768: The Other Front Lines - This American Life
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00:00 00:00 Transcript Share This American Life Life Partners How to Listen Episodes Recommended About Overview Staff Announcements Fellowships Jobs Music Make Radio On The Road FAQ Submissions Merch Contact Us Our Other Shows Merch Follow Us Life Partners Subscribe to our newsletter Full episode Toggle Audio and Transcript Sync Transcript | Episode #768 | April 22, 2022 768: The Other Front Lines Note: This American Life is produced for the ear and designed to be heard.
00:00 00:00 文字记录 分享此 美国生活 生活伙伴 如何收听 剧集 推荐 关于 概述 员工公告 奖学金 工作 音乐 在路上制作电台 常见问题解答 提交 商品 联系我们 我们的其他节目 商品 关注我们 生活伙伴 订阅我们的时事通讯 整集 切换音频和文字记录同步 文字记录 | 内容第 768 集 | 2022 年 4 月 22 日 768：其他前线 注：《美国生活》是为耳朵而制作的，旨在让人们听到。
If you are able, we strongly encourage you to listen to the audio, which includes emotion and emphasis that's not on the page.
如果可以的话，我们强烈建议您收听音频，其中包括页面上没有的情感和重点。
Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors.
文字记录是使用语音识别软件和人工转录员结合生成的，可能包含错误。
Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print.
请在印刷版引用前检查相应的音频。
Prologue: Prologue Ira Glass From WBEZ Chicago, it's This American Life.
序言：序言 来自 WBEZ 芝加哥的 Ira Glass，这就是美国生活。
OK, so going down the stairs to walk the dog, reluctant to use the elevator today because there are explosions in my area, mostly pretty rare ones, but over the last hour, maybe more frequent.
好吧，所以下楼梯去遛狗，今天不愿意使用电梯，因为我所在的地区发生了爆炸，大多是非常罕见的爆炸，但在过去的一个小时里，可能更频繁。
This is recorded in Kyiv by a woman named Katia.
这是由一位名叫卡蒂亚（Katia）的妇女在基辅录制的。
And it takes you into the everydayness of this war in this very intimate, three-dimensional way.
它以一种非常亲密的三维方式带你进入这场战争的日常生活。
I'm going to play you a bit more of this before I say more about it.
在我详细介绍之前，我将先给大家演示一下。
And I already have noticed that the best way to know if they are really close is to observe the birds.
我已经注意到，了解它们是否真的很接近的最好方法是观察鸟类。
If the birds start panicking and flying away, that means that explosion is probably relatively close.
如果鸟儿开始惊慌并飞走，则意味着爆炸可能相对较近。
Oh, here.
哦，在这里。
There was another one.
还有另外一个。
I really need to have my dog pee.
我真的需要让我的狗撒尿。
There is a beep of the door.
门传来“嘟”的一声。
And so day, I think, second of the war-- I think it was February 25-- there was shooting that I could hear from three directions.
所以，我想，战争的第二天——我想是 2 月 25 日——我可以从三个方向听到枪声。
And then when I came home, almost immediately I heard this loud, metallic noise.
然后当我回到家时，几乎立刻我就听到了这种巨大的金属噪音。
And I looked out the window, and there was a tank driving along my building.
我向窗外望去，有一辆坦克沿着我的大楼行驶。
So there is a dig in the ground where Russian tank was driving, and my dog is considering peeing on it right now, which is frankly hilarious.
俄罗斯坦克行驶的地方有一个挖洞，我的狗现在正在考虑在上面撒尿，坦率地说，这很搞笑。
But if you go along them, you can clearly see--
但如果你沿着它们走下去，你可以清楚地看到——
OK, the birds are flying.
好吧，鸟儿飞了。
I think I will try to head back in general direction of my house, and sorry.
我想我会尝试朝我家的大致方向返回，抱歉。
My dog is stubborn.
我的狗很固执。
He doesn't want to.
他不想。
I think he wants to go poop.
我觉得他想拉屎。
Risking my life for you, asshole.
为了你我冒着生命危险，混蛋。
No, he's not an asshole.
不，他不是一个混蛋。
He's a very sweet and kind dog.
他是一只非常可爱又善良的狗。
He is very, very calm about the-- OK, I'm going home because this one was really loud.
他非常非常平静——好吧，我要回家了，因为这个声音真的很大。
Katia actually recorded these for the VICE News Reports podcast, starting at the beginning of the war.
卡蒂亚实际上从战争开始时就为 VICE 新闻报道播客录制了这些内容。
She asked that they and we not say her last name, or what part of the city she's in, or what kind of job she does, other than it's in education.
她要求他们和我们不要说出她的姓氏，或者她在城市的哪个部分，或者她从事什么工作，除了教育以外。
War is personal.
战争是个人的。
We don't usually talk about it that way, but Ukraine had over 40 million people at the start of the war.
我们通常不会这样谈论它，但战争开始时乌克兰有超过 4000 万人口。
And there are just all kinds of ways that they're going through it, on all sorts of front lines.
他们在各种前线以各种方式经历着这一切。
For Katia, the front line has been a bunch of different things, but one of them is her decision to stay in Kyiv with her parents.
对于卡蒂亚来说，前线有很多不同的事情，但其中之一就是她决定和父母一起留在基辅。
Her dad's 87.
她父亲87岁了。
Her mom's 73.
她妈妈73岁了。
Both have medical issues.
两人都有健康问题。
My dad has cancer.
我爸爸得了癌症。
He's not treatable, basically not treatable anymore.
他无法治疗，基本上已经无法治疗了。
He's also almost completely blind.
他也几乎完全失明。
And so he's basically lying in bed the entire day, apart from walking along the corridor a little bit and eating, and he's listening to radio.
所以他基本上一整天都躺在床上，除了沿着走廊走一会儿、吃点东西外，他还听广播。
My mom has diabetes.
我妈妈患有糖尿病。
She also has trouble walking.
她走路也有困难。
They are choosing to stay here because they can't just go to the bomb shelter back and forth all the time.
他们选择留在这里，是因为他们不能一直去防空洞来回。
And we're just hoping for the best.
我们只是希望得到最好的结果。
She shops for them, stays up nights to help her dad with whatever he needs.
她为他们购物，熬夜帮助她父亲满足他需要的一切。
At this stage of his illness, she says, he wouldn't be as comfortable anywhere as he is in this apartment.
她说，在他病情的这个阶段，他在任何地方都不会像在这间公寓里那么舒服。
She does a bunch of different stuff in these audio diaries, like she does a tour of their apartment, which includes a stop at this big bag in the hallway with stuff that she's packed if they need to flee.
她在这些音频日记中做了很多不同的事情，比如她参观了他们的公寓，其中包括在走廊里的这个大包前停下来，里面装着她打包的东西，以防他们需要逃跑。
Inside my backpack, I have documents.
我的背包里有文件。
I have some of my clothes, headlight.
我有一些衣服，车头灯。
I think I have some of my underpants.
我想我有一些内裤。
OK, going further through my corridor, there is a spot where I sleep because it has wall on one hand and it has a big wardrobe on the other.
好吧，再穿过我的走廊，有一个我睡觉的地方，因为它一方面有墙，另一方面有一个大衣柜。
I think it's, maybe apart from the bathroom, the best option to survive in case of blast.
我认为，也许除了浴室之外，这是在发生爆炸时生存的最佳选择。
There's an audio diary that she does, where her dad is listening to a radio report, where people on the radio are explaining what taxes they do and do not need to pay right now that the country is in a state of war.
她写了一本音频日记，她爸爸正在听广播报道，广播里的人正在解释他们现在需要缴纳哪些税，而国家正处于战争状态，不需要缴纳哪些税。
There's one where Katia notes that before the war, the hallway in her apartment building always smelled like weed because that's where teenagers went to get high, but that hasn't been true since the war.
卡蒂亚（Katia）在其中指出，战前，她公寓楼的走廊总是闻起来像杂草，因为那是青少年吸毒的地方，但战后情况并非如此。
And then she records this one, I guess, for her American listeners.
然后她录制了这首歌曲，我想是为了她的美国听众。
OK, there is an address by the president that was published exactly three minutes ago.
好的，总统的讲话是三分钟前发表的。
So I'm going to watch it.
所以我要去看看。
I know that Zelensky is a bit of a sex symbol in the West right now, so I hope this is a bit of an ASMR sesh for you, [LAUGHS] as well.
我知道泽连斯基现在在西方有点性感象征，所以我希望这对你来说也有点 ASMR sesh，[笑]。
[LAUGHS] I'm sorry if this was way too harsh of a joke.
[笑]如果这是一个太严厉的笑话，我很抱歉。
Ira Glass Katia's dog, Yoki, is in a bunch of these audio diary entries.
Ira Glass Katia 的狗 Yoki 就出现在这些音频日记条目中。
In one of them, she talks about how they bought some canned dog food for him, which luckily he likes.
在其中一篇文章中，她谈到他们如何给他买了一些罐装狗粮，幸运的是他喜欢。
He's apparently kind of a finicky eater.
看来他是个挑食的人。
But now the cans are running out, and they're not sure what they're going to find to replace them with.
但现在罐子已经用完了，他们不知道能找到什么来代替。
Today we gave him one can in the morning, and in the evening my mom said that maybe we should don't give him his second meal to spread out the food supplies for him that we have.
今天早上我们给了他一罐，晚上我妈妈说也许我们不应该给他第二顿饭，以分散我们为他提供的食物供应。
And my dad, he just wanted to eat kefir, which I don't know if you're familiar with.
而我爸爸，他只是想吃开菲尔，我不知道你是否熟悉。
It's a kind of sour milk drink.
这是一种酸奶饮料。
He drank maybe half of it, maybe a little bit more than half of it, and he just said, give the rest to the dog.
他可能喝了一半，可能比一半多一点，他只是说，把剩下的给狗。
And this was heartbreaking.
这令人心碎。
My 87-year-old dad, him in his condition, he'd given half of his dinner to the dog.
我87岁的父亲，在他的情况下，他把一半的晚餐给了狗。
It's just fucked.
简直就是操蛋。
Russian warship, go fuck yourself.
俄罗斯军舰，去你妈的吧。
In a war, the front line is everywhere, every place the war touches.
在战争中，前线无处不在，战争触及的每一个地方都存在。
And right now, people are navigating their own small struggles in the shadow of this huge one.
现在，人们正在这场巨大斗争的阴影下进行自己的小斗争。
In putting together today's show, I thought about Studs Terkel's book, The Good War.
在整理今天的节目时，我想到了 Studs Terkel 的书《正义之战》。
I don't know if you know this one.
我不知道你是否认识这个。
He tries to document World War II, but not talking about it as history with a capital H, but just, he does interviews, just these great interviews with all sorts of people who lived through the war.
他试图记录第二次世界大战，但不是用大写的 H 将其作为历史来谈论，而是只是进行采访，只是对经历过战争的各种人进行了这些精彩的采访。
Today's show is kind of like that.
今天的节目有点像这样。
Anyway, stay with us.
无论如何，留在我们身边吧。
Act One: Yevgenia and Her Neighbors Ira Glass Act One, Yevgenia and Her Neighbors.
第一幕：叶夫根尼娅和她的邻居 艾拉·格拉斯 第一幕，叶夫根尼娅和她的邻居。
So one of the things that made us want to do a show of personal stories in this war was reading these diaries that Yevgenia Belorusets has been publishing.
因此，让我们想要在这场战争中展示个人故事的原因之一就是阅读叶夫根尼娅·贝洛鲁塞特出版的这些日记。
She's a writer and a photographer in Kyiv.
她是基辅的一名作家和摄影师。
And after the Russians invaded, when she'd go out and take pictures, she would be told over and over to put away her camera.
俄罗斯人入侵后，当她出去拍照时，她会一遍又一遍地被告知收起相机。
People wanted to know, are you a spy?
人们想知道，你是间谍吗？
They didn't want to be photographed.
他们不想被拍照。
So instead she started writing about the interactions that she was having with people and putting them into Der Spiegel Magazine.
因此，她开始写下她与人们的互动，并将其放入《明镜周刊》杂志中。
Kyiv was nowhere as violent or as dangerous as certain other cities in Ukraine, but everybody was still living in this city that was transformed by the war and figuring out how to deal with that.
基辅不像乌克兰其他一些城市那样暴力或危险，但每个人仍然生活在这座被战争改变的城市里，并想出如何应对这一问题。
In the diaries, Yevgenia says over and over in different ways, is this really happening?
在日记中，叶夫根尼娅以不同的方式一遍又一遍地说，这真的发生了吗？
Even just a week or two into the war, she writes about how it feels like it's been going on forever.
即使战争刚刚开始一两周，她也会写到战争永远持续下去的感觉。
She gave us permission to excerpt the diaries here.
她允许我们在这里摘录日记。
They're read first by actress Ivanna Sakhno.
首先由女演员伊万娜·萨赫诺 (Ivanna Sakhno) 朗读。
They begin on February 24, the day of the invasion, day one, and then proceed day by day, day two, day three, which is where we'll pick them up.
他们从 2 月 24 日，也就是入侵的那天开始，第一天，然后一天天地进行，第二天，第三天，我们将在那里接他们。
Day three, my first night in a bomb shelter.
第三天，我在防空洞的第一个晚上。
It is 1 and 1/2 floors deep underground, to be precise, a network of corridors and corridors.
它在地下1又1/2层深处，准确的说，是一个由走廊和走廊组成的网络。
At the dark entrance to our basement, I see the silhouettes of residents scurrying past each other.
在我们地下室黑暗的入口处，我看到居民们的剪影彼此匆匆而过。
You can overhear the occasional petty arguments.
您偶尔会听到一些琐碎的争吵。
Two older shadows pass by two younger ones.
两个年长的影子从两个年轻的影子旁边走过。
Good evening.
晚上好。
But the evening is not good, the younger ones protest.
但晚上不太好，年轻人抗议道。
We wish you a good evening anyway, the older ones say in triumphant tone, because we mean well and we'll continue to wish it.
无论如何，我们祝您度过一个美好的夜晚，年长的人用胜利的语气说道，因为我们的本意是好的，我们将继续祝愿这一点。
The shadows disappear into the depths of the cellar.
影子消失在地窖深处。
As I write, it occurs to me that during the day, I saw many smiling people, for example, a woman who was sitting in the park, on a bench, next to two shopping bags.
当我写作时，我突然想到，白天，我看到许多微笑的人，例如，一位女士坐在公园的长凳上，旁边有两个购物袋。
She spoke to me in an absurdly happy voice, saying that she was waiting for her nephew to help her carry the bags home.
她用一种异常高兴的声音对我说话，说她正在等她的侄子帮她把袋子搬回家。
I'm so happy to have you standing next to me now, talking to me.
我很高兴现在你站在我旁边跟我说话。
When there are two of us, I'm less afraid of the artillery.
当我们有两个人的时候，我就不那么害怕大炮了。
Day five.
第五天。
Almost all pharmacies are closed.
几乎所有药店都关门了。
Electricity, water, and heating are under constant threat of failure.
电力、水和暖气不断面临故障的威胁。
The public spaces, squares, streets in the city are empty.
城市的公共空间、广场、街道空无一人。
I accompanied a German friend who could not stay in Kyiv to the railway depot, a journey of 25 minutes, which for me was a walk into another vast reality.
我陪一位无法在基辅停留的德国朋友来到火车站，25分钟的路程，对我来说就像走进了另一个广阔的现实。
Since the beginning of the war, I have not visited Shevchenko Boulevard, a wide street leading down to the depot.
自从战争开始以来，我就没有去过舍甫琴科大道，这是一条通往仓库的宽阔街道。
We walked along the street, and every house, every intersection, carried something new, a new language, a new narrative about our shared reality.
我们沿着街道行走，每一栋房子、每个十字路口都承载着一些新的东西、一种新的语言、一种关于我们共同现实的新叙述。
The city looked peaceful.
这座城市看上去很平静。
We quickly said goodbye and I strolled back alone.
我们很快就告别了，我独自漫步回去。
At about the same time, peaceful residents of the city of Berdiansk in the south of the country were gathered in front of their local government building, which was occupied by Putin's army and guarded by armed soldiers.
大约在同一时间，该国南部别尔江斯克市的和平居民聚集在当地政府大楼前，该大楼已被普京军队占领，并由武装士兵把守。
The women shouted at the soldiers in Russian.
妇女们用俄语对士兵们大喊大叫。
How can you look your mothers in the face?
你怎么能看你妈妈的脸？
You brought war and slaughter into our land.
你们给我们的土地带来了战争和屠杀。
Shame on you.
你太无耻了。
Old people were also in the crowd.
人群中也有老人。
They were not afraid.
他们并不害怕。
The soldiers looked demoralized.
士兵们看上去士气低落。
They replied, we came to protect you.
他们回答说，我们是来保护你的。
The women resisted.
妇女们反抗了。
They continued to protest.
他们继续抗议。
We were never in danger here.
我们在这里从来没有遇到过危险。
There was no threat to us before you came.
在你来之前我们没有受到任何威胁。
Now, with you, because of you, we are in the greatest danger.
现在，和你在一起，因为你，我们面临着最大的危险。
Then came cursed insults, which have a very great richness in the Ukrainian and Russian languages.
然后是咒骂的侮辱，这在乌克兰语和俄语中非常丰富。
Day six.
第六天。
It is the sixth day of the war, which I feel has already lasted 50 years.
这是战争的第六天，我感觉这场战争已经持续了50年。
I went for a walk to breathe some fresh air in this first day of spring and maybe do some shopping.
在春天的第一天，我出去散步，呼吸新鲜空气，也许还可以去购物。
Knowing that many supermarket shelves were already empty, I decided to visit a larger grocery store that had recently opened not far from us.
知道许多超市的货架已经空了，我决定去看看离我们不远最近新开业的一家更大的杂货店。
How pleasant it was to be there.
在那里真是太愉快了。
The shopping mall is deep underground.
购物中心位于地下深处。
Everyone felt safe and walked past the shelves with a slowness that has not been seen in Kyiv for six days.
每个人都感到安全，并以基辅六天来从未见过的缓慢速度走过货架。
On the way back, I took a picture of an old man sitting alone on a bench in the park.
回来的路上，我拍了一张照片，一位老人独自坐在公园的长椅上。
He wanted to talk to me.
他想和我说话。
His wife was ill, he told me, and he was taking care of her.
他告诉我，他的妻子病了，他正在照顾她。
He wanted to take care of her until tomorrow.
他想照顾她直到明天。
Then he will join the Kyiv territorial defense.
随后他将加入基辅领土保卫战。
He and his wife are 66 years old.
他和他的妻子今年 66 岁。
In his youth, he served in the military.
年轻时，他曾在军队服役。
I started thanking him.
我开始感谢他。
I couldn't stop, as if that would prevent this elderly man, caring for his sick wife, from risking his life.
我无法停下来，仿佛这样就可以阻止这位照顾生病妻子的老人冒着生命危险。
Day nine.
第九天。
I woke up quite early in a bright mood and with the feeling that this sunny day had something to offer me.
我很早就醒了，心情愉快，感觉这个阳光明媚的日子可以给我带来一些东西。
Little was left of the melancholy I felt yesterday.
昨天的忧郁已所剩无几。
Then I discovered the reason for this change.
后来我发现了这个变化的原因。
I no longer believe in the war.
我不再相信战争。
It simply can't be, I thought.
我想，这根本不可能。
It isn't true.
这不是真的。
What neighboring country bombs a city to rubble in the 21st century?
哪个邻国在 21 世纪将一座城市炸成废墟？
You can't occupy this country.
你不能占领这个国家。
It's unrealistic.
这是不现实的。
The war is a dream, a dictator's fantasy.
战争是一场梦，是独裁者的幻想。
I wanted to see if the little store next to our house still had bread.
我想看看我们家旁边的小商店还有没有面包。
I have not been able to get bread since the third day of the war.
自从战争第三天起我就再也买不到面包了。
It is usually sold out.
通常已经卖完了。
The store was full.
店里已经满了。
With some amazement, I discovered a group, who I took to be representatives of the International Military.
带着一些惊讶，我发现了一个团体，我认为他们是国际军队的代表。
They spoke English and needed help translating.
他们说英语，需要翻译帮助。
Then I realized that they were not soldiers, but unarmed, if well-protected, escorts of a war photographer, who was also shopping in the store.
然后我意识到他们不是士兵，而是一名战地摄影师的护卫，虽然保护得很好，但手无寸铁，而这位摄影师也在商店购物。
I tried to help her choose a detergent.
我试图帮助她选择洗涤剂。
The small group exuded enthusiasm, humor, and inspiration.
这个小团体散发着热情、幽默和灵感。
My mood suddenly darkened.
我的心情顿时暗了下来。
One of the three escorts proudly said to me, do you know who you're standing with?
三个护卫之一骄傲地对我说，你知道你和谁站在一起吗？
This is one of the best photographers in the world.
这是世界上最好的摄影师之一。
And the photographer laughed and shrugged it off.
摄影师笑了，耸耸肩。
Please, she said.
拜托，她说。
I'm embarrassed.
我很尴尬。
Then she told me her name.
然后她告诉我她的名字。
I can't remember the name.
我不记得名字了。
I've been having a hard time concentrating lately.
我最近很难集中注意力。
Then she said, you can follow me on Instagram.
然后她说，你可以在 Instagram 上关注我。
The group bought a lot of detergent, almost everything in the store.
一行人买了很多洗洁精，店里几乎都有。
I told them, good to have you with us, and said, goodbye.
我告诉他们，很高兴有你和我们在一起，然后说再见。
But quickly, an uneasiness came over me.
但很快，一种不安袭上心头。
I realized that it is not a good sign when a well-known war photographer sets up shop here.
我意识到，一位著名的战地摄影师在这里开店，这不是一个好兆头。
Day 12.
第 12 天。
I receive a utility bill for my Kyiv apartment.
我收到了基辅公寓的水电费账单。
It is accompanied by a telegram message that sounds like an apology.
它附有一条听起来像是道歉的电报。
We are writing to you with a request.
我们写信给您提出请求。
If your financial means allow, under the circumstances, please pay the utilities.
如果您的经济能力允许，请在这种情况下缴纳水电费。
Many Kyiv utility workers joined the Ukrainian army and are now fighting for our freedom.
许多基辅公用事业工人加入了乌克兰军队，现在正在为我们的自由而战。
However, it is still important to pay the bills.
然而，支付账单仍然很重要。
Day 17.
第 17 天。
It was a sleepless night.
这是一个不眠之夜。
The air raid alarm, sounding its sirens over the city, kept me up all night.
空袭警报在城市上空响起，让我彻夜难眠。
I was too tired to go to the shelter.
我太累了，不想去避难所。
I heard explosions and hoped that no one was injured.
我听到爆炸声，希望没有人受伤。
My plan for the day was to pick up my bulletproof vest, which had finally been delivered.
我今天的计划是去取我的防弹背心，它终于送到了。
Then I would visit a lady who, as a sort of concierge, watches over a house in the neighborhood and keeps an eye on the comings and goings.
然后我会去拜访一位女士，她就像门房一样，看守着附近的一栋房子，留意着人来人往。
There are many such concierges in the city, but since the beginning of the war, this lady had taken on an additional task.
城里有很多这样的礼宾员，但自从战争开始后，这位女士就承担了一项额外的任务。
She must make sure that nothing is stolen from the abandoned apartments.
她必须确保废弃公寓中没有任何东西被盗。
Her name had a comforting ring to it that reminded me of childhood-- Dussia.
她的名字听起来让人感到安慰，让我想起了童年——杜西亚。
One of the residents from her building, who had escaped, had asked me to check in on her, which made her happy.
她所在大楼的一位逃出的居民让我去看看她，这让她很高兴。
Because she is alone, no one can relieve her of her watch.
因为她孤身一人，没有人可以替她值班。
She also lives in the building where she works.
她也住在她工作的大楼里。
I visited her in her small concierge room on the first floor.
我在一楼她的小礼宾室拜访了她。
There was only space for a table and a sofa.
房间里只有一张桌子和一张沙发。
The TV was on.
电视开着。
She said, so many people are escaping Kyiv, but I have nowhere to go.
她说，这么多人逃离基辅，但我无处可去。
In her face I saw helplessness, but she had made her decision to stay put.
从她的脸上我看到了无奈，但她已经决定留在原地。
I tried to lighten the mood with some not entirely clever jokes.
我试图讲一些不太聪明的笑话来缓解气氛。
I was happy that she smiled at me, and I decided to visit her again soon.
我很高兴她对我微笑，我决定很快再去看她。
Day 24.
第 24 天。
Today an old couple made their way through the wreckage on Sich Riflemen's Street.
今天，一对老夫妇在西奇步枪兵街的废墟中艰难前行。
They walked shakily past shards of broken glass and heaps of rubble.
他们摇摇晃晃地走过碎玻璃碎片和瓦砾堆。
This elderly pair, who have lived their lives amid undying declarations of love between Russians and Ukrainians, two brotherly peoples, did not want to believe that fratricide was in full swing.
这对老年夫妇一生都生活在俄罗斯人和乌克兰人这两个兄弟民族之间永恒的爱的宣言中，他们不想相信兄弟间的自相残杀正在如火如荼地进行。
The man, speaking to his wife, reproached an invisible enemy.
男人在对妻子说话时，责备了一个看不见的敌人。
Look how many windows, how much glass has been smashed.
看看有多少窗户、多少玻璃被打碎了。
Jesus.
耶稣。
They haven't thought about the fact that they'll have to clean this up.
他们没有想到他们必须清理这个事实。
All this chaos, just to say, the Russians did it to us.
所有这些混乱，只是说，俄罗斯人对我们做了这件事。
The man spoke desperately and with an honest sadness.
男人语气绝望，带着真诚的悲伤。
The woman nodded and sighed.
女人点点头，叹了口气。
They walked straight past me.
他们径直从我身边走过。
On the ground, pigeons pecked at bread crumbs among the shards of glass.
地上，鸽子在玻璃碎片中啄食面包屑。
Despite the damage, a woman had come to the marketplace, as she does every day, to feed the birds.
尽管遭受了破坏，一名妇女仍一如既往地来到市场喂鸟。
It was sunny and awfully quiet.
天气晴朗，而且非常安静。
The streets felt free.
街道感觉很自由。
And there was a deceptive illusion that a long walk was safe.
人们有一种欺骗性的错觉，认为长途步行是安全的。
Day 26.
第 26 天。
I went to the train station with my mother to see if we could get train tickets for ourselves and our relatives.
我和妈妈一起去火车站看看能否为自己和亲戚买到火车票。
We walked through the old city that my mother had once shown me, like a story one reads to a child.
我们走过母亲曾经带我看过的老城，就像给孩子读的故事一样。
The train station was not as crowded as we expected.
火车站并没有我们想象的那么拥挤。
All the shops had closed, and the only tickets available were for the evacuation trains.
所有商店都关门了，唯一能买到的是疏散列车的车票。
Several of these tickets were standing room only.
其中几张门票只能站着。
And because some of my relatives have health concerns that keep them from standing, we decided to look for tickets again later.
由于我的一些亲戚有健康问题，无法站立，我们决定稍后再寻找门票。
My mother and I walked back down the street and tried to cheer each other up with a few jokes.
我和妈妈沿着街道走回去，试图讲几个笑话让彼此开心起来。
Then we saw little yellow buses with red crosses, heading toward us in the direction of the train station.
然后我们看到了带有红十字的黄色小巴士，朝火车站的方向朝我们驶来。
On each bus was written, Irpin, a place north of Kyiv where so many artists and writers once lived, and where now people die every day.
每辆巴士上都写着，伊尔平，基辅北部的一个地方，曾经有很多艺术家和作家居住过，现在每天都有人死去。
Russia is annihilating the small town, block by block.
俄罗斯正在一个街区一个街区地摧毁这个小镇。
In the dusty bus windows we saw the gray, tired faces of old people and children, all staring somewhere far away into the distance.
在布满灰尘的车窗里，我们看到老人和孩子们灰色、疲惫的脸，他们都凝视着远方。
We stopped and looked.
我们停下来看了看。
I could not take a photo.
我无法拍照。
In the evening, I saw that the train tickets were being sold again.
晚上，我看到火车票又开始卖了。
Without much time to consider it, I bought six tickets for Friday.
没有太多时间考虑，我就买了六张周五的票。
My parents still don't want to leave Kyiv.
我的父母仍然不想离开基辅。
I really don't know what we should do, but there should be enough time before Friday to decide.
我真的不知道我们应该做什么，但是周五之前应该有足够的时间来做决定。
Day 29.
第 29 天。
A little girl looked at me with a friendly expression.
一个小女孩用友善的表情看着我。
She was coloring the backrest of a wooden bench with a piece of chalk.
她正在用粉笔给木凳的靠背上色。
She tried to tell me something, but she was interrupted by her grandfather, who seemed annoyed.
她试图告诉我一些事情，但她的祖父打断了她，祖父似乎很生气。
Listen here, he said to me in a somewhat brazen voice.
听着，他用有点厚颜无耻的声音对我说。
I told my daughter, let's buy the apartment in Kyiv.
我告诉我女儿，我们去基辅买一套公寓吧。
But she replied, nobody wants to live in Kyiv, with its stuffy, big-city air.
但她回答说，没有人愿意住在基辅，那里有闷热的大城市空气。
We should get a nice apartment under the green trees in Bucha, outside of Kyiv.
我们应该在基辅郊外的布查的绿树下租一套漂亮的公寓。
And being the foolish person I am, I agreed.
作为一个愚蠢的人，我同意了。
He looked at me reproachfully, as if I were the one who had persuaded him to buy an apartment in a pleasant suburb now smothered in fire, rockets, and mortar shells.
他责备地看着我，仿佛是我说服他在一个宜人的郊区买了一套公寓，而现在这个郊区却被大火、火箭弹和迫击炮弹所笼罩。
I didn't even want to talk to him at first, but he called out to me and asked to walk a few steps in his direction.
一开始我什至不想和他说话，但他喊我并要求朝他的方向走几步。
It was already evening.
已经是晚上了。
Soon the curfew would begin.
很快宵禁就要开始了。
The air raid alarm had just sounded, and I thought I only had a few minutes for a little conversation.
空袭警报刚刚拉响，我以为我只有几分钟的时间进行简短的交谈。
But then the man mentioned Bucha, and all of a sudden, I decided to spend as much time with them as they wanted.
但后来那个人提到了 Bucha，突然间，我决定花尽可能多的时间和他们在一起。
The girl, who was about six years old, told me in a serious voice, for two weeks we lived in the basement.
那个六岁左右的女孩严肃地告诉我，我们在地下室住了两周。
We were 21 adults and seven children.
我们有 21 名成人和 7 名儿童。
The grandfather still seemed angry with me.
祖父似乎还在生我的气。
I come from a city where most people speak Russian.
我来自一个大多数人说俄语的城市。
I come from Dnipro, but part of our family lives here in Bucha and in Kyiv.
我来自第聂伯罗，但我们家庭的一部分住在布恰和基辅。
Two weeks in the basement, with only water, some food, almost no heating, and barely any electricity, constant shelling, especially when we tried to sneak a little fresh air.
在地下室待了两个星期，只有水和一些食物，几乎没有暖气，几乎没有电，不断的炮击，尤其是当我们试图偷偷呼吸一点新鲜空气时。
And then they found us.
然后他们找到了我们。
The Russians came to us in the cellar and explained-- no, they barked-- that they had come to denazify us.
俄罗斯人来到地窖里向我们解释——不，他们咆哮着——他们是来剥夺我们的纳粹资格的。
If I were not 70 years old, I answered them, I would rather throw you out than talk to you.
如果我不是70岁，我回答他们，我宁愿把你赶出去，也不会跟你说话。
Don't speak to me, not even for a second.
别跟我说话，一秒钟也别。
At the end, he got so furious that he said to me, you should go there, to Bucha.
最后，他非常愤怒，对我说，你应该去那里，去Bucha。
If you were there, you wouldn't look at me like that.
如果你在场，你就不会那样看着我。
You would understand everything.
你就会明白一切。
And here in Kyiv, nothing has been made clear.
而在基辅这里，一切都还没有明确。
Today my childhood friend lost his family home.
今天，我儿时的朋友失去了他的家。
Early in life, I used to visit his house all the time.
小时候，我经常去他家拜访。
I tried to remember the rooms.
我试图记住房间。
I recall the traditional living room of a small house with a low ceiling, a resplendent cabinet with old photos behind a glass shelf, and the meals my friend's grandmother used to prepare for us.
我记得一间小房子的传统客厅，天花板很低，玻璃架子后面有一个金碧辉煌的柜子，里面摆着老照片，还有我朋友的祖母以前为我们准备的饭菜。
This memory is not accompanied by any feeling.
这段记忆不伴随任何感觉。
Day 30.
第 30 天。
My relatives want to leave Kyiv.
我的亲戚想离开基辅。
We had already planned our exit, but as the day of departure ruthlessly approached, they had more and more complaints and objections.
我们本来就计划好了离开的事情，但随着出发的日子无情地临近，他们的抱怨和反对却越来越多。
Here in Kyiv, where every day you come across friends, acquaintances, and strangers you end up helping, you manage somehow to bear the unbearable news and events.
在基辅这里，每天你都会遇到朋友、熟人和你最终帮助的陌生人，你会设法忍受难以忍受的新闻和事件。
We decided to postpone our departure for a few days and perhaps prepare a little better.
我们决定推迟几天出发，或许可以做更好的准备。
On the way back from the train station, my mother and I met two people from the military who were sitting in front of a grocery store, drinking coffee.
从火车站回来的路上，我和妈妈遇到了两个军人，他们坐在一家杂货店前喝咖啡。
They showed us a picture of a boy who was only 14 years old, posing in a uniform next to some soldiers.
他们给我们看了一张照片，照片上一个年仅 14 岁的男孩穿着制服，旁边是一些士兵。
We're going to our military positions today to fetch him, one of the soldiers explained.
“我们今天要去我们的军事阵地去接他，”一名士兵解释道。
He followed his father and wants to fight shoulder-to-shoulder with him, but he's too young.
他追随父亲，想和他并肩作战，但他太年轻了。
They have clearly lost everything, their house, their family, and now all he wants is to fight.
他们显然已经失去了一切，他们的房子，他们的家人，现在他想要的就是战斗。
We understand, of course, but cannot allow it.
我们当然理解，但不能允许。
They were obviously proud, both of this mission and this boy's determination.
他们显然对这个使命和这个男孩的决心感到自豪。
They smiled with a little bit of tenderness, and their good mood even infected us.
他们的笑容带着一丝温柔，他们的好心情甚至感染了我们。
Ivanna Sakhno, reading the diaries of Yevgenia Belorusets.
伊万娜·萨赫诺（Ivanna Sakhno）正在阅读叶夫根尼娅·贝洛鲁塞特（Yevgenia Belorusets）的日记。
She got out of Ukraine on day 41, April 4.
她于 4 月 4 日第 41 天离开乌克兰。
We first saw her diaries on the website, Isolarii.
我们第一次看到她的日记是在 Isolarii 网站上。
Yevgenia's diary is being published as part of a new book called In The Face of War.
叶夫根尼娅的日记将作为新书《面对战争》的一部分出版。
You can find links to all of that, as well as to some of Yevgenia's photography, at our website, ThisAmericanLife.org.
您可以在我们的网站 ThisAmericanLife.org 上找到所有这些内容以及叶夫根尼亚的一些摄影作品的链接。
Coming up, so your friend's a Russian soldier being sent into Ukraine.
即将到来，所以你的朋友是一名被派往乌克兰的俄罗斯士兵。
What do you say to him, exactly?
你到底对他说什么？
It's in a minute from Chicago Public Radio, when our program continues.
距离芝加哥公共广播电台一分钟后，我们的节目仍在继续。
Act Two: Munachi and The Escape Ira Glass It's This American Life.
第二幕：穆纳奇和逃亡艾拉·格拉斯 这就是美国生活。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Today's program, The Other Front Lines, stories of the many ways that people are going through the war in Ukraine.
今天的节目《其他前线》讲述了人们以多种方式经历乌克兰战争的故事。
We have arrived at Act Two of our program, Act Two, Munachi and the Escape.
我们已经到了节目的第二幕，第二幕《穆纳奇与逃亡》。
So for years before this war, Ukraine had been a destination for foreign students, kids from Nigeria, Morocco, China, Azerbaijan, Turkey, India.
因此，在这场战争之前的几年里，乌克兰一直是来自尼日利亚、摩洛哥、中国、阿塞拜疆、土耳其、印度的外国学生和孩子的目的地。
The tuition is affordable.
学费是负担得起的。
It's relatively easy to get a visa.
获得签证相对容易。
You can study in English.
你可以用英语学习。
So when the war started, 77,000 foreign students, just a ton of people, had to figure out what to do.
因此，当战争开始时，77,000 名外国学生（只是一大群人）必须弄清楚该怎么办。
Alexis Okeowo is a reporter who was based in Lagos for a few years, and over the last few weeks, they've been hearing about Nigerian students trapped in Ukraine, Black students blocked at the border, unable to escape to the rest of Europe.
亚历克西斯·奥克沃（Alexis Okeowo）是一名驻拉各斯的记者，在过去的几周里，他们一直听说尼日利亚学生被困在乌克兰，黑人学生被困在边境，无法逃往欧洲其他地方。
Alexis also knew what an education in Ukraine had meant to those students.
亚历克西斯也知道乌克兰的教育对这些学生意味着什么。
For lots of them, it was their one chance to get a degree.
对于他们中的许多人来说，这是他们获得学位的唯一机会。
Back home in Nigeria, there aren't nearly enough seats in schools for everybody who wants them.
在尼日利亚的家乡，学校里几乎没有足够的座位供每个需要的人使用。
If you do get in, your studies can be interrupted by long teacher strikes.
如果你真的被录取了，你的学习可能会因为教师的长期罢工而中断。
Alexis wanted to talk to the students about what they were going through.
亚历克西斯想和学生们谈谈他们正在经历的事情。
Over the last month, as I read about the racism international students-- especially African ones-- were facing as they tried to leave Ukraine, I felt angry, and sad, and curious.
上个月，当我读到国际学生——尤其是非洲学生——在试图离开乌克兰时所面临的种族主义时，我感到愤怒、悲伤和好奇。
Who were these kids caught in a war, and what had their lives been like in Ukraine?
这些陷入战争的孩子是谁？他们在乌克兰的生活是什么样的？
What would they be now?
他们现在会是什么样子呢？
When I went to Ukraine, it was a very beautiful place.
当我去乌克兰时，那是一个非常美丽的地方。
It was like everything is organized.
就好像一切都井井有条。
This is Munachi Nnadi.
我是穆纳奇·纳迪。
He arrived in Ukraine last summer.
他去年夏天抵达乌克兰。
Munachi is someone at ease with himself, gentle, the really big smile.
Munachi 是一个对自己很放松的人，温柔，笑容灿烂。
And he's a person who likes to plan things to be in order.
而且他是一个喜欢把事情安排得井井有条的人。
For instance, one thing he mentioned that he first noticed in Ukraine was how the cars were parked in straight lines.
例如，他提到他在乌克兰第一次注意到的一件事是汽车是如何停在直线上的。
Out of all the Nigerian students I spoke with, Munachi had the most clarity about what he wanted to do with his life and why he was in Ukraine.
在我采访过的所有尼日利亚学生中，穆纳奇最清楚自己想做什么，以及为什么来到乌克兰。
He wanted to be a doctor and then work in the United States, the UK, or Switzerland.
他想成为一名医生，然后在美国、英国或瑞士工作。
When Munachi landed in Ukraine, a Nigerian representative from his new university picked him up.
当穆纳奇抵达乌克兰时，新大学的一名尼日利亚代表接了他。
They played Bob Marley as they drove through the city.
他们开车穿过城市时扮演鲍勃·马利。
And it was so beautiful, like the different people, the color and everything, the waterfalls.
它是如此美丽，就像不同的人、颜色和一切，还有瀑布。
Ah, it was so beautiful, like new things to me.
啊，它是如此美丽，对我来说就像新事物一样。
A lot of things were new.
很多事情都是新的。
Munachi managed to get an apartment with other Nigerians in the southern city of Odessa, but he didn't know where to exchange money.
穆纳奇设法与其他尼日利亚人在南部城市敖德萨租到一套公寓，但他不知道在哪里换钱。
A friend invited him to join a group chat on Telegram called Nigerian Students Ukraine.
一位朋友邀请他加入 Telegram 上一个名为“尼日利亚学生乌克兰”的群聊。
It's a big group.
这是一个大团体。
Over 1,000 Nigerians are in it.
其中有超过 1,000 名尼日利亚人。
Reading through the messages, I was reminded they're college students, trying to learn how to be adults.
读完这些信息，我想起他们是大学生，正在努力学习如何成为成年人。
They're just kids, even though Munachi doesn't like me to call him that.
他们只是孩子，尽管穆纳奇不喜欢我这么称呼他。
Members helped each other find jobs and Nigerian restaurants.
成员们互相帮助寻找工作和尼日利亚餐馆。
Do you have dollars and you need grivna?
你有美元并且需要 grivna 吗？
DM me.
私信我。
Who's in for a shared apartment in Kharkiv?
谁想在哈尔科夫租一间合租公寓？
Abeg oo.
阿贝格哦。
If you're looking for an unserious relationship, please just DM me.
如果您正在寻找一段不严肃的关系，请直接私信我。
Single ladies only.
仅限单身女士。
Me.
我。
Job needed in Kharkiv.
哈尔科夫需要工作。
Anyone available or knows anyone to help, please?
请问有谁可以帮忙或者认识的人可以帮忙吗？
Are you interested in a modeling shoot in Kyiv?
您对在基辅拍摄模特感兴趣吗？
Please send your picture for number and age if you're interested.
如果您有兴趣，请发送您的照片以获取号码和年龄。
Munachi settled in, started learning Ukrainian.
穆纳奇安顿下来，开始学习乌克兰语。
I asked him what he did for fun.
我问他做什么好玩的。
[SIGHING] Munachi Nnadi Well, actually, to be honest, the parts I enjoy most is being in school.
[叹息] Munachi Nnadi 好吧，说实话，我最喜欢的部分是在学校。
Yeah, being in school and doing what I love.
是的，在学校做我喜欢做的事。
I love anatomy.
我喜欢解剖学。
That's my favorite.
这是我最喜欢的。
It's very interesting.
这很有趣。
Every day is getting interesting.
每一天都变得有趣起来。
You get to know human body, organs, and all the rest, and I love it.
你可以了解人体、器官和其他一切，我喜欢它。
I go to libraries.
我去图书馆。
I feel free.
我感觉很自由。
Yeah.
是的。
I feel very free to do whatever I want.
我感觉很自由，可以做任何我想做的事。
What he wanted to do was study the thing he'd always wanted to do, be a medical student.
他想做的是学习他一直想做的事情，成为一名医科学生。
Were you going to parties?
你去参加聚会吗？
Were you dating?
你们约会过吗？
Why not?
为什么不呢？
Munachi Nnadi Oh, because there's a saying medical students say, study now and love later.
Munachi Nnadi 哦，因为医学生有句话说，现在学习，以后再去爱。
[LAUGHTER] Alexis Okeowo Love later.
[笑声] 亚历克西斯·奥克沃 (Alexis Okeowo) 爱过以后。
OK.
好的。
I'm 23 now.
我现在23岁了。
Alexis Okeowo Oh, you're 23.
Alexis Okeowo 哦，你 23 岁了。
OK, OK.
好的，好的。
Six months after Munachi arrived in Ukraine in January, people in the Nigerian student chat began asking, what's up with the Russians?
穆纳奇一月份抵达乌克兰六个月后，尼日利亚学生聊天中的人们开始问，俄罗斯人怎么了？
Munachi's phone buzzed constantly with notifications.
穆纳奇的手机不断响起通知消息。
He'd sometimes wake up to hundreds of missed messages in the group.
有时他醒来时会发现群里有数百条错过的消息。
Hi, please.
嗨，请。
Any more info about the war?
还有更多有关战争的信息吗？
They're trying to resolve it diplomatically.
他们正试图通过外交手段解决这个问题。
I don't know if it's true, oh.
不知道是不是真的哦，呵呵。
Not true.
不正确。
True.
真的。
I don't believe this because if Putin is waiting for marshlands to get frozen, that means he will wait till another winter, and this one is basically over.
我不相信这一点，因为如果普京正在等待沼泽地结冰，那就意味着他将等到另一个冬天，而这个冬天基本上已经结束了。
People just be putting fear in others.
人们只是将恐惧置于他人身上。
Stay safe, though.
不过，请注意安全。
Damn.
该死。
I like your analysis, girl.
我喜欢你的分析，女孩。
Very apt.
非常贴切。
All I came here to do was study.
我来这里只是为了学习。
I feel your pain, bro-- laughing emoji, laughing emoji.
我感受到你的痛苦，兄弟——笑表情符号，笑表情符号。
Anybody got malaria drugs?
有人有治疗疟疾的药物吗？
Russians only moved their army closer.
俄罗斯人只是将他们的军队移得更近。
Shit didn't happen.
狗屎并没有发生。
Find way, move to Western part of Ukraine, and stay there.
想办法，搬到乌克兰西部，并留在那里。
The West is already bordered by Russian soldiers through Belarus.
西方已经通过白俄罗斯与俄罗斯士兵接壤。
That's the north northeast.
也就是东北方的北边。
Oh, well, bro.
哦，好吧，兄弟。
Everybody done turn geographer.
每个人都变成了地理学家。
I was telling all the students, whoa.
我告诉所有的学生，哇。
You guys don't need to panic.
大家不必惊慌。
I don't believe there will be war.
我不相信会有战争。
We don't need to spread panic.
我们不需要散布恐慌。
That's just because the school told us not to spread panic.
那只是因为学校告诉我们不要传播恐慌。
I was telling them to chill.
我告诉他们要冷静。
Let's get every information from the school.
让我们从学校获取所有信息。
But Munachi says there was almost no information from the school or from the Nigerian embassy.
但穆纳奇表示，学校或尼日利亚大使馆几乎没有提供任何信息。
Very quickly, the chat turned from looking for flatmates to trying to escape war.
很快，话题就从寻找室友变成了逃避战争。
Is it just me that heard those sounds?
只有我听到那些声音吗？
Yes, just now here in Kyiv.
是的，刚才在基辅。
Me, too.
我也是。
I'm hearing the same sounds, oh.
我听到同样的声音，哦。
Boom, boom.
繁荣，繁荣。
If you see the last one shake my window, my heart first stop.
如果你看到最后一个摇动我的窗户，我的心第一个停止跳动。
Stay safe, my brothers.
保持安全，我的兄弟们。
Guys, real missile, oh.
伙计们，真正的导弹，哦。
I'm hearing something from my hostel.
我从宿舍里听到了一些消息。
Even the ambassador of Nigeria has gone back home.
就连尼日利亚大使也回国了。
Borders no safe again, oh.
边界又不安全了哦。
Guys, please, which way now?
请问各位，现在走哪条路？
I'm scared.
我很害怕。
I'm fucking scared.
我真他妈害怕。
Find your way to Poland and leave.
找到前往波兰的路并离开。
Please, would they allow us to enter Poland?
请问他们允许我们进入波兰吗？
They accept Ukrainians, no?
他们接受乌克兰人，不是吗？
How can we get from Lviv to Kyiv?
我们如何从 利沃夫 往 基辅?
Everything is down.
一切都下降了。
Fastest way is metro, but to my knowledge, that is also down.
最快的方式是地铁，但据我所知，地铁也很慢。
Munachi was reading these messages, but he kept coming up with reasons why he couldn't leave yet.
穆纳奇正在阅读这些信息，但他不断地想出自己还不能离开的理由。
He needed to buy chicken, eggs, tomatoes, apples, juice, milk, and ice cream to fill his fridge.
他需要买鸡肉、鸡蛋、西红柿、苹果、果汁、牛奶和冰淇淋来装满他的冰箱。
Then he couldn't leave because he had a fridge full of food.
然后他无法离开，因为他的冰箱里装满了食物。
He still thought maybe the war would pass.
他仍然认为战争也许会过去。
But overall, Munachi says he didn't leave because it would mean abandoning his plan.
但总的来说，穆纳奇说他没有离开，因为这意味着放弃他的计划。
He wanted to follow the rules, look to an authority for direction.
他想遵守规则，向权威寻求指导。
Then there was an explosion at Odessa Sea Port, so Munachi took a train to Lviv.
随后敖德萨海港发生爆炸，穆纳奇乘火车前往利沃夫。
Then he went to the platform for the train to Poland, where he found other Africans waiting in the crowd.
然后他前往前往波兰的火车站台，发现其他非洲人在人群中等候。
But the conductor and a police officer were not letting Black people onto the train.
但售票员和一名警察不让黑人上车。
He watched as some of them started arguing with the officer blocking the door.
他看到他们中的一些人开始与挡在门上的警察发生争执。
Why?
为什么？
What's going on?
这是怎么回事？
Why you not letting us in?
为什么不让我们进去？
This is not good.
这不好。
This is bad.
这很糟糕。
You want us to die?
你想让我们死吗？
No?
不？
The police was like, wait, wait, wait.
警察说，等等，等等，等等。
We are still waiting, like--
我们还在等待，就像——
Some Africans forced themselves onto the train.
一些非洲人强迫自己上火车。
But Munachi was told to wait, so he waited until the conductor closed the doors and the train, with empty seats, left without him.
但穆纳奇被告知要等，所以他一直等到售票员关上车门，火车才带着空座位离开，没有他。
Yeah, [SIGHING] and there was a lot of people, so I gave up.
是的，[叹息]而且有很多人，所以我放弃了。
He got a taxi with other Africans to drive to the Polish border.
他和其他非洲人一起打车前往波兰边境。
But at a certain point, the traffic just stopped moving.
但在某个时刻，交通就停止了。
So he walked for more than an hour to the crossing and stood in line.
于是，他步行了一个多小时来到十字路口并排队。
So when I get to my town, the border guard told me to go back.
所以当我到达我的城镇时，边防人员让我回去。
And how long could you have been waiting?
你还能等多久？
I've been waiting for maybe two hours.
我已经等了大概两个小时了。
Yeah, and he told me to go back.
是的，他叫我回去。
I just go back.
我就回去吧。
Alexis Okeowo You didn't say, why?
Alexis Okeowo 你没有说，为什么？
[LAUGHS] Munachi Nnadi I didn't know what to say, just go back.
[笑] Munachi Nnadi 我不知道该说什么，就回去吧。
I was like, I don't want to feel so embarrassed, so I just go back.
我当时想，我不想感到如此尴尬，所以我就回去了。
It was so embarrassing.
太尴尬了。
So when you say that word, embarrassing, what do you mean by it?
那么，当你说“尴尬”这个词时，你的意思是什么？
For example, in the midst of crowd, others are going in, and you are restricted from going in.
比如，在人群中，别人进去了，你却被限制进去。
People will look at you.
人们会看着你。
I felt like I want to cry.
我感觉我想哭。
At that point, I feel like I wanted to cry.
那一刻，我感觉自己想哭。
I feel like, wow, this is it.
我感觉，哇，就是这样。
Wow.
哇。
I felt so bad, so I said, OK, let me go back.
我感觉很糟糕，所以我说，好吧，让我回去吧。
Let me go back.
让我回去吧。
At the back of the line, Munachi met some Africans and an Indian man, who said the border guards were going to let them die in Ukraine.
在队伍后面，穆纳奇遇到了一些非洲人和一名印度男子，他们说边防人员会让他们死在乌克兰。
The man advised Munachi to try to get someone with a car to take him across.
该男子建议穆纳奇尝试找一个有车的人送他过河。
Munachi saw there were long lines of cars passing through.
穆纳奇看到一排排汽车经过。
He began hailing them down and asking for a ride, politely, pleadingly.
他开始礼貌地、恳求地招呼他们下来并请求搭车。
He even offered to pay.
他甚至主动提出付钱。
Yep.
是的。
I was like, maybe you have a free car-- now, it's your car, I know, but you need to understand.
我当时想，也许你有一辆免费的汽车——现在，这是你的车，我知道，但你需要明白。
It just happens, you're almost there.
它就这样发生了，你就快到了。
Just drive us in or something like that.
开车送我们进去或者类似的事情。
And we just came in peace.
我们只是和平而来。
And all of them said, no?
他们所有人都说，不是吗？
Munachi Nnadi Yeah.
穆纳奇·纳迪 是的。
All of them said, no. No, no. It felt so bad, and the way they say it, it's like to hurt you.
他们都说，不。不，不。这感觉太糟糕了，用他们的话说，就像是在伤害你。
No, no, no-- everyone, the same.
不不不——每个人都一样。
No one wanted to help.
没有人愿意帮忙。
Munachi Nnadi Yeah.
穆纳奇·纳迪 是的。
Was this surprising to you that so many Ukrainians were saying, no, no, no, no?
这么多乌克兰人说“不，不，不，不”，这让您感到惊讶吗？
To me, first, I was thinking it was a very easy something for people to do in this kind of situation.
对我来说，首先，我认为人们在这种情况下做这件事是非常容易的。
My teachers are Ukrainians and they are so friendly and nice to us.
我的老师是乌克兰人，他们对我们非常友好和友善。
Yeah.
是的。
I actually thought maybe I'll find my teacher, like, oh, my god, she'll help me or something, or he will help me, something like that.
我实际上想也许我会找到我的老师，就像，哦，天哪，她会帮助我什么的，或者他会帮助我，类似的事情。
I was--
我当时——
It didn't happen?
没有发生？
Munachi Nnadi I was only wishing to see someone that I know, that would just help me.
Munachi Nnadi 我只是想见见我认识的人，那只会对我有帮助。
I have to go back, maybe find a place to stay.
我得回去了，也许找个地方住下。
Then tomorrow I might try again.
那么明天我可能会再试一次。
So I had to walk back again.
于是我只好又走回去。
An hour?
一个小时？
Munachi Nnadi Yeah, an hour, again.
Munachi Nnadi 是的，又一个小时。
It was so far.
到目前为止。
But I was so sad, so it was very easy for me because I was sad.
但我很伤心，所以这对我来说很容易，因为我很伤心。
[LAUGHS] Yeah.
[笑]是的。
I was so sad.
我很伤心。
I wasn't even looking at anybody's face.
我什至没有看任何人的脸。
I hated everyone at that moment.
那一刻我讨厌所有人。
What do I have to do?
我必须做什么？
I don't know what to do.
我不知道该怎么办。
It was already 12:00 in the night.
此时已经是深夜12:00了。
And it was so cold, so cold, like, oh, my god.
天气太冷了，太冷了，就像，哦，天哪。
Munachi says that on his walk back, he remembers that he stopped feeling like himself.
穆纳奇说，在他回来的路上，他记得自己不再感觉像自己了。
His entire world, everything he thought he knew about Ukraine, was thrown into chaos.
他的整个世界，他自以为了解的关于乌克兰的一切，都陷入了混乱。
Nothing was organized.
一切都没有组织起来。
The Ukrainians he lived among were now treating him like an alien, even an enemy, because he wasn't the right color.
与他生活在一起的乌克兰人现在把他当作外星人，甚至敌人，因为他的肤色不对。
Munachi saw himself one way, hardworking, quiet, friendly, and soon realized during the worst moments of his life that others were seeing him in a very different way.
穆纳奇以一种方式看待自己，勤奋、安静、友善，但很快他就意识到，在他生命中最糟糕的时刻，其他人以一种截然不同的方式看待他。
The people who wouldn't give him a ride, who wouldn't let him cross the border, to them, his life seemed to be worth less than theirs.
那些不让他搭车、不让他过境的人，对他们来说，他的命似乎比他们的还不值钱。
He finally reaches a hotel, but the clerk says there are no rooms.
他终于到达一家酒店，但店员说没有房间了。
But this time, Munachi did not just accept what he was told.
但这一次，穆纳奇并没有仅仅接受他所说的。
Munachi calls his cousin in the United States.
穆纳奇给他在美国的表弟打电话。
His cousin gets a friend who speaks Ukrainian to talk to the hotel clerk, and the friend is able to book a room over the phone.
他的表弟找了一位会说乌克兰语的朋友与酒店服务员交谈，这位朋友可以通过电话预订房间。
[LAUGHS] Munachi Nnadi That is a big question.
[笑] Munachi Nnadi 这是一个大问题。
Well, I gave the lady a very big smile, [LAUGHTER] and like, god, finally, oh, you see.
好吧，我给了这位女士一个非常灿烂的微笑，[笑声]，天啊，终于，哦，你看。
[LAUGHTER] Alexis Okeowo The next day, Munachi tried again.
[笑声] Alexis Okeowo 第二天，Munachi 再次尝试。
He made his way back to the border and could finally cross to Poland.
他回到边境，终于可以越境到达波兰。
Less than a week later, he moved on to Berlin.
不到一周后，他前往柏林。
I was in Berlin last month as thousands of refugees from Ukraine came through Central Station and went on to various hostels.
上个月我在柏林，当时数千名来自乌克兰的难民通过中央车站，前往各个旅馆。
The Ukrainians I talked to told me they had no plans.
与我交谈的乌克兰人告诉我他们没有计划。
They just wanted their home to be safe again, so they could return as soon as possible.
他们只是希望自己的家能够再次安全，能够尽快返回。
But the foreign students, like Munachi, are in a different situation.
但像Munachi这样的外国学生的情况就不同了。
Ukrainian citizens can get temporary residence in the European Union.
乌克兰公民可以获得欧盟的临时居留权。
Foreign students cannot, even though they're living alongside Ukrainian refugees.
外国学生不能，即使他们与乌克兰难民生活在一起。
They just fled the same war.
他们只是逃离同一场战争。
The students either have to go back to their home countries, or hope that the countries they fled to will allow them to stay and finish the educations they came for.
学生们要么必须返回自己的祖国，要么希望他们逃往的国家允许他们留下来完成他们想要的教育。
Munachi is currently in his third hostel in Germany.
穆纳奇目前住在他在德国的第三家旅馆。
He's been sharing a room with another refugee, learning another new language, and waiting to hear if the German government will let him stay in the country.
他一直与另一名难民共用一个房间，学习另一种新语言，并等待德国政府是否会让他留在该国。
He and other international students there have until August to get accepted to a German school and prove they have at least 10,000 euros to pay for a year of living costs.
他和那里的其他国际学生必须在八月份之前被德国学校录取，并证明他们有至少 10,000 欧元来支付一年的生活费用。
Otherwise, they will be required to leave.
否则，他们将被要求离开。
That's money a lot of students don't have.
这是很多学生都没有的钱。
Munachi is trying to finish up this year's classes online, but it hasn't been easy.
穆纳奇试图在网上完成今年的课程，但这并不容易。
He left his school books in Poland.
他把课本留在了波兰。
It's still surreal that he's even in this situation.
即使他处于这种情况，仍然是超现实的。
The 1,000 people in the Nigerian students' group chat are now scattered, but people are still posting, checking in on one another, and helping each other figure out their next steps.
尼日利亚学生群里的 1000 人现在已经分散，但人们仍在发帖、互相关注、互相帮助制定下一步计划。
Please, who is in Poland here?
请问，谁在波兰？
I have my dog stocked in Lviv.
我把我的狗饲养在利沃夫。
It can be sent to you, so you can help me give it to someone coming to Nigeria.
它可以发送给您，这样您就可以帮我把它送给来尼日利亚的人。
Please.
请。
I don't want them to die.
我不想让他们死。
Hello?
你好？
Has anyone gotten into Ireland between yesterday and today?
从昨天到今天有人进入爱尔兰吗？
Most countries are closing their border now.
大多数国家现在正在关闭边境。
Anybody know anyone or news from France?
有人认识法国的人或消息吗？
Are they deporting people in France?
他们正在驱逐法国人吗？
Anybody in Belgium?
有人在比利时吗？
What's the update, people?
各位，更新了什么？
Hope you all are safe.
希望你们都安全。
It's an uneasy limbo these students are in.
这些学生正处于一个令人不安的困境。
In order to finish their degrees in Europe, they're signing up for an immediate future of moving from place to place, of starting all over again and again.
为了在欧洲完成学位，他们准备在不久的将来从一个地方搬到另一个地方，一次又一次地重新开始。
Here's what Munachi is thinking about.
这就是穆纳奇的想法。
I asked myself, oh, what does it feel like to be a war student?
我问自己，哦，成为一名战争学生感觉如何？
What if I'm a doctor?
如果我是一名医生怎么办？
What will I be doing in a situation like this if my help is needed, something like that?
在这种情况下，如果需要我的帮助，类似的事情，我会怎么做？
I don't know if you understand.
不知道你是否明白。
I do understand.
我明白。
Munachi is spinning through all the identities he's both imagined for himself and experienced, medical student, doctor, and now, student during wartime.
穆纳奇正在盘旋着他为自己和经验丰富的人想象的所有身份，医学生、医生，以及现在的战时学生。
But I noticed there was one word he wasn't using.
但我注意到他没有使用一个词。
These are the feelings I don't want to have.
这些是我不想有的感觉。
[LAUGHS] Even when you say me as a refugee, I was trying to dodge it, to be honest, yes.
[笑]即使你说我是难民，我也试图回避，说实话，是的。
My friend told me, well, bro, we are now refugees, like when we came here.
我的朋友告诉我，好吧，兄弟，我们现在是难民，就像我们刚来这里时一样。
I said, no, bro, maybe you, not me.
我说，不，兄弟，也许是你，而不是我。
[LAUGHTER] Alexis Okeowo But why do you not feel like a refugee?
[笑声] Alexis Okeowo 但你为什么不觉得自己像个难民呢？
I don't want to feel like [LAUGHS] a refugee.
我不想感觉自己像个难民[笑]。
[LAUGHTER] Alexis Okeowo Right.
[笑声] 亚历克西斯·奥克沃 (Alexis Okeowo) 是的。
You don't want to.
你不想。
But what if I don't want to be a refugee and I want to stay in the country?
但是，如果我不想成为难民并且想留在该国怎么办？
Ah.
啊。
Yeah.
是的。
That's what we cannot control.
这是我们无法控制的。
These students are different than Ukrainian refugees.
这些学生与乌克兰难民不同。
They still have homes in Nigeria to which they can return, but going back would be going backwards for them.
他们在尼日利亚仍有家园可以返回，但返回对他们来说就意味着倒退。
It would be giving up on how far they've come, so they're fighting to protect their identity as students and as people worthy of respect and dignity.
这将是放弃他们已经取得的进步，因此他们正在努力保护自己作为学生和值得尊重和尊严的人的身份。
But as Black people displaced by war, even a European one, they have lost all of that.
但随着黑人因战争而流离失所，即使是欧洲战争，他们也失去了这一切。
Alexis Okeowo is a staff writer for The New Yorker, where they first wrote about foreign students in Ukraine.
亚历克西斯·奥克沃（Alexis Okeowo）是《纽约客》的特约撰稿人，他们在该报上首次撰写了有关乌克兰外国学生的文章。
Act Three: Alyona and Oleg Ira Glass Act Three, Alyona and Oleg.
第三幕：阿廖娜和奥列格 艾拉·格拉斯 第三幕，阿廖娜和奥列格。
OK, so in Russia, lots of people's relationships have become their own personal front lines.
好吧，在俄罗斯，很多人的人际关系已经成为他们自己的个人前线。
Ashley Cleek has been seeing this, talking with a bunch of young Russians who are against the war.
阿什利·克莱克（Ashley Cleek）看到了这一点，并与一群反对战争的俄罗斯年轻人交谈。
Ashley's been reporting on the war for the VICE News Reports podcast.
阿什利一直在为 VICE 新闻报道播客报道这场战争。
She used to live in Russia.
她曾经住在俄罗斯。
One of the Russians that she'd been talking to about this is Alyona, a 25-year-old protester who lives in Moscow, who's been trying to make sense out of one of her oldest friendships.
与她谈论此事的俄罗斯人之一是阿廖娜 (Alyona)，她是一位住在莫斯科的 25 岁抗议者，她一直试图从她最古老的友谊之一中理清思路。
Because it's so sensitive to speak about the war in Russia right now, we have changed some of the names in this story.
因为现在谈论俄罗斯战争非常敏感，所以我们更改了这个故事中的一些名字。
Here's Ashley.
这是阿什利。
The friendship Alyona's been struggling with, it's with her friend, Oleg.
阿廖娜一直在与她的朋友奥列格的友谊作斗争。
When I ask her why she's friends with him, she doesn't understand the question.
当我问她为什么和他成为朋友时，她不明白这个问题。
It's just one of the fundamental facts of her life.
这只是她生活的基本事实之一。
She and Oleg are friends because they've always been friends.
她和奥列格是朋友，因为他们一直都是朋友。
They met when they were seven or eight, in the tiny village hours east of Moscow.
他们七八岁时在莫斯科以东的一个小村庄里相识。
It's where Alyona would spend summers with her grandmother.
这是阿廖娜和祖母一起度过夏天的地方。
They were outside friends, roaming around in a little pack together.
他们是外面的朋友，一群人一起四处游荡。
So we would steal apples from the neighbors, went out to beat the grass with sticks, rode our bikes a lot, I don't know, tease the goat, stuff like that.
所以我们会从邻居那里偷苹果，出去用棍子打草，经常骑自行车，我不知道，逗山羊，诸如此类。
So could you explain beating the grass with sticks?
那么你能解释一下用棍子敲打草地吗？
I don't totally understand.
我完全不明白。
Well, when the grass grows really tall in the field, we would just go out into the field and hit the grass with our sticks.
好吧，当田野里的草长得很高时，我们就会走到田野里，用棍子敲打草。
I'm sure that somewhere out in the farms where you are, children do the exact same thing.
我确信在你所在的农场的某个地方，孩子们也会做同样的事情。
As they grew up and spread out across the country, Alyona to college, Oleg to the military academy, they stayed really close.
随着他们长大并遍布全国，阿廖娜上大学，奥列格上军事学院，他们一直保持着非常亲密的关系。
Alyona always liked how simple and positive Oleg's outlook was.
阿廖娜一直喜欢奥列格的简单和积极的观点。
Nothing seemed to bother him.
似乎没有什么能让他烦恼。
Whenever Alyona was stressed or angry about something, talking to Oleg would always make it feel like less of a big deal.
每当阿廖娜因某件事感到压力或生气时，与奥列格交谈总是会让她觉得这没什么大不了的。
When they were teenagers, Russia annexed Crimea.
当他们十几岁的时候，俄罗斯吞并了克里米亚。
This was 2014.
那是2014年。
Alyona says she and Oleg and everyone they knew are watching a lot of TV, and she remembers this feeling of euphoria that Russia was doing the right thing, defending ethnic Russians in Crimea.
阿廖娜说，她和奥列格以及他们认识的每个人都看了很多电视，她记得那种欣喜若狂的感觉，因为俄罗斯正在做正确的事情，保卫克里米亚的俄罗斯族人。
And it had an effect on both of them.
这对他们俩都有影响。
Alyona thought about becoming a doctor in the military, and she thinks this is one reason Oleg joined the army.
阿廖娜想过成为一名军队医生，她认为这是奥列格参军的原因之一。
But then in 2019, Alyona went on a trip to Crimea, and it totally changed her mind about what had happened.
但到了 2019 年，阿廖娜去克里米亚旅行，这完全改变了她对所发生事情的看法。
She was hitchhiking with a friend, talking to a lot of Crimeans, and the story they told was completely different from what she knew.
她和一个朋友搭便车，和很多克里米亚人交谈，他们讲述的故事与她所知道的完全不同。
The annexation had been awful.
吞并是可怕的。
There was this one woman that we hitched a ride with, who took us all the way to Feodosia.
与我们搭便车的是一位女士，她带我们一路前往费奥多西亚。
Alyona's friend asked her about some graffiti he'd seen in Russia back in 2014 that said, Crimea is ours.
阿廖娜的朋友向她询问他 2014 年在俄罗斯看到的一些涂鸦，上面写着“克里米亚是我们的”。
And she started literally yelling [LAUGHS] at us, being like, what do you mean, Crimea is yours, when it's ours?
她开始对我们大喊[笑]，就像，你是什么意思，克里米亚是你的，而它是我们的？
It belongs to the people who actually live there.
它属于实际居住在那里的人们。
And that made a really big impression on me.
这给我留下了非常深刻的印象。
I came away with the sense that I had made a huge mistake and that I had been thinking really wrongly for a really long time.
离开时我感觉自己犯了一个巨大的错误，并且很长一段时间以来我的想法都是错误的。
This was the first big crack in what Alyona had believed.
这是阿廖娜所相信的第一个重大裂痕。
When she came back from Crimea, she started going to protests against the government.
当她从克里米亚回来后，她开始参加反对政府的抗议活动。
And hearing about how Putin came to power, about the crimes his government had committed, her entire worldview changed, and she wanted to tell everyone.
听到普京如何上台，听到他的政府犯下的罪行，她的整个世界观都改变了，她想告诉所有人。
I was living with the conviction that I had just been living with my eyes closed before that.
我坚信在那之前我一直是闭着眼睛生活的。
And now that I had my eyes open, I wanted everyone else in the world to open their eyes, too.
既然我睁开了眼睛，我希望世界上的其他人也能睁开眼睛。
Including Oleg, and he listened.
包括奥列格，他听着。
He didn't agree with her, but he was nice about it.
他不同意她的观点，但他对此表示友善。
Well, Oleg just said, that's fine.
好吧，奥列格只是说，没关系。
That's your choice.
那是你的选择。
Oleg's choice was different.
奥列格的选择不同。
He believed the propaganda, what he saw on TV.
他相信宣传，相信他在电视上看到的。
So he stuck with what the government said.
所以他坚持政府所说的。
By the way, I reached out to Oleg for this story and didn't hear back.
顺便说一句，我联系奥列格了解这个故事，但没有收到回复。
But he knows through Alyona that we're telling it, and he told her he's OK with it.
但他通过阿廖娜知道我们正在告诉她，他告诉她他对此表示同意。
Alyona would talk about her changing politics, and Oleg would disagree, but it never felt like a big deal until this year.
阿廖娜会谈论她不断变化的政治，奥列格会不同意，但直到今年才觉得这是什么大事。
In January, Oleg was on leave from the military, and he came through Moscow.
一月份，奥列格从军队休假，他从莫斯科来到这里。
And he had a few hours before his flight.
距离起飞还有几个小时。
And we went down to the airline office to get his ticket, and then we hung out at my house, drinking tea and talking.
我们去航空公司办公室买了他的机票，然后我们在我家闲逛，喝茶聊天。
And that was when he told me that there was going to be a war in Ukraine.
就在那时他告诉我乌克兰将要爆发战争。
And I was like, Oleg, please.
我当时想，奥列格，拜托。
There's not going to be a war.
不会有战争。
And I started telling him the stuff from the Steven Pinker book, that global violence is going down, that globally there is less and less crime, there's less murder, less war.
我开始告诉他史蒂文·平克（Steven Pinker）书中的内容，全球暴力正在减少，全球犯罪越来越少，谋杀越来越少，战争也越来越少。
That's what all the political scientists say.
所有政治学家都是这么说的。
And he's just like, well, I hope you're right.
他只是说，好吧，我希望你是对的。
And that night we said goodbye to each other, and after that, it all began.
那天晚上我们互相道别，之后一切就开始了。
February 24, Russia invades Ukraine.
2月24日，俄罗斯入侵乌克兰。
Alyona calls Oleg, and Oleg says, yes, soldiers are being sent, but he's not on the list.
阿廖娜打电话给奥列格，奥列格说，是的，正在派遣士兵，但他不在名单上。
Alyona immediately joins the protest in Moscow.
阿廖娜立即加入莫斯科的抗议活动。
Alyona is categorically against this war.
阿廖娜坚决反对这场战争。
She decides to get the now-famous phrase, Russian warship, go fuck yourself, tattooed across her ribs.
她决定将现在著名的短语“俄罗斯军舰，操你自己”纹在她的肋骨上。
It's her first tattoo.
这是她的第一个纹身。
And then in the middle of March, Oleg messages their group chat.
然后在三月中旬，奥列格向他们的群聊发送了消息。
Alyona pulls it up to read it to me.
阿廖娜把它拿出来读给我听。
And he said, well, looks like I'm actually leaving.
他说，好吧，看来我真的要走了。
And I'm only going to have a dumb phone with me when I get there, so I'm not going to be able to send you anything over telegram.
当我到达那里时，我只会随身携带一部哑电话，所以我无法通过电报向您发送任何信息。
I love you all.
我爱你们。
Goodbye.
再见。
And our friend was like, where exactly are they sending you?
我们的朋友问，他们到底要把你送到哪里？
And he said, they're sending me to the hot zone.
他说，他们要把我送到危险区。
Alyona writes back, we all love you, then calls him.
阿廖娜回信说，我们都爱你，然后给他打电话。
She wants to know exactly where he's going and what he'll be doing.
她想确切地知道他要去哪里以及他要做什么。
And then he told me that he was probably going to go to Rostov or maybe even somewhere closer, just to pick up the bodies of the dead, the casualties.
然后他告诉我他可能要去罗斯托夫或者更近的地方，只是为了收拾死者和伤员的尸体。
[SPEAKING RUSSIAN] Bela Shayevich I was like, promise me that you're not going to go fight in this war.
[说俄语] Bela Shayevich 我当时想，答应我你不会去参加这场战争。
For me, him going to get the bodies was OK, as long as he didn't go fight.
对我来说，只要他不去打架，他去拿尸体就可以了。
And he said, I can't promise you that.
他说，我不能向你保证这一点。
Well, I just completely freaked out.
好吧，我完全吓坏了。
I was just yelling at him.
我只是对他大喊大叫。
I don't even remember what I was yelling, and I was just screaming into my phone, and he was completely silent.
我什至不记得我在喊什么，我只是对着手机尖叫，而他却完全沉默了。
Alyona tries to convince him not to go, that since it's not an officially declared war, he can defect without getting in trouble.
阿廖娜试图说服他不要去，因为这不是一场正式宣战的战争，他可以叛逃而不会遇到麻烦。
She's looking for a way out for him, but he doesn't want one.
她正在为他寻找出路，但他不想要。
She remembers yelling that she was going to come to his army base and break all his fingers.
她记得她大喊大叫，说她要去他的军事基地，打断他所有的手指。
By the end of the call, she's calmed down, accepted that this is what's happening.
通话结束时，她平静下来，接受了正在发生的事情。
She can't change it.
她无法改变它。
But that evening, as the reality of what's happening settles in, that there's no way Oleg can go to war and not harm someone, Alyona swings back into a state of impotence and rage.
但那天晚上，随着现实发生的事情的发生，奥列格不可能在不伤害别人的情况下发动战争，阿廖娜又陷入了无能为力和愤怒的状态。
I got so wasted that night at a bar that I was probably screaming loud enough for everybody in the bar to hear me that my friend was going to go fight in this war, and it would be better if he just died in it.
那天晚上我在一家酒吧喝得烂醉如泥，我可能大声尖叫，让酒吧里的每个人都能听到我的声音，我的朋友要去参加这场战争，如果他死在这场战争中会更好。
Because if he doesn't die, he'll come back, and I'll know that he's a murderer.
因为如果他不死，他就会回来，我就会知道他是杀人犯。
[SPEAKING RUSSIAN] Bela Shayevich That he's a criminal.
[俄语] Bela Shayevich 他是个罪犯。
Alyona's not sure if she ever wants to talk to him again.
阿廖娜不确定自己是否还想再和他说话。
So many people I've talked to in Russia are going through something like this right now, having their fundamental relationships get ripped up by this war.
我在俄罗斯采访过的很多人现在都在经历类似的事情，他们的基本关系被这场战争撕裂了。
Several of my friends no longer talk to their parents.
我的几个朋友不再和他们的父母说话。
One of my friends, whose response to this war was to threaten to burn his passport, his father called him a Nazi.
我的一个朋友对这场战争的反应是威胁要烧毁他的护照，他的父亲称他为纳粹。
And he doesn't know how he'll get over that.
他不知道如何克服这个困难。
I was coming home from work, and I was going up the escalator in the subway.
我下班回家，正乘地铁自动扶梯上楼。
And I got a phone call, and I didn't even suspect who it was.
我接到一个电话，我什至没有怀疑是谁打来的。
And I was already kind of pissed off because I actually hate it when people call me.
我已经有点生气了，因为我真的很讨厌人们打电话给我。
And then when I took out my phone and I saw that it was Oleg, I mean, I don't even have the words to describe what I felt.
然后当我拿出手机，看到那是奥列格时，我的意思是，我什至无法用言语来形容我的感受。
This was two weeks after he'd left, and Alyona's relieved just to hear his voice again.
这是他离开两周后的事，阿廖娜再次听到他的声音就松了口气。
All that anger that she'd felt so intensely towards him, in that moment, disappeared.
那一刻，她对他的所有愤怒都消失了。
I got up to the top of the escalator and I was just pacing around in the subway station, asking him totally banal questions, like, what are you eating, what are you drinking, how is the weather, just completely silly things.
我爬到自动扶梯的顶部，在地铁站里踱来踱去，问他一些完全平庸的问题，比如，你在吃什么，你在喝什么，天气怎么样，这些都是完全愚蠢的事情。
How did he answer?
他怎么回答呢？
What did he tell you?
他告诉你什么了？
When I asked him how he was sleeping, he told me he wasn't sleeping well.
当我问他睡得怎么样时，他告诉我他睡得不好。
And I started telling him stuff like, oh, man, sleep is so important for your mental health, and you have to try to sleep well.
我开始告诉他，哦，伙计，睡眠对你的心理健康非常重要，你必须努力睡个好觉。
And he just laughed at me and he was like, can you imagine how hard it is to sleep in Ukraine right now?
他只是嘲笑我，然后说，你能想象现在在乌克兰睡觉有多难吗？
After that call, they keep texting.
打完电话后，他们继续发短信。
Eventually, his unit is moved from somewhere around Kyiv to Belarus.
最终，他的部队从基辅附近的某个地方转移到了白俄罗斯。
And there, he's more free to talk.
在那里，他可以更自由地说话。
They video-chat every few days.
他们每隔几天就视频聊天一次。
During one call, Oleg shares these details about the war and a crime he's heard a Russian soldier has committed.
在一次通话中，奥列格分享了有关战争的详细信息以及他听说一名俄罗斯士兵犯下的罪行。
Suddenly, their calls cut off.
突然，他们的电话断了。
After that, they decide they shouldn't talk about the war because they're probably being monitored.
之后，他们决定不应该谈论战争，因为他们可能受到监视。
So they stick to basic stuff, food, weather.
所以他们坚持基本的东西、食物、天气。
Talking to Alyona these past weeks has been like watching a pendulum swing back and forth.
过去几周与阿廖娜的谈话就像看着钟摆来回摆动。
She started off with such intense feelings of fury and helplessness.
她一开始就感到强烈的愤怒和无助。
She once cried on a call.
有一次，她在电话中哭了。
But now she's swinging less.
但现在她的摇摆次数减少了。
All the feelings are still there.
所有的感觉都还在。
They're just smaller.
它们只是更小。
On her way to work, she does these small protests.
在上班的路上，她做了这些小小的抗议。
She ties green ribbons in tree branches.
她把绿丝带系在树枝上。
She writes, No War, in black Sharpie at her benches.
她在长凳上用黑色记号笔写下了《不要战争》。
And she still chats with her friend, a Russian soldier.
她仍然和她的朋友，一位俄罗斯士兵聊天。
And then the news from Bucha comes out.
然后布查的消息就传出来了。
Hundreds of civilians have been killed.
数百名平民被杀。
The photos, as many of you know, are awful.
正如你们很多人所知，这些照片非常糟糕。
There are dead bodies in the streets, in gardens, fallen from bicycles.
街道上、花园里都有尸体，还有从自行车上掉下来的尸体。
For Alyona, there was one picture in particular that made her whole body turn cold.
对于阿廖娜来说，尤其有一张照片让她浑身发冷。
It was of a woman's hand, lifeless.
这是一只女人的手，毫无生气。
Alyona remembered the perfect manicure, one nail painted with a tiny heart.
阿廖娜记得那次完美的美甲，一个指甲上画着一颗小小的心形。
[SPEAKING RUSSIAN] Bela Shayevich What was going through their heads, that they could have done that?
[俄语] 贝拉·沙耶维奇 (Bela Shayevich) 他们脑子里在想什么，竟然能这么做？
[SPEAKING RUSSIAN] Bela Shayevich It's unbearable to even think about how you're the same species as people who are capable of doing something like that.
[俄语] Bela Shayevich 一想到你和有能力做这样事情的人是同一物种，就让人难以忍受。
And when you saw it, when you heard about it, did you think about Oleg?
当你看到它、听到它时，你会想到奥列格吗？
It's just really hard to put into words.
这真的很难用语言表达。
[SPEAKING RUSSIAN] Ashley Cleek After Bucha, Alyona says, it was harder to talk to Oleg.
[俄语] 阿什利·克里克 (Ashley Cleek) 阿廖娜说，在布查之后，与奥列格交谈变得更加困难。
She asked him if he was part of anything like that.
她问他是否参与了类似的活动。
He said, no. But then, he denied it was even happening.
他说，不。但随后，他否认了这件事的发生。
He tried to convince her that it was all a lie.
他试图让她相信这一切都是谎言。
When I asked Oleg about Bucha, he immediately was telling me that this was a false flag, that the Ukrainian army had done it themselves, just kept saying and is still saying that Bucha was faked and that nothing like that happened where he was, either.
当我向奥列格询问布查的情况时，他立即告诉我，这是一面假旗，是乌克兰军队自己干的，只是一直说并且仍在说布查是假的，而且他所在的地方也没有发生过类似的事情。
And this, it infuriated Alyona.
而这一点，却激怒了阿廖娜。
He had recently told her how he had heard of a soldier committing crimes against civilians, and now here he was, parroting the government's propaganda.
他最近告诉她，他听说一名士兵对平民犯下罪行，而现在他却在这里重复政府的宣传。
That thing she used to love about him, his refusal to be bothered by anything, it now made her sick.
她曾经喜欢他的这一点，他拒绝被任何事情打扰，现在却让她感到恶心。
As Alyona tells me about this conversation, though, I could hear her softening, giving him the benefit of the doubt, the benefit of friendship.
然而，当阿廖娜向我讲述这次谈话时，我能听到她的态度软化了，让他从怀疑中受益，从友谊中受益。
Part of her would really like to imagine that maybe Oleg doesn't even believe what he's saying to her, but that he has to say it.
她的一部分真的很想想象也许奥列格甚至不相信他对她说的话，但他必须说出来。
[SPEAKING RUSSIAN] Bela Shayevich It's very possible that he's just telling me what they tell him to tell people.
[说俄语] Bela Shayevich 他很可能只是告诉我他们告诉他要告诉人们的事情。
Their friendship used to be so easy.
他们的友谊曾经是那么的简单。
Now it has the weight of a war attached to it.
现在它有了战争的分量。
I don't know if it survives this.
我不知道它是否能幸存下来。
It seems like, despite all of Alyona's efforts, there's been an irreversible change.
尽管阿廖娜付出了一切努力，但似乎已经发生了不可逆转的变化。
But Alyona is pushing back against it.
但阿廖娜对此表示反对。
She's holding onto this imaginary future where Oleg will come back a different person, that he'll grow to see things more her way, less like that of a dutiful, party-line soldier, maybe go to therapy.
她坚信着这样一个想象中的未来：奥列格回来后会变成一个不同的人，他会越来越以她的方式看待事物，而不是像一个尽职尽责、遵循党派路线的士兵，也许会去接受治疗。
And that's what I'm invested in, and that's why I'm continuing my relationship with him.
这就是我所投入的，也是我继续与他保持关系的原因。
And what if he doesn't become that kind of person?
如果他没有成为那样的人怎么办？
Well, I am not going to give up, or let me put it like this.
好吧，我不会放弃，或者让我这样说吧。
If I start thinking about how the war is not going to end, how Russia's not going to retreat from Ukraine, how people are never going to face up to what they've done and acknowledge their mistakes, I'm not going to be able to function.
如果我开始思考战争如何不会结束，俄罗斯如何不会从乌克兰撤退，人们如何永远不会正视他们所做的事情并承认他们的错误，我将无法正常工作。
And so I can't think that way.
所以我不能那样想。
Alyona just got news that Oleg's been sent back into Ukraine.
阿廖娜刚刚得到消息称奥列格已被送回乌克兰。
When he returns from the war, though, she's determined to stay his friend.
然而，当他从战争中归来时，她决心继续做他的朋友。
And then she hopes someday, maybe in 20 or 30 years, they'll finally be able to talk about what really happened in the war.
然后她希望有一天，也许在 20 或 30 年后，他们最终能够谈论战争中到底发生了什么。
Ashley Cleek.
阿什利·克里克。
She's a producer for VICE News Reports, which is a weekly podcast by VICE Audio, with lots of reporting on the war in Ukraine that dives deeply into people's personal stories.
她是 VICE News Reports 的制作人，这是 VICE Audio 的每周播客，其中有大量关于乌克兰战争的报道，深入探讨人们的个人故事。
[MUSIC - "WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE" BY SOLANGE]
[音乐 - SOLANGE 的《我们从这里去哪里》]
Credits Ira Glass Well, our program was produced today by our executive editor, Emanuele Berry, and by Diane Wu.
感谢 Ira Glass 嗯，我们的节目今天由我们的执行编辑 Emanuele Berry 和 Diane Wu 制作。
People who put together today's show include Chris Benderev, Ben Calhoun, Zoe Chace, Sean Cole, Michael Comite, Andrea López Cruzado, Aviva DeKornfeld, Chana Joffe-Walt, Rudy Lee, Seth Lind, Tobin Low, Michelle Navarro, Stowe Nelson, Katherine Rae Mondo, Marisa Robertson-Textor, Alix Spiegel, Robyn Semien, Laura Starcheski, Lilly Sullivan, Christopher Swetala, and Matt Tierney.
今天节目的制作人包括 Chris Benderev、Ben Calhoun、Zoe Chace、Sean Cole、Michael Comite、Andrea López Cruzado、Aviva DeKornfeld、Chana Joffe-Walt、Rudy Lee、Seth Lind、Tobin Low、Michelle Navarro、Stowe Nelson、Katherine Rae Mondo、Marisa Robertson-Textor、Alix Spiegel、Robyn Semien、Laura斯塔切斯基、莉莉·沙利文、克里斯托弗·斯韦塔拉和马特·蒂尔尼。
Our managing editor is Sarah Abdurrahman.
我们的总编辑是萨拉·阿卜杜拉赫曼 (Sarah Abdurrahman)。
Our senior editor is David Kestenbaum.
我们的高级编辑是大卫·凯斯滕鲍姆。
Russian interpretation by Bela Shayevich.
贝拉·沙耶维奇 (Bela Shayevich) 的俄语翻译。
Editing help from Bethel Habte.
来自 Bethel Habte 的编辑帮助。
Special thanks today to Sam Greenspan, Sam Eagan, and Kate Osbourne at the VICE News Reports podcast, where you can hear more of Katia's audio diaries from Kyiv that we heard at the beginning of the show.
今天特别感谢 VICE 新闻报道播客中的萨姆·格林斯潘、萨姆·伊根和凯特·奥斯本，您可以在其中听到更多我们在节目开始时听到的来自基辅的卡蒂亚的音频日记。
Katia's dad, Volodymyr, as she talked about in the excerpts we played, died last Monday.
卡蒂亚的父亲弗拉基米尔（Volodymyr），正如她在我们演奏的片段中谈到的那样，于上周一去世。
Thanks also today to Ibe Elvis Chigaemezu, Egwim Chioma Benjamin, Luisa Emmi Beck, Kevin Caners, Katharina Eggmann, Dana Ballout, Helen Davidson, Anthony Kuhn, and Angela Mosher-Salazar.
今天还要感谢 Ibe Elvis Chigaemezu、Egwim Chioma Benjamin、Luisa Emmi Beck、Kevin Caners、Katharina Eggmann、Dana Ballout、Helen Davidson、Anthony Kuhn 和 Angela Mosher-Salazar。
Our website, ThisAmericanLife.org, where you can stream our archive of over 750 episodes for absolutely free.
我们的网站 ThisAmericanLife.org，您可以在其中完全免费地观看我们的 750 多集档案。
Also, there's videos.
另外，还有视频。
There's lists of favorite programs.
有最喜欢的节目列表。
There's tons of other stuff there.
那里还有很多其他东西。
Again, ThisAmericanLife.org.
再次，ThisAmericanLife.org。
This American Life is delivered to public radio stations by PRX, the Public Radio Exchange.
《美国生活》由公共广播电台 PRX 向公共广播电台播出。
Thanks as always to our program's co-founder, Mr. Torey Malatia.
一如既往地感谢我们计划的联合创始人 Torey Malatia 先生。
Most nights, he just sits in his easy chair, sipping a White Claw, watching his favorite, Ali Wong.
大多数晚上，他只是坐在安乐椅上，喝着 White Claw，看着他最喜欢的黄阿丽。
Now and then, he talks to the television.
他时不时地对着电视讲话。
Damn.
该死。
I like your analysis, girl.
我喜欢你的分析，女孩。
Very apt.
非常贴切。
I'm Ira Glass, back next week with more stories of This American Life.
我是艾拉·格拉斯，下周回来，带来更多《美国生活》的故事。
[MUSIC - "WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE" BY SOLANGE]
[音乐 - SOLANGE 的《我们从这里去哪里》]
This American Life is produced in collaboration with WBEZ Chicago and delivered to stations by PRX The Public Radio Exchange.
《This American Life》与 WBEZ Chicago 合作制作，并由 PRX 公共广播电台传送到各电台。