602: The Sun Comes Up - This American Life

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00:00 00:00 Transcript Share This American Life Life Partners How to Listen Episodes Recommended About Overview Staff Announcements Fellowships Jobs Music Make Radio On The Road FAQ Submissions Merch Contact Us Our Other Shows Merch Follow Us Life Partners Subscribe to our newsletter Full episode Toggle Audio and Transcript Sync Transcript | Episode #602 | November 11, 2016 602: The Sun Comes Up Note: This American Life is produced for the ear and designed to be heard.

00:00 00:00 文字记录 分享此 美国生活 生活伙伴 如何收听 剧集 推荐 关于 概述 员工公告 奖学金 工作 音乐 在路上制作电台 常见问题解答 提交 商品 联系我们 我们的其他节目 商品 关注我们 生活伙伴 订阅我们的时事通讯 整集 切换音频和文字记录同步 文字记录 | 内容第 602 集 | 2016 年 11 月 11 日 602：太阳升起 注意：《美国生活》是为耳朵而制作的，旨在让人们听到。

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如果可以的话，我们强烈建议您收听音频，其中包括页面上没有的情感和重点。

Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors.

文字记录是使用语音识别软件和人工转录员结合生成的，可能包含错误。

Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print.

请在印刷版引用前检查相应的音频。

Prologue Ira Glass It's This American Life .

序言 艾拉·格拉斯 这就是美国生活。

I'm Ira Glass.

我是艾拉·格拉斯。

OK, so much has already been said about this week's news.

好的，关于本周的新闻已经说了这么多。

And so what we're going to do today is very simple.

所以我们今天要做的事情非常简单。

We have people from all over the country, all walks of life, absorbing the news and getting to talk about what they are feeling and thinking.

我们有来自全国各地、各行各业的人们，他们吸收新闻并谈论他们的感受和想法。

Some of these people you may agree with, some you will not.

其中有些人您可能同意，有些人则不同意。

This has been a year where it feels like the two sides are so radically far apart.

今年感觉两方差距如此之大。

But of course, we all live here in this country together, we are all facing this future together-- what are we feeling right now as we do that?

但当然，我们一起生活在这个国家，我们一起面对这个未来——当我们这么做的时候，我们现在的感受是什么？

And I'm just going to start right in on our first stop.

我将从我们的第一站开始。

Act One, Southern Florida.

第一幕，佛罗里达州南部。

Our producer Miki Meek met these two police officers.

我们的制片人米基·米克会见了这两名警察。

They were both Latino, both voted Obama in 2008, then Romney in 2012, then Donald Trump this week.

他们都是拉丁裔，2008 年都投票给奥巴马，2012 年投票给罗姆尼，本周又投票给唐纳德·特朗普。

It was Thursday, middle of the night.

那是星期四，半夜。

And I was in the parking lot of a restaurant in South Florida, where these two officers were taking a short break.

当时我在南佛罗里达州一家餐厅的停车场，两名警官正在那里短暂休息。

The news of President Trump had been out for exactly 24 hours, and they were still in shock.

特朗普总统的消息传出整整24小时，他们仍然处于震惊之中。

The results came in just as they were checking out a burglary at a local business.

当他们正在检查当地一家企业的入室盗窃案时，结果出来了。

They turned and said to each other.

他们转身互相说道。

This is almost as good as the Dolphins winning the Super Bowl.

这几乎和海豚队赢得超级碗一样好。

You know?

你知道？

Yeah, I didn't know.

是的，我不知道。

I looked at the Miami Dolphins.

我看了迈阿密海豚队。

The last time they won the Super Bowl, 1974.

他们上一次赢得超级碗是在 1974 年。

We never expected anything.

我们从来没有期待过什么。

Just all of a sudden it happened.

只是突然发生了。

This is Nick.

这是尼克。

He and his partner Alex said they'd talk to me as long as I didn't use their real names or say what police department they worked for.

他和他的搭档亚历克斯说，只要我不使用他们的真实姓名或透露他们在哪个警察局工作，他们就会和我交谈。

Also, we had to kind of hide behind their SUV, just in case other cops drove by.

此外，我们还得躲在他们的SUV后面，以防其他警察开车经过。

Nick and Alex aren't supposed to talk to the press.

尼克和亚历克斯不应该接受媒体采访。

But like a lot of police officers, the last couple of years have been pretty rough for them.

但和许多警察一样，过去几年对他们来说非常艰难。

And hearing Donald Trump be called President Trump, it calmed them.

听到唐纳德·特朗普被称为特朗普总统，这让他们平静下来。

Here's Alex.

这是亚历克斯。

Right now is what we're thinking of, it's-- he's going to install members of his cabinet that are going to be more law and order.

现在我们正在考虑的是，他将任命他的内阁成员，这些成员将更加法律和秩序。

Then Nick jumped back in.

然后尼克跳了回来。

Nick It was actually just a relief, like saying, God, maybe now there's a change in directions.

尼克：这实际上只是一种解脱，就像在说，上帝，也许现在方向发生了变化。

Maybe now it's not OK to go out and riot in the streets and burn down buildings, saying, [BLEEP] the police.

也许现在不适合出去在街上骚乱并烧毁建筑物，并说[哔]警察。

Maybe there will be hope.

也许会有希望。

Maybe somebody's up there that could change that and say, hey, enough is enough.

也许有人可以改变这一点并说，嘿，够了。

Here's an example of how they're treated.

这是他们受到的待遇的一个例子。

The night before, on election night, they stopped by a restaurant.

前一天晚上，选举之夜，他们去了一家餐馆。

There were a lot of people standing around the TV, and Trump was on, giving his victory speech.

电视周围站着很多人，特朗普正在发表胜利演讲。

And we asked to turn up the volume so we could listen to whatever was said.

我们要求调高音量，这样我们就可以听到所说的内容。

And one particular person said, no, we're not going to raise the volume on the TV.

一个人说，不，我们不会提高电视的音量。

Someone else reached over and turned it up for them.

有人伸手帮他们打开。

That person got extremely upset and said, why are you raising the volume for these people?

那人很不高兴地说，你为什么要给这些人开大音量？

And the person just shook their heads and walked away, like in disbelief.

那人只是摇摇头，一脸不可置信地走开。

Like, I can't believe we've got to let these cops listen to what the president has to say.

就像，我不敢相信我们必须让这些警察听总统所说的话。

It's kind of like, for many years, you're kind of like down under a rock.

多年来，你就像在岩石下一样。

And then finally you kind of get used to living down there.

最后你就习惯了那里的生活。

You go to any bar, you go to any gathering or barbecue or anything like that, and the first thing, hey, what do you do for a living?

你去任何酒吧，去任何聚会或烧烤或类似的事情，第一件事就是，嘿，你以什么为生？

And you're like, here we go.

你就像，我们开始吧。

And it's like, the last thing I want to tell people is I'm a cop.

就像，我想告诉人们的最后一件事是我是一名警察。

I'm a firefighter.

我是一名消防员。

Firefighter.

消防队员。

What else do I tell people?

我还能告诉人们什么？

I sell pharmaceuticals.

我卖药品。

I don't even know.

我什至不知道。

I come up with the weirdest things.

我想出了最奇怪的事情。

But people's demeanor immediately changes.

但人们的神态立刻就变了。

What does it look like?

它看起来像什么？

Nick They're just like, oh, oh!

尼克他们就像，哦，哦！

Everything changes.

一切都变了。

Even if they're holding a drink, they'll put it down.

即使他们手里拿着一杯酒，他们也会放下。

Although Nick and Alex were both Obama supporters in 2008, they felt let down by the president and the Democratic Party.

尽管尼克和亚历克斯在2008年都是奥巴马的支持者，但他们对总统和民主党感到失望。

They didn't like how policing issues had been handled over the past few years.

他们不喜欢过去几年处理警务问题的方式。

It was a lack of support.

这是缺乏支持。

Obviously it was 100% a lack of support.

显然这是100%缺乏支持。

Basically right now, when a police officer is involved in anything, we are guilty until proven innocent.

基本上现在，当一名警察参与任何事情时，我们都是有罪的，直到被证明无罪。

You're supposed to be for everybody.

你应该适合所有人。

You're the president of everybody.

你是所有人的总统。

And then during this election, the way he ran and the way he supported Hillary, and Hillary's number one thing was, hey, let's bring on victims of these shootings, let's bring the Black Lives Matter, let's bring out artists that sing against police.

然后在这次选举期间，他的竞选方式和支持希拉里的方式，希拉里的首要任务是，嘿，让我们带上这些枪击事件的受害者，让我们带上“黑人生命也是命”，让我们带上唱反对警察的艺术家。

We're good guys, they kept saying to me.

我们是好人，他们一直对我说。

We're not all bad apples.

我们并不都是坏苹果。

Both Alex and Nick are upfront that Trump has done things that trouble them.

亚历克斯和尼克都坦言特朗普做了一些让他们烦恼的事情。

All the stuff he's said about women, it shocked them.

他所说的所有关于女性的事情都让她们感到震惊。

And also--

还有——

He's inexperienced.

他缺乏经验。

And I think he's very hot-headed.

我认为他非常头脑发热。

And when you're a man of the power that he is now, any wrong decision could cost a lot.

当你是一个拥有现在这样权力的人时，任何错误的决定都可能造成巨大的损失。

Is he the answer that we're looking for?

他就是我们要寻找的答案吗？

Who knows?

谁知道？

But for the moment, he feels like their best bet.

但就目前而言，他感觉是他们最好的选择。

Miki Meek.

米基·米克.

Act Two: Metro-North Train Ira Glass Act Two, Metro North Train.

第二幕：地铁北线列车 Ira Glass 第二幕，地铁北线列车。

OK, so next we head north.

好的，接下来我们向北行驶。

One of our producers, Neil Drumming, talked to somebody who was not happy with the results of Tuesday's election at all and was trying to figure out how to brace herself and think about the coming days.

我们的一位制片人尼尔·德鲁明 (Neil Drumming) 与一位对周二选举结果根本不满意的人进行了交谈，他正在努力弄清楚如何做好准备并思考未来的日子。

Wednesday morning, my friend Janelle posted a comment on Facebook.

周三早上，我的朋友珍妮尔在 Facebook 上发表了一条评论。

Janelle's a stand-up comedian, so this stood out to me because it wasn't at all funny.

珍妮尔是一位单口喜剧演员，所以这对我来说很突出，因为它一点也不好笑。

But it was a thing a lot of my black friends had been saying on social media in the hours after the election.

但这是我的很多黑人朋友在选举后几个小时内在社交媒体上说的一句话。

Her post read, "All the older black people I've spoken to this morning, including my mom, are not surprised.

她的帖子写道：“今天早上我采访过的所有年长黑人，包括我妈妈，都不感到惊讶。

Straight of back, and calm as [BLEEP], so I will strive for the same."

背部笔直，平静如[BLEEP]，所以我会努力做到这一点。”

The next day, I called Janelle to ask her about it.

第二天，我打电话给珍妮尔询问此事。

She was on the train headed into New York to do some gigs.

她当时正在火车上前往纽约参加一些演出。

What did your mom say?

你妈妈说什么了？

Or what did you ask her, and what did she say?

或者你问她什么，她说什么？

Well, my mom is, like, one of those people that stresses out over the littlest [BLEEP].

嗯，我妈妈是那种因为最小的[BLEEP]而感到压力的人之一。

Like, she watches-- she checks the weather where I live and tells me when storms are coming.

就像，她观察——她检查我居住地的天气并告诉我暴风雨何时来临。

[CHUCKLING] So I called her thinking she would be freaking out.

[咯咯笑]所以我打电话给她，以为她会吓坏了。

I mean, I was freaking out.

我是说，我吓坏了。

Wait.

等待。

What kind of state were you in, first of all?

首先，你处于什么样的状态？

Oh, I was-- I didn't sleep all night.

哦，我——我整夜没睡。

Like, I was really feeling real stressed.

就像，我真的感到压力很大。

Like, physical pain stress.

比如，身体疼痛压力。

And then so, when you called your mother, like, how was she on the phone?

然后，当你打电话给你妈妈时，她在电话里怎么样？

I called her thinking she would be even worse than me, and she was so chill that it was surprising.

我打电话给她，以为她会比我更糟糕，而她却如此冷漠，这令人惊讶。

I called her, and I was like, can you believe this?

我打电话给她，我问她，你能相信吗？

And she was like, you know where we live.

她说，你知道我们住在哪里。

That's what she said, you know?

她就是这么说的，你知道吗？

Yeah.

是的。

Neil Drumming Janelle's mother means the United States of America.

尼尔·鼓明（Neil Drumming）珍妮尔（Janelle）的母亲意指美利坚合众国。

When she told Janelle "you know where we live," she meant, in a country with a history of racism that runs so deep, you as a black person should not be shocked by the results of this election or anything else you may witness in the near future.

当她告诉珍妮尔“你知道我们住在哪里”时，她的意思是，在一个种族主义历史如此根深蒂固的国家，你作为一个黑人不应该对这次选举的结果或你在不久的将来可能目睹的任何其他事情感到震惊。

Stay cool.

保持冷静。

Like, I've heard that sentiment a few times now, and does it make you feel better?

就像，我已经听过几次这样的观点了，这会让你感觉好一点吗？

Or how does it make you feel?

或者它让你感觉如何？

It's kind of resigned.

有点辞职了。

I feel like that's how black people are.

我感觉黑人就是这样。

We're just like, this is how it's gonna be.

我们就像，事情就是这样。

And you get little moments of reprieve.

你会得到短暂的喘息机会。

Like, I guess Obama here and there.

就像，我猜奥巴马到处都是。

But it always comes back.

但它总是会回来。

Like, we're just always waiting for the shoe to drop.

就像，我们总是在等待鞋子落地。

And it's an ever-present thing that we have to deal with, this feeling of being just always, this [BLEEP] is dangerous is how I feel, you know.

这是我们必须处理的始终存在的事情，这种总是存在的感觉，这种[BLEEP]很危险，这就是我的感受，你知道。

[BLEEP] surrounded.

[BLEEP] 被包围了。

So, half the country now, literally half the country, I don't know who the fuck is sitting next to me, closed mouth smiling about this [BLEEP].

所以，现在，半个国家，实际上是半个国家，我不知道他妈的是谁坐在我旁边，闭着嘴微笑着这个[BLEEP]。

You know what I mean?

你知道我的意思？

And you travel a lot, right?

而且你经常旅行，对吗？

You're on the road in all of these towns.

您正在所有这些城镇的路上。

Yeah.

是的。

I feel like I'm not under siege, but yeah, I just don't feel safe.

我觉得我没有被围困，但是，是的，我只是感觉不安全。

Whereas maybe before, I had forgotten.

而也许以前，我已经忘记了。

That's what happens.

就是这样。

You forget.

你忘了。

And then this [BLEEP] happens.

然后这个[BLEEP]发生了。

And you're like, oh yeah.

你就像，哦，是的。

We know where we live, like my mother says.

正如我母亲所说，我们知道我们住在哪里。

Like, that's basically what she was saying, like, oh, you forgot.

就像，这基本上就是她所说的，就像，哦，你忘了。

I guess if I was you, I would feel genuine-- I mean, I'm concerned myself.

我想如果我是你，我会感到真诚——我的意思是，我自己也很担心。

But it's like the notion of going around these towns.

但这就像游览这些城镇的想法。

Like, you're going to see a lot.

就像，你会看到很多。

Yeah.

是的。

I mean, I feel like for most black people, it's not that it's Donald Trump.

我的意思是，我觉得对于大多数黑人来说，这并不是唐纳德·特朗普。

It's what he represents.

这就是他所代表的。

You know what I mean?

你知道我的意思？

And so there were those-- people have already, they're coming out of the woodwork.

因此，人们已经这样做了，他们正在从木制品中脱颖而出。

You know, there's already been reports of people walking around with black face, walking up to people saying [BLEEP].

你知道，已经有报道称有人黑脸走来走去，走到人们面前说[BLEEP]。

Like, we can say that now.

就像，我们现在可以这么说。

Just [BLEEP] jerks-- he represents jerks.

只是[BLEEP]混蛋——他代表混蛋。

They [BLEEP] hate their life and just mad at the world and want to lash out.

他们[发出哔哔声]讨厌自己的生活，只是对这个世界感到愤怒，想要猛烈抨击。

Do you feel emboldened at all?

你觉得有底气吗？

Do you feel bolstered at all by what your mom said?

妈妈的话让你感到振奋了吗？

Like, I mean, not just is there a silver lining for you, but are you confident?

就像，我的意思是，不仅你有一线希望，而且你有信心吗？

It just calmed me down.

这让我平静下来。

I'm not, like, oh, now everything's going to be fine.

我不是，哦，现在一切都会好起来的。

I'm still like, people are just on alert.

我仍然认为，人们只是保持警惕。

That's how I feel.

我就是这样的感觉。

Like, my body is just on alert.

就像，我的身体正处于戒备状态。

You know what I mean?

你知道我的意思？

Danger, danger.

危险，危险。

Like, that's how my body feels.

就像，这就是我的身体的感觉。

Act Three, Trump Tower.

第三幕，特朗普大厦。

So we've all been witnessing this historic campaign and this election together.

因此，我们共同见证了这场历史性的竞选活动和这次选举。

But some of us have front-row seats on that.

但我们中的一些人拥有前排座位。

And our producer Karen Duffin went to talk to somebody who actually knows the man who is going to be the president.

我们的制片人凯伦·达芬（Karen Duffin）去采访了一位真正认识即将成为总统的人的人。

Here she is.

她在这里。

Last week, a few days before the election, I spent an hour inside Trump Tower, where Donald Trump lives, talking with a friend and neighbor of his, a guy named George Lombardi.

上周，就在大选前几天，我在唐纳德·特朗普居住的特朗普大厦内呆了一个小时，与他的朋友兼邻居乔治·隆巴迪交谈。

I mean, you're here.

我的意思是，你在这里。

I wish your audience can see.

我希望你的观众能够看到。

I've got two pictures here, one of George Bush, Jr, and one of George Bush, Sr, with myself.

我这里有两张照片，一张是小乔治·布什的照片，一张是老乔治·布什和我自己的照片。

I've got also Rudy Giuliani.

我还有鲁迪·朱利安尼。

I've got also the Pope and the Dalai Lama.

我还有教皇和达赖喇嘛。

But anyway--

但无论如何——

His living room is littered with pictures of famous people.

他的客厅里堆满了名人的照片。

I couldn't see any of Trump from where I was sitting, but they've been friends for over 25 years now.

从我坐的地方看不到特朗普，但他们已经是 25 年多的朋友了。

In June of last year, I said, Donald, are you really serious about this, for president?

去年六月，我说，唐纳德，作为总统，你真的认真对待这件事吗？

And he goes, yep.

然后他就走了，是的。

I'm determined.

我已下定决心。

I'm going to do it.

我会去做的。

So he signed on to help his friend out.

于是他报名帮助他的朋友摆脱困境。

He organized volunteers for Trump.

他为特朗普组织了志愿者。

And when we talked last week, he told me something that at the time seemed to me and probably every pollster in the country a little like wishful thinking.

当我们上周谈话时，他告诉我一些当时对我以及可能在该国每个民意调查专家来说都有点像一厢情愿的想法。

There might be a big surprise on November 8.

11月8日可能会有一个大惊喜。

Do you think there will be?

你觉得会有吗？

George Lombardi Absolutely.

乔治·隆巴迪 绝对的。

I wouldn't be surprised if we get 48 states.

如果我们有 48 个州，我不会感到惊讶。

Really?

真的吗？

Trump did not win 48 states.

特朗普没有赢得 48 个州。

But when I called George this week, it was, of course, a very different conversation.

但是当我本周给乔治打电话时，当然，这是一次非常不同的谈话。

So, do you want the chance to say, I told you so, Karen?

那么，你想有机会说，我告诉过你了吗，凯伦？

No. Absolutely not.

不，绝对不。

No, no. I mean, honestly, the margin was so small that if I have to give, you know, really responsibility for the victory of Mr. Trump, it's to the Almighty God.

不，不。我的意思是，老实说，差距是如此之小，以至于如果我必须为特朗普先生的胜利承担真正的责任，那就是全能的上帝。

Because only God could pull something like that, frankly speaking.

因为坦白说，只有上帝才能做出这样的事情。

Have you spent time with President-Elect Trump since the victory?

自胜利以来，您是否曾与当选总统特朗普共度时光？

No. I saw him here in the building just as he was walking away from the building going to the Hilton for the speech.

不。我在大楼里看到他，当时他正在离开大楼前往希尔顿酒店参加演讲。

At that point, it wasn't yet 100%.

那时，还没有达到100%。

George told Trump, hey, we're having a victory party in the building, and you should come.

乔治告诉特朗普，嘿，我们正在大楼里举办胜利派对，你应该来。

He looked at Melania and says, well, maybe two minutes.

他看着梅拉尼娅说，好吧，也许两分钟。

But then the Secret Service said no, you cannot go in this suite.

但后来特勤局说不，你不能进入这间套房。

We check the premises first

我们首先检查场地

He said, Trump looked at Melania, said maybe two minutes, but the Secret Service said no.

他说，特朗普看着梅拉尼娅，说也许两分钟，但特勤局说不行。

So he said, OK, sorry.

所以他说，好吧，抱歉。

I'm a slave of these guys now.

我现在是这些家伙的奴隶了。

As Trump walked away from him, George says, he seemed serious.

乔治说，当特朗普从他身边走开时，他看起来很严肃。

Mike Pence too.

迈克·彭斯也是。

Like, the gravity of what they might be about to take on was finally sinking in.

就像，他们可能即将承担的事情的严重性终于被人们所理解了。

The size and the magnitude of the job ahead, leaving basically the best city of the world for the next four or maybe eight years.

未来工作的规模和规模，基本上会在未来四年甚至八年内成为世界上最好的城市。

How do you think this is going to change him?

你认为这会如何改变他？

Like, who do you think he's going to be in four years as a person?

比如，你认为四年后他会成为什么样的人？

Mr. Trump and President Trump are going to be remembered as completely different people.

特朗普先生和特朗普总统将作为完全不同的人被人们铭记。

George says he can already see this.

乔治说他已经看到了这一点。

In Trump's acceptance speech, at the White House with President Obama.

特朗普与奥巴马总统在白宫发表获奖感言。

It is not the same man that did the campaign.

发起这次活动的不是同一个人。

It is a different man.

这是一个不同的人。

Are they going to let him keep his Twitter account?

他们会让他保留他的推特账户吗？

Oh, I don't know.

哦，我不知道。

You have to ask him that.

这个你得问他。

I have to go.

我得走了。

No problem.

没问题。

Thank you.

谢谢。

George Lombardi Thank you so much.

乔治·隆巴迪 非常感谢。

Karen Duffin did that story.

凯伦·达芬（Karen Duffin）写了这个故事。

Of course, Donald Trump has started tweeting again.

当然，唐纳德·特朗普又开始发推文了。

Act Four, Los Angeles.

第四幕，洛杉矶。

So the day after the election, the board president of the Los Angeles Unified School District put out this statement.

所以选举第二天，洛杉矶联合学区董事会主席就发表了这样的声明。

"As students and staff arrive at school today, we know there may be feelings of fear and anxiety, especially within our most vulnerable communities.

“当学生和教职员工今天到达学校时，我们知道可能会有恐惧和焦虑的感觉，尤其是在我们最脆弱的社区。

The district is providing additional supports to those who need it." Latinos make up 74% of the student body there.

该学区正在为有需要的人提供额外的支持。”该校学生中拉丁裔占 74%。

Our producer Jonathan Menjivar checked in with a teacher who he knows.

我们的制片人乔纳森·门吉瓦 (Jonathan Menjivar) 咨询了一位他认识的老师。

I'm going to let you eavesdrop on this conversation that happened this week.

我会让你偷听本周发生的这次谈话。

So, I mean, is it OK if we just talk normal, Jonathan?

所以，我的意思是，乔纳森，我们正常说话可以吗？

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

是啊，是啊，是啊。

Of course.

当然。

Angelina Yeah.

安吉丽娜 是的。

So, you know, it was a school night last night.

所以，你知道，昨晚是学校之夜。

So we had to go to sleep.

所以我们必须去睡觉了。

This is my cousin, Angelina.

这是我的表弟，安吉丽娜。

I talked to her the day after the election.

选举后的第二天我和她谈过。

She's a kindergarten teacher.

她是一名幼儿园老师。

She teaches in this bilingual program at a school in LA, in Highland Park.

她在洛杉矶高地公园的一所学校教授双语课程。

There's lots of immigrant families.

那里有很多移民家庭。

So Wednesday morning, she got up and learned that Donald Trump would be the next president of the United States.

所以周三早上，她起床后得知唐纳德·特朗普将成为美国下一任总统。

She had 10 parent-teacher conferences scheduled that day and a full day of classes.

那天她安排了 10 场家长会和一整天的课程。

So, the first conference, she and the parent sit down at 7 o'clock in the morning, and they both start crying.

所以，第一次会议，她和家长在早上7点坐下来，他们都开始哭了。

We only have 15 minutes to talk.

我们只有 15 分钟的时间交谈。

So we kind of said, OK, we're going to do this for five minutes, and then we're going to talk for 10.

所以我们就说，好吧，我们要讨论 5 分钟，然后我们要聊 10 分钟。

This is how every conference started-- a download on the election, sometimes with crying, and then they'd talk about how the five-year-olds were doing.

每次会议都是这样开始的——下载有关选举的内容，有时会哭，然后他们会谈论五岁孩子的表现。

It was hard to avoid the historic news.

很难回避历史性的新闻。

[SPEAKING SPANISH] Jonathan Menjivar It's sad what's happening, this mom says.

[西班牙语] Jonathan Menjivar 这位妈妈说，发生的事情令人难过。

Angelina says, it's hard, it's hard.

安吉丽娜说，很难，很难。

[SPEAKING SPANISH] Jonathan Menjivar But I hope that something good comes out of this, she says.

[西班牙语]乔纳森·门吉瓦尔（Jonathan Menjivar）但她说，“我希望这能带来一些好处”。

That something good comes out of this, Angelina asks.

安吉丽娜问道，这会带来一些好处。

I hope that he doesn't do everything he says he's going to, that he does something good.

我希望他不要做他所说的一切，而是做一些好事。

We need to think positively, that he'll do something good.

我们需要积极地思考，他会做一些好事。

[SPEAKING SPANISH] Jonathan Menjivar So, after Angelina's morning conferences, the kids arrive for school.

[西班牙语] Jonathan Menjivar 那么，安吉丽娜上午的会议结束后，孩子们就到了学校。

She picks up her class from the spot where they line up.

她从排队的地方接她的课。

And one of the kids, he yells out, Donald Trump is president.

其中一个孩子，他喊道，唐纳德·特朗普是总统。

Then when we got into the classroom, another student said, I'm really afraid because he's going to build a wall.

然后当我们进教室的时候，另一个学生说，我真的很害怕，因为他要砌一堵墙。

And then another student shouted, he doesn't like brown people.

然后另一个学生喊道，他不喜欢棕色人种。

And I have a mixed class.

我有一个混合班。

These are not just Latinos in my class.

这些不仅仅是我班上的拉丁裔。

I have a culturally, ethnically diverse classroom.

我有一个文化、种族多元化的教室。

And one of my students approached me and said, I'm really sad.

我的一位学生走过来对我说，我真的很难过。

I'm leaving the school.

我要离开学校了

And then I said, where are you going?

然后我说，你要去哪里？

You know, kids move schools.

你知道，孩子们会转学。

And I said, where are you going to another school?

我说，你要去哪里的另一所学校？

And he said, no, I'm going to Mexico.

他说，不，我要去墨西哥。

And then I said, when are you going?

然后我就说，你什么时候走？

He said, I'm going right now.

他说，我现在就去。

And I thought it was kind of like an imaginary conversation.

我觉得这有点像一场想象中的对话。

So I said, oh, are you going on vacation?

所以我说，哦，你要去度假吗？

He said, no, I'm leaving because Donald Trump is the president now.

他说，不，我要离开，因为唐纳德·特朗普现在是总统。

And I'm leaving, and I'll never come back.

而我就要走了，我再也不会回来了。

And I'm really going to miss you.

我真的会想念你的。

And I just was shocked.

我只是感到震惊。

Angelina doesn't think this kid is actually leaving.

安吉丽娜并不认为这孩子真的要离开。

It's just a five-year-old digesting the news.

这只是一个五岁的孩子在消化这个消息。

And it was constant.

而且它是恒定的。

It was all day long.

一整天都是这样。

And so I had to tell the students, you know, you spend your day at home, and you spend your day with me.

所以我不得不告诉学生们，你知道，你们在家里度过了一天，并且和我一起度过了一天。

And you're protected at home, and you're protected at school.

你在家里受到保护，在学校也受到保护。

Nothing bad is going to happen to you here.

你在这里不会发生任何不好的事情。

As long as you're home.

只要你在家。

I mean, you know, I can only speak for home and school, that everything is going to be OK.

我的意思是，你知道，我只能代表家庭和学校发言，一切都会好起来的。

Angelina says she doesn't know the immigration status of her students.

安吉丽娜说她不知道她的学生的移民身份。

It's just not something you're privy to as a teacher.

这不是你作为老师所知道的事情。

Trump has said he wants to end illegal immigration entirely.

特朗普曾表示，他希望彻底结束非法移民。

The question is, will he deport the 11 million undocumented immigrants who are already here-- something he said during the campaign but seems to have backed off of now.

问题是，他是否会驱逐已经在这里的 1100 万无证移民——他在竞选期间曾说过这句话，但现在似乎有所放弃。

In the absence of information, the kids and parents, they're filling in the blanks.

在缺乏信息的情况下，孩子和父母只能填补空白。

It's like, it's hard to believe.

就好像，很难相信。

How could this be?

怎么会这样？

This is another one of the conferences.

这是另一场会议。

This mom told my cousin that she has an autistic brother.

这位妈妈告诉我表弟，她有一个患有自闭症的兄弟。

You can see it when you look at him.

当你看着他的时候你就能看到这一点。

So Donald Trump's imitation of a disabled reporter--

所以唐纳德·特朗普模仿了一位残疾记者——

It's not OK.

这不行。

It's not all right.

不太好。

Yeah, it's not all right.

是的，这不太好。

He's just-- who is he to talk to someone like that?

他只是——他是谁，竟然敢跟这样的人说话？

So I've been crying all day with all the parents that I meet.

所以我整天和我遇到的所有父母一起哭泣。

Yeah, because it's hard, you know?

是的，因为这很难，你知道吗？

I have my 11-year-old.

我有我11岁的孩子。

And it's hard to explain to him-- he's just, like, how did he win, Mom?

这很难向他解释——他只是想，他是怎么赢的，妈妈？

And he says, you said he wasn't going to win.

他说，你说过他不会赢。

And then I said, you know, he just doesn't have that much power, though.

然后我说，你知道，他只是没有那么大的权力。

I told him, you know, just stay calm.

我告诉他，你知道，保持冷静。

And you know, he's worried about people getting deported, mainly families getting separated.

你知道，他担心人们被驱逐出境，主要是家庭失散。

It's just ridiculous.

这太荒谬了。

Yeah.

是的。

OK.

好的。

Let's do our conference.

让我们开我们的会议吧。

Thank you.

谢谢。

Thank you.

谢谢。

Angelina told me that this day, processing all of this with the parents, was exhausting.

安吉丽娜告诉我，这一天，和父母一起处理这一切，让人筋疲力尽。

She crawled into bed as soon as she got home.

她一回到家就爬上了床。

Jonathan Menjivar.

乔纳森·门吉瓦尔。

Act Five: Long Island Ira Glass Act Five, Long Island.

第五幕：长岛 Ira Glass 第五幕，长岛。

So next we have two guys for whom the election was not just about choosing a politician.

接下来我们有两个人，对他们来说，选举不仅仅是选择一位政治家。

It was about choosing the new boss.

这是关于选择新老板的问题。

Producer Stephanie Foo hung out with them and recorded their conversation.

制片人斯蒂芬妮·符（Stephanie Foo）与他们一起出去玩并记录了他们的谈话。

It's the day after the election, and I'm sitting in a diner in Long Island with two Army officers.

这是选举后的第二天，我和两名军官坐在长岛的一家小餐馆里。

They're both in the same unit in the reserves.

他们都在预备队的同一单位。

They both have other jobs, but they could be deployed at any time.

他们都有其他工作，但随时可能被调动。

They've worked together for about two years now.

他们已经一起工作了大约两年了。

One of them voted for Trump, the other voted for Clinton.

其中一人投票支持特朗普，另一人投票支持克林顿。

Why do you like each other.

为什么你们互相喜欢。

Chet I don't know.

切特我不知道。

Why do we like each other?

我们为什么互相喜欢？

You know why?

你知道为什么吗？

Because I know that he'll have my back, and I'll have his.

因为我知道他会支持我，我也会支持他。

Regardless of what he believes, although it's ill-founded, most of it, he's awesome.

不管他相信什么，虽然毫无根据，但大部分，他是很棒的。

I'd give my life for him.

我愿意为他献出我的生命。

I'd save my own life.

我会拯救自己的生命。

Nah.

不。

He knows we're good.

他知道我们很好。

We're good.

我们很好。

Stephanie Foo I'm not using their real names in this story.

Stephanie Foo 我在这个故事中没有使用他们的真名。

Tom's the Clinton supporter.

汤姆是克林顿的支持者。

He's eating a stack of pancakes and is wearing a periwinkle blue button-down shirt and matching V-neck sweater.

他正在吃一堆煎饼，穿着一件浅蓝色系扣衬衫和配套的 V 领毛衣。

Chet is the Trump supporter.

切特是特朗普的支持者。

He's drinking a double shot of whiskey and wearing flannel over a Millennium Falcon T-shirt.

他喝了两杯威士忌，穿了一件法兰绒的千年隼 T 恤。

These two guys have a text chain going with a couple other officers in their unit.

这两个人与他们单位的其他几名警官有一条短信链。

Sometimes they're planning training exercises, but mostly I get the feeling they're just complaining about their girlfriends and sending each other South Park memes.

有时他们会计划训练，但大多数时候我觉得他们只是在抱怨他们的女朋友并互相发送南方公园表情包。

On the morning after the election, Chet texted Tom.

选举后的第二天早上，切特给汤姆发短信。

I say, hey, you doing OK, Tom?

我说，嘿，汤姆，你还好吗？

You didn't have an aneurysm, did you?

你没有动脉瘤吧？

I go, I'm practicing meditative breathing, preparing for the end.

我去，我正在练习冥想呼吸，为结局做准备。

So then I respond, ha ha, it'll be fine, buddy.

然后我就回复了，哈哈，没问题的，哥们。

I saw this coming.

我看到了这一切的到来。

So, and this is where I say, so did I.

所以，这就是我所说的，我也是如此。

That doesn't mean it's going to be fine.

这并不意味着一切都会好起来。

Lots of people feel like their lives are going to be impacted by this election.

许多人觉得他们的生活将受到这次选举的影响。

But this is the person who could deploy these guys, sending them to risk their lives in combat.

但正是这个人可以部署这些人，让他们冒着生命危险参加战斗。

And on this point, they agreed.

在这一点上，他们达成了一致。

One candidate was way more likely to do that.

一位候选人更有可能这样做。

Hillary.

希拉里。

Stephanie Foo Hillary Clinton had talked about establishing a no fly zone above Syria.

斯蒂芬妮·符·希拉里·克林顿曾谈到在叙利亚上空建立禁飞区。

And both men agree, that sounded like a big first step towards war with Syria.

两人都同意，这听起来像是迈向与叙利亚战争的重要第一步。

Here's Chet.

这是切特。

Listen, man.

听着，伙计。

I was in Iraq, and I was in Afghanistan.

我在伊拉克，我在阿富汗。

As far as I'm concerned, I don't need to go to another [BLEEP] country to fight another [BLEEP] civil war.

就我而言，我不需要去另一个[BLEEP]国家去打另一场[BLEEP]内战。

Let those [BLEEP] people work it out.

让那些[BLEEP]人解决这个问题。

It sucks.

太糟糕了。

My question is, it's not that we shouldn't help people, it's at what point, man?

我的问题是，并不是我们不应该帮助别人，而是在什么时候，伙计？

At what point do I need to keep helping?

什么时候我需要继续提供帮助？

At what point do we as Americans have to keep helping the rest of the world?

在什么时候我们作为美国人必须继续帮助世界其他国家？

I tend to agree with him that I don't want our forces there.

我倾向于同意他的观点，即我不希望我们的部队在那里。

But I do not agree with the isolationist policies that Trump is putting forth.

但我不同意特朗普提出的孤立主义政策。

I believe that a strong American footprint internationally is important.

我相信美国在国际上的强大影响力非常重要。

So that's the big picture.

这就是大局。

But the small picture is, they both think that under Republican, more money might come into the Army.

但小问题是，他们都认为在共和党的领导下，军队可能会投入更多资金。

Maybe their unit will get more money for training, for supplies.

也许他们的部队会得到更多的资金用于培训和物资。

But then there's the issue of the recruits.

但接下来还有新兵的问题。

The most recent numbers I could find, in 2008, 65,000 members of the armed services were immigrants.

我能找到的最新数据是，2008 年，武装部队中有 65,000 名移民。

Chet and Tom's unit is really diverse.

切特和汤姆的单位确实很多元化。

And Tom's worried that that could change, that fewer people would sign up to the US military as a path to citizenship.

汤姆担心这种情况可能会改变，越来越少的人愿意加入美国军队作为获得公民身份的途径。

You're looking at-- what, I don't know how many soldiers I've met that still weren't American citizens.

你看到的是——什么，我不知道我见过多少不是美国公民的士兵。

They don't get citizenship because they're--

他们没有获得公民身份，因为他们——

Your fear is that we would get less of those--

你担心的是我们得到的会更少——

People that would be invested in America.

将在美国投资的人。

If Donald Trump is president.

如果唐纳德·特朗普是总统。

Tom Yeah.

汤姆 是的。

They're saying, all right, this isn't worth fighting for anymore.

他们说，好吧，这不值得再为之奋斗了。

They don't care about me.

他们不关心我。

And I have a lot more faith in them to vote for the next president or to participate in the American process than a lot of people that were born in the United States.

与许多出生在美国的人相比，我对他们投票选举下一任总统或参与美国进程更有信心。

Yeah, me too.

是的，我也是。

Stephanie Foo And then, of course, there's the biggest question of all-- the actual, for real, apocalypse.

Stephanie Foo：当然，还有一个最大的问题——真正的世界末日。

Lots of people this year have questioned whether Donald Trump is too erratic to be trusted with the nuclear codes.

今年，很多人质疑唐纳德·特朗普是否过于反复无常，以至于不值得信任核密码。

Tom's worried.

汤姆很担心。

Chet's not.

切特不是。

They'll be fine.

他们会没事的。

He's not going to drop nukes on people.

他不会向人们扔核武器。

I don't know.

我不知道。

I think he's incredibly uneducated about it.

我认为他对此非常缺乏教育。

So, here's the thing about the codes that people don't realize.

所以，这是人们没有意识到的关于代码的事情。

It's not like he has a piece of paper in his pocket.

他口袋里并没有一张纸。

It's like, here are the nuclear codes.

就像，这是核密码。

It doesn't work that way.

事实并非如此。

How it works is, there's a military officer that walks around with what's called a Football.

工作原理是，有一名军官拿着所谓的足球四处走动。

That officer, he's got more experience than I do.

那个军官，他的经验比我丰富。

And at the end of the day, if the president goes off the handle and says, nuke these guys because I don't like them, we're taught, in the military, as officers, that we have a moral obligation to refuse orders that are not moral.

归根结底，如果总统发脾气说，用核武器攻击这些人，因为我不喜欢他们，我们在军队里，作为军官，就被教导说，我们有道德义务拒绝不道德的命令。

So if my commander tells me to do that, and it is not moral, I have an obligation to tell him to [BLEEP] off.

因此，如果我的指挥官告诉我这样做，而这是不道德的，我有义务让他[BLEEP]停止。

So you tell him to [BLEEP] off.

所以你告诉他[BLEEP]关掉。

And then he goes, OK, you're out.

然后他说，好吧，你出局了。

So he, as the president, has somebody else [BLEEP] take that Football from you.

所以他，作为总统，让其他人[哔]从你手中夺走那个足球。

And then he looks at the guy and goes, are you in, because this guy's fired.

然后他看着那个人说，你在吗，因为这个人被解雇了。

Except the guy-- Tom At the very best, he's fired or he's going to jail.

除了那个人——汤姆 最好的情况是，他被解雇或者进监狱。

So you're telling me that Army or Navy or Air Force officers of Major or Lieutenant Commander or whatever rank, guys who have been in the military for 15 years, are just going to go ahead, who have children and families, are just going to pull the trigger because Trump decides one day, you know what, [BLEEP] them, I don't like them, nuke them?

所以你是在告诉我，陆军、海军或空军的少校、中尉或任何级别的军官，已经在军队服役了 15 年的人，他们有孩子和家庭，他们只会扣动扳机，因为有一天特朗普决定，你知道吗，[哔]他们，我不喜欢他们，用核武器攻击他们？

You're counting on the moral character of every single one of these individuals.

你指望的是这些人中每一个人的道德品质。

Should we not?

我们不应该吗？

Because that's what we're trained to do.

因为这就是我们接受的训练要做的事情。

Say I am working for a man that I completely trust.

假设我正在为一个我完全信任的人工作。

I haven't been informed of the situation at all.

我根本没有被告知有关情况。

And he comes in and he says, this is what's got to be done.

他进来后说，这就是必须要做的事情。

More than likely, I would probably do it, right?

我很有可能会这么做，对吧？

So I mean, I can't--

所以我的意思是，我不能——

Sitting with these guys the night after this divisive, awful election was actually really reassuring.

在这场分裂的、糟糕的选举之后的那个晚上，和这些人坐在一起实际上真的让人感到安心。

Not the part about possible nuclear obliteration, but it's the way they talk to each other.

不是关于可能的核毁灭的部分，而是他们彼此交谈的方式。

They disagree on everything, but they like each other so much.

他们在所有事情上都有分歧，但他们非常喜欢对方。

They work together great.

他们合作得很好。

They get stuff done.

他们把事情做好。

So many Trump and Clinton supporters, we just never talk to each other for long enough to realize we might actually get along.

这么多特朗普和克林顿的支持者，我们只是从来没有交谈足够长的时间来意识到我们可能真的相处得很好。

In this moment, when nobody seems to be listening to anybody with a different point of view, when each side vilifies the other and thinks the other side is going to destroy this country, it was calming to watch conflict play out in this way that was devoid of rage and judgment and hurt, that had each person continually acknowledging the other person's humanity.

在这一刻，当似乎没有人在倾听持不同观点的人的声音，当双方都诽谤对方并认为对方要毁灭这个国家时，看到冲突以这种没有愤怒、评判和伤害的方式上演，让每个人都不断承认对方的人性，是令人平静的。

After this year, I could use more of that.

今年之后，我可以使用更多。

Stephanie Foo.

史蒂芬妮·福.

Coming up, a Trump supporter explains to us the difference between gloating and simply celebrating.

接下来，一位特朗普的支持者向我们解释了幸灾乐祸和简单庆祝之间的区别。

And a foreigner wonders if it's time to leave this country.

一个外国人想知道是否是时候离开这个国家了。

That's in a minute, from Chicago Public Radio, when our program continues.

稍后，芝加哥公共广播电台将继续我们的节目。

It's This American Life .

这就是美国生活。

I'm Ira Glass.

我是艾拉·格拉斯。

Today on our program, The Sun Comes Up, people around the country reacting to the news this week in all kinds of ways.

今天，在我们的节目《太阳升起》中，全国各地的人们对本周的新闻做出了各种反应。

The name of today's show came from President Obama's speech the day after the election.

今天的节目名称来自奥巴马总统大选后第二天的演讲。

Good afternoon, everybody.

大家下午好。

Yesterday, before votes were tallied, I shot a video that some of you may have seen in which I said to the American people, regardless of which side you were on in the election, regardless of whether your candidate won or lost, the sun would come up in the morning.

昨天，在计票之前，我拍了一段视频，你们可能有人看过，我在视频中对美国人民说，无论你在选举中站在哪一边，无论你的候选人获胜还是失败，太阳都会在早晨升起。

And that is one bit of prognosticating that actually came true.

这是一个实际实现的预测。

The sun is up.

太阳升起来了。

And I know everybody had a long night.

我知道每个人都度过了一个漫长的夜晚。

We have arrived at Act Six of our show.

我们已经到了节目的第六幕了。

Act Six, Times Square.

第六幕，时代广场。

So on election night, a young woman named Blair Imani tweeted this around 11:30.

因此，在选举之夜，一位名叫 Blair Imani 的年轻女性在 11:30 左右发布了这条推文。

Quote, "I'm scared today will be the last day I feel somewhat safe wearing my hijab." I got her on the phone the next day, and she told me that she wrote that after walking through Times Square in New York.

引用：“我担心今天将是我戴头巾感到安全的最后一天。”第二天我给她打电话，她告诉我这是她在走过纽约时代广场后写下的。

Four guys walked past her, probably on their way to the Trump victory party, which wasn't that far away.

有四个人从她身边走过，可能是在前往距离不远的特朗普胜利派对的路上。

They were wearing red "Make America Great Again" caps.

他们戴着写着“让美国再次伟大”的红色帽子。

She had never seen groups of Trump supporters together like that.

她从未见过特朗普的支持者像这样聚集在一起。

You know, whenever I see men in red hats-- just because of this election, not before.

你知道，每当我看到戴红帽子的人时——只是因为这次选举，而不是之前。

But you know, because of this election, I kind of tense up and I wait to see what's on their hat.

但你知道，因为这次选举，我有点紧张，我等着看他们的帽子上有什么。

And when I see that it's not "Make America Gay Again" or, you know, a parody of Trump's campaign, I kind of feel a knot in my stomach.

当我看到这不是“让美国再次成为同性恋”，或者，你知道，不是对特朗普竞选活动的模仿时，我有点感到胃里打结。

And so when I saw four white men walking towards me with "Make America Great Again" hats, I was just kind of feeling the anxiety.

因此，当我看到四个白人戴着“让美国再次伟大”的帽子向我走来时，我只是感到了焦虑。

And were you seriously debating not wearing your hijab.

你是否认真讨论过不戴头巾的问题？

I always will have my head covered.

我总是会蒙着头。

Today, actually, I went and I bought some hats.

事实上，今天我去买了一些帽子。

Wait, so you stopped wearing your hijab.

等等，所以你不再戴头巾了。

Yeah.

是的。

And tweeted a picture of myself with, like, hashtag Muslim Girl Camo.

并在推特上发布了一张我自己的照片，上面带有“穆斯林女孩迷彩”标签。

Camo, like camouflage.

迷彩，就像迷彩一样。

She's done this in the past sometimes.

她过去有时也这么做过。

Like, when she has to fly, she'll wear a hat instead of a hijab on the plane.

比如，当她必须坐飞机时，她会在飞机上戴帽子而不是头巾。

On election night, there were other people tweeting things, like, quote, "My mom literally texted me, don't wear the hijab, please, and she's the most religious person in our family." And quote, "My mom and sister are actually having the conversation on whether or not they should continue wearing hijab for their own safety."

在选举之夜，还有其他人发推文，比如，“我妈妈真的给我发短信，请不要戴头巾，她是我们家里最虔诚的人。”并引用：“我的妈妈和姐姐实际上正在讨论是否应该为了自身安全继续戴头巾。”

In the days since then, Blair says that she's seeing more and more red hats around New York.

从那以后的几天里，布莱尔说她在纽约看到越来越多的红帽子。

Like, Trump supporters are feeling bolder now that he's won in this super-liberal city, which is weird for her.

就像，特朗普的支持者现在感觉更加大胆，因为他在这个超级自由的城市获胜，这对她来说很奇怪。

But at the same time, other strangers are being especially nice to her.

但与此同时，其他陌生人对她特别好。

Before she switched to the hat on Wednesday, an older white woman on the train made a point to sit next to her and smile at her.

在周三她换上这顶帽子之前，火车上一位年长的白人妇女特意坐在她旁边，并对她微笑。

There was a couple of situations like that, like when I was in the checkout line getting the hats, the woman noticed that I was getting hats, and she was like, yeah, this is bad.

有几种类似的情况，比如当我在收银台排队买帽子时，那位女士注意到我在买帽子，她说，是的，这很糟糕。

Do you think it's going to start to feel safer to wear the hijab around New York City?

您认为在纽约市戴头巾会变得更安全吗？

I think-- I'm going to be optimistic in saying that I think yes.

我想——我会乐观地说我认为是的。

So I'm hoping there will be more people, like the old woman today who reached out to me to just kind of make eye contact to smile.

所以我希望会有更多的人，就像今天那位老妇人向我伸出援手，只是进行眼神交流并微笑。

And that's really my hope, because that's kind of-- that's what I feel like America should be.

这确实是我的希望，因为这就是我认为美国应该成为的样子。

And I feel, despite what the polls show, that more people in America are good than are bigoted and awful.

我觉得，不管民意调查显示什么，在美国，善良的人多于偏执和糟糕的人。

Act Seven, Nicholasville, Kentucky.

第七幕，肯塔基州尼古拉斯维尔。

So Donald Trump has been vague and even contradictory about some of the changes that he wants to make once he takes office.

因此，唐纳德·特朗普对于他上任后想要做出的一些改变一直含糊甚至矛盾。

But there are some very specific things he's promised over and over.

但他一遍又一遍地承诺了一些非常具体的事情。

One of our producers, David Kestenbaum, talks to somebody who's life seems like it definitely will be affected.

我们的一位制作人 David Kestenbaum 与一位生活似乎肯定会受到影响的人进行了交谈。

Hello?

你好？

David Kestenbaum Hey, is this Billy?

大卫·凯斯滕鲍姆 嘿，这是比利吗？

Hey, what's up.

嘿，怎么了。

David Kestenbaum Billy Webster is 45 years old.

大卫·凯斯坦鲍姆比利·韦伯斯特今年 45 岁。

He lives in Kentucky, works for Hallmark, setting up the card displays at a local Walmart store.

他住在肯塔基州，为 Hallmark 工作，在当地一家沃尔玛商店设置卡片展示架。

His favorite cards are probably the Star Wars ones.

他最喜欢的卡片可能是星球大战卡片。

Is there a "sorry you lost the election" card?

有没有一张“对不起你选举失败”的卡片？

Billy voted for Clinton, so he had the usual shock when he saw that Trump was going to win.

比利投票给了克林顿，因此当他看到特朗普将获胜时，他感到了一如既往的震惊。

But he also had this very specific thought watching the TV that night.

但那天晚上他在看电视时也有这个非常具体的想法。

What is going to happen to my health insurance?

我的健康保险会怎样？

He gets his through Obamacare.

他通过奥巴马医改获得了自己的收入。

What can you do about it?

你能做些什么呢？

David Kestenbaum You hadn't thought about it, but basically, we all decided your health insurance the other day.

David Kestenbaum：您没有考虑过这一点，但基本上，前几天我们都决定了您的健康保险。

Yeah, basically.

是的，基本上。

Uh-huh.

嗯嗯。

David Kestenbaum Trump and the Republicans have, of course, promised to repeal Obamacare.

当然，特朗普和共和党人已承诺废除奥巴马医改。

And however you feel about Obamacare and how well it's working, there are something like 20 million people currently getting insurance through it.

无论你对奥巴马医改有何看法以及它的效果如何，目前大约有 2000 万人通过它获得了保险。

So here, just for the record, is exactly one of those stories.

所以，为了记录，这里正是这些故事之一。

Hallmark, for all its get well cards, does not offer Billy health insurance.

尽管霍尔马克有康复卡，但并不提供比利健康保险。

The job isn't full time.

这份工作不是全职的。

He says he earned about $12,000 last year.

他说他去年的收入约为 12,000 美元。

Before that, he was unemployed, and so didn't go to a doctor.

在此之前，他失业了，所以没有去看医生。

Even when stuff happened that really, honestly, you should go to a doctor if it happens to you.

即使事情真的发生了，老实说，如果发生在你身上，你也应该去看医生。

Thanksgiving Day, you know, I had a big meal at Thanksgiving.

感恩节，你知道，感恩节我吃了一顿大餐。

And all of sudden, I just got this rush of not feeling good, like my vision started blurring, and my feet tingled and hurt really bad.

突然间，我感觉不太舒服，就像我的视力开始模糊，我的脚刺痛，疼得很厉害。

And I don't know, I lost my hearing.

我不知道，我失去了听力。

I started having a little ringing in my years.

我的岁月开始有点响亮。

And just, I don't know, kind of like an out-of-body experience.

只是，我不知道，有点像灵魂出窍的体验。

Didn't your parents or friends say, you should go to a doctor?

你的父母或朋友没有说过，你应该去看医生吗？

Oh, they always tell you that, yeah.

哦，他们总是告诉你，是的。

But I couldn't afford it.

但我买不起。

So yeah, they always tell you that when you're sick and you don't feel good.

所以，是的，当你生病并且感觉不舒服时，他们总是会告诉你。

Yeah, go to the doctor.

是的，去看医生。

Well, you gonna pay for it?

嗯，你会付钱吗？

When Obamacare came along, Billy qualified for insurance under the Medicaid expansion part of it.

当奥巴马医改出现时，比利有资格获得医疗补助扩展部分的保险。

It cost him about $50 a month.

他每个月的花费约为 50 美元。

And he finally went to a doctor who did a simple blood test and was like, yeah, you got diabetes.

最后他去看了一位医生，医生做了一个简单的血液检查，医生说，是的，你得了糖尿病。

I was ecstatic.

我欣喜若狂。

I mean-- David Kestenbaum You were ecstatic to be diagnosed with diabetes?

我的意思是 - David Kestenbaum 您对被诊断患有糖尿病感到欣喜若狂吗？

The doctor prescribed some pills, and pretty quickly, Billy's blood sugar levels went back into the normal range.

医生开了一些药，很快比利的血糖水平就回到了正常范围。

I mean, I felt so much better after that.

我的意思是，在那之后我感觉好多了。

So it probably saved my life, you know.

所以它可能救了我的命，你知道。

With diabetes, you can lose your eyesight, lose your limbs.

患有糖尿病，您可能会失去视力，失去四肢。

Trump was never very specific about what he would replace Obamacare with.

特朗普从来没有明确表示他将用什么来取代奥巴马医改。

Billy says, to be honest, losing health insurance would not be the end of the world.

比利说，说实话，失去健康保险并不意味着世界末日。

It's not like he has cancer, doesn't need heart surgery, though that is certainly the case for some other people on Obamacare.

这并不是说他患有癌症，不需要心脏手术，尽管对于其他一些享受奥巴马医改的人来说肯定是这样。

Billy told me he'd have to pay for the diabetes medication himself, which would be a strain, but he said he'd just have to find a way.

比利告诉我，他必须自己支付糖尿病药物的费用，这将是一种压力，但他说他必须找到一种方法。

And if something really went wrong, he's not just going to sit at home and die.

如果真的出了问题，他不会只是坐在家里等死。

You know, I'll go to the emergency room.

你知道，我要去急诊室。

You know, and then the state can pay for it, or whoever else is the people that complain about people like me or whatever that has benefited from this, then they can just pay for it out of their taxes.

你知道，然后国家可以为此买单，或者任何其他人抱怨像我这样的人或任何从中受益的人，那么他们就可以从税收中支付它。

You know, the people of the state of Kentucky can pay for those $1,000 emergency room bills.

你知道，肯塔基州的人民可以支付那 1,000 美元的急诊室费用。

I'll never pay.

我永远不会付钱。

So-- I mean, I'd try to pay them, but you know, I was just being sarcastic.

所以——我的意思是，我会尝试付钱给他们，但你知道，我只是在讽刺。

Going to the emergency room with no money, that's basically the system we had before Obamacare.

没有钱就去急诊室，这基本上就是我们在奥巴马医改之前的制度。

I asked Billy if he thought Trump and the Republicans might replace Obamacare with something better.

我问比利，他是否认为特朗普和共和党可能会用更好的东西取代奥巴马医改。

Maybe, he said.

也许吧，他说。

I should just give the guy a chance.

我应该给那家伙一个机会。

David Kestenbaum.

大卫·凯斯滕鲍姆。

Act Eight: Greenville South Carolina Ira Glass Act Eight, Greenville, South Carolina.

第八幕：南卡罗来纳州格林维尔 Ira Glass 第八幕，南卡罗来纳州格林维尔。

So, all this year, we've been talking to Trump voters, as their chances went from laughable to striking distance to victory.

因此，今年一整年，我们一直在与特朗普选民交谈，因为他们的胜利机会从可笑变为了惊人的距离。

One guy who was all the way for Trump back in February was Barry Chisholm.

巴里·奇泽姆（Barry Chisholm）是二月份一直支持特朗普的一个人。

His son was too.

他的儿子也是。

His son's Dave.

他的儿子是戴夫。

Our producer, Zoe Chace, met them back then.

我们的制片人佐伊·切斯（Zoe Chace）当时遇见了他们。

They used to call up their local talk show host on the radio and crow about how great Donald Trump was.

他们过去常常打电话给当地电台脱口秀主持人，夸耀唐纳德·特朗普有多么伟大。

They were underdogs back then.

那时他们是弱者。

So we checked back in this week to see how the week was going for them.

所以我们这周回来看看他们这一周过得怎么样。

What's going on?

这是怎么回事？

Are you being safe up there or what?

你在那里安全吗？

I'm safe.

我很安全。

Barry Walking around the streets of New York?

巴里在纽约街头漫步？

Good grief.

好悲伤。

Doesn't seem like they're too happy still, huh?

看起来他们还不太高兴吧？

Um, yeah.

嗯，是的。

I do think a lot of people are upset.

我确实认为很多人都感到不安。

Mm-hmm.

嗯嗯。

Yeah, we're pretty safe here in the South.

是的，我们在南方很安全。

Yeah, I'm wearing my Trump hat today.

是的，我今天戴着特朗普帽子。

I'm good to go.

我很好，可以走了。

I'm getting a lot of high-fives.

我得到了很多击掌。

You're getting a lot of high-fives in your Trump hat?

你戴着特朗普帽子得到了很多人击掌吗？

Are you guys excited?

你们兴奋吗？

Barry Yeah, but only to the point of celebration.

巴里 是的，但只是为了庆祝。

Not like we get satisfaction-- there's a difference between celebrating and gloating.

我们并不是得到满足——庆祝和幸灾乐祸之间是有区别的。

Gloating is you're happy that someone else is sad.

幸灾乐祸是因为别人悲伤而你感到高兴。

You're happy that someone else is stressed.

你很高兴别人有压力。

That is not where our happiness or celebratory comes from.

那不是我们的幸福或庆祝的来源。

It's from the fact that we defended this campaign and we wanted it.

这是因为我们捍卫了这场运动并且我们想要它。

And our guy won.

我们的人赢了。

It doesn't go past that.

它不会过去。

I think it's a little ridiculous.

我觉得这有点可笑。

I think people are overboard with being that upset, because we weren't even that upset with Obama.

我认为人们如此沮丧太过分了，因为我们甚至没有对奥巴马感到那么沮丧。

Yeah, we didn't see-- did you remember all the deplorables out on the street when Obama got elected, punching all the Obama voters.

是的，我们没有看到——你还记得奥巴马当选时街上所有的可悲者，殴打所有奥巴马选民。

You remember that, right?

你还记得吧？

That's why all these people that are upset-- they don't realize the good that's going to come.

这就是为什么所有这些心烦意乱的人——他们没有意识到即将到来的好处。

They're going to benefit.

他们将会受益。

I think eventually they're going to come around.

我想他们最终会回心转意的。

Honestly, my thing is-- this is where I'll be going forward-- we don't want to be rubbing it in people's faces.

老实说，我的事情是——这就是我前进的方向——我们不想把它磨在人们脸上。

I want to show people that this is going to be better.

我想向人们展示这会变得更好。

"Make America Great Again" includes all the citizens that are in this country.

“让美国再次伟大”包括这个国家的所有公民。

So when the economy goes, everybody goes up.

因此，当经济衰退时，每个人都会上涨。

You just think the economy is just going to go gangbusters now?

你只是认为经济现在会猛烈发展吗？

If you do one thing-- well, you get the regulations off, you do the pipeline, you let them drill for oil, you bring the coal back, and Hillary's happy to tell people she's going to put them out of a job.

如果你做一件事——嗯，你取消法规，你修管道，你让他们钻探石油，你把煤炭带回来，希拉里很高兴告诉人们她会让他们失业。

That's all these people have their whole lives in generations.

这就是这些人世世代代的一生。

They don't have the luxury of going out there and using their political position to use the State Department to make herself a multimillionaire.

他们无法奢侈地走出去，利用自己的政治地位，利用国务院让自己成为千万富翁。

These people have to work every day for a living.

这些人每天都必须工作才能谋生。

It sounds like you're still mad at Hillary.

听起来你还在生希拉里的气。

Well, I'm mad at the way-- no, I'm not mad at Hillary.

好吧，我对这种方式很生气——不，我不是对希拉里生气。

I mean, you know, it's a difference of opinion.

我的意思是，你知道，这是意见分歧。

I mean, it's a difference of ideology.

我的意思是，这是意识形态的差异。

And then yeah, well, wouldn't you be mad if people were calling you racist and xenophobe?

然后，是的，如果人们称你为种族主义者和仇外者，你不会生气吗？

I mean, good grief.

我的意思是，好悲伤。

Well, so, what are you so happy about?

那么，你有什么好高兴的呢？

Like, what's going to happen now?

比如说，现在会发生什么？

Good grief, how could you not be?

天哪，你怎么能不呢？

Look it, we've had a lawless country.

看看吧，我们有一个无法无天的国家。

The immigration law is a mockery to people who obey the law.

移民法是对遵守法律的人的嘲弄。

You have a president doing executive orders.

你有一位总统在执行行政命令。

If you do one thing, well, you get the regulations off, you do the pipeline, and then the repatriation-- there's $2 trillion.

如果你做一件事，那么，你就可以取消监管，建立管道，然后遣返——就有 2 万亿美元。

They're not going to bring it back and pay 35%.

他们不会把它带回来并支付 35% 的费用。

These are business people.

这些都是商人。

They're not stupid.

他们并不傻。

They're not going to hand their money over to a bunch of dopey politicians.

他们不会把钱交给一群愚蠢的政客。

Barry, you still sound mad.

巴里，你听起来还是很生气。

I'm saying, you still--

我是说，你还是——

No, I'm excited.

不，我很兴奋。

Zoe Chace OK, that's your excited.

佐伊·查斯（Zoe Chace）好吧，那是你的兴奋。

OK.

好的。

Because we have the opportunity to do this now.

因为我们现在有机会这样做。

Are you nervous he's going to disappoint you now?

你担心他现在会让你失望吗？

He's not going to be as good as you thought?

他不会像你想象的那么好？

Do I worry about, can he stick to his first principles and the things that he talked about?

我是否担心他能否坚持他的首要原则和他所说的事情？

Of course I do.

我当然知道。

I didn't say that-- this guy is not like a saviour.

我没这么说——这家伙不像救世主。

This guy is not going to be the answer to all of the problems that this country faces.

这个人不会解决这个国家面临的所有问题。

But can he do some good things?

但他能做一些好事吗？

I think so.

我想是的。

Zoe Chace.

佐伊·查斯。

Act Nine: Salt Lake City Ira Glass Act Nine, Salt Lake City.

第九幕：盐湖城 Ira Glass 第九幕，盐湖城。

Emily Ellsworth is a lifelong Republican.

艾米丽·埃尔斯沃斯 (Emily Ellsworth) 是一位终生的共和党人。

Grew up Mormon in one of the most reliably Republican states in the country.

在该国最可靠的共和党州之一的摩门教长大。

Culturally, being Mormon is pretty much synonymous with being Republican.

从文化上来说，成为摩门教徒几乎等同于成为共和党人。

But like lots of Mormons, Emily found Donald Trump unacceptable.

但和许多摩门教徒一样，艾米丽发现唐纳德·特朗普无法接受。

175,000 Utahans voted for third-party candidate Evan McMullin.

175,000 名犹他州人投票给了第三方候选人埃文·麦克马林 (Evan McMullin)。

Lots more did not vote at all.

还有更多人根本没有投票。

Emily decided she was going to vote for Hillary Clinton after she watched the Democratic Convention.

艾米丽在观看民主党全国代表大会后决定投票给希拉里·克林顿。

She liked her.

她喜欢她。

She liked the message she was sending to women.

她喜欢她向女性传达的信息。

Because of where she lived, Emily's experience before the election was different from most Clinton supporters.

由于居住的地方，艾米丽在大选前的经历与大多数克林顿支持者不同。

And her experience after it this week has also been.

这周之后她的经历也是如此。

For starters, if your world is Mormon and you live in Utah, there are consequences if you support Clinton.

首先，如果你的世界是摩门教，而你住在犹他州，那么如果你支持克林顿，就会产生后果。

Elna Baker explains.

埃尔娜·贝克解释道。

Even before Donald Trump won, Emily paid a price for publicly supporting Hillary Clinton.

甚至在唐纳德·特朗普获胜之前，艾米丽就为公开支持希拉里·克林顿付出了代价。

Her former coworkers stopped calling and texting.

她以前的同事不再打电话和发短信。

She and her younger sister are no longer on speaking terms because of their political and ideological differences.

由于政治和意识形态的差异，她和妹妹不再说话。

Emily wasn't even invited to her wedding ceremony.

艾米丽甚至没有被邀请参加她的婚礼。

It was incredibly lonely.

这是令人难以置信的孤独。

I didn't think I was being all that radical.

我不认为我那么激进。

I feel that I am standing alone out there, and I don't know who has my back.

我觉得我一个人站在外面，我不知道谁在支持我。

You feel like you're just very exposed, being out in a field or on an island.

你感觉自己非常暴露，身处野外或岛屿上。

Emily's not just a casual Republican.

艾米丽不仅仅是一个随便的共和党人。

Her father was a precinct chair in Utah.

她的父亲是犹他州的一名选区主席。

And growing up, he would hold meetings in her living room.

在成长过程中，他会在她的客厅里举行会议。

To her, the Republican Party feels like home-- literally, as in, it feels like the voices coming from the living room.

对她来说，共和党就像家一样——从字面上看，感觉就像是从客厅里传来的声音。

Her dad would take her to election parties and Republican state conventions.

她的父亲会带她参加选举派对和共和党州代表大会。

As a little girl, she'd wanted to be president.

当她还是个小女孩时，她就想当总统。

But her mother discouraged her.

但她的母亲却劝阻了她。

But still, she figured she'd run for some office one day.

但她仍然认为有一天她会竞选某个职位。

As an adult, she worked for two years for Republican Congressman Chris Stewart and four years for Jason Chaffetz, who was one of the most outspoken Republicans about the Benghazi attack.

成年后，她为共和党众议员克里斯·斯图尔特工作了两年，为杰森·查菲茨工作了四年，后者是班加西袭击事件中最直言不讳的共和党人之一。

When Emily decided on Hillary Clinton, she went bigly.

当艾米丽决定选择希拉里·克林顿时，她下了很大的决心。

She wrote an op-ed entitled "Republican Women Should Join Me in Voting for Hillary." She started the Utah chapter of Republican Women for Hillary, she worked the phones for the Clinton campaign, she did interviews on TV.

她写了一篇题为“共和党女性应该和我一起投票给希拉里”的专栏文章。她为希拉里创办了共和党妇女犹他州分会，她为克林顿竞选团队工作，她在电视上接受采访。

It wasn't the first time she took a stand like this.

这并不是她第一次采取这样的立场。

Two years earlier, Emily had been involved in a movement to get Mormon women more authority in the Church.

两年前，艾米丽参与了一场让摩门教女性在教会中获得更多权威的运动。

When Mormon boys turn 12, they're given the power to act in the name of God and to speak on his behalf.

当摩门教男孩年满 12 岁时，他们就被赋予以上帝之名行事并代表他发言的权力。

Girls at 12 get a trinket necklace.

12 岁的女孩会得到一条小饰品项链。

Women can't be priests, elders, bishops, stake president, patriarchs, Quorum of the Seventy, Apostles, Prophets.

女性不能担任牧师、长老、主教、支联会会长、族长、七十员定额组、使徒、先知。

And for the rest of their lives, it's not that women are second-class citizens.

而在她们的余生中，女性也并不是二等公民。

It's that their connection to God can be vetoed by a man at any time.

他们与上帝的联系可以随时被人否决。

Like, if Hermione had to run all her spells past Harry Potter and wasn't allowed to have a wand, she would be pissed.

就像，如果赫敏必须用她所有的咒语打败哈利·波特，并且不被允许拥有魔杖，她会很生气。

Emily looked at Hillary Clinton and thought, if a woman were president, it would be hard for the Mormon Church to continue saying a woman can't have authority.

艾米丽看着希拉里·克林顿，心想，如果一位女性担任总统，摩门教就很难继续说女性不能拥有权威。

It'd send a message to little girls, and over time, maybe more women would demand leadership positions.

它会向小女孩传达一个信息，随着时间的推移，也许会有更多的女性要求担任领导职务。

Emily has a six-year-old daughter named Abigail.

艾米丽有一个六岁的女儿，名叫阿比盖尔。

The same way Emily was ushered into politics as a little girl, she ushered Abigail in.

就像艾米莉在还是个小女孩时就被引入政坛一样，她也引入了阿比盖尔。

They talked about Hillary Clinton a lot.

他们经常谈论希拉里·克林顿。

She used Hillary to teach Abigail a lesson she hadn't been taught, that Abigail could become president one day.

她利用希拉里给阿比盖尔上了一堂她从未受过的课，即阿比盖尔有一天可以成为总统。

Then on Tuesday Hillary Clinton lost to Donald Trump, and it was devastating.

然后周二希拉里·克林顿输给了唐纳德·特朗普，这是毁灭性的。

I talked Emily on Wednesday.

星期三我和艾米丽谈过。

I did not even send my daughter to school today.

今天我什至没有送女儿上学。

My daughter Abigail told me-- she's in first grade-- that yesterday they had a mock election, and she was the only one in her class who voted for Hillary Clinton, and that her friends said-- you know, she said that they tried to get her to vote for Donald Trump.

我女儿阿比盖尔告诉我——她一年级——昨天他们进行了一次模拟选举，她是班上唯一投票给希拉里·克林顿的人，她的朋友们说——你知道，她说他们试图让她投票给唐纳德·特朗普。

And she just said, I wasn't going to do it.

她只是说，我不会这么做。

They weren't going to bully me into voting for anybody that I didn't want to.

他们不会胁迫我投票给我不想投票的人。

And she took great pride in that.

她对此感到非常自豪。

I was afraid of what her classmates were going to say to her about being a Hillary voter and a Hillary supporter.

我担心她的同学会对她说她是希拉里选民和希拉里支持者。

I mean, I wish I could rewind time.

我的意思是，我希望时间能够倒转。

If I had been less excited about it and hadn't talked it up as much, then she wouldn't be this disappointed.

如果我当时不那么兴奋，也没有说得那么多，那么她就不会这么失望。

And I feel like I wanted her so badly to believe that she could do anything she wanted.

我觉得我非常希望她相信她可以做任何她想做的事。

And now there's a part of her that does not believe that anymore.

现在她的一部分不再相信这一点了。

She's been painting pictures and drawing things about being president and has said that she wants to be a female president, that she was going to be next.

她一直在画画和画有关担任总统的事情，并表示她想成为一名女总统，她将成为下一个总统。

And today she said, if Hillary Clinton can't win, I don't think I can win either.

今天她说，如果希拉里·克林顿不能获胜，我认为我也不能获胜。

And I don't know what to tell her, because I want to say, no, you can be anything you want.

我不知道该告诉她什么，因为我想说，不，你可以成为任何你想要的人。

But yesterday showed us that maybe that is just not the reality yet.

但昨天向我们表明，也许这还不是现实。

Let's be clear.

让我们说清楚。

Emily voted for Hillary Clinton, but she's not a Democrat.

艾米丽投票给了希拉里·克林顿，但她不是民主党人。

She's a committed Republican, and all her hopes for the country are with the GOP.

她是一名坚定的共和党人，她对国家的所有希望都寄托在共和党身上。

But this year, she watched her old boss Jason Chaffetz and other senior Utah Republicans, Mormons, un-endorse Donald Trump after the Access Hollywood tape, and then, three weeks later, re-endorse him.

但今年，她看到她的前老板贾森·查菲茨(Jason Chaffetz)和其他犹他州高级共和党人、摩门教徒在《走进好莱坞》录像带之后不再支持唐纳德·特朗普，然后，三周后，又重新支持他。

It was surreal, she said, to hear them describe it as this moral choice.

她说，听到他们将其描述为这种道德选择，真是超现实。

It felt incredibly personal because these were people I had worked with and people who had told me that they really didn't like Trump but here they were just saying, but you've got to go out and vote for him.

这感觉非常个人化，因为这些人和我一起工作过，他们告诉我他们真的不喜欢特朗普，但在这里他们只是说，但你必须出去投票给他。

It felt like a betrayal, of her, of women.

这感觉像是对她、对女性的背叛。

Which is why she'd hoped Donald Trump would lose and Hillary Clinton would win.

这就是为什么她希望唐纳德·特朗普会输而希拉里·克林顿会赢。

In my mind, this would have been a true wake-up call that we needed to expand who we were reaching and we needed to let go of some of these ideas that were unpopular with women and minorities and immigrants.

在我看来，这确实是一个警钟，我们需要扩大我们的覆盖范围，我们需要放弃一些不受妇女、少数族裔和移民欢迎的想法。

And now that that didn't happen, what does it mean for the Republican Party?

现在这种情况没有发生，这对共和党意味着什么？

They got their pass.

他们拿到了通行证。

And I think that sends a signal to the Republican Party that Donald Trump has it right.

我认为这向共和党发出了一个信号，表明唐纳德·特朗普是对的。

It makes me feel that there's not a place for me in a position of leadership in my church, in my party, or in the presidency.

这让我觉得在我的教会、我的政党或总统职位上没有我的领导地位。

I'm not allowed to have the priesthood, I'm not allowed to have the presidency.

我不被允许担任神职人员，也不被允许担任总统。

And it just feels like another slap in the face, that there are certain things that women are just not allowed to have.

这感觉就像又打了一记耳光，因为有些东西是女性不被允许拥有的。

Emily's in a real predicament now.

艾米丽现在确实陷入了困境。

She was so vocal about supporting Hillary Clinton.

她如此直言不讳地支持希拉里·克林顿。

If she hadn't been, she said, or if Clinton had won and Trump had lost, in four years, she could have run for something.

她说，如果她没有这样做，或者如果克林顿赢了而特朗普输了，四年后，她本可以竞选一些东西。

Not president, of course.

当然不是总统。

Something local, something small, a place to start.

一些本地的、一些小的、一个开始的地方。

Now, that's not going to happen.

现在，这不会发生了。

Elna Baker.

埃尔娜·贝克。

Act Ten: New York City Ira Glass Act 10, New York.

第十幕：纽约市 Ira Glass 第 10 幕，纽约。

President-Elect Donald Trump has made it clear that he's going to be tough on both legal and illegal immigrants.

当选总统唐纳德·特朗普明确表示，他将对合法和非法移民采取强硬态度。

That means many immigrants in this country got scared when he won.

这意味着这个国家的许多移民在他获胜时感到害怕。

Zoe Chace sat in the day after the election with some immigration lawyers who were getting nervous calls from their clients.

选举后的第二天，佐伊·查斯 (Zoe Chace) 与一些移民律师坐在一起，这些律师接到了客户打来的紧张电话。

There are two types of worries in this world.

这个世界上有两种忧虑。

One's based on a real threat, and one's based on a feeling.

一个是基于真实的威胁，一个是基于感觉。

And this week immigration lawyers are sorting through both of those.

本周，移民律师将对这两个问题进行整理。

This is an email that Cheryl David, a longtime immigration lawyer in New York, woke up to this morning.

这是纽约长期移民律师谢丽尔·戴维 (Cheryl David) 今天早上醒来时收到的一封电子邮件。

"Hi, Cheryl.

“嗨，谢丽尔。

I'm in total shock for the election result.

我对选举结果感到非常震惊。

I'm literally in disbelief.

我简直不敢相信。

I slept three hours total."

我一共睡了三个小时。”

She's reading this to me and my friend Lindsey Gauzza who's also her associate.

她正在给我和我的朋友 Lindsey Gauzza（她也是她的同事）读这篇文章。

I spent the day after the election at their office.

选举后的一天我在他们的办公室度过。

The email is about one of their clients.

这封电子邮件是关于他们的一位客户的。

"Is it premature to ask for asylum in Canada?

“现在在加拿大申请庇护还为时过早吗？

I'm worried that my own green card will be revoked, as I come from a country that has Syrian refugees.

我担心我自己的绿卡会被撤销，因为我来自一个有叙利亚难民的国家。

Please let me know your thoughts.

请让我知道您的想法。

I'm in total political disarray.

我完全陷入政治混乱之中。

Grazie."

谢谢。”

Revoke my green card because I'm from a country that has Syrian refugees?

因为我来自有叙利亚难民的国家而撤销我的绿卡？

Refugees.

难民。

Lindsey Gauzza Like, that's insane on one hand.

Lindsey Gauzza 就像，一方面这很疯狂。

On the other hand, it's like, oh, it makes sense.

另一方面，这就像，哦，这是有道理的。

We do hate Syrian refugees apparently in this country.

显然，我们确实讨厌这个国家的叙利亚难民。

During the election, President-elect Trump said a couple things about immigrants that have freaked out these lawyers and their clients.

在选举期间，当选总统特朗普说了一些关于移民的事情，这让这些律师和他们的客户感到害怕。

Keep out Muslim refugees, build a wall-- they obviously don't know if Trump is going to do any of that as president or how that will change their jobs.

将穆斯林难民拒之门外，修建隔离墙——他们显然不知道特朗普作为总统是否会做这些事情，也不知道这将如何改变他们的工作。

And they hadn't seriously considered that Trump's views on immigration would become the law-- like, really not.

他们并没有认真考虑过特朗普对移民的观点会成为法律——实际上没有。

Especially lately, they've been super-excited about Hillary Clinton, Cheryl the most.

尤其是最近，他们对希拉里·克林顿（Hillary Clinton）感到超级兴奋，其中最兴奋的是谢丽尔（Cheryl）。

She's the boss.

她是老板。

This is an all-lady office.

这是一间全是女士的办公室。

No men work here.

没有男人在这里工作。

The day I was there, they'd watched Hillary Clinton's concession speech in the dark in Cheryl's office.

我去的那天，他们在谢丽尔办公室的黑暗中观看了希拉里·克林顿的败选演讲。

Sobbing, they said.

他们抽泣着说。

We spend a lot of time together.

我们花了很多时间在一起。

We talk about this stuff all day long.

我们整天都在谈论这些事情。

We've been talking about the election--

我们一直在谈论选举——

For two years.

两年了。

Cheryl David For two years, every single day.

谢丽尔·大卫 两年来的每一天。

And yesterday we felt so positive.

昨天我们感觉很积极。

We were talking about a matriarchy.

我们正在谈论母权制。

No, it didn't even-- it didn't even enter my mind yesterday that she would lose.

不，昨天我什至没有想到她会输。

It's devastating.

这是毁灭性的。

The thing that feels like the legit worry is that all of President Obama's executive orders will be repealed on day one.

让人感觉合理的担忧是，奥巴马总统的所有行政命令都将在第一天就被废除。

Trump said over and over he would do this.

特朗普一再表示他会这样做。

And that will affect a lot of their immigration cases.

这将影响他们的很多移民案件。

For instance, DACA-- this is a status for young adults who came here as children illegally, most of them brought by their parents, the Dream Act kids.

例如，童年抵美者暂缓遣返 (DACA)——这是针对童年时期非法来到这里的年轻人的一种身份，其中大多数是由父母（即“梦想法案”的孩子）带来的。

DACA lets them stay in the country and work.

DACA 让他们留在国内工作。

It's renewable every two years.

每两年可更新一次。

Unless it isn't anymore.

除非现在不再是这样了。

Cheryl reads me another email they got early that morning.

谢丽尔给我读了他们那天早上收到的另一封电子邮件。

"Hi, Andrea or Cheryl.

“嗨，安德里亚或谢丽尔。

I'm sure you're getting flooded with emails about Trump and his position on deporting DACA members.

我确信您收到了大量有关特朗普及其关于驱逐 DACA 成员的立场的电子邮件。

What should I expect to happen with my application in future?"

我的申请将来会发生什么？”

They don't know the answer.

他们不知道答案。

It feels too soon to have the question.

感觉现在提出这个问题还为时过早。

But it doesn't look good for this client.

但对于这位客户来说，情况看起来不太好。

Really, the ones that I am a little concerned-- I'm concerned about the DACA, because I think he will take the DACA.

真的，我有点担心——我担心 DACA，因为我认为他会接受 DACA。

I think they're going to end the DACA program.

我认为他们将结束 DACA 计划。

I don't think he'll take it away from the people who have it, but they won't be allowed to renew it because it's an executive order.

我不认为他会从拥有它的人手中夺走它，但他们不会被允许更新它，因为这是一项行政命令。

So I think executive orders are over.

所以我认为行政命令已经结束了。

And I am pretty straight with clients.

我对客户很直率。

I don't sugarcoat.

我不粉饰。

So, what did you say?

那么，你说什么？

Cheryl David I said, I think that they're going to take it away.

谢丽尔·大卫，我说，我认为他们会把它拿走。

You know, why sugarcoat it?

你知道为什么要糖衣吗？

Um, OK.

嗯，好的。

I'm worried about Trump, you know, his policies.

我担心特朗普，你知道，他的政策。

Uh-huh.

嗯嗯。

Zoe Chace He's Jamaican.

佐伊·切斯（Zoe Chace） 他是牙买加人。

He's got a green card.

他有绿卡。

Lots of the clients here are in this country legally.

这里的很多客户都是合法居留在这个国家的。

They have a green card or a valid visa.

他们拥有绿卡或有效签证。

But they've committed crimes that make them deportable.

但他们犯下的罪行使他们被驱逐出境。

This guy's like that.

这家伙就是这样的。

Obviously these are people Donald Trump has said he wants to deport.

显然，这些人是唐纳德·特朗普所说的他想要驱逐出境的人。

President Obama has also targeted them.

奥巴马总统也瞄准了他们。

These lawyers think even under President Trump, this guy has a pretty good case to stay here.

这些律师认为，即使在特朗普总统的领导下，这个人也有很好的理由留在这里。

Yeah.

是的。

I mean, first of all, you're already in a situation where immigration has already come to-- you have come to their attention.

我的意思是，首先，你已经处于移民已经出现的情况——你已经引起了他们的注意。

So for your purposes, the worst has already happened, and we're taking care of it.

因此，就您而言，最坏的情况已经发生，我们正在处理它。

And it's not going to get worse for you right now.

现在对你来说情况不会变得更糟。

I mean, you're eligible for relief.

我的意思是，你有资格获得救济。

There's been no talk of him making it worse for people who are already green card holders.

没有人说他会让已经是绿卡持有者的情况变得更糟。

This is an example of the other kind of call they've been getting all day.

这是他们一整天接到的另一种电话的例子。

Just generalized anxiety.

只是广泛性焦虑。

No particular reason.

没有什么特别的原因。

Just has my case changed now?

只是我的情况现在有变化吗？

Is everything different?

一切都不同了吗？

I mean, are things going to change?

我的意思是，事情会改变吗？

I think so.

我想是的。

But not for you, I hope.

但我希望不适合你。

There's no sign that it will change for you.

没有迹象表明它会为你改变。

Oh, OK.

哦，好吧。

I appreciate it.

我很感激。

I just wanted a heads-up, you know.

我只是想要一个提醒，你知道。

Yeah, I know.

是的，我知道。

I don't blame you.

我不怪你。

We're all panicking.

我们都很恐慌。

Yeah, I know, you know?

是的，我知道，你知道吗？

Zoe Chace Lin says she knows how it is under President Obama.

佐伊·蔡斯·林 (Zoe Chace Lin) 说她知道奥巴马总统领导下的情况如何。

Like, she knows how to react and advise her clients.

就像，她知道如何应对并为客户提供建议。

She knows when they're safe and when they are not.

她知道他们什么时候安全，什么时候不安全。

And I've felt pretty confident in the last five years to say, I can take you even though you have a deportation order.

在过去的五年里，我非常有信心地说，即使你有驱逐令，我也可以带你走。

You have a path forward.

你有前进的道路。

We can get rid of it.

我们可以摆脱它。

We can get to a green card.

我们可以获得绿卡。

And come with me, I will walk you into this office.

跟我来，我带你走进这间办公室。

We will have an interview with the government.

我们将与政府进行面谈。

They will not arrest you.

他们不会逮捕你。

That maybe isn't true anymore.

这也许不再是真的了。

And we won't know until they start arresting people.

在他们开始逮捕人之前我们不会知道。

You know, they're not going to put out a statement saying--

你知道，他们不会发表声明说——

Crackdown looks like this.

镇压看起来是这样的。

Lindsey Gauzza Exactly, exactly.

Lindsey Gauzza 完全正确。

They're just going to start doing it around-- and it's going to be different all over the country.

他们将开始在各地这样做——而且全国各地的情况都会有所不同。

So you're going to have advocates in San Francisco saying, it's happening like this.

所以旧金山的支持者会说，事情就是这样发生的。

Atlanta is going to be having a different scenario.

亚特兰大将会出现不同的情况。

New York, who knows?

纽约，谁知道呢？

So it just feels really anxiety-inducing for me, and I'm not even the person who is being marched into the government's offices.

所以这对我来说真的很焦虑，而且我什至不是那个被带进政府办公室的人。

It's not my life.

这不是我的生活。

We were talking about this a little bit before, but I don't-- it's a terrible feeling to not know how to advise your clients when they call.

我们之前讨论过这个问题，但我没有——当客户打电话时不知道如何为他们提供建议是一种可怕的感觉。

Usually it's like, if I don't know the answer, I can go to Cheryl.

通常情况下，如果我不知道答案，我可以去找谢丽尔。

And Cheryl almost always knows the answer.

谢丽尔几乎总是知道答案。

And we can figure it out.

我们可以弄清楚。

We can think about the law.

我们可以考虑一下法律。

We can look at cases.

我们可以看案例。

This, it's like, we don't know.

这，就像，我们不知道。

We have lists of clients who are waiting for us to do certain applications we've been preparing to file that now we're not sure if we can.

我们有一些客户正在等待我们提交某些申请，我们一直在准备提交这些申请，但现在我们不确定是否可以。

And we're not going to know the answer for a while.

我们暂时不会知道答案。

I mean, there's--

我的意思是，有——

And I think we don't know the answer because I don't think he knows what he wants to do, frankly.

我认为我们不知道答案，因为坦率地说，我认为他不知道自己想做什么。

I think as a president he doesn't know what he wants to do.

我认为作为总统，他不知道自己想做什么。

I mean, I guess he could build his wall and he'll be busy building the wall and maybe forget about other parts of immigration.

我的意思是，我猜他可以建造他的隔离墙，他会忙于建造隔离墙，也许会忘记移民的其他部分。

And once the wall is built, he'll look at the policies, so we might be safe.

一旦隔离墙建成，他就会研究政策，这样我们可能就安全了。

Brick by brick.

一砖一瓦。

A lot of immigration lawyers around the country are worried and confused, and they got in touch with each other this week.

全国很多移民律师都感到担忧和困惑，本周他们相互取得了联系。

Conference calls, webinars, Facebook posts-- they're in uncharted territory, lots of them, and they don't know what to think.

电话会议、网络研讨会、Facebook 帖子——他们处于未知领域，很多，他们不知道该怎么想。

Once they have the new rules, they'll get a new strategy.

一旦他们有了新规则，他们就会制定新策略。

It's the not knowing that's painful for lawyers.

对于律师来说，不知道才是痛苦的。

Zoe Chace.

佐伊·查斯。

Act Eleven: Toledo Ira Glass Act 11, Toledo, Ohio.

第十一幕：托莱多 Ira Glass 第 11 幕，俄亥俄州托莱多。

So, the youngest person on our production staff is Emmanuel-- Emmanuel Dzotsi.

所以，我们制作团队中最年轻的人是 Emmanuel——Emmanuel Dzotsi。

He's 23, grew up in Toledo, Ohio.

他今年 23 岁，在俄亥俄州托莱多长大。

But he's British.

但他是英国人。

His dad's company would move their family around a lot.

他父亲的公司会经常搬家。

His dad worked in marketing.

他的父亲从事营销工作。

And so they've lived in England and in Belgium and here in the United States, in Ohio.

所以他们住在英国、比利时、美国俄亥俄州。

And late on election night, just before midnight Eastern time, Emanuel was the last person at the office.

在选举之夜深夜，东部时间午夜之前，伊曼纽尔是办公室里的最后一个人。

And he got on the phone to his mom, back home in Ohio, and recorded the conversation.

他打电话给他在俄亥俄州的家中的妈妈，并记录了谈话。

I called my mom, because after watching America vote this anti-immigrant candidate into the presidency, I had this vague panic, that all of a sudden I wasn't welcome here anymore.

我打电话给我妈妈，因为在看到美国将这位反移民候选人选举为总统后，我有一种模糊的恐慌，突然之间我不再受到这里的欢迎。

We're the only black family in our neighborhood in Toledo.

我们是托莱多附近唯一的黑人家庭。

We used to be the only Brits too.

我们也曾经是唯一的英国人。

But somehow our suburb has more of those than other black people.

但不知何故，我们郊区的黑人比其他黑人更多。

And I know this election has been hard on my mom.

我知道这次选举对我妈妈来说很艰难。

Our friends and our neighbors tell her of their anti-immigrant views.

我们的朋友和邻居向她讲述了他们的反移民观点。

They forget she's an immigrant because she's been here so long.

他们忘记了她是移民，因为她在这里已经很久了。

And they forget she's black because she's English.

他们忘记了她是黑人，因为她是英国人。

And they say all kinds of things about Black Lives Matter or the Obamas.

他们对“黑人的命也是命”或奥巴马一家说了各种各样的话。

Come election time in this country, people who otherwise seem quite normal or rational people suddenly say the most outlandish and hurtful things.

在这个国家的选举期间，那些看起来很正常或理性的人突然说出最古怪和最伤人的话。

And they don't even seem to realize that the things that they are saying are extremely hurtful and offensive to me.

他们甚至似乎没有意识到他们所说的话对我来说是极其伤害和冒犯的。

You know, you just feel that the general populace clearly don't want you here.

你知道，你只是觉得普通民众显然不希望你在这里。

After all, when Donald Trump started denouncing the H-B1 visa as well, that's the visa under which we came here.

毕竟，当唐纳德·特朗普也开始谴责 H-B1 签证时，我们就是通过这个签证来到这里的。

I didn't realize until she said it, right then.

直到她说出这句话时我才意识到。

That's us.

那就是我们。

Like, that exact thing is us, the H-1B visa.

就像，那个东西就是我们，H-1B 签证。

I'd seen him talk about that.

我见过他谈论过这个。

You know, we do have our green card.

你知道，我们确实有绿卡。

We are legally here as permanent residents.

我们是合法的永久居民。

The only thing is, is that our green cards come up for renewal in a year or two.

唯一的问题是，我们的绿卡会在一两年内更新。

So we have to decide.

所以我们必须做出决定。

Either we decide to plunge all in and go for citizenship, or we renew.

我们要么决定全力以赴，争取公民身份，要么更新。

But then renewal may be difficult.

但续约可能会很困难。

Or maybe just go.

或者也许就走吧。

When she said this, I thought, but I want to stay.

当她说这句话时，我想，但我想留下来。

I really want to stay.

我真的很想留下来。

And I want you to stay.

我希望你留下来。

Six months ago, we had a big conversation about applying for citizenship.

六个月前，我们就申请公民身份进行了一次大讨论。

A few days later, I put in the form.

几天后，我提交了表格。

But she never mentioned it again, so I knew she hadn't applied.

但她再也没有提过这件事，所以我知道她没有申请。

This didn't feel like the time to bring it up.

感觉现在不是提出这个问题的时候。

My more immediate concern is, you know, what's it going to be like living day to day in this climate and environment.

我更直接关心的是，你知道，在这种气候和环境下每天生活会是什么样子。

I haven't shared it with you, but I had a very nasty experience just last week in the car park at Kroger.

我没有与你分享，但上周我在克罗格的停车场经历了一次非常糟糕的经历。

Kroger's is the local supermarket.

Kroger's 是当地的超市。

Apparently when she pulled in, she had to stop suddenly to avoid a guy going out of the store with his kids.

显然，当她停车时，她不得不突然停下来，以避免一个带着孩子走出商店的男人。

Thinking nothing was wrong, she parks in the spot right next to the guy.

她认为没有什么问题，就把车停在了那家伙旁边。

She was with my kid sister Marissa, who's 16.

她和我 16 岁的妹妹玛丽莎在一起。

And he was clearly saying something and mouthing off inside the car.

而且他显然在车里说着什么，还胡言乱语。

So I stopped.

所以我停了下来。

And then he rolled his window down, and then just sort of a whole torrent of abuse at me.

然后他摇下车窗，然后对我进行了一系列的辱骂。

What did he say?

他说什么？

Emmanuel's Mom Oh, how I should and shouldn't be driving in the car park and blah blah, and I'm speeding around the car park.

Emmanuel 的妈妈哦，我应该和不应该在停车场开车，等等，我在停车场超速行驶。

And I said, uh, no, in fact.

我说，呃，不，事实上。

I was actually being very careful.

其实我是非常小心的。

And I said, well, you really don't need to worry.

我说，好吧，你真的不用担心。

I'm always very careful.

我总是非常小心。

And then he started shouting, get away from my car.

然后他开始大喊，离开我的车。

Don't touch my car.

别碰我的车。

I said, I'm not touching your car.

我说，我不会碰你的车。

I'm not doing anything.

我什么也没做。

I'm standing here.

我站在这里。

And he was just saying, get away from my car.

他只是说，离开我的车。

If you don't get away from my car, I'm calling the police.

如果你不离开我的车，我就报警。

At which point, you know, Marissa started saying, Mommy, Mommy, just leave it.

就在这时，你知道，玛丽莎开始说，妈妈，妈妈，别管它了。

Just leave it.

就留下它吧。

So you know, [INAUDIBLE].

所以你知道，[听不清]。

And then it totally just finally hit me, I was thinking, oh my god.

然后它终于彻底击中了我，我在想，天哪。

And looking at the guy, his face the way-- and suddenly I realized what it was all about it.

看着那个家伙，他的脸——我突然意识到这是怎么回事。

It was a racial thing.

这是种族问题。

You know that trope about immigrant kids translating for their parents who don't speak English?

你知道移民孩子为不会说英语的父母做翻译的比喻吗？

It's true even for parents who speak the Queen's English.

即使对于说女王英语的父母来说也是如此。

My sister translated the situation for my mother.

我姐姐给我妈妈翻译了情况。

You know, Marissa, she was really going on and on at me.

你知道，玛丽莎，她真的对我没完没了。

She was just saying, Mommy, why did you bother to talk to that man?

她只是说，妈妈，你为什么费力去跟那个男人说话呢？

Couldn't you have realized?

难道你就没有意识到吗？

You understand.

你明白。

I said, well, I don't know.

我说，好吧，我不知道。

Clearly, I'm missing something because I don't see what I have to understand.

显然，我错过了一些东西，因为我看不到我必须理解的东西。

And she said, he's a white man with his two children.

她说，他是一个白人，有两个孩子。

If the police had come, they wouldn't have listened to you.

如果警察来了，他们就不会听你的。

They would immediately have taken his side.

他们会立即站在他一边。

And they would have done something bad to you.

他们会对你做一些坏事。

And I said, do you really believe that?

我说，你真的相信吗？

And she said, oh, I know it.

她说，哦，我知道。

She said, you don't seem to understand, Mommy.

她说，妈妈，你好像不明白。

I've actually grown up in this country.

我其实是在这个国家长大的。

You haven't.

你还没有。

And you don't understand how these people are and how they think.

而且你不明白这些人是怎样的，他们是怎样想的。

But that's what would have happened to you.

但这就是发生在你身上的事情。

And it was just really, really horrible, and it really shook me up badly.

这真的非常非常可怕，它真的让我震惊不已。

I was just thinking, I think it's time for our American experiment to end.

我只是在想，我想我们美国的实验是时候结束了。

I was actually thinking you were going to say that.

我其实以为你会这么说。

I don't know.

我不知道。

For some reason, that was my first reaction to the news, was that's what Mommy's thinking.

出于某种原因，这是我听到这个消息的第一反应，妈妈也是这么想的。

But I mean, where would we go?

但我的意思是，我们要去哪里？

Is Britain that much better?

英国有那么好吗？

Well, the thing is, it's all about the devil you know.

好吧，问题是，这都是关于你知道的魔鬼的。

The Britain my mother grew up in wasn't exactly thrilled with the immigrants streaming in from its former colonies.

我母亲长大的英国对从前殖民地涌入的移民并不感到兴奋。

And Brexit has brought back a lot of those anti-immigrant sentiments in the UK.

英国脱欧又在英国带回了很多反移民情绪。

My mom was born in Britain to Dominican parents.

我妈妈出生在英国，父母是多米尼加人。

And my dad moved there from Ghana when he was eight.

我父亲八岁时从加纳搬到了那里。

The US is still a place she doesn't understand, especially after what she's seen in this election.

美国仍然是一个她不了解的地方，尤其是在她在这次选举中看到的一切之后。

She's mentioning fears I haven't heard in a very, very long time.

她提到了我已经很长时间没有听到的恐惧了。

It used to be a regular nightmare of mine, was one of you children being shot dead.

这曾经是我经常做的噩梦，就是你们中的一个孩子被枪杀。

Why live here if you don't have to?

如果没有必要，为什么要住在这里？

If you have option to be elsewhere, why choose here?

如果您可以选择去其他地方，为什么选择这里？

And quite honestly, I've lived my whole life being symbolic black, and I'm quite happy to do that.

老实说，我一生都是象征性的黑色，我很高兴这样做。

But really, I suppose I don't feel valued enough by this society to do what it takes to live here and to struggle and to try to make the difference in order to make this place better.

但实际上，我想我并没有感受到这个社会对我的重视，让我无法尽一切努力生活在这里，努力奋斗，努力做出改变，让这个地方变得更好。

My mom and I talk about race and our place in the world all the time.

我和妈妈总是谈论种族和我们在世界上的地位。

My entire life, the message has always been, rise to the challenge.

我一生的讯息始终是：迎接挑战。

When you're the only one, be the best, and make it easier for the black people who follow you.

当你是唯一的人时，成为最好的，让追随你的黑人更容易。

So hearing this stuff is devastating.

所以听到这些东西是毁灭性的。

She's the one who's supposed to have a good attitude about this.

她才是应该对此保持良好态度的人。

[SIGHS] OK, Mommy.

[叹气]好吧，妈妈。

I don't know.

我不知道。

I think it's all--

我想这就是全部——

Were you hoping that talking to me, you'd feel better?

你希望和我说话会让你感觉好一点吗？

Emmanuel's Mom Don't worry about this country.

伊曼纽尔的妈妈 别担心这个国家。

As they say, a country gets the government it deserves.

正如他们所说，一个国家得到了它应得的政府。

So you know, good luck to them with it.

所以你知道，祝他们好运。

And you just take care of yourself and just carry on being the decent person that you are.

你只需照顾好自己，继续做一个正派的人。

And try to love everybody.

并努力去爱每一个人。

And that's all we can do.

这就是我们所能做的。

Bye.

再见。

Ira Glass Emmanuel Dzotsi.

艾拉·格拉斯·伊曼纽尔·佐西。

He's one of the producers of our show.

他是我们节目的制作人之一。

[MUSIC - "IT SEEMED THE BETTER WAY" BY LEONARD COHEN]

[音乐 - 伦纳德·科恩的“这似乎是更好的方式”]

Credits Ira Glass Well, our production staff, Susan Burton, Zoe Chace, Sean Cole, Neil Drumming, Karen Duffin, Emmanuel Zotsi, Stephanie Foo, Chana Joffe-Walt, David Kestenbaum, Miki Meek, Jonathan Menjivar, Robyn Semien, Matt Tierney, and Nancy Updike.

感谢 Ira Glass Well、我们的制作人员、Susan Burton、Zoe Chace、Sean Cole、Neil Drumming、Karen Duffin、Emmanuel Zotsi、Stephanie Foo、Chana Joffe-Walt、David Kestenbaum、Miki Meek、Jonathan Menjivar、Robyn Semien、Matt Tierney 和 Nancy Updike。

Research help for today's show from Michelle Harris, Benjamin Phelan, and Christopher Sewtala.

米歇尔·哈里斯 (Michelle Harris)、本杰明·费兰 (Benjamin Phelan) 和克里斯托弗·塞塔拉 (Christopher Sewtala) 为今天的节目提供了研究帮助。

Music help from Damien Graef.

达米安·格雷夫 (Damien Graef) 的音乐帮助。

Our website, thisamericanlife.org.

我们的网站 thisamericanlife.org。

This American Life was delivered to public radio stations by PRX, the Public Radio Exchange.

《美国生活》由公共广播电台 PRX 向公共广播电台播出。

Thanks, as always, to our program's co-founder Mr. Torey Malatia.

一如既往地感谢我们项目的联合创始人 Torey Malatia 先生。

You know, he's got a new hobby.

你知道，他有一个新爱好。

He bought himself a priest outfit.

他给自己买了一套牧师服装。

And he likes to go to bars, walk up to people, stand very close, take out his Bible, take out a cross, and ask for their confession.

他喜欢去酒吧，走到人们面前，站得很近，拿出圣经，拿出十字架，要求他们忏悔。

Everything changes.

一切都变了。

Even if they're holding a drink, they'll put it down.

即使他们手里拿着一杯酒，他们也会放下。

I'm Ira Glass, back next week with more stories of This American Life .

我是艾拉·格拉斯，下周回来，带来更多《美国生活》的故事。

This American Life is produced in collaboration with WBEZ Chicago and delivered to stations by PRX The Public Radio Exchange.

《This American Life》与 WBEZ Chicago 合作制作，并由 PRX 公共广播电台传送到各电台。