543: Wake Up Now - This American Life
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00:00 00:00 Transcript Share This American Life Life Partners How to Listen Episodes Recommended About Overview Staff Announcements Fellowships Jobs Music Make Radio On The Road FAQ Submissions Merch Contact Us Our Other Shows Merch Follow Us Life Partners Subscribe to our newsletter Full episode Toggle Audio and Transcript Sync Transcript | Episode #543 | December 26, 2014 543: Wake Up Now Note: This American Life is produced for the ear and designed to be heard.
00:00 00:00 文字记录 分享此 美国生活 生活伙伴 如何收听 剧集 推荐 关于 概述 员工公告 奖学金 工作 音乐 在路上制作电台 常见问题解答 提交 商品 联系我们 我们的其他节目 商品 关注我们 生活伙伴 订阅我们的时事通讯 整集 切换音频和文字记录同步 文字记录 | 内容第 543 集 | 2014 年 12 月 26 日 543：现在醒来 注意：《美国生活》是为耳朵而制作的，旨在让人们听到。
If you are able, we strongly encourage you to listen to the audio, which includes emotion and emphasis that's not on the page.
如果可以的话，我们强烈建议您收听音频，其中包括页面上没有的情感和重点。
Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors.
文字记录是使用语音识别软件和人工转录员结合生成的，可能包含错误。
Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print.
请在印刷版引用前检查相应的音频。
Prologue Ira Glass Someone who works with our radio show, Bianca Giaever, went to this presentation at Columbia University a while back where two people onstage puzzled over this thing they had found online called Wake Up Now.
序言 Ira Glass 为我们的广播节目工作的人 Bianca Giaever 不久前在哥伦比亚大学观看了这个演讲，台上的两个人对他们在网上找到的一个名为“Wake Up Now”的东西感到困惑。
And I say "thing they found online," because the whole point of their presentation was it was hard to tell exactly what it was.
我说“他们在网上找到的东西”，因为他们演示的重点是很难确切地说出它是什么。
Why do some people live their lives in black and white while others seem to live in vibrant color?
为什么有些人的生活是黑白的，而另一些人的生活却似乎是鲜艳的？
Well, part of it is knowing a secret, a secret that changes how people see the world.
嗯，其中一部分是知道一个秘密，一个改变人们看待世界方式的秘密。
This video is your invitation to WakeUpNow.
该视频是您对 WakeUpNow 的邀请。
This is a video that was on WakeUpNow's website, which just looked like a kind of generic corporate-y website.
这是 WakeUpNow 网站上的一个视频，该网站看起来就像是一种通用的企业网站。
And WakeUpNow seemed to be a company.
WakeUpNow 似乎是一家公司。
But it was hard to tell exactly what the company did.
但很难确切地说出该公司做了什么。
This site talked about joining, about becoming a member, about living a better life.
这个网站谈论加入、成为会员、过上更好的生活。
So was it a club?
那么这是一个俱乐部吗？
Was it an organization?
这是一个组织吗？
And then, when you googled WakeUpNow, there were tons of videos.
然后，当你用谷歌搜索 WakeUpNow 时，会出现大量视频。
Bianca saw some at the presentation at Columbia.
比安卡在哥伦比亚大学的演讲中看到了一些。
And then, after the presentation, she started Googling on her own.
然后，在演讲结束后，她开始自己谷歌搜索。
And then, she sucked one of our producers, Brian Reed, into the vortex with her.
然后，她把我们的一位制片人布莱恩·里德（Brian Reed）也卷入了漩涡。
Here is one of the videos they found.
这是他们找到的视频之一。
Hey, we're here in Cancun with the greatest team in the world, WakeUpNow.
嘿，我们和世界上最伟大的团队 WakeUpNow 一起来到坎昆。
You should have been here.
你本来应该在这里的。
All the leaders are here.
所有的领导都在这儿。
We're having fun.
我们玩得很开心。
Beautiful island.
美丽的岛屿。
This is a video of a bunch of young people hanging out on the beach.
这是一群年轻人在海滩闲逛的视频。
You can see jet skis and the ocean.
您可以看到摩托艇和海洋。
In the video, they refer to this as a leadership summit.
在视频中，他们将此称为领导力峰会。
And there was a whole genre of videos just like this, people in exotic locations, riding around in nice looking cars or, in this one, spelunking in a cave in Mexico, chanting.
有一整套类似的视频，人们在异国他乡，骑着漂亮的汽车四处走动，或者在这个视频中，在墨西哥的一个洞穴里探险，吟诵。
That is, of course, WakeUpNow with "La Bamba." And then, there were a lot of videos with the word "scam" in the title, like "WakeUpNow is a scam, for real exposed truth." And so, these two producers on our staff were like, oh, so this is some kind of internet scam.
当然，那就是“La Bamba”的 WakeUpNow。然后，出现了很多标题中带有“骗局”一词的视频，例如“WakeUpNow 是一个骗局，真正暴露了真相”。所以，我们员工中的这两位制作人就像，哦，所以这是某种网络骗局。
But then, when they watched the videos, it seemed very different.
但当他们观看视频时，情况似乎很不一样。
Like, take this one for example titled, "WakeUpNow Warning, Don't Join Until You See This."
例如，以标题为“WakeUpNow 警告，在看到此内容之前不要加入”的示例为例。
WakeUpNow is one of the most legitimate companies out there.
WakeUpNow 是最合法的公司之一。
The reason why is because--
究其原因，是因为——
So "WakeUpNow Warning, Don't Join Till You See This" is actually not a warning at all but entirely about how great WakeUpNow is.
因此，“WakeUpNow 警告，请勿加入，直到看到此内容”实际上根本不是警告，而完全是关于 WakeUpNow 的出色之处。
And in fact, there were so many videos like this, a video called "Five Reasons Not to Join WakeUpNow" offered not a single reason why not to join WakeUpNow, but instead went on to describe what a super awesome company it is.
事实上，这样的视频还有很多，一个名为《不加入 WakeUpNow 的五个理由》的视频没有给出任何不加入 WakeUpNow 的理由，而是继续描述这是一家多么棒的公司。
So I'm joined in the studio right now by the two producers who were watching all these videos, Brian and Bianca.
现在，正在观看所有这些视频的两位制作人布莱恩和比安卡加入了我的工作室。
Hi, guys.
嗨，大家好。
So at that point, as best as you could tell, what was WakeUpNow?
那么在那一点上，据您所知，WakeUpNow 是什么？
We honestly didn't know.
老实说我们不知道。
Like, we couldn't figure it out.
就像，我们无法弄清楚。
We eventually put some research in.
我们最终进行了一些研究。
We learned that, later, this move, the scam thing--
后来我们才知道，这个举动，骗局的事情——
You mean labeling videos "Such and Such is a Scam"?
您的意思是给视频贴上“某某是骗局”的标签？
Yeah, exactly that.
是的，正是如此。
And then, having it not actually talk about it being a scam.
然后，让它实际上没有谈论它是一个骗局。
So that's a move, I guess, that some people who are involved with certain companies or selling certain products will do.
所以我想，一些参与某些公司或销售某些产品的人会采取这一行动。
Like, that's a thing, I guess.
就像，我想这是一件事。
But I'd never seen a video like that before.
但我以前从未见过这样的视频。
And it was really confusing.
这真的很令人困惑。
I mean, in so many of these WakeUpNow videos, we could tell people we're pitching something.
我的意思是，在很多 WakeUpNow 视频中，我们可以告诉人们我们正在推销一些东西。
But as far as we could tell, it wasn't a product.
但据我们所知，它不是一种产品。
(SINGING) Build a bank, ah!
（唱）建银行啊！
I say, I say, I say, you need to build a bank, ah!
我说我说我说你要建银行啊！
So what is this?
那么这是什么？
Bianca Giaever This is a video of a guy who calls himself Panama.
Bianca Giaever 这是一个自称巴拿马的人的视频。
And it's titled "WakeUpNow Scam, Lend a Hand, Build a Man, Woman."
它的标题是“WakeUpNow Scam，伸出援助之手，建立一个男人，女人”。
What are you doing?
你在干什么？
Eating carrots?
吃胡萝卜吗？
Tomatoes?
西红柿？
[SPEAKING SPANISH]
[说西班牙语]
So yeah, it wasn't really clear what WakeUpNow was.
是的，目前还不清楚 WakeUpNow 是什么。
But still, there were hundreds of these videos.
但这样的视频仍然有数百个。
It was like this whole subculture with all these people, about thousands of people.
这就像整个亚文化，有这么多人，大约有数千人。
OK, so then, I know what happened next is that you found out that WakeUpNow had a conference coming up, right?
好的，那么，我知道接下来发生的事情是您发现 WakeUpNow 即将召开会议，对吗？
Yeah, and we went to try and figure out what this was.
是的，我们试图弄清楚这是什么。
Yeah, and what we eventually found out is that it's something called "network marketing." It's a network marketing company.
是的，我们最终发现这就是所谓的“网络营销”。这是一家网络营销公司。
But also what we found out is that that is a very bland term for something completely mind-blowing, way beyond anything we could have imagined.
但我们还发现，这是一个非常平淡的术语，指的是完全令人兴奋的事物，远远超出我们的想象。
So today on our radio program, Wake Up Now.
今天我们的广播节目《现在醒来》。
If nothing else, I have to say, that is a completely genius name for a company.
如果不出意外的话，我不得不说，这对于一家公司来说绝对是一个天才的名字。
It promises so much so efficiently.
它的承诺如此之多，如此有效。
That you'll open your eyes.
你会睁开眼睛。
You're life will be totally different, totally better.
你的生活将会完全不同，完全更好。
And so, today, as New Year's approaches, as lots of people take stock of who they've been and make resolutions about who they want to be, we have stories of people in very different contexts who try to wake up and wake up others.
因此，今天，随着新年的临近，当许多人盘点自己曾经是谁并决定自己想成为谁时，我们看到了不同背景下的人们试图唤醒并唤醒他人的故事。
Stay with us.
留在我们身边。
Act 1, Something's Happening Here and You Don't Know What It Is.
第一幕，这里发生了一些事情，但你不知道那是什么。
So Brian and Bianca headed to WakeUpNow's conference in New York City at a hotel in Times Square to try to figure out what this was.
因此，布莱恩和比安卡前往纽约时代广场一家酒店参加 WakeUpNow 会议，试图弄清楚这是什么。
Here they are, Brian and Bianca.
他们在这里，布莱恩和比安卡。
I'm a little embarrassed to admit this.
我有点不好意思承认这一点。
But even after being at this conference for several hours, if you put a gun to my head and asked me what WakeUpNow is, what it does, I still don't think I could have told you.
但即使在参加这个会议几个小时之后，如果你用枪指着我的头并问我 WakeUpNow 是什么，它有什么作用，我仍然认为我无法告诉你。
We talked to dozens of participants.
我们与数十名参与者进行了交谈。
And what we learned is that people were incredibly excited about something they weren't terribly good at explaining.
我们了解到，人们对他们不太擅长解释的事情感到非常兴奋。
Why do WakeUpNow?
为什么要立即唤醒？
This is a new beginning for the new generation.
对于新一代来说，这是一个新的开始。
What is it?
它是什么？
I don't even know what it is.
我什至不知道那是什么。
Oh, it's a software company.
哦，这是一家软件公司。
Bianca Giaever It's a software company, you said?
Bianca Giaever 你说这是一家软件公司？
I think.
我认为。
Bianca Giaever People had come from all over, East Coast, Minnesota, California.
比安卡·贾埃弗 (Bianca Giaever) 人们来自世界各地，东海岸、明尼苏达州、加利福尼亚州。
They're mostly young and mostly people of color.
他们大多是年轻人，而且大多是有色人种。
They called WakeUpNow a lifestyle.
他们将 WakeUpNow 称为一种生活方式。
They talked about WUN life, W-U-N, for WakeUpNow.
他们为 WakeUpNow 谈论了 WUN 生活，W-U-N。
For the longest time, I couldn't even figure out what to call the hundreds of people at this conference.
在很长一段时间里，我什至不知道如何称呼参加这次会议的数百人。
Were they customers of WakeUpNow?
他们是 WakeUpNow 的客户吗？
Employees?
雇员？
Card-carrying members?
持卡会员？
Whatever they were, some of them could list specific WakeUpNow products.
无论它们是什么，其中一些可以列出特定的 WakeUpNow 产品。
And the product is?
产品是？
Man 1 Awaken Thunder.
男人1唤醒雷霆。
What's Wake and Thunder?
什么是唤醒和雷霆？
Man 1 Awaken Thunder.
男人1唤醒雷霆。
It's--
这是——
What is that?
那是什么？
Man 1 --an energy drink.
Man 1——能量饮料。
An energy drink.
一种能量饮料。
OK.
好的。
I'm just try-- so are you guys going to work for the company?
我只是尝试一下——那么你们愿意为这家公司工作吗？
Or you're buying the product?
或者你正在购买该产品？
Well, we don't have to buy the product.
好吧，我们不必购买该产品。
So what you do is you just go around and spread the word about it.
所以你要做的就是到处传播它。
But are you selling an energy drink, though?
但你在卖能量饮料吗？
I'm confused.
我很困惑。
No, we don't have to sell it.
不，我们不必卖掉它。
Man 2 The company offers it.
男人2 公司提供它。
Yeah.
是的。
Man 2 The company offers it for you.
男士2 公司为您提供。
It's exclusive only for the people that are in WakeUpNow.
它仅适用于 WakeUpNow 中的用户。
So there are products.
于是就有了产品。
And these people encouraged other people to buy them.
这些人鼓励其他人购买它们。
But when we tried to use the word "selling," we were corrected.
但当我们尝试使用“销售”这个词时，我们被纠正了。
Yeah, I mean, I don't like saying "selling." I like using "providing." I provide people with it.
是的，我的意思是，我不喜欢说“销售”。我喜欢用“提供”。我为人们提供它。
No, not really.
不，不是真的。
I got a commission from it.
我从中得到了佣金。
That's about it.
就是这样。
Awaken Thunder energy drink was not the only thing WakeUpNow was not selling, but providing.
唤醒雷霆能量饮料并不是 WakeUpNow 唯一不销售而是提供的东西。
People seemed to be listing a totally random assortment of products.
人们似乎列出了完全随机的产品种类。
Lots of things people said WakeUpNow offered were just discounts, off their AT&T phone bills, purchases at Office Depot, on groceries.
人们说 WakeUpNow 提供的很多东西只是折扣、AT&T 电话费折扣、在 Office Depot 购物、杂货等。
We have the Trivanis.
我们有特里瓦尼斯。
Brian Reed What are those?
布莱恩·里德那些是什么？
And then, we have the coffee.
然后，我们喝咖啡。
Man 4 We have cyber-protection.
Man 4 我们有网络保护。
Have you ever wanted to learn another language?
您曾经想学习另一种语言吗？
well we have a program that has 80 languages, similar to Rosetta Stone.
我们有一个有 80 种语言的程序，类似于 Rosetta Stone。
There's a vacation club.
有一个度假俱乐部。
Man 5 For example, I'm going to Florida.
男人 5 例如，我要去佛罗里达。
Hotel's usually $1,100.
酒店通常是1,100美元。
I'm going to pay $290 for the whole week, a condo.
我打算支付 290 美元一整周的公寓费用。
There's tax software.
有税务软件。
Man 6 Most people can increase their tax deduction by $3,000 to $6,000 per year, just by the tax part alone.
Man 6 大多数人每年可以将税收减免增加 3,000 至 6,000 美元，仅考虑税收部分。
But in this sea of hard-to-understand information and unrelated products, one thing everyone seemed to agree on, WakeUpNow had a mission.
但在这片难以理解的信息和不相关产品的海洋中，每个人似乎都同意一件事：WakeUpNow 有一个使命。
WakeUpNow actually is a financial wellness company, showing people how to save, manage, and make money.
WakeUpNow 实际上是一家金融健康公司，向人们展示如何储蓄、管理和赚钱。
In fact, so many people recited this mission so precisely, it was actually a bit weird.
事实上，这么多人把这个任务背诵得如此精确，实在是有些奇怪了。
We'll save money, manage money, and make money.
我们会省钱、理财、赚钱。
Save money, make money, and manage your money.
省钱、赚钱、管理你的钱。
Save, manage, and make money.
储蓄、管理和赚钱。
Man 11 Save money, manage money, and make more money.
男人11省钱、理财、赚更多钱。
Save, manage, and make money at the same time.
同时节省、管理和赚钱。
It took us all day and, honestly, quite a bit more research afterwards, including signing up ourselves-- which was really complicated-- to piece together how WakeUpNow works.
我们花了一整天的时间，说实话，之后还进行了更多的研究，包括我们自己注册——这真的很复杂——来拼凑出 WakeUpNow 的工作原理。
Like I said earlier, they're a network marketing company.
正如我之前所说，他们是一家网络营销公司。
And if you haven't heard that term, you've probably heard of Amway or Herbalife or New-Skin, companies where you sell things to people you know.
如果您还没有听说过这个词，您可能听说过安利、康宝莱或 New-Skin，这些公司向您认识的人出售产品。
That's network marketing.
这就是网络营销。
When you join WakeUpNow, you get access to a place on their website called The Hub, which is where you can purchase many of the products and services we heard about.
当您加入 WakeUpNow 时，您可以访问他们网站上名为 The Hub 的位置，您可以在这里购买我们听说过的许多产品和服务。
You can join for free.
您可以免费加入。
But you're encouraged to sign up on a plan where you pay between $80 and $150 a month.
但我们鼓励您注册每月支付 80 至 150 美元的计划。
You pay more money, you get more stuff, like the financial management and tax software.
你花更多的钱，你会得到更多的东西，比如财务管理和税务软件。
So that's the saving money and managing money part of WakeUpNow.
这就是 WakeUpNow 的省钱和理财部分。
As for the making money part, you can make money by recruiting other people to join WakeUpNow.
至于赚钱部分，你可以通过招募其他人加入WakeUpNow来赚钱。
They buy stuff, you can earn commission.
他们买东西，你可以赚取佣金。
They recruit people, you make money off that too.
他们招人，你也能从中赚钱。
A chain forms below you.
一条链条在你下方形成。
That's the network in network marketing.
这就是网络营销中的网络。
You get three people to join, you get $100.
只要三个人加入，你就可以得到 100 美元。
If each of them gets three people to join, that's when the real money kicks in, about $600 a month.
如果他们每个人都吸引三个人加入，那么真正的钱就会开始发挥作用，每月大约 600 美元。
There are other ways to earn that money.
还有其他方法可以赚到这笔钱。
But that's the one we saw them push.
但这就是我们看到他们推动的。
I know, this may sound like a pyramid scheme.
我知道，这听起来像是传销。
Whether it is one, though, would have to be decided by the courts.
不过，是否属实还须由法院决定。
We called the Federal Trade Commission.
我们致电联邦贸易委员会。
And a spokesman said figuring out if a network marketing company is a pyramid scheme is very difficult and takes a long investigation.
一位发言人表示，弄清楚一家网络营销公司是否是传销公司非常困难，需要长期调查。
The FTC's website says a good tip off that a network marketing company might be a pyramid scheme is that members earn more money for recruiting new members than for selling products to the public.
联邦贸易委员会的网站称，网络营销公司可能是传销的一个好消息是，会员通过招募新会员赚的钱比向公众销售产品的钱更多。
WakeUpNow's chief marketing officer told us that 100% of the company's profits come from product sales.
WakeUpNow的首席营销官告诉我们，公司100%的利润来自于产品销售。
But when you pay a monthly fee to join, they consider that a product.
但当你支付月费加入时，他们就会认为这是一种产品。
He said WakeUpNow is absolutely not a pyramid scheme.
他表示，WakeUpNow绝对不是传销。
For now though, WakeUpNow members are charging forth, recruiting more and more people into the company and, apparently, getting paid a boatload to do it.
但目前，WakeUpNow 的成员正在奋力拼搏，招募越来越多的人加入公司，显然，他们也因此获得了丰厚的报酬。
Boom, boom, boom.
繁荣，繁荣，繁荣。
Just watch, probably 500K a month walked by you.
看看吧，大概每个月你走过50万。
This guy's pointing at a group of otherwise ordinary looking people.
这家伙指着一群看上去很普通的人。
He's talking about all their salaries added together.
他说的是他们所有的工资加在一起。
500K a month?
一个月50万？
Man 13 500K a month just walked by you, under 25-years-old.
一个月1350万的男人就从你身边走过，25岁以下。
This company is making history actually.
这家公司实际上正在创造历史。
This company is creating the largest amount of under 30-year-old 6-figure-earner that I've ever seen.
这家公司创造了我所见过最多的 30 岁以下收入达 6 位数的公司。
Look, 6-figure-earner, 6-figure-earner.
看，六位数的收入，六位数的收入。
People loved pointing out all the 6-figure-earner magnates among us.
人们喜欢指出我们当中所有年薪六位数的富豪。
In our first few minutes of the conference, I saw this big bearded man.
在会议的前几分钟，我看到了这个大胡子男人。
Someone else called him, quote, "a freaking duck hunter guy," which seemed like an apt description.
引用其他人的话说，他是“一个该死的鸭子猎人”，这似乎是一个恰当的描述。
People lined up to take pictures with him.
人们排着队与他合影。
Someone nearby told me why.
附近有人告诉我原因。
My boy right here is making $114,000 a month right now, $114,000.
我的儿子现在每月赚 114,000 美元，114,000 美元。
His name?
他的名字？
See More Green.
查看更多绿色。
That's S-E-E M-O-R-E Green.
那是 S-E-E M-O-R-E 绿色。
See More is the top earner in WakeUpNow.
See More 是 WakeUpNow 中收入最高的人。
He's been doing it a year.
他已经这样做一年了。
He's 25.
他25岁了。
Everybody knew who he was and how much he allegedly made.
每个人都知道他是谁以及他据称赚了多少钱。
Later in the day, WakeUpNow gave See More Green an award for being number one.
当天晚些时候，WakeUpNow 向 See More Green 颁发了第一名的奖项。
(CHANTING) See More!
（念诵）看到更多！
Man 17 See More Green!
男士 17 看到更多绿色！
See More!
查看更多！
See More!
查看更多！
See More!
查看更多！
See More!
查看更多！
See More!
查看更多！
See More!
查看更多！
A woman near me says, he's a regular dude.
我附近的一位女士说，他是个普通人。
He's wearing a t-shirt.
他穿着一件 T 恤。
You would never know.
你永远不会知道。
You would never know.
你永远不会知道。
Woman 6 You'd never know, right?
女人 6 你永远不会知道，对吧？
[CHEERING] Brian Reed Another thing we encountered at the conference was a repulsion to something so unsavory, so unseemly, that WakeUpNow's emcee for the day couldn't even bear to speak the word aloud.
[欢呼] Brian Reed 我们在会议上遇到的另一件事是对一些令人厌恶、不体面的事情的厌恶，以至于 WakeUpNow 当天的主持人甚至无法大声说出这个词。
So he spelled it out instead.
所以他改为拼写出来。
There are so many people in a J-O-B that are bored.
J-O-B 中有很多人感到无聊。
There's no reason they just another one of them.
没有理由他们只是其中的另一个。
J-O-B.
工作。
Quick warning, I'm going to say the word right now, job.
快速警告，我现在就要说这个词，工作。
When you go into a store and you run into an employee with a J-O-B, and you can see it in their face.
当你走进一家商店，遇到一位拿着 J-O-B 的员工时，你可以从他们的脸上看到这一点。
There is no energy, because they're not invested in what they're doing.
没有精力，因为他们没有投入到他们正在做的事情上。
It's not their business.
这不关他们的事。
I'm looking at a room full of people who care, because it's their business.
我看着一屋子充满关心的人，因为这是他们的事。
It is their future.
这是他们的未来。
That is why I love this industry.
这就是我热爱这个行业的原因。
This dissatisfaction with 9-to-5s ran deep through the crowd.
这种对朝九晚五的不满情绪深入人群。
Take this paralegal.
以这位律师助理为例。
How does she describe her job?
她如何描述她的工作？
It's a soul-sucking, like, life-destroying, "sit at a desk all day and get fat" waste of life.
这是一种吸食灵魂、毁灭生命的“整天坐在办公桌前发胖”的生命浪费。
She told me that as soon as her income from WakeUpNow inches above her current salary, she's outta there.
她告诉我，一旦她从 WakeUpNow 获得的收入比她目前的工资高出几英寸，她就会离开那里。
It could be, like, $1 more than I'm making now.
可能比我现在赚的多 1 美元。
I'm quitting.
我要辞职了
Like, literally, $1.
就像字面意思一样，1 美元。
OK, I quit.
好吧，我退出了。
I'm not coming in ever.
我永远不会进来。
Of course, lots of jobs do suck.
当然，很多工作确实很糟糕。
A surprising number of attendees at the conference told us they were planning on quitting to pursue WakeUpNow.
数量惊人的与会者告诉我们，他们计划退出，转而追求 WakeUpNow。
These appear to be people with steady full-time E-M-P-L-O-Y-M-E-N-T, a compliance manager at a big bank, a human resources person at Coca-Cola.
这些人似乎有稳定的全职 E-M-P-L-O-Y-M-E-N-T、一家大银行的合规经理、可口可乐的人力资源人员。
And we also met people who had actually done it.
我们还遇到了真正做到这一点的人。
One person quit a restaurant.
一个人离开了一家餐馆。
Another quit his sales job at Samsung.
另一位则辞去了三星的销售工作。
Plus, there was this guy.
另外，还有这个人。
He quit his job two years ago.
他两年前辞去了工作。
Now, he has a motto.
现在，他有一个座右铭。
It's clear why lots of people would want to leave their current lousy jobs.
很明显为什么很多人想离开目前糟糕的工作。
What's not so clear is why they'd choose to leave them for WakeUpNow.
不太清楚的是他们为什么选择离开他们去 WakeUpNow。
When you look at the WakeUpNow compensation plan, which we did later, it actually says in there how many members are making a small profit, 4%.
当你看一下我们后来做的 WakeUpNow 补偿计划时，它实际上说明了有多少会员正在赚取微薄的利润，4%。
That's it.
就是这样。
And those 4% are not making a living, just an average of about $600 a month.
而这 4% 的人并没有谋生，平均每月只有 600 美元左右。
The number of people making anything close to resembling a living is about 1%.
谋生的人数大约为 1%。
Those are the company's numbers.
这些是公司的数字。
If they're accurate, presumably 95% of the people chanting in this conference room weren't making any profit whatsoever.
如果准确的话，想必 95% 在这个会议室里喊口号的人都没有获得任何利润。
(CHANTING) WakeUpNow!
（唱诵）现在醒来！
WakeUpNow!
现在醒来！
WakeUpNow!
现在醒来！
WakeUpNow!
现在醒来！
WakeUpNow!
现在醒来！
WakeUpNow!
现在醒来！
WakeUpNow!
现在醒来！
This is the beginning of the main event, what was billed as a business presentation that stretched on for nearly five hours with more than a dozen speakers.
这是主要活动的开始，这场被宣传为商业演示的活动持续了近五个小时，有十多名演讲者。
A lot of it was about how to recruit people into WakeUpNow.
其中很多内容是关于如何招募人员加入 WakeUpNow。
I should say, officially, the company doesn't use the word "recruit." But there's no other way to describe what we saw.
我应该说，公司官方并没有使用“招聘”这个词。但没有其他方法可以描述我们所看到的。
It was about recruiting.
这是关于招聘的。
Like this advice from a guy named Rob McFadden.
就像罗布·麦克法登（Rob McFadden）的建议一样。
He said that, on the day you launch your WakeUpNow business--
他说，在你推出 WakeUpNow 业务的那天——
You set up a conference call at 10:00 AM.
您在上午 10:00 设置了电话会议。
You invite everybody you know to be on that call.
您邀请所有认识的人参加该通话。
On that call, all you tell them is, I'm launching.
在那个电话中，你只告诉他们，我要发射了。
We're going nuts.
我们快要疯了。
I can't even tell you what we're doing.
我什至无法告诉你我们在做什么。
I have a call scheduled at noon.
我中午有一个电话。
Who's going to be on it?
谁会参与其中？
The next step was to get each person on the 10:00 AM call to bring 10 more people with them to the noon call and, then, to do the exact same thing over again for a 2 o'clock call, all with no mention of what the business actually is.
下一步是让上午 10:00 的通话中的每个人再带 10 个人参加中午的通话，然后在 2 点的通话中再次做同样的事情，所有这些都没有提及实际业务是什么。
After all--
毕竟——
People care more about how you say something that anything you ever say.
人们更关心你怎么说，而不是你说过的话。
The fact that they called this event a business presentation was strange, because there was so little actual business discussed.
他们将这次活动称为商业演示，这一事实很奇怪，因为讨论的实际业务太少了。
So much of it was just motivational speeches.
其中大部分只是励志演讲。
And you being here today, I got to give you props.
你今天来到这里，我必须给你支持。
Because you get it.
因为你明白了。
You get it.
你明白了。
You're changing lives.
你正在改变生活。
You're starting a movement.
你正在发起一场运动。
You don't got a dream, you don't have a roadmap.
你没有梦想，你没有路线图。
You don't have a roadmap, you ain't taking a trip.
你没有路线图，你就没有去旅行。
See, what is it that drives you?
看看，是什么驱使着你？
Is it feeding starving kids?
是在喂养饥饿的孩子吗？
Is it making a difference in this world?
它对这个世界有影响吗？
I saw a vision to help people.
我看到了帮助人们的愿景。
I saw a vision to change the world.
我看到了改变世界的愿景。
You have the ability to speak life or death into people.
你有能力对人们说出生或死。
WakeUpNow is speaking life.
WakeUpNow 正在讲述生活。
This was the aspect of the conference that we really struggled to make sense of, the contrast between this vision of WakeUpNow changing the world, speaking life into people, and the reality of what it seemed like WakeUpNow is actually doing, which is selling energy drinks and giving people discounts on random stuff.
这是我们真正难以理解的会议的一个方面，WakeUpNow 改变世界、向人们讲述生活的愿景与 WakeUpNow 看起来实际上正在做的事情（销售能量饮料并为人们提供随机商品折扣）之间的对比。
Now, product announcements, guys.
现在，产品公告，伙计们。
It wouldn't be--
不会是——
This crystallized during the single most confusing moment of the conference, the big announcement they made in between inspirational speeches.
这一点在会议中最令人困惑的时刻得到了体现，即他们在鼓舞人心的演讲之间宣布的重大消息。
The company's marketing director, Jordan Harris, took the stage.
该公司营销总监乔丹·哈里斯上台。
Nobody else outside this room knows anything about what we're about to talk about.
这个房间之外的其他人都不知道我们将要谈论的内容。
And what he went on to talk about was coupons.
他接着谈到的是优惠券。
WakeUpNow members have access to coupons that they can print out and use to get money off at local businesses.
WakeUpNow 会员可以使用优惠券，打印出来并用于在当地企业赚钱。
How many of you guys have smartphones?
你们中有多少人拥有智能手机？
OK, pull out your smartphones real quick.
好的，赶快拿出你的智能手机。
How cool would it be if, instead of having to print the coupon, you just showed your smartphone.
如果您不必打印优惠券，而只需出示您的智能手机，那该多酷啊。
[CHEERING] Right?
[欢呼]对吧？
This is awesome.
这太棒了。
So guys, we're excited.
所以伙计们，我们很兴奋。
Today, we're announcing our new iPhone and Android app that's going to let you do just that.
今天，我们宣布推出新的 iPhone 和 Android 应用程序，让您能够做到这一点。
The big announcement was that you no longer had to print the coupons out.
最重要的公告是您不再需要打印优惠券。
You could now just use a smartphone app.
您现在只需使用智能手机应用程序即可。
Let's talk about when it's going to launch.
我们来谈谈它什么时候推出。
OK, it's going to be available-- two weeks.
好的，它将可用——两周。
[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE] What do you think?
[欢呼和掌声]你觉得怎么样？
I think we can do better.
我认为我们可以做得更好。
Let's just do it today.
我们今天就这样做吧。
That's right.
这是正确的。
You can go in the iPhone store and Android store and download this today!
您今天就可以前往 iPhone 商店和 Android 商店下载！
After this, Brian and I had to check with each other.
此后，布莱恩和我必须互相核实。
We honestly weren't sure if we had missed something.
老实说，我们不确定我们是否错过了一些东西。
This excitement was over coupons?
这种兴奋是因为优惠券吗？
The emcee couldn't even move on with the presentation after this, because everyone was so overwhelmed.
此后主持人甚至无法继续演示，因为每个人都不知所措。
Wow, that is-- I'm-- I'm beside myself.
哇，那是——我——我疯了。
I know, you're all looking.
我知道，你们都在寻找。
It's OK, take your time.
没关系，慢慢来。
Wow.
哇。
All right, we're all catching our breath.
好吧，我们都喘口气了。
It's OK.
没关系。
Yeah, day might as well be over for some of you.
是的，对于你们中的一些人来说，一天可能已经结束了。
We left the conference not sure what to think of what we'd witnessed.
会议结束后，我们不知道该如何看待我们所目睹的一切。
But the fact that people were talking about quitting their jobs to do WakeUpNow, when the chances of making any kind of living were so low, that seemed alarming.
但事实上，当谋生的机会如此之低时，人们却在谈论辞掉工作去做 WakeUpNow，这似乎令人震惊。
And to our surprise, when we interviewed WakeUpNow's Chief Marketing Officer Jordan Harris, the guy who made the coupon announcement, he said that isn't meant to be the company's message.
令我们惊讶的是，当我们采访 WakeUpNow 的首席营销官乔丹·哈里斯（Jordan Harris）时，他是宣布优惠券的人，他说这并不意味着该公司要传达的信息。
They don't want everyone quitting their jobs.
他们不希望每个人都辞职。
There's an element of any live event, like we have, where sometimes people get up there and they get excited.
任何现场活动都有一个元素，就像我们一样，有时人们会站起来并感到兴奋。
And there's things that you'd rather have them not say.
有些事情你宁愿他们不要说。
Our standard advice for people, you should be replacing your income for at least three to four months consistently through WakeUpNow before you consider it.
我们对人们的标准建议是，在考虑之前，您应该通过 WakeUpNow 持续更换至少三到四个月的收入。
So on WakeUpNow's Income Disclosure Statement, it says that 4% of members make a profit.
所以在 WakeUpNow 的收入披露声明中，它说 4% 的会员盈利。
Do you think most people who are doing WakeUpNow as a business know that number?
您认为大多数从事 WakeUpNow 业务的人都知道这个数字吗？
I think, no question.
我想，毫无疑问。
That is so widely disseminated.
这句话传播得如此广泛。
You can go pull income disclosure statements from--
您可以从以下位置获取收入披露报表——
You guys-- like, I don't think you mentioned it aloud at the conference.
你们——就像，我认为你们没有在会议上大声提到这一点。
Yeah, we don't mention it aloud.
是的，我们不会大声提及。
But it's like, it is--
但它就像是——
Why not?
为什么不呢？
Jordan Harris --on our website, on every-- eh?
乔丹·哈里斯——在我们的网站上，在每个网站上——嗯？
In a conference, when you're out there talking to them, it didn't come up.
在会议上，当你在那里与他们交谈时，这个问题并没有出现。
We're at a conference.
我们正在开会。
We're trying to have high energy.
我们正在努力保持高能量。
We're there to have a lot of fun.
我们来这里是为了玩得很开心。
That's not something that is pitched from stage.
这不是在舞台上推销的东西。
But we make sure that everybody is aware of it.
但我们确保每个人都知道这一点。
I don't know if you saw to stage left.
我不知道你是否看到舞台向左走。
There was an income disclosure statement on the wall.
墙上贴着一份收入披露表。
It was in the booklet that everybody got.
每个人都拿到了小册子里。
So everybody left with that income disclosure statement in their hand.
所以每个人都拿着收入披露表离开了。
We don't want people joining with the idea that, hey, you promised me, if I joined, I would make this amount.
我们不希望人们加入的想法是，嘿，你向我保证，如果我加入，我会赚到这么多钱。
That's not what we care about.
那不是我们关心的。
We care about changing your financial situation from the products.
我们关心通过产品改变您的财务状况。
And if you'd like to supplement it by making money, you have an opportunity.
如果你想通过赚钱来补充它，你就有机会。
We told Jordan this wasn't the measured message we left the conference with.
我们告诉乔丹，这不是我们离开会议时所传达的谨慎信息。
Instead, in a room where less than 1% was making any real money from WakeUpNow, we heard speakers spinning a fantasy of enormous wealth, infinity pools, trips to Cancun.
相反，在一个只有不到 1% 的人从 WakeUpNow 赚到真正钱的房间里，我们听到演讲者编织着巨大财富、无边泳池、坎昆之旅的幻想。
One speaker had the crowd shout out their favorite fancy cars, Maseratis and Porsches.
一位演讲者让人群大声喊出他们最喜欢的豪华汽车：玛莎拉蒂和保时捷。
Jordan understood why we got this impression.
乔丹明白我们为什么会有这样的印象。
But he says that's not WakeUpNow is really about.
但他表示，这并不是 WakeUpNow 的真正目的。
He says their company was built around the idea of helping people make an extra $500 or $600 a month and that they chose that number deliberately.
他说，他们的公司是围绕帮助人们每月多赚 500 或 600 美元的想法而建立的，并且他们故意选择了这个数字。
Because we look at the statistics and the majority of bankruptcies could avoid it if they had $500 more per month.
因为我们看一下统计数据，大多数破产者如果每月多付 500 美元，就可以避免破产。
And so, really, if we can get a ton of people that are earning $500 to $600 a month, then for us, that's our sweet spot.
因此，实际上，如果我们能够吸引大量月薪 500 至 600 美元的人，那么对我们来说，这就是我们的最佳选择。
We're not encouraging people to just walk away from their own personal income.
我们并不鼓励人们放弃自己的个人收入。
We're just trying to be something in the middle that helps it be easier every single month.
我们只是想成为一个中间人，让每个月的事情变得更容易。
Right, but from being at the conference, it just does seem like the messages are not that.
是的，但从参加会议的情况来看，这些信息似乎并非如此。
They're not, we want to help you live a easier life every month with supplemental income and financial management.
他们不是，我们希望通过补充收入和财务管理帮助您每个月过上更轻松的生活。
The message is much more like, your life is unsatisfactory.
传达的信息更像是，你的生活并不令人满意。
You are slave to some job.
你是某些工作的奴隶。
You don't have your own freedom.
你没有自己的自由。
And this is the answer to that.
这就是答案。
The reality of the message I think people are getting is not what you just said.
我认为人们得到的实际信息并不是你刚才所说的那样。
And does that concern you?
这与您有关吗？
Yeah.
是的。
We want to unify the message from corporate.
我们希望统一企业的信息。
Like I said, I think you guys caught us right in the spike of our growth where there were so many people that were involved in WakeUpNow that we didn't necessarily have as good as communication from corporate as we could have.
就像我说的，我认为你们在我们成长的高峰期抓住了我们，当时有很多人参与了 WakeUpNow，因此我们不一定能与企业进行尽可能好的沟通。
But we're a different company than we were eight months ago.
但与八个月前相比，我们已经是一家不同的公司了。
The conference we went to was in April.
我们参加的会议是在四月份。
Jordan says the company had grown 4,000% over the previous year.
乔丹表示，该公司比上一年增长了 4,000%。
And they were scrambling to deal with that expansion.
他们正在忙着应对这种扩张。
WakeUpNow, by the way, was only founded in 2009.
顺便说一句，WakeUpNow 于 2009 年才成立。
Since April, Jordan says they're running a tighter ship.
自四月份以来，乔丹表示他们的管理更加严格。
They recently replaced their CEO.
他们最近更换了首席执行官。
They're rewriting some of their introductory literature, downplaying the recruiting side of things.
他们正在重写一些介绍性文献，淡化招聘方面的内容。
And they've changed what they say at their events.
他们改变了在活动中所说的话。
He says, WakeUpNow has never been intentionally vague.
他说，WakeUpNow 从来没有故意含糊其辞。
But he thinks we were not unique in our confusion.
但他认为我们并不是唯一陷入困惑的人。
And that's one of the things they're trying to fix.
这就是他们正在努力解决的问题之一。
A couple weeks ago, we talked to a guy who studies companies like WakeUpNow, Amway and Herbalife and other network marketing companies.
几周前，我们采访了一位研究 WakeUpNow、安利、康宝莱和其他网络营销公司的人。
And he said, when reporters talk about them, they usually focus on the money people spend on them, but rarely discuss the part he considers more troubling and more destructive-- what it does to members' personal relationships.
他说，当记者谈论它们时，他们通常关注人们花在它们身上的钱，但很少讨论他认为更令人不安和更具破坏性的部分——这对成员的个人关系产生了怎样的影响。
This guy's name is Robert L.
这个人的名字叫罗伯特·L.
Fitzpatrick.
菲茨帕特里克。
And he used a word to describe WakeUpNow that may sound hyperbolic.
他用了一个听起来可能有些夸张的词来形容 WakeUpNow。
The word was "cult," except not a religious cult.
这个词是“邪教”，但不是宗教邪教。
It's an economic cult.
这是一种经济崇拜。
That's the distinction that I think you may be grasping for when you say, what is this thing?
我想，当你说“这是什么东西”时，你可能会抓住这个区别。
Robert Fitzpatrick says it's not an accident that it took us so long to figure out what WakeUpNow is, that the videos all seem so vague and the website was so confusing about pricing and products when we signed up as a member.
罗伯特·菲茨帕特里克 (Robert Fitzpatrick) 表示，我们花了很长时间才弄清楚 WakeUpNow 是什么，当我们注册成为会员时，所有视频看起来都很模糊，网站的定价和产品也非常混乱，这并非偶然。
He says, vagueness is part of a strategy companies use.
他说，模糊性是公司使用的战略的一部分。
Robert became interested in network marketing after he and some friends got caught up years ago in the frenzy of recruiting people into a gifting scheme.
几年前，罗伯特和一些朋友陷入了疯狂招募人员参加礼物计划的过程中，之后他对网络营销产生了兴趣。
And he says the most disturbing thing about it was how it manipulated their thinking, made them suspend critical judgment.
他说，最令人不安的是它如何操纵他们的思维，让他们暂停批判性判断。
So he spent years researching how network marketing companies work.
因此，他花了数年时间研究网络营销公司的运作方式。
A regular business, Robert says, doesn't try to tell people how to treat their friends and family, which we saw at WakeUpNow.
罗伯特说，常规企业不会试图告诉人们如何对待他们的朋友和家人，正如我们在 WakeUpNow 上看到的那样。
The intention to isolate you from other people who are not in the scheme-- you are told to shun doubters, critics, even if they're in your family.
目的是将你与其他不在该计划中的人隔离开来——你被告知要避开怀疑者、批评者，即使他们是你的家人。
And then, when you go around your friends and they get uncomfortable, like, you buggin'!
然后，当你和朋友在一起时，他们会感到不舒服，就像，你该死！
Guess what?
你猜怎么着？
You know who to walk away from.
你知道该远离谁。
[AFFIRMATIONS] You know who to walk away from, because they can't understand your language.
[肯定] 你知道该远离谁，因为他们听不懂你的语言。
They won't be able to understand your language.
他们将无法理解您的语言。
So isolation-- and the other is a certain requirement of blind faith and obedience.
所以孤立——另一个是盲目信仰和服从的某种要求。
You're not supposed to question.
你不应该质疑。
Critical thinking is for losers.
批判性思维是为失败者准备的。
You will see it when you believe it.
当你相信的时候你就会看到它。
This industry-- wrong.
这个行业——错了。
This busi-- no. This profession-- this profession rewards one thing.
这家公司——不。这个职业——这个职业奖励一件事。
It rewards belief.
它奖励信念。
How many of you believe you are Global sitting in that chair right now?
你们中有多少人相信你们现在坐在那把椅子上是全球的？
Global is the highest earning level in the company, the level See More Green is.
Global是公司内最高的盈利水平，See More Green的水平。
That guy literally just dropped the mic, by the way.
顺便说一句，那家伙实际上刚刚放下了麦克风。
We asked WakeUpNow's Chief Marketing Officer Jordan Harris if the company is a cult.
我们询问 WakeUpNow 的首席营销官乔丹·哈里斯（Jordan Harris）该公司是否是邪教。
And no surprise here.
这并不奇怪。
He says that's an unfair characterization.
他说这是一种不公平的描述。
He says, he interprets those moments from the conference differently than Robert Fitzpatrick does.
他说，他对会议中这些时刻的解读与罗伯特·菲茨帕特里克不同。
WakeUpNow is not trying to isolate members from their family, he says.
他说，WakeUpNow 并不是试图将成员与家人隔离。
But if someone's being negative about your work, he thinks it is good advice not to hang around them.
但如果有人对你的工作持消极态度，他认为最好不要和他们混在一起。
And what's wrong with believing in what you do?
相信自己所做的事情有什么错呢？
Look, if you're going to do anything, you better believe that you can do before you start.
听着，如果你要做任何事情，你最好在开始之前相信你能做到。
I think that that is a universal truth.
我认为这是一个普遍的真理。
But to portray it as, the only way to be successful is to believe hard enough-- I would much rather have them preface that with, it is not enough to succeed.
但如果把它描述为，成功的唯一方法就是足够坚定地相信——我宁愿让他们在序言中这样说，这还不足以成功。
You've got to have the hard work.
你必须努力工作。
And you've got to have the talent to be successful.
而且您必须拥有成功的才能。
At the conference, everyone was so amped up.
发布会上，大家都兴奋不已。
It was hard to get a sense of what it was really like to do WakeUpNow day in and day out.
很难体会日复一日地做 WakeUpNow 到底是什么样的感觉。
So we found someone who'd gone all in on WakeUpNow, who'd quit his job to dedicate himself to it, a guy with a wife and three young kids who recently stopped working in the kitchen of a really nice restaurant to do WakeUpNow.
所以我们找到了一个全身心投入 WakeUpNow 的人，他辞去了工作全身心投入其中，他有妻子和三个年幼的孩子，最近不再在一家非常好的餐厅的厨房工作，开始做 WakeUpNow。
His name is Damien Lacks.
他的名字叫达米安·拉克斯。
He's 29 years old.
他今年 29 岁。
We went to visit him at his apartment in Gettysburg, Pennsylvania.
我们去他位于宾夕法尼亚州葛底斯堡的公寓拜访了他。
Damien grew up in a rough part of Baltimore.
达米安在巴尔的摩的一个贫困地区长大。
He was a charismatic kid, a good athlete who did well in school.
他是一个有魅力的孩子，一名优秀的运动员，在学校表现出色。
But he got into drugs, dropped out, did some time in jail.
但他染上了毒瘾，退学了，还进过监狱。
By the time he was 24, he was living in a halfway house in Gettysburg, where he moved to get away from the city, and working at a McDonald's.
24 岁时，他为了远离城市而搬到了葛底斯堡的一所中途宿舍，并在一家麦当劳工作。
I didn't know what I wanted to do with life.
我不知道我这一生想做什么。
At the same time though-- and this might sound strange to some people-- even back then, even since I was 10 years old, I've known that I was supposed to do something great.
但与此同时，这对某些人来说可能听起来很奇怪，即使在那时，即使从我 10 岁起，我就知道我应该做一些伟大的事情。
Now, I ain't saying it to boast.
现在，我这么说并不是为了夸耀。
I just am giving praise to God.
我只是在赞美神。
Because that's who he made me.
因为这就是他创造的我。
I haven't always lived up to it.
我一直没有做到这一点。
I've been terrible at living up to it.
我一直很难做到这一点。
After McDonald's, Damien worked in kitchens at a couple of pubs in town, then landed at a TGI Fridays.
离开麦当劳后，达米恩在镇上几家酒吧的厨房工作，然后在周五的 TGI 工作。
But Damien was bored there.
但达米安在那里感到无聊。
The district manager would walk in.
地区经理会走进来。
He wouldn't speak to the little guys on the line.
他不会和电话里的小家伙说话。
I hated that feeling, feeling like I'm a little guy.
我讨厌那种感觉，感觉自己像个小人物。
And that the big guys, who are already making $100,000 a year, when you come around, you don't even have the decency to say, hey, how are you guys doing in here?
而那些年薪已经达到 10 万美元的大人物，当你过来时，你甚至没有礼貌地说，嘿，你们在这里过得怎么样？
You know, we hot.
你知道，我们很热。
We sweating.
我们满头大汗。
We busting our ass.
我们拼尽全力。
Excuse me.
打扰一下。
You don't really care about nothing but how the restaurant is running and how much money we're making.
你什么都不关心，只关心餐厅的经营情况以及我们赚了多少钱。
You don't care about the people at all.
你根本不关心人民。
It makes you feel low.
它让你感觉情绪低落。
No, I hated that.
不，我讨厌那样。
I hated it.
我讨厌它。
In other words, it was a J-O-B.
换句话说，这是一个 J-O-B。
So he applied to one of the best restaurants in the area, a place called Restaurant Sydney, founded by a chef he admired.
于是，他申请了该地区最好的餐厅之一，一家名为“悉尼餐厅”的餐厅，由他崇拜的一位厨师创办。
Damien was taking online culinary classes.
达米安正在参加在线烹饪课程。
He had dreams of becoming a sous chef, of one day opening his own restaurant.
他梦想成为一名副主厨，有一天开设自己的餐厅。
So when Sidney hired him, he was thrilled.
因此，当西德尼雇用他时，他感到很兴奋。
What were your expectations going in there?
你对那里的期望是什么？
The highest level of chefness-- I don't know a better word.
最高水平的厨师——我不知道更好的词了。
[LAUGH] And it wasn't all the way like that.
[笑]但事实并非如此。
When it came down to it, working in the kitchen at Restaurant Sidney was still just working in a kitchen.
归根结底，在悉尼餐厅的厨房工作仍然只是在厨房工作。
His co-workers grumbled, told offensive jokes to pass the time.
他的同事们会发牢骚，讲一些无礼的笑话来打发时间。
They didn't seem inspired.
他们似乎没有受到启发。
And Damien was only making $10 an hour.
达米安每小时只赚 10 美元。
After babysitters and gas-- Sidney is 25 minutes from his house-- Damien says his pay was basically a wash.
达米安说，除去保姆和煤气费（悉尼距他家 25 分钟路程），他的工资基本上就是洗钱。
He kept asking for a raise, but wasn't getting one.
他一直要求加薪，但没有得到。
And that's when an Instagram friend sent Damien some of the YouTube videos about WakeUpNow.
就在那时，一位 Instagram 朋友向达米安发送了一些有关 WakeUpNow 的 YouTube 视频。
Just like us, he says he'd never seen anything like them before.
就像我们一样，他说他以前从未见过这样的东西。
Unlike us, though, his reaction was--
但与我们不同的是，他的反应是——
The video she sent me was so inspiring.
她发给我的视频非常鼓舞人心。
I went from being the lowest-paid person in my family to, now, the highest residual income-earner in my family.
我从家里收入最低的人变成了现在家里剩余收入最高的人。
We asked Damien what about the video spoke to him.
我们问达米安，这段视频对他有何启发。
And what it came down to was the positivity.
归根结底就是积极性。
It was a bunch of young people and, in particular, young black people succeeding as entrepreneurs.
这是一群年轻人，特别是年轻的黑人作为企业家取得了成功。
They were working for themselves, in total control of their own destiny.
他们为自己工作，完全掌握自己的命运。
[LAUGHTER] Damien Lacks To me, it was nostalgic.
[笑声] Damien Lacks 对我来说，这是怀旧的。
It took me back to that place, when I was a kid.
它带我回到了那个地方，当我还是个孩子的时候。
You dream about where you want to be in your life.
您梦想着自己想要生活的地方。
And it was like, that's right.
就好像，没错。
That's right.
这是正确的。
That's what I wanted my life to be.
这就是我想要的生活。
That's right.
这是正确的。
I'm going after it.
我要去追它。
Thank you for reminding me.
谢谢你提醒我。
This is my calling right here.
这就是我在这里的召唤。
Damien began reading WakeUpNow's literature obsessively.
达米安开始着迷地阅读 WakeUpNow 的文学作品。
He went on a vacation with his family.
他和家人一起去度假。
And he says, the whole time, he couldn't tear himself away.
他说，自始至终，他都无法摆脱自己。
He compares it to reading scripture.
他将其比作阅读经文。
The company's Quick Start Guide includes a whole section called "Your Thoughts can Change the Future." Damien loved that.
该公司的快速入门指南包括一个名为“您的想法可以改变未来”的完整部分。达米安喜欢这个。
It talks about feeding yourself positive ideas and filtering out the negative, not hanging around negative people.
它谈论的是给自己喂积极的想法并过滤掉消极的想法，而不是和消极的人在一起。
After that, every dirty joke his co-workers made felt like it was poisoning his mind.
从那以后，他的同事们开的每一个下流笑话都让他觉得自己的思想受到了毒害。
Then, after weeks of asking for a raise, his boss told him he wouldn't be getting one.
然后，在要求加薪几周后，他的老板告诉他不会得到加薪。
Not long after, Damien quit Restaurant Sidney and devoted himself to WakeUpNow.
不久之后，达米恩 (Damien) 退出了 Restaurant Sidney，全身心投入到 WakeUpNow 工作中。
When we visited Damien, he'd been doing WakeUpNow for four months.
当我们拜访达米安时，他已经做 WakeUpNow 四个月了。
Here's what a typical work day looks like for him.
这是他典型的工作日的样子。
He wakes up and helps get his two boys off to school.
他醒来并帮助他的两个儿子去上学。
And once they're off, he usually dials into a 10:00 AM motivational group call.
一旦他们下班，他通常会拨打上午 10:00 的励志小组电话。
But most of the day, he watches his baby daughter.
但一天的大部分时间，他都在看着他的小女儿。
While she's napping, he spends a few hours poking around on the computer, watching YouTube videos about how to present WakeUpNow to people and, then, just kind of being on Facebook.
当她小睡的时候，他会花几个小时在电脑上闲逛，观看 YouTube 视频，了解如何向人们展示 WakeUpNow，然后就上 Facebook。
If he starts to feel down, he'll watch an uplifting video.
如果他开始感到沮丧，他会观看一段令人振奋的视频。
Early on, he tried calling every contact in his phone to tell them about WakeUpNow.
早些时候，他尝试给手机上的每个联系人打电话，告诉他们有关 WakeUpNow 的信息。
That yielded exactly one WakeUpNow recruit.
这恰好产生了一名 WakeUpNow 新成员。
My mom.
我的妈妈。
Bianca Giaever His mom.
比安卡·贾埃弗 他的妈妈。
After four months, she's still the only recruit he has, which means he's not making any income.
四个月后，她仍然是他唯一的新员工，这意味着他没有任何收入。
And in fact, he's paying $100 a month to be part of WakeUpNow.
事实上，他每月支付 100 美元才能成为 WakeUpNow 的一员。
What are you going to do if another four months go by and you still haven't gotten anyone and aren't making any money?
如果又四个月过去了，你仍然没有找到任何人，也没有赚到钱，你会怎么办？
And you're spending money to be in it?
而且你还花钱来参与其中？
Um-- that's a hard question.
嗯——这是一个很难回答的问题。
Because I honestly know that it's going to work.
因为我真的知道它会起作用。
We spent a lot of time debating with Damien about this.
我们花了很多时间与达米安讨论这个问题。
It was nearly impossible to get him to even entertain the hypothetical of WakeUpNow not working.
让他接受 WakeUpNow 不起作用的假设几乎是不可能的。
If the year goes by and you haven't made any money with WakeUpNow or network marketing, would you be disappointed?
如果这一年过去了，您还没有通过 WakeUpNow 或网络营销赚到任何钱，您会感到失望吗？
No, I would just keep going.
不，我会继续前进。
Brian Reed Think about that.
布莱恩·里德想一想。
A year has gone by with no success.
一年过去了，毫无成果。
You wouldn't feel any kind of way about that?
你对此没有任何感觉吗？
A year gone by-- and network marketing is successful.
一年过去了——网络营销取得了成功。
Think about doctors and lawyers.
想想医生和律师。
They go to school for four years, eight years, before they actually reach the time when they can get paid for what they've been training for.
他们上学四年、八年，然后才真正达到他们接受培训的报酬的程度。
Damien knows the stats, that just 1% of WakeUpNow members make a living.
Damien 知道统计数据，只有 1% 的 WakeUpNow 会员能够谋生。
He actually pointed the numbers out to us on his own.
他实际上亲自向我们指出了这些数字。
But it's almost as if those dismal statistics made Damien even more optimistic about his prospects.
但这些惨淡的统计数据似乎让达米安对自己的前景更加乐观。
I have the persistence to become in the 1%, in the less than 1%.
我有毅力成为那1%，成为那1%以下的人。
Because it says, the results are not typical.
因为它说，结果并不典型。
Well, I say, I'm not typical.
好吧，我说，我不典型。
And the thing about it is, more people could be successful.
问题是，更多的人可以成功。
But more people don't have desire.
但更多的人没有欲望。
They're not going to put in the work.
他们不会投入工作。
And if you tell yourself it's too hard, it's going to be too hard.
如果你告诉自己这太难了，那就太难了。
But what if it's not the fact that you're telling yourself that something is really hard, but that it just is really hard?
但如果你并不是在告诉自己某件事真的很难，而是只是真的很难呢？
Like, that is the reality, the chances of making money are low.
这就是现实，赚钱的机会很低。
And so, when someone's telling themself that it's hard, they're right.
因此，当有人告诉自己这很难时，他们是对的。
It's only hard if you believe it's hard.
只有当你相信它很难时，它才很难。
We thought that one person who might be silently freaking out about this was Damien's wife, Candice.
我们认为达米安的妻子坎迪斯可能会默默地对此感到恐惧。
Candace has a full-time job managing a store at the nearby outlet mall and is now the sole breadwinner in their family of five.
坎迪斯有一份全职工作，负责管理附近奥特莱斯购物中心的一家商店，现在是他们五口之家唯一的养家糊口的人。
They have two kids, a baby and an eight-year-old, and just became the legal guardians of a third child, a 12-year-old who neither is related to, the son of one of Damien's ex-girlfriends.
他们有两个孩子，一个婴儿和一个 8 岁的孩子，并且刚刚成为第三个孩子的法定监护人，第三个孩子是 12 岁的孩子，与达米安的一位前女友的儿子没有任何关系。
So we took Candice aside, out of Damian's earshot, to ask how she was dealing with the pressure of providing for three kids while Damien didn't have a job and wasn't bringing in any money with WakeUpNow.
因此，我们把坎迪斯拉到一边，在达米安听不到的地方，询问她如何应对养活三个孩子的压力，而达米安没有工作，也没有通过 WakeUpNow 赚到任何钱。
I'm not as stressed out.
我没有那么紧张。
I have a lot more help around the house.
我在家里还有很多帮助。
So my days off, I actually can enjoy instead of having mounds of laundry to do.
所以我的休息日实际上可以享受而不是有大量的衣服要洗。
[LAUGHS] So like, it's really helped us as a family unit.
[笑]所以，这对我们作为一个家庭单位确实有帮助。
This is not the answer we were expecting.
这不是我们期待的答案。
But Candice likes her job.
但坎迪斯喜欢她的工作。
And she says that her income is enough to support the family without Damien earning money.
她说，即使达米安不挣钱，她的收入也足以养家糊口。
She says they're not in financial trouble at all.
她说他们根本没有陷入财务困境。
When Damien had restaurant gigs where he worked long erratic hours, she and the kids would sometimes go days without seeing him.
当达米恩在餐馆工作时，他的工作时间很不稳定，她和孩子们有时会几天都见不到他。
Now that Damien has left the restaurant industry for WakeUpNow, Candice says her kids get to be raised by their father.
现在，达米安 (Damien) 已经离开餐饮业，加入 WakeUpNow，坎迪斯 (Candice) 说她的孩子们将由父亲抚养。
And it's great.
这很棒。
Because, with us adding on another child, getting that child in a routine and working on his homework-- because he is behind, so he needs a lot more help and attention with schoolwork and stuff.
因为，随着我们增加另一个孩子，让那个孩子养成习惯并做作业——因为他落后了，所以他在功课和其他事情上需要更多的帮助和关注。
It's beneficial right now with the dynamics of our family.
现在对我们家庭的活力来说是有益的。
And Damien's been able to do that with him?
达米安能和他一起做到这一点吗？
Absolutely.
绝对地。
He cooks.
他做饭。
He does homework.
他做作业。
He cleans.
他打扫卫生。
So I'm very thankful for that.
所以我对此非常感谢。
It's 3:30 in the afternoon on a Thursday.
现在是星期四下午 3:30。
And Damien's greeting his boys, Damian Jr. and Leonte, as they get off the school bus.
当他的孩子们小达米安和莱昂特下了校车时，达米安正在向他们打招呼。
He asked them about their day, explains who these weird radio reporters are in their apartment.
他询问他们今天过得怎么样，并解释了他们公寓里这些奇怪的电台记者是谁。
And then, they get to homework.
然后，他们开始做作业。
And I got to read.
我必须读书。
Leonte By the way, it's due tomorrow.
Leonte 顺便说一下，明天就到期了。
Leonte has to present a biography of Bruce Lee.
莱昂特必须介绍李小龙的传记。
I thought he was Chinese.
我以为他是中国人。
Damien Lacks I thought so too, Pooch.
达米安·拉克斯 我也这么认为，普奇。
Maybe I don't know what's going on.
也许我不知道发生了什么事。
Let's find out.
让我们来看看吧。
He's Chinese and half-German.
他是中国人，有一半德国血统。
Damien Lacks Oh, Chinese and half-German.
达米安缺少哦，中国血统和一半德国血统。
Oh, now, you said American and German first.
哦，现在，你先说美国和德国。
Oh.
哦。
Damien Lacks Yeah, that's a big difference.
达米安缺乏 是的，这是一个很大的区别。
OK, so just remember that tomorrow.
好吧，明天记住这一点。
Both Damien and Candice say without hesitation that if Damien never makes a dime from WakeUpNow, it still will have been the best move he could have made for their family.
达米安和坎迪斯都毫不犹豫地表示，即使达米安从未从 WakeUpNow 赚到一分钱，这仍然是他能为他们的家庭做出的最好的举动。
Bianca Giaever and Brian Reed.
比安卡·贾埃弗和布莱恩·里德。
A few weeks after the visit, Damien-- he decided to put WakeUpNow on pause.
访问几周后，达米安决定暂停 WakeUpNow。
He is no longer a member.
他不再是会员了。
He says he's not paying money every month.
他说他不是每个月都付钱的。
He wanted to make some money for the holidays, went back to work at TGI Fridays where he's now a waiter, which says he likes a lot more than working in the kitchen.
他想在假期赚点钱，于是回到 TGI Fridays 工作，现在是一名服务员，这表明他比在厨房工作更喜欢。
Coming up, a rich guy tries to wake up other rich guys about the issue of how rich certain rich guys are getting.
接下来，一个富人试图唤醒其他富人关于某些富人变得多么富有的问题。
That's in a minute from Chicago Public Radio when our program continues.
芝加哥公共广播电台一分钟后我们的节目仍在继续。
It's This American Life .
这就是美国生活。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Each week on our program, of course, we choose a theme.
当然，每周我们的节目都会选择一个主题。
Today, with people making resolutions for how this new year will be different from the previous one, our show is "Wake Up Now." I hope you notice how classy we're keeping it here on the show by not inserting alarm clock sounds every time I say those words.
今天，当人们决定新的一年将如何与往年不同时，我们的节目是“现在醒来”。我希望你注意到我们在节目中保持它的优雅，每次我说这些话时都不会插入闹钟声音。
Wake Up Now-- stories of people trying to wake themselves up or wake up others.
立即醒来——人们试图唤醒自己或唤醒他人的故事。
We've arrived at Act 2 of our program, Act 2, Board Games.
我们已经到了计划的第二幕，第二幕，棋盘游戏。
So there's this thing that comes up in the news pretty regularly, CEO pay.
所以新闻里经常出现这样的事情：CEO 付钱。
When it comes up, rarely is it good for the CEOs.
当这个问题出现时，对首席执行官来说很少有好处。
Usually, the point is that CEOs are overpaid, something needs to be done.
通常，关键是首席执行官的薪酬过高，需要采取一些措施。
If you figure that most people work 40 or 50 years in their work lives, it would take a typical worker four or five lifetimes to earn what the CEOs of large companies earn in a single year.
如果你计算出大多数人的工作寿命为 40 或 50 年，那么一个典型的工人需要四到五辈子才能挣到大公司首席执行官一年的收入。
So you hear statistics like that in these stories.
所以你会在这些故事中听到类似的统计数据。
But what you almost never hear is anybody actually trying to cut the pay of a CEO.
但你几乎从未听说过有人真的试图削减首席执行官的薪酬。
Well, David Kestenbaum and Jacob Goldstein of NPR'S "Planet Money" found a guy who tried to wake people up to the fact of the CEO of one small company seemed to be making way too much money.
嗯，美国国家公共广播电台“金钱星球”的大卫·凯斯滕鲍姆和雅各布·戈尔茨坦发现，有一个人试图让人们认识到一家小公司的首席执行官似乎赚了太多钱。
It takes an unusual person to wage a war against a CEO and his pay.
一个不寻常的人才会对首席执行官及其薪酬发动战争。
The odds of success are just so low.
成功的几率是如此之低。
And Tim Stabosz was definitely an outsider.
蒂姆·斯塔博斯（Tim Stabosz）绝对是个局外人。
He lived in a small town, Laporte, Indiana, in a small house.
他住在印第安纳州拉波特小镇的一栋小房子里。
We went to visit.
我们去参观了。
In the dining room, there's a broken Dungeons and Dragons pinball machine.
餐厅里有一台坏掉的龙与地下城弹球机。
Tim tried to fix it.
蒂姆试图修复它。
Here it is.
这里是。
Yeah, it's sad.
是的，很伤心。
I made a boo-boo when I fried out the display.
当我把显示器烧坏时，我发出了一声嘘声。
It was just a disaster.
这简直就是一场灾难。
When Tim got out of college, he got a government job and tried his hand at the stock market on the side.
蒂姆大学毕业后，找到了一份政府工作，同时也尝试涉足股市。
He used a computer to pick out stocks he thought were undervalued.
他用电脑挑选出他认为被低估的股票。
He still has that computer.
那台电脑他还留着。
And just so you have the right image in your head, this is the kind of computer you'd find sitting out on the sidewalk.
为了让您的头脑中有正确的图像，您可以在人行道上找到这种计算机。
It's got a floppy disk drive.
它有一个软盘驱动器。
And when you turn it on, it just goes beep.
当你打开它时，它只会发出蜂鸣声。
Over the years, Tim did well in the stock market, really well, well enough that he was never going to have to work a regular job again.
这些年来，蒂姆在股市上表现得很好，非常好，足够好，以至于他再也不用做一份固定的工作了。
Sometime in the mid '90s, Tim came across this one company.
90 年代中期的某个时候，蒂姆偶然发现了这家公司。
He'd end up investing hundreds of thousands of dollars in its stock.
他最终投资了数十万美元购买该公司的股票。
It was a small company based on Long Island called P&F Industries.
这是一家位于长岛的小公司，名为 P&F Industries。
It made pneumatic tools.
它制造气动工具。
You can actually buy them at Home Depot.
您实际上可以在家得宝购买它们。
I don't believe so, no. Jacob Goldstein Tim just like the company's numbers.
我不相信，不。雅各布·戈德斯坦·蒂姆 (Jacob Goldstein Tim) 非常喜欢该公司的数字。
It was a small company where you could understand everything about it.
那是一家小公司，你可以了解它的一切。
P&F seemed like a good deal.
P&F 似乎是一笔不错的交易。
But over the years, something began to gnaw at him, the salary of the CEO, Richard Horowitz.
但这些年来，有件事开始困扰着他，那就是首席执行官理查德·霍洛维茨(Richard Horowitz)的薪水。
Roughly $1 and 1/2 million a year, total compensation.
每年的总薪酬大约为 1 又 0.5 百万美元。
Is that a lot?
这么多吗？
Tim Stabosz $1 and 1/2 million is outrageous and outlandish.
蒂姆·斯塔博斯 (Tim Stabosz) 的 1 又 1/2 百万美元是令人震惊和古怪的。
Tim looked around at similar companies, some in the same industry, some in the same geographic area.
蒂姆环顾了类似的公司，有些在同一行业，有些在同一地理区域。
And he couldn't find any where the CEO was paid even half of what Horowitz made.
他找不到任何地方首席执行官的薪酬甚至只有霍洛维茨的一半。
Now, if you just own a few shares of a company's stock and you think the CEO is overpaid, there isn't much you can do.
现在，如果您只拥有一家公司的几股股票，并且您认为首席执行官的薪酬过高，那么您无能为力。
But if you own more, well, that's different.
但如果你拥有更多，那就不同了。
And by the fall of 2009, Tim owned 180,000 shares.
到 2009 年秋天，蒂姆拥有 180,000 股股票。
I came to own 5%.
我开始拥有5%的股份。
Jacob Goldstein 5% of the whole company?
雅各布·戈德斯坦占整个公司 5% 的股份？
5% of the entire company.
占整个公司的5%。
Jacob Goldstein His stake was worth more than half a million dollars.
雅各布·戈德斯坦 (Jacob Goldstein) 他的股份价值超过 50 万美元。
And it turned out, Tim had an ally in this fight, a guy with a little more experience, a guy who ran a hedge fund.
事实证明，蒂姆在这场斗争中有一个盟友，一个更有经验的人，一个经营对冲基金的人。
I'm Andrew Shapiro.
我是安德鲁·夏皮罗。
I'm president and portfolio manager of Lawndale Capital Management.
我是劳恩代尔资本管理公司的总裁兼投资组合经理。
Andrew also owned a big chunk of the company, about 8%.
安德鲁还拥有该公司的很大一部分股份，约 8%。
He and Tim didn't work together directly.
他和蒂姆没有直接合作。
They had very different styles.
他们有非常不同的风格。
Andrew was a by-the-book investor, fond of semi-obscure military allusions.
安德鲁是一位循规蹈矩的投资者，喜欢半隐晦的军事暗示。
With what we do, we deploy what I call the Powell Doctrine of investments.
通过我们的工作，我们部署了我所说的鲍威尔投资主义。
And I try to take on targets where I can mount overwhelming force.
我尝试去攻击那些我可以发挥压倒性力量的目标。
For years, Andrew had been arguing that the CEO was grossly overpaid.
多年来，安德鲁一直认为首席执行官的薪酬严重过高。
Over one 10-year period, he says, Richard Horowitz took home $13.5 million dollars.
他说，在 10 年间，理查德·霍洛维茨 (Richard Horowitz) 赚了 1,350 万美元。
That's more than twice what the entire company made in profits over that time.
这是整个公司同期利润的两倍多。
Sometimes, when people complain about CEO pay, they talk about it as if the money's coming out of the pockets of ordinary workers.
有时，当人们抱怨首席执行官的薪酬时，他们谈论起来就好像这些钱是从普通工人的口袋里掏出来的一样。
That is not how Tim and Andrew see it.
蒂姆和安德鲁可不这么看。
Every dollar the CEO gets is $1 less profit, $1 less for Tim and Andrew and all the other stockholders.
首席执行官每获得 1 美元，利润就会减少 1 美元，蒂姆和安德鲁以及所有其他股东的利润也会减少 1 美元。
The overpaid CEO's taking money out of the shareowner's pocket.
薪酬过高的首席执行官从股东的口袋里掏钱。
You're not in it because, hey, wouldn't it feel great if CEOs weren't paid so much more than everyone else?
你之所以不参与其中，是因为，嘿，如果首席执行官的薪酬不比其他人高那么多，那不是感觉很棒吗？
I am doing this to make a return on our capital.
我这样做是为了获得我们的资本回报。
This is why, if you think CEOs are overpaid rich guys, your best hope for changing things may be other rich guys, rich guys with enough money to buy up a bunch of stock and take on the company to try and cut the CEO's pay, in hopes of becoming even richer themselves.
这就是为什么，如果你认为首席执行官是薪酬过高的富人，那么你改变现状的最大希望可能是其他富人，这些富人有足够的钱购买大量股票，并与公司竞争，试图削减首席执行官的薪酬，希望自己变得更加富有。
We, of course, wanted to know what the CEO Richard Horowitz had to say about this.
当然，我们想知道首席执行官理查德·霍洛维茨对此有何评论。
We tried to get him.
我们试图抓住他。
We had a bunch of talks with the company's lawyer.
我们与该公司的律师进行了多次会谈。
In the end, Horowitz declined to be interviewed.
最终，霍洛维茨拒绝接受采访。
But because this is a public company, there are plenty of recordings of him.
但因为这是一家上市公司，所以有很多他的录音。
Public companies have what are called "quarterly earnings calls" for investors, really anyone who wants to listen.
上市公司为投资者（实际上是任何想听的人）举办所谓的“季度收益电话会议”。
Good day, everyone.
大家好。
Thank you for holding.
谢谢你的坚持。
Today's conference will begin with a presentation and, then, a question and--
今天的会议将以演讲开始，然后是一个问题——
The operator starts the call.
接线员开始通话。
And then, here is the man himself, Richard Horowitz.
然后，这就是这个人本人，理查德·霍洛维茨。
Firstly, I'm pleased to report that the company's revenue from continuing operations was $14,164,000.
首先，我很高兴地报告，公司持续经营收入为 14,164,000 美元。
I've listened to a lot of earnings calls like this over the years.
这些年来我听过很多这样的财报电话会议。
Usually, they are incredibly dull.
通常，他们非常沉闷。
Analysts from big banks asking super specific things about the company's balance sheet.
来自大银行的分析师询问有关公司资产负债表的非常具体的问题。
But remember, P&F is a small company.
但请记住，P&F 是一家小公司。
And on some of these calls, there are only two people phoning in with questions, two people who feel the CEO is grossly overpaid, Andrew and Tim.
在其中一些电话中，只有两个人打电话来提出问题，两个人认为首席执行官的薪酬严重过高，安德鲁和蒂姆。
They get to ask the CEO whatever they want.
他们可以向首席执行官提出任何他们想要的问题。
Here's one exchange.
这里有一个交流。
Thank you.
谢谢。
Our next question is from Timothy Stabosz.
我们的下一个问题来自蒂莫西·斯塔博斯。
Your line is--
你的线路是——
Tim is asking about this key thing that's used to determine a CEO's salary.
蒂姆问的是这个用于确定首席执行官薪资的关键因素。
It's called a compensation study.
这称为补偿研究。
It looks at what CEOs at comparable companies are earning.
它着眼于可比公司的首席执行官的收入。
P&F Industries had hired an external firm to do one of these reports.
P&F Industries 聘请了一家外部公司来制作其中一份报告。
And Tim wanted details.
蒂姆想要细节。
--a little shocked.
——有点震惊。
That's the best I can tell you.
这是我能告诉你的最好的了。
So we're still waiting on a report from that outside firm, right?
所以我们仍在等待该外部公司的报告，对吧？
I can't tell you.
我不能告诉你。
I don't know what the comp committee-- I mean, I don't-- I can't answer that question.
我不知道薪酬委员会是什么——我的意思是，我不知道——我无法回答这个问题。
I don't have the knowledge to answer that question.
我没有知识来回答这个问题。
OK, um-- Richard Horowitz I'm not being evasive.
好吧，嗯——理查德·霍洛维茨（Richard Horowitz），我没有回避。
I just don't know the answer, Tim.
我只是不知道答案，蒂姆。
I'm sorry.
对不起。
OK.
好的。
Well, you know that there's a firm that's-- we've certainly announced that there's a firm that's doing an analysis, right?
嗯，你知道有一家公司——我们当然已经宣布有一家公司正在做分析，对吧？
I can't-- I don't know.
我不能——我不知道。
Tim Stabosz Does anyone in that room know?
Tim Stabosz 房间里有人知道吗？
It's not the purview of-- Tim Stabosz Does the attorney for the company know?
这不是 Tim Stabosz 的职权范围 该公司的律师知道吗？
Tim, I can't comment any further.
蒂姆，我无法进一步发表评论。
And this is a Q2 conference call.
这是第二季度的电话会议。
Q2 means second quarter.
Q2是指第二季度。
Richard Horowitz We're talking about the results of Q2.
理查德·霍洛维茨（Richard Horowitz）我们正在谈论第二季度的结果。
Well-- Richard Horowitz So please, please, please, Tim, and Andrew and anybody else, please, let's keep the comments to the Q2 numbers.
好吧——理查德·霍洛维茨（Richard Horowitz） 所以请蒂姆、安德鲁和其他人请让我们将评论保留在第二季度的数字上。
Thank you.
谢谢。
Well, that's fine.
嗯，没关系。
But executive salaries are relevant to the future profitability and whatnot.
但高管薪酬与未来盈利能力等相关。
I can't comment any further, Tim.
我无法进一步发表评论，蒂姆。
Any other questions about the Q2?
关于 Q2 还有其他问题吗？
Well, it would have been helpful if you would have simply said, we're not going to talk about executive compensation, period.
好吧，如果你简单地说，我们不会谈论高管薪酬，就这样，那就会有帮助了。
Because that's what you're essentially saying, right?
因为这就是你本质上说的，对吧？
I'll get back in queue.
我会回到队列中。
I'm frustrated right now, Richard.
我现在很沮丧，理查德。
OK, you'll handle it.
好的，你会处理好的。
Operator Thank you.
接线员谢谢。
Our next question is from Andrew Shapiro.
我们的下一个问题来自安德鲁·夏皮罗。
Your line is open.
您的线路已开通。
A CEO's salary is set by a company's board of directors.
首席执行官的薪水由公司董事会确定。
And Shapiro suspected Richard Horowitz had packed the board with his cronies, people who paid him more than he deserved.
夏皮罗怀疑理查德·霍洛维茨在董事会中塞满了他的亲信，这些人给他的报酬超出了他应得的水平。
So Andrew hired a private detective and did some digging himself.
因此安德鲁聘请了一名私家侦探并亲自进行了一些挖掘。
He discovered that, in fact, several board members played golf at the same country club as the CEO.
他发现，事实上，几位董事会成员与首席执行官在同一个乡村俱乐部打高尔夫球。
The Glen Oaks Country Club of Westbury, New York.
纽约州韦斯特伯里的格伦奥克斯乡村俱乐部。
Glen Oaks Country Club of Old Westbury, New York.
纽约老韦斯特伯里的格伦奥克斯乡村俱乐部。
Nothing illegal or maybe even surprising about these guys blowing into the same country club.
这些家伙闯入同一个乡村俱乐部并不违法，甚至可能令人惊讶。
But still, what would General Colin Powell do?
但是，科林·鲍威尔将军会怎么做呢？
He'd get them off the board.
他会把他们从董事会上除掉。
Andrew suggested several potential new board members.
安德鲁推荐了几位潜在的新董事会成员。
And Tim, Tim nominated himself.
蒂姆，蒂姆提名了自己。
Getting new people on a board is tough.
让新人加入董事会很困难。
There is a vote.
有一个投票。
But in most cases, the existing board members get to decide who's on the ballot.
但在大多数情况下，现有的董事会成员可以决定谁参与投票。
It's as if members of Congress were the ones who decided who got to run for Congress.
就好像国会议员是决定谁竞选国会议员的人。
So Tim and Andrew went to the company's annual meeting to try to convince the board to put their candidates on the ballot.
因此，蒂姆和安德鲁参加了公司的年会，试图说服董事会将他们的候选人列入投票名单。
It was the first time Andrew Shapiro and Richard Horowitz, the CEO, had met in person.
这是安德鲁·夏皮罗 (Andrew Shapiro) 和首席执行官理查德·霍洛维茨 (Richard Horowitz) 第一次面对面会面。
It actually was quite crowded.
实际上非常拥挤。
Every seat at the table was full.
餐桌上的每个座位都坐满了。
And there was the paid-for advisers standing around the periphery of the table, in the room, but along the wall.
付费顾问站在桌子的周围，在房间里，但沿着墙。
Where was the CEO?
首席执行官在哪里？
Andrew Shapiro Oh, he's sitting directly across the table from me.
安德鲁·夏皮罗（Andrew Shapiro）哦，他就坐在我的桌子对面。
Oh, it's not awkward or not.
哦，这不尴尬不尴尬。
I go into these rooms with the distinct view that I am an owner of this business and you members of the board of directors are my agents.
当我走进这些房间时，我清楚地意识到我是这家企业的所有者，而你们董事会成员是我的代理人。
And you work for me.
而你为我工作。
You don't work for Mr. Horowitz.
你不为霍洛维茨先生工作。
You don't work for management.
你不是为管理工作。
Management works for you, the board.
管理层是为董事会而工作的。
And the board, you work for me and all of the other shareholders.
董事会，你们为我和所有其他股东工作。
The board did not seem immediately swayed by this argument.
董事会似乎并没有立即受到这一论点的影响。
And it's easy to imagine how this whole thing might feel on the other side if you're, say, Richard Horowitz, the CEO; if you've got two guys who have never even worked in the tool business telling you how they think the business that your father built up should be run and how much you should be paid and who should be on your board.
很容易想象，如果你是 CEO 理查德·霍洛维茨 (Richard Horowitz)，那么另一方会有何感受？如果你有两个从未在工具行业工作过的人告诉你他们认为你父亲建立的企业应该如何经营，你应该得到多少报酬以及谁应该成为你的董事会成员。
For Tim Stabosz, what had started out as a rational investment, something just based on numbers, had become emotional, had become something hard to let go of.
对于蒂姆·斯塔博斯（Tim Stabosz）来说，最初是理性投资、仅基于数字的投资，已经变得情绪化，变成了难以放弃的东西。
At some point in this whole fight, Tim's letters to the company took on a different tone.
在整个斗争的某个时刻，蒂姆给公司的信呈现出不同的语气。
He got rid of the lawyer who'd been vetting them.
他解雇了负责审查他们的律师。
Some of the letters start to have words in all caps.
有些字母开始全部大写。
Some start to feel weirdly intimate.
有些人开始感到奇怪的亲密。
One is addressed just to Richard and uses phrases like, "I was at the end of my rope," and, "goodness knows, I tried a different course."
其中一封是专门写给理查德的，并使用了诸如“我已经束手无策”和“天知道，我尝试了不同的做法”之类的短语。
And then, in the summer of 2010, more than a decade after Tim first bought stock in P&F Industries, something finally went his way.
然后，在 2010 年夏天，也就是蒂姆首次购买 P&F Industries 股票十多年后，事情终于如他所愿。
There was a change on the board.
董事会发生了变化。
The two guys who played golf at the same country club as the CEO stepped down from the committee that set the CEO's pay.
与首席执行官在同一个乡村俱乐部打高尔夫球的两个人从制定首席执行官薪酬的委员会辞职。
Also, one of the people Andrew had recommended for the board got put on the ballot and elected.
此外，安德鲁推荐的董事会成员之一也参加了投票并当选。
And a year and a half later-- if you haven't noticed, this is an incredibly long process-- it finally happened, the thing that almost never happens.
一年半之后——如果你没有注意到，这是一个令人难以置信的漫长过程——它终于发生了，一件几乎从未发生过的事情。
The board of P&F did what Andrew and Tim wanted.
P&F 董事会按照安德鲁和蒂姆的意愿行事。
They cut Richard Horowitz's base salary by a lot, from $975,000 to $650,000, a cut of over $300,000.
他们将理查德·霍洛维茨的基本工资大幅削减，从 975,000 美元降至 650,000 美元，削减幅度超过 300,000 美元。
It actually made the news, at least a little corner of the news, an article in a publication called "Institutional Investor." An expert in that article said it was the first time he'd ever seen shareholders get a board to cut the pay of a sitting CEO.
它实际上成为了新闻，至少是新闻的一个小角落，一篇名为“机构投资者”的出版物上的文章。该文章中的一位专家表示，这是他第一次看到股东让董事会削减现任首席执行官的薪酬。
Tim Stabosz, of course, was elated about the pay cut.
当然，蒂姆·斯塔博斯对减薪感到高兴。
Well, it felt fantastic.
嗯，感觉棒极了。
It felt great.
感觉棒极了。
It felt like I had served to effect this change, that I was an agent of change.
感觉就像我为实现这一变化做出了贡献，我是变革的推动者。
That feeling did not last.
这种感觉并没有持续多久。
It turns out, that new contract also made it easier for Richard Horowitz to get a bigger bonus.
事实证明，这份新合同也让理查德·霍洛维茨更容易获得更大的奖金。
And in 2012, even though Horowitz's base pay had been cut, he actually ended up making more money than he had the previous year.
2012年，尽管霍洛维茨的基本工资被削减，但他实际上最终赚到的钱比前一年更多。
And then, earlier this year, Richard Horowitz got a raise.
然后，今年早些时候，理查德·霍洛维茨获得了加薪。
The board boosted his base pay by $50,000.
董事会将他的基本工资提高了 50,000 美元。
And they also raised the bonus percentages, so he would be able to earn even more on the bonus.
而且他们还提高了奖金比例，这样他就能通过奖金赚更多的钱。
The company only let us talk to one person on its side of things.
该公司只让我们与该公司的一个人交谈。
But it was someone we definitely wanted to hear from, the board member that Andrew Shapiro had recommended.
但这是我们绝对想听到的人，安德鲁·夏皮罗推荐的董事会成员。
We met him one afternoon at a business club at the top of a tall building in Philadelphia.
一天下午，我们在费城一栋高楼顶层的一家商业俱乐部见到了他。
His name is Howard Brownstein.
他的名字叫霍华德·布朗斯坦。
And he told us he thinks Richard Horowitz's pay is reasonable.
他告诉我们，他认为理查德·霍洛维茨的薪酬是合理的。
Yeah, I would say to you that, based on the work that the comp committee did, as they reported it to us and as we listened to it, that the compensation is within the realm of reasonableness for our company and how it's doing and the money we make for the shareholders.
是的，我要告诉你的是，根据薪酬委员会所做的工作，他们向我们报告并听取了我们的意见，薪酬对于我们公司、我们的经营状况以及我们为股东赚到的钱来说是在合理范围内的。
We asked Brownstein about that compensation study that Tim asked about on the conference call, the study that compares Richard Horowitz's pay to the CEOs of other companies.
我们向布朗斯坦询问了蒂姆在电话会议上询问的薪酬研究，该研究将理查德·霍洛维茨的薪酬与其他公司首席执行官的薪酬进行了比较。
And we read Brownstein this letter Tim wrote, asking the board to release details from the report.
我们读了布朗斯坦蒂姆写的这封信，要求董事会公布报告的细节。
"Asked" is probably the wrong word.
“问”这个词可能用错了。
Tim writes, I demand, in all caps.
我要求蒂姆用全部大写字母书写。
And then, at the end, also in caps, I have waited long enough.
然后，最后，同样是大写，我已经等得够久了。
I am done waiting.
我已经等完了。
Well, Mr. Stabosz obviously hasn't been able to find the Caps Lock key on his typewriter.
嗯，斯塔博斯先生显然无法在他的打字机上找到 Caps Lock 键。
Look, generally in my world, when somebody demands something, it's because they have a legal right to it.
听着，一般来说，在我的世界里，当有人要求某样东西时，那是因为他们拥有合法的权利。
He may say he demands it, but the fact is, he doesn't have a right to it.
他可能会说他要求这样做，但事实是，他没有权利这样做。
So what he really meant when he said, I demand it, is I really, really want it.
所以当他说“我要求它”时，他真正的意思是我真的非常想要它。
I get it.
我得到它。
It's OK.
没关系。
You can't have it.
你不能拥有它。
Next.
下一个。
He's one of the owners of the company, right?
他是公司的所有者之一，对吗？
Sure he is.
当然是。
But the owners of the company only have the rights that they have, the rights the law gives them.
但公司所有者只拥有他们拥有的权利，法律赋予他们的权利。
It doesn't give them more than that.
它并没有给他们更多。
Since P&F wouldn't release that study, we asked a company that analyzes CEO compensation to take a look.
由于 P&F 不会发布该研究，我们请一家分析首席执行官薪酬的公司进行查看。
The company is called Equilar.
该公司名为 Equilar。
They do a lot of work for companies who are trying to figure out how much to pay their CEOs.
他们为那些试图计算出向首席执行官支付多少钱的公司做了很多工作。
Here is what Equilar found.
这是 Equilar 的发现。
Among roughly 200 companies of similar size, Richard Horowitz's pay ranked near the very top, in the top 7%, more than twice the average.
在大约 200 家规模相似的公司中，理查德·霍洛维茨 (Richard Horowitz) 的薪酬名列前茅，位列前 7%，是平均水平的两倍多。
Equilar also looked at a smaller group of companies that, like P&F, are in what's called the "industrial goods" sector.
Equilar 还研究了一小部分公司，例如 P&F，属于所谓的“工业品”行业。
There were 13 companies in that group.
该组中有 13 家公司。
The top paid CEO was Richard Horowitz.
薪酬最高的首席执行官是理查德·霍洛维茨(Richard Horowitz)。
In other words, according to the study, Richard Horowitz is one of the highest paid or the highest paid CEO for what he does.
换句话说，根据这项研究，理查德·霍洛维茨是薪酬最高或就其所做工作而言薪酬最高的首席执行官之一。
Tim Stabosz lost.
蒂姆·斯塔博斯输了。
But he had owned shares in P&F for most of his adult life.
但他成年后的大部分时间都持有 P&F 的股份。
And when you've been in something that long, it can be hard to know when to walk away.
当你从事某件事这么久时，你可能很难知道什么时候该离开。
What happens next?
接下来会发生什么？
Are you going to keep at this?
你要坚持下去吗？
That's a good question.
这是个好问题。
I hadn't thought about that.
我没有想到这一点。
Um, yeah, yeah.
嗯，是的，是的。
I want the company to know that I'm not going anywhere.
我想让公司知道我不会去任何地方。
Well, I mean, I'm trying to think about what giving up means.
嗯，我的意思是，我正在尝试思考放弃意味着什么。
I can tell you what giving up looks like.
我可以告诉你放弃是什么样子。
After we talked to Tim this summer, he had a momentary cash crunch.
今年夏天我们与蒂姆交谈后，他出现了短暂的现金短缺。
He had to sell all his shares.
他不得不卖掉所有股份。
The company bought them from him.
公司从他那里买了它们。
And as part of the deal, Tim promised not to buy any shares of P&F Industries for three years.
作为交易的一部分，蒂姆承诺三年内不会购买 P&F Industries 的任何股票。
It turns out it's really hard to cut a CEO's pay, even if you own 5% of the company.
事实证明，即使你拥有公司 5% 的股份，削减 CEO 的薪酬也非常困难。
Now, he has even less power to do anything about it.
现在，他无能为力。
Now, Tim Stabosz is just like everybody else.
现在，蒂姆·斯塔博斯和其他人一样。
Jacob Goldstein and David Kestenbaum from the NPR podcast "Planet Money," the very entertaining podcast about economics.
来自 NPR 播客“金钱星球”的雅各布·戈德斯坦和大卫·凯斯滕鲍姆，这是一个非常有趣的经济学播客。
Get it for free at npr.org/money or whenever you get your podcasts.
您可以在 npr.org/money 上免费获取它，或者在您收到播客时免费获取它。
Act Three: Sleep No More Ira Glass Act 3, Sleep No More.
第三幕：不再睡觉 艾拉·格拉斯 第三幕，不再睡觉。
OK, so to end today's program about waking up, let's leave the world of metaphor completely.
好啦，今天的《觉醒》节目到此结束，让我们彻底离开隐喻的世界吧。
So we're not talking about waking up to a new way of seeing the world or waking up to the things you need to do to change your life or waking up other people to the issue of overpaid CEOs, or whatever issue.
因此，我们并不是在谈论如何以一种新的方式看待世界，或者如何改变自己的生活，或者如何让其他人意识到首席执行官薪酬过高的问题，或者其他任何问题。
I'm talking about just waking up, just waking up, pure and simple.
我说的是刚刚醒来，刚刚醒来，纯粹而简单。
That shouldn't be hard, right?
这应该不难吧？
You do it every day.
你每天都这样做。
Springfield, Oregon, Monday morning during finals week, 7:30.
俄勒冈州斯普林菲尔德，决赛周周一早上 7:30。
Morgan Peach, a grad student hears the alarm that's supposed to wake him up.
研究生摩根·皮奇听到了应该叫醒他的警报。
And he shuts it off.
然后他把它关掉了。
This happens again at 7:35.
7点35分，这种情况再次发生。
You get the idea, 8:15, 8:25.
你明白了，8:15、8:25。
Finally, 9 o'clock, his girlfriend, Angela Evancie, who made this recording, steps in.
最后，九点钟，录制这段录音的女友安吉拉·伊万西 (Angela Evancie) 介入了。
[DEEP INHALE] It's time.
[深吸一口气]是时候了。
Angela Evancie It's time.
安吉拉·伊万西 是时候了。
It's time.
是时候了。
Ira Glass Right.
艾拉·格拉斯 对。
He doesn't get up.
他没有站起来。
Besides an exam, he has two research papers to turn in and 55 exams and papers to grade.
除了考试之外，他还有两篇研究论文要上交，还有 55 份考试和论文要评分。
Angela sees him struggle everyday with waking up.
安吉拉看到他每天都在挣扎着醒来。
But she thought, this week-- this week-- for once, he would do it when the alarm sounds, because he has so much to do.
但她想，这周——这周——这一次，当闹钟响起时，他会这样做，因为他有很多事情要做。
Tuesday, it goes off first at 7:30, then seven more times.
周二，它首先在 7:30 响，然后又响七次。
7:40, 7:45, 8 o'clock, 8:05, 8:10, 8:15, 8:20.
7:40、7:45、8 点、8:05、8:10、8:15、8:20。
Wednesday, pretty much the same deal.
周三，几乎同样的交易。
At some point, Angela says to her sleeping boyfriend--
在某个时刻，安吉拉对她熟睡的男友说——
Yes, I did.
是的，我做到了。
Angela Evancie Can you afford to sleep in that late?
Angela Evancie 你能睡那么晚吗？
Certainly can.
当然可以。
I'm wealthy in time, not in money.
我富有的是时间，而不是金钱。
People can be surprisingly articulate when they're barely awake sometimes.
有时候，人们在几乎没睡着的时候就能表达出惊人的口才。
Wednesday night, Morgan tells Angela that the next morning, Thursday, he actually is going to have to get up.
周三晚上，摩根告诉安吉拉，第二天早上，即周四，他实际上必须起床。
The geography paper's due at noon.
地理论文中午交。
Yeah, could you set the alarm for 7:30 tomorrow?
好的，你能把闹钟定在明天 7:30 吗？
I'd like to get up at 7:30 and work on my research papers and finish them.
我想在 7:30 起床并完成我的研究论文。
So next morning.
所以第二天早上。
Angela Evancie (WHISPERING) And now it's 8:00.
Angela Evancie（低声）：现在是 8:00。
The alarm went off.
警报响了。
And he reset it for 8:30.
他将时间重置为 8:30。
I really thought he was going to do it this morning.
我真的以为他今天早上就会这么做。
Sometime near 10:00 AM, they finally have this conversation.
上午 10:00 左右的某个时候，他们终于进行了这次对话。
It's time to get up.
是时候起床了。
Morgan Peach [YAWN] That's what you always say.
摩根·皮奇 [打哈欠] 这就是你常说的。
And then, still lying in bed.
然后，依然躺在床上。
He explains the whole thing perfectly.
他完美地解释了整个事情。
It would be impossible to say this better.
这句话再好不过了。
(SLEEPILY) It's almost as if the sleeping is that much sweeter when you have to get up or you think you have to get up, and then you don't.
（困倦地）当你必须起床或者你认为你必须起床，但你却没有起床时，睡眠就变得更加甜蜜。
[MUSIC - "WAKE UP EVERYBODY" BY JOHN LEGEND AND THE ROODS, FEATURING COMMON & MELANIE FIONA]
[音乐 - JOHN Legend 和 The Roods 创作的“Wake Up Everybody”，由 Common 和 MELANIE FIONA 主演]
Ira Glass Our program was produced today by Jonathan Menjivar, with Sean Cole, Stephanie Foo, Chana Joffe-Walt, Sarah Koenig, Miki Meek, Brian Reed, Robyn Semien, Alissa Shipp, and Nancy Updike.
Ira Glass 今天我们的节目由 Jonathan Menjivar 制作，与 Sean Cole、Stephanie Foo、Chana Joffe-Walt、Sarah Koenig、Miki Meek、Brian Reed、Robyn Semien、Alissa Shipp 和 Nancy Updike 一起制作。
Our senior producer is Julie Snyder.
我们的高级制片人是朱莉·斯奈德。
Production help from JP Dukes.
JP Dukes 提供制作帮助。
Seth Lind is our operations director.
塞思·林德 (Seth Lind) 是我们的运营总监。
Emily Condon's our production manager.
艾米丽·康登是我们的生产经理。
Elise Bergerson's our office manager.
埃莉斯·伯格森是我们的办公室经理。
Adrianne Mathiowetz runs our website.
阿德琳娜·马修韦茨 (Adrianne Mathiowetz) 负责运营我们的网站。
Editing help today from Joel Lovell.
今天由乔尔·洛弗尔 (Joel Lovell) 提供编辑帮助。
Research help from Christopher Swetala and Benjamin Anastas.
Christopher Swetala 和 Benjamin Anastas 提供了研究帮助。
Music help from Damen Graef.
达门·格雷夫 (Damen Graef) 的音乐帮助。
Our website, thisamericanlife.org, our spin-off program, Serial , serialpodcast.org.
我们的网站 thisamericanlife.org，我们的衍生项目 Serial、serialpodcast.org。
This American Life is delivered to public radio stations by PRX, the Public Radio Exchange.
《美国生活》由公共广播电台 PRX 向公共广播电台播出。
Thanks, as always, to our program's co-founder, Mr. Torey Malatia.
一如既往地感谢我们项目的联合创始人 Torey Malatia 先生。
This is what he said to the crowd immediately after Peter Sagal dropped by the WBEZ Christmas party for five minutes.
这是 Peter Sagal 参加 WBEZ 圣诞晚会五分钟后他立即对人群说的话。
Wow.
哇。
All right.
好的。
This American Life This American Life is produced in collaboration with WBEZ Chicago and delivered to stations by PRX The Public Radio Exchange.
This American Life This American Life 与 WBEZ Chicago 合作制作，并由 PRX 公共广播电台传送到各电台。