508: Superpowers - This American Life
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00:00 00:00 Transcript Share This American Life Life Partners How to Listen Episodes Recommended About Overview Staff Announcements Fellowships Jobs Music Make Radio On The Road FAQ Submissions Merch Contact Us Our Other Shows Merch Follow Us Life Partners Subscribe to our newsletter Full episode Toggle Audio and Transcript Sync Transcript | Episode #508 | May 19, 2023 508: Superpowers Note: This American Life is produced for the ear and designed to be heard.
00:00 00:00 文字记录 分享此 美国生活 生活伙伴 如何收听 剧集 推荐 关于 概述 员工公告 奖学金 工作 音乐 在路上制作电台 常见问题解答 提交 商品 联系我们 我们的其他节目 商品 关注我们 生活伙伴 订阅我们的时事通讯 整集 切换音频和文字记录同步 文字记录 | 内容第 508 集 | 2023 年 5 月 19 日 508：超能力 注：《美国生活》是为耳朵而制作，旨在让人们听到。
If you are able, we strongly encourage you to listen to the audio, which includes emotion and emphasis that's not on the page.
如果可以的话，我们强烈建议您收听音频，其中包括页面上没有的情感和重点。
Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors.
文字记录是使用语音识别软件和人工转录员结合生成的，可能包含错误。
Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print.
请在印刷版引用前检查相应的音频。
Prologue Ira Glass When we were weak, we told ourselves we were strong.
序言 艾拉·格拉斯 当我们软弱时，我们告诉自己我们很坚强。
And sometimes, if we were very weak, we told ourselves we were very, very strong.
有时，如果我们非常软弱，我们就会告诉自己我们非常非常坚强。
I mean unquestionably, I was by far the most loathed member of my class, I think, you know?
我的意思是，毫无疑问，我是班上最令人讨厌的成员，我想，你知道吗？
Being a pasty, unathletic kid who was weird looking and probably seemed overly eager, so, you know.
作为一个面色苍白、缺乏运动能力的孩子，他看起来很奇怪，而且可能看起来过于渴望，所以，你知道。
And I had friends that would come over on the weekends to play.
我有朋友周末会过来玩。
But then at school, they would ignore me and pretend like they didn't know me.
但到了学校，他们就会无视我，假装不认识我。
And so when he was little, Chris Ware-- the guy you were just hearing-- spent a lot of time thinking about superpowers.
所以当克里斯·韦尔（Chris Ware）——你刚才听到的那个人——小时候，花了很多时间思考超能力。
He drew superheroes over and over, trying to get them right.
他一遍又一遍地画超级英雄，试图把它们画对。
He always wondered where somebody could find a radioactive animal like the one that bit Peter Parker and turned him into the amazing Spider-Man.
他总是想知道哪里可以找到像咬了彼得·帕克并把他变成了神奇蜘蛛侠的那种放射性动物。
And a couple of times, Chris thought that he might be developing his own superpowers-- real ones.
有几次，克里斯认为他可能正在发展自己的超能力——真正的超能力。
There was one morning where I was standing under the shower.
有一天早上，我站在淋浴下。
And of course, when you get in immediately because you're so cold, the water is extremely hot by contrast.
当然，当你因为太冷而立即进入水中时，相比之下水却非常热。
So you have the cold water turned up.
所以你已经打开了冷水。
And as you stand in there, you get used to it, and you turn the cold water down.
当你站在那里时，你就会习惯它，然后把冷水关小。
And I was in there for a very long time.
我在那里呆了很长一段时间。
And I remember turning the cold, and it wouldn't go any farther.
我记得我感冒了，但就没有再继续下去了。
And I thought, well, that's weird.
我想，这很奇怪。
It must be stuck.
一定是卡住了。
And I turned it more, and it wouldn't go any farther.
我又把它转了几圈，它就再也转不动了。
And I realized I was standing under completely hot water, but it felt fine to me.
我意识到我正站在完全热水下，但对我来说感觉很好。
It actually felt warm, almost cool.
实际上感觉很温暖，几乎是凉爽的。
And the longer I stood there, it felt cooler and cooler.
我站在那里的时间越长，感觉就越凉爽。
And the only explanation I could come up with is that I had developed the ability to withstand extraordinary heat.
我能想到的唯一解释是我已经具备了承受异常高温的能力。
And, of course, we'd just run out of hot water.
当然，我们的热水也用完了。
But at that time, I didn't know that that happened.
但当时我并不知道发生了这样的事情。
I thought hot water was an endless commodity.
我认为热水是取之不尽用之不竭的商品。
He invented his own superhero called the Hurricane, who could shoot blasts of wind from his hands and was drawn with huge, manly muscles.
他发明了自己的超级英雄，名为飓风，可以从手中喷射出一阵风，并拥有巨大的、有男子气概的肌肉。
He made a Hurricane costume that he could wear himself-- red t-shirt with a black circle with an H on it, and a mask that his mom made for him, and a yellow cape.
他做了一套自己可以穿的飓风服装——红色T恤，上面有一个黑色圆圈，上面有一个H，还有他妈妈为他做的面具，还有一件黄色斗篷。
You know, some kids really go for a cape.
你知道，有些孩子真的很喜欢斗篷。
There were a few times where I actually came to school with bits of a superhero costume secreted under my school uniform.
有几次，我真的带着一些超级英雄服装来学校，校服下面藏着一些超级英雄服装。
I don't exactly know why.
我不知道为什么。
I guess I thought it was like it was going to give me some sense of power or something.
我想我以为这会给我某种力量感或其他什么。
But of course, then I have gym class, you know?
当然，然后我有体育课，你知道吗？
So you have to change your clothes, so I don't know what I was thinking.
所以你必须换衣服，所以我不知道我在想什么。
There was one time I actually-- this is sort of peripherally superhero, but I'd actually drawn circuit boards on pieces of paper, like the Bionic Man, the $6 Million Man.
有一次，我实际上——这有点像超级英雄，但我实际上在纸上画了电路板，比如仿生人、价值 600 万美元的人。
And I'd actually taped them on my legs to look like real circuitry exposed, as if I had mechanical legs or something like that.
我实际上把它们贴在我的腿上，看起来就像真实的电路暴露出来，就好像我有机械腿或类似的东西一样。
So I guess I vaguely thought that somebody would catch a glimpse of it and think, wow.
所以我想我隐隐约约地认为有人会瞥见它并想，哇。
Look.
看。
He's bionic,
他是仿生人，
Some of us, we spend a long, long time hoping that we're more than what the world thinks of us.
我们中的一些人花了很长很长的时间希望自己能够超越世界对我们的看法。
And so of course we're drawn to these stories of these mild-mannered guys who, underneath their clothes, wear a costume in secret with powers nobody suspects.
因此，我们当然会被这些彬彬有礼的家伙的故事所吸引，他们在衣服下面秘密穿着一件服装，拥有无人怀疑的力量。
And when we get older, it all seems ridiculous, of course.
当然，当我们长大后，这一切看起来都很荒谬。
It seems really, really dumb.
看起来真的非常非常愚蠢。
It's embarrassing.
真尴尬。
Chris Ware, though, went on to draw cartoons for his living.
不过，克里斯·韦尔继续以画漫画为生。
But the cartoons that he draws are like novels.
但他画的漫画就像小说一样。
They're graphic novels about real people.
它们是关于真实人物的图画小说。
And anytime a Superman type shows up in one of his cartoons, he's always somebody trying to con kids with a costume and a cape.
每当超人类型出现在他的一部动画片中时，他总是试图穿着服装和斗篷来欺骗孩子。
He's always a disappointment.
他总是让人失望。
It's just more interesting that way.
这样才更有趣。
I think he's more like a real dad that way, I guess.
我认为他更像是一个真正的父亲，我想。
And the more I draw him, the fatter he gets too, and the more bald he gets, I guess.
我越画他，他就越胖，我猜他也秃得越多。
I mean, if you were Superman, too, you're like-- you know, what do you care what you look like?
我的意思是，如果你也是超人，你会想——你知道，你在乎你的样子吗？
You wouldn't be all handsome.
你不会全都是帅哥。
You'd just eat whatever you felt like.
你想吃什么就吃什么。
You'd take whatever you wanted.
你想要什么就拿什么。
And you'd end up looking really terrible after a while, I think.
我想，过了一段时间你就会变得非常糟糕。
If I was a superhero, I think I would probably-- I mean, who's going to criticize you?
如果我是一个超级英雄，我想我可能会——我的意思是，谁会批评你？
Well, today on our radio program, superpowers-- four real life stories about how easy it is to be caught up in the dream of them.
好吧，今天在我们的广播节目《超级大国》中，讲述了四个现实生活中的故事，讲述他们是多么容易陷入梦想。
From WBEZ Chicago, it's This American Life.
来自芝加哥 WBEZ 的《This American Life》。
I'm Ira.
我是艾拉。
Glass.
玻璃。
As the super-villains say, silence, miscreant.
正如超级反派所说，沉默，恶棍。
Our program has begun.
我们的计划开始了。
So we now present a kind of super contest for you, beloved super listener, between two ancient superpowers-- two of the superpowers which have fascinated humans since antiquity.
因此，我们现在为您呈现一场超级竞赛，亲爱的超级听众，在两个古老的超级大国之间进行——这两个自古以来就让人类着迷的超级大国。
And actually, this is kind of a super Rorschach test.
事实上，这是一种超级罗夏墨迹测试。
John Hodgman has been conducting an unscientific survey, posing for people a very simple choice.
约翰·霍奇曼一直在进行一项不科学的调查，为人们提出了一个非常简单的选择。
Flight versus invisibility.
飞行与隐形。
This question is only for you.
这个问题只针对你。
Whichever you pick, you'll be the only person in the world to have that particular superpower.
无论你选择哪一个，你都将成为世界上唯一拥有这种特殊超能力的人。
You can't have both.
你不能两者兼得。
Which do you choose?
你选择哪个？
I started wondering about this a few years ago.
几年前我开始思考这个问题。
I'd bring it up at parties, dinners, wedding receptions.
我会在聚会、晚宴、婚宴上提起它。
It was more interesting to ask than where people worked or where they went to school and clearly more fun to answer.
询问比人们在哪里工作或在哪里上学更有趣，而且显然回答也更有趣。
Like a magic word, shazam, flight versus invisibility would instantly change an evening's character, opening passionate conversation and debate.
就像一个神奇的词“shazam”一样，“飞行”与“隐形”会立即改变当晚的气氛，引发激烈的对话和辩论。
But what surprised me more was how quickly everyone would choose, as though they had been thinking about it for a long time.
但更让我惊讶的是，大家的选择速度之快，就好像他们已经考虑了很久一样。
Everyone knew exactly which superpower they wanted and what they would do with it.
每个人都清楚地知道他们想要哪种超能力以及他们会用它做什么。
Their plans weren't always flashy or heroic.
他们的计划并不总是华而不实或英雄的。
In fact, they almost never were.
事实上，他们几乎从未如此。
If I could fly, the first thing I would do is fly into the bar, check out what's going on there, fly back home.
如果我能飞，我要做的第一件事就是飞进酒吧，看看那里发生了什么，然后飞回家。
I would attach my baby to me and fly to a doctor's appointment at 11:30 and fly right back.
我会把宝宝抱在身上，然后在 11:30 乘飞机去看医生，然后立即飞回来。
Then I think I would fly to Atlantic City.
然后我想我会飞往大西洋城。
I would imagine if it got around that I had the power of flight, and it was a rare type of thing, I mean, there would definitely be flight groupies.
我想象如果我有飞行的能力，这是一种罕见的事情，我的意思是，肯定会有飞行追星族。
I would imagine.
我会想象。
So there's going to be just, like, oh, yeah.
所以就会有，就像，哦，是的。
I just slept with a flying dude.
我刚刚和一个会飞的家伙睡过
You know?
你知道？
But people are just like, oh, score.
但人们就像，哦，得分。
I'd go into Barney's.
我会去巴尼店。
I'd pick out the cashmere sweaters that I like.
我会挑选我喜欢的羊绒衫。
I'd go into the dressing room.
我会走进更衣室。
The woman says, how many items?
女人说，有多少东西？
I say five.
我说五个。
I go into the dressing room.
我走进更衣室。
I put those five sweaters on, and I summon my powers of invisibility in the dressing room.
我穿上那五件毛衣，然后在更衣室里召唤出我的隐形能力。
I turn invisible.
我变得隐形。
I walk out, leaving her to wonder why there's a tag hanging from the door that says five and no person inside.
我走出去，留下她想知道为什么门上挂着一个标签，上面写着“五个”，而且里面没有人。
So you would become a thief pretty quickly?
那么你很快就会成为小偷吗？
Immediately, until I had all the sweaters that I wanted.
立即，直到我得到了我想要的所有毛衣。
And then I would have to think of other things to do.
然后我就不得不考虑其他事情要做。
Typically, this is how it goes.
通常情况下，事情就是这样的。
People who turn invisible will sneak into the movies or onto airplanes.
隐形的人会潜入电影或飞机上。
People who fly stop taking the bus.
乘坐飞机的人不再乘坐公共汽车。
Here's one thing that pretty much no one ever says.
这是一件几乎没有人说过的事情。
I would use my power to fight crime.
我会利用我的力量打击犯罪。
No one seems to care about crime.
似乎没有人关心犯罪问题。
I don't think I would want to spend a lot of time using my power for good.
我不认为我愿意花很多时间去善用我的力量。
I mean, if I don't have super strength, and I'm not invulnerable, then, I mean, would be very dangerous.
我的意思是，如果我没有超强的力量，而且我也不是刀枪不入，那么，我的意思是，将会非常危险。
If you had to.
如果你必须这样做的话。
rescue somebody from a burning building or something like that, you might catch on fire.
从燃烧的建筑物或类似的地方救人，你可能会着火。
Just having flight I don't think is necessarily quite enough because you don't have the super strength.
我认为仅仅飞行并不一定足够，因为你没有超强的力量。
I'd still be weak when I got there, I guess.
我想，当我到达那里时，我仍然很虚弱。
I don't fight crime now, and people without superpowers do.
我现在不打击犯罪，而没有超能力的人会打击犯罪。
So sure, in theory, yes.
所以理论上来说，是的。
But I'm not a-- I mean, what can I do as a-- I mean, either one of those-- you see, you need a whole package because there's not much you can do with any one thing.
但我不是——我的意思是，我能做什么——我的意思是，其中任何一个——你看，你需要一整套，因为你对任何一件事都无能为力。
I'd go to Paris, I suppose.
我想我会去巴黎。
Well, may-- you know, I could be a Going-to-Paris Man, that sort of a superhero.
好吧，也许——你知道，我可能会成为一个去巴黎的人，那种超级英雄。
Going-to-Paris Man is not a superhero.
去巴黎的人不是超级英雄。
And I have to say this drove me crazy a little bit.
我不得不说这让我有点抓狂。
We are, after all, talking about superpowers.
毕竟，我们正在谈论超级大国。
Why not take down organized crime, bring hope to the hopeless, swear vengeance on the underworld, if only a little bit?
为什么不打击有组织的犯罪，给绝望的人带来希望，发誓向黑社会复仇，哪怕只是一点点？
I proposed a variety of sample scenarios along these lines, such as, how would you handle a mad genius taking over the Empire State Building or a group of terrorists hijacking an overseas flight?
我沿着这些思路提出了各种示例场景，例如，你将如何处理一个疯狂的天才占领帝国大厦或一群恐怖分子劫持海外航班？
And what I learned is some people should simply not be fighting crime.
我了解到，有些人根本不应该打击犯罪。
Well, the first thing that occurs to me is I'd go sneak up behind them very low and with a knife that they didn't see and slice their Achilles tendon.
好吧，我想到的第一件事是我会悄悄地潜到他们身后，用一把他们没有看到的刀切开他们的跟腱。
Uh, no. I somehow shove a sock in their mouth, or something like that, and wrap some tape around their mouth so that they can't yell out.
呃，不。我不知何故把一只袜子塞进他们嘴里，或者类似的东西，然后用胶带缠住他们的嘴，这样他们就不能喊叫了。
It might not be a sock.
它可能不是袜子。
It might just be some napkins or something.
可能只是一些餐巾纸或其他东西。
I can't keep all this in my head.
我无法把这一切都记在心里。
I'd have to keep a bag full of stuff with me-- [LAUGHS] knives, socks, tape.
我必须随身携带一个装满东西的袋子——[笑]刀、袜子、胶带。
Do you think you would be tempted to enlist a teenage helper?
您认为您会想要招募一名青少年帮手吗？
No, I think a helper would be good, a helper with a complimentary power.
不，我觉得有个帮手就好，一个有互补能力的帮手。
There's no others-- anybody else with superpowers.
没有其他人——任何其他拥有超能力的人。
Oh.
哦。
It would just be a teenager hanging around me?
只会是一个十几岁的孩子在我身边徘徊？
No.
不。
People who consider invisibility always want to know, do I have to be naked?
考虑隐形的人总是想知道，我必须裸体吗？
People who choose flight want to know how fast.
选择飞行的人想知道飞行速度有多快。
Almost all asked, who would win in a fight, Mr. Invisible or Flying Man?
几乎所有人都在问，隐形先生和飞人谁会在战斗中获胜？
And so I had to lay down some rules.
所以我必须制定一些规则。
Invisibility means the power to become transparent at will, including your clothing, but anything you may pick up is visible.
隐形意味着可以随意变得透明的能力，包括你的衣服，但你捡到的任何东西都是可见的。
Flight means the power to fly at any altitude within the Earth's atmosphere at speeds up to 1,000 miles per hour.
飞行是指在地球大气层内任何高度以高达每小时 1,000 英里的速度飞行的能力。
But even then they start looking for loopholes, hidden catches, superpower fine print.
但即便如此，他们也开始寻找漏洞、隐藏的陷阱、超级大国的细则。
They start negotiating their dreams with me.
他们开始与我协商他们的梦想。
Now, when you're flying, if you're flying at 1,000 miles an hour at 100,000 feet, are you comfortable?
现在，当您飞行时，如果您以每小时 1,000 英里的速度在 100,000 英尺的高度飞行，您感到舒服吗？
Do you get very cold?
你觉得很冷吗？
Let's say I'm in this room, and I'm invisible.
假设我在这个房间里，而且我是隐形的。
And I'm walking around this apartment, and I'm invisible.
我在这间公寓里走来走去，却是隐形的。
And--
还有——
Yes, you-- Man 2 Do I have to be completely quiet or you guys will hear my footsteps?
是的，你-- 男人 2 我必须完全安静，否则你们会听到我的脚步声吗？
Yes.
是的。
Man 2 Because that's a pain in the ass.
男人 2 因为那真是令人痛苦。
And also someone would have to let you in.
而且还得有人让你进去。
Can I carry somebody?
我可以载人吗？
Can somebody go on my back?
有人可以坐我背上吗？
Little people, yeah.
小人物，是啊。
John Hodgman Then you can carry little people on your back.
约翰·霍奇曼 那么你就可以背着小人物了。
Done.
完毕。
Flight, it is.
飞行，确实如此。
John Hodgman This is all part of what I call the five stages of choosing your superpower.
约翰·霍奇曼 这就是我所说的选择超能力的五个阶段的一部分。
Sometimes, this process occurs in just moments.
有时，这个过程只发生在瞬间。
For example, subject A, a tallish man with glasses wedged into a cramped bar room corner begins as they all do, with stage 1-- gut reaction.
例如，受试者 A，一个戴着眼镜的高个子男人，被塞在狭窄的酒吧房间角落里，像他们所有人一样开始第一阶段——本能反应。
Initially, I would think perhaps invisibility.
最初，我认为也许是隐形。
Next comes stage 2-- practical consideration.
接下来是第二阶段——实际考虑。
Because you have the ability to walk around work, perhaps, show up at one point and perhaps go away for a little while and turn invisible, and then come back and listen to what they say about you.
因为你有能力在工作中四处走动，也许会在某一时刻出现，也许会离开一会儿然后变得隐形，然后回来听听他们对你的评价。
You have the power to spy on your exes, and that would all be enlightening, and fun, and in fact, a little bit perverted.
你有能力监视你的前任，这会很有启发，很有趣，但事实上，有点变态。
You hear that doubt in his voice?
你从他的声音中听到了怀疑吗？
That's the beginning of stage 3-- philosophical reconsideration.
这是第三阶段的开始——哲学反思。
That would-- I believe it would be-- it would immediately turn into a life of complete depression.
那会——我相信会的——它会立即变成完全抑郁的生活。
You wouldn't be able to really share with anyone, you know?
你无法真正与任何人分享，你知道吗？
And I know there would be some problems with the perversion thing.
我知道性变态会带来一些问题。
Invisibility leads me, as an invisible person, down a dark path, because you're not going want to miss out when you're invisible on-- you know, no matter how many times you've seen a woman naked in a shower, you're going to want to see it again because there's always a different woman, right?
隐形让我，作为一个隐形人，走上了一条黑暗的道路，因为当你隐形时，你不会想错过——你知道，无论你在淋浴中看到一个女人裸体多少次，你都会想再次看到它，因为总会有一个不同的女人，对吧？
And there's just like a lifetime of that.
这就像一生一样。
And that's not acceptable behavior, no matter whether you're invisible or not.
无论你是否隐形，这都是不可接受的行为。
So who chooses invisibility, and who chooses flight?
那么谁选择隐身，谁选择飞行？
In my experience, though there are lots of exceptions, men lean toward flying, women to invisibility.
根据我的经验，尽管有很多例外，但男性倾向于飞行，女性倾向于隐身。
And many brood anxiously over their choice, switching from one to the other and back again.
许多人焦急地思考自己的选择，从一种切换到另一种，然后再切换回来。
And that's because more than the ability, say, to burst into flame or shoot arrows with uncanny accuracy, flight and invisibility touch a nerve.
这是因为，除了能够以惊人的准确度爆发火焰或射箭之外，飞行和隐形还触动神经。
Actually, they touch two different nerves, speak to very different primal desires and unconscious fears.
事实上，它们触及两种不同的神经，诉说着截然不同的原始欲望和无意识的恐惧。
One superpower is about something that's obvious, and the other is about something that is hidden.
一种超能力是关于明显的东西，另一种是关于隐藏的东西。
I think that indicates your level of shame.
我认为这表明了你的羞耻程度。
How do you mean?
你是什么意思？
Christine A person who chooses to fly has nothing to hide.
Christine 选择飞行的人没有什么可隐瞒的。
A person who'd choose to be invisible wants clearly to hide themselves.
一个选择隐身的人显然想要隐藏自己。
Do you feel that you want to hide yourself?
你觉得你想隐藏自己吗？
I want to-- I'd like to not-- I'm not going to answer that question.
我想——我不想——我不会回答这个问题。
It all has to do with guile.
这一切都与诡计有关。
Wanting to be invisible means that you're a more guileful person.
想要隐形意味着你是一个更狡猾的人。
If you want to fly, it means you're guileless.
如果你想飞，就说明你天真无邪。
And I think the reason that I'm so conflicted about flying versus invisibility is that I have guile, but I really wish that I didn't.
我认为我对飞行和隐形如此矛盾的原因是我有狡猾，但我真的希望我没有。
Flight is the hero-- selfless, and competent, and unashamed.
飞行是英雄——无私、能干、无耻。
And invisibility, the villain.
还有隐形，恶棍。
Almost everyone I talked to called invisibility the sneakier power.
几乎所有与我交谈过的人都称隐形能力为偷偷摸摸的力量。
Flying is for people who want to let it all hang out.
飞行适合那些想要让一切都闲逛的人。
Invisibility is for fearful, crouching masturbators.
隐形是为那些害怕、蹲着的自慰者准备的。
First of all, I think that a lot of people are going to tell you that they would choose flight.
首先，我想很多人会告诉你他们会选择飞行。
And I think they're lying to you.
我认为他们在骗你。
I think they're saying that because they're trying to sound all mythic and heroic, because the better angels of our nature would tell us that the real thing that we should strive for is flight and that that's noble and all that kind of stuff.
我认为他们这么说是因为他们试图让自己听起来充满神话和英雄气概，因为我们本性中更好的天使会告诉我们，我们应该努力追求的真正目标是飞行，这是高贵的，诸如此类的东西。
But I think actually, if everybody were being perfectly honest with you, they would tell you the truth, which is that they all want to be invisible so that they can shoplift, get into movies for free, go to exotic places on airplanes without paying for airline tickets, and watch celebrities have sex.
但我认为实际上，如果每个人都对你完全诚实，他们会告诉你真相，那就是他们都想隐形，这样他们就可以去商店行窃，免费看电影，不用付机票钱就可以乘飞机去异国他乡，观看名人做爱。
Anyone faced with this choice in their heart of hearts will choose invisibility?
任何一个人内心深处面临这样的选择，都会选择隐身吗？
Yes, or they have this sort of inflated, heroic, mythical concept of themselves, and that in fact, they're not really giving it very much practical thought.
是的，或者他们对自己有这种夸大的、英雄的、神话般的概念，而事实上，他们并没有真正给予它太多实际的思考。
In the end, it's not a question of what kind of person flies and what kind of person fades.
归根结底，不是什么样的人飞翔，什么样的人衰落的问题。
We all do both.
我们都做。
Perhaps that's why, when I put the choice to myself, I'm hopelessly, completely stuck.
也许这就是为什么，当我把选择权交给自己时，我完全陷入了困境。
At the heart of this decision the question I really don't want to face is this-- who do you want to be?
在这个决定的核心，我真正不想面对的问题是——你想成为谁？
The person you hoped to be, or the person you fear you actually are?
你希望成为的人，还是你担心自己实际上是的人？
Don't rush into it.
不要急于这么做。
Think it over.
想一想。
Which would you choose?
你会选择哪个？
John Hodgman is the author of many fine books.
约翰·霍奇曼是许多优秀书籍的作者。
His latest is called Vacationland: True Stories from Painful Beaches.
他的最新作品名为《度假胜地：来自痛苦海滩的真实故事》。
Act Two, Wonder Woman.
第二幕，神奇女侠。
OK.
好的。
What are the ways to create a superhero?
塑造超级英雄的方法有哪些？
Gamma rays, space alien abduction, prison experiment, or a NASA flight gone awry.
伽马射线、太空外星人绑架、监狱实验或美国宇航局的一次飞行出了差错。
And then there's the idea of a list.
然后就是一个列表的想法。
Is it possible that a to-do list is powerful enough to achieve this incredible result?
一个待办事项列表是否有足够的力量来实现这个令人难以置信的结果？
Hmm.
唔。
Kelly McEvers met somebody who tried.
凯莉·麦克埃弗斯遇到了一个尝试过的人。
We met in a bar in Flagstaff, Arizona.
我们在亚利桑那州弗拉格斯塔夫的一家酒吧见面。
I'd just moved back from Cambodia, and I was going out for one of my first beers back in the States.
我刚从柬埔寨搬回来，正打算出去喝我回到美国后的第一杯啤酒。
Not long into the first one, I noticed this Amazon of a woman with huge blond and red-streaked hair and frosty lips, wearing a short, red tank dress and at least 50 bracelets.
第一个刚开始不久，我就注意到了一位亚马逊女人，她有着巨大的金色和红色条纹的头发和冷漠的嘴唇，穿着一件红色背心短裙，戴着至少 50 个手镯。
She's six feet tall and showing a lot of leg.
她身高六英尺，露出大长腿。
People at the bar swivel their heads to watch her every move.
酒吧里的人都转着头注视着她的一举一动。
She stands next to me to order a drink and in this throaty voice says, what are those?
她站在我旁边点了一杯饮料，用沙哑的声音说，那些是什么？
Pointing to my cigarettes.
指着我的香烟。
I tell her they're Cambodian.
我告诉她他们是柬埔寨人。
Her eyes light up, and she shoots out a long, tanned arm and points at a table in the corner.
她的眼睛一亮，伸出一条晒黑的长臂，指着角落里的一张桌子。
She orders me there.
她命令我去那里。
Before I can say no, I'm following her to my seat.
在我能拒绝之前，我已经跟着她到了我的座位上。
She tells me she's an international private investigator, a bounty hunter, and a bail bonds enforcer, and that her name is Zora.
她告诉我她是一名国际私家侦探、赏金猎人和保释债券执行者，她的名字叫佐拉。
I sit there for hours listening to her.
我坐在那里听她讲了好几个小时。
Within a week, she takes me to Las Vegas.
一周之内，她带我去了拉斯维加斯。
We drive there in her red Mustang.
我们开着她的红色野马车去那里。
As always, there's a Colt .380 under the driver's seat and a .45 Megastar in the trunk.
与往常一样，驾驶座下有一把 Colt 0.380，后备箱里有一把 0.45 Megastar。
In Vegas, we skip the casinos and head straight for the male strip clubs where Zora drops at least $200 on lap dances from buff guys with names like Roman.
在维加斯，我们跳过赌场，直接前往男性脱衣舞俱乐部，在那里，佐拉至少要花 200 美元才能从像罗曼这样的健壮男人那里跳上膝上舞。
Her get-up is the same as before-- teased hair, jewelry, and the ubiquitous tank dress-- which, I realize, is the best way to show off her tattoos.
她的装扮和以前一样——挑逗的头发、珠宝和无处不在的背心裙——我意识到，这是炫耀她纹身的最好方式。
One is this big circle with blue and white swirls in it, kind of like a bowling ball on her left shoulder.
一个是这个大圆圈，里面有蓝色和白色的漩涡，有点像她左肩上的保龄球。
Every guy she meets asks her about it.
她遇到的每个男人都会问她这个问题。
And when they hear her answer, they sometimes propose marriage.
当他们听到她的回答时，有时就会求婚。
Turns out the tattoo is a magic globe she holds in her dreams.
原来纹身是她梦中持有的一个魔法地球仪。
And in these dreams, it gives her superpowers.
在这些梦中，它赋予了她超能力。
Ever since I remember, I've had the dreams.
自从我记事起，我就一直有梦想。
And they're very vivid, but it varies.
它们非常生动，但又各不相同。
It usually involves fighting, sometimes with guns, sometimes with superhero powers-- lightning from my fists, and all that.
它通常涉及战斗，有时用枪，有时用超级英雄的力量——我的拳头发出闪电，等等。
And I usually have super strength, and I can fly, and I have all those things, right?
而且我平时力量超强，还能飞，这些东西我都有吧？
And it's my most common set of dreams.
这是我最常见的一系列梦想。
And it varies.
而且情况各不相同。
Sometimes it's medieval.
有时它是中世纪的。
Sometimes it's futuristic.
有时它是未来主义的。
Sometimes it's like a guerrilla war in Latin America.
有时这就像拉丁美洲的游击战。
Can you describe that Zora to me?
你能给我描述一下佐拉吗？
The Zora in the dreams?
梦中的佐拉？
Very powerful athletically, but beyond the rules of nature that this world allows.
运动能力非常强大，但超出了这个世界允许的自然规则。
So 6'5" and long-- like almost impossibly long silver hair.
6英尺5英寸那么长——就像几乎不可能长的银发。
This sort of otherworldly quality to her where her voice did not sound normal.
对她来说，这种超凡脱俗的品质让她的声音听起来不正常。
It sounded almost musical.
这听起来几乎是音乐性的。
It became something that I aspire to be-- aspire to be this sort of superhero, this sort of person who would fight for a cause.
这成为了我渴望成为的事情——渴望成为这种超级英雄，这种为某种事业而奋斗的人。
Yeah.
是的。
It was my motivation in life.
这是我人生的动力。
Ever since I was 10 or 11, I decided that that was my goal.
从我10岁或11岁起，我就决定这就是我的目标。
Zora took the dreams seriously.
佐拉认真对待这些梦想。
So seriously that, at the age of 12, she sat down and composed a list of some 30 skills she needed to learn if she wanted to become as close to a superhero as any mortal could be.
她是如此认真，以至于在 12 岁时，她坐下来列出了一份清单，列出了如果她想像任何凡人一样接近超级英雄，她需要学习的大约 30 项技能。
She even gave herself a deadline-- to master these skills by the time she was 23.
她甚至给自己设定了一个最后期限——在 23 岁之前掌握这些技能。
I know it's in these.
我知道就在这些里面
Kelly Mcevers Zora pulls out the old spiral notebook that was her diary at the age of 13 and turns to the inside back cover.
凯莉·麦克弗斯·佐拉 (Kelly Mcevers Zora) 拿出一本旧螺旋笔记本，那是她 13 岁时的日记，然后翻到封底内页。
Yep.
是的。
There's the list.
这是清单。
Kelly Mcevers Wow.
凯莉·麦克弗斯 哇。
Why don't you go ahead and read it?
你为什么不继续读一下呢？
OK.
好的。
The list included martial arts, electronics, chemistry, metaphysics, hang gliding, helicopter and airplane flying, parachuting, mountain climbing, survival--
清单包括武术、电子、化学、玄学、悬挂式滑翔、直升机和飞机飞行、跳伞、登山、生存——
--martial arts, politics-- Kelly Mcevers --each time she started a new diary, she would update the list--
——武术、政治——凯莉·麦克弗斯——每次她开始写新日记时，她都会更新清单——
--physics-- Kelly Mcevers --and write it in the back of the book.
--物理学--凯利·麦克弗斯--并将其写在书的后面。
French, Arabic, Spanish-- Kelly Mcevers Each one with the same format, each one titled, The List.
法语、阿拉伯语、西班牙语——Kelly Mcevers 每一篇的格式都相同，每一篇的标题都是“名单”。
Weaponry, rafting, scuba diving, herbology.
武器装备、漂流、水肺潜水、草药学。
Yes, I studied that.
是的，我研究过这个。
CPR, first aid and mountain emergency kind of medicine.
心肺复苏、急救和山地急救类药物。
The list also includes-- Zora Archaeology--
该清单还包括——佐拉考古学——
--bodybuilding, archery-- Zora --sailing--
--健美、射箭--佐拉--帆船--
--demolitions, and explosives.
——爆破和爆炸。
She wanted to learn how to hunt animals and track men.
她想学习如何狩猎动物和追踪人类。
This is funny.
这很有趣。
I have here major physical conditioning.
我在这里主要调理身体。
And the most incredible thing about all of this is that Zora accomplished nearly every item on the list.
最令人难以置信的是，佐拉几乎完成了清单上的每一项。
Throwing stars, and compound bows, and throwing knives, and-- yes.
飞镖、复合弓、飞刀，还有——是的。
It was a very interesting pastime.
这是一种非常有趣的消遣。
To keep up with the goals set by the list, she sped through school.
为了跟上清单上设定的目标，她加快了学业。
Starting in the seventh grade, she began completing entire school years during the summer term and finished high school by the time she was 15.
从七年级开始，她在暑期学期开始完成整个学年的学习，并在 15 岁时完成了高中学业。
She got her BA at 18, a masters at 20, and completed the coursework for a PhD in geopolitics by the time she was 21.
她 18 岁获得学士学位，20 岁获得硕士学位，21 岁时完成地缘政治学博士学位课程。
She wanted to live like Indiana Jones, spending half her time in the classroom and half her time saving the world in the jungles of Peru.
她想要像印第安纳·琼斯一样生活，一半的时间在教室里，一半的时间在秘鲁的丛林里拯救世界。
Item number 4, camel, elephant riding.
项目编号4，骑骆驼、骑大象。
Evasive driving and stunts.
躲避驾驶和特技。
When you're a kid, you have these romantic visions of what you'll be when you grow up.
当你还是个孩子的时候，你会对长大后的生活抱有浪漫的幻想。
But how many people are so diligent they commit their dreams to paper and make it their life's work to achieve them?
但有多少人如此勤奋，将自己的梦想写在纸上，并为实现这些梦想而奋斗一生呢？
How many keep a list, amending it, adding to it, ticking things off as they go along well into their adult lives?
有多少人会保留一份清单，修改它，添加它，在他们进入成年生活的过程中勾选一些事情？
After finishing the coursework for her PhD, Zora decided to quit school, disappointed at the lack of cliff-hanging adventure in her doctoral program.
完成博士学位课程后，佐拉决定退学，她对博士课程中缺乏悬而未决的冒险感到失望。
And since superheroes who live in the real world need jobs, she decided to seek employment at the only place that would allow her to put all the skills from the list to use.
由于生活在现实世界中的超级英雄需要工作，她决定在唯一能让她使用清单上的所有技能的地方寻找工作。
Zora wanted to become an agent in the CIA.
佐拉想成为中央情报局的特工。
And so began a rigorous application process-- interviews, psych exams, a three-day lie detector test.
严格的申请流程就这样开始了——面试、心理测试、为期三天的测谎仪测试。
After that, then they sent investigators out to interview me, interview my neighbors, interview ex-boyfriends, interview friends, ex-friends, former colleagues, people I work with, people I used to work with.
之后他们又派调查员去采访我，采访我的邻居，采访我的前男友，采访我的朋友，前朋友，前同事，和我一起工作的人，曾经和我一起工作的人。
They threw a question out in the middle of an interview.
他们在采访中提出了一个问题。
So what would you do in this situation?
那么在这种情况下你会怎么做？
If you were driving down the road and you had one of your native agents with you, someone who's going to give you some information, and you were in a third-world country somewhere, and you were driving a car, and you accidentally ran into a dog?
如果你在路上开车，身边有一位本地特工，他会给你一些信息，而你在第三世界国家的某个地方，你开着车，不小心撞到了一只狗？
And people have been out playing in the street, children in the street, they see their dog get killed.
人们在街上玩耍，孩子们在街上，他们看到他们的狗被杀。
And they get upset, and they rush towards the car.
他们很沮丧，冲向汽车。
What do you do in that situation?
在这种情况下你会怎么做？
You don't want to draw attention to the person who's with you.
您不想引起对与您在一起的人的注意。
So what I said was that I would tell my agent to get down lower in the car.
所以我说的是我会告诉我的经纪人在车里蹲得更低。
And I would get out of the car and draw the attention to myself and try to appease them in some way, either by giving them money, more likely, but-- and that was an acceptable answer to them.
我会下车，把注意力吸引到自己身上，并试图以某种方式安抚他们，要么给他们钱，更有可能，但是——这对他们来说是一个可以接受的答案。
That was a good answer to them.
这对他们来说是一个很好的答案。
At the time, when I was going through the process, it felt like everything was coming together.
当时，当我经历这个过程时，感觉一切都在一起了。
And I had not felt so much joy, probably ever.
我可能从来没有感受到如此多的快乐。
Absolutely not.
绝对不是。
And I would tell them that I had a sense that I could combine the whole street smarts, intellectual, the education, with the sort of adventurer personality.
我会告诉他们，我有一种感觉，我可以将整个街头智慧、知识、教育与冒险家的个性结合起来。
And I was actually told that I had the perfect personality for it and that I would do really well.
事实上，有人告诉我，我有完美的个性，而且我会做得很好。
It was like the fruition of my life, that it was going to be the step into the next-- you know, where I would be using all that list and preparation for the next phase, which would be to actually put it into practice.
这就像我生命的成果，这将是进入下一个阶段的一步——你知道，我将使用所有清单并为下一阶段做准备，这将实际付诸实践。
About eight months into the interviews, Zora got a letter saying she'd been rejected.
面试大约八个月后，佐拉收到一封信，说她被拒绝了。
She appealed over the next year and a half, partly to find out why they'd turned her down.
在接下来的一年半时间里，她提出了上诉，部分原因是为了找出他们拒绝她的原因。
But the best they could do was to tell her to try again in a few more years.
但他们最多只能告诉她几年后再试一次。
In the end, the CIA wouldn't take her, and they wouldn't even tell her why.
最后，中央情报局不带她走，甚至不告诉她原因。
Probably it took me more like two years to recover.
可能我花了两年多的时间才恢复过来。
I was a basket case.
我是一个篮子里的人。
I wasn't-- I wasn't-- I was just down, you know?
我没有——我没有——我只是情绪低落，你知道吗？
I would have to work.
我必须工作。
I couldn't concentrate.
我无法集中注意力。
Sort of slumped down, staring at the wall.
有点瘫倒在地，盯着墙壁。
I put my whole life into examination, all the years of preparation.
我把一生都投入到了考试中，投入了多年的准备。
Most of us give up our dreams of superhero adventure when we're adolescents.
我们大多数人在青少年时期就放弃了超级英雄冒险的梦想。
Zora was only getting to it at the age of 27.
佐拉 (Zora) 27 岁时才开始接触这一领域。
Here she knew how to fly a helicopter and survive in the wilderness, but for what?
在这里她知道如何驾驶直升机并在荒野中生存，但为了什么？
She devoted a lot of time to thinking about why she might have been rejected by the CIA.
她花了很多时间思考为什么她可能会被中央情报局拒绝。
Maybe it was all those months she spent with right-wing militia groups doing her doctoral research.
也许这就是她与右翼民兵团体一起度过的那些几个月进行博士研究的原因。
Maybe she shouldn't have told the CIA how she ended up in a clandestine IRA club one night while on vacation in Ireland.
也许她不应该告诉中央情报局她在爱尔兰度假的一天晚上是如何进入爱尔兰共和军秘密俱乐部的。
Maybe the CIA didn't like the fact that her father, a professor at the University of Minnesota, is an outspoken Serbian nationalist.
也许中央情报局不喜欢她的父亲，明尼苏达大学的教授，是一位直言不讳的塞尔维亚民族主义者。
Or maybe it was simply her own fault-- that she couldn't turn herself into a superhero.
或者也许这只是她自己的错——她无法把自己变成超级英雄。
I had violated the agreement of the list, violated the agreement that I made with myself, that I had not become what the archetype was, that I had become something lacking.
我违反了清单的约定，违反了我与自己达成的约定，即我没有成为原型，我已经成为了某种缺乏的东西。
The point being that my mythology should have guided me better, and it felt like such a final thing.
重点是我的神话应该更好地指导我，而这感觉就像是最后的事情。
So Zora remade herself.
于是佐拉重塑了自己。
She had been virtually isolated from other people since she was 15, when she started actively pursuing the goals on the list.
从 15 岁起，她就开始积极追求清单上的目标，几乎与其他人隔绝。
Her parents were happy she was so busy because she had no time for boys.
她的父母很高兴她这么忙，因为她没有时间照顾男孩。
But now she started working for a woman private investigator.
但现在她开始为一名女私家侦探工作。
One day when she went to court, she wore her first pair of pantyhose because she was told it would help her look more feminine.
有一天，当她出庭时，她穿上了第一双连裤袜，因为有人告诉她这会让她看起来更女性化。
Soon after, she was schooled in the sheer power of lipstick, a short skirt, and a supermodel runway walk to control the minds of others.
不久之后，她就学会了用口红、短裙和超模走秀的纯粹力量来控制别人的思想。
These days, she works for an international private investigation agency that handles these kinds of cases.
如今，她在一家处理此类案件的国际私人调查机构工作。
Child abduction retrieval custody, reverse stings, occult and ritualistic crimes-- those tend to be really interesting, I like working on those-- anti-terrorism, kidnap protection and return, counterintelligence.
儿童绑架取回监护权、反向刺杀、神秘和仪式犯罪——这些往往非常有趣，我喜欢从事这些工作——反恐、绑架保护和遣返、反情报。
She's happy doing this work.
她很高兴做这份工作。
In a typical case, Zora's agency sent her on a mission to Mexico to do what's known as a reverse scam.
在一个典型案例中，佐拉的机构派她前往墨西哥执行所谓的反向骗局。
The agency was hired by the family of a young woman who'd recently traveled there and fallen in love with a man she planned to marry after knowing him for only 10 days.
该机构受雇于一位年轻女子的家人，这位年轻女子最近去过那里，并爱上了一位认识仅十天就打算结婚的男子。
The family suspected some sort of con.
家人怀疑有某种骗局。
Zora contacted him, pretending she was looking for a girlfriend who used to work with him in the travel industry.
佐拉联系了他，假装她正在寻找一位曾经和他一起在旅游业工作的女朋友。
She took a photo of a classmate with her to begin the scam.
她拍了一张同学的照片，开始了诈骗。
I sort of played the distressed American student going to the Spanish school.
我扮演了一个去西班牙学校上学的苦恼的美国学生。
And he invited me on a couple of dates and asked me to come back for the bullfight.
他邀请我约会几次，并邀请我回来观看斗牛。
What did you wear when you went to the bullfight?
你去看斗牛时穿什么？
Oh, I wore like a little, itty-bitty skirt and a little tank top.
哦，我穿了一条小裙子和一件小背心。
I made it seem like I had plenty of money, and that interested him.
我让他看起来好像我很有钱，这让他很感兴趣。
You know, he kind of perked up at that.
你知道，他对此感到很兴奋。
He never mentioned, the whole time that I ever spent any time with him, he never mentioned that there was ever a woman.
他从来没有提到过，在我和他在一起的所有时间里，他从来没有提到过曾经有过一个女人。
I found him to be pretty emotionally open and a very romantic guy, but I honestly felt that he probably was not in love with her, that he was taking this as an opportunity to live in the United States.
我发现他在情感上非常开放，是一个非常浪漫的人，但老实说，我觉得他可能不爱她，他以此为在美国生活的机会。
And that was the report I gave.
这就是我给出的报告。
Before Zora set out for Mexico, I rode with her to the airport.
在佐拉出发前往墨西哥之前，我和她一起骑车去了机场。
We were late and hurrying through the terminal, just 10 minutes to spare, when she did the strangest thing.
我们迟到了，匆匆穿过航站楼，只剩下 10 分钟的时间，这时她做了一件最奇怪的事。
She sat down in a chair far from the gate and wouldn't move.
她坐在离大门较远的椅子上，一动不动。
I told her she was going to miss her flight, but she didn't budge.
我告诉她她会错过航班，但她没有让步。
I sat down next to her.
我坐在她旁边。
She said she was scared.
她说她很害怕。
About the case?
关于案件？
About which disguise she might wear?
她可能会穿哪种伪装？
About being found out?
会不会被发现？
No, she said.
不，她说。
She said she was afraid that when she got to Mexico, people wouldn't like her.
她说她担心当她到达墨西哥时，人们会不喜欢她。
The next time I was at her house, I hadn't noticed before, but I realized her bookshelf was packed with advice on how to build confidence-- titles like Princessa: Machiavelli for Women.
下次我去她家时，我以前没有注意到，但我意识到她的书架上堆满了如何建立自信的建议——比如《公主：女性的马基雅维利》等书。
Books like that aren't really so far from the idea of keeping a list, having an ongoing plan for self-improvement, believing that if you just put something on paper and stick to it, you can change.
像这样的书与保留清单、制定持续的自我完善计划、相信只要把一些东西写在纸上并坚持下去的想法相去不远。
I need to learn how to play tennis and golf.
我需要学习如何打网球和高尔夫球。
And my new list is windsurfing, tennis, golf.
我的新清单是风帆冲浪、网球、高尔夫。
I need to develop some kind of talent.
我需要培养某种才能。
Like I need to learn how to sing properly, or to do some kind of comedy or sketches, acting.
就像我需要学习如何正确地唱歌，或者做某种喜剧或小品，表演。
Acting-- I need to learn how to act.
表演——我需要学习如何表演。
Oh, I need to learn how to sing like Billie Holiday.
哦，我需要学习如何像比莉·哈乐黛一样唱歌。
She doesn't take the list so seriously these days.
这些天她不再那么认真地对待这份清单了。
There are no deadlines.
没有最后期限。
She puts things on the list and later decides not to do them.
她把事情列在清单上，后来又决定不做。
It's not a grand mission anymore.
这不再是一个伟大的使命。
Now, it's just a list.
现在，这只是一个列表。
Kelly McEvers-- she's the host of NPR's Embedded podcast.
Kelly McEvers——她是 NPR 嵌入式播客的主持人。
Zora is currently doing a kind of superhero work.
佐拉目前正在做一种超级英雄的工作。
She's on the UN peacekeeping mission-- no kidding-- in the Central African Republic.
她正在中非共和国执行联合国维和任务——这不是开玩笑。
Noted Billie Holiday imitator David Sedaris.
著名的比莉·哈乐黛模仿者大卫·塞达里斯。
Coming up, exactly what Superman knows that jigsaw man does not.
接下来，正是超人知道而拼图人不知道的事情。
That's in a minute from Chicago Public Radio when our program continues.
芝加哥公共广播电台一分钟后我们的节目仍在继续。
It's This American Life.
这就是美国生活。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Each week on our program, of course, we choose a theme, bring you a variety of different kinds of stories on that theme.
当然，每周我们的节目都会选择一个主题，为您带来有关该主题的各种不同类型的故事。
Today's program-- superpowers and how easy it is to get caught up in the dream of superpowers.
今天的节目——超能力，是多么容易陷入超能力的梦想。
We've arrived at Act Three.
我们已经到了第三幕了。
Act Three-- The Green Team of Superhero Boy Millionaires, the Amazing Super Monkey From Planet Krypton, and the Man From Sram.
第三幕——超级英雄男孩百万富翁的绿色团队、来自氪星的神奇超级猴子和来自斯拉姆的男人。
My friends, they come in waves-- 100 a year or more, whole armies of them.
我的朋友们，他们一波又一波地来——每年100人或更多，他们是一大群人。
I'm talking about new superheroes created by the comic book companies.
我说的是漫画公司创造的新超级英雄。
It is rare for any of them to last more than a few issues.
它们中很少有能持续超过几个问题的。
The website Gone and Forgotten is, as far as we can tell, the authoritative archive of these failed super souls.
据我们所知，“消失和被遗忘”网站是这些失败的超级灵魂的权威档案馆。
The guy who runs the site under the title Your Humble Editor is Jonathan Morris.
乔纳森·莫里斯（Jonathan Morris）以“谦虚的编辑”为标题运营该网站。
He says that the few great superheroes have some common sense things going for them.
他说，少数伟大的超级英雄都有一些适合他们的常识。
One, they have powers that make intuitive sense.
第一，他们拥有具有直觉意义的力量。
Two, they have a reason for fighting crime.
第二，他们有打击犯罪的理由。
Three, the stories have a human touch to them.
第三，故事富有人情味。
You can relate to them.
你可以与他们产生共鸣。
He agreed to come into the studio with a stack of some of the comics that do not quite measure up to those super standards.
他同意带着一堆不太符合这些超级标准的漫画进入工作室。
I'm trying to find a very good one.
我正在努力寻找一个非常好的。
I've brought a ton of comics with me.
我随身带了一大堆漫画。
Let's see.
让我们来看看。
We've got Captain Marvel, who's one of the characters featured on the website.
我们有惊奇队长，他是网站上的特色角色之一。
His amazing power is that he can split, by which we mean his limbs fall off and then flail around.
他的惊人力量在于他可以分裂，这意味着他的四肢脱落，然后四处乱舞。
Hopefully, I imagine, beating up the criminal.
我想，希望能够殴打罪犯。
What?
什么？
Jonathan Morris I'm not kidding.
乔纳森·莫里斯 我不是在开玩笑。
He says, split.
他说，分手吧。
His arms, legs, and head fall off, and he screams, yow, I popped apart!
他的胳膊、腿和头都掉下来了，他尖叫着，哟，我摔碎了！
And with the word, zam, he returns to normal.
听到“zam”这个词，他就恢复了正常。
That's a-- Jonathan Morris He's flying into action.
那是乔纳森·莫里斯（Jonathan Morris），他正在采取行动。
I don't even know why-- that is one of the most disturbing things I've ever heard.
我什至不知道为什么——这是我听过的最令人不安的事情之一。
This company had a number of characters who shared their names with preexisting characters.
该公司有许多角色与先前存在的角色同名。
They had a Plastic Man, who appeared in this very issue, in fact, but he was nothing like the famous Plastic Man.
事实上，他们有一个塑料人，他出现在这一期中，但他与著名的塑料人完全不同。
Which was always an embarrassment to him.
这对他来说始终是一种尴尬。
He'd be ordering-- you know, he'd be ordering online, or he'd--
他会订购——你知道，他会在网上订购，或者他会——
Exactly.
正是如此。
He'd make a reservation at a restaurant.
他会在一家餐厅订位。
And then he'd show up, and they're like, oh, we thought you were the other Plastic Man.
然后他出现了，他们就像，哦，我们以为你是另一个塑料人。
Right.
正确的。
And there's even a point where he hears people yell Plastic Man on the street, and he's long past the point where he's thinking, maybe they mean me.
甚至有一次，他听到人们在街上大喊“塑料人”，他早就不再想，也许他们指的是我。
No, he knows they mean the guy in the red.
不，他知道他们指的是那个穿红衣服的人。
Pres?
总统？
Jonathan Morris Pres-- the first teen president of the United States.
乔纳森·莫里斯·普雷斯——美国第一位青少年总统。
A rather earnest young man named Pres Rickard becomes-- and with a name like that, how could he not?
一个名叫普雷斯·里卡德（Pres Rickard）的相当认真的年轻人——有了这样的名字，他怎么可能不呢？
He becomes the first teenage president of the United States.
他成为美国第一位青少年总统。
This is the issue right before he has to fight vampires too, which was not a responsibility I was aware the president had, but apparently it's rather important.
这是他必须与吸血鬼战斗之前的问题，这不是我知道总统有的责任，但显然它相当重要。
Now, what is his superpower?
现在，他的超能力是什么？
Like what kind of president does he make?
比如他会成为什么样的总统？
Well, he kind of fits in that Doc Savage, Batman mold where he's mostly a very well-trained human.
嗯，他有点符合萨维奇博士、蝙蝠侠的模式，他基本上是一个训练有素的人。
And thanks to his Indian companion Eaglefree's menagerie of animals, he learns several animal skills-- helping teach Pres Rickard how to be fast as an antelope, swing like a monkey, fight like a bear, I guess.
多亏了他的印度同伴 Eaglefree 的动物园里的动物，他学会了一些动物技能——我猜，他帮助教 Pres Rickard 如何像羚羊一样快，像猴子一样摇摆，像熊一样战斗。
You know, I've always thought that the United States presidency would be so much more effective if the president had the powers to communicate and control the animals.
你知道，我一直认为，如果总统拥有与动物沟通和控制的权力，美国总统的任期将会更加有效。
Well, there's one thing that Pres proves.
好吧，普雷斯证明了一件事。
It's that there's nothing that the President couldn't solve with two fists, an Indian companion, and a small army of birds and elephants.
问题是，没有什么是总统用两只拳头、一个印度同伴以及一小群鸟和象不能解决的。
If you were to explain to people the characteristics of a bad comic book superhero--
如果你要向人们解释一个糟糕的漫画超级英雄的特征——
Yeah.
是的。
There are obviously a lot of ways you can screw up.
显然有很多方法可以搞砸。
One of the ways is to just overdo it and cram the elements of the character down the readers' throats.
其中一种方法就是做得太过分，将角色的元素塞进读者的喉咙里。
One of the characters was Bee Man, and everything about him was bees.
其中一个角色是蜜蜂人，他的一切都是蜜蜂。
His full name was Barry E.
他的全名是巴里·E。
Eames.
埃姆斯。
He was attacked by mutant bees which were sent to Earth by space alien bee people.
他遭到了外星蜂人送到地球的变异蜜蜂的攻击。
And he himself became a mutant bee person who had bee powers, and lived in a hive, and ate honey, and stole gold because gold looked like honey.
他自己也变成了变异蜜蜂人，拥有蜜蜂的能力，住在蜂巢里，吃蜂蜜，还偷金子，因为金子看起来像蜂蜜。
And he could sting you.
他可能会蜇你。
There's nothing bee-related this man refused to do.
这个人没有拒绝做任何与蜜蜂有关的事情。
It's as if you meet somebody at a bar, you start talking to him, and you realize he only has one interest in life.
就好像你在酒吧遇到某人，你开始和他交谈，然后你意识到他对生活只有一种兴趣。
That's exactly what Bee Man was.
这正是蜜蜂人。
Everything would have gotten back to bees.
一切都会回到蜜蜂身上。
You start talking about what you watched on television last night, he'll say, you know, I saw an interesting show on bees.
你开始谈论昨晚在电视上看到的内容，他会说，你知道，我看了一个关于蜜蜂的有趣节目。
Do certain comic superheroes come out of particular moments in the nation's history?
某些喜剧超级英雄是否来自国家历史上的特定时刻？
Positively.
积极地。
That's another thing that really works against a character is when they're tied in too tightly to a fad or tied in too tightly to something that is identifying an era.
另一件真正对角色不利的事情是，当他们与时尚或特定时代的事物联系得太紧密时。
There's a character created in the '70s, but who was supposed to be a retro character from the '50s, name of 3D Man, to help hook up on the 3D movies that were a craze in the '50s.
有一个70年代创建的角色，但他应该是50年代的复古角色，名字叫3D Man，以帮助连接50年代热潮的3D电影。
Terrible, flat character.
性格扁平，可怕。
Nothing going on.
没什么事发生。
And when you say 3D Man, what was his power?
当你说3D Man时，他的力量是什么？
He had a magical pair of glasses and had the strength of three men.
他拥有一副神奇的眼镜，拥有三人的力量。
And that's it.
就是这样。
He was as strong as three people, fast as three people, whatever that means-- Probably three times faster than a human being.
他的力量相当于三个人，速度相当于三个人，不管这意味着什么——可能比人类快三倍。
They always describe it as something as so much as three men.
他们总是将其描述为最多三个男人。
But I don't see how how he can be three times as-- or have the agility of three men.
但我不明白他如何能够三倍于——或者拥有三个人的敏捷性。
There's just three guys who are agile.
敏捷的家伙只有三个。
It doesn't make any sense.
这没有任何意义。
I have a little trouble with 3D Man.
我在使用 3D Man 时遇到了一些麻烦。
Part of the problem with just naming off the superheroes or going through their powers is that, on the face value, there's not a superhero who doesn't seem silly.
仅仅点名超级英雄或展示他们的力量的部分问题在于，从表面上看，没有一个超级英雄看起来不傻。
Because you have to get to a point where the man's wearing a costume, and he's driving around fighting crime.
因为你必须达到一个男人穿着戏服，开着车到处打击犯罪的地步。
Then where does the line come where they rise above that?
那么它们上升的界限在哪里呢？
Do you have a theory on this about what makes a good one and a bad one?
关于什么是好的和坏的，你有什么理论吗？
I have sort of a half-formed theory.
我有一个半成形的理论。
I know that one of the things that really helps a superpower get over with the audience, get over with readers, is if it's something they can apply to their normal lives, perhaps by way of fantasy.
我知道，真正帮助超级大国接受观众、接受读者的事情之一是，他们是否可以将其应用到他们的正常生活中，也许可以通过幻想的方式。
And that's, I think, why super strength, super speed, invulnerability, or just general toughness are often so common.
我认为，这就是为什么超强的力量、超快的速度、刀枪不入或一般的韧性常常如此常见。
If you can get on the court with it, get that super accuracy and get a slam dunk from midcourt and really just school over somebody, then that's probably a superpower you want.
如果你能带着它上场，获得超强的准确性，并在中场扣篮，并且真正地超越某人，那么这可能就是你想要的超能力。
But when you start getting into powers, like one character who had magnetic eyes of superpower, which is a little too esoteric to even understand--
但当你开始接触超能力时，就像一个拥有超能力磁力眼睛的角色，这有点太深奥了，甚至无法理解——
Yeah.
是的。
I don't even understand anything you say.
我什至听不懂你说的话。
Yeah.
是的。
Ira Glass What does it mean?
艾拉·格拉斯是什么意思？
Magnetic eyes of super power?
超能力的磁力眼？
But yeah, in his first appearance, he announced that he had magnetic eyes of superpower.
但是，是的，在他第一次露面时，他就宣布自己拥有超能力的磁力眼睛。
They would illustrate little beams coming out of his eyes making metal things shoot right at them, which would be terrible in a room full of forks.
他们会展示他眼睛里发出的小光束，使金属物体直接射向他们，这在一个满是叉子的房间里会很糟糕。
Jonathan Morris, who brought a few of his 15,000 comics into the studio-- search the internet for Gone and Forgotten, and you'll find his web site.
乔纳森·莫里斯（Jonathan Morris）把他的 15,000 幅漫画中的一些带进了工作室——在互联网上搜索《Gone and Forgotten》，你会找到他的网站。
Buttercup, Bubbles, let's go!
毛茛，泡泡，我们走吧！
[MUSIC - "SIGNAL IN THE SKY" BY THE APPLES IN STEREO]
[音乐 - Apple 的立体声“天空信号”]
Act Four, Villain and Able.
第四幕，恶棍与能手。
Of course, you can't have a superhero without a supervillain.
当然，没有超级反派就不可能有超级英雄。
And the most interesting supervillains, of course, are the ones who think that they are the real heroes, that they're the ones living by a true code of honor, not the guys in the capes.
当然，最有趣的超级反派是那些认为自己是真正的英雄，遵循真正的荣誉准则的人，而不是那些披着斗篷的人。
This story comes from Glynn Washington.
这个故事来自格林·华盛顿。
Rule number 1-- whatever it is you do, always look good doing it.
规则一——无论你做什么，总是看起来做得很好。
See, now, my quantum drive, the lithium core, dimension jumping rocket ship, does not just go fast, it's sharp, baby.
现在看，我的量子驱动器，锂核心，维度跳跃火箭飞船，不仅走得快，而且很锋利，宝贝。
Yes, that is a new chrome alloy.
是的，那是一种新型铬合金。
And no, it is not available in stores.
不，它在商店里是买不到的。
Recognize.
认出。
And please understand, if they hadn't made the big fuss about how unbreakable the new security system was, I wouldn't even have bothered.
请理解，如果他们没有大惊小怪新的安全系统是多么牢不可破，我什至都不会打扰。
Check the tape.
检查磁带。
I sat there for 45 minutes, big sack full of jewels in my lap before I finally pulled the alarm my damn self.
我坐了 45 分钟，腿上放着装满珠宝的大袋子，最后我自己拉响了警报。
That's when the fun started.
那就是乐趣开始的时候。
I hopped in my rocket ship and tore through the middle of downtown Metropolis, making up all kinds of commotion-- sirens, helicopters, police lights.
我跳上我的火箭飞船，穿过大都会市中心，制造出各种骚动——警报声、直升机、警灯。
I'm having a ball.
我正在玩球。
Then here he comes-- Superman.
然后他来了——超人。
And right on cue, the ladies start screaming.
就在这时，女士们开始尖叫。
Oh, Superman, Superman.
哦，超人，超人。
Superman's so brave.
超人好勇敢啊
It is not brave to go in the burning building when you do not burn.
当你没有被烧毁时，进入正在燃烧的建筑物是不勇敢的。
It ain't brave to get shot when you don't feel bullets.
当你感觉不到子弹的时候，被枪杀并不是勇敢。
Superman-- nothing stops him.
超人——没有什么能阻止他。
Nothing.
没有什么。
Yeah, kryptonite-- please.
是的，氪星——拜托。
I think he started that nonsense.
我认为他开始了那些废话。
I tried everything-- kryptonite rays, kryptonite missiles.
我尝试了一切——氪石射线、氪石导弹。
Once, I had the fool locked in a kryptonite coffin.
有一次，我把傻瓜锁在氪石棺材里。
Oh, oh, it hurts.
噢噢，好痛。
Kryptonite, kryptonite.
氪石，氪石。
Then he broke out and started tearing up my secret lab.
然后他爆发了，开始撕毁我的秘密实验室。
It just never stops.
它永远不会停止。
Then-- then-- he's got the nerve to put on some glasses.
然后——然后——他有勇气戴上眼镜。
And suddenly, he's incognito, like I'm stupid.
突然间，他隐姓埋名，就像我是个傻子一样。
I even called him out at the club.
我什至在俱乐部叫他出去。
What's up, Superman?
怎么了，超人？
How you doing, Superman?
你好吗，超人？
Clark-- steady, looking all around all corny like I must be talking to somebody else.
克拉克——镇定自若，环顾四周，一副老土的样子，好像我一定是在和别人说话。
Excuse me?
打扰一下？
What's going on here?
这是怎么回事？
Whatever, man.
不管怎样，伙计。
And no, this had nothing to do with Lois Lane.
不，这与露易丝·莱恩无关。
You want to know what this is about?
你想知道这是关于什么的吗？
You want to know what this beef is about?
你想知道这牛肉是什么意思吗？
One thing, and one thing only-- jungle fever.
一件事，而且只有一件事——丛林热。
Superman had it bad.
超人的处境很糟糕。
Call me what you want to, but Clark Kent was up in Lector's nightclub seven nights a week chasing the chocolate goodness.
你想怎么称呼我就怎么称呼我吧，但克拉克·肯特每周七个晚上都在莱克特的夜总会里追逐巧克力的美味。
And I'm not hating.
我并不讨厌。
I understand.
我明白。
So one night, I'm ordering my Hennessy, turn around, and there he is talking to Sheila.
所以有一天晚上，我点了轩尼诗，一转身，他就在那里和希拉说话。
My Sheila.
我的希拉。
And I went, oh, hell to the no. But I'm supposed to step to the Man of Steel?
我去了，噢，见鬼去吧。但我应该走向钢铁之躯吗？
And on top of everything else, Superman's got that mind control.
最重要的是，超人拥有精神控制能力。
How else Sheila going to get up in front of everybody in the club and walk out with Clark Kent?
否则希拉怎么会在俱乐部里的每个人面前站起来，和克拉克·肯特一起走出去呢？
Explain me that.
给我解释一下。
She was with me.
她和我在一起。
She came there with me.
她和我一起来的。
So yeah, I stalked him.
所以是的，我跟踪他。
I followed him.
我跟着他。
I know him better than his Momma, and I don't know him at all.
我比他妈妈还了解他，但我根本不了解他。
He's weird.
他很奇怪。
Like he's reading the words that come out of his mouth.
就像他正在读从他嘴里说出的话一样。
For a while, I thought he was a robot because everybody breaks character sometimes.
有一段时间，我以为他是一个机器人，因为每个人有时都会打破性格。
But not Superman.
但不是超人。
I trailed him with my special Seeing Everywhere Machine.
我用我的特殊“无处不在”机器跟踪他。
He knew I was watching him the whole time, and he didn't care.
他知道我一直在看着他，但他不在乎。
Why should he?
他为什么要这么做？
Do you know what Superman does in his apartment by himself?
你知道超人一个人在他的公寓里做什么吗？
Huh?
啊？
Nothing.
没有什么。
Just sits there.
就坐在那里。
Doesn't turn on the TV.
不打开电视。
Doesn't eat cereal.
不吃麦片。
Doesn't watch porn.
不看色情片。
He does nothing but sit there and look stupid.
他什么也不做，只是坐在那里，看上去很傻。
I had to take him out.
我不得不带他出去。
I tried to take him out.
我试图带他出去。
I couldn't take him out.
我无法带他出去。
At first, if you don't succeed, try again, and again, and again.
一开始，如果你没有成功，就再试一次，再试一次，再试一次。
And every time, he's all flying me back to jail, steady, making pronouncements about fighting evil.
每次，他都会稳稳地把我送回监狱，发表关于打击邪恶的声明。
I am nobody's evil.
我没有任何人是邪恶的。
I just don't think we should be letting aliens from outer space roll up in here with our women.
我只是认为我们不应该让来自外太空的外星人和我们的女人一起聚集在这里。
That's right, I said it-- our women.
是的，我说过——我们的女人。
Now I'm evil?
现在我邪恶了？
Please.
请。
My name is Darnell, and what I am is a student of the game.
我叫达内尔，是一名游戏学生。
The rules clearly state when the big dog is up in your way, accept the play, son.
规则明确规定，当大狗挡住你的路时，接受游戏，儿子。
Or-- or you go get you some more juice.
或者——或者你去拿点果汁。
I needed power-- crazy power, power like the sun.
我需要力量——疯狂的力量，像太阳一样的力量。
I started looking in my brand new secret laboratory.
我开始寻找我全新的秘密实验室。
Turns out there are dimensions between the dimensions and dimensions between that.
事实证明，维度之间还有维度。
The deeper you dig, the stronger the force, the stronger the power.
挖得越深，力量就越强，威力也就越强。
All this technology, and in the end, I didn't just find power, I found God, and I put him in a gun.
所有这些技术，最后，我不仅找到了力量，我找到了上帝，我把他放进了枪里。
At least, I think it's God.
至少，我认为这是上帝。
Or maybe it's the devil.
或许这就是魔鬼。
It's really simple, though.
不过，这真的很简单。
At the end of the universe, the end of time, the end of everything, it is going to ask you what matters.
在宇宙的尽头、时间的尽头、一切的尽头，它会问你什么是重要的。
No more waiting eons for your personal judgment day.
无需再等待您的个人判断日。
My little shooter sends you there with a quickness, and you can't lie.
我的小射手很快就会把你送到那里，你不能撒谎。
You can't lie.
你不能说谎。
God will have her answer.
上帝会给她答案。
So anyway, Superman was hovering in front of my chrome grill rocket ship.
不管怎样，超人正在我的镀铬烤架火箭飞船前盘旋。
I went on ahead and fired my tractor beam.
我继续前进并发射了牵引光束。
Useless.
无用。
Superman ripped the hatch off my ship like it was wrapping paper.
超人像撕包装纸一样撕下了我船上的舱口。
All right.
好的。
All right.
好的。
You got me.
你抓住了我。
Stop tearing up my ride.
别再破坏我的座驾了。
Your reign of terror has come to an end.
你们的恐怖统治已经结束。
The crowd cheered.
人群欢呼起来。
Superman's gaze stayed fixed into the distance as he flew me off to prison.
当超人把我送进监狱时，他的目光一直盯着远方。
I even gave him a couple minutes.
我什至给了他几分钟。
Hey, Clark?
嘿，克拉克？
He didn't turn his head, didn't look at me.
他没有回头，也没有看我。
I was not worth the effort to him.
我不值得为他付出努力。
Hey, Clark?
嘿，克拉克？
I've got a present for you.
我有一份礼物给你。
I shot God right between his eyes.
我对着上帝的双眼开了一枪。
It was instantaneous.
这是瞬间的。
I saw Superman at the end of a universe.
我在宇宙的尽头看到了超人。
Then came the question.
然后问题来了。
Will you give your life to save this world?
你愿意献出自己的生命来拯救这个世界吗？
Or will you live as a hero knowing the Earth is doomed?
或者知道地球注定要灭亡，你会像英雄一样生活吗？
Tough one, Clark.
很难，克拉克。
Lay down your life like a new Jesus, or keep up with this fake hero act.
像新耶稣一样放下你的生命，或者跟上这个假英雄的行为。
Superman bowed his head and answered instantly, softly, hero.
超人低下头，立即轻声回答，英雄。
(ECHO) Hero.
（回声）英雄。
Ah.
啊。
Finally, at long last, Super Duper Man was off script.
最后，超级骗子终于脱离了剧本。
Then we were back in the sky, Superman still flying me off to jail.
然后我们又回到了天空，超人仍然带我去监狱。
The air was warm, salty, delicious.
空气温暖、咸咸、美味。
I spoke in a little voice, because I know he's got that super hearing.
我说话的声音很小，因为我知道他有超强的听力。
Clark?
克拉克？
Clark?
克拉克？
I heard you, Clark.
我听到你的声音了，克拉克。
I heard you sell us out.
我听说你出卖了我们。
Nothing.
没有什么。
Nothing.
没有什么。
No reaction at all.
一点反应都没有。
Then he blinked.
然后他眨了眨眼睛。
Just a blink, and everything changed.
只是一眨眼，一切都变了。
We sped towards the ground.
我们向地面疾驰而去。
I didn't scream because I couldn't scream.
我没有尖叫，因为我无法尖叫。
I couldn't inhale.
我无法吸气。
We landed, soft, like a swan kissing the water.
我们着陆了，动作轻柔，就像一只亲吻水面的天鹅。
He released me.
他放开了我。
His eyes shone.
他的眼睛闪闪发亮。
His mouth hung open in shock.
他震惊地张大了嘴巴。
Then Superman shrieked.
然后超人尖叫起来。
The air burned.
空气燃烧起来。
Yeah, he looked at me then.
是的，当时他看着我。
Yeah.
是的。
For the first time ever, he looked at me then.
这是他第一次看着我。
I spit in his face.
我吐口水在他脸上。
It ran down his cheek and his eye.
它顺着他的脸颊和眼睛流下来。
He shot up into the air speeding toward the sun.
他腾空而起，飞向太阳。
See?
看？
Life hurts.
生活很痛苦。
We all have hard choices to make.
我们都要做出艰难的选择。
I had my own decision in front of the light.
我在灯光面前有了自己的决定。
But that-- [CHUCKLES] see, that's a whole other story.
但是——[笑]看，那是完全不同的故事了。
Glynn Washington.
格林·华盛顿。
He challenges all bespectacled, seemingly mild-mannered nemeses, as well I know, in his job as host of the Public Radio show and podcast Snap Judgment, where this story first appeared.
据我所知，他在担任公共广播节目和播客“快速判断”（这个故事首次出现）的主持人的工作中挑战了所有戴眼镜、看似温和的敌人。
If you are not hearing or downloading Snap Judgment already each week, what is holding you back, my friends?
如果您还没有每周听到或下载《快速审判》，那么是什么阻碍了您，我的朋友们？
Find them on iTunes or at snapjudgment.org.
在 iTunes 或 snapjudgment.org 上查找它们。
Our program was produced today by Alex Blumberg and myself with Blue Chevigny, Jonathan Goldstein and Starlee Kine.
今天我们的节目由 Alex Blumberg 和我本人以及 Blue Chevigny、Jonathan Goldstein 和 Starlee Kine 制作。
Our senior producer for today's show, Julie Snyder.
我们今天节目的高级制片人朱莉·斯奈德。
Production help today from Anna Martin.
安娜·马丁今天为制作提供帮助。
Music help from Mr. John Connors.
约翰·康纳斯先生的音乐帮助。
Our technical director is Mr. Matt Tierney.
我们的技术总监是 Matt Tierney 先生。
Mixing help from Jared Floyd, Katherine Rae Mondo, and Stowe Nelson.
Jared Floyd、Katherine Rae Mondo 和 Stowe Nelson 提供混音帮助。
Special thanks today to James Hulk, Ari Andrews, Seth Fischer, Adam Warren, Jason Bennett, Ivan Brunetti, Axel Aronso, Spouse, the band, Jason Cadell, and Seth Mydans.
今天特别感谢 James Hulk、Ari Andrews、Seth Fischer、Adam Warren、Jason Bennett、Ivan Brunetti、Axel Aronso、Spouse、乐队、Jason Cadell 和 Seth Mydans。
Our website-- thisamericanlife.org-- where you can listen to our archive of over 600 stories for absolutely free, and where you can find a cartoon by Chris Ware, who we interviewed at the beginning of our program, a cartoon about superheroes and their power over us-- which is beautiful, actually.
我们的网站 -- thisamericanlife.org -- 在这里您可以完全免费收听我们的 600 多个故事档案，还可以找到我们在节目开始时采访过的克里斯·威尔 (Chris Ware) 创作的卡通片，一部关于超级英雄及其对我们的力量的卡通片 - 事实上，这很美丽。
Chris, by the way, most recently came out with a retrospective of his own work-- this massive tome called Monograph that I wrote the introduction for.
顺便说一句，克里斯最近出版了他自己作品的回顾展——这本名为《专题》的巨著，我为它写了介绍。
This American Life is distributed by PRX, the Public Radio Exchange.
《美国生活》由公共广播电台 PRX 发行。
Thanks as always to our program's co-founder, Torey Malatia, who told me back when he first hired me--
一如既往地感谢我们项目的联合创始人托里·马拉蒂亚 (Torey Malatia)，他在第一次雇用我时告诉我——
You have the ability to walk around work, perhaps show up at one point, and perhaps like go away for a little while and turn invisible, and then come back and listen to what they say about you.
你有能力在工作中四处走动，也许在某一时刻出现，也许喜欢离开一会儿然后变得隐形，然后回来听听他们对你的评价。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Back next week with more stories of This American Life.
下周我们将带来更多《美国生活》的故事。
This American Life is produced in collaboration with WBEZ Chicago and delivered to stations by PRX The Public Radio Exchange.
《This American Life》与 WBEZ Chicago 合作制作，并由 PRX 公共广播电台传送到各电台。