David Kestenbaum.

图片来源：Ira Glass 嗯，我们今天的节目是由 Michelle Navarro 和 David Kestenbaum 制作的。

The people who put together today's show include Elna Baker, Chris Benderev, Susan Burton, Zoe Chace, Sean Cole, Michal Comite, Miki Meek, Stowe Nelson, Katherine Rae Mondo, Alix Spiegel, Robyn Semien and Alissa Shipp, Laura Starcheski, Christopher Swetala, Matt Tierney, Julie Whitaker, and Diane Wu.

今天节目的制作人包括 Elna Baker、Chris Benderev、Susan Burton、Zoe Chace、Sean Cole、Michal Comite、Miki Meek、Stowe Nelson、Katherine Rae Mondo、Alix Spiegel、Robyn Semien 和 Alissa Shipp、Laura Starcheski、Christopher Swetala、Matt Tierney、Julie Whitaker 和 Diane Wu。

Our managing editor is Sarah Abdurrahman.

我们的总编辑是萨拉·阿卜杜拉赫曼 (Sarah Abdurrahman)。

Our executive editor is Emanuele Berry.

我们的执行编辑是 Emanuele Berry。

Special thanks today to Kevin Roose, Timothy Massad, Howell Jackson, Matt Levine, Aaron Klein, Samantha Ventura, Chris Crawford, and a bunch of people in the NFT world who asked not to be named but who know who they are.

今天特别感谢 Kevin Roose、Timothy Massad、Howell Jackson、Matt Levine、Aaron Klein、Samantha Ventura、Chris Crawford 以及 NFT 世界中的一群不愿透露姓名但知道他们是谁的人。

This episode right now is our last episode with one of our longtime producers, Robyn Semien, she's been here for nearly 15 years, produced so much memorable stuff, including our live show at BAM and what may be my favorite episode we've ever done, 129 Cars, about a car dealership trying to make its monthly quota.

这一集是我们与我们的长期制作人之一 Robyn Semien 合作的最后一集，她已经在这里工作了近 15 年，制作了很多令人难忘的东西，包括我们在 BAM 的现场表演，以及可能是我们做过的我最喜欢的一集《129 汽车》，讲述了一家汽车经销商试图完成每月配额的故事。

She won us a Peabody with her episode Anatomy of Doubt.

她凭借《怀疑的解剖》一集为我们赢得了皮博迪奖。

She's a force behind the scenes here too.

她也是这里的幕后力量。

She will be very much missed.

我们会非常想念她。

She's off to create a new podcast series that she's been thinking about for years.

她即将创建一个她多年来一直在思考的新播客系列。

I definitely know I'll be listening.

我绝对知道我会听。

Our website, thisamericanlife.org.

我们的网站 thisamericanlife.org。

You can stream our archive of over 750 episodes for absolutely free.

您可以完全免费地观看我们的 750 多集档案。

Also, there's videos.

另外，还有视频。

There's lists of favorite programs.

有最喜欢的节目列表。

If you're looking for something to listen to, there's tons of other stuff there.

如果您正在寻找可听的内容，那里还有大量其他内容。

Again, thisamericanlife.org.

再说一次，thisamericanlife.org。

This American Life is delivered to public radio stations by PRX, the Public Radio Exchange.

《美国生活》由公共广播电台 PRX 向公共广播电台播出。

Thanks, as always, to our program's co-founder, Mr. Torey Malatia.

一如既往地感谢我们项目的联合创始人 Torey Malatia 先生。

You know, before he got into radio, he worked for years as a field biologist.

你知道，在他进入广播行业之前，他曾担任多年的野外生物学家。

He was actually Jane Goodall's assistant for a long time.

他实际上长期担任珍·古道尔的助手。

But she fired him because whenever they would sneak up close to a pack of chimps, he'd yell--

但她解雇了他，因为每当他们偷偷靠近一群黑猩猩时，他就会大喊——

Oh my god, boom, ape-age.

天哪，繁荣，猿龄。

Ira Glass I'm Ira Glass, back next week with more stories of This American Life.

艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass）我是艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass），下周回来，带来更多《美国生活》的故事。

This American Life This American Life is produced in collaboration with WBEZ Chicago and delivered to stations by PRX The Public Radio Exchange.

This American Life This American Life 与 WBEZ Chicago 合作制作，并由 PRX 公共广播电台传送到各电台。