690: Too Close to Home - This American Life
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00:00 00:00 Transcript Share This American Life Life Partners How to Listen Episodes Recommended About Overview Staff Announcements Fellowships Jobs Music Make Radio On The Road FAQ Submissions Merch Contact Us Our Other Shows Merch Follow Us Life Partners Subscribe to our newsletter Full episode Toggle Audio and Transcript Sync Transcript | Episode #690 | December 27, 2019 690: Too Close to Home Note: This American Life is produced for the ear and designed to be heard.
00:00 00:00 文字记录 分享此 美国生活 生活伙伴 如何收听 剧集 推荐 关于 概述 员工公告 奖学金 工作 音乐 在路上制作电台 常见问题解答 提交 商品 联系我们 我们的其他节目 商品 关注我们 生活伙伴 订阅我们的时事通讯 整集 切换音频和文字记录同步 文字记录 | 内容第 690 集 | 2019 年 12 月 27 日 690：离家太近 注：《美国生活》是为耳朵而制作的，旨在让人们听到。
If you are able, we strongly encourage you to listen to the audio, which includes emotion and emphasis that's not on the page.
如果可以的话，我们强烈建议您收听音频，其中包括页面上没有的情感和重点。
Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors.
文字记录是使用语音识别软件和人工转录员结合生成的，可能包含错误。
Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print.
请在印刷版引用前检查相应的音频。
Prologue: Prologue Ira Glass A quick warning-- there are curse words that are unbeeped in today's episode of the show.
序言：序言 Ira Glass 一个快速警告——今天的节目中有些脏话没有发出提示音。
If you prefer a beeped version, you can find that at our website, thisamericanlife.org.
如果您更喜欢蜂鸣声版本，您可以在我们的网站 thisamericanlife.org 上找到该版本。
We're all getting kind of old in my family.
我们家里的人都变老了。
And when we get together for the holidays, there's never any drama anymore.
当我们假期聚在一起时，就再也不会发生任何戏剧性的事情了。
Used to be.
曾经是。
I avoided coming home for years all through my 20s and early 30s because my parents and I were not getting along so well.
在我20多岁和30出头的时候，我有好几年都不回家，因为我和父母相处得不太好。
Part of the problem was me.
部分问题出在我身上。
In my early 20s, I was harsh and judgey and said lots of things that now I wouldn't have said and have apologized for.
在我20岁出头的时候，我很严厉，爱评判，说了很多现在我不会说的话，并且已经道歉了。
But part of the problem was them.
但问题的一部分在于他们。
They did not agree with most of my big life choices, starting with and especially the fact that I worked in public radio.
他们不同意我大部分人生的重大选择，尤其是我在公共广播电台工作这一事实。
During that period, I was working for the NPR news shows, All Things Considered and Morning Edition.
在那段时间，我为 NPR 新闻节目《All Things Thought》和《Morning Edition》工作。
And my parents were completely against it.
我的父母完全反对。
I've said this before-- and my parents hate it when I say this-- but my parents are the only Jews in America who don't like public radio.
我以前说过这句话——我的父母讨厌我这么说——但我的父母是美国唯一不喜欢公共广播的犹太人。
The stories are too long.
故事太长了。
It seemed second rate to them.
这对他们来说似乎是二流的。
If I wanted to be a journalist, why wasn't I on TV?
如果我想成为一名记者，为什么我不上电视呢？
Why was I settling for this place that paid me so little?
为什么我要选择这个薪水这么低的地方？
The money was a huge thing.
钱是一件大事。
My dad is an accountant, does all our taxes, and so he knew what I made and couldn't quite believe it.
我爸爸是一名会计师，负责我们所有的税，所以他知道我做了什么，但不太相信。
I could still earn a good living somewhere.
我仍然可以在某个地方过上好的生活。
I could still be a doctor.
我仍然可以成为一名医生。
So coming home for the holidays, sometimes my dad would pull me aside.
所以放假回家，有时爸爸会把我拉到一边。
Sometimes he would bring it up during dinner at a crowded table.
有时他会在餐桌上拥挤的餐桌上提起这件事。
Shouldn't I quit these jobs I love and finally go to med school?
难道我不应该辞掉这些我喜欢的工作并最终去医学院吗？
It's not too late, my parents pleaded with me well into my 30s.
现在还不算太晚，我的父母在我三十多岁时恳求我。
My mom officially, kind of half joking, half serious, gave up the effort when I was 41 and had been hosting This American Life for five years.
我妈妈正式半开玩笑半认真地在我 41 岁时放弃了这一努力，并且已经主持《美国生活》五年了。
But for so long, my dad especially would express his love and concern for me when I came home by questioning the basics-- where I lived, how I lived, how I dressed, how my hair looked, who I fell in love with, why wasn't I more of a success.
但长期以来，当我回家时，我的父亲尤其会通过询问一些基本问题来表达他对我的爱和关心——我住在哪里，我如何生活，我如何穿着，我的头发看起来如何，我爱上了谁，为什么我没有更成功。
To be clear, he wasn't mean.
需要明确的是，他并不刻薄。
He wasn't angry.
他没有生气。
He was just very, very concerned.
他只是非常非常担心。
My sisters, Randi and Karen, they got their own versions of this.
我的姐妹兰迪和凯伦对此有自己的版本。
So holidays, yeah, things would get very tense.
所以假期，是的，事情会变得非常紧张。
Which is to say, we were a normal family.
也就是说，我们本来就是一个普通的家庭。
But now, it couldn't be more different.
但现在，情况完全不同了。
My mom died over a decade ago.
我妈妈十多年前去世了。
My dad's in his 80s.
我爸爸80多岁了。
In the last couple years, he's had a lot of hearing loss.
在过去的几年里，他的听力严重受损。
It's harder to interact with him.
和他交往比较困难。
He is not the critical, questioning man he once was.
他不再是以前那样挑剔、爱质疑的人了。
I go home now, and nothing's bothering him about me that he needs to get off his chest.
我现在回家了，没有任何事情让他烦恼我需要他倾诉。
He's been trained over the years to say I love you when we talk on the phone or see each other.
多年来，他一直接受训练，当我们打电话或见面时，他会说我爱你。
And he actually seems to mean it.
他似乎确实是这么想的。
He's lovely.
他很可爱。
But I am not used to this milder, gentler version of the overworked, stressed out dad that I grew up with.
但我不习惯这个和我一起长大的、劳累过度、压力重重的父亲，他的态度温和、温和。
It's like that guy-- I don't know-- dissolved away that whole side of his personality, leaving another man standing there.
就好像那个人——我不知道——溶解了他性格的整个一面，留下另一个人站在那里。
And I have to say-- this is bad to admit-- sometimes I miss that other guy.
我不得不说——承认这一点很糟糕——有时我想念另一个人。
I go home for the holidays, and it's chill and everybody gets along.
我回家过节，天气很冷，每个人都和睦相处。
And I never thought I'd say this-- I swear I never thought these words would come out of my mouth-- I wish he would pick a fight with me.
我从来没想过我会这么说——我发誓我从来没想过这些话会从我嘴里说出来——我希望他会跟我吵架。
I feel like that's my real dad.
我感觉那是我真正的爸爸。
This elderly guy with the same name, who likes and accepts the person that I'm in love with and, in fact, notices if she leaves her glasses in the dining room and then helpfully brings them to her in the kitchen just to be nice, that guy, he's awesome.
这个同名的老人，喜欢并接受我所爱的人，事实上，他会注意到她是否把眼镜落在餐厅里，然后在厨房里帮忙把眼镜拿给她，只是为了表现得好，那个家伙，他很棒。
But where's my real dad?
但我真正的父亲在哪里？
And this BS of going home for the holidays and not having anything to fight about at all, I mean, are our lives over?
回家过节，没有任何可争吵的废话，我的意思是，我们的生活就结束了吗？
Are we already dead?
我们已经死了吗？
That's it?
就是这样？
We're done?
我们完成了吗？
No fighting?
没有战斗吗？
Are we really a family anymore?
我们真的还是一家人了吗？
Today, on our program, we have families boisterously, noisily getting into it with each other, kids coming home with important stuff they've been waiting to get off their chests, parents showing up at their grown children's houses with demands that absolutely need to be met, and then let the games begin.
今天，在我们的节目中，我们的家庭彼此喧闹，吵吵闹闹，孩子们带着他们一直在等待的重要东西回家，父母带着绝对需要满足的要求出现在他们成年孩子的家里，然后让游戏开始。
For the holidays, it is a family get-together episode of our show, including a song sung at a family event that either is or is not a veiled critique of one family member in particular.
对于假期，这是我们节目的家庭聚会剧集，其中包括在家庭活动中演唱的一首歌曲，这首歌要么是或不是对某个家庭成员的隐晦批评。
From WBEZ Chicago, it's This American Life.
来自芝加哥 WBEZ 的《This American Life》。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Stay with us.
留在我们身边。
Act One, How Do I Say This?
第一幕，我该怎么说？
So we begin today with somebody returning to their family in the suburbs out in the far west in Canada, in Calgary, Alberta.
因此，我们从今天开始，有人回到加拿大最西部阿尔伯塔省卡尔加里郊区的家人身边。
And she is returning with a mission, something she needed to discuss in English, though the thing she wanted to discuss was a different language entirely.
她带着使命回来，她需要用英语讨论一些事情，尽管她想讨论的是完全不同的语言。
The person doing this is Scaachi Koul.
做这件事的人是斯卡奇·库尔（Scaachi Koul）。
Nine months ago, after 28 years of being alive, I finally started taking Hindi classes.
九个月前，在活了 28 年之后，我终于开始上印地语课程。
My parents are both from India, and they emigrated to Canada long before I was born.
我的父母都来自印度，他们早在我出生之前就移民到了加拿大。
They speak a number of languages, including Hindi, and their mother tongue, Kashmiri.
他们讲多种语言，包括印地语和他们的母语克什米尔语。
But there's no real textbook or organized class or Duolingo program for Kashmiri.
但克什米尔没有真正的教科书、有组织的课程或 Duolingo 项目。
Hindi proved to be the easiest one for me to learn.
事实证明，印地语是我最容易学的一种。
I'm not enjoying these lessons.
我不喜欢这些课程。
I've said aloud in class several times that I hate it.
我曾多次在课堂上大声说过我讨厌它。
I hate it because it's hard, harder than I expected.
我讨厌它，因为它很难，比我想象的还要难。
Because for some reason, I thought this language would come naturally.
因为出于某种原因，我认为这种语言会自然而然地出现。
And yet, for two hours every week, I meet my teacher and fellow classmate at a coffee shop in midtown Manhattan and learn how to greet someone, and tell them what I am presently eating, and that the cat is sitting in the big chair.
然而，每周我都会花两个小时在曼哈顿市中心的一家咖啡店见到我的老师和同学，学习如何向某人打招呼，告诉他们我现在在吃什么，还有那只猫坐在大椅子上。
Sometimes the cat is sitting on the little chair.
有时猫坐在小椅子上。
Learning to say that has cost me $1,150 thus far.
到目前为止，学会说这句话已经花费了我 1,150 美元。
I started these lessons on a whim.
我一时兴起开始了这些课程。
I knew for years that I wanted to do it, but I didn't give much thought as to why.
多年来我就知道我想这样做，但我并没有过多地思考为什么。
I assumed my parents would be happy about it.
我以为我的父母会对此感到高兴。
Not even just happy-- elated.
甚至不仅仅是高兴——兴高采烈。
My dad has said to me more than once, you're barely recognizable.
我爸爸不止一次对我说过，你快认不出来了。
When he says it, he means I'm not recognizable to him as the person he wanted me to be, the person who would never, for example, have married a white man much older than she is, or refused a career in medicine, or smoked at least 800 cigarettes.
当他这么说时，他的意思是他不认为我是他希望我成为的人，例如，我永远不会嫁给比她大得多的白人，或者拒绝从事医学事业，或者吸至少 800 支香烟。
But I don't know if my learning Hindi even matters to my parents, or how much.
但我不知道我学习印地语对我的父母是否重要，或者有多大。
I also don't know why they never made me learn it in the first place.
我也不知道为什么他们一开始就不让我学习。
So I went home to find out.
于是我就回家一探究竟。
Hey, Google.
嘿，谷歌。
Play something by Girija Devi.
播放 Girija Devi 的歌曲。
Here's a Spotify station featuring [INAUDIBLE] Devi.
这是一个以 [听不清] Devi 为特色的 Spotify 电台。
When I visit my parents, we don't usually do much more than sit together in the living room and alternate between joking and fighting.
当我去看望父母时，我们通常不会做太多事情，只是一起坐在客厅里，时而开玩笑，时而打架。
We're all indoor cats.
我们都是室内猫。
Hey, Google.
嘿，谷歌。
Scaachi Koul I recently got them a Google Home, foolishly thinking they'd delight in being able to boss it around.
Scaachi Koul 我最近给他们买了一个 Google Home，愚蠢地认为他们会很高兴能够掌控它。
They've had it for a day and have been characteristically hostile to it.
他们已经忍受了一天，并且对它抱有典型的敌意。
Yeah, you are buzzy.
是的，你很热闹。
Scaachi Koul She didn't say she was buzzy.
Scaachi Koul 她没说她很忙碌。
She said she was buggy.
她说她有马车。
What does that mean?
这意味着什么？
Scaachi Koul Like, she has a bug.
斯卡奇·库尔（Scaachi Koul） 就像，她有一个错误。
My parents have long converted my childhood bedroom into a sorry storage facility, but it's still home.
我的父母早已将我儿时的卧室改造成一个糟糕的储藏室，但它仍然是家。
There's nothing more comforting to me than my mom accusing an inanimate object of being against her.
没有什么比我妈妈指责一个无生命的物体反对她更让我安慰的了。
This thing is a racist because I keep telling play bhajan, and it doesn't play bhajan.
这东西是种族主义者，因为我一直告诉玩巴赞，但它不玩巴赞。
When the Google Home fails to play the devotional song my mom requests, she curses at it.
当 Google Home 无法播放我妈妈要求的虔诚歌曲时，她会咒骂它。
And I finally recognize one of the few Kashmiri words I know from my childhood.
我终于认出了我从小就知道的少数克什米尔语单词之一。
[KASHMIRI], as my mom said, is her saying that she hopes lightning hits the Google Home.
[克什米尔]，正如我妈妈所说，她希望闪电击中 Google Home。
The insults my parents use are the part of their language I absolutely know.
我父母使用的侮辱是我绝对了解的他们语言的一部分。
I can help you call someone lazy, dumb, loud, annoying, rude, ugly.
我可以帮助你称呼某人懒惰、愚蠢、大声、烦人、粗鲁、丑陋。
But the one I know best is [KASHMIRI].
但我最了解的是【克什米尔】。
You say it when you're mad or shocked or when someone's cooking is so excellent, you just can't help but want them to get hit by lightning.
当你生气或震惊时，或者当某人的厨艺如此出色时，你会情不自禁地希望他们被闪电击中。
My dad eventually gives up on trying to teach the Google Home Kashmiri and settles on something she knows.
我父亲最终放弃了教 Google Home 克什米尔语的尝试，转而选择了她知道的东西。
Hey, Google.
嘿，谷歌。
Play Frank Sinatra.
扮演弗兰克·西纳特拉。
You have to say please to her?
你必须对她说“请”吗？
No, she's a robot.
不，她是一个机器人。
I mean, it's nice, but it's not necessary.
我的意思是，这很好，但没有必要。
[MUSIC - "COME FLY WITH ME" BY FRANK SINATRA]
[音乐 - 弗兰克·辛纳屈的《跟我一起飞翔》]
That's my main man, isn't he?
这就是我的男主角，不是吗？
I should have a cigarette and a whiskey in one hand and a smoking jacket.
我应该一只手拿着一支香烟和一杯威士忌，穿着一件吸烟夹克。
It's 10:00 in the morning.
现在是上午 10:00。
Dad Who cares?
爸爸 谁在乎？
It's 10:00 PM somewhere.
某个地方现在是晚上 10:00。
Later that night, my mom hosts a party for my brother's 40th birthday.
那天晚上晚些时候，我妈妈为我哥哥 40 岁生日举办了一场聚会。
And she's cooked her usual dinner party spread-- the mallu, rogan josh, bhatta, haakh dripping in oil.
她还准备了她平常的晚宴菜品——滴着油的mallu、rogan josh、bhatta、haakh。
I have all these questions for my parents.
我有所有这些问题要问我的父母。
But first, I want to talk to my brother, the only other person in the world who understands what I'm getting myself into.
但首先，我想和我的兄弟谈谈，他是世界上唯一理解我陷入困境的人。
I call my brother 'Bhai,' meaning older brother.
我称我的兄弟为“Bhai”，意思是哥哥。
He's 12 years older than me and was born in India.
他比我大 12 岁，出生在印度。
Kashmiri is his first language, and though he understands it when it's spoken to him, he lost the ability to speak it himself soon after he moved to Canada as a toddler.
克什米尔语是他的母语，虽然他能听懂别人对他讲的语言，但在他还是个孩子的时候搬到加拿大后不久，他就失去了自己说克什米尔语的能力。
He doesn't remember anyone trying to get him to speak Kashmiri instead of English.
他不记得有人试图让他说克什米尔语而不是英语。
But nobody said anything to me, or maybe they did, and I just said, I just want to watch Three's Company.
但没有人对我说什么，或者也许他们说了，我只是说，我只是想看《三人为伴》。
Thank you very much.
非常感谢。
That is how my brother learned English-- reruns of Three's Company.
这就是我哥哥学习英语的方法——重播《三人行》。
Consequently, he has a very complex understanding of tenant protection rights.
因此，他对租客保护权有着非常复杂的理解。
My brother affirms one thing I remember to be true when we were kids.
我哥哥肯定了我小时候记得的一件事是真的。
It was deeply uncool to speak Hindi or Kashmiri.
说印地语或克什米尔语非常不酷。
We knew lots of Indian kids who spoke their parents' language.
我们认识很多说父母语言的印度孩子。
They were dutiful, good, polite, always saying, yes, Auntie [INAUDIBLE].
他们尽职尽责、善良、有礼貌，总是说，是的，阿姨[听不清]。
But we also knew that those kids were fucking dorks and worthy of our ire.
但我们也知道那些孩子都是他妈的傻瓜，值得我们愤怒。
We were never dutiful.
我们从来都不尽职尽责。
Back then, I envied my brother.
那时候我很羡慕我的弟弟。
He's fair-skinned with angular features and a phonetic name.
他皮肤白皙，五官棱角分明，还有一个拼音名字。
He could always hide in plain sight.
他总是能躲在众目睽睽之下。
I used to wish I could do the same.
我曾经希望我也能这样做。
My brother is married.
我哥哥结婚了。
He lives 20 minutes away from my parents.
他住在离我父母20分钟路程的地方。
And he has a nine-year-old daughter that I call Raisin.
他有一个九岁的女儿，我称之为葡萄干。
She is the best person in the world.
她是世界上最好的人。
Raisin is biracial.
葡萄干是混血儿。
Her mother is white, and she's light skinned with bright blue eyes.
她的母亲是白人，肤色浅，眼睛明亮。
She doesn't speak Hindi or Kashmiri, with the exception of naming her favorite foods.
她不会说印地语或克什米尔语，除了说出她最喜欢的食物的名字。
And even though my brother could do something about her slim language skills, he hasn't.
尽管我哥哥可以对她薄弱的语言能力做点什么，但他却没有。
Why haven't you put her in those classes?
你为什么不让她去那些班？
She doesn't want to do it.
她不想这样做。
Scaachi Koul Yeah, but she's nine.
Scaachi Koul 是的，但她九岁了。
She doesn't want to do anything.
她什么都不想做。
I don't think she wants to wash her butt.
我认为她不想洗屁股。
Like--
就像——
But I don't want to-- I also don't-- I'm super lazy.
但我不想——我也不想——我超级懒。
So if it's like the reality is driving to the [INAUDIBLE] at 8:30 on a Sunday, that's not going to happen.
因此，如果现实是周日 8:30 开车去[听不清]，那就不会发生。
I can barely get her to go to karate, something she is interested in.
我几乎无法让她去学她感兴趣的空手道。
As for my brother, he's not likely to sign up for a class himself, despite having the urge, just like I do.
至于我的兄弟，尽管有这种冲动，但他不太可能自己报名参加课程，就像我一样。
Do I think about practicing?
我考虑练习吗？
Yeah, all the time.
是的，一直如此。
But I just don't.
但我就是不这样做。
(LAUGHING) Why not?
（笑）为什么不呢？
Brother I don't because our parents are merciless when you try to learn something new, and I'm not interested in giving them more fodder for jokes.
兄弟，我不这样做，因为当你尝试学习新东西时，我们的父母是无情的，而且我没有兴趣给他们更多的笑话素材。
What do you mean that they're merciless about--
你说他们无情是什么意思——
Have you ever tried to speak a language that they know in front of them?
您是否尝试过在他们面前说一种他们懂得的语言？
That doesn't mean anything to me, but OK.
这对我来说没有任何意义，但好吧。
Do you think that we turned out the way he wanted, that he'd-- like when he--
你认为我们会按照他想要的方式发展吗？他会——喜欢当他——
If we didn't turn out the way our dad wanted us to, well, my dad bears a lot of responsibility for that.
如果我们没有成为父亲希望的那样，那么，我父亲对此负有很大的责任。
For one thing, instead of forcing us to learn Hindi, he made us learn French.
一方面，他没有强迫我们学习印地语，而是让我们学习法语。
Why instead of making me take Hindi classes at the temple, did you decide, oh, I know, I'm going to put them in French immersion for some reason?
为什么你不让我在寺庙上印地语课程，而是决定，哦，我知道，出于某种原因我要让他们沉浸在法语中？
Because Canada is a bilingual country.
因为加拿大是双语国家。
And I was hoping that the Hindi would come automatically because at home and other Indians.
我希望印地语会自动出现，因为在家里和其他印度人。
My dad is loquacious and wry and thinks he's the smartest person in the room.
我爸爸很健谈，爱挖苦人，他认为他是房间里最聪明的人。
He's also stubborn as hell, and so am I, which means we're often trying to murder each other.
他也很顽固，我也是，这意味着我们经常试图谋杀对方。
After I first got together with the man who would become my husband, the way older white guy, my dad didn't talk to me for a year.
在我第一次和后来成为我丈夫的男人在一起后，一个年长的白人，我父亲有一年没有和我说话。
When I first asked him how he feels about me taking these classes, he's his typical self-- dismissive and glib.
当我第一次问他对我参加这些课程有何感想时，他表现出典型的自我轻视和油嘴滑舌。
What did you think when I started taking the Hindi classes?
当我开始上印地语课程时，你有什么想法？
I was amused.
我被逗乐了。
Since you do whatever you want to do, I thought maybe, OK, good.
既然你做任何你想做的事，我想也许，好吧，很好。
What does that mean, I do whatever I want to do?
我做我想做的事是什么意思？
Because you are a very independent-minded person.
因为你是一个非常有独立思想的人。
You do not take any instruction or anything.
你不接受任何指示或任何东西。
So I was glad that at least you are doing something for your betterment.
所以我很高兴至少你正在为自己的进步做一些事情。
Because, like I said, having knowledge of another language can never hurt you.
因为，就像我说的，掌握另一种语言永远不会伤害你。
Don't be fooled by his detached attitude about whether I speak Hindi.
不要被他对我是否会说印地语的超然态度所迷惑。
He has other feelings as well, depending on the day.
根据当天的情况，他还有其他感觉。
He used to get upset about it.
他曾经为此感到不安。
When I was younger, sometimes he would speak to me in Kashmiri and quickly get frustrated that I could barely understand it and couldn't respond.
当我年轻的时候，有时他会用克什米尔语对我说话，但很快我就因为我几乎听不懂并且无法回应而感到沮丧。
He gave that up after I moved out.
我搬出去后他就放弃了。
But ever since I started my Hindi classes, he's trying again.
但自从我开始印地语课程后，他又开始尝试了。
Now when I call my mother, he'll barge into our calls and demand that she speak to me in Hindi and Kashmiri.
现在，当我打电话给我母亲时，他会闯入我们的电话并要求她用印地语和克什米尔语与我交谈。
I had to ask him the same question over and over again before he finally admits that, yes, he's absolutely thrilled at the idea of me learning Hindi.
在他最终承认，是的，他对我学习印地语的想法感到非常兴奋之前，我不得不一遍又一遍地问他同样的问题。
And hopefully, one day, you will converse with somebody in Hindi.
希望有一天，您能与某人用印地语交谈。
And you should go to India.
你应该去印度。
I'll go with you, but let you lead so that you can speak with taxi drivers or auto rickshaw drivers or shopkeepers, and try to haggle with them in Hindi.
我和你一起去，但让你带路，这样你就可以和出租车司机、人力车司机或店主交谈，并尝试用印地语与他们讨价还价。
I bet you it'll be hilarious.
我敢打赌，这会很搞笑。
It'll be wonderful.
这会很棒的。
Were you surprised that I started taking lessons?
我开始上课你感到惊讶吗？
Yeah, I was.
是的，我是。
Because you were-- both you kids were extremely whitewashed.
因为你们——你们两个孩子都被彻底洗白了。
Maybe I had something to do with it.
也许我和这件事有关。
I didn't purposely do that.
我不是故意这样做的。
Exactly what my dad had to do with that goes all the way back to his arrival in Canada.
我父亲与这件事的确切关系可以追溯到他抵达加拿大时。
This is who my dad was when me and my brother were kids-- 125 pounds, 5 foot 4, ambitious, and working hard as a pharmaceutical representative.
这就是我和我哥哥小时候的父亲——体重 125 磅，身高 5 英尺 4 英寸，雄心勃勃，作为一名制药代表而努力工作。
It was all so we would eventually have all you could ever want-- house, two cars, a yard, university educations.
这一切都是为了我们最终能拥有你想要的一切——房子、两辆车、一个院子、大学教育。
We were middle class in Canada, all with traditional Hindu names.
我们是加拿大的中产阶级，都有传统的印度教名字。
It was the Indian dream.
这是印度梦。
We didn't have much family near us in Calgary.
在卡尔加里，我们附近没有多少家人。
I didn't go to school with any other brown kids until I was well into high school.
直到我进入高中，我才和其他棕色人种的孩子一起上学。
My brother and cousin spoke to each other and me in English.
我的兄弟和表弟彼此和我用英语交谈。
My father had this idea that we'd pick up Hindi at home, but that's ridiculous.
我父亲有这样的想法：我们应该在家学习印地语，但这太荒谬了。
My parents spoke Kashmiri and English.
我的父母说克什米尔语和英语。
Hindi was reserved for Bollywood movies and when my mom needed to speak to her jeweler.
印地语是为宝莱坞电影以及我妈妈需要与她的珠宝商交谈时保留的。
What form of osmosis is my dad even talking about?
我爸爸所说的渗透是什么形式？
I thought that this language, mother tongue specifically, would come a little later on.
我认为这种语言，特别是母语，会稍后出现。
And I should concentrate on you being totally assimilated with the Canadian culture, if you will, whatever that culture is.
我应该集中精力让你完全融入加拿大文化，如果你愿意的话，无论这种文化是什么。
But somehow I should have created some sort of infrastructure where you would be-- you would learn and be at least proficient in one of the languages-- Indian languages, that is.
但不知何故，我应该创建某种基础设施，让你可以学习并至少精通其中一种语言，即印度语言。
Well, why didn't you make me take lessons for either Hindi or Kashmiri?
那么，你为什么不让我上印地语或克什米尔语课程呢？
I don't know.
我不知道。
I don't know why.
我不知道为什么。
I ought to have done it.
我应该这么做的。
I don't think my dad is equipped to directly talk about how hard it was to leave India.
我认为我父亲没有能力直接谈论离开印度有多么困难。
My mom can talk about her sadness easily, as if all those feelings are still right at the surface of her skin, waiting to bleed out of her and drown me.
我妈妈可以轻松地谈论她的悲伤，就好像所有这些感觉仍然在她的皮肤表面，等待着从她身上流血并淹没我。
I had to say goodbye to my dad and my mother.
我不得不和我的爸爸和妈妈说再见。
That was very hard.
那是非常困难的。
That was really, really hard.
那真的非常非常难。
My dad was the family's sole breadwinner, and in her early days in Canada, my mother was alone a lot with my brother, just a toddler.
我的父亲是家里唯一的养家糊口的人，在我母亲刚到加拿大的时候，她经常独自和我的弟弟在一起，而我的弟弟只是一个蹒跚学步的孩子。
She noticed he was losing his Kashmiri three or four months after they arrived.
她注意到他们到达三四个月后，他就失去了克什米尔语。
And I would talk to him in Kashmiri, and he would answer me in English.
我会用克什米尔语与他交谈，他会用英语回答我。
And I said, OK, this is it.
我说，好吧，就这样了。
He's not going to say anything back now.
他现在不会再说什么了。
And I would push him and say it in Kashmiri, and he would say it in English.
我会催促他用克什米尔语说，他也会用英语说。
He would not say in Kashmiri.
他不会用克什米尔语说。
So then why didn't you push him to keep it up?
那你为什么不督促他坚持下去呢？
Well, how can you make him do-- push-- how can you make him to speak?
好吧，你怎样才能让他做——推——你怎样才能让他说话？
When bhai got a little older, my mother and father considered signing him up for Hindi classes.
当 bhai 长大一点时，我的父母考虑让他报名参加印地语课程。
And it turns out their reason for not doing so is the exact same practical, yet lazy one my big brother gives about Raisin.
事实证明，他们不这样做的原因与我哥哥关于葡萄干时给出的实际但懒惰的原因完全相同。
Papa said Sunday morning, I don't want to get up at 10 o'clock and take him to Hindi school.
爸爸周日早上说，我不想十点起床带他去印地语学校。
That was only because Hindi schools, that's what the timing.
那只是因为印地语学校，这就是时机。
Sunday's the only day when I had my day off.
周日是我唯一休息的一天。
And I was not that confident driving that time on the Deerfoot in wintertime.
那次在冬天驾驶鹿脚车时我并没有那么自信。
So that's all.
就这样。
Fell apart.
崩溃了。
My mother says that years later, they actually put me in Hindi classes.
我母亲说，几年后，他们实际上让我参加了印地语课程。
I was maybe five then.
那时我大概五岁。
She says that I'd wander out of class, which was held in the basement of our [INAUDIBLE], and would trot up the stairs to find her.
她说我会在我们的[听不清]的地下室里走出教室，然后小跑上楼梯去找她。
I don't remember this at all.
我根本不记得这个了。
They stopped trying to force it.
他们不再试图强迫它。
At the time, I'm sure I was thrilled that they left it alone.
当时，我确信我很高兴他们不去管它。
I pushed against brownness in every way I could.
我尽我所能地反对棕色。
I recoiled when my white friends would call and overhear my parents speaking Kashmiri in the background.
当我的白人朋友打电话并无意中听到我的父母在背景中说克什米尔语时，我会退缩。
I didn't want to invite them over because they could smell sandalwood in the curtains.
我不想邀请他们过来，因为他们可以闻到窗帘里的檀香味。
I resented my unpronounceable first name and passively let people call me Sasha or Sara or Scratchy or Sushi or whatever examples of genteel racism were permeating my life.
我讨厌我难以发音的名字，被动地让人们叫我萨莎、莎拉、斯卡奇、寿司或任何渗透到我生活中的上流种族主义的例子。
Are you disappointed that I can't speak Kashmiri and I can't speak Hindi?
你对我不会说克什米尔语和不会说印地语感到失望吗？
I wouldn't say disappointed.
我不会说失望。
But I feel sad that it would have been nice.
但我感到难过，如果那样的话会很好。
Because sometimes if I want to tell you something, and I have to change the language, it loses its-- what I want to tell you.
因为有时如果我想告诉你一些事情，而我必须改变语言，它就会失去我想告诉你的东西。
So that time, I'm really frustrated.
所以那一次我真的很沮丧。
I say I wish she could understand what I'm trying to tell her.
我说我希望她能明白我想告诉她的话。
Sometimes I could see my mom struggling to find the right word to convey the right feeling.
有时我可以看到妈妈努力寻找合适的词来表达正确的感觉。
Has she always felt a gap between what she wanted to tell me and what I was able to grasp?
她是不是总觉得她想要告诉我的和我能掌握的之间有差距？
When I moved away for university, I worried my mom would be lonely.
当我搬去上大学时，我担心妈妈会感到孤独。
I resented that I worried about her.
我很怨恨我担心她。
But I wondered who my mom would talk to when I left home.
但我想知道当我离开家时，我妈妈会和谁说话。
I never considered that maybe the language we were speaking left her feeling lonely, before I even moved away.
在我搬走之前，我从未想过我们所说的语言可能让她感到孤独。
Did you want me and bhai to assimilate in Canada?
你想让我和 bhai 融入加拿大吗？
Yeah.
是的。
Scaachi Koul Did we assimilate too much?
Scaachi Koul 我们是不是同化太多了？
Well, I will say yes and no to that.
好吧，我对此会说是和否。
It would have been nice if a little bit stayed towards your heritage, towards your culture.
如果能稍微保留一下你的传统、你的文化，那就太好了。
But I guess it was supposed to happen, and there's nothing I can do about it.
但我想这是应该发生的，而我对此无能为力。
This idea from both of my parents makes me nuts.
我父母的这个想法让我发疯。
Of course there's something she could have done about it.
当然，她本可以做点什么。
I know that my parents made the best choices they had at the time.
我知道我的父母做出了当时最好的选择。
Now, though, I feel like I missed out on something that I desperately want.
但现在，我觉得我错过了我迫切想要的东西。
I wish I could have spoken to your mom when she was alive.
我希望当你妈妈还活着的时候我能和她说话。
I mean, did that-- did she say anything to you about that, that she couldn't speak to her grandchildren?
我的意思是，她有没有对你说过她不能和她的孙子们说话？
Yeah, she used to cry and cry and cry.
是的，她曾经哭过，哭过，哭过。
She says, I cannot speak to them, and they don't understand me.
她说，我无法和他们说话，他们也不理解我。
And I wish I could talk to them.
我希望我能和他们谈谈。
So it was hard.
所以这很难。
It was a shame that you guys couldn't talk to her.
很遗憾你们不能和她说话。
She would have been overwhelmed if you would say just a few words.
如果你只说几句话，她就会不知所措。
Now it is all gone, so it doesn't matter now.
现在一切都过去了，所以现在已经不重要了。
Anything else?
还要别的吗？
Of course there's something else.
当然还有别的事情。
There's always something else.
总有别的事情。
What are we making first?
我们首先要做什么？
Mom You said you wanted to see how we cook green beans, right?
你妈妈说你想看看我们怎么煮绿豆，对吧？
Yeah.
是的。
Cooking is the only place where I don't know the English equivalency of most words, evidenced by how many times I go to the grocery store and ask for amruth or elaichi, and struggle to name it in English.
烹饪是唯一一个我不知道大多数单词的英语对应词的地方，有多少次我去杂货店询问 amruth 或 elaichi，却很难用英语命名它，就证明了这一点。
In the kitchen, my pronunciation is flawless.
在厨房里，我的发音毫无瑕疵。
And for once, I don't feel like a fraud when I speak in Hindi or Kashmiri.
这一次，当我用印地语或克什米尔语说话时，我不再觉得自己是个骗子。
When I was a kid, I wouldn't even let my mom pack me Indian food for lunch.
当我还是个孩子的时候，我什至不让我妈妈给我带印度菜当午餐。
No one wants to be different in a grade school cafeteria.
没有人想在小学食堂里与众不同。
Then I moved away for university, and I realized all I wanted was my mom's cooking.
然后我搬去上大学，我意识到我想要的只是妈妈做的饭菜。
I wanted her to braid my hair and rub my back and wax my mustache off for me, all these blips of intimacy with her I once had.
我想让她帮我编辫子、帮我揉背、给我的胡子打蜡，所有这些都是我和她曾经有过的亲密时刻。
I've been learning how to make her food ever since.
从那时起我就开始学习如何给她做食物。
Why?
为什么？
Scaachi Koul I don't know.
斯卡奇·库尔 我不知道。
They get too salty.
它们变得太咸了。
Maybe you are putting too much salt.
也许你放的盐太多了。
Simple.
简单的。
Yeah, Mom, I know.
是的，妈妈，我知道。
God.
上帝。
How is that helpful?
这有什么帮助？
My Hindi, after a few months of lessons, is finally good enough that I can have slivers of conversations with my parents.
经过几个月的课程，我的印地语终于足够好，可以和父母进行一些对话了。
Recently, they visited me in New York.
最近，他们去纽约拜访了我。
And on a walk with my husband barely two feet ahead of us, my mother told me in Hindi, your husband has no butt.
当我和我丈夫一起散步时，我的丈夫只比我们领先两英尺，我母亲用印地语告诉我，你丈夫没有屁股。
One day, my parents will die.
有一天，我的父母会去世。
And when that happens, we'll all forget the insults and the sounds and the way my mom rolls her Rs.
当这种情况发生时，我们都会忘记侮辱、声音以及我妈妈滚动卢比的方式。
I can't even imagine how lonely I'll be without her sounds.
我什至无法想象如果没有她的声音我会多么孤独。
Maybe it'll hurt less if I learn how to make these sounds on my own.
如果我学会自己发出这些声音，也许伤害会减轻一些。
For now, I'm still stumbling over how to say "I love you" to my mother in her mother tongue.
现在，我还在纠结如何用妈妈的母语对她说“我爱你”。
Thank you.
谢谢。
Scaachi Koul My mom now tells me constantly how proud she is that I'm trying to learn Hindi.
Scaachi Koul 我妈妈现在经常告诉我，她为我正在努力学习印地语感到多么自豪。
More than anything, that's what keeps me going to class.
最重要的是，这就是我坚持上课的原因。
Scaachi Koul, she writes about culture for BuzzFeed News, and she's also the author of a collection of essays, One Day We'll All Be Dead and None of This Will Matter.
Scaachi Koul，她为 BuzzFeed News 撰写有关文化的文章，也是散文集《有一天我们都会死》和《一切都无关紧要》的作者。
[MUSIC - "DON'T LET ME BE MISUNDERSTOOD" BY NINA SIMONE]
[音乐 - NINA SIMONE 的《别让我被误解》]
Coming up, they didn't mean it.
来了，他们不是这个意思。
They really didn't mean it.
他们确实不是这个意思。
They really, really didn't mean it.
他们真的真的不是这个意思。
Right?
正确的？
That's what they say.
他们就是这么说的。
Mother and daughter, and the song they chose to sing at a very significant family event.
母亲和女儿，以及她们在一次非常重要的家庭活动中选择演唱的歌曲。
That's in a minute from Chicago Public Radio when our program continues.
芝加哥公共广播电台一分钟后我们的节目仍在继续。
It's This American Life.
这就是美国生活。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Each week on the program, of course, we choose a theme, bring you different kinds of stories on that theme.
当然，每周的节目我们都会选择一个主题，为您带来关于该主题的不同类型的故事。
Today's show, "Too Close to Home." For the holidays, stories of family get-togethers where somebody shows up with something they think the entire family has to deal with, or at least, discuss.
今天的节目是《离家太近》。假期里，家庭聚会的故事中，有人带着他们认为全家人必须处理或至少讨论的事情出现。
And they're ready to force the issue.
他们已经准备好强制解决这个问题。
We've arrived at Act Two of our program.
我们已经到了节目的第二幕了。
Act Two, You Probably Think This Song is About You.
第二幕，你可能认为这首歌是关于你的。
So in this act, two family members show up with a message.
因此，在这一幕中，两名家庭成员带着一条信息出现。
The message is contained in a song, which makes sense because the family includes a bunch of musicians.
该信息包含在一首歌中，这是有道理的，因为这个家庭有一群音乐家。
The dad in this family is Loudon Wainwright III, the songwriter who started putting out albums in the 1970s.
这个家庭的父亲是劳登·温赖特三世 (Loudon Wainwright III)，他是一位歌曲作家，于 20 世纪 70 年代开始发行专辑。
He is father to singer-songwriters Rufus Wainwright and Martha Wainwright, and with a different mom, Lucy Wainwright Roche.
他是创作型歌手鲁弗斯·温赖特和玛莎·温赖特的父亲，母亲是露西·温赖特·罗奇。
Lucy's mom is Suzzy Roche, who got some notoriety in the band The Roches.
露西的妈妈是苏兹·罗奇 (Suzzy Roche)，她在 The Roches 乐队中名声大噪。
Lucy and Suzzy came into the studio to tell the story of this song.
Lucy和Suzzy来到录音室讲述这首歌的故事。
We sang this one, actually, at one of my dad's weddings.
事实上，我们在我父亲的一场婚礼上唱过这首歌。
To be precise, her dad, Loudon, had gotten married for the second time.
准确地说，她的父亲劳登已经是第二次结婚了。
And this was a party to celebrate it, maybe 50 people.
这是一场庆祝活动，大概有 50 人。
Lucy went with her mom, Suzzy, who'd never been married to Loudon, but they were together for years.
露西和她的妈妈苏西一起去了，她从未与劳登结婚，但他们在一起很多年了。
And he asked us if we wanted to sing something, and we said, sure.
他问我们是否想唱点什么，我们说当然可以。
And then he was like, OK, well, pick whatever you feel like singing and surprise us.
然后他说，好吧，选你喜欢唱的歌，给我们一个惊喜。
And we'd been learning this song that was a cover song that we just really liked.
我们一直在学习这首歌，这是一首我们非常喜欢的翻唱歌曲。
And sometimes when you're learning a new song, you kind of have a little crush on the song, so you just want to sing it all the time.
有时当你学习一首新歌时，你有点迷恋这首歌，所以你只想一直唱它。
And so we were like, let's just do that new one that we've been learning.
所以我们就想，让我们来做我们一直在学习的新项目吧。
And we just didn't really think it through.
我们只是没有真正考虑清楚。
Yeah, I would say that that's an understatement.
是的，我想说这是轻描淡写的。
I don't know what we were thinking.
我不知道我们在想什么。
I mean, it was one of those kind of situations where you're standing in front of a roomful of people, and they all have their champagne glasses.
我的意思是，这是一种这样的情况，你站在一屋子的人面前，他们都拿着香槟杯。
And they're looking at you, smiling.
他们看着你，微笑着。
And you start to sing the song.
然后你开始唱这首歌。
And so just imagine that you're at a wedding, and--
想象一下你正在参加一场婚礼，然后——
Yeah, you're-- Suzzy Roche --these people are going to sing.
是的，你——Suzzy Roche——这些人要唱歌。
You got your champagne, and then this happens.
你喝了香槟，然后就发生了这种情况。
[MUSIC - "DESPERADO" BY LUCY WAINWRIGHT ROCHE AND SUZZY ROCHE]
[音乐 - 露西·温赖特·罗奇 (Lucy WAINWRIGHT ROCHE) 和苏兹·罗奇 (SUZZY Roche) 创作的《亡命之徒》]
Lucy Wainwright Roche (SINGING) Desperado, why don't you come to your senses?
露西·温赖特·罗奇（演唱） 亡命之徒，你为什么还不清醒过来？
You've been out riding fences for so long now.
你已经在栅栏外面骑了这么久了。
Well, you're a hard one.
嗯，你是个很难对付的人。
I know that you've got your reasons.
我知道你有你的理由。
These things that are pleasing you can hurt you somehow.
这些让你高兴的事情可能会以某种方式伤害你。
OK, so at this point, what are they thinking?
好吧，那么此时，他们在想什么？
I feel like as soon as you sing, "Desperado," people think, oh-- oh.
我觉得你一唱“亡命之徒”，人们就会想，哦——哦。
I bet more than anything, they felt like, what is happening right now?
我敢打赌，他们觉得，现在发生了什么？
[LAUGHS] Lucy Wainwright Roche Like, is this OK?
[笑] Lucy Wainwright Roche 就像，这样可以吗？
Is this a message?
这是一条消息吗？
Lucy Wainwright Roche It's a slightly hostile thing to sing at your father's wedding, or your ex's wedding.
露西·温赖特·罗奇（Lucy Wainwright Roche）：在你父亲的婚礼或你前任的婚礼上唱歌是一件有点敌意的事情。
But we were thinking, (SINGING) G, G7, C, C Minor.
但我们在想，（唱）G、G7、C、C 小调。
And basically concentrating on playing it, because I didn't know it that well.
基本上专注于玩它，因为我不太了解它。
OK, keep going.
好的，继续。
Lucy And Suzzy Roche (SINGING) Don't you draw the Queen of Diamonds.
露西和苏西·罗奇（演唱） 你不画钻石皇后吗？
She'll beat you if she's able.
如果她有能力的话，她会打败你的。
You know the Queen of Hearts is always your best bet.
您知道红心皇后始终是您的最佳选择。
Now it seems to me some fine things have been laid upon your table.
现在在我看来，一些好东西已经摆在你的桌子上了。
But you only want the ones that you can't get.
但你只想要那些你得不到的。
What do you think people thought at that point?
您认为当时人们会怎么想？
I think that is the most cringey line in the song.
我觉得这是这首歌里最虐心的一句。
In this context.
在此背景下。
Lucy Wainwright Roche Yes.
露西·温赖特·罗氏 是的。
Yeah.
是的。
"It seems to me some fine things have been laid upon your table, and you only want the ones that you can't get." I mean, that--
“在我看来，一些好东西已经摆在你的桌子上，而你只想要那些你得不到的东西。”我的意思是，那——
That seems rude.
这看起来很粗鲁。
You don't often hear a wedding toast that says like, and what I love about him is, lucky you.
你不会经常在婚礼祝酒词中听到这样的话，我喜欢他的是，你很幸运。
He never wants the things he can get.
他从不想要他能得到的东西。
That's not--
那不是——
No, I haven't heard that at a wedding.
不，我没在婚礼上听说过。
Weird.
诡异的。
No. I think that's the low point of what we've done here.
不，我认为这是我们所做的工作的最低点。
Let's go into the next verse.
让我们进入下一节。
"Oh, you ain't getting no younger."
“哦，你已经不再年轻了。”
Right.
正确的。
I would say this is the second to worst line of the song.
我想说这是这首歌中倒数第二句。
(SINGING) Desperado, oh, you ain't getting no younger.
（唱）亡命之徒，哦，你已经不再年轻了。
Your pain and your hunger are driving you home.
你的痛苦和饥饿正驱使你回家。
And freedom, oh, that's just some people talking.
还有自由，哦，那只是一些人的说法。
Your prison is walking through this world all alone.
你的监狱正在独自行走在这个世界上。
So how do you think people might have heard that?
那么你认为人们是如何听到这个消息的呢？
It is so sad.
太悲伤了。
Ira Glass Now the line, "You ain't getting no younger," how old was your dad?
艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass）：现在，“你不再年轻了”，你爸爸多大了？
So you're singing this, and you're looking around at the faces.
所以你一边唱着这首歌，一边环顾四周，看着人们的脸。
What are you seeing?
你看到什么了？
It didn't feel like it was the most well-received thing we'd ever done.
感觉这不是我们做过的最受好评的事情。
Yeah, I mean, there was a kind of a feeling of being looked at without a lot of expression, which is sometimes not a great sign.
是的，我的意思是，有一种被人看着但没有太多表情的感觉，这有时不是一个好兆头。
[LAUGHS]
[笑]
I think they were probably thinking a thought that I think a lot when something happens that is uncomfortable.
我认为当发生令人不舒服的事情时，他们可能正在思考我经常思考的想法。
And when something like that is happening, like, just make the right kind of face right now.
当类似的事情发生时，就像，现在就做出正确的表情。
[LAUGHS] And maybe this will be over soon.
[笑]也许这很快就会结束。
Yes.
是的。
Like, just make sure your face is right.
就像，只要确保你的脸是正确的。
I mean, the truth of it is that nobody has ever mentioned it again to us.
我的意思是，事实是没有人再向我们提起过这件事。
What did he say afterwards?
他后来说什么了？
Lucy Wainwright Roche Nothing.
露西·温赖特·罗奇 什么也没有。
Did he say thank you?
他有说谢谢吗？
Suzzy Roche No. Not really, no.
Suzzy Roche 不。不完全是，不。
The horrible thing about this is that people must have felt like we were doing something passive aggressive, or aggressive maybe.
可怕的是，人们一定会觉得我们在做一些被动攻击性的事情，或者可能是攻击性的事情。
Right.
正确的。
And the sad thing is we were completely oblivious.
可悲的是我们完全忘记了。
And I know that that probably sounds like maybe it's not true, and unconsciously, we had some sort of thing we were doing.
我知道这听起来可能不是真的，而且在不知不觉中，我们正在做一些事情。
Perhaps, but it didn't feel like that at all.
也许吧，但根本没有那样的感觉。
But I think then after that, a couple years later when we first performed this song in a show, I might have said to the audience for the first time, oh, actually, we sang this once at my dad's wedding.
但我想在那之后，几年后，当我们第一次在节目中表演这首歌时，我可能第一次对观众说，哦，实际上，我们在我爸爸的婚礼上唱过一次。
And then the absurdity of that really hit us.
然后这件事的荒谬性确实让我们震惊了。
Right, and also the song kind of turns into a comedy, instead of the beautiful song that it is.
是的，这首歌也变成了喜剧，而不是它本来的美丽歌曲。
Let's hear a recording from one of those concerts.
让我们听听其中一场音乐会的录音。
It's weird that you can get a song like this to play as comedy.
很奇怪你能把这样的歌曲当作喜剧来播放。
I mean, people get hysterical when they hear it in that context, which makes it obvious that there was something strange about it.
我的意思是，当人们在这种情况下听到它时，他们会变得歇斯底里，这显然表明它有一些奇怪的地方。
(SINGING) Now it seems to me some fine things have been laid upon your table.
（唱）现在我觉得有些好东西已经摆在你的桌上了。
But you only want the ones that you can't get.
但你只想要那些你得不到的。
[LAUGHTER] Desperado, no, you ain't getting no younger.
[笑声]亡命之徒，不，你已经不再年轻了。
[LAUGHTER] Well, here's the other thing about it.
[笑声] 嗯，这是另一件事。
I don't know if I should say this, but I mean, on the one hand, it's a terrible thing to sing at a wedding and at that wedding.
我不知道我是否应该这么说，但我的意思是，一方面，在婚礼上唱歌是一件可怕的事情。
But on the other hand, it's kind of the perfect thing to sing at that wedding.
但另一方面，在婚礼上唱歌也是完美的选择。
I know.
我知道。
Ira Glass How do you mean it's the perfect thing to sing?
艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass）：你怎么说这首歌是最适合唱歌的？
Well, because you're basically-- the lyrics, if you really study them, are basically saying you've got to let somebody love you.
嗯，因为基本上，如果你认真研究歌词，你会发现基本上是在说你必须让别人爱你。
So you're saying, unconsciously maybe, it was the perfect pick for the wedding.
所以你可能在潜意识里说，这是婚礼的最佳选择。
Right, I'm starting to change my mind on this whole thing and say that, yes, of course we meant to sing this song.
是的，我开始改变对整件事的看法，并说，是的，我们当然想唱这首歌。
When I see what it's actually saying, what it says to me, if there is a subconscious message that we were aiming at Loudon-- or I'll speak for myself, me-- is just, I see you.
当我看到它实际上在说什么，它对我说了什么，如果有一个潜意识信息表明我们的目标是劳登——或者我自己来说，我——就是，我看到你了。
I see what you've been through, and I see your pain.
我看到你所经历的一切，我看到你的痛苦。
And we're happy for you that you've found somebody to be with.
我们为你感到高兴，因为你找到了可以在一起的人。
Suzzy and Lucy Roche.
苏西和露西·罗奇。
Their version of "Desperado" is on their album Mud and Apples.
他们的“Desperado”版本收录在专辑《Mud and Apples》中。
Lucy's most recent album is Little Beast.
露西的最新专辑是《Little Beast》。
I did, by the way, check with Loudon, Suzzy's ex and Lucy's dad, to see what he thought about "Desperado" as their choice of song at the party, since they really had no idea at all.
顺便说一下，我确实和苏西的前男友、露西的父亲劳登核实过，看看他对《亡命之徒》作为他们在聚会上选择的歌曲有何看法，因为他们真的根本不知道。
And Loudon told me he definitely remembered it.
劳登告诉我他肯定记得这件事。
Oh, yes.
哦是的。
Yes.
是的。
I remember thinking it was hilariously funny and ironic.
我记得当时我觉得这非常好笑而且具有讽刺意味。
And I thought it was a kind of really ironic, cool choice of a song to do.
我认为这是一种非常讽刺、很酷的歌曲选择。
[MUSIC - "WHAT ARE FAMILIES FOR?" BY LOUDON WAINWRIGHT III]
[音乐-“家庭有什么用？”作者：劳登·温赖特三世]
Music from Loudon Wainwright III, which brings us to Act Three of our show.
劳登·温赖特三世 (Loudon Wainwright III) 的音乐将我们带入节目的第三幕。
Act Three, Pigeons on a Plane.
第三幕，飞机上的鸽子。
So we have one more family member on a mission for you today, and this mission was made possible by a government official, a government official in Mexico, namely the Secretary of Migration in the Mexican state of Michoacán.
今天我们还有一位家庭成员为您执行任务，这项任务是由一位政府官员、墨西哥的一名政府官员、即墨西哥米却肯州的移民部长促成的。
And a little while back, this official, he started to hear that lots of elderly people in Mexico were dying without being able to see their kids.
不久前，这位官员开始听说墨西哥有很多老年人在无法见到自己的孩子的情况下濒临死亡。
Because their kids were living in the United States and were undocumented.
因为他们的孩子住在美国并且没有证件。
And the kids didn't have the papers to cross in and out of Mexico.
孩子们没有出入境墨西哥的证件。
The migration secretary wanted to help, and he set up a program to help these elderly Mexicans with families in the US get tourist visas.
移民部长想提供帮助，他设立了一个计划来帮助这些在美国有家人的墨西哥老人获得旅游签证。
They have special days at the US embassy for them to apply, buses to take them to the embassy.
他们在美国大使馆有特殊的日子供他们申请，还有巴士送他们去大使馆。
And then they organized these trips, these trips were they fly them to the United States en masse.
然后他们组织了这些旅行，这些旅行是他们集体飞往美国。
These elderly people get regular tourist visas with the same rules as any other tourist visas, but good for 10 years so that they can come and go and see their kids and grandkids in the US.
这些老年人获得的常规旅游签证与其他旅游签证的规则相同，但有效期为 10 年，这样他们就可以来美国看望自己的孩子和孙子。
You have to be 60 years old qualify for the program.
您必须年满 60 岁才有资格参加该计划。
And since 2017, over 9,000 people have come to the States this way.
自 2017 年以来，已有 9,000 多人通过这种方式来到美国。
Not one of them, we're told, has ever overstayed a visa.
我们被告知，他们中没有人曾经逾期居留。
Over a dozen other Mexican states have created their own versions of the program.
墨西哥其他十几个州也创建了自己的该计划版本。
In Michoacán, the elderly travelers are known as palomas mensajeras, the messenger pigeons.
在米却肯州，老年旅行者被称为“palomas mensajeras”，即信鸽。
Reporter Kevin Sieff tagged along on one of their trips.
记者凯文·西夫 (Kevin Sieff) 跟随他们进行了一次旅行。
He started in Mexico and flew to the US with them.
他从墨西哥出发，与他们一起飞往美国。
I'm standing with a group of 70 elderly palomas mensajeras.
我和一群 70 名老人站在一起。
They're all wearing matching T-shirts and have lanyards around their necks with these big clear pouches, holding their airport tickets and passports.
他们都穿着配套的 T 恤，脖子上挂着挂绳，还有这些大的透明袋子，里面装着机场机票和护照。
It looks like a giant group of really old schoolchildren.
它看起来就像一大群真正的老学童。
To make sure no one's wandered off, the chaperones take a roll call.
为了确保没有人走失，监护人会进行点名。
We're at a small airport in central Mexico.
我们在墨西哥中部的一个小机场。
The people in this group have some very specific things in common.
这个群体中的人有一些非常具体的共同点。
None of them has ever flown on an airplane before, and they're all headed to Chicago to see their kids for the first time in more than a decade.
他们以前都没有坐过飞机，现在他们都要去芝加哥看望他们的孩子，这是十多年来的第一次。
The biggest migration boom from Mexico happened in the 1990s, nearly 5 million people by the end of the decade.
墨西哥最大规模的移民热潮发生在 20 世纪 90 年代，到 20 世纪末已有近 500 万人。
The exodus was especially big in a city called Ciudad Hidalgo, where these parents are from.
在这些父母来自的一个名为伊达尔戈城的城市，外逃人数尤其多。
By 1998, roughly 10% of the city's population was living in Chicago.
到 1998 年，大约有 10% 的城市人口居住在芝加哥。
Today, the kids who cross the border as teenagers and 20 somethings are middle-aged undocumented immigrants with children of their own, US citizen children who've never met their grandparents.
如今，十几岁和二十几岁跨越边境的孩子都是中年无证移民，他们有自己的孩子，是从未见过祖父母的美国公民孩子。
Those are the grandparents I'm with now.
他们就是我现在和我在一起的祖父母。
They board the plane slowly, so slowly, as you'd expect on a flight where almost everyone is elderly, on canes and wheelchairs, and utterly unaccustomed to air travel.
他们慢慢地、非常缓慢地登上飞机，正如你所想象的那样，飞机上几乎每个人都是老人，拄着拐杖和轮椅，完全不习惯航空旅行。
Sort of chaotic now as everyone's boarding, a lot of confusion about where people are sitting.
现在大家都在登机，气氛有点混乱，人们对座位的位置很困惑。
This woman's asking, am I in the right seat?
这位女士问，我坐在正确的座位上吗？
Is this the right seat?
这是正确的座位吗？
She's actually in the wrong seat.
她实际上坐错座位了。
The parent I ended up talking to the most was a mom named Lupita Neri.
我最终交谈最多的家长是一位名叫露皮塔·内里（Lupita Neri）的妈妈。
At 67, she was one of the younger parents on the trip.
67 岁的她是这次旅行中最年轻的父母之一。
She sat in the front of the plane in a window seat, wearing a yellow dress and heels and bright pink lipstick.
她坐在飞机前部靠窗的座位上，穿着黄色连衣裙和高跟鞋，涂着亮粉色口红。
She's saying she expected the plane to move like a truck, but it didn't.
她说她预计飞机会像卡车一样移动，但事实并非如此。
Lupita's son, Daniel, and daughter, Marilu, have been in Chicago for almost 20 years.
Lupita 的儿子 Daniel 和女儿 Marilu 已经在芝加哥生活了近 20 年。
For you guys, you've only been able to talk over the phone.
对于你们来说，你们只能通过电话交谈。
Is there anything you've been waiting to talk to them about in person?
有什么事情是您一直在等待与他们亲自讨论的吗？
Well, I'm going to, of course, get there.
嗯，我当然要去那里。
And then I'm going to greet my children and my grandchildren.
然后我要向我的孩子和孙子们问好。
But then there are some things that we're going to have to talk about once we're at home, about what they are going to do.
但是，一旦我们回到家，我们就必须讨论一些事情，讨论他们要做什么。
Because I want my kids to come here to be with me.
因为我想让我的孩子们来这里和我在一起。
Because I'm all alone here.
因为我独自一人在这里。
[SPEAKING SPANISH] Kevin Sieff In fact, this was her mission for the trip.
[说西班牙语] Kevin Sieff 事实上，这就是她此行的使命。
Like parents everywhere, she wants to convince her children to move back home.
和世界各地的父母一样，她想说服孩子们搬回家。
For months, she'd been preparing what to say, practicing her pitch in the mirror.
几个月来，她一直在准备要说什么，对着镜子练习自己的表达方式。
[SPEAKING SPANISH] Interpreter Yeah, I mean, I actually will, like, talk to myself.
[说西班牙语] 口译员 是的，我的意思是，我实际上会喜欢自言自语。
I'll say, OK, well, are you going to stay here forever?
我会说，好吧，你要永远留在这里吗？
Or are you going to come back?
或者你会回来吗？
Because I've said this before, but Chicago isn't your homeland.
因为我以前说过，但芝加哥不是你的祖国。
This is your homeland.
这是你的祖国。
And you've already had the opportunity to enjoy Chicago, to work there, but now it's time to come back.
您已经有机会享受芝加哥并在那里工作，但现在是时候回来了。
So please come back so that you can be with me.
所以请回来，这样你就可以和我在一起了。
This won't be news to her kids.
这对她的孩子们来说不是什么新闻。
She's brought it up before.
她以前就提过。
How often do you bring it up over the phone?
您多久通过电话提起一次？
[SPEAKING SPANISH] Interpreter About three times a year.
[西班牙语] 口译员 每年大约 3 次。
I don't do it too much because I might get hung up on.
我不会做太多，因为我可能会被挂断。
It's very touchy to talk about that kind of stuff over the phone because my son, he'll get upset.
在电话里谈论这类事情非常敏感，因为我的儿子会感到不安。
And he says, well, Mom, if I'm earning money to help you, then if I come back there to be with you, how are we going to live?
他说，好吧，妈妈，如果我赚钱来帮助你，那么如果我回到那里和你在一起，我们将如何生活？
And I tell him, well, from your perspective, you're seeing it as something that's so impossible.
我告诉他，好吧，从你的角度来看，你认为这是不可能的事情。
But it's not.
但事实并非如此。
Save up some money over there so that you can come back here without needing to go back to the United States.
在那里存点钱，这样你就可以回到这里，而不需要回美国。
And yes, maybe we'll live humbly, and we'll be eating beans and eggs.
是的，也许我们会过着谦卑的生活，我们会吃豆子和鸡蛋。
But you'll at least be here in your home.
但你至少会在你的家里。
And my son says, well, I'll think about it, Mom.
我儿子说，好吧，我会考虑一下，妈妈。
I'll think about it.
我会考虑一下。
Like a lot of the parents I talked to, Lupita never expected Daniel and Marilu to be gone for so long, at most just a few years.
和我交谈过的许多父母一样，卢皮塔从未想到丹尼尔和玛丽卢会离开这么久，最多只有几年。
Save some money, and then come back to Mexico.
存点钱，然后回到墨西哥。
That was their original plan.
这是他们原本的计划。
Daniel even bought a calendar and penciled in the date when he would return.
丹尼尔甚至买了一本日历，并用铅笔记下了他回来的日期。
But they kept pushing back the deadline, telling her they needed to save more money.
但他们不断推迟最后期限，告诉她他们需要存更多的钱。
Then they had children and houses and dogs and friends.
然后他们有了孩子、房子、狗和朋友。
It got harder to leave.
离开变得更加困难。
Lupita was losing her patience.
露皮塔正在失去耐心。
She'd been living alone since her husband died four years ago of cancer.
自从她的丈夫四年前因癌症去世以来，她一直独自生活。
She wanted her kids with her.
她希望孩子们和她在一起。
Both of them have told me, Mom, just give me time.
他们俩都告诉我，妈妈，请给我时间。
Just give me time.
只要给我时间。
And I say, but I've already given you a lot of time.
我说，但我已经给了你很多时间。
Lupita had another son, Isaac, who moved to the US and died of pneumonia a few years ago.
卢皮塔还有另一个儿子艾萨克，他移居美国，几年前死于肺炎。
She never had the chance to say goodbye, even over the phone.
她从来没有机会说再见，即使是通过电话。
It made her feel like that could be her, dying without them.
这让她觉得那可能就是她，在没有他们的情况下死去。
She wanted the kids back now.
她现在想要孩子们回来。
Daniel was the first to leave Mexico, back in 1999.
丹尼尔是第一个离开墨西哥的人，时间早在 1999 年。
He got a job as a dishwasher and then kept working his way up to bartending at fancy restaurants.
他找到了一份洗碗工的工作，然后继续在高档餐厅担任调酒师。
Marilu joined Daniel in Chicago soon after.
不久之后，马里鲁在芝加哥加入了丹尼尔。
She was a single mom with five kids who needed more money for her family.
她是一位有五个孩子的单亲妈妈，需要更多的钱来养家糊口。
She took cleaning jobs in Chicago.
她在芝加哥从事清洁工作。
Now she works three jobs, including back-to-back night shifts, cleaning at a restaurant and a health clinic.
现在她打三份工，包括连续夜班、餐厅清洁工和诊所清洁工。
Lupita says when she's brought up coming home on the phone, she's been pretty gentle.
露皮塔说，当她在电话里长大时，她一直很温柔。
She thinks in person, it'll all be different.
她认为，如果是个人的话，一切都会有所不同。
She'll be more aggressive, and her kids will really have to hear her out.
她会变得更加咄咄逼人，她的孩子们真的必须听她说完。
Her plan was to wait until she'd been in Chicago for about a week before springing this conversation on them.
她的计划是等到她到芝加哥大约一周后才向他们发起这次谈话。
[SPEAKING SPANISH] Interpreter So you got to just wait till everything is calm.
[说西班牙语] 翻译 所以你必须等到一切平静下来。
Because if I do it immediately, then it'll be like dumping a bucket of cold water on their heads, and that might scare them off.
因为如果我立刻这么做，那就等于把一桶冷水泼在他们头上，可能会吓跑他们。
So I'm going to wait for a day when my son takes me out to go sightseeing.
所以我准备等有一天儿子带我出去旅游。
And that's when I'll talk to him.
那时我会和他谈谈。
We'll maybe go out to have a coffee, maybe eat a hamburger.
我们也许会出去喝咖啡，也许吃汉堡。
And then I'll start talking to him about it.
然后我会开始和他谈论这件事。
And Lupita kept making what sounded like a half joke, half backup plan about her son Daniel.
卢皮塔一直在为她的儿子丹尼尔制定听起来像是半开玩笑、半备用的计划。
I think sometimes it would be so great if they could actually deport him back to be with me.
我想有时如果他们真的能把他驱逐回我身边那就太好了。
I asked Lupita what her kids would think if they knew she was saying that.
我问露皮塔，如果她的孩子们知道她这么说，他们会怎么想。
Well, I think they'll get mad.
好吧，我想他们会生气的。
They'll say, what are you talking about, Mom?
他们会说，妈妈，你在说什么？
But yes, this is something that I've thought about, that it might be better if they're deported because then they'll be deported to be back with me.
但是，是的，这是我考虑过的事情，如果他们被驱逐出境可能会更好，因为那样他们就会被驱逐出境并回到我身边。
She says in the past, she's gotten so frustrated about her kids not being home that she thought about going to the US embassy to report them.
她说，过去，她对孩子不在家感到非常沮丧，以至于她想过去美国大使馆举报。
[LAUGHS] I don't think she will be capable to do that.
[笑]我认为她没有能力做到这一点。
This is Lupita's son Daniel.
这是露皮塔的儿子丹尼尔。
I caught up with him in Chicago.
我在芝加哥遇见了他。
But maybe.
但也许吧。
You never know.
你永远不知道。
[LAUGHS] I don't even get mad if she does.
[笑]即使她这样做我也不会生气。
I'll be like, OK.
我会说，好吧。
She's my mother, so.
她是我的母亲，所以。
She gave me life, so.
她给了我生命，所以。
[LAUGHS] I started laughing, to be honest, because make me feel like, oh, she loves me very much.
[笑]说实话，我开始笑，因为让我感觉，哦，她非常爱我。
Just as Lupita landed in Chicago with the rest of the parents, Daniel and Marilu and more than 100 other families were waiting in the basement of a packed church.
当露皮塔和其他父母一起降落在芝加哥时，丹尼尔和玛丽鲁以及其他 100 多个家庭正在一座挤满了人的教堂的地下室里等待。
The chaperones had specifically told them not to come to the airport.
监护人特意告诉他们不要来机场。
It wasn't a good idea to have so many undocumented people in a place with so much law enforcement.
在一个执法机构如此多的地方有这么多无证人员并不是一个好主意。
The organizers tried to keep details about the reunion secret.
组织者试图对聚会的细节保密。
There's the sinking worry that ICE could find out.
人们越来越担心 ICE 可能会发现这一点。
Some families worried that the whole thing could be a ploy to deport them.
一些家庭担心整件事可能是驱逐他们的阴谋。
In the church basement, about 300 people, all families, squished together, long folding tables piled with flowers, homemade posters, and heart-shaped balloons.
在教堂的地下室里，大约有300人，都是家庭成员，挤在一起，长折叠桌上堆满了鲜花、自制海报和心形气球。
There are grown men walking around with teddy bears for their moms.
有些成年男子带着泰迪熊为他们的妈妈走来走去。
Then an MC standing near the door started giving updates about the parents landing at the airport, getting on buses headed to the church.
然后，站在门口附近的主持人开始通报父母抵达机场、搭乘前往教堂的巴士的最新情况。
The mood got rowdier.
气氛变得更加喧闹。
Lupita's son Daniel and her daughter, Marilu, are sitting at a table near the center of the room.
卢皮塔的儿子丹尼尔和她的女儿玛丽卢坐在房间中央附近的一张桌子旁。
They crane their necks to watch for the bus.
他们伸长脖子等待公共汽车。
Marilu has been waiting in the church basement for hours.
马里卢已经在教堂地下室等了几个小时了。
She left three children in Mexico when she came to Chicago, and she brought two younger kids with her.
当她来到芝加哥时，她把三个孩子留在了墨西哥，还带着两个年幼的孩子。
It gnaws at her not seeing her kids back in Mexico.
回墨西哥后看不到孩子们，这让她心痛不已。
And she worries about her mom dying alone.
她担心她妈妈独自死去。
I feel sad.
我感到难过。
She's by herself.
她一个人。
I worry about her.
我担心她。
Sometimes I'm thinking about, what about if something happened to her?
有时我会想，如果她出了什么事怎么办？
What'll we do?
我们该怎么办？
I don't want to let her die without me.
我不想让她在没有我的情况下死去。
Suddenly, this famous mariachi song came on.
突然，这首著名的墨西哥流浪乐队歌曲响起。
And Marilu started singing along, loudly.
玛丽露开始大声唱歌。
The lyrics were pretty on the nose.
歌词很漂亮。
"Beautiful and beloved Mexico, if I die far from you, let them say that I'm asleep and have them bring me back here."
“美丽而可爱的墨西哥，如果我死在离你很远的地方，让他们说我睡着了，让他们把我带回这里。”
The MC at the church gives an update.
教堂的司仪提供了最新消息。
The buses with everyone's parents are just minutes away.
载着每个人的父母的巴士距离酒店只有几分钟的路程。
Marilu suddenly gets quiet.
玛丽露突然安静下来。
Tears are running down her face.
泪水从她的脸上流下来。
She lets out a sigh.
她叹了口气。
[SIGH] Kevin Sieff Daniel wipes his eyes, too.
[叹息]凯文·西夫·丹尼尔也擦了擦眼睛。
Outside, the bus pulls up in front of the church.
外面，巴士停在教堂前。
As they drove to the church, the parents were looking out the windows, commenting on how drab and ugly Chicago is.
当他们开车去教堂时，父母们看着窗外，评论着芝加哥是多么单调和丑陋。
Well, it isn't beautiful, one of them said to me.
嗯，这并不漂亮，其中一位对我说。
But once we parked, everyone got very excited.
但当我们停车后，每个人都变得非常兴奋。
Lupita says, I'm going to spring to hug them, to greet them.
露皮塔说，我要跳起来拥抱他们，向他们打招呼。
[SPEAKING SPANISH] Kevin Sieff She's the last parent off the bus.
[西班牙语] Kevin Sieff 她是最后一个下车的家长。
She enters the church building and wades into this intense scene, with little pods of families all over the place, hugging and crying.
她走进教堂建筑，走进这个紧张的场景，周围都是小群的家庭，拥抱和哭泣。
[SPEAKING SPANISH] Interpreter I don't want to cry.
[说西班牙语] 翻译 我不想哭。
But she doesn't see her kids.
但她看不到她的孩子们。
It's chaotic.
很混乱。
Finally, Marilu and Daniel walk up, each of them holding a flower.
最后，玛丽露和丹尼尔走了过来，他们每人都拿着一朵花。
Daniel is shaking a little.
丹尼尔有点发抖。
They surround Lupita and start hugging.
他们包围了露皮塔并开始拥抱。
[SPEAKING SPANISH] They're saying, I'm so happy to see you.
[说西班牙语] 他们说，我很高兴见到你。
And it's my mom, my mom.
这是我的妈妈，我的妈妈。
Lupita says, it's so amazing to see you, my daughter.
露皮塔说，见到你真是太棒了，我的女儿。
I love you.
我爱你。
[SPEAKING SPANISH] Marilu gives her a big kiss.
[说西班牙语] Marilu 给了她一个大大的吻。
Then Daniel says, it's been 20 years since we saw each other.
然后丹尼尔说，我们已经二十年没见面了。
They linger and take a picture together.
他们徘徊并一起拍照。
Lupita meets a great-grandchild, Marilu's grandson, who she's never met before.
露皮塔遇到了玛丽鲁的曾孙，她以前从未见过他。
She tells him that he's so handsome.
她告诉他他很帅。
Then her kids grab her two bags, full of more than 100 hand-sewn sweaters, table linens, and scarves that Lupita has been working on for a year.
然后她的孩子们抓起她的两个袋子，里面装满了 100 多件手工缝制的毛衣、桌布和围巾，这些都是露皮塔花了一年时间制作的。
They joke that they're filled with rocks.
他们开玩笑说里面装满了石头。
She had dreamed of eating at an American restaurant with her family.
她梦想着和家人一起在一家美国餐馆吃饭。
And suddenly, there she was, in Chicago, and her kids were telling her that they were going to take her out to dinner.
突然，她来到了芝加哥，她的孩子们告诉她要带她出去吃晚饭。
Lupita spent three weeks with Daniel and Marilu in Chicago, and they didn't want me hanging around with a recorder, which I understood.
露皮塔在芝加哥与丹尼尔和马里卢待了三个星期，他们不想让我带着录音机闲逛，我理解这一点。
But three days into the trip, before Lupita launched into her campaign to convince her kids to move home, Daniel sat down with me for an interview.
但旅行三天后，在卢皮塔发起说服孩子们搬回家的活动之前，丹尼尔接受了我的采访。
And he told me, yeah, he knew what was coming.
他告诉我，是的，他知道接下来会发生什么。
But I ran down the details with him anyway.
但无论如何我还是跟他谈了细节。
Your mom, when we were talking about it, she was saying like, she has this whole plan for you.
你妈妈，当我们谈论这件事时，她说，她为你制定了整个计划。
Like, she's talked to the high school principal.
比如，她和高中校长谈过。
Maybe he's willing to hire you to teach English.
也许他愿意雇用你来教英语。
[LAUGHS] I don't know if that's good.
[笑]我不知道这样好不好。
That's my mom's dream, not mine.
这是我妈妈的梦想，不是我的。
Daniel is single with no kids, something his mom constantly reminds him.
丹尼尔单身，没有孩子，这是他妈妈经常提醒他的事情。
She's trying to arrange things so that she has a perfect place for you.
她正在努力安排事情，以便为您提供一个完美的地方。
She wants to find you a woman for you to marry.
她想给你找个女人让你结婚。
She said you can live in the same house.
她说你们可以住在同一所房子里。
Oh yeah, she's been finding candidates for that.
哦，是的，她一直在寻找合适的候选人。
I'm like, no, this isn't going to work at all because I don't know how to say this, but fortunately, or unfortunately, I have absorbed so much stuff from this culture.
我想，不，这根本行不通，因为我不知道该怎么说，但幸运的是，或者不幸的是，我从这种文化中吸收了很多东西。
And when I talk to people from Mexico, they're like, what he's talking about?
当我和墨西哥人交谈时，他们会问，他在说什么？
Marilu had a different take.
Marilu 有不同的看法。
She wants to move back to Mexico, but not right now, not for 10 more years.
她想搬回墨西哥，但不是现在，也不是十年后。
She says she has to earn more money first.
她说她必须先赚更多的钱。
I think nothing Marilu and Daniel told us would have been a surprise to Lupita.
我认为玛丽露和丹尼尔告诉我们的任何事情都不会让露皮塔感到惊讶。
Lupita knew it would be a hard sell.
卢皮塔知道这很难推销。
But she'd convinced herself that she could pull it off.
但她坚信自己能成功。
Across Mexico, kids from this generation are coming back voluntarily.
在墨西哥各地，这一代的孩子正在自愿回归。
Mexico has become a wealthier country in the years since they left.
自从他们离开后的几年里，墨西哥已经成为一个更加富裕的国家。
Some of those kids are moving back and starting businesses.
其中一些孩子正在搬回来创业。
Others are retiring, spending more time with family back home.
其他人正在退休，花更多时间与家人在一起。
They did what they came to do.
他们做了他们要做的事。
I called Lupita after the trip to find out what happened.
旅行结束后我给露皮塔打电话了解发生了什么事。
Did you stick to your plan about how you were going to ask and how many times you were going to ask?
您是否坚持计划询问如何询问以及询问多少次？
[SPEAKING SPANISH] Interpreter Well, I planned it out, and I did it, but well, it didn't work.
[说西班牙语] 口译员 嗯，我计划好了，我也做到了，但是，没有成功。
How many times did you try?
你尝试了多少次？
Interpreter Oh, heaven, almost every other day, I'd say something to them.
口译员哦，天哪，几乎每隔一天，我都会对他们说些什么。
[SPEAKING SPANISH] Lupita Neri [SPEAKING SPANISH]
[说西班牙语] 露皮塔·内里 [说西班牙语]
Every other day.
每隔一天。
Kevin Sieff Every third day.
凯文·西夫 每三天一次。
[SPEAKING SPANISH] Interpreter Yes, every other day, so that I wouldn't bother them.
[说西班牙语] 翻译 是的，每隔一天，这样我就不会打扰他们。
If not, I was going to annoy them.
如果没有的话，我就会惹恼他们。
She ran the lines that she rehearsed.
她把排练过的台词唱出来。
But her kids had their own response ready.
但她的孩子们已经准备好了自己的回应。
They reminded her that her visa was good for 10 years, that it would be easier for her to visit them.
他们提醒她，她的签证有效期为10年，这样她去探望他们会更容易。
Did you feel disappointed?
你是否感到失望？
Were you surprised by what they said?
你对他们所说的话感到惊讶吗？
Desperate.
绝望的。
Desperate and sad.
绝望又悲伤。
Sad at the same time because I said to myself, my God, I think my kids are going to stay there.
同时感到悲伤，因为我对自己说，天啊，我想我的孩子们会留在那里。
So when it's my time to go, what's going to happen?
那么当我离开的时候，会发生什么？
They said, our lives are here.
他们说，我们的生命就在这里。
Mom, let's not talk about that right now because we're happy, and that will make us sad.
妈妈，我们现在不要谈论这个，因为我们很高兴，那会让我们伤心。
She says that's when she understood that their answer was definite, unchangeable.
她说，从那时起她就明白他们的答案是确定的、不可改变的。
She stopped bothering them about it.
她不再为此打扰他们了。
She wanted the reunion to remain pleasant.
她希望这次重聚能够保持愉快。
But the truth is there were moments when she became really sad, like when her daughter was at work and she was alone in the house.
但事实是，有时候她会变得非常悲伤，比如当她的女儿在工作而她独自一人在家时。
She kept that feeling to herself.
她把这种感觉藏在心里。
Back in the '90s, millions of Mexican parents watched their kids leave for the US, often with just a backpack and an address.
早在上世纪九十年代，数以百万计的墨西哥父母看着他们的孩子前往美国，通常只带着一个背包和一个地址。
The parents never imagined that the next trips would be theirs to make, elderly moms and dads with 10-year visas, convinced by their kids that it was their turn to cross the border.
父母们从来没有想到，下一次旅行将是他们的，年迈的父母持有十年签证，他们的孩子们让他们相信，轮到他们跨越边境了。
Like Lupita, she'll be flying back to see her kids now and then.
和露皮塔一样，她也会时不时地飞回来看望她的孩子们。
They beat me, she said.
他们打败了我，她说。
I'm not going to say anything more about it.
我不会再多说什么了。
Kevin Sieff, he's the Mexico Bureau Chief for The Washington Post.
凯文·西夫（Kevin Sieff），《华盛顿邮报》墨西哥分社社长。
[MUSIC - "TOO CLOSE TO HOME" BY RHONDA FUNK]
[音乐 - 朗达·芬克 (Rhonda Funk) 的《Too Close to Home》]
Credits Ira Glass Our program was produced today by Sean Cole.
图片来源 Ira Glass 今天我们的节目由 Sean Cole 制作。
The people who put together today's show include Bim Adewunmi, Elna Baker, Emanuele Berry, Susan Burton, Zoe Chace, Dana Chivvis, Andrea Lopez Cruzado, Whitney Dangerfield, Damien Graef, Michelle Harris, Seth Lind, Jessica Lussenhop, Miki Meek, Stowe Nelson, Katherine Rae Mondo, Gabriela Munoz, Ben Phelan, Nadia Reiman, Alissa Shipp, Lilly Sullivan, Christopher Swetala, Matt Tierney, and Nancy Updike.
今天节目的制作人包括 Bim Adewunmi、Elna Baker、Emanuele Berry、Susan Burton、Zoe Chace、Dana Chivvis、Andrea Lopez Cruzado、Whitney Dangerfield、Damien Graef、Michelle Harris、Seth Lind、Jessica Lussenhop、Miki Meek、Stowe Nelson、Katherine Rae Mondo、Gabriela Munoz、Ben Phelan、Nadia雷曼、艾丽莎·希普、莉莉·沙利文、克里斯托弗·斯维塔拉、马特·蒂尔尼和南希·厄普代克。
Our managing editor is Diane Wu.
我们的总编辑是 Diane Wu。
Our executive editor is David Kestenbaum.
我们的执行编辑是大卫·凯斯滕鲍姆。
Special thanks today to Dr. Vaile Wright, Virangna Kaul, Jaya Saxena, Philip Good, and Bernadette Mayer.
今天特别感谢 Vaile Wright 博士、Virangna Kaul、Jaya Saxena、Philip Good 和 Bernadette Mayer。
Our website, thisamericanlife.org, where you can stream our archive of nearly 700 episodes.
我们的网站 thisamericanlife.org，您可以在其中播放我们近 700 集的档案。
Also, there's videos and tons of other stuff there.
此外，那里还有视频和大量其他内容。
Or get our app, which has all that stuff and also lets you download as many episodes as you want.
或者获取我们的应用程序，它拥有所有这些内容，还可以让您下载任意数量的剧集。
Again, thisamericanlife.org.
再说一次，thisamericanlife.org。
This American Life is delivered to public radio stations by PRX, the Public Radio Exchange.
《美国生活》由公共广播电台 PRX 向公共广播电台播出。
Thanks, as always, to our program's co-founder, Mr. Torey Malatia.
一如既往地感谢我们项目的联合创始人 Torey Malatia 先生。
He told me that he bought me a Hanukkah gift this year on his trip to Mexico.
他告诉我，今年他去墨西哥旅行时给我买了一份光明节礼物。
I asked him what it is.
我问他那是什么。
He was very vague.
他说得很模糊。
[SPEAKING SPANISH] Ira Glass I'm Ira Glass.
[说西班牙语] Ira Glass 我是 Ira Glass。
Back next week with more stories of This American Life.
下周我们将带来更多《美国生活》的故事。
This American Life is produced in collaboration with WBEZ Chicago and delivered to stations by PRX The Public Radio Exchange.
《This American Life》与 WBEZ Chicago 合作制作，并由 PRX 公共广播电台传送到各电台。