635: Chip in My Brain - This American Life
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00:00 00:00 Transcript Share This American Life Life Partners How to Listen Episodes Recommended About Overview Staff Announcements Fellowships Jobs Music Make Radio On The Road FAQ Submissions Merch Contact Us Our Other Shows Merch Follow Us Life Partners Subscribe to our newsletter Full episode Toggle Audio and Transcript Sync Transcript | Episode #635 | February 26, 2021 635: Chip in My Brain Note: This American Life is produced for the ear and designed to be heard.
00:00 00:00 文字记录 分享此 美国生活 生活伙伴 如何收听 剧集 推荐 关于 概述 员工公告 奖学金 工作 音乐 在路上制作电台 常见问题解答 提交 商品 联系我们 我们的其他节目 商品 关注我们 生活伙伴 订阅我们的时事通讯 整集 切换音频和文字记录同步 文字记录 | 内容第 635 集 | 2021 年 2 月 26 日 635：我大脑中的芯片 注：《This American Life》是为耳朵而制作的，旨在让人们听到。
If you are able, we strongly encourage you to listen to the audio, which includes emotion and emphasis that's not on the page.
如果可以的话，我们强烈建议您收听音频，其中包括页面上没有的情感和重点。
Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors.
文字记录是使用语音识别软件和人工转录员结合生成的，可能包含错误。
Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print.
请在印刷版引用前检查相应的音频。
Prologue Ira Glass From WBEZ Chicago, it's This American Life.
序言 来自 WBEZ 芝加哥的 Ira Glass，这就是美国生活。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
I think the thing that gets to me the most about the story that we're doing today is I feel for the parents in this story.
我认为我们今天正在做的这个故事最让我感动的是我对这个故事中的父母的感受。
Like when you're a parent, at some point you're in the situation where your kid is having experiences and friendships with people that are completely out of your reach, right?
就像当你是父母时一样，在某些时候你会遇到这样的情况：你的孩子与完全超出你能力范围的人拥有经历和友谊，对吧？
You don't know what's really happening between them.
你不知道他们之间到底发生了什么。
You don't really know what's going through your kid's head.
你真的不知道你的孩子脑子里在想什么。
You're powerless.
你无能为力。
The parents in the story today, they thought they were close to their son, who was doing really well in school.
今天故事中的父母，他们认为自己和儿子很亲近，儿子在学校表现非常好。
Things seemed fine.
一切看起来都很好。
Anyway, it's our whole hour today, a story we call Chip in My Brain.
无论如何，这是我们今天的一小时，我们称之为“我大脑中的芯片”的故事。
David Kestenbaum tells what happened, which begins with basketball.
大卫·凯斯滕鲍姆 (David Kestenbaum) 讲述了发生的事情，首先从篮球开始。
It would probably be wrong to say that Cody Treybig loved basketball at the beginning.
如果说科迪·特雷比格一开始就热爱篮球，那可能是错误的。
It would definitely be wrong to say he was good at it.
说他擅长肯定是错误的。
He wasn't at all.
他根本就不是。
He was good at World of Warcraft though, the video game.
不过他很擅长电子游戏《魔兽世界》。
Sometimes I still almost cry thinking about the first time I walked into Stormwind, the capital human city.
有时我仍然会想起第一次走进人类首都暴风城的情景，差点哭出来。
And the music changes.
音乐也发生了变化。
And you see this beautiful, huge castle.
你看到了这座美丽而巨大的城堡。
And you're walking in, and it's like-- it's just really-- it's amazing.
当你走进去时，感觉——这真的是——太神奇了。
Cody says he wasn't exactly avoiding physical activity.
科迪说他并没有完全避免体力活动。
The game was just super fun.
游戏非常有趣。
He and his friends would all log on, go on adventures together.
他和他的朋友们都会登录，一起去冒险。
As someone who used to play a lot of video games, it felt like bad etiquette not to ask who his online character was.
作为一个经常玩电子游戏的人，不问他的在线角色是谁感觉像是一种不礼貌的行为。
Cody told me-- and knowing him a little bit now, this seems entirely appropriate-- he was a paladin, which is a holy knight who can fight.
科迪告诉我——现在对他有了一点了解，这似乎完全合适——他是一名圣骑士，是一名能够战斗的神圣骑士。
But also, he's nice.
但同时，他也很好。
He casts healing spells when his co-adventurers get hurt.
当他的同伴受伤时，他会施放治疗咒语。
Cody eventually built them up to level 60, as high as you can go.
Cody 最终将它们提升到了 60 级，这是你能达到的最高水平。
I was just really proud of having six-eighths of Lightforge gear, which was nothing.
我只是为拥有八分之六的光铸装备而感到自豪，但这没什么。
But--
但是——
All of which is just to say that sports were not Cody's top priority.
所有这些只是说明运动并不是科迪的首要任务。
In gym class when they'd have to run laps, he'd always be at the back.
体育课上，当他们必须跑几圈时，他总是站在后面。
Basketball somehow though, he kind of liked.
但不知何故，他有点喜欢篮球。
His dad had played when he was growing up.
他的父亲在他成长的过程中就玩过。
So early on, in third grade, Cody found himself on this local youth league team.
早在三年级时，科迪就发现自己加入了当地的青年联赛球队。
I was not very athletic at all.
我一点也不擅长运动。
I remember being at basketball games with my friend Daniel.
我记得和我的朋友丹尼尔一起看篮球比赛。
And we'd be talking about World of Warcraft while the game was going on on the bench.
当比赛在替补席上进行时，我们会谈论《魔兽世界》。
OK.
好的。
Well, from Mom's perspective, I thought he was adorable.
嗯，从妈妈的角度来看，我认为他很可爱。
That's Mom, Drew Treybig.
那是妈妈，德鲁·特雷比格。
And here's Dad, Jimmy Treybig.
这是爸爸，吉米·特雷比格。
He wasn't real aggressive.
他并不是真正具有攻击性。
Drew Treybig He's in the middle of the court, watching everybody run back and forth.
德鲁·特雷比格（Drew Treybig） 他在球场中央，看着每个人来回奔跑。
And if he got the ball and someone wanted it, he'd just give it to them.
如果他拿到球并且有人想要它，他就会把它给他们。
He would just so sweetly hand it off to another player.
他会如此甜蜜地把它交给另一个球员。
I didn't really have a problem with that, to be honest, at that age.
说实话，在那个年纪我对此并没有什么问题。
He was little.
他还小。
I thought, this is my dear, sweet boy.
我想，这就是我亲爱的、可爱的男孩。
And he'll get it.
他会得到它。
He'll get it eventually.
他最终会得到它。
But it bothered him, after a while, that the boys were making fun of him.
但过了一会儿，男孩们开始取笑他，这让他很烦恼。
Drew describes herself as a kind of helicopter mom, which seems right.
德鲁将自己描述为直升机妈妈，这似乎是正确的。
While I was there talking to Cody, she kept momming us.
当我在那里和科迪谈话时，她一直在妈妈我们。
Are you guys hungry?
你们饿了吗？
How about a smoothie?
来一杯冰沙怎么样？
I'm going to get one.
我要去买一个。
Drew says the whole family is kind of kooky.
德鲁说全家人都有点古怪。
Whenever someone was leaving, they'd be sure to say I love you, to the other person.
每当有人离开时，他们一定会向对方说我爱你。
And I don't mean leaving the house, just like leaving the room.
我并不是说离开家，就像离开房间一样。
Cody's dad, Jimmy, says he had a hard time getting his father to say I love you.
科迪的父亲吉米说，他很难让父亲说我爱你。
So this is their fix.
所以这就是他们的解决方案。
The Treybigs live in Texas in the outskirts of Austin.
特雷比格一家住在德克萨斯州奥斯汀郊区。
Jimmy was an early tech entrepreneur.
吉米是一位早期的科技企业家。
He founded a company that made the computers that ran ATM machines.
他创立了一家公司，生产运行 ATM 机的计算机。
So they had a nice house on a big piece of land.
所以他们在一大块土地上有一栋漂亮的房子。
There were cows around, but no neighbors you could walk to, which Jimmy told me he regretted.
周围有牛，但没有可以步行去的邻居，吉米告诉我他对此感到遗憾。
As it happened, there was an old basketball court out behind the house.
碰巧，房子后面有一个旧篮球场。
So they decided to get Cody some lessons.
所以他们决定给科迪一些教训。
Like instead of a piano teacher or something, get him a basketball teacher.
比如不要请钢琴老师什么的，给他找个篮球老师。
His dad found someone through the local youth league, a guy named AJ.
他的父亲通过当地的青年联盟找到了一个名叫 AJ 的人。
Cody is in third grade at the time.
科迪当时上三年级。
So I remember the first meeting.
所以我记得第一次见面。
He came in the front door.
他从前门进来。
And he was just very friendly, is what I remember feeling at the time, tall, 6 foot 6".
他非常友好，我记得当时的感觉，身高 6 英尺 6 英寸。
And I think I probably asked him, oh my god, can you dunk?
我想我可能问他，天哪，你能扣篮吗？
And he's like, oh yeah, I can dunk.
他说，哦，是的，我可以扣篮。
He said they used to call him "Springs" was his nickname because he dunked a lot.
他说他们以前叫他“斯普林斯”，这是他的昵称，因为他扣篮很多。
So that first day, AJ walks in.
第一天，AJ 走进来。
They all hang out by the front door.
他们都在前门闲逛。
Cody is shy, but AJ gets right down on his level.
科迪很害羞，但 AJ 的水平与他相当。
The two of them go out to the basketball court, talking the whole way.
两人一路聊着，来到了篮球场。
When they get there, Cody can't really even do a layup.
当他们到达那里时，科迪甚至无法上篮。
And AJ is like, OK, we can fix this.
AJ 说，好吧，我们可以解决这个问题。
Let's do some basics.
让我们做一些基础知识。
He teaches Cody this drill where you stand just to the side of the basket, try to bank it in off this magic spot.
他教科迪这个练习，你站在篮筐的一侧，尝试将球投进这个神奇的位置。
Then you get the rebound, go to the other side, and do it again, back and forth, back and forth.
然后你得到反弹，走到另一边，再做一次，来回，来回。
And he would put his hand through the hoop and act like a little monster, a dragon or something, squiggle his fingers around like, feed the monster.
他会把手伸进篮筐，表现得像一个小怪物，一条龙什么的，手指乱画，就像喂怪物一样。
Feed the monster.
喂怪物。
[CHUCKLES] So I thought that was pretty fun.
[笑] 所以我觉得这很有趣。
AJ works with Cody two days a week, then three days a week.
AJ 每周与科迪一起工作两天，然后每周工作三天。
Sometimes other kids come over so they can all train together.
有时其他孩子也会过来，这样他们就可以一起训练。
And it's great.
这很棒。
Mom would bring out snacks for everyone.
妈妈会给大家准备零食。
Or if other kids weren't around, Mom or Dad would get drafted.
或者如果其他孩子不在身边，妈妈或爸爸就会被征召入伍。
We would stand there and pretend to be a player on the other team so that they could-- or he told us to try to move into them, or try to steal the ball, or you know.
我们会站在那里假装是另一支球队的球员，这样他们就可以——或者他告诉我们尝试进入他们，或者尝试抢球，或者你知道。
So we could kind of be silly doing that too, right?
所以我们这样做也可能有点愚蠢，对吧？
Was that fun?
有趣吗？
Drew Treybig Yeah.
德鲁·特雷比格 是的。
Yeah.
是的。
It was really fun-- but not on the hot days.
这真的很有趣——但不是在炎热的日子里。
I'd say, AJ, I don't want to do this.
我会说，AJ，我不想这样做。
It's too hot.
太热了。
[LAUGHS]
[笑]
Word spreads around town about this great basketball trainer.
关于这位伟大的篮球教练的消息在镇上传开。
Other parents hire him.
其他父母雇用他。
But AJ and Cody, they have something kind of special.
但是 AJ 和 Cody，他们有一些特别的东西。
They just click, and they have this way of being around each other that seems sweet.
他们只是一拍即合，他们的相处方式看起来很甜蜜。
When AJ was working with Cody, they would trash talk on the court, which I always thought of as involving a lot of swearing.
当 AJ 和科迪一起工作时，他们会在球场上说垃圾话，我一直认为这涉及很多脏话。
But AJ taught Cody this really hilarious kind of trash talking-- just messing with someone, asking weird, random questions in the middle of the game.
但 AJ 教会了科迪这种非常搞笑的垃圾话——只是在游戏过程中惹恼某人，问奇怪的、随意的问题。
Hey, what did you have for breakfast?
嘿，你早餐吃什么了？
He would act like my mom sometimes.
有时他会表现得像我妈妈。
He would talk in my mom's voice and be like, OK, Cody, make the shot.
他会用我妈妈的声音说话，然后说，好吧，科迪，开枪吧。
Time to make the shot.
是时候开枪了。
Let's go.
我们走吧。
Let's get in there and try hard.
让我们进去并努力吧。
[LAUGHS] And that would obviously crack me up, and it would be hard to focus.
[笑]这显然会让我崩溃，而且很难集中注意力。
Cody played constantly.
科迪不断地打球。
If the family went on a trip, he would deflate a basketball, stick it in the suitcase, then re-inflate it after they arrived.
如果一家人去旅行，他会把篮球放气，把它放在行李箱里，然后在他们到达后重新充气。
When you're a kid, you want there to be something that you're special at, or even just a little good at.
当你还是个孩子的时候，你希望有一些你特别擅长的事情，甚至只是有点擅长。
Because as a kid, you start off being terrible at everything.
因为作为一个孩子，你开始对所有事情都很糟糕。
That is the definition of being a kid.
这就是作为一个孩子的定义。
So when you meet someone who helps you get good at something, it can feel amazing.
因此，当你遇到一个能帮助你擅长某件事的人时，你会感觉很棒。
Cody remembers this one afternoon-- maybe fourth grade, on the court out back-- where it all just felt perfect.
科迪记得那天下午——也许是四年级的时候，在后面的球场上——一切都感觉很完美。
We were just doing jump shots.
我们只是在做跳投。
And I was making like all of them, like never done-- making all of them.
我正在像他们所有人一样制作，就像从未做过的那样——制作所有这些。
And one of my brother's friends had come to hang out with my brother.
我哥哥的一位朋友来和我哥哥一起出去玩。
And he was up at the top watching us.
他在山顶看着我们。
And I noticed that.
我注意到了这一点。
And I was like-- to me, he was older and cool.
我觉得——对我来说，他年纪更大，而且很酷。
And I was making them.
我正在制作它们。
And he could see I was making them.
他可以看到我正在制作它们。
And I had just this pride, just like it's something I loved, the shooting.
我有这种自豪感，就像我喜欢的事情一样，拍摄。
And I was doing good at it.
我做得很好。
And I just remember feeling like I was, yeah, floating on air.
我只记得感觉就像是，是的，漂浮在空中。
It was really nice.
真的很好。
And AJ was there?
AJ也在场吗？
Cody Treybig Yeah.
科迪·特雷比格 是的。
He was coaching me.
他正在训练我。
He was rebounding and giving me the passes.
他抢篮板并给我传球。
The next year, Cody got the MVP award for the school team.
第二年，科迪获得了校队 MVP 奖。
In some ways, AJ was like a big kid himself.
在某些方面，AJ 自己就像一个大孩子。
Drew says he often seemed more comfortable with kids than adults.
德鲁说，他通常看起来比与成人相处更舒服。
And as Cody gets older, he and AJ really start to become friends.
随着科迪长大，他和 AJ 真正开始成为朋友。
After his games, Cody would always call AJ to tell him how it went.
比赛结束后，科迪总是打电话给 AJ，告诉他事情进展如何。
Which kind of drove my parents nuts, actually, because they wanted to talk to me after the game in the car.
事实上，这让我父母抓狂，因为他们想在比赛结束后在车里和我说话。
And I would be talking to AJ on the phone the whole way home, [CHUCKLES] which just shows how close we were.
我会在回家的路上和 AJ 通电话，[笑]这正好表明我们有多亲密。
AJ would sometimes pick Cody up from middle school.
AJ 有时会去中学接科迪。
Cody started to listen to the music AJ listened to.
科迪开始听 AJ 听的音乐。
Young MC, "Bust a Move" was a favorite.
年轻的MC，“Bust a Move”是最受欢迎的。
When Cody went out clothes shopping with his mom, he picked out clothes that looked like things AJ would wear-- simple, solid color T-shirts.
当科迪和妈妈一起出去买衣服时，他挑选了看起来像 AJ 会穿的衣服——简单的纯色 T 恤。
Cody fell in love with basketball.
科迪爱上了篮球。
And he kind of fell in love with AJ.
他有点爱上了AJ。
I would hug him and tell him I loved him, yeah.
我会拥抱他并告诉他我爱他，是的。
I mean, I would jump up, and he was holding me in the air, or whatever, yeah, and tell him I loved him, yeah.
我的意思是，我会跳起来，他将我举在空中，或者其他什么，是的，然后告诉他我爱他，是的。
I would get sad when he left.
当他离开时我会很难过。
I was shy.
我很害羞。
But once I got to know people, I got very attached to them.
但一旦我认识了一些人，我就对他们产生了浓厚的兴趣。
There's something Cody wrote about AJ that sums up how he felt and also weirdly foreshadows what was to come.
科迪写了一些关于 AJ 的文章，总结了他的感受，也奇怪地预示了即将发生的事情。
It's from early on, a school assignment to write about your hero.
从一开始，学校的作业就是写你的英雄。
I had Cody read from it.
我让科迪读了一遍。
"Some people in fourth grade might have picked their heroes because they're national celebrities.
“有些四年级的人可能会选择他们的英雄，因为他们是全国名人。
But I picked mine because he has made me a better person."
但我选择了我的，因为他让我成为了一个更好的人。”
Cody runs through how they met the way a fourth grader would.
科迪以四年级学生的方式讲述了他们是如何相遇的。
"Ding dong goes our doorbell.
“叮咚按响了我们的门铃。
[CHUCKLES] He was here.
[轻笑]他在这里。
I closed my eyes and hoped.
我闭上眼睛，满怀希望。
Then the door opened.
然后门开了。
'Hey, Cody,' he said with happiness.
“嘿，科迪，”他高兴地说。
'Hi, AJ,' I replied."
“嗨，AJ，”我回答道。
The essay ends with an interview, Cody asking AJ what seemed like innocuous questions.
文章以一次采访结束，科迪问了 AJ 一些看似无害的问题。
Where did you grow up?
你在哪里长大？
What was your favorite subject in school?
你在学校最喜欢的科目是什么？
And then these two questions.
然后就是这两个问题。
What values do you think are important?
您认为哪些价值观很重要？
And he says, "Communication and 'Thy shalt not have any gods before me,' and, 'Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.'" Did you have a hero in your life?
他说，“沟通，‘除了我之外，你不可有任何神’，以及‘己所不欲，勿施于人。’”你的生活中有英雄吗？
"Yes, Christ."
“是的，基督。”
Is it hard to get back in the mind of yourself writing this, when you wrote this?
当你写这篇文章的时候，你是否很难回想起自己写这篇文章的时候的心情？
It's very hard, because now I know kind of what was going on.
这非常困难，因为现在我知道发生了什么事。
And so it's pretty sad, I think.
我认为这是非常悲伤的。
Fast forward to the morning of February 7, 2012.
快进到 2012 年 2 月 7 日早上。
Cody's in ninth grade.
科迪九年级了。
He and AJ have been hanging out for six years.
他和 AJ 已经交往六年了。
Here's Drew, Cody's mom.
这是科迪的妈妈德鲁。
At that point, I was driving Cody to school.
那时，我开车送科迪去学校。
And I don't remember why.
我不记得为什么。
But I dropped him off.
但我把他送走了。
And just as I'm getting ready to leave, my friend whips into the spot next to me.
正当我准备离开时，我的朋友突然来到我旁边的位置。
And so I put my window down.
于是我就把窗户放下了。
She put her window down.
她把窗户放下。
And she's sobbing.
她在抽泣。
She's not even the tearing up kind of person.
她根本就不是那种会流泪的人。
And she handed me-- she said, oh my god, oh my god.
她递给我——她说，哦我的上帝，哦我的上帝。
You need to see what AJ has done.
你需要看看 AJ 做了什么。
I found some transcripts with my son.
我和儿子找到了一些成绩单。
Here they are.
他们在这里。
They were instant messages between the woman's son, Lucas, and AJ.
这些是该妇女的儿子卢卡斯和 AJ 之间的即时消息。
AJ had been coaching Lucas too.
AJ 也一直在执教卢卡斯。
And they'd been typing back and forth over Skype.
他们一直通过 Skype 来回打字。
Lucas's mom had printed them out.
卢卡斯的妈妈把它们打印出来了。
And I read them.
我读了它们。
And it was as if my entire body went numb.
就好像我的整个身体都麻木了。
It's still really hard to talk about.
这仍然很难谈论。
[CRYING]
[哭泣]
There didn't seem to be anything physical going on.
似乎没有发生任何身体上的事情。
The messages were about religion, but not any religion that Drew was familiar with-- stuff from the Bible, but also things that were definitely not in the Bible.
这些信息是关于宗教的，但不是德鲁熟悉的任何宗教——来自圣经的东西，但也有绝对不在圣经中的东西。
Some of it seemed really out there and scary.
其中一些看起来真的很可怕。
I knew I had to get home.
我知道我必须回家。
And she told me-- she said, go home right away.
她告诉我——她说，马上回家。
You've got to check Cody's Skype transcripts.
你必须检查科迪的 Skype 通话记录。
And I'm an Apple person.
我是苹果人。
I really don't know anything about the PC, the Skyping, and the keyboard even.
我真的对电脑、Skype、甚至键盘一无所知。
I mean, everything seems different.
我的意思是，一切看起来都不一样了。
So I say to her, I don't know if I'm going to be able to do it.
所以我对她说，我不知道我是否能做到。
I couldn't get home fast enough, because I knew in my heart it was going to be terrible.
我无法足够快地回到家，因为我心里知道这会很糟糕。
I got home.
我到家了。
Nobody was here.
没有人在这里。
And I went to Cody's room, and his Skype log was up.
我去了科迪的房间，他的 Skype 日志已经打开。
So he must have been on it that morning right before school.
所以那天早上他一定是在上学前做的。
She sits there at Cody's desk and starts to read.
她坐在科迪的办公桌旁，开始读书。
Cody and AJ had been messaging and Skyping, sometimes late into the night, and clearly trying to hide it from her.
科迪和 AJ 一直在通过短信和 Skype 聊天，有时会持续到深夜，显然是想向她隐瞒。
The first pages are from some night when she'd been threatening to take his phone away.
第一页是某个晚上的内容，当时她威胁要拿走他的手机。
Cody writes to AJ, "How do I communicate with you without technology"" AJ, "Please turn off everything and remain calm as possible.
科迪写信给 AJ，“在没有科技的情况下我如何与你沟通”” AJ，“请关闭一切并尽可能保持冷静。
This is just for tonight." Cody, "Should I give them my phone if they ask for it?" AJ, "Delete everything and give it to them." She keeps reading, and it gets even stranger.
这只是今晚的事。”科迪：“如果他们要我的手机，我应该给他们吗？” AJ：“删除所有内容并将其交给他们。”她继续读下去，事情变得更加奇怪。
Rapture, Illuminati, there were references to all these things, biblical or religious, that I was just astounded by.
狂喜，光明会，所有这些事情的参考，无论是圣经的还是宗教的，我都感到震惊。
It was like Cody and AJ were living in this other world.
科迪和 AJ 就好像生活在另一个世界。
And it was vast-- some mix of science fiction and stuff inspired by the Bible, particularly the book of Revelation.
它是巨大的——科幻小说和受圣经启发的东西的混合，特别是启示录。
At the time, Drew couldn't piece it all together.
当时，德鲁无法将这一切拼凑起来。
But as best as I can tell, this is the basic outline of it.
但据我所知，这就是它的基本轮廓。
It starts with standard evangelical beliefs about the rapture, the end of days, when a select group of people will suddenly disappear from the Earth to go live with God.
它始于关于被提的标准福音派信仰，即末日，一群选定的人将突然从地球上消失，与上帝同住。
And everyone else is going to be left to suffer.
其他人都将遭受痛苦。
Who will be saved, and who will be left behind?
谁会被拯救，谁会被抛在后面？
Well, the devil is trying to capture as many souls as he can.
好吧，魔鬼正试图捕获尽可能多的灵魂。
And here's where the sci-fi stuff comes in.
这就是科幻小说的用武之地。
The devil is operating through a powerful and secret society called the Illuminati.
魔鬼通过一个名为“光明会”的强大秘密社团来运作。
The Illuminati have built a self-programming supercomputer somewhere in Belgium called "The Beast."
光明会在比利时某处建造了一台名为“野兽”的自编程超级计算机。
At some point, the Illuminati is going to try to control people by implanting a computer ID chip, an RFID chip, in everyone's hands or foreheads.
在某些时候，光明会将试图通过在每个人的手上或额头上植入计算机 ID 芯片（RFID 芯片）来控制人们。
This chip, it said, is what the Bible has been prophesying, the mark of the beast, a high-tech version of 666.
据称，这款芯片就是《圣经》所预言的“兽印”，是666的高科技版本。
If you get an RFID chip implanted, well, you are definitely not getting saved.
如果你植入了 RFID 芯片，那么你绝对无法得救。
In the transcripts, AJ and Cody go back and forth about RFID chips a bunch.
在文字记录中，AJ 和 Cody 就 RFID 芯片问题反复讨论。
At one point, AJ writes, "It's here.
AJ 有一次写道：“它就在这里。
This coming up year, it will be mandatory for all armed forces, followed by medical field, then everyone else.
明年，所有武装部队都将强制执行此操作，其次是医疗领域，然后是其他所有人。
What it does to the body is inhuman."
它对身体的影响是不人道的。”
Cody, "What do they do to your body?" AJ, "You lose mind control.
科迪：“它们对你的身体做了什么？” AJ：“你失去了精神控制。
Why do you think I took time to study the mind with you?" Cody, "How does it do that?" AJ, "Oh, [BLEEP], here we go.
你认为我为什么要花时间和你一起研究心呢？”科迪：“它是怎么做到的？” AJ，“哦，[哔]，我们开始了。
Are you sure?
你确定吗？
You want to know the truth?" Cody, "Yes, I do." Then the Skype log indicates AJ called him to talk.
你想知道真相吗？”科迪：“是的，我愿意。”然后 Skype 日志显示 AJ 打电话给他谈话。
You could see how he was manipulating by reading it.
通过阅读，你可以看到他是如何操纵的。
"Yes, there's more.
“是的，还有更多。
But I guess if you're not ready to hear it--" I mean, you could see him, how he would reel a child in.
但我想如果你还没准备好听的话——”我的意思是，你可以看到他，他会如何把一个孩子卷进来。
AJ writes, "For now, rest.
AJ 写道：“现在，休息吧。
I have so much more to show you.
我还有很多东西要向你展示。
But you have class tomorrow." In some places, the conversation seems very middle school, except they're texting about the apocalypse.
不过明天你还要上课。”在某些地方，谈话看起来很中学，除了他们发短信谈论世界末日。
And one of them is 36 years old.
其中一位今年36岁。
Like this time AJ is talking about how he's preparing to assist other followers of the Lord.
就像这次 AJ 正在谈论他准备如何帮助主的其他追随者。
And Cody compares the whole thing to a movie.
科迪将整个事情比作一部电影。
Cody, "So it's like you're that guy from The Matrix who rescues Neo and takes him to the refuge underground."
科迪：“所以你就像是《黑客帝国》中拯救尼奥并把他带到地下避难所的那个人。”
AJ, "You must be talking about Morpheus." Cody, "Yes, that guy." AJ, "How do you know I'm not Neo?" Cody, "But Neo never goes and rescues people from the Matrix." AJ, "But he does show them the truth."
AJ：“你一定是在谈论睡眠。”科迪：“是的，就是那个家伙。” AJ：“你怎么知道我不是尼奥？”科迪：“但是尼奥从来没有去从黑客帝国中救出人们。” AJ：“但他确实向他们展示了真相。”
The most alarming part for Drew reading this is that AJ seems to be trying to slowly separate Cody from his family, to drive a wedge between her and her son.
让德鲁读到这篇文章最令人震惊的是，AJ 似乎试图慢慢地将科迪与他的家人分开，离间她和她的儿子。
At one point, AJ is telling Cody that his parents are influenced by, quote, "the other side."
有一次，AJ 告诉科迪，他的父母受到“另一方”的影响。
One of the first things I had read that popped up was him telling Cody to call CPS.
我读到的第一件事就是他告诉科迪给 CPS 打电话。
Child Protective Services?
儿童保护服务？
Drew Treybig Yeah, Child Protective-- and to fake that we were abusing him.
德鲁·特雷比格 是的，儿童保护组织——并假装我们在虐待他。
Cody had been asking AJ what he should do if his parents tried to make him get an RFID chip implanted.
科迪一直在问 AJ，如果他的父母试图让他植入 RFID 芯片，他该怎么办。
AJ writes, "CPS, one phone call, 911.
AJ 写道：“CPS，一通电话，911。
You can easily claim abuse, which is not a lie because they would be forcing you into hell.
你可以很容易地声称受到虐待，这不是谎言，因为他们会强迫你进入地狱。
Tell CPS nothing about the chip.
告诉 CPS 任何有关芯片的信息。
Stress potential harm to your body and yelling." Drew reads this and worries that Cody is about to run off with AJ.
强调对你身体的潜在伤害并大喊大叫。”德鲁读到这篇文章后担心科迪会和 AJ 私奔。
You can just see in this sweet, little, innocent Cody saying things like, well, I think I have some money in a savings account.
你可以看到这个可爱、小、天真的科迪在说这样的话，好吧，我想我的储蓄账户里有一些钱。
And then, because AJ is telling him we're going-- he and Cody are going to need a lot of money.
然后，因为 AJ 告诉他我们要去——他和科迪将需要很多钱。
Drew calls Jimmy, her husband, who rushes home.
德鲁打电话给她的丈夫吉米，吉米赶回家。
I was really afraid.
我真的很害怕。
And it was obviously-- it had been going on a very long time.
显然，这种情况已经持续了很长时间。
The Skype transcripts only went back a month.
Skype 的文字记录只能追溯到一个月前。
But they eventually learned from Cody that he and AJ had been having conversations like this for years-- right there in the house, right under their noses.
但他们最终从科迪那里得知，他和 AJ 多年来一直在进行这样的对话——就在房子里，就在他们眼皮子底下。
Drew and Jimmy call the police, but it's unclear if there's anything they can charge AJ with.
德鲁和吉米报了警，但尚不清楚他们是否可以指控 AJ。
They decide for sure they need to cut off all contact with AJ, which they worry will upset Cody.
他们确信需要切断与 AJ 的所有联系，他们担心这会让科迪不高兴。
They don't know how much of all this religious stuff he really believes.
他们不知道他到底相信多少这些宗教东西。
But they know he loves AJ.
但他们知道他爱 AJ。
They need time to figure things out.
他们需要时间来解决问题。
So they just leave Cody at school for the rest of the day.
所以他们就把科迪留在学校剩下的时间里。
He's going to classes, doesn't know any of this is happening.
他要去上课，不知道发生了什么事。
They call a friend who's a lawyer, and they make a plan.
他们打电话给一位律师朋友，制定了一个计划。
When the school day is over, Drew will pick up Cody and also his friend Lucas, who had been messaging with AJ.
放学后，德鲁会去接科迪和他的朋友卢卡斯，卢卡斯一直在和 AJ 发信息。
She'll pretend like everything's normal.
她会假装一切都很正常。
But she'll take them directly to the lawyer's office, where Jimmy and the other kid's parents will be.
但她会直接带他们去律师办公室，吉米和另一个孩子的父母也在那里。
Last period of the day, last class, I had off period, no class.
当天的最后一节课，最后一节课，我有休息时间，没有课。
And I was texting AJ about something I had seen on the internet.
我正在给 AJ 发短信，讲述我在互联网上看到的一些事情。
And I think he replied.
我认为他回答了。
And it was a normal day.
这是正常的一天。
And my mom-- my friend Lucas and I were hanging out before my mom came and picked me up.
在我妈妈来接我之前，我妈妈——我的朋友卢卡斯和我正在出去玩。
And I think we had a basketball session that day with AJ planned.
我想那天我们计划和 AJ 一起进行篮球训练。
And my mom said, oh, I'm going to drive both of you guys to our house to play.
我妈妈说，哦，我要开车送你们俩去我们家玩。
They were so happy that day when they got in the car.
那天，当他们坐上车时，他们非常高兴。
And all I'm thinking is, oh my god, it's just in a couple of minutes when I have to turn left.
我脑子里想的就是，天哪，几分钟后我就得左转了。
It's all I kept thinking about.
这就是我一直在想的一切。
It's just going to all come crashing down.
一切都会崩溃。
And I don't know if I'm strong enough to do this, because I'm still barely keeping it together.
我不知道我是否有足够的力量去做这件事，因为我仍然勉强维持现状。
So that was fine.
所以那很好。
It was normal.
这很正常。
And we were going home.
我们要回家了。
And instead of turning right, we turn left.
我们没有右转，而是左转。
And Lucas and I were, what's going on?
卢卡斯和我，发生了什么事？
Why are we turning left?
我们为什么要左转？
And my mom wouldn't answer us.
我妈妈不肯回答我们。
And we could tell something was weird.
我们可以看出有些事情很奇怪。
So immediately, Lucas and I are like, what is going on?
卢卡斯和我立即想，发生了什么事？
My mind immediately turned to, oh my god, maybe my parents are taking me somewhere to implant the RFID chip in me.
我的思绪立刻转向，天啊，也许我的父母要带我去某个地方，把RFID芯片植入我体内。
So I'm starting to think about how are we going to get out of this car.
所以我开始思考我们要如何离开这辆车。
The other little boy almost jumped out of the car.
另一个小男孩差点从车上跳下来。
And I had to beg him to just please not jump out of the car.
我不得不求他不要跳下车。
They had done nothing wrong.
他们没有做错任何事。
They weren't in trouble.
他们没有遇到麻烦。
They were going to be OK.
他们会没事的。
But I couldn't tell them.
但我不能告诉他们。
For 20 minutes, that's all I kept saying.
20分钟里，我一直在说这句话。
We were texting AJ like, what's going on?
我们给 AJ 发短信说，发生了什么事？
Do you know what's going on?
你知道发生了什么事吗？
We were kind of frantic.
我们有点疯狂。
She took us to, I guess, our family lawyer at the time's office and sat us down.
我猜她带我们去了当时我们家庭律师的办公室并让我们坐下。
And they informed us that they had found Lucas's Skype transcripts with AJ.
他们告诉我们，他们已经找到了卢卡斯与 AJ 的 Skype 通话记录。
And that prompted my parents to look at my computer.
这促使我的父母查看我的电脑。
And they found my Skype transcripts with AJ and that they were going to fire him.
他们发现了我和 AJ 的 Skype 通话记录，并表示要解雇他。
I wouldn't be allowed to see him anymore and that he wasn't allowed to talk to us anymore.
我不会再被允许见到他，他也不会再和我们说话了。
So I mean it-- my world blew up.
所以我是认真的——我的世界爆炸了。
My world blew up.
我的世界爆炸了。
It was-- I don't know how else to put it.
这是——我不知道还能怎么说。
My world just blew up.
我的世界简直爆炸了。
Looking at Cody, though, Drew couldn't tell what was going on with him.
然而看着科迪，德鲁却看不出他发生了什么事。
He didn't cry.
他没有哭。
He didn't yell.
他没有喊叫。
When they got home, she says she tried to talk to him about all this, but he wouldn't talk.
当他们回到家时，她说她试图和他谈论这一切，但他不肯说话。
They got him a therapist right away.
他们立即给他找了一位治疗师。
The lawyer told AJ he was fired and to stay away from the Treybigs.
律师告诉 AJ 他被解雇了，并远离 Treybigs。
The family sent the school a photo of AJ, told them to watch out for him.
家人给学校发了一张 AJ 的照片，让他们留意他。
AJ sent an email to the Treybigs' lawyer, threatening to sue them if they said bad things about him.
AJ 给特雷比格夫妇的律师发了一封电子邮件，威胁说如果他们说他的坏话，就要起诉他们。
Cody had been a high honors student.
科迪是一名优秀学生。
But the next day, he got a 24 on a test.
但第二天，他的考试得了24分。
After school, he'd go to his room, stay in there, and go to sleep.
放学后，他就回自己的房间，呆在里面睡觉。
In the mornings, his parents would break down.
早上，他的父母就会崩溃。
They'd say, please just come home to us today.
他们会说，请今天回到我们身边吧。
Don't run away with him.
别跟他逃走。
Of course, one of the weird things about this whole situation is that before this, Cody had seemed totally normal around the house, just his regular self.
当然，整个情况的奇怪之处之一是，在此之前，科迪在房子里看起来完全正常，只是他平常的自己。
When I first heard this story, I honestly didn't know what to think.
当我第一次听到这个故事时，老实说我不知道该怎么想。
It seemed incredible that all this could be going on and that no one would notice.
令人难以置信的是，这一切正在发生，却没有人注意到。
How did this happen?
这是怎么发生的？
And why did AJ do it?
那么AJ为什么要这么做呢？
The Treybigs thought he was grooming Cody for years in some evil plan to control him and pull him away from the family.
特雷比格一家认为他多年来一直在培养科迪，目的是为了控制他并把他从家族中拉走。
But maybe AJ was just a devoted religious guy with unconventional beliefs.
但也许 AJ 只是一个有着非传统信仰的虔诚宗教徒。
We reached out to AJ, who declined multiple interview requests.
我们联系了 AJ，但他拒绝了多次采访请求。
Then just before we went to air, he did finally agree to talk.
然后就在我们播出之前，他终于同意谈话。
So we have some tape of him, which you'll hear later.
我们有他的一些录音带，稍后你会听到。
He has a different version of most of this.
他对其中大部分内容都有不同的版本。
But here is the story from Cody and his family's perspective.
但这是从科迪和他的家人的角度来看的故事。
Those years where life in the Treybig household felt totally ordinary, here's what Cody says was actually going on.
那些年，特雷比格一家的生活感觉很平常，科迪说，实际情况是这样的。
Cody says the first time he and AJ talked about religion was back in the sixth grade.
科迪说，他和 AJ 第一次谈论宗教是在六年级。
AJ had been coaching him for a few years.
AJ 已经指导他几年了。
And this one day, AJ starts talking about that video game that Cody loved, World of Warcraft.
有一天，AJ 开始谈论科迪喜欢的一款电子游戏，《魔兽世界》。
We were in my garage.
我们在我的车库里。
And that's where we had some workout equipment at the time.
那就是我们当时有一些健身器材的地方。
And he just turned so serious suddenly.
他突然变得如此严肃。
He's telling me, Cody, the things in your World of Warcraft game-- these demons, these warlocks--
他告诉我，科迪，你的魔兽世界游戏中的东西——这些恶魔，这些术士——
--all these things, they're real.
——所有这些事情，它们都是真实的。
And they're all around us all the time.
他们一直就在我们身边。
And it's not good that you play that game, because when you play that game, these things, they can come into you.
你玩那个游戏不好，因为当你玩那个游戏时，这些东西就会进入你的身体。
And those things come from hell.
而那些东西来自地狱。
It's a spiritual war going on around us all the time.
这是我们周围时时发生的一场属灵战争。
You just can't see it.
你只是看不到它。
Only some people can see it.
只有部分人能看到。
I can see it.
我能看到它。
I just remember I-- it was truly terrifying.
我只记得我——这真的很可怕。
How did he seem?
他看上去怎么样？
Cody Treybig He seemed compassionate, like he was looking out for me, telling me this information that I needed to hear.
科迪·特雷比格（Cody Treybig）他看起来很富有同情心，就像他在照顾我一样，告诉我这些我需要听到的信息。
And he's saying, that's why you need to stop playing that game.
他说，这就是为什么你需要停止玩那个游戏。
That's why you need to start reading the Bible.
这就是为什么你需要开始阅读圣经。
That's why you need to go to church.
这就是为什么你需要去教堂。
That's why you need to start praying.
这就是为什么你需要开始祈祷。
That's why you need to start understanding these things, and thinking about these things, and maturing.
这就是为什么你需要开始理解这些事情，思考这些事情，然后变得成熟。
So to me, it was like he was protecting me from these terrible things.
所以对我来说，就像他在保护我免受这些可怕的事情的侵害。
As for how this could all stay secret, this first conversation didn't.
至于如何才能保密这一切，第一次谈话就没有保密。
When other kids came over to play basketball that day, Cody disappeared into the house.
那天，当其他孩子过来打篮球时，科迪就消失在屋子里。
He started to cry.
他开始哭泣。
And he told his mom.
他告诉了他妈妈。
Cody tells me, there's a computer in the sky that's going to kill me.
科迪告诉我，天上有一台电脑会杀了我。
I'm like, what?
我想，什么？
What are you talking about?
你在说什么？
Drew says people have asked her now why she didn't fire AJ on that day.
德鲁说，现在人们问她为什么那天没有解雇 AJ。
She says she tries to be open-minded about religion.
她说她试图对宗教保持开放的态度。
People believe all kinds of things.
人们相信各种各样的事情。
AJ seemed like a good guy.
AJ 看起来是个好人。
So when Cody tells his mom, we've got to cancel World of Warcraft, she's like, no, we don't.
因此，当科迪告诉他妈妈，我们必须取消《魔兽世界》时，她说，不，我们不会。
Cody's telling me that I never told him that the game was evil.
科迪告诉我，我从未告诉过他这个游戏是邪恶的。
And why was I allowing him to play an evil game?
为什么我要允许他玩邪恶的游戏？
Well, I remember almost laughing about that.
嗯，我记得当时我差点笑了。
I'm like, Cody, you love this game.
我想，科迪，你喜欢这个游戏。
This is so silly.
这太愚蠢了。
It's not evil.
这并不邪恶。
It's just a game.
这只是一个游戏。
And I'm going to go talk to AJ because this is ridiculous.
我要去和 AJ 谈谈，因为这太荒谬了。
Drew says she went out to talk to AJ, who was coaching the other boys.
德鲁说她出去和正在指导其他男孩的 AJ 交谈。
She said, what did you tell Cody?
她说，你告诉科迪什么了？
He's really upset.
他真的很难过。
Oh, I'm so sorry.
哦，我很抱歉。
I didn't mean to upset him.
我并不是故意让他不高兴。
He misunderstood me.
他误解了我。
I won't ever do it again.
我再也不会这样做了。
I'm so sorry.
我很抱歉。
And I explained to him-- I said, well, we're going to have a problem if you do that again.
我向他解释说——我说，好吧，如果你再这样做，我们就会遇到问题。
You're hired to be a basketball coach.
你被聘为一名篮球教练。
So do you think that you can not talk about those things?
那么你认为你不能谈论这些事情吗？
And he assured me that he could.
他向我保证他可以。
Pretty much immediately, they did talk about religion again.
几乎立刻，他们又开始谈论宗教了。
And this was a moment, if you rewind the tape, when things might have all gone differently.
这一刻，如果你倒带，事情可能会发生不同的变化。
Cody could have believed his mom that all this stuff was ridiculous.
科迪本可以相信他妈妈所有这些事情都很荒谬。
But instead, he wondered why his mom didn't want him to learn about this stuff.
但相反，他想知道为什么他妈妈不想让他了解这些东西。
He adored AJ.
他很喜欢AJ。
And the stuff AJ was saying, if it was true, it seemed really important.
AJ 所说的话，如果这是真的，那似乎真的很重要。
Like it's hard to think of anything that could be more urgent.
好像很难想到还有什么比这更紧急的事情了。
Cody canceled his World of Warcraft account and stopped playing.
科迪取消了他的《魔兽世界》帐户并停止玩游戏。
And he says, after that day, their basketball sessions started changing.
他说，那天之后，他们的篮球课程开始发生变化。
AJ told Cody he wasn't really there to teach him basketball.
AJ 告诉科迪他并不是真的来教他篮球。
That didn't really matter.
那并不重要。
He said he was sent there because he, AJ, was one of the chosen.
他说他被派到那里是因为他，AJ，是被选中的人之一。
And Cody was special.
科迪很特别。
He would either just start and say that God had instructed him that it was time that he shares this new thing with me.
他要么开始说上帝指示他是时候与我分享这个新事物了。
Or he would just start the whole thing off by just sighing and going, [SIGHS HEAVILY], they have eyes, but they can't see.
或者他会以叹息开始整个事情，[重重叹息]，他们有眼睛，但他们看不到。
They have ears, but they can't hear.
他们有耳朵，但听不到声音。
You know, if only they knew, if only they knew.
你知道，如果他们知道就好了，如果他们知道就好了。
And I would be like, what?
我会想，什么？
And he would make it such a challenge for me to get that information out of him.
他会让我从他那里得到这些信息成为一个挑战。
He would be like, you're not ready.
他会说，你还没准备好。
You're not ready.
你还没准备好。
It was like a story being revealed in many chapters about this whole world around them that was invisible to most people.
这就像一个在许多章节中揭示的关于他们周围的整个世界的故事，而大多数人是看不见的。
If you only knew who I am, AJ would say.
如果你知道我是谁就好了，AJ 会说。
AJ said he could see demons gathering around the house.
AJ 说他可以看到恶魔聚集在房子周围。
But when he came over, they'd flee because they were afraid of him.
但当他过来时，他们就会因为害怕他而逃跑。
AJ said he sometimes saw demons around the basketball court while they were playing.
AJ 说，当他们打球时，他有时会在篮球场周围看到恶魔。
And then sometimes he would pause in the middle of the session, just look into the field in the distance, and then smile, and then keep going in the session, and like--
有时他会在训练中间停下来，看看远处的田野，然后微笑，然后继续训练，就像——
As if he'd seen something?
好像看到了什么？
Cody Treybig --as if he'd seen something.
科迪·特雷比格——就好像他看到了什么一样。
He would say like when he was talking to my mom, he could see the devil behind her smiling.
他会说，就像当他和我妈妈说话时，他可以看到她背后的魔鬼在微笑。
And he would tell me this about other clients he had too.
他也会告诉我有关他其他客户的情况。
This other client, his dad's part of the Illuminati.
另一位客户，他的父亲是光明会的一员。
And the demons are flocked at his house.
恶魔们聚集在他的房子里。
And when he went there, the demons would scream and run.
当他去那里时，恶魔们就会尖叫着逃跑。
And they hated it when they went there.
当他们去那里时，他们讨厌它。
And he told me, as soon as that family fired him, he saw the kid that he was working with age 10 years in one day and start getting sick and depressed all the time, because the demons were finally able to flock to that kid and attack him, because he wasn't there to protect him anymore.
他告诉我，那家人一解雇他，他就看到那个和他一起工作的孩子一天就长大了10年，开始生病并且一直郁闷，因为恶魔终于能够涌向那个孩子并攻击他，因为他不再在那里保护他了。
Cody's dad's office had a particularly bad feel about it, AJ said.
AJ 说，科迪父亲的办公室对此感觉特别不好。
There was a statue of a snake in it.
里面有一尊蛇的雕像。
He said that was a sign of the Illuminati.
他说这是光明会的标志。
As it happened, that's where Cody and I were doing this interview.
碰巧，这就是我和科迪进行这次采访的地方。
The snake was there on the table.
蛇就在桌子上。
It's just one of those corporate "we did it" kind of things from the sales team at his dad's company.
这只是他父亲公司的销售团队发出的“我们做到了”的公司之类的事情之一。
But in Cody's mind, everything around him started to have a double, deeper meaning to it.
但在科迪看来，他周围的一切开始具有双重的、更深层次的意义。
There's a Bohemian Grove in California where the Illuminati worship a 40-foot statue of an owl.
加利福尼亚州有一座波希米亚丛林，光明会在那里崇拜一座 40 英尺高的猫头鹰雕像。
And Cody, why do you think your dad takes two-week trips to California?
科迪，你认为你爸爸为什么要去加利福尼亚州旅行两周？
Where do you think he's going?
你认为他要去哪里？
Do you really think he has business for two weeks there?
你真的认为他在那里呆两周有事吗？
Who has business for two weeks?
谁有两周的生意？
That's not normal.
这不正常。
Is there really a 40-foot statue of an owl in California?
加州真的有一座 40 英尺高的猫头鹰雕像吗？
[LAUGHS] I don't know.
[笑]我不知道。
I really-- I don't know.
我真的——我不知道。
There is a giant owl.
有一只巨大的猫头鹰。
Bohemian Grove is this enclave for the rich and powerful.
波希米亚格罗夫 (Bohemian Grove) 是富人和有权势人士的聚集地。
Presidents have been there.
总统们都去过那里。
But Cody's dad says he's never been.
但科迪的父亲说他从来没有去过。
The things AJ said were hard to disprove, especially if you're in sixth grade.
AJ 所说的话很难反驳，特别是如果你是六年级的话。
AJ said he could see people talking about him when he wasn't there, that he could see people's dreams, sometimes read their thoughts.
AJ 说，当他不在场时，他可以看到人们谈论他，他可以看到人们的梦想，有时甚至能读懂他们的想法。
And those demons around the house, he said, they're spreading.
他说，房子周围的恶魔正在蔓延。
That one was particularly alarming.
这一点尤其令人震惊。
When you were playing basketball, did you imagine like little demons all around that you couldn't see?
当你打篮球的时候，你是否想象过周围有一些看不见的小恶魔？
Yes.
是的。
It was horrible for me, because by seventh and eighth grade, he started talking to me about the rapture and how the rapture could happen at any second.
这对我来说太可怕了，因为到了七年级和八年级，他开始和我谈论被提以及被提如何随时发生。
And to me, in my mind, he said, once you're spiritually sound, once your soul is good, you'll see the things I see.
对我来说，在我看来，他说，一旦你的灵性健全，一旦你的灵魂善良，你就会看到我所看到的东西。
So I was waiting for the day when I could see the demons.
于是我就等待着能见到恶魔的那一天。
And so I would go to the court sometimes and just look and just, why can't I see it?
所以我有时会去法庭看看，为什么我看不到呢？
Why can't I see it?
为什么我看不到？
Please, God, show me.
上帝啊，请让我看看。
Am I not doing enough?
我做得还不够吗？
There was an urgency to the whole thing.
整件事都很紧迫。
AJ said there were signs the rapture might happen during the upcoming Olympics, which meant the Illuminati were going to be trying to implant everyone with RFID chips.
AJ 表示，有迹象表明这种狂喜可能会在即将到来的奥运会期间发生，这意味着光明会将尝试为每个人植入 RFID 芯片。
There was very little time left.
剩下的时间已经所剩无几了。
How do you have that going on in your head, and then you get up in the morning, eat breakfast with the family, chat about whatever they're joking about, and then go to school, and--
你脑子里怎么会有这样的想法，然后你早上起床，和家人一起吃早餐，聊他们开玩笑的事情，然后去学校，然后——
Every second was not normal.
每一秒都不正常。
It was-- I would walk around school.
我会在学校周围散步。
And I would think, all these idiots, they don't see what's really going on.
我想，所有这些白痴，他们不明白到底发生了什么。
The world's ending so soon.
世界末日这么快就来了。
I would spend my off periods walking around the school looking for the Illuminati symbols AJ told me are around St. Stephen's.
我会利用休息时间在学校里走来走去，寻找 AJ 告诉我在圣史蒂芬教堂附近的光明会标志。
I would spend my offs researching articles he showed me about how my dad's ham radio is proof that he's part of the Illuminati and that he's listening in on people's conversations using his antennas.
我会花时间研究他向我展示的文章，内容是关于我父亲的业余无线电如何证明他是光明会的一员，以及他正在使用天线监听人们的谈话。
Was there any part of you that questioned it, that was like, that doesn't sound like that's possible?
你是否有任何一部分对此表示质疑，就像，这听起来不可能？
I think for me, at the time, it was so scary that I wouldn't allow myself to question.
我想对我来说，当时太可怕了，我不允许自己质疑。
I can't explain like how-- the way it was real to me.
我无法解释它对我来说是如何真实的。
It was like I'm in this real battle that's happening everywhere.
就好像我正处于一场无处不在的真实战斗中。
I know something that nobody else knows.
我知道一些别人不知道的事情。
I'm special.
我很特别。
And God had chosen me.
神选择了我。
Yeah, it's like you're put in this fantasy world.
是的，你就像置身于这个幻想世界中。
It's like-- it's hard to explain the way it built you up but simultaneously broke you down.
就像——很难解释它是如何让你变得强大，但同时又让你崩溃的。
I mean, but it was also this part of you-- it just builds you up, like you are this person.
我的意思是，但这也是你的这一部分——它只是让你成长，就像你就是这个人一样。
And he did it in such a way-- it just was so real to me.
他以这样的方式做到了——这对我来说是如此真实。
It's funny.
很有趣。
I feel like it's at a time where you're forming your worldview as a kid.
我觉得这是你小时候形成世界观的时期。
You know what I mean?
你知道我的意思？
And like someone snuck this really messed up version of it into you.
就像有人偷偷把这个非常混乱的版本塞给你一样。
Yeah.
是的。
David Kestenbaum I talked to some other kids who were around at the time.
大卫·凯斯滕鲍姆（David Kestenbaum） 我和当时在场的其他一些孩子交谈过。
They said AJ talked to them about this stuff too.
他们说 AJ 也和他们谈过这件事。
One of them told me he sees himself as a skeptical person, but he still found himself wondering.
其中一位告诉我，他认为自己是一个持怀疑态度的人，但他仍然发现自己很疑惑。
Maybe AJ knows something.
也许AJ知道一些事情。
AJ would call him on his cell phone during school and say something like, are you in a secure location?
AJ 会在上学期间给他打电话，问他类似这样的话：你在安全的地方吗？
It was scary, but also kind of exciting, like you were a secret agent.
这很可怕，但也有点令人兴奋，就像你是一名特工一样。
But Cody was the one AJ spent the most time with, and he believed it all.
但科迪是 AJ 相处时间最多的人，他相信这一切。
His friends told me they had no idea.
他的朋友告诉我他们不知道。
In his head, it was like Cody was living inside a movie.
在他的脑海里，科迪就像生活在电影里一样。
And as it turns out, it is an actual movie from 1972 called The Rapture.
事实证明，这是一部真实的 1972 年电影《狂喜》。
That's where this whole story about a supercomputer called "The Beast," in Belgium, connected to people being marked with numbers-- that's where it comes from.
这就是关于比利时一台名为“野兽”的超级计算机的整个故事，它与被数字标记的人联系在一起——这就是它的来源。
I wasn't able to get a copy of the film.
我没能拿到这部电影的副本。
But we were able to find an LP which has a radio drama version of it in the style of War of the Worlds.
但我们找到了一张LP，其中有世界大战风格的广播剧版本。
The computer will assign each citizen of the world a number for use for all buying and all selling.
计算机将为世界上的每个公民分配一个号码，用于所有买卖。
We're setting it up so that every person will be tattooed with an invisible mark.
我们正在设置它，以便每个人都会纹上一个看不见的标记。
I've already had my number tattooed on my hand and forehead.
我已经把我的号码纹在了手上和额头上。
That's amazing.
太棒了。
David Kestenbaum I tracked down the screenwriter, a Christian author named Joe Musser.
我找到了编剧大卫·凯斯坦鲍姆（David Kestenbaum），他是一位基督徒作家，名叫乔·穆瑟（Joe Musser）。
He said some of the promotional material for the movie was in the form of fictional news stories, which some people thought were real.
他说，这部电影的一些宣传材料是虚构的新闻故事，有些人认为是真实的。
They got passed around in churches and even published in one Christian magazine.
它们在教堂里流传，甚至在一本基督教杂志上发表。
He wrote in to say, hey, you messed up.
他写信说，嘿，你搞砸了。
This isn't true.
这不是真的。
But it was too late.
但为时已晚。
40-something years later, the idea of a supercomputer in Belgium called "The Beast," it's still around.
40 多年后，比利时的超级计算机“野兽”的想法仍然存在。
Cody says he would wake up in the morning and check CNN to see if the rapture had happened, because for sure, it would be on the news.
科迪说，他早上醒来后会查看 CNN，看看是否发生了被提事件，因为这肯定会出现在新闻中。
The things AJ said were terrifying, but the only safe place was with AJ.
AJ说的话很可怕，但唯一安全的地方就是和AJ在一起。
So instead of running away, he'd go back to him.
所以他不会逃跑，而是回到他身边。
My own thoughts weren't safe.
我自己的想法并不安全。
I had this tic where I was so afraid that I would say "I hate God" in my head that if I-- I had to talk constantly in my head.
我有这样的抽动症，我非常害怕我会在脑海里说“我恨上帝”，如果我——我不得不在脑海里不断说话。
I had to say the phrase, I love God so much.
我不得不说这句话，我非常爱上帝。
God is so amazing.
神真是太奇妙了。
I love him so much.
我非常爱他。
Like I'm-- I love God.
就像我一样——我爱上帝。
I love God.
我爱上帝。
And that would be every waking hour of my day.
那将是我一天中醒着的每个小时。
I would have to say that constantly throughout in my head, or else I was afraid I would let the phrase "I hate God" out.
我必须在脑海中不断地这样说，否则我担心我会说出“我恨上帝”这句话。
And then I would be-- I would go to hell forever.
然后我就会——我会永远下地狱。
I wasn't even safe with my own self.
我什至对自己都没有安全感。
Cody hid all this from his parents for three years.
科迪向父母隐瞒了这一切三年。
And just like in basketball, how you had codes so your teammates knew what play you were running, he and AJ had one too.
就像在篮球中一样，你有代码，这样你的队友就知道你在打什么球，他和 AJ 也有一个。
He might say, even in front of my parents or something, hey, I was talking to my friend John the other day.
他可能会说，即使是在我父母面前或其他什么情况下，嘿，前几天我正在和我的朋友约翰说话。
And he told me he had 12 points and 4 rebounds in a game.
他告诉我他在一场比赛中得到12分和4个篮板。
And I knew that meant go read in the Bible, John, chapter 12, or whatever, verse 4.
我知道这意味着去读《圣经》约翰福音第 12 章，或者其他的第 4 节。
Cody's mom says she did notice Cody was more interested in religion.
科迪的妈妈说她确实注意到科迪对宗教更感兴趣。
He would pester her to let him talk to AJ about religion.
他会缠着她让他和 AJ 谈论宗教。
She said no. At some point, Cody asked to get baptized.
她说不。在某个时候，科迪要求接受洗礼。
His mom worried that might mean that AJ was still talking to Cody about religion, which he'd promised not to do.
他妈妈担心这可能意味着 AJ 仍在与科迪谈论宗教问题，而他曾承诺不会这样做。
But Cody insisted, no, no, this is just something I want to do.
但科迪坚持说，不，不，这只是我想做的事。
So they said OK.
所以他们说好的。
Drew says, in retrospect, of course, all this looks very different.
德鲁说，当然，现在回想起来，这一切看起来都非常不同。
I feel like, as a mom, how could I not know?
我觉得，作为一个妈妈，我怎么会不知道呢？
This little boy thought he was going to die every day, every minute of every day.
这个小男孩每天、每时每刻都认为他会死。
I mean, how could I have not known that?
我的意思是，我怎么可能不知道呢？
I mean, it's like Cody's been living in this world that is not the real world.
我的意思是，就像科迪一直生活在这个不是现实世界的世界中一样。
But you were also living in this world that was not the real world because this was going on, and you didn't know it.
但你也生活在这个不是真实世界的世界里，因为这一切正在发生，而你却不知道。
Right.
正确的。
Right.
正确的。
The specialists and the psychiatrists and all, they'll tell you that you have to forgive yourself.
专家和精神科医生等等，他们会告诉你，你必须原谅自己。
I guess I just don't.
我想我只是不知道。
I think my focus is just still on Cody.
我想我的注意力仍然集中在科迪身上。
I talked to some experts about cults and brainwashing.
我和一些专家谈论了邪教和洗脑问题。
And when I told them this story, they reacted the way doctors do when someone comes in with what they think is an unusual set of symptoms but that the doctor's seen a hundred times.
当我告诉他们这个故事时，他们的反应就像医生当有人进来时的反应一样，他们认为这是一组不寻常的症状，但医生已经看了一百次了。
There's no official definition of a cult.
邪教没有正式的定义。
But they all said, yeah, that sounds like one.
但他们都说，是的，这听起来像是一个。
Cults often promise the key to understanding the whole world.
邪教经常承诺提供了解整个世界的钥匙。
Followers are pressured to keep everything secret.
追随者被迫保守一切秘密。
The whole thing gets built up gradually, so it becomes hard to back out without admitting you were wrong the whole time.
整个事情是逐渐积累起来的，所以很难在不承认自己一直错了的情况下退出。
At the top of it all is a charismatic leader.
最重要的是一位有魅力的领导者。
I asked if cult leaders knew they were cult leaders.
我问邪教领袖是否知道自己是邪教领袖。
The answer, sometimes.
答案是，有时。
These experts told me perfectly healthy people with no history of mental illness fall into cults.
这些专家告诉我，没有精神疾病史的完全健康的人会陷入邪教。
Part of what makes the whole thing work is that the leader introduces something to be afraid of, while also providing the solution to that fear, which creates this really strong bond.
整个事情之所以成功，部分原因在于领导者引入了令人害怕的东西，同时也为这种恐惧提供了解决方案，从而创造了这种真正牢固的联系。
That technique, of course, is used in lots of places-- advertising, political campaigns.
当然，这种技术被用在很多地方——广告、政治活动。
Here it's just all turned up to 10.
这里全部变成了 10。
Cody's dad told me that this experience helped him understand those stories in the news about parents who wake up one day to discover one of their kids has disappeared and gone off to join ISIS.
科迪的父亲告诉我，这段经历帮助他理解了新闻中的那些故事：父母有一天醒来，发现他们的一个孩子失踪了，并加入了伊斯兰国。
The one thing the experts told me felt unusual about this case to them is that it seemed to be what they called a one-on-one cult-- one leader, one follower.
专家告诉我，他们对这个案例感到不寻常的一件事是，这似乎是他们所说的一对一的邪教——一个领导者，一个追随者。
Those can be particularly hard to undo.
这些可能特别难以撤销。
In a very real way, it was as if someone had implanted a chip in Cody's brain.
以一种非常真实的方式，就好像有人在科迪的大脑中植入了一个芯片。
David Kestenbaum.
大卫·凯斯滕鲍姆。
Coming up, Cody's parents try to get the chip out of Cody's brain, which, as you might expect, is really hard.
接下来，科迪的父母试图从科迪的大脑中取出芯片，正如你所料，这真的很难。
That's in a minute, from Chicago Public Radio, when our program continues.
稍后，芝加哥公共广播电台将继续我们的节目。
It's This American Life.
这就是美国生活。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Today's program, Chip in My Brain.
今天的节目是《我的大脑中的芯片》。
In the first half of today's show, if you're just tuning in, we heard how Cody Treybig got all kinds of sci-fi religious beliefs from his basketball coach.
在今天节目的前半部分，如果您刚刚收看，我们会听到科迪·特雷比格如何从他的篮球教练那里获得各种科幻宗教信仰。
In this half of the show, his parents try to get him to unbelieve that stuff.
在节目的这一半中，他的父母试图让他不相信这些东西。
Again, here's David Kestenbaum.
大卫·凯斯滕鲍姆再次报道。
Cody says in the initial therapy sessions, actually for most of the first year, part of him was super angry.
科迪说，在最初的治疗过程中，实际上在第一年的大部分时间里，他的一部分都非常愤怒。
Like, why do I have to go to a therapist?
比如，为什么我必须去看治疗师？
There's nothing wrong with me.
我没有什么问题。
The problem is with you.
问题出在你身上。
He'd have these tantrums.
他会发脾气。
His mom, Drew, would watch him hole up in his room for hours, and she'd just have to wait.
他的妈妈德鲁会看着他在房间里躲几个小时，而她只能等待。
Sometimes she'd say, please, please, talk to me.
有时她会说，求你了，求你了，跟我说话吧。
But Cody would just explode.
但科迪会爆炸。
Why can't I be with AJ?
为什么我不能和AJ在一起？
Can't we all just sit down with him and work this out?
我们就不能和他一起坐下来解决这个问题吗？
Instead of getting better, there were just these reminders of how deep in this world he was.
这些不但没有变得更好，反而提醒着他在这个世界上有多深。
Like this one day took Drew totally by surprise.
就像这一天让德鲁大吃一惊。
They were preparing to go on a special family trip they had planned ages ago.
他们正准备去一次他们多年前计划好的特别的家庭旅行。
They were going to go to London for the Olympics which, remember, was the very event AJ had said might mark the end of days, when the rapture could happen, which meant the Illuminati were going to be trying to implant everybody with RFID chips.
他们要去伦敦参加奥运会，请记住，这正是 AJ 所说的可能标志着末日的事件，届时狂欢可能会发生，这意味着光明会将尝试为每个人植入 RFID 芯片。
Drew didn't know any of that at the time.
德鲁当时对此一无所知。
But the morning they were getting ready to go, Cody would not get out of bed.
但在他们准备出发的那天早上，科迪却起不了床。
So I got-- I laid down next to him.
所以我——我躺在他旁边。
And I put my arms around him.
我用双臂搂住他。
And I said, Cody, we really need to leave for the airport.
我说，科迪，我们真的需要去机场了。
I said, let's just throw some clothes on you.
我说那我们就给你穿件衣服吧。
Your suitcase is packed.
你的行李箱已经收拾好了。
Let's just go.
我们走吧。
And he told me he couldn't in just the weakest voice, almost like he'd given up.
他用最微弱的声音告诉我他做不到，就像他已经放弃了一样。
He said, Mom, I can't because I'm going to get killed.
他说，妈妈，我不能，因为我会被杀。
Drew and her husband Jimmy told me they both felt like, OK, here is a moment where we can show him, prove to him, that none of this is real.
德鲁和她的丈夫吉米告诉我，他们都觉得，好吧，现在我们可以向他展示，向他证明，这一切都不是真实的。
Just come to the Olympics.
刚来奥运会。
You'll see.
你会看到的。
The fact that Cody thought we were going to die if we went there, that was a hard thing to understand.
科迪认为如果我们去那里就会死，这是一件很难理解的事情。
So I mean, no matter what the logic was, mentally, there was something that it didn't matter how we talked.
所以我的意思是，无论逻辑是什么，在心理上，我们如何交谈并不重要。
So afterwards, you would have conversations like that about many different things that you couldn't really understand.
所以后来你们会就很多你无法真正理解的不同事情进行这样的对话。
How do you convince someone that their whole worldview is wrong?
你如何让某人相信他们的整个世界观都是错误的？
Cody's therapist's take was that you couldn't.
科迪的治疗师认为你不能。
Cody was going to have to decide for himself.
科迪必须自己做出决定。
Maybe if you could take away the fear and the anxiety, it would allow his mental immune system, for lack of a better word, to function.
也许如果你能消除恐惧和焦虑，他的精神免疫系统（找不到更好的词来形容）就会发挥作用。
Cody would start to examine the idea of a supercomputer in Belgium and the Illuminati and think it all through for himself.
科迪开始研究比利时和光明会的超级计算机的想法，并亲自思考。
Back then, lots of things were triggering a kind of terror in Cody.
那时，很多事情都引发了科迪的某种恐惧。
If he'd trip on something or miss foul shots, well, AJ had told him that was a sign the devil was close by.
如果他被什么东西绊倒或错过罚球，那么，AJ 告诉他，这是魔鬼就在附近的迹象。
The therapist gave Cody ways to calm himself down when he felt that panic coming-- breathing exercises, simple facts to focus on.
当科迪感到恐慌即将来临时，治疗师给了他一些让自己平静下来的方法——呼吸练习、需要关注的简单事实。
I'm around people who love me.
我周围都是爱我的人。
One counselor who has handled cases like this put it in this way that really stuck with me.
一位处理过此类案件的辅导员的说法让我印象深刻。
He said, you have to help the fly find its way out of the bottle, the idea being that a fly in a bottle doesn't know it's in a bottle because the walls are transparent.
他说，你必须帮助苍蝇找到离开瓶子的路，这个想法是瓶子里的苍蝇不知道它在瓶子里，因为瓶壁是透明的。
But if you can get it to see the bottle, it can find its way out.
但如果你能让它看到瓶子，它就能找到出路。
The fly in a bottle is a reference to something Wittgenstein wrote, and he was talking about philosophers.
瓶子里的苍蝇参考了维特根斯坦写的东西，他在谈论哲学家。
But whatever, I found it useful.
但无论如何，我发现它很有用。
Cody's therapist never told Cody that what he believed was wrong.
科迪的治疗师从未告诉科迪他所相信的事情是错误的。
He just asked questions, tried to create a place where Cody felt safe to talk about these things and to think about them.
他只是提出问题，试图创造一个让科迪感到安全的地方来谈论这些事情并思考它们。
Cody did start to question things.
科迪确实开始质疑一些事情。
Instead of reading about RFID chips and the Illuminati, Cody started reading debates between atheists and religious scholars online.
科迪没有阅读有关 RFID 芯片和光明会的内容，而是开始在网上阅读无神论者和宗教学者之间的辩论。
He grew to love Richard Dawkins and Christopher Hitchens.
他渐渐喜欢上了理查德·道金斯和克里斯托弗·希钦斯。
But unbelieving something is hard.
但不相信某件事是很难的。
You don't want to give up that special thing that you're a part of.
你不想放弃你所参与的特殊事物。
It was really hard for me to get back to normalcy in life and recognizing that this is all there is to it-- it's just life, and you make your own meaning-- to get to the point where I realized that there wasn't this special thing that I was a part of.
对我来说，要回到正常的生活并认识到这就是生活的全部——这只是生活，你创造自己的意义——要达到这样的地步，我意识到我并不是其中的一部分，这真的很困难。
It was just made up.
这是刚刚编造出来的。
Over time, it seemed to be working.
随着时间的推移，它似乎起了作用。
Cody started having these moments where he would feel at peace, little islands of normalcy where he wouldn't have crazy thoughts.
科迪开始有这样的时刻，他会感到平静，就像一个正常的小岛，在那里他不会有疯狂的想法。
Cody remembers driving home after this one therapy session.
科迪记得在这一次治疗后开车回家。
For that one car ride, I was happy.
对于那一趟车，我很高兴。
I was happy.
我很高兴。
And I just wanted it to last forever.
我只是希望它永远持续下去。
And I thought maybe it would.
我想也许会的。
And of course, once you start to think, oh, I'm happy, and then I hope it doesn't go away.
当然，一旦你开始想，哦，我很高兴，然后我希望它不会消失。
And then you start to scare yourself.
然后你开始害怕自己。
And then it's over.
然后就结束了。
Cody says his sophomore year, he was still deep in the world that AJ had described.
科迪说，在他大二的时候，他仍然沉浸在 AJ 所描述的世界中。
Junior and senior year, he was probably half in, half out.
高三和高四的时候，他可能一半进一半出。
Like if you asked him if he believed in the Illuminati, he would say no. But it was like some deep part of him still did.
就像如果你问他是否相信光明会一样，他会说不。但他内心深处的某个部分似乎仍然如此。
He kept having these intense episodes of panic and anxiety.
他不断地出现强烈的恐慌和焦虑。
One of Cody's friends told me that Cody wouldn't talk about how deeply he'd been affected and how this stuff was still with him.
科迪的一位朋友告诉我，科迪不愿谈论他受到的影响有多深，以及这些东西如何仍然伴随着他。
But they could tell he was having a hard time.
但他们看得出来，他过得很艰难。
We tried to help him, one said.
一位人士说，我们试图帮助他。
But what did we know?
但我们知道什么？
We were 18 years old.
那年我们18岁。
Cody had to take a medical leave from high school.
科迪不得不从高中休病假。
Then he went back, finished.
然后他就回去了，完成了。
He applied to college, got in.
他申请了大学，并被录取了。
And Cody thought, if I can do this, if I can go to college and get through that, it'll be like a certificate of sanity, a sign that I'm going to be OK.
科迪想，如果我能做到这一点，如果我能上大学并完成学业，这就像一张理智证明，表明我会没事的。
It was just two hours from home.
离家只有两个小时。
His mom told him, call anytime.
他妈妈告诉他，随时打电话。
I can get in a car, and I'll be there in just two hours.
我可以坐车，两个小时内就能到达。
Things seemed to be going OK for a while.
有一段时间事情似乎进展顺利。
But she knew he was struggling.
但她知道他正在挣扎。
And then she got a call.
然后她接到电话。
I can't do it anymore, he said.
我不能再这样做了，他说。
I can't do it.
我做不到。
She drove to get him, went to his dorm room, which is when she saw how he'd been living.
她开车去接他，去了他的宿舍，这时她看到了他的生活。
Cody had mentioned to her that he had raised his bed, which she thought meant that he'd converted it into a loft or something to make more space.
科迪向她提到他已经抬高了床，她认为这意味着他将其改造成阁楼或其他东西以腾出更多空间。
But that wasn't it.
但事实并非如此。
He'd raised it a tiny bit and was sleeping under it in this little space.
他把它稍微举高了一点，就在这个狭小的空间里睡在它下面。
When I walked in there, and I saw how my son had been sleeping for months and months and months-- there were maybe inches from-- I mean I don't even know how he could have slid under there.
当我走进那里时，我看到我的儿子已经睡了好几个月了——距离可能只有几英寸——我的意思是我什至不知道他怎么会滑到那里去。
The space was so small from the ground to the bottom of the bed.
从地面到床底的空间很小。
Drew Treybig And I realized that was a hiding spot.
德鲁·特雷比格 我意识到那是一个藏身之处。
He wasn't sleeping.
他没有睡觉。
He was hiding.
他躲起来了。
Like that was his version of a-- I mean, he was literally hiding.
就像那是他的版本——我的意思是，他实际上是在躲藏。
And that's where he was living.
那就是他住的地方。
And I remember thinking when I saw that-- I mean, I said, Cody, this is where you've been sleeping?
我记得当我看到这个的时候我在想——我的意思是，我说，科迪，这就是你睡觉的地方？
And he said, yeah, Mom.
他说，是的，妈妈。
And I didn't want him to see me get upset, so I walked out of his room.
我不想让他看到我不高兴，所以我走出了他的房间。
And I broke down because I thought, we're going to-- he's not going to make it.
我崩溃了，因为我想，我们会——他不会成功的。
We're going to lose him.
我们将会失去他。
And I don't mean figuratively.
我的意思并不是比喻。
We are going to literally lose this kid.
我们真的会失去这个孩子。
We are going to lose him.
我们将会失去他。
Cody later said he had thought about killing himself.
科迪后来说，他曾想过自杀。
It seemed like it might be the only way to make this stop.
看来这可能是阻止这一切的唯一方法。
Cody and his mom drove home together.
科迪和他妈妈一起开车回家。
It had been four years at this point-- four years of, as Cody puts it, trying to fix his own brain.
此时已经过去四年了——正如科迪所说，四年来，他一直在努力修复自己的大脑。
Sometime after Cody moves home, his parents tell him there's something they need to talk to him about.
科迪搬回家后的某个时候，他的父母告诉他有件事需要和他谈谈。
They're pretty sure it's a bad idea.
他们非常确定这是一个坏主意。
But they feel like they have to tell him, because if he wants to do it, he needs to decide soon.
但他们觉得必须告诉他，因为如果他想这么做，他需要尽快做出决定。
It involved the court, and not a basketball one.
它涉及球场，而不是篮球场。
They told Cody if he wanted to, he could try to sue AJ.
他们告诉科迪，如果他愿意，他可以尝试起诉 AJ。
It was a long shot.
这是一个远景。
The law doesn't have a good way to deal with cases like this.
对于此类案件，法律并没有很好的处理办法。
After all, no one was kidnapped.
毕竟没有人被绑架。
No money was stolen.
钱没有被偷。
Cody says nothing physical ever happened.
科迪说没有发生任何实际的事情。
All they'd done was talk.
他们所做的只是谈话。
and in fact, talk about religion, which is specifically protected in this country.
事实上，谈论在这个国家受到特别保护的宗教。
It's in the Constitution.
这是宪法里写的。
Cody's parents had done some research.
科迪的父母做了一些研究。
And the best route seemed to be to sue for intentional infliction of emotional distress.
最好的途径似乎是以故意造成精神痛苦为由提起诉讼。
The legal description of what they would have to show was daunting.
对他们必须展示的内容的法律描述令人望而生畏。
The conduct had to be, quote, "So outrageous in character and so extreme in degree as to go beyond all possible bounds of decency, and to be regarded as atrocious and utterly intolerable in a civilized community."
引用的话，这种行为必须是“性质如此令人愤慨，程度如此极端，超出了所有可能的正派界限，在文明社会中被视为残暴且完全无法容忍。”
If Cody chose to do it, the whole thing could take years.
如果科迪选择这样做，整个事情可能需要数年时间。
Cody would have to be in a courtroom with AJ.
科迪必须和 AJ 一起出庭。
He would have to relive the whole thing in detail in public, while an opposing attorney tried to derail him.
他必须在公开场合详细地重温整个事情，而对方律师则试图阻止他。
In the end, he might lose.
最后，他可能会输。
Or put another way, AJ might win.
或者换句话说，AJ 可能会赢。
And there wasn't much time to think about it.
而且也没有太多的时间去思考这个问题。
Cody's birthday was coming in just a couple of weeks.
几周后科迪的生日就到了。
And the statute of limitations was going to run out.
而且诉讼时效即将到期。
So he would need to decide within the next two, two and a half weeks before his birthday.
所以他需要在生日前的两周、两周半内做出决定。
Cody thought about it.
科迪想了想。
And one day before his birthday, he filed the paperwork to go ahead.
在他生日的前一天，他提交了文件以继续进行。
There was over a year of legal wrangling.
法律纠纷持续了一年多。
But this past September, it went to trial.
但去年九月，它进入了审判阶段。
I was there for the beginning of it.
我在一开始就在那里。
Cody had all kinds of worries leading up to it.
科迪对此有各种各样的担忧。
What if he had made all this up?
如果这一切都是他编造的怎么办？
He said that actually crossed his mind.
他说这确实是他的想法。
Or what if, when he told all this to the jury, they thought there was something wrong with him instead of AJ?
或者，如果当他向陪审团讲述这一切时，他们认为有问题的是他而不是 AJ 呢？
Cody had panic attacks in the days before the trial.
科迪在审判前几天出现了恐慌症。
It was like he'd slid backward.
就好像他向后滑了一步。
But he took the stand in front of the jury.
但他在陪审团面前出庭。
The first day, I can remember so vividly.
第一天，我记得如此清晰。
We were in my weight room.
我们在我的举重室里。
And--
还有——
Cody's lawyer said this was a case of, quote, "The secret manipulation and isolation of a young boy." He called what happened psychological torture.
科迪的律师表示，这是一起“秘密操纵和孤立一个小男孩”的案件。他称所发生的事情为心理折磨。
I looked at the jury, but they were impossible to read.
我看了看陪审团，但他们根本看不懂。
They sat there totally expressionless.
他们面无表情地坐在那里。
Cody was on the stand for over seven hours.
科迪在证人席上呆了七个多小时。
But then his part was done.
但随后他的任务就完成了。
Would you state your name for the record, sir?
先生，请报出您的姓名以供记录吗？
Arthur Lawrence, Jr. Clerk And do you go by AJ?
亚瑟·劳伦斯 (Arthur Lawrence)，小职员 您是 AJ 吗？
Yes.
是的。
David Kestenbaum And here, finally, is AJ.
David Kestenbaum 最后是 AJ。
He was neatly dressed, carrying a Bible, and yes, tall, barely fit in the witness stand.
他衣着整洁，手里拿着一本《圣经》，是的，他个子很高，几乎无法坐进证人席。
My lower back is killing me.
我的下背部快要死了。
It's tightening up, and I apologize for that.
情况正在紧张，对此我深表歉意。
If you need more space, we can move those two notebooks.
如果您需要更多空间，我们可以移动那两个笔记本。
And that little table will fold down, if that's helpful.
如果有帮助的话，那张小桌子会折叠起来。
[LAUGHTER] Attorney 1 How tall are you, sir?
[笑声] 律师 1 你有多高，先生？
6' 6".
6'6"。
Attorney 1 OK.
律师1 好的。
Mr. Lawrence, have you ever been convicted of a felony?
劳伦斯先生，您曾被判犯有重罪吗？
No. Attorney 1 Have you ever been convicted of a misdemeanor?
编号 律师 1 您是否曾因轻罪被定罪？
No. David Kestenbaum That's AJ's attorney there.
不，David Kestenbaum 那是 AJ 的律师。
He asked AJ how he'd grown up.
他问 AJ 他是怎么长大的。
I had great parents.
我有很棒的父母。
Mom and Dad raised me the old-fashioned way, respect elders.
爸爸妈妈用传统的方式抚养我，尊重长辈。
Yes, sir.
是的，先生。
No, sir.
不，先生。
Yes, ma'am.
是的，女士。
No, ma'am.
不，女士。
Private, preparatory, Christian education, a pretty cool life.
私立预科基督教教育，生活很酷。
OK.
好的。
David Kestenbaum AJ went to college for a bit.
David Kestenbaum AJ 上过一段大学。
He said he'd tried out for the NBA's developmental league but didn't make it.
他说他曾尝试参加NBA发展联盟，但没有成功。
So he became an athletic trainer, often teaching kids.
所以他成为了一名运动教练，经常教孩子们。
He said families loved him.
他说家人都很爱他。
They were really happy with his work, including Cody's family.
他们对他的工作非常满意，包括科迪的家人。
It went fantastic.
一切都很顺利。
I was a little bit shocked of Cody's ability to get things quickly and understand them, especially his vocabulary, wow.
我对科迪快速了解事物并理解它们的能力感到有点震惊，尤其是他的词汇量，哇。
How were his basketball skills when you started with him?
当你刚开始和他一起工作时，他的篮球技术怎么样？
He could dribble.
他可以运球。
I think when I first saw him, the first assessment I did with him, it was-- he dribbled like-- the most he was able to dribble consecutively was like three dribbles.
我想当我第一次见到他时，我对他进行的第一次评估是——他运球的方式——他连续运球最多的次数就像三次运球。
He was not good.
他不好。
And, of course, his lawyer asked about his religious beliefs.
当然，他的律师询问了他的宗教信仰。
When did you first learn about the rapture and the tribulation?
你什么时候第一次知道被提和灾难？
Sorry, I got emotional there.
抱歉，我当时情绪激动。
I just remember Miss Ward.
我只记得沃德小姐。
I really loved that teacher.
我真的很喜欢那个老师。
She introduced me to that in central assembly in the sixth grade.
她在六年级的中央集会上向我介绍了这一点。
About the same age Cody was when AJ started talking to him about religion.
当 AJ 开始与科迪谈论宗教时，科迪大约在同一年龄。
One of the big questions I had going into the trial was whether AJ had actually believed all the religious stuff he'd told Cody.
我在审判中遇到的一个大问题是，AJ 是否真的相信他告诉科迪的所有宗教内容。
One possibility was that AJ would just say, yes, we talked about the rapture, the Illuminati, RFID chips.
一种可能性是，AJ 只会说，是的，我们谈论了狂喜、光明会、RFID 芯片。
All that stuff is real.
所有这些东西都是真实的。
I was trying to save him.
我试图拯救他。
Cody pointed out that if AJ really did believe it all, why wouldn't he just testify to that in court?
科迪指出，如果 AJ 真的相信这一切，他为什么不在法庭上作证呢？
But that is not what AJ said.
但AJ可不是这么说的。
Cody's lawyer asked AJ about the Illuminati.
科迪的律师向 AJ 询问有关光明会的情况。
AJ said, yes, he had discussed the Illuminati with Cody, but not as a secret society that ran the world.
AJ 说，是的，他曾与科迪讨论过光明会，但并不是将其视为统治世界的秘密社团。
I discussed it in a context that I do believe that there are fraternities, sororities that will cling together and assist others.
我在讨论这个问题的背景下，我确实相信兄弟会、姐妹会会团结在一起并帮助他人。
And that possibly could be a society that he sees on the internet, known as the Illuminati.
这可能是他在互联网上看到的一个社会，称为光明会。
Of course, in his Skype messages, AJ said something very different.
当然，AJ 在 Skype 消息中说了一些非常不同的话。
He really seemed to believe in the Illuminati.
他似乎真的相信光明会。
He wrote, quote, "The Illuminati will kill you if you don't do as you're told.
他写道，“如果你不按照吩咐去做，光明会就会杀了你。
Give the system problems, and you die or live with their mark."
如果系统出现问题，你的命运就会受到影响。”
Cody's lawyer also asked about RFID chips.
科迪的律师还询问了有关 RFID 芯片的问题。
Over Skype, AJ had told Cody the chips cause you to lose mind control, quote, "It's imperative that you know what this chip does!!!" - three exclamation points.
AJ 通过 Skype 告诉科迪这些芯片会导致你失去精神控制，并引用道：“你必须知道这个芯片的作用！！！” - 三个感叹号。
But on the stand, AJ downplayed that, didn't say the chips were the mark of the beast.
但在看台上，AJ 淡化了这一点，并没有说芯片是野兽的印记。
He talked about them like they were just some new technology he'd read about online.
他谈论它们就好像它们只是他在网上读到的一些新技术一样。
I had found a link online.
我在网上找到了一个链接。
I believe it was done out of the University of North Carolina.
我相信这是北卡罗来纳大学完成的。
And also, there was another link out of Alberta, Canada, I believe, that said there's biometric technology.
而且，我相信加拿大艾伯塔省还有另一个链接，说有生物识别技术。
It's here.
就在这里。
It'll store your information, et cetera, et cetera, and all your stuff.
它将存储您的信息等等，以及您的所有内容。
Would you be surprised if this was interpreted as something different than that by a 14-year-old boy?
如果这与 14 岁男孩的理解不同，您会感到惊讶吗？
After all this, [CHUCKLES] I'm not surprised now.
经历了这一切之后，[笑]我现在并不感到惊讶。
I take it, by the way you're laughing about this, that you think it's funny that this was taken very seriously by Cody at the impressionable age you were communicating with him?
顺便说一句，你对此大笑，你认为科迪在你与他交流的易受影响的年纪就非常认真地对待这件事，这很有趣吗？
No. What-- I do take this very seriously.
不，什么——我确实非常认真地对待这件事。
I mean, this is a court of law.
我的意思是，这是法庭。
What I'm implying, Counsel, is before, I didn't really think nothing of this, this Skype or anything, that it can escalate to this level because this--
律师，我的意思是，之前我并没有真正想到过这个、这个 Skype 或任何东西，它会升级到这个级别，因为这个——
Where Cody said they had talked about religion for years, AJ said their conversations had been minimal, a matter of hours total.
科迪说他们已经谈论宗教很多年了，而 AJ 说他们的谈话很少，总共也就几个小时。
He said when they did talk about religion, it was because Cody had asked.
他说，当他们确实谈论宗教时，那是因为科迪问了。
Do you feel like you owe any apologies for the communications you had with Cody about the subject of this lawsuit?
对于您与科迪就该诉讼主题进行的沟通，您是否觉得自己有必要道歉？
Let's go ahead and just jump to the end of everything.
让我们继续前进，跳到所有内容的结尾。
I pondered on this.
我思考着这一点。
And I'm looking at all of this and the jury and everybody here, Counsel.
律师，我正在关注所有这一切、陪审团和这里的每个人。
And I really wish I could turn back the hands of time and taken Mr. And Mrs. Treybig, Cody to church a lot more so that they can see and they can understand that there are a lot of others in this world.
我真的希望我能让时间倒流，带科迪特雷比格夫妇去更多的教堂，这样他们就能看到并理解这个世界上还有很多其他人。
There are a lot of other Christians that share my same views and opinions about the Bible.
有很多其他基督徒与我对圣经有相同的看法和看法。
So then they wouldn't classify me or label me as being a mean or evil person.
这样他们就不会把我分类或给我贴上卑鄙或邪恶的人的标签。
This all took place in an old courtroom in Austin.
这一切都发生在奥斯汀的一个旧法庭里。
I was struck by the smallness of it.
我对它的渺小感到震惊。
There was basically no one in the audience.
观众席上基本没有人。
Very few witnesses took the stand-- Cody, his parents, his therapist, and AJ.
很少有证人出庭作证——科迪、他的父母、他的治疗师和 AJ。
The main piece of physical evidence was those Skype transcripts, 25 pages long.
主要的物证是那些长达 25 页的 Skype 文字记录。
This is the system we've come up with for settling disputes between people.
这是我们为解决人与人之间的纠纷而提出的制度。
We get a bunch of strangers together, the jury, who just have to decide what they think happened and how bad it was.
我们把一群陌生人聚集在一起，组成陪审团，他们只需要决定他们认为发生了什么以及事情有多糟糕。
Cody's lawyer, in his closing statement, said they weren't asking for a specific amount of money in damages.
科迪的律师在结案陈词中表示，他们并没有要求具体数额的赔偿金。
But he said Cody's therapist fees had totaled over $76,000.
但他表示，科迪的治疗费总计超过 76,000 美元。
And the jury could add whatever they thought was appropriate for mental anguish.
陪审团可以添加任何他们认为适合缓解精神痛苦的内容。
AJ's attorney, in his closing statement, said no one could know for sure why Cody was so strongly affected.
AJ 的律师在结案陈词中表示，没有人能确切知道为什么科迪受到如此严重的影响。
Thousands or millions of Americans share AJ's religious beliefs, he said.
他说，成千上万的美国人与 AJ 有着共同的宗教信仰。
Why don't we have mental hospitals filled with kids who are terrified of the rapture?
为什么我们没有精神病院里住满了害怕狂喜的孩子呢？
The jury, still totally expressionless, recessed on Friday to deliberate.
陪审团仍然面无表情，于周五休会进行商议。
Was what happened beyond all possible bounds of decency?
发生的事情是否超出了所有可能的正派界限？
Was it atrocious and utterly intolerable in a civilized community?
在文明社会中这是残暴且完全无法容忍的吗？
That evening, I got this voicemail from Cody.
那天晚上，我收到了科迪发来的语音邮件。
Hey, David.
嘿，大卫。
This is Cody.
这是科迪。
And [SIGHS] wow, we won.
[叹息]哇，我们赢了。
The jury came back unanimous.
陪审团一致同意。
And I'm just so happy.
我很高兴。
I want to sing.
我想唱歌。
I want to shout.
我想大声喊叫。
I want to dance.
我想跳舞。
I'm just-- for so long, he was this mythical figure in my life that I couldn't touch.
我只是——很长一段时间以来，他都是我生命中的一个我无法触及的神话人物。
[SIGHS HEAVILY] It's amazing.
[重重叹气]太棒了。
And I'm the happiest I've ever been in my life.
我是我一生中最幸福的时刻。
And that's all I can say.
我只能说这么多。
There is one thing Cody did not mention in that message-- the amount of the judgment.
科迪在那条消息中没有提到一件事——判决的金额。
The jury awarded Cody just $4 in damages, basically the minimum-- $1 for medical care, $1 for mental anguish, et cetera, which seemed weird.
陪审团只判给科迪 4 美元的损害赔偿，基本上是最低赔偿额——1 美元用于医疗护理，1 美元用于精神痛苦等等，这看起来很奇怪。
They agreed that AJ had done this thing that was beyond all possible bounds of decency.
他们一致认为，AJ 所做的事情超出了所有可能的正派界限。
But when it came time to put a dollar figure on that, their answer was $4.
但当需要用美元来衡量时，他们的答案是 4 美元。
We talked to five members of the jury after the trial.
审判后我们与五名陪审团成员进行了交谈。
So I can tell you what happened.
所以我可以告诉你发生了什么事。
The presiding juror who they picked to lead the discussion, and who happens to be a judge in real life, told me they started with a quick vote to see where everyone stood.
他们选出的主持讨论的首席陪审员，同时也是现实生活中的法官，告诉我，他们首先进行了快速投票，以了解每个人的立场。
Seven jurors were yeses, ready to hold AJ liable.
七名陪审员表示同意，准备让 AJ 承担责任。
Three were undecided, and two were nos.
其中三个尚未决定，两个则没有。
So they debated and read through the Skype transcripts.
于是他们进行了辩论并通读了 Skype 的文字记录。
And they took another vote, 10 yeses, two undecideds, both of them men.
他们又进行了一次投票，10 票赞成，2 票犹豫不决，都是男性。
The presiding juror told me two things seemed to win over the last two.
首席陪审员告诉我，有两件事似乎胜过最后两件事。
One was the mothers on the jury, who just kind of went to town.
其中之一是陪审团中的母亲们，她们只是进城了。
And the other was this idea of awarding just $4 in damages.
另一个是只判给 4 美元损害赔偿金的想法。
And everyone liked that idea.
每个人都喜欢这个主意。
For some, it was a way to acknowledge that maybe AJ hadn't known the harm he was causing.
对于一些人来说，这是承认 AJ 可能不知道他所造成的伤害的一种方式。
Legally, they only had to determine that his behavior had been reckless, not necessarily intentional.
从法律上讲，他们只需确定他的行为是鲁莽的，不一定是故意的。
It seemed to some of the jurors that AJ actually believed the stuff about RFID chips and all that.
在一些陪审员看来，AJ 实际上相信有关 RFID 芯片之类的东西。
But for a lot of the jurors, the $4 was a way to help Cody put this behind him.
但对于很多陪审员来说，4 美元是帮助科迪摆脱这一切的一种方式。
Cody's family didn't need any money.
科迪的家人不需要任何钱。
And they figured, if they picked a large dollar amount, yes, that would punish AJ.
他们认为，如果他们选择了一大笔金额，是的，这会惩罚 AJ。
But he probably wouldn't be able to pay it, which would just drag this whole thing out, more legal stuff.
但他可能无法支付这笔费用，这只会拖延整个事情，更多的法律问题。
Maybe AJ would appeal.
也许AJ会上诉。
And everyone would have to go through this whole thing again.
每个人都必须再次经历这整件事。
So $4.
所以 4 美元。
I'm not sure that's how the jury was supposed to think about things, but it's what they did.
我不确定陪审团应该如何思考事情，但他们就是这么做的。
After the trial, some of the jurors hugged Cody or came over to talk.
审判结束后，一些陪审员拥抱了科迪，或者走过来说话。
One told me he also tried to find AJ to say good luck.
有人告诉我，他还试图找到 AJ 说祝你好运。
But he'd already left.
但他已经离开了。
I usually think of courts as deciding who goes to prison or how much money someone owes someone else.
我通常认为法院是决定谁进监狱或某人欠别人多少钱的。
Here, it was doing something much more basic, just saying who was right, deciding for the record what actually happened.
在这里，它正在做一些更基本的事情，只是说谁是对的，决定记录实际发生的事情。
As I said, after the trial, AJ did finally agree to talk to us.
正如我所说，审判后，AJ 最终同意与我们交谈。
Hey, David.
嘿，大卫。
David Kestenbaum Is this AJ?
大卫·凯斯滕鲍姆 这是 AJ 吗？
This is he.
这就是他。
David Kestenbaum The thing I was most interested in was, what was it all about?
David Kestenbaum 我最感兴趣的是，这到底是关于什么的？
Why did he say all that stuff to Cody?
他为什么要对科迪说这些话？
But in our conversation, AJ basically denied saying those things.
但在我们的谈话中，AJ基本上否认说过这些话。
He said Cody made it all up or exaggerated.
他说这一切都是科迪编造的或夸大的。
He told me he stood by everything he said in court, 100%.
他告诉我他百分百坚持他在法庭上所说的一切。
And he's planning to appeal the ruling.
他计划对裁决提出上诉。
So I took a different approach.
所以我采取了不同的方法。
Forget about what he said or didn't say to Cody.
忘记他对科迪说过或没说过的话。
Did he believe those things?
他相信那些事吗？
Somehow in court, no one had asked him that simple question.
不知何故，在法庭上，没有人问过他这么简单的问题。
So can I ask you about RFID chips?
那么我可以向您询问有关 RFID 芯片的问题吗？
In court, it seemed like you were saying you viewed RFID chips as just some new piece of technology to store data about you and that you'd sent Cody a link to some news story.
在法庭上，您似乎在说您将 RFID 芯片视为存储有关您的数据的某种新技术，并且您向 Cody 发送了一些新闻报道的链接。
But then in the Skype transcripts, Cody writes, "What do they do to your body?" And you write, "You lose mind control." And also, you have this whole discussion with him about what to do if his parents make him get an RFID chip implanted.
但科迪在 Skype 记录中写道：“它们对你的身体做了什么？”然后你写道：“你失去了精神控制。”而且，您还与他进行了整个讨论，讨论如果他的父母让他植入 RFID 芯片该怎么办。
So which is it?
那么是哪一个呢？
Do you think RFID chips are just little computer chips or you think they're the mark of the beast that the Illuminati want to implant in everyone?
您认为 RFID 芯片只是小型计算机芯片，还是认为它们是光明会想要植入每个人体内的野兽标记？
How familiar are you with radio frequency?
您对射频的熟悉程度如何？
If you're in broadcasting, you should know quite a bit.
如果你从事广播工作，你应该了解很多。
[CHUCKLES] Right?
[笑]对吧？
[LAUGHING]
[笑]
Tell me something about radio frequencies.
告诉我一些关于无线电频率的事情。
Tell me something that's useful here about radio frequencies.
告诉我一些关于无线电频率的有用信息。
Well, the thing about it is you're interviewing me.
嗯，问题是你正在采访我。
I'm not interviewing you.
我不是在采访你。
I'm not here to educate you about radio frequency.
我来这里不是为了向您介绍无线电频率。
No, I'm just asking a question.
不，我只是问一个问题。
You seemed to say that there's something important I should know about radio frequencies that would help me understand this, so--
你似乎说我应该了解一些关于无线电频率的重要知识，这将有助于我理解这一点，所以——
Well, let's start off with what they are.
好吧，让我们从它们是什么开始吧。
Radio frequency identification is what it is, OK?
射频识别就是这样，好吗？
You have a credit card probably in your pocket.
您的口袋里可能有一张信用卡。
And it has a chip in it.
它里面有一个芯片。
Yeah.
是的。
So is that all you think it is?
那么这就是您所认为的全部吗？
Do you think it's the mark of the beast also?
你认为这也是兽的印记吗？
And that it's something the Illuminati want to implant in everybody and will control your mind, do you believe that?
这是光明会想要植入每个人并控制你的思想的东西，你相信吗？
Well, first of all, in a court of law, that's-- I would object to that.
嗯，首先，在法庭上，我会反对这一点。
It's called compounding, OK?
这就是所谓的复合，好吗？
Well, do you-- Aj Lawrence So if you're going to ask me a question--
好吧，你 - Aj Lawrence 那么如果你要问我一个问题 -
OK.
好的。
Aj Lawrence --I mean, ask me a specific one.
Aj Lawrence——我的意思是，问我一个具体的问题。
Don't put words in my mouth and don't lead me.
不要把话放在我嘴里，也不要引导我。
OK.
好的。
Do you believe-- Aj Lawrence I really wish you wouldn't do that.
你相信吗——Aj Lawrence 我真的希望你不要这么做。
Do you believe RFID chips are, or could be, the mark of the beast?
您是否相信 RFID 芯片是或可能是野兽的印记？
I believe that it could be a potential prequel to the mark of the beast based upon what it says, what it states, in scripture.
我相信，根据《圣经》中的说法和陈述，这可能是《野兽印记》的潜在前传。
I told AJ what the experts told me, that this seemed like a one-on-one cult.
我告诉 AJ 专家告诉我的话，这似乎是一对一的崇拜。
He said he's not part of any cult.
他说他不属于任何邪教。
Elaborate.
详细说明。
David Kestenbaum I don't know.
大卫·凯斯滕鲍姆 我不知道。
I mean, are you angry at him?
我的意思是，你对他生气吗？
I feel sorry for him.
我为他感到难过。
I feel sorry for him.
我为他感到难过。
I really do.
我真的这么做。
I'm really disappointed.
我真的很失望。
I'm sad.
我很伤心。
But you know what?
但你知道吗？
Life is about choices.
生活就是选择。
So on Judgment Day, he'll have to stand before the father.
所以在审判日，他必须站在父亲面前。
And that's-- vengeance is that of the father.
这就是——父亲的复仇。
If you ask me what I make of all this after listening to four days of testimony, reading through the trial documents, interviewing the family and other kids and AJ for two hours, I think AJ believes all the stuff he told Cody.
如果你问我在听了四天的证词、阅读了审判文件、采访了家人和其他孩子以及 AJ 两个小时后对这一切有何看法，我认为 AJ 相信他告诉科迪的所有事情。
I found someone who knew AJ before all this, who said he talked about RFID chips and the Illuminati all the time, with enthusiasm.
我找到了一个在此之前认识 AJ 的人，他说他一直热情地谈论 RFID 芯片和光明会。
I think the appeal for AJ is the same as it was for Cody.
我认为对 AJ 的吸引力与对 Cody 的吸引力是一样的。
It's a story he is at the center of.
这是一个以他为中心的故事。
I think he's learned how to present it in a way that draws people in.
我认为他已经学会了如何以吸引人们的方式呈现它。
And Cody was a sweet kid who adored AJ.
科迪是个可爱的孩子，很喜欢 AJ。
I went to visit Cody after the trial.
审判结束后我去探望科迪。
It did seem like the court case had put some final piece of this thing behind him.
法庭案件似乎确实让他摆脱了这件事的最后一部分。
It was like Cody had gotten over his fear of the rapture and the Illuminati.
就好像科迪已经克服了对狂喜和光明会的恐惧。
But he still had a much more ordinary fear.
但他仍然有一种更为平常的恐惧。
He was afraid of a person.
他害怕一个人。
But in court, AJ did not seem supernatural.
但在法庭上，AJ 看起来并不超自然。
He seemed very human.
他看起来很人性化。
You look at him, and you say, you're just a guy.
你看着他，你说，你只是个男人。
You're just a person.
你只是一个人。
Is part of why this was so powerful for you that you lived for so long with this totally other version of how the world was.
这就是为什么这对你如此强大，以至于你长期生活在这个完全不同的世界版本中的部分原因。
And here's the time where you've finally decided what is real.
现在是你最终决定什么是真实的时候了。
And now you've shown it to a bunch of other people in this very setting where we are supposed to decide what is real and what happened.
现在你已经在这个环境中向其他一群人展示了它，我们应该在这个环境中决定什么是真实的以及发生了什么。
And they said yes.
他们说是的。
That's exactly it.
就是这样。
You look back, and you just can't believe that the things you're saying actually happened.
当你回头看时，你简直不敢相信你所说的事情真的发生了。
It's crazy stuff to me now.
现在这对我来说太疯狂了。
It's crazy stuff.
这太疯狂了。
And that it happened to you, it's weird.
而且这件事发生在你身上，这很奇怪。
I think those are the words of a fly finally looking at the bottle from the outside.
我想这是一只苍蝇最终从外面看着瓶子时说的话。
David Kestenbaum, he's one of the producers of our show.
大卫·凯斯滕鲍姆（David Kestenbaum），他是我们节目的制片人之一。
[MUSIC - "CULT OF PERSONALITY" BY LIVING COLOR]
[音乐 - “个性崇拜”，BY LIVING COLOR]
Credits Ira Glass Our program was produced today by Neil Drumming.
图片来源 Ira Glass 今天我们的节目由 Neil Drumming 制作。
Our staff includes Ben Calhoun, Zoe Chace, Dana Chivvis, Sean Cole, Kimberly Henderson, David Kestenbaum, Miki Meek, Alvin Melathe, Jonathan Menjivar, BA Parker, Lilly Sullivan, Christopher Swetala, Matt Tierney, and Diane Wu.
我们的员工包括 Ben Calhoun、Zoe Chace、Dana Chivvis、Sean Cole、Kimberly Henderson、David Kestenbaum、Miki Meek、Alvin Melathe、Jonathan Menjivar、BA Parker、Lilly Sullivan、Christopher Swetala、Matt Tierney 和 Diane Wu。
Our senior producer is Brian Reed.
我们的高级制片人是布莱恩·里德。
Our managing editor is Susan Burton.
我们的总编辑是苏珊·伯顿。
[ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS] Today is the last day for our production fellow BA Parker.
[致谢] 今天是我们的制作伙伴 BA Parker 的最后一天。
She came here from her job as a film professor.
她是从电影教授的工作来到这里的。
She leaves a radio producer and essayist.
她离开了电台制作人和散文家。
We all look forward to having her stories here on the radio show very soon.
我们都期待很快在广播节目中听到她的故事。
A special announcement, our brand new, newly-designed website is at thisamericanlife.org, with lots of new features.
特别宣布，我们全新设计的网站位于 thisamericanlife.org，具有许多新功能。
We also have a brand new app.
我们还有一个全新的应用程序。
Our app is available for both iPhone and Android.
我们的应用程序适用于 iPhone 和 Android。
Whitney Dangerfield, Julie Whitaker, and Seth Lind on our staff made all that happen.
我们的员工惠特尼·丹泽菲尔德 (Whitney Dangerfield)、朱莉·惠特克 (Julie Whitaker) 和赛斯·林德 (Seth Lind) 促成了这一切。
This American Life is delivered to public radio stations by PRX, the Public Radio Exchange.
《美国生活》由公共广播电台 PRX 向公共广播电台播出。
Thanks, as always, to our program's cofounder, Mr. Tony Malatia.
一如既往地感谢我们项目的联合创始人托尼·马拉蒂亚先生。
You know, he always gets so sad when he sees a garden gnome.
你知道，当他看到花园侏儒时，他总是感到非常悲伤。
They have eyes, but they can't see.
他们有眼睛，但他们看不到。
They have ears, but they can't hear.
他们有耳朵，但听不到声音。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Back next week with more stories of This American Life.
下周我们将带来更多《美国生活》的故事。
This American Life is produced in collaboration with WBEZ Chicago and delivered to stations by PRX The Public Radio Exchange.
《This American Life》与 WBEZ Chicago 合作制作，并由 PRX 公共广播电台传送到各电台。