71: Defying Sickness - This American Life
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00:00 00:00 Transcript Share This American Life Life Partners How to Listen Episodes Recommended About Overview Staff Announcements Fellowships Jobs Music Make Radio On The Road FAQ Submissions Merch Contact Us Our Other Shows Merch Follow Us Life Partners Subscribe to our newsletter Full episode Toggle Audio and Transcript Sync Transcript | Episode #71 | August 1, 1997 71: Defying Sickness Note: This American Life is produced for the ear and designed to be heard.
00:00 00:00 文字记录 分享此 美国生活 生活伙伴 如何收听 剧集 推荐 关于 概述 员工公告 奖学金 工作 音乐 在路上制作电台 常见问题解答 提交 商品 联系我们 我们的其他节目 商品 关注我们 生活伙伴 订阅我们的时事通讯 整集 切换音频和文字记录同步 文字记录 | 内容第 71 集 | 1997 年 8 月 1 日 71：战胜疾病 注：《美国生活》是为耳朵而制作的，旨在让人们听到。
If you are able, we strongly encourage you to listen to the audio, which includes emotion and emphasis that's not on the page.
如果可以的话，我们强烈建议您收听音频，其中包括页面上没有的情感和重点。
Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors.
文字记录是使用语音识别软件和人工转录员结合生成的，可能包含错误。
Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print.
请在印刷版引用前检查相应的音频。
Prologue Ira Glass There's the part of you that's healthy, and there's the part of you that's sick.
序言 Ira Glass 你有健康的部分，也有生病的部分。
And sometimes the healthy part doesn't want to admit there's a sick part.
有时健康的部分不想承认有生病的部分。
Well, back in 1945, Walt Strommer was wounded in the Battle of the Bulge.
1945 年，沃尔特·斯特罗默 (Walt Strommer) 在突出部战役中受伤。
He was permanently blinded, sent home.
他永久失明，被送回家。
For the next year or so, when I was back home going to college, I would dream that I was driving a car.
接下来的一年左右，当我回家上大学时，我会梦见自己正在开车。
And then in the dream I would think, "You shouldn't be doing this.
然后在梦中我会想：“你不应该这样做。
You're blind."
你是瞎子。”
In fact, he realized, in his dream, he was always able to see.
事实上，他意识到，在梦中，他总是能够看见。
And even to this day, over 50 years later, he still has these dreams from time to time.
直到50多年后的今天，他仍然时不时地有这样的梦想。
Sometimes I will dream of myself as I was as a teenager.
有时我会梦见自己十几岁时的样子。
And those dreams are almost completely as I would have been then, seeing.
这些梦几乎完全像我当时所看到的那样。
Or occasionally, I will still, in dreams, see a page of a book and read it, and absolutely clearly, and I may even remember a sentence or two when I wake up.
或者偶尔，我还会在梦中看到一页书，读起来，而且清清楚楚，醒来时甚至可能记得一两句话。
Mr. Strommer says it took 10 or 15 years of blindness before he showed up in his own dreams as a blind person.
斯特罗默先生说，他失明了 10 到 15 年之后才以盲人的身份出现在自己的梦中。
And at some point, he started to wonder, "Why the delay?" He wrote a letter to a publication called Paraplegia News asking if anybody else had the same experience.
在某个时候，他开始想，“为什么要拖延？”他给一家名为“截瘫新闻”的出版物写了一封信，询问其他人是否有同样的经历。
He got a handful of letters from people who had.
他收到了一些有此经历的人的来信。
Some of them started seeing themselves as in wheelchairs or paralyzed-- whatever-- within a few months.
几个月内，他们中的一些人开始认为自己坐在轮椅上或瘫痪了——无论如何。
Others it was years before it was incorporated.
其他人则在几年前才成立。
And I think almost all of them say it's inconsistent.
我认为几乎所有人都说这是不一致的。
Sometimes they will see themselves as in a wheelchair, the next time not.
有时他们会认为自己坐在轮椅上，但下一次就不会了。
I think one of the more amusing ones was the man who said he would go along in his wheelchair and he gets to a curb that the chair won't get up on.
我认为更有趣的事情之一是那个男人说他会坐在轮椅上，然后他走到了椅子无法站起来的路边。
So he gets out of the chair, lifts it up on the curb, and then he gets back in and goes on his way.
于是他从椅子上站起来，把它举到路边，然后又坐回去继续上路。
Or one woman wrote about she will dream that she's walking with her husband, and he's pushing her wheelchair.
或者一位女士写道，她会梦见她和丈夫一起散步，而他推着她的轮椅。
And then he sees somebody coming.
然后他看到有人过来了。
He says, "Quick, get back in your wheelchair.
他说：“快点，回到轮椅上。
People are coming."
人们来了。”
Here's a letter that you were sent.
这是寄给您的一封信。
An older man writes, "I've been in a wheelchair since October 6, 1966.
一位老人写道：“从 1966 年 10 月 6 日起我就一直坐在轮椅上。
And during the dream state, I've never visualized myself in a wheelchair.
在梦境中，我从未想象过自己坐在轮椅上。
I've been impotent since 1962, but in dreams, I see myself as a stud that can go out with any of the cute, young things."
我从 1962 年起就阳痿了，但在梦里，我把自己看作是一个可以和任何可爱、年轻的东西交往的种马。”
Yes.
是的。
That comes through in a couple of the letters.
这在几封信中得到了体现。
And as I recall, one of the people wrote-- I guess I had raised the question, why doesn't the dreaming brain catch up and show you the reality?
我记得，其中一个人写道——我想我已经提出了这个问题，为什么做梦的大脑没有跟上并向你展示现实？
And she said, "Why should it?
她说：“为什么要这么做呢？
Why should it be in a hurry to show us the unpleasant side of life?
为什么要急于向我们展示生活中不愉快的一面呢？
Maybe part of the function of dreams is to give us a few minutes of respite and happiness so we can come out of it and say, 'Hey, that felt pretty good.'"
也许梦的部分功能是给我们几分钟的休息和快乐，这样我们就可以从梦中走出来并说，‘嘿，那感觉真好。’”
One man, a wheelchair user, wrote, "This is better than just a harmless fantasy.
一位坐轮椅的男子写道：“这比无害的幻想要好。
It means I can re-experience walking and running temporarily.
这意味着我可以暂时重新体验步行和跑步。
I wake up mentally refreshed, at ease." Mr. Strommer was a college professor, and he spent some time researching why our subconscious minds would take so long to absorb the new facts about our lives, why his brain took a decade to admit to itself in dreams that he was blind.
我醒来时精神焕发、轻松自在。”斯特罗默先生是一位大学教授，他花了一些时间研究为什么我们的潜意识需要这么长时间才能吸收有关我们生活的新事实，为什么他的大脑花了十年的时间才在梦中承认自己是盲人。
He says nobody really knows why.
他说没有人真正知道为什么。
It might be chemical, or it might simply be that it's common for us all to see ourselves one way when in reality we're not that way at all.
这可能是化学因素，也可能只是我们所有人都以一种方式看待自己，而实际上我们根本不是那样的。
Well, from WBEZ Chicago and Public Radio International, it is This American Life.
嗯，来自 WBEZ 芝加哥和国际公共广播电台，这是《美国生活》。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Today on our program, Defying Sickness.
今天我们的节目《战胜疾病》。
Act One, Road Trip.
第一幕，公路旅行。
A father and a son go on a long car ride to figure out what parts of the father's brain have not been lost yet to Alzheimer's disease and to try to jump-start his memories.
一对父亲和一个儿子长途驾车，想弄清楚父亲大脑的哪些部分尚未因阿尔茨海默病而丧失，并试图启动他的记忆。
Act Two, My World Record, a hemophiliac's adventures at motocross racing and at setting another world's record.
第二幕，我的世界纪录，一个血友病患者在越野摩托车比赛中的冒险经历，并创造了另一个世界纪录。
Act Three-- well, just stay tuned for Act Three.
第三幕——好吧，请继续关注第三幕。
We'll launch Act One after some music.
听完音乐后我们将开始第一幕。
Act One, Road Trip.
第一幕，公路旅行。
Joel Meyerowitz is a photographer, grew up in New York City.
Joel Meyerowitz 是一位摄影师，在纽约长大。
But for the last two decades, his parents have lived in Florida.
但在过去的二十年里，他的父母一直住在佛罗里达州。
Joel would see them, visit for a few days at a time.
乔尔会去看他们，一次拜访他们几天。
But over the past 10 years, Joel's father, Hy, developed Alzheimer's.
但在过去的 10 年里，乔尔的父亲海 (Hy) 患上了阿尔茨海默氏症。
Before he retired, Hy was a salesman for 40 years and did a few years as a comic in a vaudeville act before that.
退休前，Hy 做了 40 年的推销员，此前还曾在歌舞杂耍表演中担任过几年喜剧演员。
He was a boxer, won his weight class in the very first Golden Gloves competition.
他是一名拳击手，在第一届金手套比赛中赢得了他的重量级冠军。
But now that he had Alzheimer's, the doctor said that he should stay inside, avoid a lot of stimulation.
但现在他得了老年痴呆症，医生说他应该呆在室内，避免很多刺激。
His son Joel thought, "What if we try, just for a brief time, something different?"
他的儿子乔尔想：“如果我们尝试一些不同的东西，哪怕只是一小会儿，会怎么样？”
I was visiting my father.
我正在拜访我的父亲。
We were driving someplace and he was babbling on, as he does.
我们开车去某个地方，他就像他一样胡言乱语。
His great skill is that he can talk.
他最大的本领就是他会说话。
And in the middle of one of these riffs, he turned to me with a look of panic, really, and he said, "The trouble with me is I never get to the point where I get to the point." And that was so pungent an observation about his predicament that it entered my consciousness in a way that made me say, now.
在其中一个连复段中，他转向我，脸上带着惊慌的表情，真的，他说，“我的问题是我从来没有达到我要达到的目的。”对他的困境的观察是如此尖锐，以至于它以某种方式进入了我的意识，让我说，现在。
That's it.
就是这样。
I'm going to make a film about him.
我要拍一部关于他的电影。
He's at a place in this disease where, before he's completely gone and while he has some consciousness about his situation, I'm going to take him out into the world again and see what happens to him and how he handles himself.
他正处于这种疾病的一个阶段，在他完全消失之前，当他对自己的处境有一定的意识时，我将带他再次进入这个世界，看看他会发生什么以及他如何处理自己。
They got a camera and went on a three-week trip, driving from Ft.
他们买了一台相机，从英国《金融时报》出发，进行了为期三周的旅行。
Lauderdale back to New York City.
劳德代尔堡返回纽约市。
Joel Meyerowitz's son Sasha did most of the filming.
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨的儿子萨沙承担了大部分拍摄工作。
You hear his voice only a few times in the footage I'm about to play you.
在我要扮演你的镜头中，你只听到他的声音几次。
When they set out on the trip, Sasha was 27, Joel was 57, Hy was 87.
当他们出发时，萨沙 27 岁，乔尔 57 岁，海 87 岁。
Well, I'll be honest with you, Joel.
好吧，我对你说实话，乔尔。
I don't remember.
我不记得了。
Not the Catskills Ocean--
不是卡茨基尔海洋——
The Catskills are mountains.
卡茨基尔山脉是山脉。
This is an ocean.
这是一片海洋。
Which one?
哪一个？
Well, I don't know.
嗯，我不知道。
Joel Meyerowitz Is it the Pacific or the Atlantic?
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨 这是太平洋还是大西洋？
I will take that as Pacific.
我将其视为太平洋。
Joel Meyerowitz Really?
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨 真的吗？
Yeah, wrong.
是的，错了。
Joel Meyerowitz So which one is it then?
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨 那么是哪一位呢？
The Permishic.
佩尔米什人。
Right.
正确的。
Hy Meyerowitz The Permishic!
嗨迈耶罗维茨，Permishic！
I am a bissel farshimmelt!
我是一个比塞尔·法什梅尔特！
What are you asking me so early in the morning a question like that?
你一大早就问我这样的问题干什么？
Where were you born?
你在哪里出世？
Hy Meyerowitz 1-0-9-2-- 1-0-9-2-0-7-- no. 1-5-9-0-5-9 East--
海·迈耶罗维茨 1-0-9-2-- 1-0-9-2-0-7-- 没有。 1-5-9-0-5-9东--
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Joel Meyerowitz He taught me all the street-smart things.
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨（Joel Meyerowitz）他教了我所有街头智慧的东西。
He set up a punching bag for me.
他为我设置了一个沙袋。
And he taught me how to fight, how to take my stance, how to throw a punch, how to put your body behind it.
他教我如何战斗，如何采取立场，如何出拳，如何将身体放在后面。
He had me work out on a light bag too, like this.
他还让我用一个轻包进行锻炼，就像这样。
He always felt that if you got into a scrape in the neighborhood that you shouldn't run away.
他总觉得，如果你在附近遇到麻烦，你不应该逃跑。
His motto was, "Step in and deliver the first blow." And he said, "Take the biggest guy down."
他的座右铭是“介入并发出第一击”。他说：“把最大的家伙打倒。”
And that was his attitude.
这就是他的态度。
He wouldn't stop and run away from anything.
他不会停下来逃避任何事情。
On Morrison Avenue, the block we lived on, he was considered the mayor of the block.
在我们居住的街区莫里森大道上，他被认为是该街区的市长。
Anytime there was a dispute that had to be settled, they would actually come and ask him, "What do you think, Hy?" Or if there were strangers coming through the neighborhood and they needed to be told to get out of there, they'd get him.
每当有争议需要解决时，他们实际上都会过来问他：“你觉得怎么样，Hy？”或者，如果有陌生人经过附近，需要告诉他们离开那里，他们就会抓住他。
And the scenes I remember of it, people would gather in front of our window, and they'd yell, "Hymie?
在我记得的场景中，人们聚集在我们的窗前，他们会大喊：“海米？
Hey, Hymie?" And he'd come to the window and he would adjudicate from the window.
嘿，海米？”他来到窗口，从窗口做出裁决。
He would say, "No, no. You shouldn't do that.
他会说：“不，不。你不应该那样做。
And he should do this.
他应该这样做。
And you get that.
你明白了。
Let him alone." And it was like The Judge.
让他一个人呆着吧。”就像《法官》一样。
Here we come, baby.
我们来了，宝贝。
And I want you to know-- hey you!
我想让你知道——嘿你！
[BIRD CHIRPING] Hy Meyerowitz Hello!
[鸟鸣声] Hy Meyerowitz 你好！
Hello!
你好！
Hello!
你好！
Hello!
你好！
No. Joel Meyerowitz Does that remind you of Melvin?
不。Joel Meyerowitz 这会让你想起 Melvin 吗？
Oh, yeah.
哦，是的。
Joel Meyerowitz That's what I was thinking.
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨 我就是这么想的。
I didn't think of the name at that time.
当时我没有想到这个名字。
Do you remember Melvin?
你还记得梅尔文吗？
Hy Meyerowitz Yeah.
海·迈耶罗维茨 是的。
Sure I remember him.
我当然记得他。
What was Melvin?
梅尔文是什么？
Hy Meyerowitz He was a little Chinese little bird.
Hy Meyerowitz 他是一只中国小鸟。
A parakeet.
一只长尾小鹦鹉。
Hy Meyerowitz A parakeet.
Hy Meyerowitz 长尾小鹦鹉。
Right.
正确的。
I didn't think--
我没想到——
Do you remember the things that Melvin said?
你还记得梅尔文说过的话吗？
He called us, he spoke to us, and he also called his name out a lot.
他打电话给我们，他和我们说话，他还经常喊他的名字。
Yeah, but how did he say it?
是啊，但是他怎么说呢？
Do you remember?
你是否记得？
"I'm Mel-- I'm Melvin!" Isn't it, isn't it, "Hi, Belvin?"
“我是梅尔——我是梅尔文！”不是吗，不是吗，“嗨，贝尔文？”
No, he said, "I'm Melvin--" what?
不，他说，“我是梅尔文——”什么？
Melvin Belvin?
梅尔文·贝尔文？
Joel Meyerowitz "I'm Melvin Meyerowitz."
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨“我是梅尔文·迈耶罗维茨。”
Can you tell me the story of the time he got lost--
你能告诉我他迷路那次的故事吗——
I can't tell you about-- look at this.
我不能告诉你——看看这个。
I can't tell you about any-- look at this.
我不能告诉你任何事情——看看这个。
Another one comes.
另一个来了。
Hiya, boys!
嗨，孩子们！
Hello!
你好！
Hello!
你好！
We know you!
我们认识你！
We know your grandfather!
我们认识你的祖父！
Pop, remember how he used to say "My name is Melvin Meyerowitz.
爸爸，还记得他曾经说过“我的名字是梅尔文·迈耶罗维茨。
I'm a Jewish bird."
我是一只犹太鸟。”
Yeah.
是的。
Yes.
是的。
Joel Meyerowitz That comes back to you?
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨（Joel Meyerowitz）你又想起了这一点吗？
Oh, yeah.
哦，是的。
Joel Meyerowitz Whenever Dr. Goldberg came to visit Mom when she was sick?
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨 每当戈德堡医生在妈妈生病时来看望她时？
Yeah.
是的。
Joel Meyerowitz And do you remember the time the bird flew away across the Bronx?
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨 你还记得那只鸟飞过布朗克斯的那次吗？
He went out the door on Mom's shoulder and he flew away.
他骑在妈妈的肩上出了门，然后飞走了。
And we were all so heartbroken that the bird was gone.
鸟儿不见了，我们都很伤心。
And then some woman called up.
然后有一个女人打来电话。
Do you remember?
你是否记得？
She called mom, and she said, "Do you have a bird named Melvin?" My mother said, "Yeah, we have a bird.
她打电话给妈妈，她说：“你有一只叫梅尔文的鸟吗？”妈妈说：“是的，我们有一只鸟。
It was a green and yellow parakeet." And the woman said, "Well, the bird landed on my window and said, 'My name is Melvin Meyerowitz.
那是一只绿色和黄色的长尾小鹦鹉。”那个女人说：“嗯，那只鸟落在我的窗户上，说道：‘我的名字是梅尔文·迈耶罗维茨。
I'm a Jewish bird.' And I looked you up in the phone book, and I called the Meyerowitz's, and they said, 'No, no. That's my brother Hy's bird.'" We went and we got the bird back.
我是一只犹太鸟。我在电话簿里查了你的名字，然后给迈耶罗维茨一家打了电话，他们说，‘不，不。那是我哥哥 Hy 的鸟。’”我们去了，把鸟拿回来了。
Do you remember that?
你还记得吗？
Come on!
快点！
You don't want to go?
你不想去吗？
Don't fall!
别摔倒！
Take it easy, take it easy.
放轻松，放轻松。
Do you want to go?
你想去吗？
With the onset of memory loss, it's not only his memories that are fading away, but it's the memories that I shared with him that are fading away.
随着失忆的发生，不仅是他的记忆在消失，我和他分享的记忆也在消失。
So I could no longer say to him, "Hey Pop, remember we did this?" And have him say, "Yes, that was fantastic.
所以我不能再对他说：“嘿爸爸，还记得我们这样做过吗？”让他说：“是的，那太棒了。
Remember it?" So I found myself progressively left alone with my memories.
还记得吗？”所以我发现自己逐渐只剩下我的记忆了。
And then you look at your own memories and you realize, I got this handful of really insignificant things, and I've made them my world, my world of memory.
然后你看看自己的记忆，你就会意识到，我得到了这一把非常微不足道的东西，我把它们变成了我的世界，我的记忆世界。
And it's astonishing how the few things that I recall to share with him are minor notes.
令人惊讶的是，我记得与他分享的几件事都是次要的。
The bird or the handful of things that I ask him.
那只鸟或者我问他的一些事情。
So that was really-- that was a lesson for me about what it is that rises up out of our experience that we hold onto.
所以这对我来说确实是一个教训，告诉我从我们所坚持的经验中会产生什么。
I want to ask you a few questions about the family.
我想问你一些关于家庭的问题。
About our family?
关于我们的家庭？
Joel Meyerowitz About our family.
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨 关于我们的家庭。
Yes.
是的。
Joel Meyerowitz You've got three sons.
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨 你有三个儿子。
Yes.
是的。
Joel Meyerowitz What are their names?
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨 他们的名字是什么？
Joel, Ricky-- Joel Meyerowitz And who's your youngest son?
乔尔、瑞奇——乔尔·迈耶罗维茨 那么谁是你最小的儿子？
The youngest one is-- I think it was David.
最小的一个是——我想是大卫。
I don't remember the name anymore.
我不记得这个名字了。
Joel, Rick, and--?
乔尔、瑞克，还有——？
Hy Meyerowitz Joel, Ricky, and-- yeah.
Hy Meyerowitz 乔尔、瑞奇，还有——是的。
OK.
好的。
Do you know what Rick does to make a living?
你知道瑞克靠什么谋生吗？
what his career is?
他的职业是什么？
Well, he tries to do a lot of stuff for you.
好吧，他试图为你做很多事情。
If he were following me, he would be doing it on the crook.
如果他跟踪我，他就会偷偷摸摸地干这件事。
But--
但是——
What's he famous for?
他凭什么出名？
Hy Meyerowitz Ricky?
你好迈耶罗维茨瑞奇吗？
Well, in the first place, he's my kid.
嗯，首先，他是我的孩子。
You are also.
你也是。
And because that alone gives you enough fame.
因为仅此一点就可以给你带来足够的名气。
Ricky?
瑞奇？
Rick is a half-time, or part-time book-- I don't know the trade names.
《瑞克》是一本半职或兼职的书——我不知道商品名。
You're getting closer, Pop.
你越来越近了，爸爸。
Just try.
试试吧。
Try to think about what Rick does.
试着想想瑞克做了什么。
Rick?
瑞克？
Rick is an artist.
里克是一位艺术家。
Joel Meyerowitz Right!
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨 对！
You got it.
你明白了。
Not what?
不是什么？
Joel Meyerowitz You got it right.
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨 你说得对。
And I'm Joel.
我是乔尔。
What do I do?
我该怎么办？
You're a doll.
你是一个洋娃娃。
You're my best number one!
你是我心中最好的第一！
I know.
我知道。
Come on.
快点。
Get serious, Pop.
认真点吧，波普。
Do you remember what it is I do?
你还记得我是做什么的吗？
What do I do?
我该怎么办？
You make money.
你赚钱了。
I'll tell you what, I'll give it to you straight off the street.
我会告诉你什么，我会直接在街上给你。
What's my profession?
我的职业是什么？
Hy Meyerowitz What's what?
海·迈耶罗维茨 什么是什么？
What's my profession?
我的职业是什么？
Hy Meyerowitz What's your most attachment?
Hy Meyerowitz 你最执着的是什么？
What's my profession?
我的职业是什么？
Hy Meyerowitz Your profession.
海·迈耶罗维茨 你的职业。
Now I've got to figure out-- I don't know.
现在我必须弄清楚——我不知道。
Crook or thief or whatever.
骗子或小偷或其他什么。
You're known as an artist.
你被称为艺术家。
Serious artist in the art field.
艺术领域严肃的艺术家。
OK, what about Stevie?
好吧，史蒂维呢？
What's Stevie's business?
史蒂维有什么生意？
Stevie?
史蒂维？
I don't know.
我不知道。
Joel Meyerowitz Does it bother you that you can't remember your kids' names sometimes and you can't remember what they do?
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨（Joel Meyerowitz）：有时您记不起孩子的名字，也不记得他们做了什么，这是否让您感到困扰？
Well, I'll tell you, yeah.
好吧，我告诉你，是的。
I see them-- "Hello, goodbye." And that's it.
我看到他们——“你好，再见。”就是这样。
I'm not complaining.
我没有抱怨。
Is it hard to see him like this?
看到他这样是不是很难受？
Does it feel painful?
是不是感觉很痛？
Honestly, it's sad.
老实说，很难过。
I have a feeling of sadness, but I also have a feeling of acceptance.
我有一种悲伤的感觉，但我也有一种接受的感觉。
We've been apart for 20 years in the mutual prime of our lives when I was raising my children and he was a grandparent.
我们已经分开20年了，当时我们正值人生的黄金时期，当时我正在抚养我的孩子，而他已经是祖父母了。
We weren't together.
我们没有在一起。
And so I guess I'm just accepting of where he is.
所以我想我只是接受他的处境。
If we had been together for 20 years and I had seen the decline and I had been relating to him emotionally and lovingly all that time, I might feel a deeper sadness.
如果我们在一起20年，我看到了他的衰落，并且一直以来我都充满情感和爱意地与他相处，我可能会感到更深的悲伤。
But even though he's my father, the distance that we've been apart all these years has put some kind of a buffer in there.
但尽管他是我的父亲，这些年来我们分开的距离已经在其中设置了某种缓冲。
So this is the guy that I know now.
这就是我现在认识的人。
We have a much closer relationship, the way we see each other and talk to each other and have continuity.
我们的关系更加密切，我们看待彼此、交谈的方式也具有连续性。
I just know at one point, you said to him he was your hero, which I thought was so sweet and I thought it must be hard to see--
我只知道有一次，你对他说他是你的英雄，我觉得这太甜蜜了，我想这一定很难看到——
Well, he was my hero.
嗯，他是我的英雄。
My childhood hero.
我儿时的英雄。
But that's so far away, I can't relate to the sadness of that.
但那是遥远的事，我无法体会那种悲伤。
I love him in that unequivocal way that a child loves a parent.
我爱他就像孩子爱父母一样明确。
And I feel when I care for him a kind of renewal or a rebirth of feeling in this period.
当我关心他时，我感觉这段时间有一种更新或重生的感觉。
I know when I take him after a shower and I rub him down, I actually feel his head in my hands and I feel his flesh in my hands.
我知道，当我洗完澡后抱起他并揉搓他时，我实际上感觉到他的头在我的手中，我感觉到他的肉在我的手中。
It's been many years since I had that kind of contact with my father.
我和父亲有过这样的接触已经很多年了。
And it was a little strange at first.
一开始有点奇怪。
I thought, "What's it like to rub this other person's body?
我想：“摩擦另一个人的身体是什么感觉？
Touch this other person's body?" It's like deference.
碰别人的身体？”这就像尊重。
And then I realize it's my Pop.
然后我意识到这是我的爸爸。
And he's in need.
他有需要。
He can't take care of himself this way.
这样他就无法照顾自己了。
Mom?
妈妈？
OK, here's Papa, Mom.
好的，爸爸、妈妈来了。
Hold on.
坚持，稍等。
OK, here comes Dad.
好的，爸爸来了。
Joel?
乔尔？
Is it my Joel?
是我的乔尔吗？
Don't you know who I am?
你不知道我是谁吗？
Who?
WHO？
What do you mean, "How come I'm on the phone?" Don't get mad at me.
“我怎么在打电话？”是什么意思？别生我的气。
Don't get mad at me.
别生我的气。
It's very important because I've been traveling.
这非常重要，因为我一直在旅行。
I didn't--
我没有——
I think my father had a classic marriage of his generation.
我认为我父亲的婚姻是他那一代人的经典。
He loved my mother.
他爱我的母亲。
She was beautiful and hot tempered, an exciting person to be with.
她很漂亮，脾气暴躁，是一个令人兴奋的人。
But he wanted something from her that either he didn't know how to get or she couldn't give.
但他想要从她那里得到一些东西，要么他不知道如何得到，要么她无法给予。
And that was a kind of mother-love that he himself hadn't experienced.
而那是一种他自己没有经历过的母爱。
Yes, I'm OK.
是的，我没事。
No, I'm not having a good time.
不，我过得不太好。
Are you having a good time?
你玩得开心吗？
You are, really?
你真的是吗？
OK.
好的。
I want you to be healthy and strong and smile, Sally.
我希望你健康、坚强、微笑，莎莉。
His mother had been bed-ridden after his birth.
他的母亲在他出生后一直卧床不起。
And then she died soon after.
然后她不久就去世了。
So he never really knew her.
所以他从来没有真正了解过她。
That's the deepest groove in his memory, which is, I think, unrequited love.
那是他记忆中最深的沟渠，我想，那就是单恋。
Don't go down the judge's because right now I'm beginning the first one of Joel's tests.
不要去法官那里，因为现在我正在开始乔尔的第一个测试。
And I will be back at home maybe-- who knows?
也许我会回到家——谁知道呢？
A couple of months from now.
几个月后。
I don't know, Sally.
我不知道，莎莉。
Would you go with me the next trip?
下次旅行你愿意和我一起去吗？
Would you go with me the next trip?
下次旅行你愿意和我一起去吗？
OK.
好的。
All right, May.
好吧，五月。
Take care, sweetheart.
保重，亲爱的。
Be careful, will you?
小心一点，好吗？
Be careful.
当心。
Bye bye.
再见。
And I think from my point of view now that if he had really just loved my mother without demanding something from her, or needing something from her, which was that childhood need, that she probably would have just loved him back for the kind, warm, funny man that he was.
我认为，从我现在的角度来看，如果他真的只是爱我的母亲，而不向她索取什么，或者需要她做些什么，这是童年的需要，那么她可能会因为他是一个善良、温暖、有趣的男人而爱他。
But because there was something that he was demanding, she couldn't give it to him.
但因为他有一些要求，她不能给他。
A kind of perverse logic of relationship occurred.
出现了一种不正当的关系逻辑。
She's mad.
她生气了。
She's mad about something.
她因为某件事而生气。
Mad about me.
为我生气。
I didn't do nothing.
我什么也没做。
Why is she mad?
她为什么生气？
Hy Meyerowitz She's mad, that's all.
海·迈耶罗维茨 她生气了，仅此而已。
She sounded very, very mad.
她听起来非常非常生气。
She sounded like she didn't care.
她听起来好像并不在意。
Oh, sure.
哦，当然。
Joel Meyerowitz --which is why she was mad.
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨——这就是她生气的原因。
That we didn't call.
就是我们没有打电话。
I waver also when I think of her being by herself.
当我想到她独自一人时，我也会动摇。
And I would rather be there than be here.
我宁愿在那里也不愿在这里。
But you're having such a good time here.
但你在这里过得很开心。
Yeah, to my limit, I'm having what I like and I would love to do, love to be involved with.
是的，在我的极限范围内，我拥有我喜欢的东西，我愿意做的事情，喜欢参与其中。
But the idea is that I always have to include Mama.
但我的想法是我总是必须包括妈妈。
Throughout the trip, he asked for Sally every single day-- "Where's Sally?
在整个旅途中，他每天都会询问莎莉——“莎莉在哪里？
Where's Mom?"-- thinking that she should have been in the car next to him.
妈妈在哪儿？”——心想她应该在他旁边的车里。
Sally?
莎莉？
Did you leave Sally upstairs there?
你把莎莉留在楼上了吗？
No kidding.
不开玩笑。
Right.
正确的。
Because I noticed right here that this is no Sally.
因为我在这里注意到这不是莎莉。
I thought this was Sally all bundled up and I see it's that bundled up.
我以为这是莎莉，全身都裹得严严实实的，我看到了，确实是裹得严严实实的。
It's your pillow.
这是你的枕头。
That pillow's going to have to be your Sally--
那个枕头一定是你的莎莉——
Yeah, yeah.
是啊，是啊。
The pillow.
枕头。
Joel Meyerowitz --for at least two weeks now.
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨——至少两周了。
Oh, you guys are starting to pull tricks on me now.
哦，你们现在开始捉弄我了。
I know, I know, I know.
我知道，我知道，我知道。
Well, is she here?
嗯，她在吗？
Jesus Christ almighty.
耶稣基督全能。
I know she's not in the trunk.
我知道她不在后备箱里。
You wouldn't do that to her.
你不会那样对她。
I'm not able to come to this, Joel.
我无法做到这一点，乔尔。
I'm not the smartest and the cutest and the swiftest.
我不是最聪明、最可爱、最快的。
I--
我——
The swiftest!
最快！
Hy Meyerowitz If my Mommy don't come up and then don't come down in five minutes, I want to know where she is.
Hy Meyerowitz 如果我妈妈在五分钟内不出现又不下来，我想知道她在哪里。
This is my wife.
这是我的妻子。
So we better check the trunk.
所以我们最好检查一下后备箱。
Hy Meyerowitz Oh, the bed is in the trunk?
Hy Meyerowitz 哦，床在后备箱里？
No. Hy Meyerowitz I wouldn't be surprised.
不，Hy Meyerowitz 我不会感到惊讶。
There was a time when we were driving with her in Florida, before we made the film.
在拍摄这部电影之前，有一次我们和她一起开车去佛罗里达。
And she was sitting right next to him.
而她就坐在他旁边。
And he leaned over to me and he said, "Where's Mom?" And I said, "Well, who's sitting next to you?" And he looked over at this person sitting next to him.
他向我倾身问道：“妈妈在哪儿？”我说：“那么，坐在你旁边的是谁？”他也看向了坐在自己身边的这个人。
He said, "Where's Sally?
他说：“莎莉在哪儿？
That's not Sally."
那不是莎莉。”
You can see better with this.
通过这个你可以看得更清楚。
Joel Meyerowitz Good morning.
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨早上好。
Good morning to you!
祝你早上好！
Joel Meyerowitz Good morning, Pop.
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨 早上好，爸爸。
Hiya, Sonny.
嗨，桑尼。
Joel Meyerowitz How are you doing?
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨 你好吗？
His real intelligence is to live in the moment.
他真正的智慧是活在当下。
He knew where he was and he was just enjoying the experience.
他知道自己在哪里，而且他只是享受这种经历。
But he couldn't really look back at what he had done even an hour before and remember it.
但他无法真正回顾一小时前所做的事情并记住它。
And I tested him all the time, because I wanted to see if stimulation could actually enliven his mentality and bring him back at all.
我一直在测试他，因为我想看看刺激是否真的能活跃他的心态并让他恢复过来。
But that was sort of a hopeless hope.
但这是一种无望的希望。
But it didn't stop me from having it anyway.
但无论如何，这并没有阻止我拥有它。
I just want to review a few things with you.
我只是想和你回顾一些事情。
I have a few questions for you.
我有几个问题要问你。
Uh, I'm not-- I don't have to call my attorney?
呃，我不是——我不需要打电话给我的律师？
Do you remember any of the things on the trip so far?
到目前为止，您还记得旅途中发生的事情吗？
But will you-- I'm just going to say.
但是你愿意吗——我只是想说。
Don't ask me about anything I did.
不要问我做过什么。
Why?
为什么？
Hy Meyerowitz Why?
海·迈耶罗维茨 为什么？
Because that's gone, man.
因为那已经消失了，伙计。
It's gone.
它消失了。
Hy Meyerowitz Not that-- it wasn't so many things going on.
Hy Meyerowitz 不是这样——并没有发生太多事情。
But I just don't remember.
但我就是不记得了。
It's jumbled.
很混乱。
I've been to a car.
我去过一辆车。
I went to the automobile.
我走向汽车。
I've been to the train.
我去过火车。
I was going in every direction.
我朝各个方向前进。
And I was losing sight.
我正在失去视力。
I was losing sight for no reason whatsoever.
我无缘无故地失去了视力。
Everybody was going around us.
每个人都围着我们转。
Turmoil.
动荡。
Turmoiled.
心乱如麻。
To moil?
捣蛋？
Hy Meyerowitz To moil is not to moil, but to moil is to have and to kiss and to love, to moil!
Hy Meyerowitz To moil 不是 moil，但是 moil 就是拥有、亲吻和爱，moil！
"Respect the old man who--" wait, wait.
“尊重这位老人——”等等，等等。
I can wear glasses.
我可以戴眼镜。
Yes?
是的？
OK.
好的。
"Respect the old man who has forgotten what he learned from a broken table-- from a broken table tablet.
“尊重这位老人，他已经忘记了他从一张破桌子上学到的东西——从一块破桌子上学到的东西。
Have a place in the urk--"
在乌尔克占有一席之地——”
"Ark." Hy Meyerowitz "Ark.
“方舟。”海·迈耶罗维茨《方舟》
Ark.
方舟。
Besides the tablets of the law."
除了法版之外。”
OK, now read it again.
好，现在再读一遍。
And for the first sentence, "respect the old man who has forgotten." Just read it that way.
而第一句，“敬已遗忘的老人”。就这样读吧。
"Repsect the old man who has forgotten what he has learned.
“尊重这位忘记了所学知识的老人。
For broken tablets have a place in the mind-- in the ark, excuse me-- the ark besides the tablets of the law." Didn't I have my glasses here?
因为破损的法版在心灵中占有一席之地——对不起，在方舟里——除了法版之外，方舟里也有一席之地。”我这里不是有眼镜吗？
OK, now read it-- do you want my glasses?
好的，现在读一下——你想要我的眼镜吗？
I wanted to try it.
我想尝试一下。
Joel Meyerowitz Read it one more time.
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨再读一遍。
At the end say, "the Talmud." Because it says--
最后说“塔木德”。因为它说——
The Talmud?
塔木德？
Joel Meyerowitz It says it comes from the Talmud.
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨（Joel Meyerowitz）说它来自《塔木德》。
"Respect the old man who has forgotten what he has learned." Come to a rest.
“尊敬这位忘记所学的老人。”来休息一下吧。
OK?
好的？
Ready?
准备好？
Read.
读。
With my glasses.
带着我的眼镜。
Joel Meyerowitz We don't have your glasses here, Dad.
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨：爸爸，我们这里没有您的眼镜。
Take--huh?
拿——嗯？
Joel Meyerowitz You don't need your glasses.
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨：你不需要眼镜。
You read it perfectly without your glasses.
不戴眼镜你也可以完美地阅读它。
Just do it one more time.
再做一次就可以了。
Hy Meyerowitz All right.
海·迈耶罗维茨 好吧。
"Respect the old man who has forgotten what he learned." [CLEARS THROAT] "For broken tablets have a place in the ark besides the tablets of the law." The Talmud.
“尊重这位忘记所学的老人。” [清嗓子]“因为除了法版之外，在方舟里还有破碎的法版。”塔木德。
It was a little skimpy.
有点吝啬。
It was?
是吗？
Hy Meyerowitz It was a little skimpy, a little jumpy.
Hy Meyerowitz 有点吝啬，有点紧张。
Yeah.
是的。
Put these glasses on and just see if they help you to read it.
戴上这些眼镜，看看它们是否可以帮助您阅读。
Maybe so.
也许是这样。
Joel Meyerowitz Maybe so.
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨 也许是这样。
One last time.
最后一次。
This is it.
就是这样。
This is your chance.
这是你的机会。
All right.
好的。
Joel Meyerowitz Otherwise you don't get the job.
Joel Meyerowitz：否则你就得不到这份工作。
This is a casting session.
这是选角环节。
Hy Meyerowitz Yeah, but maybe he's cock-eyed--
Hy Meyerowitz 是的，但也许他是斗鸡眼——
You've got enough light there, Pop.
爸爸，你那里有足够的光线。
All you've got to do is try to read it.
您所要做的就是尝试阅读它。
(SUBJECT) HY MEYEROWITZ: Yeah.
（主题）海·梅耶罗维茨：是的。
I know I-- where is my-- didn't I bring my glasses up?
我知道我——我的——我没有把眼镜举起来吗？
I don't know.
我不知道。
They're away somewhere in a bag.
它们藏在袋子里的某个地方。
OK.
好的。
Joel Meyerowitz Ready?
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨准备好了吗？
Here goes.
就这样吧。
This is your screen test.
这是您的屏幕测试。
Yes.
是的。
"Respect the old man who has forgotten-- been-- who has forgotten what he learned.
“尊重这位已经忘记了——已经——忘记了他所学到的东西的老人。
For broken ta--" only one thing.
对于破碎的ta——”只有一件事。
It was still shaking, my eye.
我的眼睛还在颤抖。
That's why I was loose.
这就是我松懈的原因。
Take 11 for Hy Meyerowitz reading from "The Forgotten."
拿 11 来让 Hy Meyerowitz 朗读《被遗忘者》。
No. Take 11.
不，选11。
Joel Meyerowitz Dad, this is-- no, no. Read that.
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨 爸爸，这是——不，不。读一下。
No, no. This is a joke, Pop.
不，不。这是个笑话，爸爸。
Read those few words there.
读那几句话。
And then with the words "the Talmud." Nice and slow, take this one.
然后是“塔木德”这个词。又好又慢，拿这个吧。
"Repsect the old man who has been forgotten, what he learned.
“尊重这位被遗忘的老人，尊重他所学到的东西。
For the broken tablets have a way place in the ark besides the tablets of the law." The Tablund-- Talmud.
因为破碎的法版在法版之外还有一个地方可以放在方舟里。”塔布伦德——塔木德。
Ah, twice I made a mistake.
啊，我犯了两次错误。
OK.
好的。
Hy Meyerowitz Well, I-- now that I know what I was doing--
Hy Meyerowitz 好吧，我——现在我知道我在做什么了——
I guess as a legitimate actor, you would have a hard time reading your lines.
我想作为一个合法的演员，你会很难读懂你的台词。
But as a comic actor, you can deliver your lines flawlessly--
但作为相声演员，台词可以说得天衣无缝——
Yeah.
是的。
Well, this one, I imagine, would have to be.
嗯，我想，这个应该是。
Because this is the Talmud.
因为这是《塔木德》。
It just ended.
事情刚刚结束。
Joel Meyerowitz --is kaput!
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨——退役了！
You're finished.
你已经完成了。
Out!
出去！
Next!
下一个！
Bring in the next old man.
请下一个老人来。
When my father was young, he was a wonderful dancer and athlete and a natural comic.
我父亲年轻时是一位出色的舞蹈家和运动员，也是一位天生的喜剧演员。
And I guess Charlie Chaplin was the rage, and just as there were Elvis imitators, there were Chaplin imitators.
我猜查理·卓别林风靡一时，就像有猫王模仿者一样，也有卓别林模仿者。
And my father, he became a Chaplin imitator.
而我的父亲，他成了卓别林的模仿者。
And he had that act that I guess he took on the road, or around the vaudeville circuit in New York.
他的表演我猜是他在路上或在纽约的歌舞杂耍表演中进行的。
I was trying to fit in myself, through all the years with the joking.
这些年来我一直在开玩笑，试图融入自己。
I was trying to be a Chaplin.
我想成为卓别林。
I didn't know if I was doing that right or wrong, but I saw that poor little guy, that he bent down, picked something up, everybody'd give him a kick in the ass.
我不知道我这样做是对还是错，但我看到那个可怜的小家伙，他弯下腰，捡起一些东西，每个人都会踢他的屁股。
That was what I used to see.
这就是我过去所看到的。
That is what I didn't want to happen to me.
这就是我不想发生在我身上的事情。
What was it that you liked about Charlie Chaplin that made you want to do the Charlie Chaplin act?
您喜欢查理·卓别林的哪一点让您想出演查理·卓别林的表演？
He was a giant in the height of a little midget.
他是一个身材矮小的巨人。
He was a little guy, went righting all the wrongs, helping others as he passed by.
他是个小人物，他纠正了所有的错误，在路过的时候帮助别人。
We'd pat him on the top of the head.
我们会拍拍他的头顶。
He was remembered out there, just for a minute.
他在那里被记住了，只是一分钟。
He'd have a little [UNINTELLIGIBLE] with a little person hat and no money or no nothing.
他会有一个小[难以理解]，戴着一顶小人帽，没有钱，或者什么都没有。
And he would go inside and he'd come out here like this.
他会像这样进去然后出来。
Like, shake his shoulders, and then travel around.
就像，摇晃他的肩膀，然后四处走动。
And that was what I loved, the goodness, the goodness.
这就是我所爱的，善良，善良。
And not everybody understood him.
并不是每个人都理解他。
But those that understood him, they would put their arm around him and he would do the same with them.
但那些理解他的人，他们会用手臂搂住他，他也会对他们做同样的事情。
It was a beautiful deed for the day.
这对今天来说是一件美丽的事。
Did you feel connected to him in that way?
你有这样的感觉和他有联系吗？
Aw-- With Alzheimer's disease, most memory finally dissolves.
噢——患有阿尔茨海默病，大多数记忆最终都会消失。
And even though he was a man who was easily lovable, I think he forgot that these were his qualities.
尽管他是一个很容易讨人喜欢的人，但我认为他忘记了这些是他的品质。
And that he was, in fact, loved by people faded from his memory.
事实上，他被人们所爱的事也从他的记忆中消失了。
And at the end of his life, he remembers a few of the more painful things-- that he's a motherless child, that he was not loved the way he wanted to be loved.
在他生命的最后，他记得一些更痛苦的事情——他是一个没有母亲的孩子，他没有得到他想要的爱的方式。
And it's amazing that with the murkiness of Alzheimer's clouding everything, that something as primal as being an unloved child stayed with him.
令人惊奇的是，随着阿尔茨海默氏症的阴暗笼罩着一切，像一个不受爱的孩子这样原始的东西却一直伴随着他。
When anybody would show a little bit of something to me that I was accepted, and they would talk to me, and they'd pat me on the top of the head of put their hands around me, I'm home.
当有人向我展示一些我被接受的东西时，他们会和我说话，他们会拍拍我的头顶，用手抱住我，我就到家了。
I loved everybody.
我爱每个人。
I loved everybody.
我爱每个人。
But nobody saw me.
但没有人看到我。
Nobody remembered me.
没有人记得我。
Nobody knew me.
没有人认识我。
Nobody saw me.
没有人看到我。
But I was there.
但我当时就在那里。
To this very day, I have the same fear.
直到今天，我仍然有同样的恐惧。
I have poor Mommy, I have.
我有可怜的妈妈，我有。
And she doesn't see me.
她没有看到我。
She doesn't see me.
她没有看到我。
Oh, Papa.
哦，爸爸。
Well, your boys saw you.
好吧，你的孩子们看到了你。
We all saw you.
我们都看到你了。
I loved when you were the strong man in the neighborhood.
我喜欢你是邻居里的强者。
I loved when you were the Chaplin figure and the comic.
我喜欢你扮演卓别林的形象和漫画。
I loved the way you drove the car.
我喜欢你开车的方式。
You were such a great driver.
你是一位很棒的司机。
I love the way you talk to people.
我喜欢你与人交谈的方式。
You could talk to the big guys or the little guys, and you made them all the same, Pop.
你可以和大人物或小人物交谈，你让他们都一样，爸爸。
I used to think of you as the great equalizer.
我曾经认为你是伟大的均衡者。
You could take a guy who was a doctor or a principal of the school or a business man, and you can take another guy who was just an ordinary worker, and you would treat them the same.
你可以带一个是医生、学校校长或商人的人，也可以带另一个只是普通工人的人，你会一视同仁地对待他们。
And you would bring them all to the same level, and that would be the level of laughter.
你会把他们都带到同一个水平，那就是笑的水平。
You saw me.
你看到了我。
You saw Papa.
你看到了爸爸。
Joel Meyerowitz That's right.
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨 没错。
Joel Meyerowitz.
乔尔·迈耶罗维茨。
His father Hy, his son Sasha.
他的父亲是海伊，儿子是萨沙。
Their film has the working title The Mayor of the Block and is looking for a distributor.
他们的电影暂定名为《街区市长》，正在寻找发行商。
Coming up, people do what they shouldn't.
接下来，人们会做他们不应该做的事情。
In a minute from Public Radio International when our program continues.
国际公共广播电台一分钟后我们的节目仍在继续。
We have arrived at Act Two of our show, My World Record.
我们已经到了节目《我的世界纪录》的第二幕。
This is from a book by Tom Andrews called The Hemophiliac's Motorcycle .
这是汤姆·安德鲁斯 (Tom Andrews) 所著的《血友病患者的摩托车》一书中的内容。
On November 15, 1972, one week after Nixon was reelected, I clapped my hands for 14 hours and 31 minutes.
1972年11月15日，尼克松连任一周后，我拍了14小时31分钟的手。
[CLAPPING] I was listed in The Guinness Book of World Records.
[鼓掌]我被列入吉尼斯世界纪录。
I was 11 years old.
那年我11岁。
[CLAPPING] My record was published on page 449 of the 1974 edition of The Guinness Book , landlocked between the listings for largest circus and club swinging in the chapter entitled "Human Achievements." The listing read, "Clapping.
[鼓掌]我的记录发表在 1974 年版《吉尼斯世界纪录》第 449 页上，位于题为“人类成就”一章中最大马戏团和摇摆俱乐部列表之间。清单上写着：“鼓掌。
The duration record for continuous clapping is 14 hours, 31 minutes by Thomas C.
连续鼓掌的持续时间记录是由托马斯·C·托马斯（Thomas C.
Andrews at Charleston, West Virginia on November 15, 1972.
1972 年 11 月 15 日，安德鲁斯在西弗吉尼亚州查尔斯顿。
He sustained an average of 120 claps per minute at an audibility range of at least 100 yards."
他在至少 100 码的可听范围内平均每分钟持续鼓掌 120 次。”
I'm writing this from my bed at the University of Michigan hospital.
我是在密歇根大学医院的床上写下这篇文章的。
It is 3:00 AM.
现在是凌晨 3:00。
It is the half-dark of hospitals at night.
医院的夜晚是半明半暗的。
I've had an accident.
我出了事故。
I have been in an accident.
我出了事故。
[CLAPPING] "That your scrapbook?" Ellen, the night nurse, asked.
[鼓掌]“那是你的剪贴簿？”夜间护士艾伦问道。
When I mutter that technically it's my mother's who brought it to the hospital to cheer me up, Ellen glances at the Inquirer headline and says, "You did that, clap your hands?" I nod.
当我嘀咕说，严格来说是我母亲把它带到医院来让我高兴起来时，艾伦瞥了一眼《询问者报》的标题，说：“你就是这么做的，拍拍手？”我点点头。
"Lord!
“主啊！
Did you have a major bleed, or what?"
是不是大出血了，还是怎么了？”
[CLAPPING] "Dear Tom, it was certainly nice to read that you had broken the world record in clapping.
[鼓掌]“亲爱的汤姆，很高兴看到你打破了鼓掌世界纪录。
We used to enjoy seeing how your dad recorded you and John in your annual picture for Christmas.
我们曾经很高兴看到你爸爸如何在圣诞节的年度照片中记录你和约翰。
The last few years, we had lost contact.
最近几年，我们失去了联系。
Congratulations again.
再次恭喜。
Everyone is very proud of you.
每个人都为你感到骄傲。
Sincerely, the Ripley-Fishers."
此致，雷普利渔民们。”
[CLAPPING] "Dear Tom, try to come out if you can.
[鼓掌]“亲爱的汤姆，如果可以的话，尽量出来。
But if you can't, that's OK.
但如果你不能，那也没关系。
I can play until about 4:00 or 5:00.
我可以玩到4:00或5:00左右。
I hope you come out.
我希望你能出来。
Will you walk with me today?
今天你愿意和我一起散步吗？
Circle yes or no. I think you are the nicest boy over in Rolling Hills.
圈出是或否。我认为你是连绵起伏的丘陵最好的男孩。
I'm going to try to get you something.
我会尽力给你买点东西。
Love, Diane.
爱，黛安。
PS-- write back if you want to.
PS--如果你愿意的话请回信。
Don't let anybody else see this except Nan.
除了南之外，不要让任何人看到这个。
If you want to.
如果你愿意的话。
Or Laura.
或者劳拉。
I just showed Nan and Laura.
我刚刚给南和劳拉看了。
Do you mind?
你介意吗？
Circle yes or no. Answer questions and give back please."
圈出是或否。请回答问题并回馈。”
[CLAPPING] I have had an accident on the sidewalk.
[鼓掌]我在人行道上发生了事故。
I watched my feet come out from under me on the iced concrete with a kind of anecdotal perspective.
我以一种轶事的视角看着我的脚从我身下伸出，踩在冰冻的混凝土上。
The bleeding inside the joints, the infusions of factor VIII, the weeks of immobility, the waiting for codeine, the inventions with which my mind would veer in the direction of solid ground.
关节内的出血，第八因子的输注，数周的不动，等待可待因，这些发明使我的思想转向坚实的基础。
As my weight drilled into the twisting leg, I saw the whole pantomime emerge with the clarity of blown glass.
当我的体重钻入扭曲的腿时，我看到整个哑剧以吹制玻璃的清晰度出现。
[CLAPPING STOPS] When I told my hematologist that as a teenager I had raced motocross, that in fact in one race in Gallipolis, Ohio, I had gotten the holeshot and was bumped in the first turn and run over by 20-some motorcycles, she said, "No. Not with your factor level.
[鼓掌停止]当我告诉我的血液科医生，我十几岁的时候参加过越野摩托车比赛，事实上，在俄亥俄州加利波利斯的一场比赛中，我遇到了漏洞，在第一个转弯处被20多辆摩托车撞倒并碾过，她说，“不。不符合你的因素水平。
I'm sorry but you wouldn't withstand the head injuries.
抱歉，你无法承受头部受伤。
You just like the sound of yourself being dramatic."
你只是喜欢自己戏剧化的声音。”
[CLAPPING] "Does he have to do that?" the waitress at the Pizza Hut asked.
[鼓掌]“他必须这么做吗？”必胜客的服务员问道。
She passed out glasses of ice water from a tray, then set the tray down on the table.
她从托盘里倒出几杯冰水，然后把托盘放在桌子上。
"He's breaking a world record," John said flatly.
“他正在打破一项世界纪录，”约翰平淡地说。
"Does it bother you?" my mother said.
“这让你烦恼吗？”我妈妈说。
"I can't make him stop, but we can leave."
“我不能让他停下来，但我们可以离开。”
The waitress looked up.
女服务员抬起头来。
"You're joking, right?
“你在开玩笑吧？
Let me see." She gestured for me to pull up my hands out from under the table.
让我看看。”她示意我把双手从桌子底下抽出来。
I showed my hands.
我伸出双手。
"He has to sustain an audibility range of at least 100 yards," John said.
“他必须维持至少 100 码的可听范围，”约翰说。
"I'm getting the cook," she said.
“我去叫厨师来，”她说。
"He's got to see this."
“他必须看到这一点。”
A minute later, a man with botched teeth wearing a blue, dough-smeared apron was glaring at me.
一分钟后，一个牙齿坏掉的男人，穿着一条沾满面团的蓝色围裙，怒视着我。
"Well?" he said, impatiently.
“出色地？”他不耐烦地说。
Again I showed my hands.
我再次伸出双手。
I speeded up just a little the rate of clapping.
我稍微加快了鼓掌的速度。
"Right.
“对了。
Unbelievable," the cook said, shaking his head and disappearing.
难以置信，”厨师摇着头说着就消失了。
"What do you do if you have to go to the bathroom?" the waitress asked.
“如果你要去洗手间怎么办？”女服务员问道。
"I'd like a root beer," I said.
“我想要一杯根汁汽水，”我说。
"Do you have root beer?"
“你们有根汁汽水吗？”
"He's trying to go the whole day without going," my mother said.
“他想一整天都不去，”我母亲说。
"Good luck," the waitress said.
“祝你好运，”女服务员说。
I said, "Do you have root beer?"
我说：“你们有根汁汽水吗？”
"Yeah, they have root beer," John said.
“是的，他们有根汁啤酒，”约翰说。
I said, "I was asking her, thank you very much."
我说：“我正在问她，非常感谢你。”
"I don't think I could go the whole day," the waitress said.
“我想我不能走一整天，”女服务员说。
"I think I have a weak bladder." I leaned over to John and whispered, "Help."
“我想我的膀胱很弱。”我向约翰倾身，低声说道：“救命。”
"Hey," said the waitress, "how are you going to eat pizza?"
“嘿，”女服务员说，“你打算怎么吃披萨？”
"I'm not," I said.
“我不是，”我说。
"I'm just sipping some root beer.
“我只是喝了一些根汁啤酒。
If you have it."
如果你有的话。”
"They have it.
“他们有。
They have it," John said.
他们有，”约翰说。
John buried his head in his hands.
约翰把头埋在双手里。
"I'm going to feed him," my mother said.
“我要去喂他，”妈妈说。
"No way," I said.
“不可能，”我说。
For a second I forgot to clap, then caught myself and reestablished my rhythm.
有那么一瞬间，我忘记了鼓掌，然后控制住自己，重新建立起自己的节奏。
"We'll have a large mushroom and pepperoni," my mother said, "and I'd like a glass of iced tea.
“我们要一个大蘑菇和意大利辣香肠，”妈妈说，“我想要一杯冰茶。
What do you want to drink?"
你想喝什么？”
[CLAPPING] There are times in the last minutes before I am allowed-- or allow myself-- more codeine when the pain inside the joint simplifies me utterly.
[鼓掌]有时在最后几分钟，当关节内的疼痛让我彻底放松时，我才被允许——或者允许自己——服用更多的可待因。
I feel myself descending some kind of evolutionary ladder until I become as crude and guileless as an amoeba.
我感觉自己在某种进化阶梯上走下来，直到变得像阿米巴原虫一样粗鲁和朴实。
The pain is not personal.
痛苦不是个人的。
I am incidental to it.
我是偶然的。
It is like faith, the believer eclipsed by something immense.
这就像信仰一样，信徒被某种巨大的东西黯然失色。
[CLAPPING] After the waitress left, my mother lectured me about not participating in events we scheduled on John's off days, days when he wasn't on the dialysis machine.
[鼓掌]女服务员离开后，我母亲训斥我不要参加我们安排在约翰休息日（即他不使用透析机的日子）的活动。
"You've known for a week that we were coming here.
“你已经知道我们要来这里一周了。
You could have picked another day for this clapping business." She said this in front of John, who grimaced and began looking around the room.
你本可以选择另一天来进行这次鼓掌活动。”她在约翰面前说了这句话，约翰做了个鬼脸，开始环视房间。
My argument was that just being there at Pizza Hut while I was in the crucial early hours of breaking a world record was sufficient participation, and that sipping a little root beer under the circumstances put me solidly in the off-day spirit of things.
我的观点是，当我正处于打破世界纪录的关键时刻时，在必胜客就足够参与了，在这种情况下喝一点根汁汽水让我完全沉浸在休息的精神中。
She didn't see it that way.
她不这么看。
[CLAPPING] What surprised me was how easy it was to keep a precise and consistent rhythm.
[鼓掌]令我惊讶的是保持精确一致的节奏是多么容易。
Two hours into the record, I felt as if my hands, like the legs of runners who have broken through the wall, could hammer away at themselves effortlessly and indefinitely.
录制两个小时后，我感觉我的双手就像冲破墙壁的跑步者的腿一样，可以毫不费力地、无限期地自我锤击。
At that point, I knew I would not start a bleed.
那时，我知道我不会流血。
I had no doubt.
我毫不怀疑。
And yet my hands kept hammering at themselves, hammering.
然而我的双手却不断地敲击着自己，敲击着。
[CLAPPING] "Nixon's problem is he's not eating right," my mother said.
[鼓掌]“尼克松的问题是他饮食不正确，”我母亲说。
"It's as plain as day.
“这就像白天一样简单。
Anyone can see it.
任何人都可以看到它。
Just look at the man." It was 5:30 PM and I was still at it, 120 claps per minute.
只要看看这个男人就行了。”当时是下午 5 点 30 分，但我仍在坚持，每分钟拍手 120 次。
"Care for a drink?" my father said to himself.
“想喝一杯吗？”父亲对自己说。
"Don't mind if I do.
“别介意我这么做。
Thank you for asking."
谢谢你的询问。”
[CLAPPING] For a long time, I asked John to come and watch me race.
[鼓掌]很长一段时间，我都邀请约翰来看我比赛。
Again and again, he refused.
他一次又一次地拒绝。
Finally, he agreed to come to a race at Hidden Hills Raceway in Gallipolis, Ohio-- to shut me up, I think, as much as to satisfy his curiosity about his hemophiliac brother racing a motorcycle across the gouged wilderness.
最后，他同意参加俄亥俄州加利波利斯隐山赛道的一场比赛——我想，是为了让我闭嘴，同时也是为了满足他对他的血友病兄弟骑摩托车穿越荒野的好奇心。
I knew John would have to wear a plastic bag over his shunt arm to keep the dust out.
我知道约翰必须在他的分流臂上戴一个塑料袋以防止灰尘进入。
We were lucky it rained.
我们很幸运，下雨了。
Dust usually billowed wildly after the start of a race, a huge rolling wave breaking over the hills and shrouding the spectators.
比赛开始后，灰尘通常会疯狂翻滚，巨大的滚滚波浪冲破山丘，笼罩观众。
Rain would keep the dirt moist and on the track.
雨水会使泥土保持湿润并保持在轨道上。
Midway through the practice sessions, however, the rain stopped.
然而，训练进行到一半时，雨停了。
By the time of the first 125 moto, dust forced John into the cab of the pickup.
到了第一辆 125 摩托车的时候，灰尘迫使约翰进入了皮卡车的驾驶室。
That is the image that attacks me now-- John in the truck, windows rolled up, reading a book to pass the time while I kicked up the dust all around him.
这就是现在袭击我的画面——约翰在卡车里，摇着车窗，看书打发时间，而我则踢起他周围的灰尘。
Random symmetries.
随机对称性。
Days when John's shunt clotted and he required I forget how many cc's of heparin to get his blood to stop coagulating.
约翰的分流器发生凝结，他需要注射多少毫升肝素才能让他的血液停止凝固。
Meanwhile, I'd start a bleed and would need cryoprecipitate or factor VIII to get my blood to clot.
与此同时，我会开始流血，需要冷沉淀或因子 VIII 来使我的血液凝结。
More x-rays.
更多 X 光检查。
I've stopped bleeding into the spinal muscles.
我已经停止了脊椎肌肉的出血。
Soon enough, my hematologist says my body will loosen and break down and absorb the hardened blood surrounding the spine, as it had been doing in my leg.
很快，我的血液科医生说我的身体会放松、分解并吸收脊柱周围硬化的血液，就像我腿上的情况一样。
There has been no intraspinal bleeding, no bleeding into the kidney or liver.
没有出现脊柱内出血，也没有出现肾脏或肝脏出血。
I look at Carrie.
我看着嘉莉。
I look at my mother and father.
我看着我的母亲和父亲。
We are inside a sudden, astonishing calm.
我们突然感到出奇的平静。
I seem to levitate and hover over the white sheets.
我似乎悬浮在白色的床单上。
[CLAPPING] Once when John was dialyzing, I tripped into the machine and jerked a tube clean out of its socket.
[鼓掌]有一次，当约翰进行透析时，我绊倒了机器，并从插座中猛地拔出了一根干净的管子。
John's blood pumped and sprayed into the air, splattering across the carpet and splotching our skin and clothes.
约翰的血喷涌而出，喷洒到空中，溅落在地毯上，弄脏了我们的皮肤和衣服。
My mother worked frantically to reconnect the tube and to stabilize John's blood pressure.
我母亲疯狂地重新连接管子并稳定约翰的血压。
Later, I noticed that some of the blood had seeped inside a picture frame in the wall besides the dialysis chair.
后来我发现透析椅旁边墙上的一个相框里有一些血渗进去了。
The frame held a photograph of John and me.
相框上有一张约翰和我的照片。
We were wading in the Kanawha River, staring hard at the gray water.
我们在卡纳瓦河中涉水，凝视着灰色的河水。
[CLAPPING] Ira Glass Excerpts from Tom Andrews' prose poem "Codeine Diary." It's in his book The Hemophiliac's Motorcycle and was read by Frank Melcori.
[鼓掌]艾拉·格拉斯 摘自汤姆·安德鲁斯的散文诗《可待因日记》。弗兰克·梅尔科里（Frank Melcori）读过他的书《血友病患者的摩托车》（The Hemophiliac's Motorcycle）。
Act Three, Iron Man.
第三幕，钢铁侠。
All of our stories today have been at one level about yearning briefly fulfilled.
我们今天所有的故事都在一定程度上是关于短暂实现的渴望。
And we thought this last story would be a perfect way to end this show.
我们认为最后一个故事将是结束这部剧的完美方式。
Mark O'Brien is a writer living in California, but because of a childhood case of polio, he lives most of each day in an iron lung, on his back.
马克·奥布莱恩是一位居住在加利福尼亚州的作家，但由于童年时患有小儿麻痹症，他每天大部分时间都生活在铁肺里，仰卧着。
He's the subject of the documentary film Breathing Lessons by Jessica Yu.
他是杰西卡·余 (Jessica Yu) 拍摄的纪录片《呼吸课》的主角。
The film is remarkable because it's about a guy in an iron long, but it is completely unsentimental.
这部电影之所以引人注目，是因为它讲述了一个穿着长裤的男人的故事，但它完全不带感情色彩。
There are even parts where it's funny.
甚至有些部分很有趣。
This is a brief scene from the film.
这是电影中的一个简短场景。
Because he's in the iron lung, Mark O'Brien has attendants.
因为马克·奥布莱恩在铁肺里，所以他有随从。
They cook and they help him out during the day.
他们做饭，白天帮他干活。
And during the film, he explains that nowadays he always has men do this job.
在电影中，他解释说现在他总是让男人做这项工作。
Because back when he had women do the job, he kept falling in love with these women, and the love was never reciprocated.
因为当他让女人做这份工作时，他一直爱上这些女人，而这种爱却从未得到回报。
He wrote about one of these women, "Her pale, perfect skin, her strong, fleshy legs drove me to ecstasies of despair.
他在描述其中一位女性时写道：“她苍白、完美的皮肤，她强壮、肉质的双腿让我陷入绝望的狂喜之中。
See, she talked to me as a human instead of her savagely crippled employer."
看，她把我当作一个人而不是她那残暴残废的雇主来跟我说话。”
A quick warning before I play this very brief scene.
在播放这个非常简短的场景之前，先快速警告一下。
It contains mild sexual content that may not be suitable for every listener.
它包含轻微的色情内容，可能并不适合每个听众。
[IRON LUNG RESPIRATION] Mark O'Brien I hired a sex-surrogate in-- '87 or '86.
[铁肺呼吸] 马克·奥布莱恩 (Mark O'Brien) 我在 87 年或 86 年雇用了一位性别代理人。
I forget when.
我忘记什么时候了。
I just-- felt very crazy.
我只是——感觉非常疯狂。
I was-- angry at all women for not falling in love-- with me, because I had fallen in love with several-- attendants.
我对所有没有爱上我的女人感到愤怒，因为我爱上了几个服务员。
And they-- all said it was a business rela-- tionship.
他们都说这是一种业务关系。
A sex surrogate's a person who has some of psychological training that-- works with their body, having sex with a client who's recruited by a therapist.
性代理人是接受过一些心理训练的人——与他们的身体一起工作，与治疗师招募的客户发生性关系。
The surrogate had this big mirror and she-- saw me naked and aroused.
代理人有一面大镜子，她看到我赤身裸体，兴奋不已。
And-- at the time, I thought I was the ugliest man in the world.
而且——当时，我认为我是世界上最丑的男人。
I looked just like something someone-- wouldn't want to have sex with.
我看起来就像是某个人——不想与之发生性关系的人。
And Cheryl was very kind to me.
谢丽尔对我很好。
She kissed me on the chest after-- we had intercourse.
我们发生性关系后，她吻了我的胸口。
I felt my-- chest was very unattractive, but-- she kissed me right there.
我觉得我的——胸部很不好看，但是——她就在那里吻了我。
And-- the intercourse was so quick, it just-- I hate to say it, but it was wham, bam, thank you ma'am.
而且——性交是如此之快，只是——我不想这么说，但那是砰的一声，砰，谢谢你，女士。
And it-- wasn't as great as I thought it would be, but-- being naked in a bed with a woman who's being extremely friendly was the-- most fun I've ever had.
它——没有我想象的那么好，但是——和一个非常友好的女人赤身裸体地躺在床上是我经历过的最有趣的事情。
I think I'd like to do it again.
我想我还想再做一次。
Usually Mark O'Brien can't be outside of his iron lung for more than 45 minutes.
通常马克·奥布莱恩在铁肺之外的时间不能超过 45 分钟。
But when the sex surrogate was with him, he was outside his tube for longer than that, longer than he almost every goes out.
但当性代理人和他在一起时，他在管外的时间比这更长，比他几乎每次出去的时间都长。
And he didn't even use his portable respirator.
他甚至没有使用他的便携式呼吸器。
I didn't need it for an hour.
我一个小时都不需要它。
I went for-- an hour without it.
我走了一个小时，没有看到它。
It makes you think of sex as respiratory-- therapy.
它让你将性视为呼吸疗法。
Maybe Medi-Cal would pay for it.
也许 Medi-Cal 会支付费用。
About a year after I last saw her, I just felt terribly depressed.
我上次见到她大约一年后，我感到非常沮丧。
I expected somehow that seeing the surrogate would change my life.
我希望看到代孕妈妈会以某种方式改变我的生活。
I had started wearing cologne.
我开始喷古龙水。
And I thought everyone would be able to tell if I was sexy and handsome.
我以为每个人都能看出我是否性感和帅气。
Nothing happened.
什么也没发生。
They tell us to think of ourselves as-- sexual and beautiful, but it doesn't do any good-- unless someone else sees us as sexual and beautiful.
他们告诉我们要认为自己性感且美丽，但这没有任何好处，除非别人认为我们性感且美丽。
You just can't demand love.
你只是不能要求爱。
You-- have to be lovable, and-- I'm still trying to figure out how to do that.
你——必须是可爱的，而且——我仍在努力弄清楚如何做到这一点。
Mark O'Brien in Jessica Yu's film, Breathing Lessons.
马克·奥布莱恩在杰西卡·余的电影《呼吸课》中。
O'Brien has a new book of poems called The Man in the Iron Lung published by the Lemonade Factory in Berkeley.
奥布莱恩有一本新诗集，名为《铁肺里的人》，由伯克利柠檬水工厂出版。
Well, our program was produced today by Alix Spiegel and myself, with Nancy Updike and Julie Snyder.
嗯，我们今天的节目是由阿利克斯·斯皮格尔和我本人以及南希·厄普代克和朱莉·斯奈德制作的。
Contributing editors Paul Tough, Sarah Vowell, Jack Hitt, and Margy Rochlin.
特约编辑 Paul Tough、Sarah Vowell、Jack Hitt 和 Margy Rochlin。
[ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS] Music help, as always, from Sarah Vowell.
[致谢] 莎拉·沃威尔一如既往地提供音乐帮助。
To buy a tape of this program, call us at WBEZ in Chicago, 312-832-3380.
要购买该节目的磁带，请致电芝加哥的 WBEZ，电话：312-832-3380。
Our email address, [email protected] .
我们的电子邮件地址，[电子邮件受保护]。
This American Life is distributed by Public Radio International.
《美国生活》由国际公共广播电台发行。
[FUNDING CREDITS] WBEZ management oversight by Torey Malatia, who can be heard in his office every day, saying--
[资金来源] WBEZ 管理由 Torey Malatia 负责监督，每天都可以在他的办公室听到他说——
Don't you know who I am?
你不知道我是谁吗？
Who?
WHO？
What do you mean how come I'm on the phone?
你说我怎么会打电话？
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Back next week with more stories of This American Life .
下周我们将带来更多《美国生活》的故事。
This American Life is produced in collaboration with WBEZ Chicago and delivered to stations by PRX The Public Radio Exchange.
《This American Life》与 WBEZ Chicago 合作制作，并由 PRX 公共广播电台传送到各电台。