407: The Bridge - This American Life
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00:00 00:00 Transcript Share This American Life Life Partners How to Listen Episodes Recommended About Overview Staff Announcements Fellowships Jobs Music Make Radio On The Road FAQ Submissions Merch Contact Us Our Other Shows Merch Follow Us Life Partners Subscribe to our newsletter Full episode Toggle Audio and Transcript Sync Transcript | Episode #407 | May 7, 2010 407: The Bridge Note: This American Life is produced for the ear and designed to be heard.
00:00 00:00 文字记录 分享此 美国生活 生活伙伴 如何收听 剧集 推荐 关于 概述 员工公告 奖学金 工作 音乐 在路上制作电台 常见问题解答 提交 商品 联系我们 我们的其他节目 商品 关注我们 生活伙伴 订阅我们的时事通讯 整集 切换音频和文字记录同步 文字记录 | 内容第 407 集 | 2010 年 5 月 7 日 407：桥 注：《美国生活》是为耳朵而制作的，旨在让人们听到。
If you are able, we strongly encourage you to listen to the audio, which includes emotion and emphasis that's not on the page.
如果可以的话，我们强烈建议您收听音频，其中包括页面上没有的情感和重点。
Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors.
文字记录是使用语音识别软件和人工转录员结合生成的，可能包含错误。
Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print.
请在印刷版引用前检查相应的音频。
Prologue Ira Glass From WBEZ Chicago, It's This American Life, distributed by Public Radio International.
序言 Ira Glass 来自 WBEZ 芝加哥，这就是美国生活，由国际公共广播电台发行。
[TRAIN SOUNDS] There's this bridge that's part of Chicago's Lake Shore Drive that crosses the Chicago River.
[火车声音] 这座桥是横跨芝加哥河的芝加哥湖滨大道的一部分。
You can see this bridge from the offices of WBEZ.
您可以从 WBEZ 的办公室看到这座桥。
It's really close.
真的很接近。
But unless you're really looking for it, you would miss the hole that is halfway across the bridge.
但除非你真的在寻找它，否则你会错过桥中间的那个洞。
It's at the foot of some steel girders, in between lanes of traffic, just 12 inches by 36.
它位于一些钢梁的底部，位于交通车道之间，只有 12 英寸 x 36 英寸。
I'd cross the two lanes and then I'd go to where the hole is, and when there was no cars coming at the time I'd slip in.
我会穿过两条车道，然后去洞所在的地方，当当时没有车过来时，我就会溜进去。
Richard Dorsay became momentarily famous in Chicago, in December 2004, when police learned from one of Richard's friends that Richard and this friend had been living down there, inside the frame of the bridge, tucked way in the rafters underneath the roadway, for years.
2004 年 12 月，理查德·多尔赛 (Richard Dorsay) 在芝加哥一举成名，当时警方从理查德的一位朋友那里得知，理查德和这位朋友多年来一直住在桥的框架内，藏在道路下方的椽子里。
Authorities kicked him out from this space that Richard says was probably 14- or 18-feet long, and about as wide as two lanes of traffic, with the steel frame of the bridge for walls and a concrete floor.
当局把他从这个空间中赶了出来，理查德说这个空间可能有 14 或 18 英尺长，大约有两条车道那么宽，墙壁是桥的钢架，地板是混凝土。
The ceiling was the roadway.
天花板就是道路。
Where, out of wood that Richard and his friend mostly took from a construction site, they built three rooms in the dank space, a supply room and two bedrooms.
理查德和他的朋友主要用从建筑工地拿来的木材，在潮湿的空间里建造了三间房间，一间供应室和两间卧室。
There was electricity from a long extension cord that they hid with piping, and plugged into a regular electric socket in the bridge down below.
他们用管道隐藏了一根长延长线，然后将其插入下面桥上的常规电源插座中。
They made a big stink out of this when actually it hit the papers.
当这件事真正见诸报端时，他们却大肆报道。
I had like a 20inch TV, which was a pain in the butt to get in, but I did it.
我有一台 20 英寸的电视，装进去很痛苦，但我还是装了。
And I had a little heater and various other things, like a PlayStation, video games, videotapes, VHS.
我还有一个小加热器和其他各种东西，比如 PlayStation、视频游戏、录像带、VHS。
And I'd come back towards the evening and sit back and play the PlayStation and, you know, maybe have some beer, drink some beer and see how far I can go in a driving game before I end up crashing.
晚上我会回来，坐下来玩 PlayStation，你知道，也许喝点啤酒，喝点啤酒，看看在我最终崩溃之前我能在驾驶游戏中走多远。
But this wasn't just an adult treehouse, hidden away inside an old bridge.
但这不仅仅是隐藏在一座旧桥内的成人树屋。
It was an adult treehouse inside in old drawbridge, a working drawbridge over the Chicago River, that every now and then would raise, turning the entire three-room apartment on its side, pulling the extension cord out of the outlet.
那是一座成人树屋，位于旧吊桥上，是芝加哥河上一座正在使用的吊桥，吊桥时不时地会升起，将整个三居室公寓翻到一边，将延长线从插座中拉出。
The only thing that was actually a little on the scary side was the first time the bridge went up.
唯一有点可怕的事情是第一次桥上来的时候。
Everything would tilt, literally.
从字面上看，一切都会倾斜。
It'd be like a one-sided earthquake.
这就像一场单方面的地震。
And instead of it shaking, it'd be like the ground just lifting up and tilting.
它不会摇晃，而是像地面升起并倾斜一样。
And then, when that bridge is vertical, that bridge really is like vertical.
然后，当那座桥是垂直的时，那座桥确实是垂直的。
You're standing straight up when in a laying-down position.
当您处于躺下位置时，您是站直的。
Some of his stuff was bungee-corded down.
他的一些东西是用松紧绳绑起来的。
The heavy stuff, like the TV, he kept against the back wall of his room, the wall that tilted to become the floor.
像电视这样的重物，他都靠在房间的后墙上，倾斜的墙变成了地板。
And sometimes I'd move things just before the bridge went up, because you can hear the motors unlock.
有时我会在桥升起之前移动东西，因为你可以听到电机解锁的声音。
Yeah, there's bells.
是的，有铃声。
Ira Glass So the bells go off, you hear the motors start.
Ira Glass 铃声响起，您听到电机启动的声音。
I'd just sit back and ride it.
我只是坐下来骑它。
And I'd just lay there, and then as the bridge went up, I slowly slid towards the wall, and then, when it was totally standing straight up, then I'd be standing straight up on that back wall
我就躺在那里，然后随着桥的上升，我慢慢地滑向墙壁，然后，当它完全笔直地站起来时，我就会笔直地站在后墙上
Yes.
是的。
And after that first time it was kind of like a rush going down a hill on a roller coaster.
第一次之后，感觉有点像坐过山车冲下山。
You know, where you get that laugh and you feel all relieved and it's real great, you know?
你知道，当你笑的时候，你会感到如释重负，这真的很棒，你知道吗？
Richard's been out of there since 2004.
理查德自 2004 年起就离开了那里。
He lives with friends in a house now, in the suburbs.
他现在和朋友住在郊区的一所房子里。
And when he talks about his little nest in the bridge today, he is surprisingly unsentimental.
而今天，当他谈到他在桥上的小窝时，却出奇的冷静。
It was hot as hell in the summer, he says, and freezing in the winter.
他说，夏天酷热难耐，冬天又冷又冷。
And the ceiling was just low enough, five feet and change, that he used to hit his head.
天花板足够低，只有五英尺，他经常撞到他的头。
But as we talked about it, there was also this.
但当我们谈论它时，还有这个。
Richard, if your friend hadn't turned you into the cops--
理查德，如果你的朋友没有把你告给警察的话——
Would I still be there, is that the question?
我还会在那里吗，这是个问题吗？
Yeah.
是的。
Richard Dorsay Probably.
理查德·多尔赛 也许吧。
Probably.
大概。
To me, it's a world of safety and comfort, where to someone else, they see it, oh, another drawbridge, whoopadeedo.
对我来说，这是一个安全和舒适的世界，而对其他人来说，他们看到的是，哦，又一座吊桥，哎呀。
The bridge connects point A to B, but there can be a whole life on a bridge.
桥连接着A点和B点，但桥上可以有一生。
And today, on the radio show, we stop there and stay for an hour and see what happens there.
今天，在广播节目中，我们在那里停留一个小时，看看那里会发生什么。
We have three stories of people at three bridges on three continents.
我们有三个关于人们在三大洲的三座桥上的故事。
Act one is in China.
第一幕发生在中国。
Act two is in the border of Egypt.
第二幕是在埃及边境。
Act three in Florida.
第三幕在佛罗里达州。
Stay with us.
留在我们身边。
In 2003, a year before Richard Dorsay got kicked out of the bridge at the Chicago River, halfway around the world, in Naan-jing, China, a man named Chen Sah, Mr. Chen, took up residence in a bridge, or anyway he spent his weekends there, 10 hours a day away from his wife and daughter.
2003年，也就是理查德·多尔赛(Richard Dorsay)被赶出芝加哥河大桥的前一年，在地球另一边的中国南靖，一个名叫陈萨(Chen Sah)的男子在一座桥上住了下来，或者说他在那里度过了周末，每天有10个小时远离他的妻子和女儿。
The bridge he chose is this concrete communist monstrosity, four miles long, covered with slogans that celebrate the worker, four lanes of traffic and thousands of pedestrians on the top deck, two train tracks on the lower over the Yangtze River into Naan-jing, a city of seven million.
他选择的这座桥就是这座混凝土的共产主义怪物，长四英里，上面贴满了颂扬工人的标语，四车道的交通和顶层甲板上的数千名行人，下游有两条火车轨道，横跨长江，通往南靖，一座七百万人口的城市。
Estimates are fuzzy, but the best guess is that one person per week commits suicide off this bridge.
估计是模糊的，但最好的猜测是每周有一个人从这座桥上自杀。
Mr. Chen decided he wanted to try to keep them from jumping, and he started to, single-handedly at first, then with an occasional volunteer.
陈先生决定尝试阻止它们跳下去，于是他开始尝试，一开始是独自一人，后来偶尔会有志愿者帮忙。
The blog that he keeps about this is the most sober, taciturn, non-boastful account of saving lives imaginable.
他所写的博客是关于拯救生命的最清醒、最沉默、最不自夸的记录。
Occasionally, Mr. Chen will insert his feelings.
偶尔，陈先生也会插入自己的感情。
"Beware heavy thoughts," he declares to himself during one entry.
“小心沉重的想法，”他在一篇文章中对自己宣称。
"How I wished he would soon be free of this shadow," he says about an old man he saved in another.
“我多么希望他能尽快摆脱这个阴影，”他谈到他在另一个地方救下的一位老人时说道。
But mostly just the facts.
但大多只是事实。
Here's a translation from the Chinese: "On July, 25, at 10:30 in the morning, I discovered a woman lying on the bridge railing, on her belly, weeping.
中文译文如下：“7月25日上午10时30分，我发现一名妇女趴在桥栏杆上哭泣。
I went to her.
我去找她。
She wiped her eyes.
她擦了擦眼睛。
She said she was just playing and walked toward the center of the bridge.
她说她只是在玩，然后朝桥中央走去。
I went with her, and she, very ordinarily, without her cell phone.
我和她一起去了，她很平常，没有带手机。
When I returned at 1:10, I discovered that she had already climbed up on the bridge railing.
1点10分我回来时，发现她已经爬上了桥栏杆。
I restrained her and forced her onto a moped.
我制止了她，强迫她上了一辆轻便摩托车。
She is from Naan-jing's Jianye District.
她是南靖建邺区人。
Her last name is Jiau, and today she's 45 years old.
她姓娇，今年45岁。
Because her husband, surname Lee, and 51 years old, is violent towards her and mistreats her, she thought killing yourself would be better.
由于她的丈夫姓李，51岁，对她暴力、虐待，她认为自杀比较好。
However, she is silent when she thinks of her 15-year-old son."
然而，一想到自己15岁的儿子，她就沉默了。”
I thought maybe I'll see him in action.
我想也许我会看到他的表现。
Maybe I'll get to see him save somebody.
也许我会看到他救人。
Just as back story, I mean, I actually came-- I had come from Cambodia, so I was covering these genocide trials, so I wasn't, you know, I didn't have the most optimistic feelings about humanity.
就像背景故事一样，我的意思是，我实际上来自柬埔寨，所以我报道了这些种族灭绝审判，所以我不是，你知道，我对人类没有最乐观的感觉。
And I thought I was going to find something there, like there some--
我以为我会在那里找到一些东西，就像那里有一些——
You said you thought you'd find a hopeful figure.
你说你认为你会找到一个有希望的人物。
Yeah.
是的。
I mean, hope, perseverance, generosity.
我的意思是，希望、毅力、慷慨。
But as soon as I got on the bridge, I realized that all those notions were completely absurd.
但一上桥，我就发现这些想法完全是荒谬的。
I mean, I got instantly depressed.
我的意思是，我立刻就沮丧了。
First of all, there's this four-mile long bridge and this one man out there sort of trying to pick out who was going to jump.
首先，有一座四英里长的桥，这个人在那里试图找出谁要跳下去。
It just seemed, from a distance, like insurmountable odds to actually maybe pull somebody off the bridge.
从远处看，将某人从桥上拉下来似乎是不可克服的困难。
Yeah, you wrote in the article, at one point, you said, first of all, there's the cars, then there's the trains and the bridge is shaking, and then there's just like a sea of people, thousands of people, in the rain with umbrellas, going back and forth on the bridge, and he's just one guy kind of walking up and down.
是的，你在文章里写到，有一次，你说，首先是汽车，然后是火车，桥在摇晃，然后就像人山人海，成千上万的人，在雨中撑着雨伞，在桥上来来回回，而他只是一个来来往往的人。
And he has this little moped and does a little cruise on the bridge every once in a while, but even that is a somewhat comical sight to behold.
他拥有这辆小型轻便摩托车，时不时地在桥上巡航一下，但即便如此，这也是一个有点滑稽的景象。
You know, he's on this little broken-down moped, put-putting through the crowd with his big pair of binoculars around his neck.
你知道，他骑着这辆破旧的轻便摩托车，脖子上挂着一副大双筒望远镜，在人群中穿梭。
You know, I sort of thought, maybe this isn't even real, like maybe this blog is a complete figment of his imagination, or a fiction that he constructs once a week, and I just don't see how this guy can save anybody out here.
你知道，我有点想，也许这根本就不是真的，就像这个博客完全是他想象中的虚构，或者是他每周构建一次的小说，我只是不明白这个家伙如何能够拯救这里的任何人。
And you write in your article, he won't really to talk to you when you're there on the bridge.
你在文章中写道，当你在桥上时，他不会真正和你说话。
Yeah, he was really grumpy, and unwilling to acknowledge me.
是的，他脾气真的很暴躁，不愿意承认我。
And so, give me a typical exchange between the two of you on the bridge.
那么，请给我介绍一下你们两个在桥上的典型交流。
I think I did ask, like why are you standing here, as opposed to any other spot on this four-mile long bridge?
我想我确实问过，比如你为什么站在这里，而不是这座四英里长的桥上的任何其他地方？
And he turned and lifted his binoculars and focused out towards the river, and then brought his binoculars down, turned the other way, put his binoculars up and focused in the other direction on the crowd.
他转身举起双筒望远镜，将焦距对准河流，然后放下双筒望远镜，转向另一个方向，举起双筒望远镜，将焦距对准人群的另一个方向。
No, it was like I wasn't even there.
不，就好像我根本不在那儿一样。
It was like I was some ghost.
就好像我是一个幽灵。
And I sort of went through some of this and then I said, maybe, you know, is there a better time for us to talk?
我经历了一些事情，然后我说，也许，你知道，我们有更好的时间来谈谈吗？
And he said to the translator, I can talk to you at lunch.
他对翻译说，我可以在午餐时和你谈谈。
So you go to lunch with him, and what happens there?
所以你和他一起去吃午饭，然后发生了什么？
Well, so we were in a little what they call family restaurant near the bridge, and there are no families present.
好吧，所以我们在桥附近的一家小餐馆里，他们称之为家庭餐馆，而且没有家人在场。
I mean, it's just workers, and they're pretty hard-drinking.
我的意思是，这只是工人，而且他们酗酒。
In this case, grain alcohol and beer.
在这种情况下，谷物酒精和啤酒。
And so we sit down at the table, and Mr. Chen has invited a man to join us whose name is Mr. Shi.
于是我们在桌边坐下，陈先生邀请了一位名叫石先生的人加入我们。
And then we are served some food, and Mr. Chen and Mr. Shi start really drinking a lot of grain alcohol.
然后给我们提供了一些食物，陈先生和石先生开始喝很多谷物酒。
And I started to sort of drink with them, because it was the convivial thing to do.
我开始和他们一起喝酒，因为这是一件很欢乐的事情。
And then I just realized, I'm going to pass out if I try to stay with these guys, like I'm literally-- my head was spinning and I was-- you know, the whole room was revolving.
然后我才意识到，如果我试图和这些家伙待在一起，我就会昏过去，就像我真的一样——我的头在旋转，我——你知道，整个房间都在旋转。
I just was like-- and he was very disappointed, and so he sort of said, just, we're drinking here, this is what we do at lunch, and drinking loosens the tongue.
我只是想——他非常失望，所以他说，我们在这里喝酒，这就是我们午餐时做的事情，喝酒可以放松舌头。
And so get with the program, and if you can't, then why don't we-- you know, why don't you put on a dress.
所以，继续这个计划，如果你做不到，那我们为什么不——你知道，你为什么不穿上裙子。
But then he, at lunch he definitely opened up a little bit more.
但后来他在午餐时确实开放了一些。
I mean, he wasn't looking at me when he answered questions, but he was answering them and he was speaking more expansively about life on the bridge.
我的意思是，他回答问题时并没有看着我，但他正在回答问题，并且更广泛地谈论桥上的生活。
Did he explain why it is that he does this?
他有解释为什么他这样做吗？
He said he had read a newspaper article about the bridge and about people jumping off the bridge, and he himself had grown up in the country outside of Naan-jing, so he really related, in particular, to these people from the villages who came to the bridge to end their lives and whose lives were hard and full of despair, and he completely understood that.
他说他在报纸上看过一篇关于这座桥和人们跳桥的文章，而且他自己是在南靖以外的乡下长大的，所以他对这些从村里来桥上结束生命的人特别有感情，他们的生活很艰难，充满了绝望，他完全理解这一点。
So you go back up to the bridge and he putters off in his moped, and then--
所以你回到桥上，他骑着轻便摩托车起步，然后——
Yeah, and then he jumped on his moped to go on his rounds, and I didn't have anything to do, but I turned to the translator, Susan, and I said, hey, let's take a little walk out on the bridge.
是的，然后他跳上轻便摩托车去巡视，我没什么可做的，但我转向翻译苏珊，我说，嘿，我们到桥上散散步吧。
And so we started walking out over the bridge, and we're chatting a little bit, and this guy kind of came lurching by, and I didn't pay any attention to him, but this guy's about 20 feet, 30 feet ahead of us, and he seems to be climbing up on the railing.
于是我们开始走出桥，我们聊了一会儿，这个家伙摇摇晃晃地走过来，我没有注意到他，但是这个家伙在我们前面大约 20 英尺、30 英尺，他似乎正在爬上栏杆。
And, at that point, I just yelled, hey, and then I said to Susan, he's going to go over.
那时，我只是大喊，嘿，然后我对苏珊说，他要过去了。
And I started running for him, and Susan came running.
我开始为他奔跑，苏珊也跑过来。
And I had that one little flash of Mr. Chen saying, some of these people will really take you with them if they can.
我突然想起陈先生说，如果可以的话，这些人中的一些人真的会带你一起去。
They're that desperate.
他们就是这么绝望。
And I had that little flash, like this would be a stupid way to die.
我有一点闪光，好像这是一种愚蠢的死亡方式。
This would be ridiculous if I go down with this guy, but it didn't come to that, because when I got to him I had my foot on the inside of the sort of the concrete buttress, and I tried to flip him back toward me.
如果我和这个家伙一起倒下，那就太荒谬了，但事情并没有发展到那一步，因为当我走到他身边时，我的脚踩在了那种混凝土扶壁的内侧，我试图把他翻回到我身边。
And he was completely limp.
他完全瘫软了。
He was like a bag of sawdust.
他就像一袋锯末。
He just flipped right back on to me, and I hadn't even really pulled him that hard.
他只是转回到我身上，而我什至没有真正用力拉他。
It's hard to explain, but, like, when I think of it, I just get-- I have to say, I have just goosebumps all over my body right now.
这很难解释，但是，就像，当我想到这一点时，我不得不说，我现在浑身起鸡皮疙瘩。
Because?
因为？
Mike Paternini Because he was going to kill himself.
迈克·帕特尼尼 因为他要自杀。
And because he didn't.
因为他没有。
So did you feel good?
那么你感觉好吗？
Mike Paternini No, I didn't feel good.
迈克·帕特尼尼 不，我感觉不太好。
I felt like kind of nauseous.
我感觉有点恶心。
I felt like, wow, there, every week, somebody actually does this thing, and even if we were to clone Mr. Chen and there were 200 of him out there, they probably-- still, one a week, someone would figure out how to do it.
我感觉，哇，每周都会有人真正做这件事，即使我们要克隆陈先生，而且那里有 200 个他，他们可能 - 仍然，每周一个，有人会弄清楚如何做到这一点。
And then, like, oh my god, who's coming next?
然后，天哪，下一个是谁？
You know?
你知道？
Yeah, well, it took Mr. Chen a while to come back on his moped, but when he came, when he showed up, the crowd sort of parted, and I was holding onto this man, whose name was Fan Ping.
是啊，陈先生花了一段时间才骑着轻便摩托车回来，但是当他来的时候，当他出现的时候，人群就分开了，我抓住了这个人，他的名字叫范平。
And he said to me, step away, which I thought was a really bad idea, because we're standing right next to the railing.
他对我说，走开，我认为这是一个非常糟糕的主意，因为我们就站在栏杆旁边。
But he had such command of the situation and all the nuances of the situation that I just stepped away.
但他对局势以及局势的所有细微差别有着如此的掌控力，以至于我只能走开。
I just let go and stepped away.
我只是放手走开。
And then he said, I want to take your picture, which seemed like, you know-- I didn't even understand what that was about.
然后他说，我想给你拍张照片，这看起来就像，你知道——我什至不明白那是什么意思。
Yeah.
是的。
So he pulls out his cell phone with a camera, takes a picture.
于是，他拿出带有相机的手机，拍了一张照片。
And then he says, and now I think I should punch you in the face.
然后他说，现在我想我应该打你的脸。
Holy-- Mike Paternini And then he said, you call yourself Chinese.
天啊——迈克·帕特尼尼 然后他说，你称自己为中国人。
How dare you?
你怎么敢？
How dare use call yourself Chinese, come up on this bridge with the intention of killing yourself today?
今天怎么敢自称为中国人，上这座桥来自杀？
You are somebody's son.
你是某人的儿子。
How dare you?
你怎么敢？
I am going to punch you in the face.
我要打你的脸。
I'm going to punch you right now.
我现在就要打你。
And the crowd, of course, is, like, crushing in because they think there's going to-- they think he's going to punch him.
当然，人群会挤过来，因为他们认为他会打他。
And I'm just sitting here like with my mouth open as he's saying this.
当他说这句话时，我就张着嘴坐在这里。
So he kind of takes another step in closer and Fan Ping says, look, I'm only doing this because my father was in the Red Army and he's lost all of his disability insurance, and there's no way for him to live anymore, and I'm a lousy son because I can't provide for him, and all of our documents burned in a fire, and without those documents we can't get any help.
于是他又靠近了一步，范平说，你看，我这么做只是因为我父亲在红军，他失去了所有的伤残保险，他已经没有办法再活下去了，而我是一个糟糕的儿子，因为我无法养活他，我们所有的文件都在火中烧毁了，没有这些文件我们无法获得任何帮助。
And Mr. Chen says, there nothing worth this.
陈先生说，没有什么值得的。
There's no problem that we can't solve.
没有我们解决不了的问题。
And then he moves in a little bit closer and he touches his arm, just sort of holding him by the elbow with, like, his right hand.
然后他靠近了一点，触碰了他的手臂，就像是用右手握住了他的肘部。
Mr. Chen says, I think I can help.
陈先生说，我想我可以帮忙。
I don't like this.
我不喜欢这个。
I don't like what you're doing here.
我不喜欢你在这里做的事。
This isn't the way to solve anything.
这不是解决任何问题的方法。
And, at that point, they have each other's word that they're going to meet on Monday morning at Mr. Chen's office.
那时，他们互相承诺，将于周一早上在陈先生的办公室见面。
Do you get creeped out on any big bridge now?
你现在在任何一座大桥上都会感到害怕吗？
Yeah.
是的。
Well, obviously, after having been on the bridge, I started looking at bridges for their suicide potential.
嗯，显然，在登上桥之后，我开始研究桥梁的自杀潜力。
And every bridge is that bridge in Naan-jing, and every person is potentially Fan Ping, and every other person is potentially Mr. Chen.
每一座桥都是南井的那座桥，每个人都可能是范平，其他人都可能是陈先生。
And you kind of look at it like, oh, I wonder if that is a bridge people would jump from.
你看着它就像，哦，我想知道那是否是一座人们会跳下去的桥。
And I wonder if maybe someone should be out here.
我想知道是否应该有人在这里。
Mike Paternini.
迈克·帕特尼尼.
His account of meeting Mr. Chen is in the current issue, the May issue, of GQ Magazine .
他与陈先生会面的经历发表在最新一期的《GQ》杂志五月号上。
[MUSIC - "THE BRIDGE" BY DOLLY PARTON].
[音乐 - 多莉·帕顿的《桥》]。
Act Two, Bridge and Tunnel.
第二幕，桥梁和隧道。
We've been talking about bridges so far in the show, but now we're going to turn to tunnel.
到目前为止，我们在节目中一直在谈论桥梁，但现在我们要转向隧道。
Same idea, just underground.
同样的想法，只是在地下。
Tunnels are natural for smuggling, and there's a place that's in the midst of a kind of tunnel fever right now for smuggling, the Gaza Strip.
隧道是走私的天然场所，加沙地带现在正处于走私的隧道热潮之中。
Gaza's the piece of land, of course, on Israel's southwestern corner at the border of Egypt.
当然，加沙是以色列西南角与埃及边境的一块土地。
About 1.5 million Palestinians live in Gaza.
大约有 150 万巴勒斯坦人居住在加沙。
And Gaza has had smuggling tunnels for a long time.
加沙长期以来就有走私隧道。
They were built years ago along the southern border of Gaza, the border it shares with Egypt, to bring in weapons.
它们是多年前沿着加沙南部边界（与埃及接壤的边界）建造的，用于运载武器。
But in the last couple of years, after Hamas took control of Gaza, Israel has blockaded the goods that come in and out of Gaza, severely restricted, and so now all kinds of stuff is going through those tunnels.
但近几年，哈马斯控制加沙后，以色列对进出加沙的货物进行了封锁，严格限制，所以现在各种东西都通过这些隧道。
That's the tunnel fever.
这就是隧道热。
Nobody knows exactly how many tunnels there are now, hundreds, possibly 1,000, more being built every day.
没有人确切知道现在有多少条隧道，数百条，可能是 1,000 条，每天都有更多隧道在建造。
They've become central to Gaza's economy.
它们已成为加沙经济的核心。
One of our producers, Nancy Updike, recently moved to the Middle East.
我们的一位制作人 Nancy Updike 最近搬到了中东。
She says they're now how a lot of basic goods get into Gaza.
她说，现在许多基本商品都是通过它们进入加沙的。
Clothing and flour and milk and cheese, cement, live animals, cigarettes, chocolate, oil, toothpaste, fish, prescription drugs, generators, computers, also gas and diesel, which are sometimes carried in by hand in cans, but are also pumped through the tunnels in these big hoses.
衣服、面粉、牛奶和奶酪、水泥、活体动物、香烟、巧克力、油、牙膏、鱼、处方药、发电机、电脑，还有汽油和柴油，有时用罐头手工运输，但也通过这些大软管的隧道泵送。
There's an organization called PalTrade.
有一个名为 PalTrade 的组织。
It's this economic data gathering group.
就是这个经济数据收集小组。
The World Bank quotes their statistics.
世界银行引用了他们的统计数据。
And according to PalTrade, about 100,000 litres of gas, and another 100,000 litres of diesel are being pumped into Gaza every day through these tunnels.
据 PalTrade 称，每天大约有 100,000 升天然气和另外 100,000 升柴油通过这些隧道被泵入加沙。
The PalTrade guy, also, by the way, sent me a QuickTime video of a car, a whole car, being driven through one of the bigger tunnels in Gaza.
顺便说一句，PalTrade 的家伙还给我发了一段 QuickTime 视频，视频中一辆汽车，一整辆车，驶过加沙一条较大的隧道。
So Nancy, so you've talked to this guy who owns his own tunnel?
南希，你已经和这个拥有自己隧道的人谈过了吗？
Yeah, I read about people dying in the tunnels, and I made a phone call with the translator, just to see what we could find out.
是的，我读到有人在隧道中死去，我给翻译打了电话，只是想看看我们能找到什么。
And we reached this guy who was very forthcoming.
我们找到了这个非常乐于助人的人。
He talked to us for a couple of hours.
他和我们聊了几个小时。
He just kind of took us along with him on his errands.
他只是带我们一起去办事。
You can hear him in the background as he's walking around.
当他四处走动时，您可以在背景中听到他的声音。
There are cars honking, occasionally he talks to people he runs into.
有汽车按喇叭，偶尔他会和遇到的人说话。
He puts us on hold a couple of times.
他让我们搁置了好几次。
We agreed to call him by a sort of classic Palestinian pseudonym, Abu Muhammad.
我们同意用一种典型的巴勒斯坦化名来称呼他：阿布·穆罕默德。
And he started out by telling us about the first tunnel he worked on, not the one he owns himself now, but the very first tunnel he dug a few years ago.
他首先向我们讲述了他建造的第一条隧道，不是他现在自己拥有的隧道，而是他几年前挖掘的第一条隧道。
How long did it take to start building the tunnel and to finish it?
隧道从开始建造到完工用了多长时间？
How long did that take?
那花了多长时间？
[TRANSLATING IN ARABIC]?
[翻译成阿拉伯语]？
Abu Muhammad [SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
阿布·穆罕默德 [用阿拉伯语发言]。
One whole year.
整整一年。
Nancy Updike Did anyone die or get injured building the tunnel?
南希·厄普代克 (Nancy Updike) 修建隧道时是否有人死亡或受伤？
[SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
[用阿拉伯语发言]。
Translator Two died.
翻译二号死了。
How did the people die?
人民是怎么死的？
Abu Muhammad [SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
阿布·穆罕默德 [用阿拉伯语发言]。
The first one died when the digging that we have being doing in the tunnel fell on him, buried him.
当我们在隧道中进行的挖掘工作落在他身上并埋葬他时，第一个人死了。
Number one.
第一。
And the second one died when the Egyptians put gas in such a way to poison the whole atmosphere.
当埃及人以这样的方式放毒气来毒害整个大气层时，第二个人就死了。
They did that to try to shut the tunnel down and stop the smuggling?
他们这样做是为了试图关闭隧道并阻止走私？
[SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
[用阿拉伯语发言]。
Translator It is a correct assumption on your part.
译者你的假设是正确的。
This is why they did it.
这就是他们这样做的原因。
There was a time when we could not go inside out tunnel for three months.
曾经有一段时间，我们三个月都不能进出隧道。
We had to evacuate it for three months in order for the gas to go out.
为了让气体熄灭，我们不得不疏散它三个月。
Once it was out, we resumed work.
事情结束后，我们又开始工作了。
And does the gas have a smell?
气体有气味吗？
How do you know that the gas is in the tunnel?
你怎么知道隧道里有气体？
[SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
[用阿拉伯语发言]。
Translator It does not have a smell.
翻译：它没有气味。
We find out in two ways: when people start fainting, losing consciousness, we know that the Egyptians have put this gas.
我们通过两种方式找到答案：当人们开始昏厥、失去知觉时，我们就知道埃及人放了这种气体。
Secondly, we find out about this gas from the amin.
其次，我们从阿明中了解这种气体。
Amin means the person from whom we buy on the Egyptian side.
阿明是指我们在埃及方面购买的人。
He is the one who notifies us about the coming of the Egyptian officials and in terms of gas or other things.
他是通知我们埃及官员到来以及天然气或其他事宜的人。
Sometimes they put bombs as well.
有时他们也会放置炸弹。
Yes, lots of things can go wrong and do go wrong.
是的，很多事情都可能出错，而且确实会出错。
I mean, since I've been here, I think there have been stories every single week about Palestinians dying in the tunnels.
我的意思是，自从我来到这里以来，我认为每周都会有关于巴勒斯坦人死于隧道的故事。
Just last week, four guys died in a tunnel.
就在上周，四名男子在隧道中死亡。
The Palestinians are accusing the Egyptians of gassing them.
巴勒斯坦人指责埃及人向他们投放毒气。
Egypt denies using gas in the tunnels ever.
埃及否认曾在隧道中使用过天然气。
Tunnels sometimes collapse on their own.
隧道有时会自行塌陷。
And there are always a lot men underground working in the tunnels.
隧道里总是有很多人在地下工作。
PalTrade, that organization I was talking about earlier, estimates that the tunnels employ 30,000 people.
我之前提到的 PalTrade 组织估计这些隧道雇用了 30,000 名员工。
Oh my god.
我的天啊。
Nancy Updike Yeah.
南希·厄普代克 是的。
They don't all work underground, but there are a lot of people under the border between Gaza and Egypt at any given time.
他们并不都在地下工作，但在任何特定时间，加沙和埃及之间的边界下都有很多人。
[SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
[用阿拉伯语发言]。
Translator One was 19 years old and one was 24 years old.
翻译者一名 19 岁，一名 24 岁。
When someone dies in the tunnel, is there any compensation to the family?
当有人在隧道中死亡时，家属有什么补偿吗？
[SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
[用阿拉伯语发言]。
Translator Yes, there is compensation.
翻译是的，有补偿。
For a married man, the compensation is $11,000.
对于已婚男子，赔偿金为 11,000 美元。
For an unmarried man, for a bachelor, it's $9,000.
对于一个未婚男子来说，对于一个单身汉来说，是9000美元。
These are the conditions put upon the tunnel owner.
这些是对隧道所有者提出的条件。
He has to comply with the government's laws and orders.
他必须遵守政府的法律和命令。
[SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
[用阿拉伯语发言]。
Translator This is correct.
译者这是正确的。
So the government knows about this and the government has rules for this sort of thing?
那么政府知道这件事并且政府对这类事情有规则吗？
Absolutely.
绝对地。
The government is Hamas in Gaza now, and it controls all of Gaza.
现在的政府是加沙的哈马斯，它控制着整个加沙。
And Hamas controls the tunnels.
哈马斯控制着隧道。
They own some of the tunnels outright and operate them themselves, but they control all of them.
他们完全拥有一些隧道并自行运营，但他们控制着所有隧道。
They shut them down when they want.
他们想什么时候就关闭它们。
They tax whatever goods they want at whatever rate they want.
他们以任何税率对任何他们想要的商品征税。
I've also heard about licensing fees the government's been charging to open tunnels, somewhere between $2,000 and $3,000.
我还听说政府对开放隧道收取许可费，大约在 2,000 美元到 3,000 美元之间。
Basically, what all this means is that smuggling through the tunnels in Gaza is becoming, in some ways, more and more a regular import/export point, taxes, licenses, regulations.
基本上，这一切意味着，通过加沙隧道的走私在某种程度上正越来越成为常规的进出口点、税收、许可证和法规。
It's nowhere near as regulated as an actual import/export would be, but these are holes in the ground covered by tents, just being dug by whoever can pull it off.
它远没有像实际的进出口那样受监管，但这些都是帐篷覆盖的地面上的洞，只要能把它拉下来的人就可以挖。
[SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
[用阿拉伯语发言]。
Translator [SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
译者[阿拉伯语]。
[SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
[用阿拉伯语发言]。
Translator [SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
译者[阿拉伯语]。
[SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
[用阿拉伯语发言]。
Translator He has to disconnect for a very important issue for one minute.
译者 他因一个非常重要的问题而必须断线一分钟。
Putting us on hold.
让我们搁置。
[PHONE BEEPING ON HOLD] [SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
[电话保持蜂鸣声] [用阿拉伯语说话]。
[SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
[用阿拉伯语发言]。
Translator There was a problem.
翻译有问题。
What was the problem?
问题出在哪里？
Abu Muhammad [SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
阿布·穆罕默德 [用阿拉伯语发言]。
I was notified that there was a problem with the electrical power inside the tunnel.
我被告知隧道内电力出现问题。
Was the person calling to ask what he should do or to get permission to do something?
这个人打电话是想询问他应该做什么或获得做某事的许可吗？
[SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
[用阿拉伯语发言]。
Translator I was told, I was asked to contact the person in charge of repairing the electricity.
翻译 我被告知，让我联系负责修电的人。
There was a breakdown in electricity at a time that my workers were bringing in merchandise.
我的工人正在运送商品时发生了停电。
This guy started out a few years ago.
这家伙几年前就开始了。
He was 19 years old, and he was just another tunnel digger.
他当时19岁，只是另一个隧道挖掘者。
And he said when he was digging it was 15 diggers at a time, making about $20 a day, working 12-hour shifts, six days a week.
他说，当他挖掘时，一次有 15 名挖掘机，每天工作 20 美元，轮班工作 12 小时，每周工作 6 天。
And once they're finished digging the tunnel, the workers get a percentage of what the tunnel brings in once it's operating as a smuggling operation.
一旦隧道挖掘完毕，工人们就可以从隧道作为走私活动所带来的收入中获得一定比例的收益。
And it's $20 a day, is that a lot of money, a little money?
而且每天20美元，这是很多钱还是一点钱？
It's better than joining the 39% who are unemployed.
这比加入 39% 的失业者行列要好。
And so if I'm a laborer and I work in a tunnel, and then I get a percentage once the tunnel is functioning, like how much money can that mean?
因此，如果我是一名工人，在隧道中工作，那么一旦隧道投入使用，我就会得到一定的百分比，比如这意味着多少钱？
This guy said, when he started to get a percentage, he was making about $70 a day.
这个人说，当他开始提成时，他每天大约能赚 70 美元。
That was his cut.
那是他的切口。
And he's getting that $70, not because he's working, carrying stuff through the tunnel, but simply for the work he did in building the tunnel?
他得到那 70 美元，不是因为他在工作，搬运东西穿过隧道，而仅仅是因为他在建造隧道时所做的工作？
No, when the tunnel is finished being dug, then those workers become the workers who bring the goods through, so he is doing the work of bringing the goods through.
不是，当隧道挖好了之后，那些工人就变成了带货物通过的工人，所以他就在做带货物通过的工作。
He's still going to work for it, but it's a better wage for still a very difficult, dangerous job.
他仍然会为此工作，但对于仍然是一项非常困难、危险的工作来说，这已经是更好的工资了。
How did you make the transition from being a worker to owning your own tunnel?
您是如何从一名工人转变为拥有自己的隧道的？
[SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
[用阿拉伯语发言]。
Translator I used to take a percentage from working in the tunnel.
译者 我曾经从在隧道工作中抽取一定比例的佣金。
Then I sold my land, my family's land, in order to work more into the tunnels.
然后我卖掉了我的土地，我家人的土地，以便在隧道中进行更多工作。
Was that a big decision, something that you'd thought about for a long time?
这是一个重大决定吗？是你考虑了很长时间的决定吗？
[SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
[用阿拉伯语发言]。
Translator It was a very difficult decision; however, there was no alternative to this.
这是一个非常艰难的决定；然而，除此之外别无选择。
I had to do it.
我必须这么做。
So that's unusual, right?
所以这很不寻常，对吧？
Nancy Updike The translator and I were both very surprised when he said that he sold his family's land.
南希·厄普代克 (Nancy Updike) 当他说他卖掉了家里的土地时，我和翻译都感到非常惊讶。
This is not something that Palestinians do.
这不是巴勒斯坦人做的事。
[SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
[用阿拉伯语发言]。
Translator I started as a worker, and then I realized that more tunnels were being dug.
我最初是一名工人，然后我意识到正在挖掘更多的隧道。
And I also realized that the money I was getting as a worker was not enough.
我也意识到我作为工人得到的钱是不够的。
Therefore, I decided to do my own tunnel.
因此，我决定自己做隧道。
How big is your tunnel?
你的隧道有多大？
Can you stand up in it?
你能在其中站起来吗？
Can you touch the sides if you hold out your hands?
如果你伸出双手，你能触摸到侧面吗？
[SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
[用阿拉伯语发言]。
tunnel Translator My tunnel is 1.6 to 1.7 in height, 1.2 to 1.3 in width.
隧道翻译 我的隧道高度为 1.6 至 1.7，宽度为 1.2 至 1.3。
Hey, Nancy, I'll just stop the tape there.
嘿，南希，我就把磁带停在那里。
What do those numbers mean?
这些数字是什么意思？
It's 1.6 meters and 1.2 meters.
分别是1.6米和1.2米。
1.6 meters is just over five feet, and 1.2 meters is over three feet, almost four feet.
1.6米就是五英尺多一点，1.2米就是三英尺多一点，快四英尺了。
Wait, wait, wait, so it's just over five feet tall and just over three feet wide?
等等，等等，等等，所以它只有五英尺多高，三英尺多宽？
So this is, like, it's tiny.
所以这就像，它很小。
Yeah, there are tunnels of all different sizes.
是的，有各种大小的隧道。
Some tunnels are massive.
有些隧道很大。
I mean, like I was saying earlier, there are tunnels you can drive a car through.
我的意思是，就像我之前说的，有些隧道你可以开车穿过。
And how deep are the tunnels?
隧道有多深？
Nancy Updike Around 30 feet.
南希·厄普代克 大约 30 英尺。
It varies.
它有所不同。
30 feet deep?
30英尺深？
Nancy Updike Yeah, and, from what I've seen, there's sort of a swing that the guy sits on that's on a winch, and he's kind of lowered down into the tunnel.
南希·厄普代克：是的，据我所知，那家伙坐在一个绞盘上的秋千上，然后他就被降到了隧道里。
Excuse the personal question, but where do you go to the bathroom in the tunnel?
请原谅我问个人问题，请问隧道里的洗手间在哪里？
[SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
[用阿拉伯语发言]。
Translator A worker, if he needs to urinate, then he can do it only in a bottle.
翻译：一个工人，如果他需要小便，那么他只能在瓶子里尿。
However, if he needs to do much more than this, he has to leave the tunnel.
然而，如果他需要做的远不止于此，他就必须离开隧道。
Nancy, you're asking about that, like needing to use the bathroom, it occurs to me, somehow I pictured these tunnels being like, OK, they go, there's a tent, they go underneath it like a fence or something on the edge of, like, the border, and they come up right on the other side of the fence.
南希，你问的是这个，就像需要使用浴室一样，我突然想到，不知怎的，我想象这些隧道就像，好吧，它们走了，有一个帐篷，它们像栅栏或边界边缘的东西一样进入它下面，然后它们就出现在栅栏的另一边。
No. Ira Glass Like, so they're not very far, but you saying this makes me realize, like, how far are these?
不。 Ira Glass 就像，所以它们不是很远，但你这么说让我意识到，就像，这些有多远？
Well, the length varies.
嗯，长度不同。
I've heard of tunnels 250 feet, and others less than that.
我听说过 250 英尺长的隧道，还有其他更短的隧道。
But it's not just popping under a fence.
但它不仅仅是在栅栏下突然出现。
I mean, these guys are underground for a long time.
我的意思是，这些人已经在地下呆了很长时间了。
This guy, Abu Muhammad, was saying that they have an intercom system set up, you know, what you would have in a multi-story house for the person on the first floor to talk to the person on the third floor.
这个人，阿布·穆罕默德，说他们设置了一个对讲系统，你知道，在多层房子里，一楼的人可以与三楼的人通话。
And as we were talking about his tunnel and how it operates, I asked the obvious question:
当我们谈论他的隧道及其运作方式时，我问了一个显而易见的问题：
[SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
[用阿拉伯语发言]。
Abu Muhammad [SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
阿布·穆罕默德 [用阿拉伯语发言]。
No. Ira Glass Do you believe him that he hasn't ran any guns through the tunnel?
不，艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass）：你相信他没有在隧道中开枪吗？
No, I think whatever people pay to bring in through the tunnels, he and everyone else brings in.
不，我认为无论人们付多少钱通过隧道带进来，他和其他人都会带来。
And, again, Hamas is the one ultimately in control of the tunnels, so even though this guy owns his own tunnel, if Hamas wants to bring in weapons or cement or anything else, it's coming in through whichever tunnels they dictate.
再说一次，哈马斯是隧道的最终控制者，所以即使这个人拥有自己的隧道，如果哈马斯想要引进武器、水泥或其他任何东西，那就从他们指定的任何隧道进入。
This guy, though, did go on to say something very surprising about weapons smuggling in the tunnels.
不过，这个人确实接着说了一些关于隧道中武器走私的非常令人惊讶的事情。
[SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
[用阿拉伯语发言]。
Translator A strange thing happened concerning weapons.
关于武器，发生了一件奇怪的事情。
Because weapons are not allowed in the streets of Gaza, therefore there's no need to have weapons.
由于加沙街头不允许携带武器，因此没有必要携带武器。
So weapons became extremely cheap.
所以武器变得极其便宜。
What we have done is to transport weapons to Egypt.
我们所做的就是向埃及运送武器。
We are making $100 per weapon by selling it in Egypt, vice versa.
我们通过在埃及销售每件武器赚取 100 美元，反之亦然。
And this, to me, is extremely strange.
这对我来说非常奇怪。
[SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
[用阿拉伯语发言]。
Translator We are sending guns and Kalashnikovs.
我们正在发送枪支和卡拉什尼科夫冲锋枪。
Wait, wait, Nancy, so in other words, he's saying that they're not bringing weapons into Gaza, basically, they're exporting weapons from Gaza into Egypt and making a profit?
等等，等等，南希，换句话说，他是说他们没有将武器带入加沙，基本上，他们是从加沙向埃及出口武器并从中获利？
Well, he's saying that's what he's doing.
嗯，他说这就是他正在做的事情。
And, again, I don't know.
再说一遍，我不知道。
He may be bringing weapons in, too.
他可能也携带武器进来。
But I believe him that he's also sending them out.
但我相信他也会把他们送出去。
So this guy's making this huge economic gamble.
所以这家伙正在进行这场巨大的经济赌博。
He's selling off his family's land to invest in this tunnel.
他正在卖掉家人的土地来投资这条隧道。
Is it working for him?
对他有用吗？
Is he getting rich?
他发财了吗？
Well, here's what he said.
嗯，这就是他说的。
Abu Muhammad [SPEAKING IN ARABIC].
阿布·穆罕默德 [用阿拉伯语发言]。
Before, we used to make between $5,000 to $10,000 dollars a month.
以前，我们每个月的收入在 5,000 美元到 10,000 美元之间。
And the money we were making was good.
我们赚的钱也不错。
But now it has decreased from $5,000 to $1,500 a month.
但现在已经从每月 5,000 美元降至 1,500 美元。
Now there's an abundance of tunnels all over the area.
现在该地区到处都有大量的隧道。
And therefore, the work has not become unique.
因此，这项工作并没有变得独一无二。
There's a lot of tunnels, and therefore, you make less money.
有很多隧道，因此，你赚的钱更少。
Nancy, doesn't he face one other economic risk, and that is that if there were peace, if peace would break out between the Israelis and the Palestinians, these tunnels wouldn't have a reason to exist, and his whole investment would go to hell?
南希，他难道没有面临另一种经济风险吗？那就是，如果有和平，如果以色列和巴勒斯坦之间爆发和平，这些隧道就没有理由存在，他的全部投资都会化为泡影？
Does he worry at all about peace?
他真的担心和平吗？
I didn't ask him, but I don't think he's worried about peace.
我没有问他，但我认为他并不担心和平。
I think he's a lot more worried about his tunnel collapsing than he's worried about Israel making peace with Hamas.
我认为他更担心自己的隧道倒塌，而不是担心以色列与哈马斯实现和平。
Nancy Updike is one of the producers of our show.
南希·厄普代克是我们节目的制片人之一。
Coming up, city and county laws that force possibly dangerous ex-cons to be homeless and move under a bridge.
即将出台的市县法律将迫使可能危险的前科犯无家可归并搬到桥下。
If I asked you to guess which state, which sunny, sunny state would do that, which would you guess?
如果我让你猜哪个州、哪个阳光明媚、阳光明媚的州会这么做，你会猜哪个？
Answers in a minute from Chicago Public Radio and Public Radio International when our program continues.
当我们的节目继续进行时，芝加哥公共广播电台和国际公共广播电台将在一分钟内答复。
This is This American Life , I'm Ira Glass.
这就是美国生活，我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Each week in our show, of course, we choose a theme, bring you different kinds of stories on that theme.
当然，我们的节目每周都会选择一个主题，为您带来有关该主题的不同类型的故事。
Today's show, the bridge, stories of people living at various bridges of various sorts.
今天的节目，桥，生活在各种桥上的人们的故事。
We have arrived at act three of our show.
我们已经到了演出的第三幕了。
This next story takes place under a bridge.
下一个故事发生在一座桥下。
You may have heard about this bridge, where a bunch of ex-cons, sex offenders, set up camp in Miami.
您可能听说过这座桥，一群有前科的性犯罪者在迈阿密安营扎寨。
South Florida is known for sun, sand, and surf, but the welcoming committee on your Miami beach is now this: convicted sex offenders.
南佛罗里达州以阳光、沙滩和冲浪而闻名，但迈阿密海滩上的欢迎委员会现在是这样的：被定罪的性犯罪者。
They are pitching tents and camping out by the Julia Tuttle Causeway.
他们正在朱莉娅·塔特尔堤道旁搭帐篷露营。
You may have seen them when you drive by and wondered why they're there.
您开车经过时可能会看到它们，并想知道它们为什么在那里。
Why they're there is because, in 2005, Miami Dade County passed a law that required sex offenders who were coming out of jail to find housing at least 2,500 feet from any school, playground, or daycare.
他们之所以出现在那里，是因为 2005 年，迈阿密戴德县通过了一项法律，要求出狱的性犯罪者必须在距离学校、游乐场或日托中心至少 2,500 英尺的地方找到住房。
You probably heard about these residency restriction laws.
您可能听说过这些居住限制法。
Communities all over the country have them, but Miami's was, at the time, probably the strictest law of its kind.
全国各地的社区都有这些法律，但迈阿密的法律在当时可能是同类法律中最严格的。
If you think about it, 2,500 feet, that's half a mile, eight football fields, in a densely packed city, from any school, park, or daycare.
如果你想一想，2,500 英尺，相当于半英里，相当于八个足球场，在人口稠密的城市中，距任何学校、公园或日托所。
The entire city of Miami Beach, one of the cities that's in that county, is barely a mile wide at its widest point, was now effectively off limits to sex offenders, which its mayor acknowledged.
迈阿密海滩市是该县的城市之一，其最宽处仅一英里，现在实际上已禁止性犯罪者进入，该市市长承认这一点。
So under this bridge was one of the few spots that sex offenders in Dade County could legally live.
所以这座桥下是戴德县性犯罪者可以合法居住的少数地方之一。
Isaiah Thompson broke this story in 2007 for the Miami New Times .
2007 年，以赛亚·汤普森 (Isaiah Thompson) 为《迈阿密新时报》报道了这个故事。
He's been closely following it ever since.
从那时起他就一直密切关注着这件事。
He says the fact that they ended up at the bridge is really just the beginning.
他说他们最终到达桥的事实只是一个开始。
What's happened under this bridge all came to pass because of one man, and he's probably the only one who can fix it, too.
这座桥下发生的一切都是因为一个人而发生的，而他也可能是唯一能够解决这个问题的人。
He's a man with a mission, and his job is to get missions done, Ron Book.
他是一个有使命的人，他的工作就是完成使命，罗恩·布克。
I use my soap box.
我用我的肥皂盒。
I use my forum.
我用我的论坛。
I use my skills.
我用我的技能。
I have a skill set that makes me the number-one ranked guy in this business.
我拥有一套技能，使我成为这个行业中排名第一的人。
Ron Book's business is lobbying.
罗恩·布克的业务是游说。
He's one of the most powerful and influential lobbyists in Florida, a man who refers to the local sheriff as my sheriff, and the state attorney as my state attorney.
他是佛罗里达州最有权势、最有影响力的游说者之一，他称当地治安官为“我的治安官”，称州检察官为“我的州检察官”。
He can be charming and gracious, but when he has a point to make, he doesn't hold back.
他可以很迷人，也很亲切，但当他有观点要表达时，他会毫不犹豫。
See that sign?
看到那个标志了吗？
See that sign right there?
看到那里的那个标志了吗？
He points to two plaques on a wall that's otherwise covered with awards and pictures of him shaking hands with famous people.
他指着墙上的两块牌匾，墙上挂满了奖项和他与名人握手的照片。
See that sign right there?
看到那里的那个标志了吗？
It says it can be done.
它说可以做到。
See that sign?
看到那个标志了吗？
Nothing is impossible.
没有什么是不可能的。
What sets me out from the others is I'm driven.
我与其他人的不同之处在于我有动力。
What sets me out from the others is I've got more passion.
我与其他人的不同之处在于我有更多的热情。
What sets me out from the others is I get up earlier than most everybody else in this business and I stay up later and I get it done.
我与其他人的不同之处在于，我比这个行业的大多数其他人起得早，熬夜得晚，但我能把事情做好。
Don't take my word for it.
别相信我的话。
Go out there and ask my colleagues.
出去问问我的同事。
Pick up the phone, call the other five or six or eight super-lobbyists in this business, and ask them who works harder than anybody else.
拿起电话，给这个行业的另外五六八个超级说客打电话，问问他们谁比谁都努力。
That's what sets me out.
这就是我的出发点。
I'm tenacious.
我很顽强。
I'm nasty if I have to be nasty.
如果我必须变得讨厌的话，我就是讨厌的。
I'm firm if I gotta be firm.
如果我必须坚定的话，我就坚定。
I'm direct if I gotta be direct.
如果我必须直接的话，我就直接。
You know, my job is to get it done.
你知道，我的工作就是完成它。
And right now, right now, the victims of sexual abuse, the victims of sexual assault, got a guy who is the worst enemy of abusers and offenders and predators and pedophiles, because I am obsessed, because I will spend the rest of my life working to protect people.
现在，现在，性虐待的受害者，性侵犯的受害者，找到了一个是施虐者、罪犯、掠夺者和恋童癖者最大敌人的人，因为我很着迷，因为我将用我的余生致力于保护人们。
That's my job.
这就是我的工作。
That's my job.
这就是我的工作。
Why is it my job?
为什么这是我的工作？
It's my job because, unfortunately for me, I have a daughter who suffered at the hands of a no-good-for-nothing, no-good-for-nothing, no redeeming qualities, no redeeming social values, no redeeming humanistic values, who raped my daughter, who beat my daughter.
这是我的工作，因为对我来说不幸的是，我有一个女儿，她在一个一无是处、一无是处、没有救赎品质、没有救赎社会价值观、没有救赎人文价值观的人手中受苦，他们强奸了我的女儿，殴打了我的女儿。
I am the predators' and offenders' worst enemy.
我是掠夺者和罪犯最大的敌人。
I am their worst nightmare, and I will be that forever until the day I die when they put me in a pine box and put me in the ground.
我是他们最可怕的噩梦，我将永远如此，直到我死的那一天，他们把我放在一个松木盒子里，然后把我埋在地里。
Around 15 years ago, Ron Book hired a nanny who started molesting his daughter.
大约 15 年前，罗恩·布克 (Ron Book) 雇了一名保姆，但保姆开始猥亵他的女儿。
It's an awful story.
这是一个可怕的故事。
The nanny was arrested, brought to trial, and sent to prison, but that was just the beginning for Book.
保姆被捕、受审、入狱，但这对布克来说只是开始。
When he found out there was no law compelling convicted sex offenders to provide blood samples for HIV tests, he wrote one and got it passed.
当他发现没有法律强制被定罪的性犯罪者提供血液样本进行艾滋病毒检测时，他写了一份并获得通过。
When the nanny started writing letters to his daughter from prison, and Book found out there was no law explicitly against it, he simply went ahead and got that law passed, too.
当保姆开始从监狱里给他的女儿写信时，布克发现没有明确的法律禁止这样做，他干脆直接让这项法律也通过了。
It's now called the Lauren Book Protection Act, after his daughter.
现在，该法案以他女儿的名字命名为《劳伦图书保护法》。
But Book didn't stop there.
但布克并没有就此止步。
He and his daughter went on a kind of tour of Florida, pushing residency restrictions.
他和他的女儿进行了一次佛罗里达州之旅，推动了居住限制。
In 2005, he helped write and pass the law in Miami Dade County that required sex offenders to find housing at least 2,500 feet from any school, playground, or daycare, leaving sex offenders with very few places to live.
2005 年，他帮助迈阿密戴德县起草并通过了一项法律，要求性犯罪者必须在距离学校、游乐场或日托中心至少 2,500 英尺的地方找到住房，这使得性犯罪者几乎没有地方可住。
They ended up under that bridge, homeless.
他们最终来到了桥下，无家可归。
And the person in Miami Dade that's in charge of helping homeless people like these find homes and jobs, the person with the resources, the manpower, and a budget of $40 million to help them also happens to be Ron Book.
迈阿密戴德县负责帮助这些无家可归者找到住房和工作的人，拥有资源、人力和 4000 万美元预算来帮助他们的人也恰好是罗恩·布克 (Ron Book)。
I am chairman of the Miami Dade County Homeless Trust.
我是迈阿密戴德县无家可归者信托基金会的主席。
I have been the chairman of this body for 16 years.
我担任这个机构的主席已有16年了。
This particular population is a piece of the homeless population and I have a responsibility to find them housing and jobs.
这个特殊群体是无家可归者的一部分，我有责任为他们找到住房和工作。
That's what my homeless trust does.
这就是我的无家可归者信托所做的事。
And these guys are a component of that.
这些人就是其中的一部分。
So the one person who could possibly help the sex offenders find a place to live is their biggest enemy, the person who got them there in the first place.
因此，能够帮助性犯罪者找到住处的人就是他们最大的敌人，也就是第一个把他们带到那里的人。
[CAR DRIVING] For as much press as this bridge has gotten, it's surprisingly hard to find.
[汽车驾驶] 尽管这座桥受到了很多媒体的关注，但它却出人意料地难以找到。
We're looking out for some kind of opening in the fence here.
我们正在这里的栅栏上寻找某种开口。
You're going to have to-- we might miss it the first time, because we're going so fast.
你将不得不——我们第一次可能会错过它，因为我们走得太快了。
My producer and I drove there one late and particularly cold night in February.
二月的一个深夜，我和我的制片人开车去那里，特别寒冷。
The bridge is part of a six-lane highway, the Julia Tuttle Causeway, which crosses the Biscayne Bay.
这座桥是穿越比斯坎湾的六车道高速公路朱莉娅·塔特尔堤道的一部分。
Put on your turn signal and then see if you can get over.
打开转向灯，然后看看是否可以过去。
I know it sounds crazy.
我知道这听起来很疯狂。
And drive on the shoulder?
并在路肩上行驶？
Isaiah Thompson Yeah, drive on the shoulder.
以赛亚·汤普森 是的，靠路肩行驶。
Wait, wait, wait, what's this?
等等，等等，等等，这是什么？
Yeah, this is it.
是的，就是这样。
This is it.
就是这样。
Go slow, because it's real rough terrain.
慢慢来，因为这是真正崎岖的地形。
Oh, my god.
我的天啊。
Isaiah Thompson We're on a tiny island in the middle of the bay.
以赛亚·汤普森（Isaiah Thompson） 我们在海湾中央的一个小岛上。
It's about a mile long, until recently, uninhabited.
它大约一英里长，直到最近还无人居住。
There are no exits on to the island, just a narrow opening in the guard rails, just before you get to the bridge, and a bumpy dirt path that leads underneath it.
岛上没有出口，只有在到达桥之前护栏上有一个狭窄的开口，桥下有一条崎岖不平的土路。
Here, hidden from the traffic above, we find a kind of post-apocalyptic outpost, scattered between the giant concrete columns that hold the bridge up are half a dozen wooden shanties, bicycles, and a makeshift fishing peer, a mound of rotting trash.
在这里，远离上面的交通，我们发现了一个后世界末日的前哨站，在支撑桥梁的巨大混凝土柱之间散布着六间木制棚屋、自行车和一个临时钓鱼点，还有一堆腐烂的垃圾。
Tents that have been fitted out with lights and furniture are tucked into little concrete alcoves high above us, in the rafters of the bridge, as if a particularly modern group of cavemen lived here.
配有灯光和家具的帐篷被塞进我们上方高处桥椽子上的混凝土小壁龛里，仿佛一群特别现代的穴居人住在这里。
The roar of electric generators blocks out almost every sound but the cars whooshing across the bridge overhead.
发电机的轰鸣声几乎掩盖了一切声音，除了头顶桥上呼啸而过的汽车声。
Hello, Patrick.
你好，帕特里克。
It's Isaiah.
这是以赛亚。
I first met Patrick Wiese three years ago, sleeping in a cardboard box.
三年前，我第一次见到帕特里克·威斯，当时我睡在一个纸板箱里。
Patrick had just come out of prison, where he'd spent two years and received 10 more years probation for molesting his nine-year-old stepdaughter, a charge to which he pled guilty after turning himself into the police at his wife's request.
帕特里克刚刚出狱，因猥亵他九岁的继女，他在监狱里呆了两年，又被判了十年缓刑，在妻子的要求下，他向警方自首，并承认了这一指控。
Considering his circumstances, what was surprising wasn't so much that he had ended up living in a box under a bridge, but how he had come to be right there precisely.
考虑到他的处境，令人惊讶的并不是他最终住在桥下的一个盒子里，而是他是如何准确地来到那里的。
His probation officer, he said, had ordered him to live there.
他说，他的缓刑官命令他住在那里。
I had a woman probation officer at that time, and she told me that I have to live underneath a bridge.
当时我有一位女缓刑官，她告诉我，我必须住在桥下。
I said, wait a minute, you're going to make me homeless?
我说，等一下，你要让我无家可归吗？
This is crazy.
这太疯狂了。
And she let me out the door, told me I have to be there by 10 o'clock at night.
她让我出了门，告诉我必须在晚上 10 点之前到达那里。
So for two or three months I lived, basically, out of a cardboard box.
所以，有两三个月的时间，我基本上是在纸箱里生活的。
For proof, Patrick extracted a few ratty sheets of paper.
为了证明这一点，帕特里克拿出了几张破烂的纸。
One was an official document, a department of corrections letterhead, indicating Patrick's address.
其中一份是一份官方文件，是惩戒部的抬头信笺，上面写着帕特里克的地址。
Bridge, it said.
桥，它说。
There are a handful of other places to live 2,500 feet from schools, playground, and daycare centers in the county.
该县还有一些其他地方可以居住，距离学校、游乐场和日托中心 2,500 英尺。
They include expensive gated communities most ex-cons can't afford, and the Everglades, where it's illegal to live, and a random apartment building here or there, but they're few and far between.
其中包括大多数前科犯买不起的昂贵的封闭式社区，以及非法居住的大沼泽地，以及随处可见的公寓楼，但数量很少且相隔很远。
So here's Patrick today.
今天是帕特里克。
He has a girlfriend and a cell phone, and for a while, a job working at a sub shop making sandwiches.
他有一个女朋友和一部手机，有一段时间在一家制作三明治的小店工作。
And I've been here almost three years now.
我来这里已经快三年了。
When I first came down here I had nothing.
当我第一次来到这里时，我什么都没有。
I acquired a tent, and I lived up on underneath the bridge.
我买了一个帐篷，住在桥下。
Now, I lived there for a little over a year in one tent.
现在，我在一个帐篷里住了一年多了。
In that year's time, I accumulated, let's see, a TV, lighting, a generator.
那一年的时间里，我积累了，让我们看看，一台电视，一台照明设备，一台发电机。
As you can see, I have my radio.
正如你所看到的，我有我的收音机。
I have my DVD player.
我有我的 DVD 播放机。
Right here is my shower.
这里是我的淋浴间。
It has like a--
它有一个——
Wow.
哇。
Patrick Wiese --a hot bag.
帕特里克·威斯（Patrick Wiese）——炙手可热的包包。
What that is a thermal shower.
那是什么热水淋浴。
You fill it up with water, you put it in the sun for two hours and it heats up, so you have hot water instead of taking a cold shower.
你把它装满水，把它放在阳光下两个小时，它就会升温，这样你就可以喝到热水，而不是洗冷水澡。
You know, the essentials.
你知道，必需品。
What began as three men living here became a kind of colony, a microcivilization.
最初居住在这里的三个人变成了一种殖民地，一种微型文明。
Tonight, it's nearing most people's curfew, 10 o'clock.
今晚，已经接近大多数人的宵禁时间，10 点。
An occasional car pulls in under the bridge, briefly lighting the place up and then rumbling off to park somewhere by the water.
偶尔会有一辆汽车停在桥下，短暂地照亮了这个地方，然后轰隆隆地停在水边的某个地方。
Other than that, it's dark and seedy.
除此之外，它又黑又破烂。
An occasional cigarette cherry reveals people hunkered down in the shadows, talking quietly, drinking.
偶尔的香烟樱桃揭示了人们蹲在阴影里，轻声交谈，喝酒。
Sex offenders getting out of prison are dropped off here like it's the most normal thing in the world.
出狱的性犯罪者会被扔到这里，就像这是世界上最正常的事情一样。
Voncel Johnson ended up under the Julia Tuttle Causeway in 2009.
2009 年，冯塞尔·约翰逊 (Voncel Johnson) 最终来到了朱莉娅·塔特尔堤道 (Julia Tuttle Causeway) 下。
She walks up to us in slippers and a bathrobe.
她穿着拖鞋和浴袍向我们走来。
When I got out of prison, I go-- they told me to go screening report to my probation officer, so I go to her.
当我出狱时，我去——他们告诉我去给我的缓刑官审查报告，所以我去找她。
She tell me, well, I'm sorry, Ms. Johnson, you can't go live where you were supposed to live at.
她告诉我，好吧，对不起，约翰逊女士，你不能住在你应该住的地方。
Now I have to go to the Julia Causeway bridge like, what the [BLEEP] is that?
现在我要去朱莉娅堤道桥，那是什么[BLEEP]？
I'm thinking, it's OK, it's a treatment.
我想，没关系，这是一种治疗。
You know, I didn't know.
你知道，我不知道。
So, in other words, you thought that the bridge was actually just the name of like a halfway house or a treatment.
所以，换句话说，你认为这座桥实际上只是一个中途宿舍或一种治疗的名称。
Yes, I was thinking it's a treatment center or something.
是的，我以为这是一个治疗中心之类的。
I didn't know the difference.
我不知道有什么区别。
I'm saying, and then you bring me down on this bridge.
我是说，然后你就把我带到这座桥上。
He just told me and aunty to follow behind her, and she was going to take us to this place.
他只是让我和阿姨跟在她身后，她要带我们去这个地方。
So you actually, the night that you showed up, she was with you, your probation officer?
所以你实际上，你出现的那天晚上，她和你在一起，你的缓刑官？
My probation officer brought me here and told me it's going to be OK.
我的缓刑官把我带到这里并告诉我一切都会好起来的。
Here it is about 10 o'clock at night, it's pitch dark here, no lights.
此时已是晚上十点左右，这里漆黑一片，没有灯光。
I see a 1,000 people coming up to my aunt's car like, are you going to be OK?
我看到 1,000 个人来到我姨妈的车前，问：你们没事吧？
No, I'm not going to be OK.
不，我不会好起来的。
I broke down.
我崩溃了。
I almost had a nervous breakdown.
我几乎精神崩溃了。
I told her I'd rather go back to prison and do my time and then get out and go where I can live.
我告诉她我宁愿回到监狱好好休息，然后出狱去我能住的地方。
But they told me I can't do that.
但他们告诉我我不能这么做。
I have to sleep under this bridge.
我必须睡在这座桥下。
Like Voncel, a lot of the people living under the bridge have family more than willing to take them in, but whose addresses don't comply with the law.
像冯塞尔一样，很多住在桥下的人都有家人愿意收留他们，但他们的地址不符合法律。
From the start, there were questions about whether the 2,500-foot rule that put all these people under this bridge actually accomplished what it was originally supposed to do, which was protect children.
从一开始，人们就质疑将所有这些人都放在这座桥下的 2,500 英尺规则是否真正实现了它最初的目的，即保护儿童。
For example, the law only restricts where sex offenders sleep, literally between the hours of 10 at night and 6 in the morning, when no kids are on the street, anyway.
例如，法律只限制性犯罪者睡觉的地方，实际上是在晚上 10 点到早上 6 点之间，反正街上没有孩子。
They're free to come and go during the day.
白天他们可以自由出入。
Some of them spend the day back at their own houses with their families, including their kids.
他们中的一些人回到自己的家中与家人（包括孩子）一起度过一天。
Jill Levenson is a researcher and social worker at Lynn University in Boca Raton, who specialized in studying sex offender policy, and is as close to a nemesis as Ron Book has in Florida.
吉尔·利文森是博卡拉顿林恩大学的研究员和社会工作者，专门研究性犯罪者政策，与佛罗里达州的罗恩·布克一样接近宿敌。
She says researchers have studied residency restrictions all over the country.
她说研究人员研究了全国各地的居住限制。
From Florida, Minnesota, Colorado, New Mexico, Nevada, New Jersey, New York, Iowa, their conclusions about residence restrictions are remarkably consistent.
佛罗里达州、明尼苏达州、科罗拉多州、新墨西哥州、内华达州、新泽西州、纽约州、爱荷华州，他们关于居住限制的结论非常一致。
The results are consistently that there is no relationship between where a sex offender lives and whether or not he reoffends.
结果一致表明，性犯罪者居住的地方与他是否再次犯罪之间没有关系。
Sex offenders who live closer to schools or parks or daycare centers do not reabuse children more often than those who live farther away.
住得离学校、公园或日托中心较近的性犯罪者并不比住得较远的性犯罪者更频繁地再次虐待儿童。
Meanwhile, the practical difficulties of housing the sex offenders was gumming up the works at a number of government agencies, who began pointing fingers at each other and suing.
与此同时，安置性犯罪者的实际困难使一些政府机构的工作陷入困境，这些机构开始互相指责并提起诉讼。
Maria Kayanan from the ACLU represents a number of the former residents from the bridge.
美国公民自由联盟 (ACLU) 的玛丽亚·卡亚南 (Maria Kayanan) 代表了该桥的一些前居民。
Everybody blames everybody else.
每个人都责怪其他人。
The Department of Corrections blames the County for its residency restriction.
惩教部指责该县的居住限制。
The County blames the Department of Corrections for having its probation officers tell released offenders that there's no place for them to live in the county other than the Julia Tuttle Causeway.
该县指责惩教局让缓刑官员告诉被释放的罪犯，除了朱莉娅·塔特尔堤道之外，该县没有其他地方可供他们居住。
The City of Miami sued the Department of Corrections, the Department of Transportation, and the Department of Motor Vehicle Safety and Licensing-- I may have that backwards-- because they were putting Julia Tuttle Causeway as the official addresses on folks' driver's license and ID cards.
迈阿密市起诉了惩教部、交通部以及机动车辆安全和执照部——我可能把这句话说反了——因为他们把朱莉娅·塔特尔堤道作为人们驾驶执照和身份证上的官方地址。
So you're saying the City of Miami sued the DMV for putting Julia Tuttle Causeway on driver's license.
所以你是说迈阿密市起诉 DMV 将 Julia Tuttle Causeway 列入驾驶执照。
That's right.
这是正确的。
It's like, if we click our heels together three times and just make their ZIP codes a string of zeroes, the problem will go away.
就像，如果我们用脚后跟敲击三下，然后将他们的邮政编码设置为一串零，问题就会消失。
As government agencies struggle with all the repercussions of the rule, officials who are pointing fingers at each other started to point them at Ron Book, the man who got them into this mess and the man with the connections to fix it.
当政府机构努力应对该规则的所有影响时，互相指责的官员们开始将矛头指向罗恩·布克(Ron Book)，他是让他们陷入困境的人，也是那个有关系来解决这个问题的人。
And Ron stepped into the fray, happy to lead the charge.
罗恩也加入了战斗，很高兴能带头冲锋。
Again, Maria Kayanan of the ACLU.
再次是美国公民自由联盟的玛丽亚·卡亚南。
I just know that he is a force of nature.
我只知道他是一种自然的力量。
When he speaks, when he appears, he commands the room.
当他说话时，当他出现时，他就指挥着整个房间。
He is omnipresent.
他无所不在。
No matter whether it's a county commission hearing, whether it's a court hearing, whether it was in our litigation or the city's litigation, [SMACKS THE TABLE] there he was with this Italian suit.
无论是县委员会听证会，无论是法庭听证会，无论是我们的诉讼还是市政府的诉讼，[拍桌子]他都参与了这起意大利诉讼。
The most obvious way to fix the problem at the bridge would be for Ron Book to go back to the legislators who originally passed the 2,500-foot rule and roll it back, and that's something Ron is uniquely qualified to make happen.
解决桥上问题的最明显方法是罗恩·布克 (Ron Book) 回到最初通过 2,500 英尺规则的立法者那里，并将其取消，而这是罗恩 (Ron) 唯一有资格实现这一目标的事情。
But that's the one thing that's off the table, as far as Ron Book is concerned.
但就罗恩·布克而言，这是唯一不能讨论的事情。
He stands by the 2,500-foot rule.
他遵守 2,500 英尺的规则。
In fact, he won't even admit it's the reason people moved under the bridge in the first place, an issue I've been arguing with him going on three years now.
事实上，他甚至不承认这就是人们搬到桥下的原因，这个问题我已经和他争论了三年了。
I don't believe the ordinance made them homeless.
我不相信该法令使他们无家可归。
I don't believe the ordinance put them under the Julia Tuttle Causeway.
我不相信该法令将它们置于朱莉娅·塔特尔堤道之下。
I disagree that the ordinance put them there.
我不同意该法令将它们放在那里。
Their crimes put them there.
他们的罪行把他们放在那里。
Their crimes put them their Their unemployability put them there.
他们的罪行使他们陷入困境，他们的失业使他们陷入困境。
Their lack of financial resources put them there.
他们缺乏财政资源，将他们逼到了那里。
I don't truly believe 2,500 feet made them there.
我真的不相信 2,500 英尺的高度能让他们到达那里。
And I will not--
我不会——
That's crazy, Ron.
这太疯狂了，罗恩。
There was no one living under the Julia Causeway.
朱莉娅堤道下无人居住。
You're not going to get me to accept that, because I don't, I don't.
你不会让我接受这一点，因为我不接受，我不接受。
As a premise, I just don't.
作为前提，我只是不这样做。
And so, instead, Book concocted a complicated and fabulously expensive plan, using the resources and staff time at his disposal as the head of the Miami Dade Homeless Trust as well as federal stimulus dollars meant primarily for housing people made homeless by the recession and the foreclosure crisis.
因此，布克制定了一项复杂且极其昂贵的计划，利用他作为迈阿密戴德无家可归者信托基金负责人所掌握的资源和员工时间，以及主要用于为因经济衰退和止赎危机而无家可归的人提供住房的联邦刺激资金。
His staff began working full-time, trying to move the sex offenders one by one into any legal housing they could find.
他的工作人员开始全职工作，试图将性犯罪者一一转移到他们能找到的任何合法住房中。
I will promise you this, that it is the 19 of February-- and I know that I told you this place was going to be closed a little sooner than now-- I assure you that you get to be the 1 of April, the 15 of April, there won't be any more people there.
我向你保证，今天是 2 月 19 日——我知道我告诉过你这个地方会比现在早一点关门——我向你保证，到了 4 月 1 日，4 月 15 日，那里不会再有人了。
There'll be a piece of guardrail up on the eastbound side and a piece of guardrail up on the westbound side.
东行侧将有一段护栏，西行侧也将有一段护栏。
They're not going to be able drive their cars down there anymore.
他们将不能再把车开到那里了。
And those people that continue to have a registration address under the Julia Tuttle Causeway will likely have their doors knocked on and they will be taken back to jail for violating the law.
那些继续在朱莉娅·塔特尔堤道下拥有登记地址的人可能会被敲门，并因违法而被带回监狱。
On April 1, The Miami Herald reported that the bridge, at last, had been cleared out.
4 月 1 日，《迈阿密先驱报》报道说，这座桥终于被清理干净了。
All Sex Offenders from Miami's Shanty Town in Housing, said the headline.
标题称，所有性犯罪者都来自迈阿密棚户区。
It was over, except it wasn't over.
一切都结束了，但一切还没有结束。
The day after the bridge had been cleared out, some 30 sex offenders who Book's people had moved into a hotel by the airport were suddenly evicted when one of the men living there was arrested for lewd and lascivious molestation of a minor.
桥梁清理完毕的第二天，布克的人搬进机场附近一家酒店的大约 30 名性犯罪者突然被驱逐，因为其中一名住在那里的男子因猥亵和猥亵未成年人而被捕。
Just two days after the bridge had been cleared out for good, its former residents were sleeping on the floor of their probation offices.
这座桥被彻底清理干净两天后，以前的居民就睡在缓刑办公室的地板上。
Asked if some of the men will be going back under the bridge, Book told reporters, that is not an option.
当被问及一些人是否会从桥下返回时，布克告诉记者，这不是一个选择。
So where were they supposed to go?
那么他们应该去哪里呢？
And where were other sex offenders coming out of prison this year and next year supposed to go?
今年和明年出狱的其他性犯罪者应该去哪里？
The few pockets of Miami Dade County that had housing that complied with the 2,500-foot rule were already filling up disproportionately with sex offenders.
迈阿密戴德县少数几个拥有符合 2,500 英尺规定的住房的地区已经挤满了性犯罪者。
Mucking through the sex offender database, I stumbled on a little patch of houses in the middle of miles of farmland, in the middle of nowhere, where, according to the most recent count, 14 sex offenders live alongside families with children.
在翻阅性犯罪者数据库时，我偶然发现了几英里农田中间的一小片房屋，在荒无人烟的地方，根据最新的统计，那里有 14 名性犯罪者与有孩子的家庭住在一起。
By now, Ron Book has to see all the trouble the 2,500-foot rule is causing.
现在，罗恩·布克 (Ron Book) 必须看到 2,500 英尺规则造成的所有麻烦。
At every turn, he's responded to events by taking on even more responsibility for the lives of these sex offenders.
每次，他都会通过对这些性犯罪者的生活承担更多责任来应对事件。
Now he's their landlord, their lawmaker, the arbiter over their fate.
现在他是他们的房东、他们的立法者、他们命运的仲裁者。
But as things have gone wrong, Book has refused to back down or lose face.
但随着事情出了问题，布克拒绝退缩或丢面子。
There have been a few attempts to clean up the current mess by forcing every community in Florida to obey the same statewide residency restriction of 1,000 feet, or maybe 1,500 feet.
为了清理当前的混乱局面，已经进行了一些尝试，迫使佛罗里达州的每个社区遵守全州范围内 1,000 英尺甚至 1,500 英尺的居住限制。
Book says that's not good enough, throwing numbers out like he's bargaining for a car.
布克说这还不够好，他把数字扔掉，就像他在讨价还价汽车一样。
1,750, he'll sometimes say, might be OK for other communities, not his though.
他有时会说，1,750 对于其他社区来说可能还可以，但对他来说不行。
For Book, for Book's community, only 2,500 will do.
对于 Book 来说，对于 Book 的社区来说，只有 2,500 个就够了。
There's a rational, responsible distance somewhere between 1,750 feet and 2,500 feet.
1,750 英尺到 2,500 英尺之间存在一个合理且可靠的距离。
What's the difference?
有什么区别？
It's 250 feet.
高度为 250 英尺。
I mean, what difference does it make?
我的意思是，这有什么区别？
It's another football field away.
这是另一个足球场之外的地方。
And when one looks at 1,000 feet, it's three football fields.
当人们看 1,000 英尺时，它相当于三个足球场。
Well, I can see three football fields.
嗯，我可以看到三个足球场。
You're in my 10th floor office having this interview with me.
你在我十楼的办公室接受我的采访。
I can see three football fields right now.
我现在能看到三个足球场。
I can see children three football fields away.
我可以看到三个足球场外的孩子们。
I have a powerful set of binoculars I will show you on your way out of my office.
我有一套功能强大的双筒望远镜，在您离开办公室时我会向您展示。
I could see five football fields with those binoculars.
用双筒望远镜我可以看到五个足球场。
I don't want a predator and offender, somebody convicted, that has been determined to have committed sexually deviant acts on our children, I do not want that person looking out of their bedroom windows, out of their living room windows, down into a park, down into a playground, that had this person who has a predilection to offend against a child scouting out their next victim.
我不想要一个掠夺者和罪犯，一个被定罪的人，被确定对我们的孩子犯下性越轨行为，我不想要那个人从卧室窗户往外看，从客厅窗户往外看，往下看公园，往下看操场，这个人有一个倾向冒犯正在寻找下一个受害者的孩子。
The irony, of course, is that Book doesn't need his binocular to see sex offenders anymore.
当然，讽刺的是，布克不再需要他的双筒望远镜来观察性犯罪者了。
Now he has to deal with them every day.
现在他每天都要和他们打交道。
Isaiah Thompson, he's the former host of The Common Rabble.
以赛亚·汤普森（Isaiah Thompson），他是《普通乌合之众》的前主持人。
These days, he's a reporter and columnist at the Philadelphia City Paper .
如今，他是《费城城市报》的记者和专栏作家。
[MUSIC - "THERE'S NO HOME FOR YOU HERE" THE WHITE STRIPES].
[音乐-“这里没有你的家”白色条纹]。
Well, our program was produced today by Robyn Semien, with Alex Blumberg, Ben Calhoun, Jane Feltes, Sarah Koenig, Lisa Pollak, Alissa Shipp, and Nancy Updike.
今天我们的节目由 Robyn Semien 与 Alex Blumberg、Ben Calhoun、Jane Feltes、Sarah Koenig、Lisa Pollak、Alissa Shipp 和 Nancy Updike 共同制作。
Our senior producer's Julie Snyder.
我们的高级制片人朱莉·斯奈德。
Seth Lind is our production manager.
塞思·林德 (Seth Lind) 是我们的生产经理。
Emily Condon's our office manager.
艾米丽·康登是我们的办公室经理。
Production help from Brian Reed.
布莱恩·里德 (Brian Reed) 提供制作帮助。
Special thanks today to Jim McDonough
今天特别感谢吉姆·麦克唐纳
Our website, thisamericanlife.org, where you can get our free weekly podcast, or this week read a translation of Mr. Chen's blog about the Yangtze River Bridge and get a link to his Chinese blog, which has tons of pictures.
我们的网站 thisamericanlife.org，您可以在其中获得我们的免费每周播客，或者本周阅读陈先生关于长江大桥的博客的翻译，并获得他的中文博客的链接，其中有大量图片。
Thanks to Paul Rand by the way, for that translation.
顺便说一下，感谢保罗·兰德的翻译。
This American Life is distributed by Public Radio International.
《美国生活》由国际公共广播电台发行。
WBEZ management oversight for our program by our boss, Mr. Torey Malatia.
我们的老板 Torey Malatia 先生对我们的项目进行 WBEZ 管理监督。
I went to his office this week and asked for a raise and-- I don't know, I think I've been an OK employee.
这周我去了他的办公室，要求加薪——我不知道，我认为我是一名还不错的员工。
His reaction was kind of weird.
他的反应有点奇怪。
I am going to punch you in the face.
我要打你的脸。
How dare you?
你怎么敢？
I'm going to punch you right now.
我现在就要打你。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Back next week with more stories with This American Life .
下周，《美国生活》将带来更多故事。
(HOST) ANNOUNCER.
（主持人）播音员。
PRI.
优先级。
Public Radio International.
国际公共广播电台。
This American Life is produced in collaboration with WBEZ Chicago and delivered to stations by PRX The Public Radio Exchange.
《This American Life》与 WBEZ Chicago 合作制作，并由 PRX 公共广播电台传送到各电台。