532: Magic Words - This American Life
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00:00 00:00 Transcript Share This American Life Life Partners How to Listen Episodes Recommended About Overview Staff Announcements Fellowships Jobs Music Make Radio On The Road FAQ Submissions Merch Contact Us Our Other Shows Merch Follow Us Life Partners Subscribe to our newsletter Full episode Toggle Audio and Transcript Sync Transcript | Episode #532 | September 4, 2015 532: Magic Words Note: This American Life is produced for the ear and designed to be heard.
00:00 00:00 文字记录 分享此 美国生活 生活伙伴 如何收听 剧集 推荐 关于 概述 员工公告 奖学金 工作 音乐 在路上制作电台 常见问题解答 提交 商品 联系我们 我们的其他节目 商品 关注我们 生活伙伴 订阅我们的时事通讯 整集 切换音频和文字记录同步 文字记录 | 内容第 532 集 | 2015 年 9 月 4 日 532：Magic Words 注意：《This American Life》是为耳朵而制作的，旨在让人们听到。
If you are able, we strongly encourage you to listen to the audio, which includes emotion and emphasis that's not on the page.
如果可以的话，我们强烈建议您收听音频，其中包括页面上没有的情感和重点。
Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors.
文字记录是使用语音识别软件和人工转录员结合生成的，可能包含错误。
Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print.
请在印刷版引用前检查相应的音频。
Prologue Ira Glass Here's one of the strangest outcomes in a courtroom I have heard about in a while.
序言 艾拉·格拉斯 这是我一段时间以来听说过的法庭上最奇怪的结果之一。
And it contains a lesson that very well might come in handy for you, and I do mean you, some day in your own life.
它包含的教训很可能对你有用，我指的是你，在你自己生命中的某一天。
Jake Halpern was the reporter who witnessed this.
杰克·哈尔彭（Jake Halpern）是目睹这一情况的记者。
It was in a courtroom in Georgia.
那是在佐治亚州的一个法庭里。
He was down there researching a book about credit card debt.
他正在那里研究一本关于信用卡债务的书。
This is called-- in Georgia, they call it magistrate court.
这就是——在佐治亚州，他们称之为地方法院。
And it's basically small claims court.
它基本上是小额索赔法庭。
And you go in and it's all debtors.
你进去一看全是欠债人。
People refer to it even as debtors court.
人们甚至将其称为债务人法庭。
So Jake meets a couple sitting there, Frederick and Keanne.
于是杰克遇到了坐在那里的一对夫妇：弗雷德里克和基恩。
They're in their 40s, nicely dressed.
他们40多岁，衣着得体。
She's a shoe salesman.
她是一名鞋推销员。
He's an ex-marine who had a business buying houses, rehabbing them, and then selling them, which was going great till the housing market fell apart in 2008, and then that kind of went to hell for a while.
他是一名退伍海军陆战队队员，从事购买房屋、修复房屋、然后出售的生意，生意一直很好，直到 2008 年房地产市场崩溃，然后这种情况有一段时间陷入了困境。
They ended up taking on some debt.
他们最终承担了一些债务。
And then they got a notice in the mail saying that they owed money to a company called LVNV Funding, which is what brought them to court.
然后他们收到一封邮件通知，称他们欠一家名为 LVNV Funding 的公司钱，这就是他们被告上法庭的原因。
And Keanne, at this point, says, like, I don't even know who LVNV Funding is.
Keanne 在这一点上说，我什至不知道 LVNV Funding 是谁。
And one of the reasons that she says I'm here today in court is just to figure out what this is all about, because she doesn't even recognize them as being her creditor.
她说我今天来到法庭的原因之一只是想弄清楚这到底是怎么回事，因为她甚至不承认他们是她的债权人。
They're on the hook for $3,762.20.
他们的赔偿金额为 3,762.20 美元。
So we're sitting there talking, and this young guy in a suit all of a sudden calls out their name.
所以我们坐在那里聊天，这个穿西装的年轻人突然喊出了他们的名字。
And, for a moment, it's not clear who exactly he is.
而且，一时之间，我们还不清楚他到底是谁。
And he calls it out in a way that almost like an official would call out your name.
他的喊声就像官员喊出你的名字一样。
And they're-- they start walking over to talk to this guy.
他们开始走过去和这个人说话。
So this young guy quickly says I'm the lawyer representing the people that own your debt.
所以这个年轻人很快就说我是代表拥有你债务的人的律师。
Are you Keanne?
你是基恩吗？
Are you Frederick?
你是弗雷德里克吗？
And then he looks at me and is like and who are you.
然后他看着我，就像你是谁。
Jake explains that he's a reporter, he's researching a book.
杰克解释说他是一名记者，正在研究一本书。
The guy replies--
那个人回答——
Well, I'm not comfortable with you being here.
好吧，你在这里我感到不舒服。
And Frederick was like, well, we are comfortable with him being here.
弗雷德里克说，好吧，他在这里我们感到很舒服。
And there's this like moment, and then this lawyer just rolls his eyes and just continues with his pitch to them.
就在这样的时刻，这位律师只是翻了个白眼，继续向他们推销。
Frederick and Keanne tell the lawyer that they're confused.
弗雷德里克和基恩告诉律师他们很困惑。
They don't know who this NVLV Funding is or what the debt is.
他们不知道 NVLV 资金是谁或债务是什么。
And the lawyer says that his client owns their American Express debt.
律师说他的客户拥有美国运通公司的债务。
Basically, when Frederick and Keanne failed to pay of their American Express bill, American Express sold the IOU to this company.
基本上，当弗雷德里克和基恩未能支付美国运通账单时，美国运通将欠条卖给了这家公司。
And they're trying to collect it.
他们正在努力收集它。
Obviously, that's a big business.
显然，这是一桩大生意。
There are lots of companies that do this.
有很多公司这样做。
The lawyer asks them--
律师问他们——
You did have an American Express card, correct?
您确实有一张美国运通卡，对吗？
And they say, yeah, we had American Express card.
他们说，是的，我们有美国运通卡。
And you do live at-- and he gives their address.
你确实住在——并且他给出了他们的地址。
Yes.
是的。
Well, this is what you owe.
嗯，这就是你欠的。
And then he reaches into his briefcase and he pulls out this piece of paper, which I'm actually holding in front of me.
然后他把手伸进公文包，拿出这张纸，我实际上就拿着它。
I brought it along.
我把它带来了。
At first glance, it resembles a credit card statement, like the ones that we get every month that says what you owe.
乍一看，它类似于信用卡对帐单，就像我们每个月收到的说明您所欠金额的信用卡对帐单一样。
But then, at the top, and you look and-- it says at the very top of it, this is an account summary.
但是，在顶部，你会看到——它在最顶部写着，这是一个帐户摘要。
It is not a credit card statement from the original creditor and has not previously been provided to the consumer.
它不是原始债权人的信用卡对账单，之前也没有提供给消费者。
So it-- it's really bizarre right off the start because they're handing this thing that's clearly been set up to resemble a credit card statement, and yet there it says right at the top, but this is not actually a credit card statement.
所以一开始就很奇怪，因为他们递给的东西显然是像信用卡对帐单一样设置的，但它在顶部写着，但这实际上不是信用卡对帐单。
And so the things you would find on a normal credit card statement, like a list of charges, it doesn't have that, doesn't say how much of this is the original debt and how much is interest.
因此，您在普通信用卡对账单上会发现的内容（例如费用清单）没有这些内容，也没有说明其中有多少是原始债务，有多少是利息。
There's nothing that would help you figure out how they got to the number $3,762.20.
没有任何东西可以帮助您弄清楚他们是如何得到 3,762.20 美元这个数字的。
So Frederick asked the guy if he has anything else to help them make sense of this number.
所以弗雷德里克问这个人是否还有其他东西可以帮助他们理解这个数字。
Does he have the original contract from when they took out the credit card to prove that, in fact, his client does actually own the debt now and it's all legit?
他是否有他们拿出信用卡时的原始合同来证明，事实上，他的客户现在确实拥有债务并且都是合法的？
The lawyer says he doesn't need to provide any of that.
律师说他不需要提供任何这些。
The debt is real, they have to pay.
债务是真实的，他们必须偿还。
And then Jake pipes up.
然后杰克就开始说话了。
For his reporting, he's wondering does the lawyer actually have any of that stuff, the original signed contract, or account statements.
对于他的报告，他想知道律师是否真的拥有这些东西，原始签署的合同或账户报表。
So the lawyer turns back to me and he says, are you representing them?
于是律师转身对我说，你代表他们吗？
And I said, no, no, I'm just curious.
我说，不，不，我只是好奇。
And he's like, well, you can't represent them, you're not a lawyer.
他说，好吧，你不能代表他们，你不是律师。
And Frederick's like, he's not representing us.
弗雷德里克说，他不代表我们。
He just asked the same question that I did.
他刚刚问了和我同样的问题。
The lawyer repeats, you can't represent them.
律师重复一遍，你不能代表他们。
And Jake says they go around and around on this for a while.
杰克说他们在这个问题上讨论了一段时间。
And, finally, it's time to go into a courtroom.
最后，是时候进入法庭了。
And as they walk in, the lawyer taps Jake on the shoulder and tells him, I'm going to put you on the witness stand.
当他们走进去时，律师拍拍杰克的肩膀并告诉他，我要把你送上证人席。
And I was like OK, like I couldn't tell-- it was just a crazy thing to say.
我当时就觉得好吧，就像我不知道——这真是一件疯狂的事。
I didn't know if he was just messing with me.
我不知道他是不是只是在逗我。
Five minutes later, they call Keanne's name out, and then the judge also says, and Jake Halpern, you need to come up here too.
五分钟后，他们喊出了基恩的名字，然后法官也说，杰克·哈尔彭，你也需要到这里来。
So I'm like-- and then it's me and Keanne raising our hands together and being sworn in together, almost like co-defendants.
所以我就像——然后我和基恩一起举手并一起宣誓就职，几乎就像共同被告一样。
That's the only-- that's the only way I can describe.
这是我唯一能描述的方式。
It's like we're both on trial here.
就好像我们都在这里受审一样。
And you've known Keanne how long at this point?
你认识基恩多久了？
I've known her like 10 minutes.
我认识她才10分钟。
And the young lawyer immediately starts with what's his opening argument.
这位年轻的律师立即开始他的开场陈词。
And he tells the judge this man right here is representing this couple and he is practicing-- therefore practicing law without a license.
他告诉法官，这个人在这里代表这对夫妇，他正在执业——因此没有执照执业。
And, Your Honor, I need you to inform him that he could face criminal sanctions for doing this.
而且，法官大人，我需要你通知他，他可能会因此而面临刑事制裁。
Jake tells the judge that he only asked a few questions.
杰克告诉法官他只问了几个问题。
And the judge rules, it turns out this is not the same thing as pretending to be a lawyer, so that gets settled.
法官裁定，这与冒充律师不是一回事，所以就解决了。
And then they turn to the business at hand.
然后他们转向手头的事情。
Remember, this entire story I'm telling you is about credit card debt, and what happens in court when a consumer is sued.
请记住，我告诉您的整个故事都是关于信用卡债务，以及消费者被起诉时法庭上会发生什么。
And so far, as you see, so far, right, the lawyer is playing hardball.
到目前为止，正如你所看到的，到目前为止，律师正在采取强硬态度。
He is not messing around, which makes what happens next even more interesting.
他并没有胡闹，这让接下来发生的事情变得更加有趣。
The judge turns to the lawyer, and the judge says to the lawyer, so what do you want to do about this debt.
法官转向律师，法官对律师说，那么这笔债务你想怎么办？
And the lawyer then says to the judge, you know what, give me a minute.
然后律师对法官说，你知道吗，请给我一分钟时间。
I need to consult with my client.
我需要咨询我的客户。
So he walks out of the courtroom.
于是他走出了法庭。
Me and Keanne and the judge are kind of left in the courtroom.
我、基恩和法官都被留在了法庭上。
And the lawyer goes out into the hallway, and then comes back like two minutes later, and says, Your Honor, we're going to be dropping this, dismissing the case.
律师走到走廊上，大约两分钟后回来说，法官大人，我们将放弃这件事，驳回此案。
What?
什么？
Jake Halpern Yeah.
杰克·哈尔彭 是的。
And I'm like-- I'm looking at her.
我就像——我正在看着她。
And Keanne's looking at me.
基恩正在看着我。
And we're both like this just makes-- this makes no sense After all this fuss and this full court press you put on us?
我们俩都是这样的——这毫无意义，在你对我们进行了所有这些大惊小怪和全场紧逼之后？
So Jake, and Keanne, and Frederick go into the hallway and they are trying to figure out what in the world just happened.
于是杰克、基恩和弗雷德里克走进走廊，他们试图弄清楚刚刚发生了什么。
And this lawyer from Georgia Legal Services, who saw this whole thing go down, joins their conversation.
这位来自佐治亚州法律服务中心的律师目睹了整件事的发生，也加入了他们的谈话。
And he is not in the least bit surprised by this.
而他对此一点也不感到惊讶。
He's like-- he's like, oh, yeah, of course he dropped the case.
他就像——他就像，哦，是的，他当然放弃了这个案子。
And I'm like what do you mean of course he dropped the case.
我想你的意思是他当然放弃了这个案子。
He said, oh, well, when a consumer actually shows up in court and says the magic words, then these cases basically evaporate.
他说，哦，好吧，当消费者真正出现在法庭上并说出神奇的话语时，这些案件基本上就消失了。
And I say, the magic words?
我说，神奇的话语？
He says, yeah, show me the evidence.
他说，是的，给我看看证据。
Show me the evidence.
给我看看证据。
In other words, show me where you got this number $3,762.20.
换句话说，请告诉我您从哪里得到这个数字 3,762.20 美元。
The Georgia Legal Services lawyer told Jake that if you're standing before a judge, and you say, OK, I don't recognize this amount that you say I owe and I want to see some documentation, I want to see account statements or whatever, because I have no way to know with certainty that this debt is really mine, the judge will usually turn to the other side and ask for the evidence.
乔治亚州法律服务部的律师告诉杰克，如果你站在法官面前，你说，好吧，我不承认你所说的我欠的这笔金额，我想看一些文件，我想看账户报表或其他什么，因为我无法确定这笔债务是否真的是我的，法官通常会转向另一方并要求提供证据。
And, in all likelihood, they'll have no documentation and they'll drop the case.
而且，他们很可能没有任何文件，并且会放弃此案。
And this is true not just in Georgia, but elsewhere.
不仅在佐治亚州如此，在其他地方也是如此。
Because the way this business works, Jake says, when credit card companies sell these IOUs to debt collection companies, they usually don't give them any documentation.
杰克说，因为这项业务的运作方式，当信用卡公司将这些欠条出售给收债公司时，他们通常不会向他们提供任何文件。
Usually, they just give them a spreadsheet with a long list of people who owe money on their credit cards, and their addresses, and their last payment, and how much they owe, and not a lot more than that.
通常，他们只是给他们一个电子表格，其中列出了信用卡欠款人的一长串名单、他们的地址、他们最后一次付款以及他们欠了多少钱，仅此而已。
So when these companies take you and me to court, where they're betting on is we won't show up, which is a really good bet, Jake says, because--
因此，当这些公司将你我告上法庭时，他们打赌我们不会出庭，这是一个非常好的赌注，杰克说，因为——
The vast majority of people don't actually-- who are debtors who are being sued don't actually show up in court.
绝大多数被起诉的债务人实际上并没有出庭。
The no show rate, there's different estimates, but it's between 80% and 90% of people don't show up.
对于缺席率，有不同的估计，但大约有 80% 到 90% 的人没有出现。
If they don't show up, they lose.
如果他们不出现，他们就输了。
If they showed up, if they said the magic words, they would probably win.
如果他们出现，如果他们说出魔法的话，他们很可能会赢。
And now you know the magic words, you can use them yourself.
现在您知道了这些神奇的词语，您可以自己使用它们。
Though, Jake said, he is not sure that he thinks it's always such a good thing.
不过，杰克说，他不确定他是否认为这总是一件好事。
He talked another guy who had a lot of debt, this is an Indian immigrant who owned a steakhouse and owed like $300,000.
他谈到了另一个负债累累的人，这是一位印度移民，拥有一家牛排馆，欠债约 30 万美元。
And he had used these magic words almost to the point where it was like a scam, like he owed all this money for this steakhouse that had gone bust.
他用这些神奇的词几乎到了像一个骗局的地步，就像他欠了这家已经破产的牛排馆这么多钱。
And he was just showing up in court and saying like show me the original signed contracts, show me the statements, and he was like beating these debts left and right.
他只是出现在法庭上并说给我看原始签署的合同，给我看声明，他就像左右清偿这些债务。
Like Keanne--
就像基恩一样——
Oh, wow.
哦，哇。
Jake Halpern He was working it.
杰克·哈尔彭（Jake Halpern） 他正在努力。
Like, oh, my god, there's this magic button, and I can totally get off the hook for all this money that I owe.
就像，哦，天哪，有这个神奇的按钮，我可以完全摆脱我所欠的所有这些钱。
I'm just going to keep on hitting it, boom, boom, boom, boom.
我要继续击球，繁荣，繁荣，繁荣，繁荣。
Oh, you see, now you're confusing me.
哦，你看，现在你让我困惑了。
Because, up until now, I thought the magic button was a really good thing, and now I think maybe it's a bad thing too.
因为，到目前为止，我认为魔法按钮确实是一件好事，但现在我认为也许它也是一件坏事。
Well, what it is-- it could be a good thing or a bad thing.
嗯，它是什么——它可能是一件好事，也可能是一件坏事。
I felt conflicted about it.
我对此感到很矛盾。
It seems strange that you wouldn't now have to pay off anything of what you borrowed.
奇怪的是，你现在不需要还清任何借来的东西。
Well, today, on our program, magic words.
好吧，今天，在我们的节目中，魔术词。
They can be used for good or for evil.
它们可以用来行善，也可以用来作恶。
We have stories of magic words that supposedly do all kinds of incredible things, like erase your debts, as you just heard, or make you rich, levitate you, help you get along better with your older relatives whose minds are going.
我们有很多关于神奇词语的故事，据说这些词语可以做各种令人难以置信的事情，比如消除你的债务，就像你刚刚听到的那样，或者让你变得富有，让你悬浮，帮助你与那些神志清醒的年长亲戚更好地相处。
From WBEZ Chicago, it's This American Life.
来自芝加哥 WBEZ 的《This American Life》。
I'm Ira Glass, with the same magic words that I intone every week at this time, full of hope that they're going to work, even though the actual magic they contain is next to nothing.
我是艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass），我每周都会吟诵同样的魔法词，充满希望它们会发挥作用，尽管它们所包含的实际魔力几乎为零。
Those words, stay with us.
这些话，请留在我们身边。
Act One, I believe I can fly.
第一幕，我相信我能飞。
So there's this book full of magic words that one of our contributors, Jonathan Goldstein, found in his apartment when he was moving.
我们的撰稿人乔纳森·戈尔茨坦在搬家时在他的公寓里发现了这本书，里面充满了神奇的词语。
He hadn't looked at it in over 30 years.
他已经有三十多年没有看过它了。
It's called Ultra-Psychonics-- How to Work Miracles with the Limitless Power of Psychoatomic Energy.
它被称为超心灵学——如何利用精神原子能量的无限力量创造奇迹。
It was written by a man named Walter Delaney, published in 1975.
该书由一位名叫沃尔特·德莱尼 (Walter Delaney) 的人撰写，于 1975 年出版。
And the book's premise, its basic premise, is that just as objects are composed of atoms, thoughts are composed of psychic atoms, or Delaney calls psychons, ultrons, and egons.
这本书的前提，它的基本前提是，正如物体是由原子组成的一样，思想也是由精神原子组成的，或者德莱尼称之为“psyns”、“ultrons”和“egons”。
And I'm just going to let Jonathan explain what all that means.
我将让乔纳森解释这一切的含义。
I was 11 years old when my father walked into my bedroom and handed me a copy of Ultra-Psychonics.
当我 11 岁的时候，我的父亲走进我的卧室，递给我一本《超灵能》。
He wasn't much of a gift-giver, more of a check-giver, but I was into magic tricks and fantasy novels.
他不太喜欢送礼，更像是送支票，但我很喜欢魔术和奇幻小说。
So when he saw it in a used book store, he must have thought it would be right up my alley.
所以当他在一家旧书店看到这本书时，他一定认为这正是我的拿手好戏。
The frayed yellow dust jacket promised a grab bag of every occult slash psychology slash self-help topic under the sun, all in 237 pages.
这本磨损的黄色防尘套承诺囊括世界上所有神秘、心理学、自助主题，全部 237 页。
Among other things, the book promised to teach you how to shoot mental laser beams, move solid objects with your mind, make others obey your command, multiply your brain power by a factor of 1,000, and defend yourself against demonic attack.
除此之外，这本书承诺教你如何发射精神激光束，用意念移动固体物体，让别人服从你的命令，将你的脑力增加1000倍，以及保护自己免受恶魔的攻击。
Ultra-Psychonics revealed what I always suspected-- that the adult world operated on magic.
超心灵学揭示了我一直怀疑的事情——成人世界是靠魔法运作的。
Finding a job, a wife, acquiring a bag of Egg McMuffins with a mere flash of a plastic card, how else were these things accomplished?
找工作、找老婆、用一张塑料卡就可以买到一袋鸡蛋松饼，否则这些事情是怎么完成的呢？
To an 11-year-old, the book's theory seemed as plausible as anything else.
对于一个 11 岁的孩子来说，这本书的理论似乎和其他理论一样合理。
An excerpt from page 217 explains the secret of ultra levitation.
第 217 页的摘录解释了超悬浮的秘密。
"One, remove all your clothes and stand on a bathroom scale.
“第一，脱掉所有衣服，站在浴室秤上。
Two, generate the ultronic power globe on a string, as you did for the ultronic poltergeist technique.
第二，在一根绳子上生成超电子能量球，就像你对超电子恶作剧技术所做的那样。
Three, concentrate on making it rise like a balloon, lifting you with it.
第三，集中精力让它像气球一样升起，并用它举起你。
Four, keep your eyes on the scale.
第四，密切关注体重秤。
It will start to drop bit by bit, showing that you are getting lighter."
它会开始一点点下降，表明你的体重正在变轻。”
This wasn't your granddaddy's old levitation.
这不是你祖父以前的悬浮状态。
This was ultra levitation.
这就是超悬浮。
And most importantly for me, Ultra-Psychonics required neither time nor effort.
对我来说最重要的是，超心灵学既不需要时间也不需要精力。
The inside flap stated it was as simple, easy, and natural as breathing.
内翻盖表明它就像呼吸一样简单、轻松、自然。
And for a child adept at breathing, but little else, this was exciting news.
对于一个擅长呼吸但除此之外别无其他的孩子来说，这是一个令人兴奋的消息。
In those dark ignorant days before the universal remote, one had to rise, not unlike an animal, from one's perch to change TV stations.
在通用遥控器出现之前的那些黑暗无知的日子里，人们必须像动物一样，从自己的栖息地站起来去更换电视台。
By using ultra kinetics, as outlined in chapter 13, I'd never have to debase myself that way again.
通过使用超动力学，如第 13 章所述，我再也不用那样贬低自己了。
Never again would I have to suffer through the depressing stage lighting of Barney Miller when the Beverly Hillbillies was a mere psychic click away.
我再也不用忍受巴尼·米勒 (Barney Miller) 令人沮丧的舞台灯光了，而贝弗利山人 (Beverly Hillbillies) 距离这里只有心灵的点击。
No longer would I be pathetic.
我不再可怜了。
I would be ultra telepathetic.
我会拥有超强的心灵感应能力。
This was during the Eden of my pre-adolescence, a time when I had yet to discover the K-Mart lingerie insert, and so had plenty of time on my hands.
那是在我青春期前的伊甸园时期，那时我还没有发现凯马特内衣插入物，所以我有足够的时间。
I wasted hours in bed, lying flat on my stomach, with the book open at my side, squinting so hard that my vision began to blur as I tried to close the bedroom door with my mind.
我在床上浪费了几个小时，平躺在床上，书打开在我身边，眯着眼睛，当我试图用意念关上卧室的门时，我的视线开始变得模糊。
Even though I had, as the book instructed, dutifully turned on the ultronic generator in my head to stimulate my flow of ultrons, I was getting nowhere.
尽管我按照书上的指示，尽职尽责地打开了脑中的超子发生器来刺激我的超子流，但我一无所获。
I assumed the fault was mine, that I was not following the instructions properly.
我认为错误是我的，我没有正确遵循指示。
But reading it now, it's hard to figure out how anyone could follow along.
但现在读起来，很难弄清楚如何有人能跟上。
I now wonder whether my father knew it was insane, and had only gifted me with the book as a means of getting me out of his hair.
我现在想知道我的父亲是否知道这很疯狂，而把这本书送给我只是为了让我摆脱他的困扰。
He could read in peace, while his son stared at a doorjamb for hours on end.
他可以安静地读书，而他的儿子则连续几个小时盯着门框。
I wonder if my father still even remembered the book.
我不知道我父亲是否还记得这本书。
Yes.
是的。
Jonathan Goldstein You remember it?
乔纳森·戈德斯坦 你还记得吗？
Yes.
是的。
Jonathan Goldstein Right off the bat?
乔纳森·戈德斯坦 马上？
Right.
正确的。
Jonathan Goldstein I thought I'd have to refresh your memory.
乔纳森·戈尔茨坦：我想我必须重新唤起你的记忆。
No, no, no. I remember it well.
不，不，不。我记得很清楚。
It's all kinds of psycho-- what do you call it?
这是各种各样的心理——你怎么称呼它？
Experiments and magic, very scientifically proven, and concrete, and so forth.
实验和魔法，经过非常科学的证明，而且具体，等等。
They give you a formula, step-by-step way of doing it, et cetera.
他们给你一个公式、一步一步的方法等等。
Did you try any of the techniques that were offered in the book?
您尝试过书中提供的任何技术吗？
No, I never tried any of the-- but, for some reason, I thought maybe there's a certain amount of validity, maybe.
不，我从未尝试过其中任何一个——但是，出于某种原因，我认为也许有一定的有效性。
But I don't know that I necessarily think of you as a believer in that kind of stuff.
但我不知道我一定认为你是这类东西的信徒。
I pooh-pooh it.
我对它嗤之以鼻。
I don't pooh-pooh anything.
我不会对任何事情嗤之以鼻。
This is patently false.
这显然是错误的。
My father has pooh-poohed everything, from sushi to liquid soap.
我父亲对一切东西都嗤之以鼻，从寿司到液体肥皂。
He's pooh-poohed abstract expressionism, the Rolling Stones, and the entire state of Florida.
他对抽象表现主义、滚石乐队和整个佛罗里达州嗤之以鼻。
He once even pooh-poohed my Pu Pu platter, telling me egg rolls were best enjoyed cold.
有一次他甚至对我的 Pu Pu 拼盘嗤之以鼻，告诉我蛋卷最好冷着吃。
In fact, whenever my great uncle Saul bragged about how his other nephew, Barney, was a successful doctor, my father pooh-poohed the hell out of that.
事实上，每当我的叔祖父索尔吹嘘他的另一个侄子巴尼是一位成功的医生时，我父亲都会对此嗤之以鼻。
Getting himself worked up, he'd insist that a chiropodist was no doctor.
当他兴奋起来时，他坚持认为足病医生不是医生。
You remember mom's uncle Saul used to have a nephew named Barney?
你还记得妈妈的叔叔索尔曾经有一个名叫巴尼的侄子吗？
A chiropodist.
一名足病治疗师。
Jonathan Goldstein A foot doctor.
乔纳森·戈德斯坦 (Jonathan Goldstein) 足部医生。
No, he's not medical doctor, no. You're not an M.D.
不，他不是医生，不。你不是医学博士
Can't operate on my foot.
我的脚无法进行手术。
Here's what I'm saying is I-- Mr. Goldstein If I have a bunion or a corn.
我要说的是，我——戈尔茨坦先生，如果我有拇囊炎或鸡眼。
I bring that up to illustrate the fact that you don't just swallow things hook, line, and sinker.
我提出这一点是为了说明这样一个事实：你不只是吞下钩子、线和坠子的东西。
Here was somebody presenting someone as a foot doctor and you said, no, he's not a doctor.
有人将某人介绍为足部医生，你说，不，他不是医生。
That's right.
这是正确的。
Jonathan Goldstein So, but, I mean, in the case of this, I imagine, you approached it probably with some skepticism.
乔纳森·戈德斯坦：所以，但是，我的意思是，在这种情况下，我想，你可能会带着一些怀疑的态度来对待它。
This book, it was kind of-- how could I put it-- seemed to me to be backed by some fact.
在我看来，这本书——我该怎么说——似乎是有某些事实支持的。
Why?
为什么？
Mr. Goldstein The way it was written.
戈德斯坦先生 就是这样写的。
What was it about the way that it was written?
它的书写方式是怎样的？
Well, the way-- because it was so concrete, so specific.
嗯，方式——因为它是如此具体、如此具体。
There was nothing vague about it.
没有什么含糊之处。
It's a sold book.
这是一本已售出的书。
It's got a table of contents, if I remember.
如果我记得的话，它有一个目录。
It's not like any little leaflet or a pamphlet.
它不像任何小传单或小册子。
Whoever wrote this, well, he put a lot of effort into it.
不管是谁写的，他都付出了很多努力。
I'll tell you that.
我会告诉你的。
He put a lot of effort into it.
他为此付出了很多努力。
I get the feeling this guy wasn't trying to con anybody.
我感觉这家伙并没有试图欺骗任何人。
He really believed what he was writing.
他真的相信他所写的东西。
Did Walter Delaney really believe what he was writing?
沃尔特·德莱尼真的相信他所写的东西吗？
Believe, for instance, that while the old-fashioned zodiac was outdated, his psychonic zodiac, with its cryanox, vernox, estavox, and invernox signs was more scientific as it was seasonally based?
例如，你相信虽然老式的十二生肖已经过时了，但他的心理十二生肖（带有 Cryanox、vernox、estavox 和 invernox 星座）更科学，因为它是基于季节的？
And that even if you were born under the estavox summer sign, you might exhibit a more cryanox winter type personality if you were born in an air conditioned hospital?
即使你出生在 estavox 夏季星座，如果你出生在有空调的医院，你可能会表现出更像 Cryanox 冬季类型的性格？
The back of the book refers to him as, quote, "one of the world's leading authorities on the psychic and occult sciences." But I could find no mention of him anywhere on the internet.
书的背面引用他的话，称他为“世界通灵和神秘科学领域的领先权威之一”。但我在互联网上找不到任何提及他的地方。
It was only when I searched on Walter Delaney and pseudonym that I finally got a lead.
直到我搜索沃尔特·德莱尼（Walter Delaney）和化名时，我才终于找到了线索。
It turns out that, like so many other mystical men from Leonard Susskind to Regis Philbin to my father, Buzz Goldstein, Walter Delaney was originally a Jew from the Bronx by the name of Joseph Schaumberger.
事实证明，就像伦纳德·萨斯金德、雷吉斯·菲尔宾和我父亲巴兹·戈德斯坦等许多其他神秘人物一样，沃尔特·德莱尼最初是来自布朗克斯的犹太人，名叫约瑟夫·绍伯格。
Schaumberger passed away in 2011, but I managed to track down his daughter, Barbara.
绍伯格于 2011 年去世，但我设法找到了他的女儿芭芭拉。
She was in her early 20s when her dad was writing the book, and she remembers it clearly.
她父亲写这本书的时候她才20岁出头，她记得很清楚。
At the time, Schaumberger was living in New Jersey and making a decent wage as an editor at a publishing house that specialized in occult self-help books with titles like Secrets from Beyond the Pyramids and The Magic of Chantomatics .
当时，绍伯格住在新泽西州，在一家出版社担任编辑，收入不错，该出版社专门出版神秘自助书籍，书名包括《金字塔外的秘密》和《魔法学》等。
And he was astonished by the amount of money he saw writers making.
他对作家赚的钱感到惊讶。
Here's Barbara.
这是芭芭拉。
They were just taking buckets of money home and it was driving him crazy.
他们只是把一大桶钱带回家，这让他发疯了。
So his wife, Dorothy, said, well, why don't you write one of these books yourself?
所以他的妻子多萝西说，好吧，你为什么不自己写一本这样的书呢？
No. What he did was he did this careful study.
不，他所做的是他进行了仔细的研究。
He just flipped through magazines, and looked at newspapers, and he read scientific journals, and such.
他只是翻阅杂志、报纸、科学期刊等等。
So from that combination of things, he just pulled ideas out and made what sounded good to him.
因此，从这些事情的结合中，他只是提取想法并做出对他来说听起来不错的东西。
Was his intention to make it scientific or was it--
他的意图是让它变得科学还是——
No. No, his intention was to make money.
不不，他的目的是为了赚钱。
You have to understand that this was just a-- it started out as a kind of warped family joke.
你必须明白，这只是——一开始只是一种扭曲的家庭笑话。
And he'd read it to the family and say, does this sound reasonable?
他把它读给家人听并说，这听起来合理吗？
Does this sound interesting?
这听起来有趣吗？
Do you remember him reading you actual passages from the book?
你还记得他给你读过书中的实际段落吗？
Oh, yeah.
哦，是的。
The best one, our family-- the absolute family favorite was the money one, where he-- one chapter was about money, about making money.
最好的一章，我们的家庭——绝对是家庭最喜欢的一章，是关于金钱的一章，其中一章是关于金钱的，关于赚钱的。
I think that was in the chapter on ultra pictronics, how to materialize the riches you desire.
我认为那是关于超电子学的章节，如何实现你想要的财富。
I'll be honest, I've never read the whole book all the way through.
老实说，我从来没有从头到尾读过整本书。
But, anyway, he said this is where you would go around the house and you would gather up your bills, and your bank statements, and your wallet, and such, and you'd put them all under your pillow.
但是，无论如何，他说这是你在房子里走动的地方，你会收集你的账单、你的银行对账单、你的钱包等等，然后你会把它们都放在枕头下。
And then you would have this formula, this chant that you would use.
然后你就会有这个公式，你会使用这个颂歌。
The lyrics go, "My money lies under my pillow, my money lies close to me.
歌词是这样的：“我的钱就在我的枕头下，我的钱就在我身边。
No matter what I do tomorrow, bring back my money to me." This was written to be sung to the tune of "My Bonnie Lies Over The Ocean." Any time I hear those words, I can hear it in my head.
不管我明天做什么，把钱还给我。”这首歌是为了配合《我的邦妮躺在海洋》的曲调而写的。每当我听到这些话时，我都会在脑海中听到它。
I can hear the echo of my father singing that song.
我能听到父亲唱那首歌的回声。
Looking at it now, it seems obvious it was a lark.
现在看来，这显然是一场闹剧。
It almost reads like a parody of another famous science fictiony slash self-helpy book with a lot of pseudo science jargon, that, for legal reasons, I will only say rhymes with diuretics.
它读起来几乎就像是对另一本著名的科幻斜线自助书的模仿，其中有很多伪科学术语，出于法律原因，我只会说与利尿剂押韵。
Take, for instance, the astral spur.
以星体刺为例。
You were supposed to use it at the racetrack to give your horse extra energy.
您应该在赛马场使用它来为您的马提供额外的能量。
And it involved standing on one foot and projecting a psychic laser at your horse's hindquarters.
它涉及单脚站立并向马的后躯投射一道心灵激光。
And then there's the section on ultra vision influence.
然后是关于超视力影响的部分。
The road to domination is explained this way.
统治之路就是这样解释的。
"One, sit in front of a mirror and practice staring fixedly into your own eyes.
“第一，坐在镜子前，练习凝视自己的眼睛。
Two, practice the look on animals.
第二，练习观察动物。
Cats are the best.
猫是最好的。
See if you can stare down a cat.
看看你是否可以盯着一只猫。
Don't be surprised if the cat seems to win the first few rounds.
如果猫似乎赢得了前几轮，请不要感到惊讶。
Three, practice the look on strangers on various forms of public transport.
第三，练习在各种公共交通工具上如何看待陌生人。
Stare steadily at someone sitting opposite you until you force them to turn their head away or look down.
盯着坐在你对面的人，直到你迫使他们转过头或低头。
You have just mastered your first human subject."
你刚刚掌握了你的第一个人类科目。”
I'm not that surprised, but I'm a little saddened or the part of me-- because I discovered the book when I was like 11 years old.
我并不感到惊讶，但我还是有点难过——因为我在 11 岁的时候发现了这本书。
So that little kid part of me--
所以我的那个小孩的一部分——
Oh, I'm so sorry.
哦，我很抱歉。
Jonathan Goldstein No, no. It makes sense.
乔纳森·戈德斯坦 不，不。这是有道理的。
Because there are parts in the book where he references things like the Tibetan Book of the Dead and the golden flower and things from eastern philosophy.
因为书中有些地方他引用了《西藏度亡经》、《金花》等东方哲学的东西。
Oh, he was very familiar with all these things.
噢，这些事情他都很熟悉。
Like the Egyptian Book of the Dead was a big one, because it was always the thing of, well, maybe if they had followed the formulas correctly, maybe something--
就像埃及亡灵书是一本大书一样，因为它总是这样的，好吧，也许如果他们正确地遵循了公式，也许有些东西——
That sounds like someone who either did believe or kind of wanted to believe.
这听起来像是一个要么确实相信，要么有点想相信的人。
He may have wanted to believe.
他可能想相信。
It may be that, in his private thoughts, there were some things in there that he believed in.
或许，在他私底下的想法里，有一些他所相信的东西。
He wouldn't have-- I can't see him as sharing that with us because he didn't want to open himself up to ridicule.
他不会——我不认为他会与我们分享这一点，因为他不想让自己受到嘲笑。
No, he was your-- he was a very geeky science fiction fan looking person.
不，他是你的——他是一个看起来非常怪异的科幻小说迷。
The thick, black, and heavy-lensed eye glasses, kind of a short, pudgy, Jewish boy from the Bronx.
戴着厚重的黑色镜片眼镜，有点像来自布朗克斯的矮胖犹太男孩。
No, he was a very quiet, private person.
不，他是一个非常安静、注重隐私的人。
Do you have any idea how he arrived upon the name Walter Delaney?
你知道他是怎么想到沃尔特·德莱尼这个名字的吗？
Oh, of course.
哦，当然。
He was at the office and the book was all ready for publication, going through all the copy editing.
他在办公室，这本书已经准备好出版，并进行了所有的文案编辑。
And he wandered into the men's room at Prentice Hall, and thinking where am I going to find a name.
他漫步走进普伦蒂斯庄园的男洗手间，想着我该去哪里找到一个名字。
What name can I use that's not going to be identifiable?
我可以使用什么名称而不被识别？
And he just kind of looked at the top of the urinal and there was the brand of the urinal, Delany Flushboy.
他只是看了一眼小便池的顶部，发现小便池的品牌是 Delany Flushboy。
So it became Walter Delaney from the Delany Flushboy urinal.
所以它变成了来自 Delany Flushboy 小便池的 Walter Delaney。
Barbara told me that not only did her father make enough money from the book to buy a large, beautiful house and take his wife on European vacations where they went to operas, she also said that Schaumberger received boxes and boxes of letters from readers thanking him and requesting further guidance.
芭芭拉告诉我，她的父亲不仅从这本书中赚到了足够的钱来买一栋又大又漂亮的房子，带他的妻子去欧洲度假，他们还去看歌剧，她还说，绍伯格收到了一箱又一箱的读者来信，感谢他并请求进一步的指导。
In rereading the book all these years later, I still remembered the stuff about how to travel to the furthest reaches of the galaxy through mind power.
多年后重读这本书，我仍然记得如何通过意念前往银河系最远的地方。
But what I didn't remember at all was the last chapter, chapter 14.
但我根本不记得最后一章，第14章。
In the book's introduction, Schaumberger promises that in the final chapter he would reveal nothing short of the meaning of life.
在书的引言中，绍伯格承诺在最后一章他将揭示生命的意义。
What could be of less interest to an 11-year-old?
对于一个 11 岁的孩子来说，还有什么不那么感兴趣的呢？
And what does the chapter contain?
本章包含哪些内容？
It outlines the 10 actions for leading a good life-- the joy of giving, humility, working, caring, fidelity, sufficiency, calmness, learning, meditation, and reverence.
它概述了过上美好生活的十项行动——给予的快乐、谦逊、工作、关怀、忠诚、充足、平静、学习、冥想和敬畏。
Nothing flashy, no ultras, just the golden rule kind of stuff.
没有什么华而不实的东西，没有极端的东西，只有黄金法则之类的东西。
I asked Barbara why she thought her father included all this straightforward do unto others kind of thing with nigh a single ultra in sight.
我问芭芭拉，为什么她认为她的父亲把所有这些直接对他人做的事情都包括在内，几乎是一个极端。
I think he believed in that quite passionately, and that would have been the only platform he had.
我认为他非常热情地相信这一点，而这将是他拥有的唯一平台。
And if there was anything that would transform their lives, it wasn't going to be gained by chanting.
如果有什么可以改变他们的生活，那也不是通过念诵就能实现的。
It would be gained by living your life according to some basic principles of decency.
它可以通过按照一些基本的正派原则生活来获得。
"Chapter 14 is the last stage in Ultra-Psychonics," wrote Schaumberger.
“第 14 章是超灵能的最后一个阶段，”绍伯格写道。
"It is the culmination of many long and arduous years of research.
“这是多年漫长而艰辛的研究的结晶。
Please do not try to read it now.
请不要尝试现在阅读它。
You will not be able to understand it until you have mastered the rest of the book.
在您掌握本书的其余部分之前，您将无法理解它。
But once you are ready for it, I think you will find it to be one of the most profound and rewarding experiences in your life."
但一旦你做好准备，我想你会发现这是你一生中最深刻、最有价值的经历之一。”
Of all the chapters in Schaumberger's book, it's this last one that might be the hardest of all to master.
在绍伯格书中的所有章节中，最后一章可能是最难掌握的。
It's the chapter with the fewest instructions.
这是说明最少的章节。
And, on some days, I still don't feel quite ready for it.
而且，有时候，我仍然觉得还没有准备好。
Jonathan Goldstein is the author of a number of books, including Ladies and Gentlemen, the Bible.
乔纳森·戈尔茨坦是多本书的作者，其中包括《女士们先生们》、《圣经》。
Coming up, how to properly use monkeys-- yes, monkeys, I said monkeys-- for the betterment of your family.
接下来，如何正确使用猴子——是的，猴子，我说猴子——为了让你的家人过得更好。
That's in a minute.
就在一分钟之内。
From Chicago Public Radio, when our program continues.
来自芝加哥公共广播电台，当我们的节目继续进行时。
This American Life, I'm Ira Glass.
这个美国生活，我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Each week on our program, of course, we choose a theme and bring you different kinds of stories on that theme.
当然，我们的节目每周都会选择一个主题，并为您带来有关该主题的不同类型的故事。
Today's show, magic words.
今天的节目，神奇的话语。
They're used for good, they're used for evil.
它们被用来行善，也被用来作恶。
We wish that they're going to work.
我们希望他们能够发挥作用。
We cross our fingers and we wait to see if they will work.
我们祈祷它们是否有效。
We've arrived at act two of our program.
我们已经进入了计划的第二幕。
Act Two, Rainy days and Mondays.
第二幕，雨天和星期一。
According to the Alzheimer's Association, every 67 seconds, somebody in the United States develops the disease.
据阿尔茨海默病协会称，美国每 67 秒就有一人患上这种疾病。
We're at this point with Alzheimer's where almost everybody has had some sort of personal experience with the disease, through a spouse or a parent or a friend.
我们现在正面临阿尔茨海默氏症，几乎每个人都通过配偶、父母或朋友有过某种与这种疾病有关的个人经历。
And because we've had that direct experience, we all know how scary Alzheimer's can be.
因为我们有过这种直接的经验，所以我们都知道阿尔茨海默氏症有多么可怕。
The thing you hear a lot is the emotional toll of taking care of parents and spouses.
你经常听到的是照顾父母和配偶的情感损失。
And you hear about the cost.
你听说过费用。
But there is this other, more basic challenge.
但还有另一个更基本的挑战。
People don't talk about this as much, but it must be a problem that everyone close to the disease struggles with.
人们不太谈论这个问题，但这肯定是每个与这种疾病有密切关系的人都在努力解决的问题。
And that is what are we supposed to talk about with our relatives who have Alzheimer's.
这就是我们应该与患有阿尔茨海默氏症的亲戚谈论的内容。
What do we talk about?
我们谈论什么？
The same stuff we always have?
我们总是有同样的东西？
Did they tell you Jenny and Joe are moving to Florida?
他们告诉你珍妮和乔要搬到佛罗里达了吗？
No. Sharon Joe got a promotion and they're going to go to Florida.
不。莎朗·乔升职了，他们要去佛罗里达州。
Sharon Stobbe is sitting on the back porch of her sister's home with her mom, Virginia.
莎朗·斯托比 (Sharon Stobbe) 和她的妈妈弗吉尼亚 (Virginia) 坐在她姐姐家的后门廊上。
You were in Florida.
你当时在佛罗里达。
Ira Glass Sharon says to her mom, you were in Florida.
艾拉·格拉斯·莎伦对她妈妈说，你在佛罗里达州。
Where were you?
当时你在哪里？
Virginia Let me think.
维吉尼亚 让我想想。
I can't remember.
我不记得了。
This is a little off mic.
这有点偏离麦克风。
She says, do you remember who you were with.
她说，你还记得你和谁在一起吗？
I was with Betty.
我和贝蒂在一起。
Oh, dear.
哦亲爱的。
Sharon And you met somebody there.
莎伦 你在那里遇见了一个人。
Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday.
周一、周二、周三、周四、周五。
Dad.
爸爸。
Dad is the answer Sharon's searching for.
爸爸就是莎伦寻找的答案。
My father, your husband.
我的父亲，你的丈夫。
Sharon didn't go into this conversation trying to play some memory game with her mom.
莎伦进入这次谈话并不是想和她妈妈玩一些记忆游戏。
She just kind of fell into that.
她就是陷入了这样的境地。
And it's easy to see how, right?
很容易看出如何实现，对吧？
You love your mom, you want to spend time with your mom.
你爱你的妈妈，你想和你的妈妈共度时光。
What are you going to talk about?
你要谈什么？
Shared memories are out, mutual loved ones are not remembered.
共同的记忆消失了，共同的亲人不再被记住。
Even current news, like joyful news, does not necessarily create a connection.
即使是当前的新闻，比如令人高兴的新闻，也不一定能建立联系。
Right before they sat down on the porch, Sharon's sister showed Virginia a picture of her two-week-old granddaughter, said, Mom, look how beautiful your great-granddaughter-- and Virginia looked at the picture and said, oh, no, for no clear reason at all.
就在他们坐在门廊上之前，莎伦的姐姐给弗吉尼亚看了一张她两周大的孙女的照片，说，妈妈，看看你的曾孙女多漂亮——弗吉尼亚看着照片说，哦，不，根本没有明确的理由。
Sharon has a sister named Karen.
莎伦有一个妹妹，名叫凯伦。
And Sharon's the oldest, Karen's the youngest.
莎伦是最大的，凯伦是最小的。
Virginia, the mom, was with Karen.
母亲弗吉尼亚和凯伦在一起。
And one of our producers, Chana Joffe-Walt, got interested in this experiment that Karen has been trying in their family.
我们的制作人之一查娜·乔菲-沃尔特 (Chana Joffe-Walt) 对凯伦 (Karen) 在他们家里尝试的这项实验很感兴趣。
Karen's been on a search for a new way to talk to her mom, looking for some magic words to say to her mom as her mom is losing her memory, words that will keep them connected.
凯伦一直在寻找一种与她妈妈交谈的新方式，在她妈妈失去记忆时寻找一些有魔力的话可以对她妈妈说，这些话可以让他们保持联系。
And, recently, she developed a plan, a fully formed theory of social interaction for the dementia landscape.
最近，她制定了一项计划，一个针对痴呆症景观的完整社会互动理论。
She's got rules, she's got best practices.
她有规则，有最佳实践。
It's a whole thing.
这是一整件事。
And she thinks it can work.
她认为这可行。
Here's Chana Joffe-Walt to explain.
查纳·乔夫-沃尔特 (Chana Joffe-Walt) 对此进行了解释。
Karen didn't have the plan in place when her mom first moved in with her, but she has wanted a plan from day one.
当凯伦的妈妈第一次搬来和她一起住时，凯伦还没有制定计划，但她从第一天起就想要一个计划。
Day one, there was just this constant stream of questions that never had definitive answers, like can I leave my mom at home alone, or what am I supposed to do when she wakes up at 2:00 in the morning and starts getting dressed?
第一天，不断出现的问题从未得到明确的答案，比如我可以把妈妈独自留在家里吗？或者当她凌晨 2:00 起床并开始穿衣服时我应该做什么？
What about when she wants another bowl of ice cream?
当她想要另一碗冰淇淋时怎么办？
And I remind her that she has diabetes, but she forgets that she has diabetes.
我提醒她她患有糖尿病，但她忘记了她患有糖尿病。
See, Karen is a person who likes structure.
看，凯伦是一个喜欢结构的人。
The lawless do-it-yourself nature of home dementia care never sat well with her.
家庭痴呆症护理的无法无天、自己动手的性质让她很不舒服。
Karen would do what she thought was right, take the ice cream away, and her mom would lose it, scream at her.
凯伦会做她认为正确的事情，把冰淇淋拿走，然后她妈妈就会把它丢掉，对她尖叫。
This is a woman who never had a cruel word to say about anyone, who considered shoot a swear word.
这是一个从来没有对任何人说过残酷的话的女人，她认为开枪是脏话。
She would look right into Karen's eyes and say you're a supreme [BLEEP], you know that?
她会直视凯伦的眼睛，说你是至高无上的[BLEEP]，你知道吗？
I had this moment where I Googled the rules of caregiving for someone with Alzheimer's.
有一次我在谷歌上搜索了老年痴呆症患者的护理规则。
And I thought-- I wondered, for some reason, if they were even out there, if there was some.
我想——出于某种原因，我想知道他们是否就在那里，是否有一些。
And when I read one of them that said, literally, step into their world, I went, bam.
当我读到其中一篇文章说，从字面上看，走进他们的世界时，我去了，砰。
Step into their world was a familiar phrase to Karen from the many nights she had spent doing improv comedy.
“走进他们的世界”是凯伦在许多个夜晚进行即兴喜剧表演时所熟悉的一句话。
She and her husband are actors.
她和她的丈夫都是演员。
Step into their world is a mantra in improv.
走进他们的世界是即兴创作的口头禅。
You walk on stage, another actor says something, and you step into their world, whatever world they have just created.
你走上舞台，另一位演员说了些什么，然后你就走进了他们的世界，无论他们刚刚创造了什么世界。
You don't ever say no, you don't question their premise.
你永远不会说不，你不会质疑他们的前提。
You just say yes.
你只要说是的。
And--
还有——
I didn't even see it.
我什至都没看到。
I didn't see the whole parallels of improv and Alzheimer's.
我没有看到即兴表演和阿尔茨海默病的全部相似之处。
And when I did, it was-- it was just so obvious.
当我这样做时，它是如此明显。
It's a whole "yes, and" world.
这是一个完整的“是的，并且”的世界。
If all you've got is "yes, and," you can't say things like, but you don't even like pickles, or you don't have a sister, Mom.
如果你只能说“是的，而且”，你就不能说这样的话，但是你甚至不喜欢泡菜，或者你没有妹妹，妈妈。
You don't tell someone they're wrong, which Karen says is exactly what you always want to do.
你不会告诉别人他们错了，凯伦说这正是你一直想做的事情。
Like when her mom says she wants to go home, the most natural response is--
就像当她妈妈说她想回家时，最自然的反应是——
Oh, but this is your home now, Virginia.
哦，但现在这是你的家了，弗吉尼亚。
Come, let me show you me your room.
来吧，让我带你看看你的房间。
But this woman is looking at you, saying, I want to go home, and you're telling her she lives here.
但是这个女人看着你，说，我想回家，而你却告诉她她住在这里。
So, now, you're telling her she's a liar, so you're going to see her little veins start popping out in her neck and her little fists.
所以，现在，你告诉她她是个骗子，所以你会看到她的脖子和小拳头上的小血管开始突出。
But if you look at her and you say-- she says I want to go home.
但如果你看着她，你说——她说我想回家。
Yes, and tell me about your home.
是的，告诉我你的家。
Now, she's not a liar anymore.
现在，她不再是个骗子了。
Karen felt like she had discovered an instruction manual.
凯伦觉得她发现了一本说明书。
Here was a way into a relationship with her mom if she just followed some basic rules of engagement, rules she conveniently already knew.
如果她遵循一些基本的交往规则，这是与她妈妈建立关系的一种方式，这些规则她很容易就已经知道了。
And so did her husband, Mondy, who was glad to have some guidelines for how to relate to this new roommate.
她的丈夫蒙迪也是如此，他很高兴能得到一些关于如何与这位新室友相处的指导。
It's like improv, Karen explained.
凯伦解释说，这就像即兴表演。
You love improv.
你喜欢即兴表演。
That's when I was like, OK, that's cool.
那时我就想，好吧，那很酷。
I know how to do that, and that's what I'll do.
我知道该怎么做，这就是我要做的。
For Karen, using the tools of improv meant when her mom, Virginia, sees monkeys out the window, don't correct her.
对于凯伦来说，使用即兴创作的工具意味着当她的妈妈弗吉尼亚看到窗外的猴子时，不要纠正她。
But Mondy-- Mondy took the whole thing to the next level.
但蒙迪——蒙迪将整件事提升到了一个新的水平。
When Virginia sees monkeys, Mondy sees them too.
当弗吉尼亚看到猴子时，蒙迪也看到它们。
He told me, oh, yeah, just the last time that happened, I said--
他告诉我，哦，是的，就在上次发生的时候，我说——
It's pretty early in the season for monkeys.
对于猴子来说，现在还很早。
Didn't even know actually that they were here in North Carolina.
甚至不知道他们实际上在北卡罗来纳州。
Oh, there's not a lot of them, but they're pretty busy now.
哦，虽然人不多，但是现在很忙。
Well, if you see one again, we should try and capture it because that would be a blast to have in the house.
好吧，如果你再次看到它，我们应该尝试捕捉它，因为这在房子里会是一场爆炸。
You can't keep monkeys in the house.
房子里不能养猴子。
Well, we could-- you just have to train them right and give them pants, because if they don't have pants-- I mean, it's-- that's just a barbarian's monkey.
好吧，我们可以——你只需正确训练他们并给他们裤子，因为如果他们没有裤子——我的意思是，那只是——那只是野蛮人的猴子。
We can't have monkeys in the house.
我们家里不能养猴子。
All right, all right, so I guess you're making up a rule that we can't have monkeys in the house.
好吧，好吧，所以我猜你是在制定一条规定，房子里不能养猴子。
Yes, I am, but she would-- at some point, there's something in her mind that's going we're not being serious now about monkeys in the house.
是的，我是，但她会——在某些时候，她心里有一些想法，我们现在对房子里的猴子不认真了。
And it's fun for her?
这对她来说很有趣吗？
Mondy And it's fun for her, yeah.
蒙迪：这对她来说很有趣，是的。
Yeah, she's definitely having a good time.
是的，她肯定玩得很开心。
For years, the staff in nursing homes and dementia care experts advised families to keep your loved ones with you, mentally speaking.
多年来，疗养院的工作人员和痴呆症护理专家建议家人从精神上来说，让亲人陪伴在身边。
Remind them who they are, where they're from, show them pictures of your family.
提醒他们他们是谁，来自哪里，给他们看你家人的照片。
Hang orientation boards everywhere that say today is August 15, the weather is overcast, the president is Barack Obama.
到处都挂着方向牌，上面写着今天是8月15日，天气阴沉，总统是巴拉克·奥巴马。
But recently, the experts have changed course.
但最近，专家们改变了方针。
And in the last decade or so, things like validation therapy are what's in.
在过去十年左右的时间里，诸如验证疗法之类的东西正在流行。
Caregivers are encouraged to listen, respond, try to live in their reality instead of trying to pull them over into yours.
我们鼓励看护者倾听、回应、尝试生活在他们的现实中，而不是试图将他们拉入你的现实。
Basically, exactly what Karen and Mondy stumbled into on their own.
基本上，这正是凯伦和蒙迪自己偶然发现的。
Most people find it pretty challenging to interact in this way.
大多数人发现以这种方式互动非常具有挑战性。
But for Mondy and Karen, it's not hard.
但对于蒙迪和凯伦来说，这并不难。
Mondy does it all the time without thinking.
蒙迪总是不假思索地这样做。
What a day.
多么美好的一天啊。
Virginia It's strange that when you get up the mountain, it's much lighter in the sky.
维吉尼亚 奇怪的是，当你上了山时，天空就亮了很多。
I'm very-- I'm very noticeable.
我非常——我非常引人注目。
You are very noticeable.
你非常引人注目。
Virginia Thanks.
弗吉尼亚 谢谢。
I've noticed you before.
我以前就注意到过你。
Chana Joffe-Walt Virginia points to the family terrier, Gus, tearing around the backyard, digging holes.
查纳·乔夫-沃尔特·维吉尼亚指着家养的小猎犬格斯，它在后院里乱窜、挖洞。
He's digging for his life.
他正在为自己的生活而挖掘。
Mondy Oh, yeah, Gus is busy working on his caverns.
蒙迪 哦，是的，格斯正在忙着修缮他的洞穴。
You're starting a coal mine.
你正在开办一个煤矿。
So he's going to get it started, and you're going to finish it up, right?
所以他要开始，你要完成，对吗？
The coal mine?
煤矿？
I never worked in a coal mine.
我从未在煤矿工作过。
I know.
我知道。
Chana Joffe-Walt Mondy says, but I need you to now.
查纳·乔夫-沃尔特·蒙迪说，但我现在需要你。
I need your help finishing up the mine.
我需要你的帮助来完成矿井的建设。
Gotta get out there and find some coal, so we can pay out these bills.
必须出去找到一些煤炭，这样我们才能支付这些账单。
Virginia gleefully refuses, so Mondy says, oh, well, we'll have to shut down the whole operation then.
弗吉尼亚兴高采烈地拒绝了，所以蒙迪说，哦，好吧，那么我们就必须关闭整个行动。
All right, Gus.
好吧，格斯。
No, she doesn't want to go in, man.
不，她不想进去，伙计。
Stop digging.
别再挖了。
Mondy All right, stop digging.
蒙迪 好吧，别挖了。
No digging.
不挖。
No, no, no. Chana Joffe-Walt This is a family all doing something together, sharing the same reality, the reality of closing down the coal mine in the backyard.
不，不，不。 Chana Joffe-Walt 这是一家人在一起做某事，分享着同样的现实，即关闭后院煤矿的现实。
When you're with your family, your parents or uncles, say, Thanksgiving, think about how much time you spend collectively recalling things.
当你和家人、父母或叔叔在一起时，比如感恩节，想想你花了多少时间来集体回忆事情。
Remember when mom laughed so hard the juice came out of her nose?
还记得妈妈笑得鼻涕都流出来了吗？
Remember when dad got in that crash?
还记得爸爸出车祸的时候吗？
Or did I ever tell you how you potty trained yourself because you saw your brother doing it?
或者我有没有告诉过你，你是如何训练自己如厕的，因为你看到你哥哥这样做了？
It's nice to share memories, makes you feel connected.
分享回忆真是太好了，让你们感觉有联系。
But, also, usually, what you're actually doing in that moment with your family is boring.
但是，通常情况下，你和家人一起做的事情也很无聊。
You're watching the game, eating chicken for dinner again.
你一边看比赛，一边又吃鸡肉当晚餐。
It's fun to recall the more dramatic moments you've shared because they are not boring, they're not boring experiences you've had together.
回忆起你们分享过的更戏剧性的时刻是很有趣的，因为它们并不无聊，它们不是你们一起经历的无聊经历。
Virginia no longer has those memories to call on.
弗吉尼亚不再有那些回忆可以唤起。
She spends a lot of her day sitting on a porch, which can't be all that interesting.
她一天大部分时间都坐在门廊上，这可没那么有趣。
But when Mondy is with her, there's literally drama.
但当蒙迪和她在一起时，简直就是戏剧性的。
They're dismantling a mine.
他们正在拆除一座地雷。
It's the most animated and happy I see Virginia all day.
这是我一整天在弗吉尼亚见到的最生气勃勃、最快乐的一天。
He'll be here in a few seconds.
几秒钟后他就会到这里。
There he is.
他就在那里。
No more caverns.
不再有洞穴了。
Mondy No more Gus caverns.
蒙迪 不再有格斯洞穴。
Mondy and Karen moved to North Carolina from Milwaukee to live with Karen's mom.
蒙迪和凯伦从密尔沃基搬到北卡罗来纳州，与凯伦的妈妈住在一起。
It was closer to the rest of the family.
它与家人的其他成员更接近。
And to Mondy, it seemed like a good time to move, but he was wrong about that in one crucial way.
对蒙迪来说，这似乎是搬家的好时机，但他在一个关键方面错了。
It was 2006, right before the economy collapsed.
那是 2006 年，经济崩溃之前。
They've found other ways to make ends meet, but Mondy left behind regular acting gigs, theater contacts, teaching jobs, just assuming that he'd find that stuff in North Carolina, which didn't happen right away.
他们找到了其他方法来维持收支平衡，但蒙迪放弃了常规的表演演出、剧院联系、教学工作，只是假设他会在北卡罗来纳州找到这些东西，但这并没有立即发生。
I'm a performer.
我是一名表演者。
I like to-- I get on stage and I do these shows and I like an audience.
我喜欢——我登上舞台，表演这些节目，我喜欢观众。
And, for a long time while I was here, I didn't get a chance to perform that much, and so I guess I just kind of focused my energy towards her.
而且，在我在这里的很长一段时间里，我没有机会表演那么多，所以我想我只是把精力集中在她身上。
Towards Virginia, his mother in law.
面向他的岳母弗吉尼亚。
Mondy says Virginia is an excellent audience.
蒙迪说弗吉尼亚是一位优秀的观众。
I never have to rein myself in, I can do anything, any kind of joke.
我从来不需要克制自己，我可以做任何事，任何笑话。
The only thing that doesn't really work is a callback.
唯一不起作用的是回调。
And when Virginia was with Mondy, this sweet woman everyone remembered started coming back.
当弗吉尼亚和蒙迪在一起时，这个每个人都记得的可爱女人开始回来。
I'll just do like the simplest thing for her, like I'll get the cream out of the refrigerator and put in the coffee and she'll say you're the nicest person in the world.
我会为她做最简单的事情，比如我从冰箱里拿出奶油，放进咖啡里，她就会说你是世界上最好的人。
And I'll go, yes, I am the nicest person in the world.
我会说，是的，我是世界上最好的人。
You're right.
你说得对。
We've got to find all the people that say I'm not the nicest person and slap them in the face, and make them agree that I'm the nicest person in the world.
我们必须找到所有说我不是最好的人的人，然后打他们的脸，让他们同意我是世界上最好的人。
And she'll find that pretty funny.
她会觉得这很有趣。
You know who doesn't find that so funny?
你知道谁不觉得这很有趣吗？
Mondy's wife, Karen.
蒙迪的妻子凯伦.
Karen told Mondy he had to find a way to perform more, outside of the house.
凯伦告诉蒙迪，他必须找到一种在屋外进行更多表演的方法。
He was driving her crazy.
他快把她逼疯了。
Yes.
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Karen's mom was fine with it, but Karen was tired of it.
凯伦的妈妈对此表示同意，但凯伦对此感到厌倦。
Their teenage daughter Grace was tired of it too.
他们十几岁的女儿格蕾丝也对此感到厌倦。
Grace is 15 years old, so when her grandmother sees something in the paper about the Beatles and says, oh, I've met them, it's like Grace is developmentally obliged to correct her.
格蕾丝已经 15 岁了，所以当她的祖母在报纸上看到有关披头士乐队的内容并说“哦，我见过他们”时，格蕾丝似乎有义务纠正她的错误。
No, you didn't.
不，你没有。
Mondy could see where they were coming from, and he did eventually get out to more auditions, got some acting work.
蒙迪可以看到他们来自哪里，他最终确实参加了更多的试镜，得到了一些表演工作。
But, by that point, Mondy was Virginia's favorite person.
但是，到那时，蒙迪是弗吉尼亚最喜欢的人。
Virginia regularly wakes up in the middle of the night and starts getting dressed.
弗吉尼亚经常在半夜醒来并开始穿衣服。
And it's Mondy who can get her back to bed.
蒙迪可以让她回到床上。
At breakfast, when Virginia wants another bowl of cereal, Karen will say to her, I'm sorry, Mom, your blood sugar will just go through the roof.
早餐时，当弗吉尼亚想要另一碗麦片时，凯伦会对她说，对不起，妈妈，你的血糖会飙升。
Virginia will sometimes reply, you're always so mean to me.
弗吉尼亚有时会回答，你对我总是那么刻薄。
Karen will try, hey, could I have that bowl of cereal?
凯伦会尝试，嘿，我可以吃那碗麦片吗？
No. Mom, how about something else?
不，妈妈，还有别的事吗？
To which Karen's mother will occasionally reply to her daughter, I hate you.
凯伦的母亲偶尔会对女儿说，我恨你。
But Mondy can swoop in there and go, hey, boy, that looks good.
但蒙迪可以猛扑过去，嘿，孩子，看起来不错。
I'm so hungry.
我好饿。
And she'd say, oh, you want this?
她会说，哦，你想要这个吗？
You can have it.
你可以拥有它。
And I'd be like you've got to be kidding me.
我会觉得你一定是在跟我开玩笑。
What the heck?
到底是什么？
What is it?
它是什么？
What is it about him that she'll do whatever for and not me?
她会为他做任何事，而不是为我做什么？
One obvious answer is Mondy's not her kid.
一个明显的答案是蒙迪不是她的孩子。
But, remember, Karen's mom has dementia.
但是，请记住，凯伦的妈妈患有痴呆症。
She doesn't always know Karen is her kid.
她并不总是知道凯伦是她的孩子。
So if they're both strangers with the same approach, same words, it may just be that Mondy does it better.
因此，如果他们都是陌生人，有相同的方法、相同的话语，那么可能只是蒙迪做得更好。
And that has created a bizarre reordering of the family dynamic.
这对家庭动态造成了奇怪的重新排序。
Karen's always been close to her mom.
凯伦和她妈妈一直很亲近。
And, now, her mom likes Mondy more.
现在，她妈妈更喜欢蒙迪了。
What do you know about Mondy?
关于蒙迪，你了解多少？
Virginia Mondy?
维吉尼亚·蒙迪？
Couldn't be a nicer fellow, very nice guy.
不能是一个更好的人了，非常好的人。
Very kind and very nice.
非常友善，非常好。
He's just crazy sometimes, makes you laugh.
他有时很疯狂，让你发笑。
Virginia is sitting with Mondy on the back porch.
弗吉尼亚和蒙迪坐在后廊上。
It's the end of the day.
今天结束了。
Karen's finishing up the dishes inside.
凯伦正在把里面的菜吃完。
And when she's done, she wanders out back.
当她完成后，她就往回走。
And this is what she walks into.
这就是她走进去的地方。
What else should I tell him that he is?
我还应该告诉他什么？
Oh, didn't I say that-- that he's wonderful?
哦，我不是说过——他很棒吗？
I did.
我做到了。
I said he was-- Karen Did you say he was good looking?
我说他是-- 凯伦 你说他好看吗？
Oh, he knows I know-- I mean, he is.
哦，他知道我知道——我是说，他知道。
He's handsome.
他很帅。
No. Karen Because what-- what do you say sometimes?
不，凯伦 因为什么——你有时会说什么？
What do you say sometimes?
有时你会说什么？
If I say, Mondy, you forgot to take out the trash, you say, poor Mondy.
如果我说，蒙迪，你忘了倒垃圾，你会说，可怜的蒙迪。
Everything is poor Mondy.
一切都是可怜的蒙迪。
Just for those little things.
就为了那些小事。
Karen Mondy could walk in and have blood all over him and say I just killed a man.
凯伦·蒙迪可以走进来，浑身是血，然后说我刚刚杀了一个人。
Oh, poor Mondy's got blood on his shirt.
哦，可怜的蒙迪衬衫上沾满了血。
That's Mom.
那是妈妈。
Poor Mondy.
可怜的蒙迪。
We were keeping count at one point how many poor Mondys would happen in a day.
我们曾一度统计一天内会发生多少可怜的蒙迪。
Well, I like Mondy a lot.
嗯，我很喜欢蒙迪。
Karen Grace and I were trying to get-- I was trying to get some poor Karens.
凯伦·格蕾丝和我试图找到一些可怜的凯伦斯。
I couldn't get any poor Karens.
我找不到可怜的凯伦斯。
I know.
我知道。
I just want a little bit of poor Karen.
我只想要一点可怜的凯伦。
Here is how deep Virginia's love is for Mondy.
由此可见弗吉尼亚对蒙迪的爱有多深。
She has inserted him into her own childhood memories, the most vivid memories she still has-- swimming, riding in a fishing boat.
她把他放进了她自己的童年记忆中，她至今还记得最清晰的记忆——游泳、乘渔船。
In Virginia's telling, Mondy was there for all of it.
在弗吉尼亚的讲述中，蒙迪全程都在场。
He was there with her on the boat, swimming in the water, traveling the country.
他和她一起在船上，在水中游泳，周游全国。
Not her husband, not Karen, Mondy.
不是她的丈夫，不是凯伦，蒙迪。
He shows up in every significant event in her life she still remembers.
她还记得，他出现在她生命中的每一个重大事件中。
Like Forrest Gump, Mondy says.
蒙迪说，就像《阿甘正传》一样。
Meanwhile, Virginia has completely forgotten Karen's childhood.
与此同时，弗吉尼亚完全忘记了凯伦的童年。
Again, a lot of the time, she's not quite sure who Karen is.
同样，很多时候，她不太确定凯伦是谁。
And, sometimes, she's not even sure she likes her.
而且，有时，她甚至不确定自己是否喜欢她。
Like the other night, Karen was trying to get Grace to bed, and Grace was stalling.
就像那天晚上一样，凯伦试图让格蕾丝上床睡觉，但格蕾丝却拖延着。
Just a few more minutes kind of thing, and I said, Grace, come on.
再等几分钟之类的事情，我说，格蕾丝，来吧。
I said, no, you need to get up-- who are you to tell her to no?
我说，不，你需要起床——你是谁，敢告诉她不？
And I said, well, you know, I'm her mom.
我说，好吧，你知道，我是她妈妈。
No, you're not, you liar.
不，你不是，你这个骗子。
And I was just like-- and Grace was like she is, and I was, Grace, just go-- and so, all the way up, Grace was like, that is my mom.
我就像——格蕾丝就像她一样，我是，格蕾丝，走吧——所以，一路向上，格蕾丝就像，那是我的妈妈。
That's my mom.
那是我妈妈。
And I'm like, well, she is my daughter, and she's your granddaughter.
我想，好吧，她是我的女儿，她是你的孙女。
What?
什么？
No, she's not.
不，她不是。
I said, OK, and I couldn't help myself, but I said, well, who do you think she is?
我说，好吧，我情不自禁，但我说，好吧，你认为她是谁？
Well, that's mine.
嗯，那是我的。
I said, oh, OK.
我说，哦，好吧。
Who am I?
我是谁？
I don't know.
我不知道。
You had nowhere to live and I took you in, so you should be thankful.
你无处可住，我收留了你，你应该感恩。
Well, I am.
嗯，我是。
Thank you for taking me in.
谢谢你接纳我。
In a moment like that, the rules that Karen set up require that she deny who she is, that she is Karen, daughter of Virginia, mother of Grace, who grew up in Texas with a loving family.
在这样的时刻，凯伦制定的规则要求她否认自己是谁，她是弗吉尼亚的女儿、格蕾丝的母亲凯伦，她在德克萨斯州一个充满爱的家庭中长大。
If Karen wants to do her plan right, she can't be that person in her own home.
如果凯伦想正确执行她的计划，她就不能成为自己家里的那个人。
Starting each moment with a blank slate is easy for Mondy.
对于蒙迪来说，每时每刻都从零开始很容易。
It's fun to create a world out of nothing with this person, as he gets to know her better.
随着他对这个人越来越了解，和这个人一起从无到有地创造一个世界是很有趣的。
But, for Karen, every interaction asks her to erase who she is.
但是，对于凯伦来说，每次互动都要求她抹去自己的身份。
When my mom sits there and she says, strawberries, they just make me think of home, my mind goes immediately to growing up in Texas and her and I and dad going out to this huge strawberry field and picking strawberries.
当我妈妈坐在那里，她说，草莓，它们让我想起了家，我的思绪立刻就想到了在德克萨斯州长大，她、我和爸爸去这片巨大的草莓地采摘草莓。
And there is this piece that you just go, that you have to let that memory go.
有这样一段你必须要离开的片段，你必须放弃那段记忆。
Because what you want to say is, oh, yeah, I remember.
因为你想说的是，哦，是的，我记得。
Remember we used to go to such--
记得我们曾经去过这样的地方——
That's not what she wants to talk about right then.
她现在不想谈这个。
And you want to go, but what about me?
你想去，但我呢？
Because you want your own mother to have those memories about you and to talk about your experiences.
因为你希望你自己的母亲拥有关于你的那些记忆并谈论你的经历。
But Karen doesn't say the words she wants to say.
但凯伦没有说出她想说的话。
She says different ones, the ones she's supposed to say.
她说的是不同的话，那些她应该说的话。
Really, Mom?
真的吗，妈妈？
Where was it?
它在哪里？
Was it out by the cemetery?
是在墓地旁边吗？
Yeah, how'd you know?
是啊，你怎么知道？
Karen And you go on and listen to the story.
凯伦 你继续听故事。
While silently letting go of the memory that came before, letting go of the old scene, and trying to be ready for what comes next.
同时默默地放下之前的记忆，放下旧的场景，努力为接下来的事情做好准备。
Chana Joffe-Walt is one of the producers of our show.
查纳·乔夫·沃尔特 (Chana Joffe-Walt) 是我们节目的制片人之一。
Karen and Mondy now offer workshops on how to use the tools of improv with people who have dementia, including a special course on how to do that if those people are your parents.
凯伦和蒙迪现在提供关于如何对痴呆症患者使用即兴创作工具的研讨会，其中包括一门关于如何在这些人是你的父母的情况下做到这一点的特别课程。
Find them at in-themoment.com.
在 in-themoment.com 上找到它们。
That's in-themoment.com.
那是 in-themoment.com。
Act Three, Pescatarian.
第三幕，鱼素者。
So there's this podcast that a bunch of us here at the radio show listen to that's put out by Slate.
Slate 推出了这个播客，我们广播节目中的一些人都在听。
It's hosted by Mike Pesca, who you may have heard of in the past reporting on sports for NPR.
该节目由迈克·佩斯卡 (Mike Pesca) 主持，您可能在过去的 NPR 体育报道中听说过他。
This podcast, though, is not about sports.
不过，这个播客与体育无关。
It is about everything, about 30 minutes a day.
内容涉及一切，每天大约 30 分钟。
Often about the news, though just as often not about the news.
通常与新闻有关，但也常常与新闻无关。
I think what makes it special is just the sheer joy, the gleeful, articulate energy that Mike Pesca marshals in thinking about and dissecting the world around him.
我认为它的特别之处在于迈克·佩斯卡在思考和剖析周围世界时所表现出的纯粹的快乐、快乐、清晰的能量。
The theme today on our radio show is magic words.
今天我们广播节目的主题是魔语。
And I thought of Pesca today because when he is not explaining what poker can tell us about missile defense systems or filling us in on the country in Africa that is doing really, really well, Mike Pesca is somebody who seems to take great pleasure in noticing words, how people use words, and especially the misuse of words.
我今天想到了佩斯卡，因为当他没有解释扑克可以告诉我们有关导弹防御系统的什么信息，也没有向我们介绍这个做得非常非常好的非洲国家时，迈克·佩斯卡似乎很高兴注意到词语、人们如何使用词语，尤其是词语的误用。
For example, there was this day when Pesca heard about some new menu items at Red Lobster and he heard a phrase he simply could not let pass.
例如，有一天，佩斯卡听说了红龙虾店的一些新菜单，他听到了一句话，他根本无法放过。
So I just found out that Red Lobster has introduced lobster-topped entrees.
所以我刚刚发现红龙虾推出了龙虾主菜。
However, I want you to listen to this commercial.
不过，我想让你听听这个广告。
About 18 seconds in, and I think you will see and hear the part where the space time crustacean continuum gets a little bent.
大约 18 秒后，我想你会看到并听到时空甲壳动物连续体稍微弯曲的部分。
How did Red Lobster makes four amazing entrees even better?
红龙虾是如何让四道令人惊叹的主菜变得更加美味的？
With lobster.
配龙虾。
Like savory new fire-grilled shrimp topped with maritime lobster in a citrus hollandaise or the new ultimate lobster-topped lobster.
就像美味的新火烤虾配上海洋龙虾配柑橘荷兰酱或新的终极龙虾配龙虾。
Three split--
三分——
Did you hear what the dude said?
你听到那家伙说的话了吗？
Lobster-topped lobster.
龙虾顶上的龙虾。
Isn't that just a bigger lobster?
这不就是一只更大的龙虾吗？
The one thing you can't top a lobster with is another lobster.
你不能在一只龙虾上放另一只龙虾。
You can't top a thing with more of the thing.
你无法用更多的东西来超越一件事。
It's not the top, it's just the thing.
这不是顶级，这只是事情。
Cherry on top, that makes sense.
樱桃放在上面，这是有道理的。
Cherry on top of a sundae.
圣代上面的樱桃。
You know what cherry on top doesn't make sense?
你知道上面的樱桃是什么没有意义吗？
Cherry on top of a bunch of other cherries.
樱桃放在一堆其他樱桃上面。
Just more cherries.
多吃点樱桃就好了
This is why--
这就是为什么——
I have to say I usually hate it when people go on and on about using the right word.
我不得不说，我通常讨厌人们不断地谈论使用正确的词。
That is not something I usually enjoy.
这不是我通常喜欢的事情。
I don't care about that.
我不在乎这个。
But Pesca's delight I find totally contagious.
但我发现佩斯卡的喜悦完全具有感染力。
I end up repeating what he says about this stuff to my friends and my loved ones.
我最终向我的朋友和我所爱的人重复了他关于这件事的说法。
One day, he got on to the phrase, "toot your own horn." He said he'd been listening to the previous day's podcast in the interest of quality control.
有一天，他听到了“自吹自擂”这句话。他说，为了质量控制，他一直在听前一天的播客。
And, you know, I just got the sense that I was tooting my own horn.
而且，你知道，我只是觉得我在自吹自擂。
A horn was being tooted and I indeed was both the tooter and the tootee.
有人吹响号角，而我确实既是吹喇叭的人，又是被吹喇叭的人。
But I really got to thinking about that phrase.
但我真的不得不思考这句话。
I would like to take two ticks to tutor you in the term to toot one's own horn.
我愿意花两滴时间来辅导你们在学期中自吹自擂。
It is a strange phrase.
这是一个奇怪的短语。
It is a logically inconsistent phrase.
这是一个逻辑上不一致的短语。
Tooting your own horn has an opposite number, and that is to be hoisted by one's own petard.
自吹自擂还有相反的说法，那就是搬起石头砸自己的脚。
To be hoisted by one's own petard actually makes sense.
搬起石头砸自己的脚，其实是有道理的。
I mean, it is antiquated language.
我的意思是，这是过时的语言。
It was coined by Shakespeare, but a petard is a small bomb.
它是莎士比亚创造的，但 petard 是一种小炸弹。
So to be hoisted by one's own petard means to be blown up by a bomb blown into the air.
因此，“自爆”意味着被炸到空中的炸弹炸毁。
It's a good phrase.
这是一个很好的短语。
A bomb normally meant for someone else blows up in your own face, lifts you high off the ground, Ashton Kutcher peeks out from behind the curtain.
一枚通常是为别人准备的炸弹在你脸上爆炸，将你从地面上高高举起，阿什顿·库彻从窗帘后面向外看去。
You've been hoisted.
你已经被举起来了。
Great expression, I love it.
很棒的表情，我喜欢。
But a horn is not meant for someone else to play.
但圆号并不是供其他人演奏的。
The expression "toot one's own horn" should instead center on a situation where you're forced to operate for yourself a device that was meant to be operated by another, right?
“自吹自擂”这个表达应该集中于这样一种情况：你被迫自己操作一个本应由他人操作的设备，对吗？
So a more sensible alternative would be, hey, listen, I don't need to hold my own ladder, or, look, I'm not trying to cut my own hair over here, or, listen, I'm not trying to tuck myself in at night, or, far be it for me to hand start my own prop airplane, or I don't want to self-operate a two-handed cross cut saw, or I'm not one to spot myself while bench pressing.
所以一个更明智的选择是，嘿，听着，我不需要拿着自己的梯子，或者，听着，我不想在这里剪自己的头发，或者，听着，我不想在晚上把自己塞进被子里，或者，我根本不想用手启动自己的螺旋桨飞机，或者我不想自己操作一把双手横切锯，或者我不是一个在卧推时发现自己的人。
Or even you could stick with the musical, if you want.
或者如果你愿意的话，你甚至可以坚持看音乐剧。
Hey, I'm not trying to play dueling banjos as a solo.
嘿，我不想独奏班卓琴决斗。
And another thing, speaking of the musical.
还有一件事，说到音乐剧。
Ever think of Louis Armstrong in this situation?
在这种情况下有没有想过路易斯·阿姆斯特朗？
How does Louis Armstrong humble brag about his own promise?
路易斯·阿姆斯特朗如何谦虚地吹嘘自己的承诺？
Can't say anything about not tooting his own horn.
不能说什么不自吹自擂。
And toot?
还有嘟嘟？
Really, toot?
真的吗，嘟嘟？
Did Miles Davis toot?
迈尔斯·戴维斯有吹笛吗？
Did Dizzy Gillespie toot?
迪兹·吉莱斯皮有嘟嘟声吗？
To toot one's own horn is a low form of self-aggrandizement.
自吹自擂是一种低级的自我膨胀。
In fact, it should be more accurately seen as a form of self-mid-sizement at best.
事实上，更准确地说，它充其量应该被视为一种自我中等规模的形式。
Pesca does know where that phrase "tooting your own horn" comes from.
佩斯卡确实知道“自吹自擂”这句话的出处。
It comes from a king.
它来自一位国王。
A king enters a room, there's trumpeters, there's fanfare.
国王进入房间，号手吹奏，号角声响起。
Others toot the horns for the king.
其他人则为国王吹响号角。
Tooting your own horn in that situation would be very-- well, kind of pathetic.
在那种情况下自吹自擂是非常——嗯，有点可悲的。
But Pesca says, today, those are not the horns we think of when we think of horns.
但佩斯卡说，今天，当我们想到喇叭时，我们想到的并不是这些喇叭。
The phrase does not hold.
这句话不成立。
And he called for a moratorium.
他呼吁暂停。
Or if you will,
或者如果你愿意的话
A moratootium.
暂停。
Ira Glass So one more, right?
艾拉·格拉斯 再来一张，对吗？
On a Monday just after an outbreak of the Ebola virus hit-- serious story, right-- Pesca was talking about how the news had been covered on television.
埃博拉病毒爆发后的周一——严肃的故事，对吧——佩斯卡正在谈论电视是如何报道这一新闻的。
Over the weekend, the Sunday talk shows had been full of talk of a killer virus, maybe out of control.
整个周末，周日的脱口秀节目都在谈论一种可能失控的杀手病毒。
Was the public at risk?
公众面临危险吗？
People were asking this over and over.
人们一遍又一遍地问这个问题。
And Pesca was parsing out what was said and what was not said.
佩斯卡正在分析说过的话和没说的话。
George Stephanopoulos was interviewing Dr. Tom Frieden.
乔治·斯蒂芬诺普洛斯正在采访汤姆·弗里登博士。
He runs the CDC.
他负责疾控中心。
And I'm going to use the opportunity to play something that we sometimes play, talk show karaoke, wherein I assume the role of a guest on the talk show.
我将利用这个机会玩一些我们有时玩的东西，脱口秀卡拉OK，其中我扮演脱口秀嘉宾的角色。
We'll have the host ask the question and I'll answer the question how I wish the guest would have.
我们将让主人提出问题，我将按照我希望客人回答的方式回答问题。
Let's go to George Stephanopoulos' question.
让我们来回答乔治·斯特凡诺普洛斯的问题。
And, Dr. Frieden, as you know, a lot of anxiety here in the United States about the spread of Ebola, whether we're taking an unnecessary risk.
弗里登博士，正如你所知，美国对埃博拉病毒的传播感到非常焦虑，我们是否正在冒不必要的风险。
A tweet that Donald Trump put out just the other day, he said that the US must immediately stop all flights from Ebola-infected countries, or the plague would start and spread inside our borders.
唐纳德·特朗普日前发布推文称，美国必须立即停止来自埃博拉病毒感染国家的所有航班，否则瘟疫将在我们境内爆发和蔓延。
Act fast.
快行动吧。
How do you respond to that?
你对此有何回应？
I'm glad you asked, George.
我很高兴你问这个问题，乔治。
First, a little bit about myself.
首先，简单介绍一下我自己。
I, Tom Frieden, have a master's degree in public health from Columbia.
我，汤姆·弗里登，拥有哥伦比亚大学公共卫生硕士学位。
I did my residency at Yale.
我在耶鲁大学完成了住院医师实习。
I've been an epidemiologist in the field for many years.
我多年来一直是该领域的流行病学家。
I've contained outbreaks of measles and typhoid and tuberculosis, as you know.
如你所知，我控制住了麻疹、伤寒和肺结核的爆发。
For the last four years, I've been with the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention as its director.
在过去的四年里，我一直在疾病控制与预防中心担任主任。
It is the foremost facility of its kind in the world.
它是世界上同类设施中最先进的。
So that's about me.
这就是我的情况。
Now let me tell you a little bit about Donald Trump and his qualifications.
现在让我告诉你一些关于唐纳德·特朗普和他的资历的信息。
Donald Trump, the man whose opinions on contagious diseases you asked me to comment on, is in real estate.
唐纳德·特朗普（Donald Trump）是一位从事房地产行业的人，你请我评论他对传染病的看法。
He also owned the New Jersey Generals, the Eastern Airline Shuttle, the Miss USA Pageant, and was executive producer of the reality TV show The Apprentice.
他还拥有新泽西将军队、东方航空公司、美国小姐选美比赛，并且是电视真人秀节目《学徒》的执行制片人。
A catchphrase from that show, The Apprentice, is contained in the following Trump quote about comedian Rosie O'Donnell.
特朗普在谈到喜剧演员罗西·奥唐纳时引用了该剧《学徒》中的一句口号。
Quote, "I'd look her right that fat ugly face that hers and I'd say, Rosie, you're fired."
引用：“我会看着她那张又肥又丑的脸，然后我会说，罗西，你被解雇了。”
An interesting coincidence from both of our biographies, I lived in India for five years, where I fought disease, Donald Trump owned a Casino that he called the Taj Mahal, took it into bankruptcy.
我们两本传记中有一个有趣的巧合，我在印度生活了五年，在那里我与疾病作斗争，唐纳德·特朗普拥有一家他称之为泰姬陵的赌场，然后将其破产。
Also, Donald Trump unsuccessfully sued for $5 million after proving that his father was not, in fact, an orangutan.
此外，唐纳德·特朗普在证明他的父亲实际上不是猩猩后，起诉要求赔偿 500 万美元，但未成功。
And while all of this does go to Donald Trump's overall credibility, in the specific area of scientific credibility, let me remind you that Richard Besser has called Donald Trump's mistaken beliefs on the causes of autism, quote, "shameful."
尽管所有这些确实影响了唐纳德·特朗普的整体可信度，但在科学可信度的具体领域，让我提醒您，理查德·贝塞尔称唐纳德·特朗普对自闭症病因的错误信念是“可耻的”。
Now, who is Richard Besser, you ask?
现在，你问理查德·贝瑟是谁？
Ah, that you'd ask that, because not 45 seconds ago, here was your introduction of this discussion that we're having right now.
啊，你会问这个问题，因为不到 45 秒前，这是你对我们现在正在进行的讨论的介绍。
And joining us now from Atlanta, the head of the Centers for Disease Control, Dr. Tom Frieden, and our own, Dr. Richard Besser, also veteran of the CDC--
现在从亚特兰大加入我们的是疾病控制中心主任汤姆·弗里登博士，以及我们自己的理查德·贝瑟博士，他也是疾病预防控制中心的资深人士——
Richard Besser is your network's chief health and medical editor.
理查德·贝瑟 (Richard Besser) 是您的网络的首席健康和医学编辑。
He said that following Trump's advice, quote, "can kill children." So, again, your question is, what do I think of Donald Trump's tweet?
他说，听从特朗普的建议，“可能会杀死儿童”。那么，你的问题又是，我对唐纳德·特朗普的推文有何看法？
I just want to go back to a little bit about my biography again.
我只想再次回顾一下我的传记。
I have over 200 peer-reviewed articles published in scientific journals.
我在科学期刊上发表了 200 多篇经过同行评审的文章。
But, again, the question for me to respond to Donald Trump's tweet that the US should stop all flights from Ebola-infected countries, so I guess I'll say this in response to that question, George.
但是，再次，我要回答唐纳德·特朗普的推文，即美国应该停止来自埃博拉感染国家的所有航班，所以我想我会这样回答这个问题，乔治。
I should answer Donald Trump's take on science as soon as Donald Trump is asked to comment on my opinion that he is a pompous, overbearing, ignorant windbag who lusts for attention the way a meth-addicted prostitute lusts for his next fix.
当唐纳德·特朗普被要求评论我的观点时，我应该立即回答唐纳德·特朗普对科学的看法，即他是一个浮夸、专横、无知的空谈家，他渴望得到关注，就像一个吸毒成瘾的妓女渴望下一次治疗一样。
And to use an analogy from my profession, the media acts as an unwashed Petri dish that allows this particular nasty virus to thrive.
用我的职业来比喻，媒体就像一个未经清洗的培养皿，让这种特殊的令人讨厌的病毒得以繁殖。
Perhaps a less incendiary way of me putting this would be to say--
也许我用一种不那么煽动性的方式来表达这一点是——
Well, Ebola's scary.
嗯，埃博拉病毒很可怕。
And it's understandable that with a deadly disease, people are concerned.
人们对一种致命疾病的担忧是可以理解的。
But the plain truth is that we can stop Ebola.
但显而易见的事实是我们可以阻止埃博拉病毒。
We know how to control it, hospital infection control and stopping it at the source in Africa.
我们知道如何控制它，在非洲控制医院感染并从源头阻止它。
So that last part, that's what Dr. Frieden did say.
最后一部分，这就是弗里登博士所说的。
It was probably smarter than what I should have said.
这可能比我应该说的更聪明。
Anyway, that guy is too important to pick media fights with Donald Trump.
无论如何，这个人太重要了，不能与唐纳德·特朗普进行媒体斗争。
He already has one seemingly unstoppable plague to wrestle with.
他已经面临着一场看似无法阻挡的瘟疫需要应对。
If words really were magic, in all fairness, Donald Trump would vanish from the earth in a puff of smoke after that.
如果文字真的有魔力，那么平心而论，唐纳德·特朗普将会在一阵烟雾中从地球上消失。
The podcast is called The Gist, Mike Pesca.
该播客名为 The Gist，Mike Pesca。
It's free, it's daily, five days a week.
它是免费的，每天都有，每周五天。
Find it at Slate.com, or anywhere you find your podcasts.
您可以在 Slate.com 或任何您可以找到播客的地方找到它。
Our program was produced today by Jonathan Menjivar, with Alex Blumberg, Ben Calhoun, Sean Cole, Stephanie Foo, Chana Joffe-Walt, Sarah Koenig, Miki Meek, Brian Reed, Robyn Semien, Alissa Shipp, and Nancy Updike.
我们今天的节目由 Jonathan Menjivar 与 Alex Blumberg、Ben Calhoun、Sean Cole、Stephanie Foo、Chana Joffe-Walt、Sarah Koenig、Miki Meek、Brian Reed、Robyn Semien、Alissa Shipp 和 Nancy Updike 共同制作。
Our senior producer for this episode was Julie Snyder.
我们本集的高级制片人是朱莉·斯奈德。
Production help from Louise Sullivan.
路易斯·沙利文 (Louise Sullivan) 提供制作帮助。
Seth Lind is our director of operations.
塞思·林德 (Seth Lind) 是我们的运营总监。
Emily Condon's our production manager.
艾米丽·康登是我们的生产经理。
Elise Bergerson's our business operations manager.
Elise Bergerson 是我们的业务运营经理。
Kimberly Henderson as our office coordinator.
Kimberly Henderson 担任我们的办公室协调员。
Research help today from Michelle Harris.
米歇尔·哈里斯今天提供研究帮助。
Music help from Rob Geddes.
罗布·格迪斯 (Rob Geddes) 提供音乐帮助。
[ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS] Jake Halpern's book about debt that I talked about at the beginning of the program is called Bad Paper-- Inside the Secret World of Debt Collectors.
[鸣谢] 我在节目开始时谈到的杰克·哈尔彭（Jake Halpern）关于债务的书名为《坏纸——追债者的秘密世界》。
Our website, thisamericanlife.org.
我们的网站 thisamericanlife.org。
This American Life is delivered to public radio stations by PRX, the Public Radio Exchange.
《美国生活》由公共广播电台 PRX 向公共广播电台播出。
Thanks, as always, to our program's co-founder, Mr Torey Malatia, who says it is all right if people want to bring their dogs to the office.
一如既往地感谢我们项目的联合创始人托里·马拉蒂亚 (Torey Malatia) 先生，他说如果人们想带狗去办公室也没关系。
You just have to train them right and give them pants.
你只需要正确训练他们并给他们裤子。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Back next week with more stories of This American Life.
下周我们将带来更多《美国生活》的故事。
[MUSIC - "ABRA-CA-DABRA" BY THE DEFRANCO FAMILY]
[音乐 - DEFRANCO 家族的“ABRA-CA-DABRA”]
This American Life This American Life is produced in collaboration with WBEZ Chicago and delivered to stations by PRX The Public Radio Exchange.
This American Life This American Life 与 WBEZ Chicago 合作制作，并由 PRX 公共广播电台传送到各电台。