351: Return to Childhood - This American Life
You are using an outdated browser.
您正在使用过时的浏览器。
Please upgrade your browser or activate Google Chrome Frame to improve your experience.
请升级您的浏览器或激活 Google Chrome 浏览器内嵌框架以改善您的体验。
Sign up for a free Life Partners trial, and you can watch the video “A Night of Stories and Improv.”
注册免费试用《Life Partners》，您可以观看视频“故事与即兴表演之夜”。
00:00 00:00 Transcript Share This American Life Life Partners How to Listen Episodes Recommended About Overview Staff Announcements Fellowships Jobs Music Make Radio On The Road FAQ Submissions Merch Contact Us Our Other Shows Merch Follow Us Life Partners Subscribe to our newsletter Full episode Toggle Audio and Transcript Sync Transcript | Episode #351 | November 18, 2022 351: Return to Childhood Note: This American Life is produced for the ear and designed to be heard.
00:00 00:00 文字记录 分享此 美国生活 生活伙伴 如何收听 剧集 推荐 关于 概述 员工公告 奖学金 工作 音乐 在路上制作电台 常见问题解答 提交 商品 联系我们 我们的其他节目 商品 关注我们 生活伙伴 订阅我们的时事通讯 整集 切换音频和文字记录同步 文字记录 | 内容第 351 集 | 2022 年 11 月 18 日 351：回到童年 注：《美国生活》是为耳朵而制作，旨在让人们听到。
If you are able, we strongly encourage you to listen to the audio, which includes emotion and emphasis that's not on the page.
如果可以的话，我们强烈建议您收听音频，其中包括页面上没有的情感和重点。
Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors.
文字记录是使用语音识别软件和人工转录员结合生成的，可能包含错误。
Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print.
请在印刷版引用前检查相应的音频。
Prologue Ira Glass Fifth grade.
序言 艾拉·格拉斯 五年级。
It was so long ago.
那是很久以前的事了。
Who can remember that far back?
谁能记得那么久远的事？
Two whole years.
整整两年。
I remember all of, like, the old things.
我记得所有的事情，比如旧事。
Like, we used to read the book Harry Potter.
比如，我们曾经读过《哈利·波特》这本书。
And we made curtains.
我们制作了窗帘。
Harry Potter curtains.
哈利波特窗帘。
Kayla Hernandez And, like, they have new curtains now.
凯拉·埃尔南德斯 而且，就像，他们现在有了新窗帘。
And I look back at them, and I'm like-- I look at them and I'm like, wow, you know.
我回头看着他们，我就像——我看着他们，我想，哇，你知道。
It's changed.
它改变了。
And I wish it was still there somehow.
我希望它仍然存在。
This is Kayla Hernandez, in seventh grade at the Pulaski School in Chicago.
我是凯拉·埃尔南德斯 (Kayla Hernandez)，就读于芝加哥普拉斯基学校 (Pulaski School) 七年级。
She says she actually visits her fifth grade classroom, room 211, and her fifth grade teacher, Mrs. Chan, fairly often, and reminisces about the past.
她说，她实际上经常去五年级的教室211室和五年级的老师陈老师，回忆过去的事情。
Recently I went through the shelves, and our books are still there.
最近我翻遍了书架，我们的书还在那里。
Like, Our America.
比如《我们的美国》。
You're talking about the book, Our America.
你说的是《我们的美国》这本书。
Yeah.
是的。
You know, I'm reminiscing about when we used to read that book, and how it showed lots of racism.
你知道，我正在回忆我们以前读过那本书的情况，以及它如何表现出大量的种族主义。
Back in fifth grade, she covered her copy of Our America with one of those paper book covers you get.
早在五年级的时候，她就用一本你能买到的纸质书封面覆盖了她的《我们的美国》。
It was her copy, though they're not allowed to write their name in the fronts of books at her school.
这是她的副本，尽管她的学校不允许他们在书的前面写下自己的名字。
They had numbers, and my number, I think, was like, 30.
他们有数字，我想我的数字是 30。
Yeah, I did.
是的，我做到了。
I saw the book, and it was just there, without its paperback cover.
我看到了这本书，它就在那里，没有平装本封面。
And everything that was mine is not mine anymore.
而曾经属于我的一切都不再是我的了。
I think that's the hardest thing from switching to another grade, into another classroom and to another teacher.
我认为这是从换到另一个年级、换到另一个教室、换到另一位老师的过程中最困难的事情。
And there is new environments and new and different things to learn, and old memories to leave behind.
还有新的环境、新的和不同的东西要学习，还有旧的记忆要留下。
20 years from now, 30 years from now, when you try to remember back to seventh grade, what do you think you're going to remember from this year?
20年后，30年后，当你尝试回忆七年级时，你认为今年你会记住什么？
Isn't that kind of strange, though, to think that you're going through all these experiences now that somehow are going to get wiped off the blackboard?
然而，想到你现在正在经历的所有这些经历都会以某种方式从黑板上擦掉，这不是很奇怪吗？
Yeah.
是的。
But I even have that experience now.
但我现在也有这样的经历。
Like, I can't remember things from second grade.
比如说，我记不起二年级的事情了。
I see some things.
我看到了一些事情。
Like, I remember this kid, he wrote this Valentine card for me.
就像，我记得这个孩子，他为我写了这张情人节卡片。
It's like, you're pretty as a rose.
就像，你像玫瑰一样美丽。
I don't know.
我不知道。
Something like that.
类似的事情。
But I can't remember teachers really well like I used to.
但我不能像以前那样清楚地记得老师了。
Do you feel sad about that, or is that OK?
你对此感到难过吗？或者这样可以吗？
I feel sad about that, because it's a part of me.
我对此感到难过，因为这是我的一部分。
It's like you don't even remember what's happened.
就好像你根本不记得发生了什么。
It's kind of hard because it's been a part of you.
这有点困难，因为它已经成为你的一部分。
When I asked Kayla which of her friends she wouldn't remember at all some day, it wasn't hard for her to answer.
当我问凯拉有一天她会完全不记得她的哪些朋友时，她不难回答。
Cynthia.
辛西娅。
I'll probably forget Alíleni.
我可能会忘记阿莱尼。
I'll probably forget Diana and Maria.
我可能会忘记戴安娜和玛丽亚。
I'll forget Erica Sorio.
我会忘记艾丽卡·索里奥。
I'll forget a whole bunch of people.
我会忘记一大群人。
She's not close to these kids or anything.
她和这些孩子什么的都不亲近。
But as she said their names, it was like watching them vaporize or something.
但当她说出他们的名字时，就好像看着他们蒸发了什么的。
Someday they'll just be gone, erased from the history of her life, like they had never been there in the first place.
总有一天，它们会消失，从她的生活历史中抹去，就像它们从来没有存在过一样。
We forget most of everything.
我们忘记了大部分事情。
And then sometimes we go back and try to remember.
有时我们会回过头来尝试回忆。
And there really is no predicting which people and places and moments we're going to be able to get back.
确实无法预测我们将能够回到哪些人、地点和时刻。
Diana and Maria, they could still make the cut.
戴安娜和玛丽亚，她们仍然可以晋级。
Well, from WBEZ Chicago, it's This American Life.
嗯，来自 WBEZ 芝加哥，这是《This American Life》。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Today on our program, "Return to Childhood," what you find and what you do not find when you go back.
今天在我们的节目《重返童年》中，当你回到童年时，你会发现什么，找不到什么。
Our show today in four acts.
我们今天的演出分四幕。
Act 1, Ich bin ein mophead.
第一幕，我是拖把头。
In that act, a 34-year-old man investigates who he was at nine years old and learns a thing or two he would just as soon not remember.
在那一幕中，一名 34 岁的男子调查了 9 岁时的自己，并了解到了一两件他可能很快就会忘记的事情。
Act 2, Punk In a Gray Flannel Suit, in which a mortgage broker discovers that the punk band he was in the '70s is hot in Japan and decides to leave corporate life for a little bit and go back on tour.
第二幕，穿着灰色法兰绒西装的朋克，一名抵押贷款经纪人发现他所在的 70 年代朋克乐队在日本很受欢迎，并决定暂时离开公司生活并重新开始巡演。
Act 3, Ariel Sharon, Shimon Peres, David Ben Gurion, and Me-- an American teenager who dreams of someday being the prime minister of a nation where he does not even reside.
第三幕，阿里尔·沙龙、西蒙·佩雷斯、大卫·本·古里安和我——一个美国少年，梦想有一天成为一个他甚至不居住的国家的总理。
Act 4, When We Were Angels, in which we hear the purest possible student uprising imaginable, the most innocent, documented by an actual student using the crudest tools-- a telephone answering machine and a shiny red boom box.
第四幕《当我们是天使》中，我们听到了可以想象到的最纯粹、最无辜的学生起义，由一个真实的学生使用最原始的工具——电话答录机和闪亮的红色音箱——记录下来。
Stay with us.
留在我们身边。
Act 1, Ich bin ein mophead.
第一幕，我是拖把头。
Alex Blumberg was a producer on our program for many years, and back when he was working here-- today's show is a rerun-- he made a decision to return to his childhood.
亚历克斯·布隆伯格（Alex Blumberg）多年来一直是我们节目的制片人，当他在这里工作时（今天的节目是重播），他决定回到他的童年。
He went searching for somebody named Susan Jordan, who he and his sister Kate and their parents knew for about a year when Alex was growing up in Cincinnati.
他去寻找一个名叫苏珊乔丹的人，当亚历克斯在辛辛那提长大时，他和他的妹妹凯特以及他们的父母认识苏珊乔丹大约一年。
These are the things that I remember about Susan Jordan.
这些是我对苏珊·乔丹的记忆。
Me and her sitting in the back room and telling her about the day camp I went to that summer.
我和她坐在后面的房间里，告诉她那年夏天我去的日营。
I can't get myself to shut up.
我无法让自己闭嘴。
"And they had alligators and snakes," I can hear myself telling her.
“他们有鳄鱼和蛇，”我可以听到自己告诉她。
"And this one time, this one alligator got out, and the counselor had to catch it," and on and on like that.
“这一次，这只鳄鱼逃了出来，辅导员必须抓住它，”如此等等。
Me and Susan flipping through one of those Time Life books-- Rock and Roll Through the Decades: The Sixties.
我和苏珊翻阅《时代生活》的一本书籍——《摇滚乐十年：六十年代》。
She has long brown hair.
她有一头棕色的长发。
She's incredibly skinny.
她瘦得令人难以置信。
It's 1975.
现在是 1975 年。
She's wearing bell bottom Levis, a faded jean jacket.
她穿着一件李维斯喇叭裤和一件褪色的牛仔夹克。
I do.
我愿意。
I do.
我愿意。
Alex Blumberg You remember Susan Jordan, right?
亚历克斯·布隆伯格（Alex Blumberg） 你还记得苏珊·乔丹（Susan Jordan），对吧？
Susan Jordan.
苏珊乔丹.
Susan Jordan.
苏珊乔丹.
Yes, it's ringing a bell, but I can't place it.
是的，它在响，但我无法放置它。
She was our babysitter.
她是我们的保姆。
Alex's Mom Oh, OK.
亚历克斯的妈妈哦，好吧。
Chicken Legs and Mophead.
鸡腿和拖把头。
One of the many ideas that Susan introduced to our household was the concept of the nickname.
苏珊向我们家介绍的众多想法之一就是昵称的概念。
I think that's all I want to say about Chicken Legs and Mophead.
我想这就是我想说的关于鸡腿和拖把头的全部内容。
I'd gone to my mother to fill in gaps in my memory of Susan, but she didn't remember much more than I did.
我去找妈妈填补我对苏珊的记忆空白，但她记得的并不比我多。
She was a babysitter that really had more of a relationship with you two than she did with us.
她是一名保姆，与你们两个的关系确实比与我们的关系更多。
She seemed to have a very meaningful relationship with you, almost the kind of relationship that you might have with another adult.
她似乎与你有着非常有意义的关系，几乎就像你与另一个成年人之间的关系一样。
That was about the extent of it.
事情的范围就到此为止了。
And she never stayed around when I came home.
当我回家时，她从来没有留下来。
She was out of there.
她已经离开那里了。
What talking to my mom did do was make me look at my childhood memories from an adult perspective-- like, for example, what I remembered about her living situation.
与我妈妈交谈确实让我从成人的角度看待我的童年记忆——例如，我记得她的生活状况。
I didn't get the impression that she was close to her family.
我没有感觉到她和她的家人很亲近。
I got the impression that she was very much out on her own very young.
我的印象是她很小的时候就非常孤独。
I think she must have been in the process of breaking with her own parents during that time.
我想那段时间她一定正在和自己的父母决裂。
That's-- yeah.
那是——是的。
See, my memory is that, like, she was in high school, right?
看，我的记忆是，就像，她在高中，对吧？
She went to Withrow.
她去了威罗。
Yeah, mm-hmm.
是的，嗯嗯。
Alex Blumberg But I also remember her living on her-- for some reason I remember her own house.
亚历克斯·布隆伯格（Alex Blumberg）但我也记得她靠她生活——出于某种原因，我记得她自己的房子。
Yeah.
是的。
Alex Blumberg And the reason I thought that she lived by herself was we went to some-- we went to her house or her boy-- we had to go pick something up somewhere, and we were in her car.
亚历克斯·布隆伯格（Alex Blumberg） 我认为她一个人住的原因是我们去了一些地方——我们去了她的房子或她的儿子——我们必须去某个地方拿东西，而我们在她的车里。
This big blue Duster, I think it was.
我想就是这个蓝色的大除尘器。
And her boyfriend was there, and her boyfriend had let the cats out, and they were gone.
她的男朋友在那里，她的男朋友把猫放了出来，然后它们就消失了。
And she was furious.
她很生气。
And then I got in the car.
然后我上了车。
And then she slammed the door.
然后她关上了门。
And I think we peeled out.
我想我们已经退出了。
And he was sort of standing-- you know, he was sort of standing there and trying to reason with her, and we were out of there.
他有点站着——你知道，他有点站在那里试图跟她讲道理，然后我们就离开了那里。
Well, what did you think?
嗯，你觉得怎么样？
Alex Blumberg It made me-- I think I felt sad for her.
亚历克斯·布隆伯格（Alex Blumberg）这让我——我想我为她感到难过。
This is sort of in retrospect, but I think I had some sort of inkling of this idea at the time.
这是回想起来的，但我想我当时对这个想法有某种暗示。
I'm just sort of now realizing it.
我现在才意识到这一点。
But I remember thinking that he was one of the few people that she had in her life, and she couldn't even really depend on him.
但我记得我当时想，他是她生命中为数不多的几个人之一，她甚至不能真正依赖他。
Yeah.
是的。
You were probably right.
你可能是对的。
She was a struggler.
她是一个奋斗者。
And you may have been at that point, at that moment, her only friend, you know?
在那一刻，你可能是她唯一的朋友，你知道吗？
My mom didn't have any idea where I could find Susan, which made things difficult.
我妈妈不知道我在哪里可以找到苏珊，这让事情变得很困难。
Because A, Susan Jordan is a very common name, and B, it's probably not her name anymore.
因为A，苏珊乔丹是一个很常见的名字，而B，这可能不再是她的名字了。
I called the county court records department to find all the Susan Jordans married in Cincinnati.
我打电话给县法院记录部门，发现苏珊·乔丹夫妇都在辛辛那提结婚了。
My mom asked a friend who worked for the city to search all the Cincinnati birth records.
我妈妈让一位在该市工作的朋友搜索辛辛那提的所有出生记录。
I contacted high school alumni associations.
我联系了高中校友会。
I asked friends at high-powered newspapers to run background checks.
我请大报社的朋友进行背景调查。
Finally, there was one former Susan Jordan who stood out.
最后，还有一位前苏珊乔丹脱颖而出。
She seemed the right age.
她看起来年龄合适。
She was married, living in a Cincinnati suburb.
她已婚，住在辛辛那提郊区。
She had a couple of kids.
她有几个孩子。
Her husband was a lawyer.
她的丈夫是一名律师。
I got her number from information.
我从信息中得到了她的电话号码。
And it wasn't until I sat down to call her that it hit me.
直到我坐下来给她打电话时我才意识到。
A phone call from someone you babysat 20 years ago might not be a welcome surprise, but in fact strange and creepy.
20 年前你保姆打来的电话可能并不令人感到意外，但事实上却很奇怪、令人毛骨悚然。
Here I am practicing sounding benign.
我在这里练习听起来友善。
One two, one two.
一二，一二。
Susan.
苏珊.
Is this Susan Jordan?
这是苏珊·乔丹吗？
Is the Susan Jordan?
是苏珊·乔丹吗？
Oh, god.
哦，上帝。
Oh, god.
哦，上帝。
Finally, I made the call.
最后，我拨通了电话。
[PHONE RINGING]
[电话铃声]
Hello.
你好。
Hi, is this Susan?
嗨，这是苏珊吗？
Susan Jordan 1 Yeah.
苏珊·乔丹 1 是的。
Hi.
你好。
My name's Alex Blumberg, and I'm calling from a radio program called This American Life.
我叫亚历克斯·布隆伯格，是通过一个名为“美国生活”的广播节目打来的。
And this is probably a very strange phone call to receive, but I was wondering-- first of all, do you remember me?
这可能是一个非常奇怪的电话，但我想知道——首先，你还记得我吗？
No. Alex Blumberg It turns out there are a lot of Susan Jordans who don't remember me.
不，亚历克斯·布隆伯格（Alex Blumberg） 事实证明，有很多苏珊·乔丹（Susan Jordan）不记得我了。
A lot.
很多。
One guy even called his ex-wife, a former Susan Jordan, and then called me back to tell me she'd never heard of me.
有个人甚至打电话给他的前妻，前苏珊·乔丹，然后又给我回电话告诉我她从未听说过我。
I was getting nowhere by myself.
我自己一事无成。
So I contacted a professional, one Irving Botwinick, a certified New York City private investigator.
于是我联系了一位专业人士，欧文·博特尼克，一位经过认证的纽约市私家侦探。
Three days after putting him on the case, I got a message saying he'd found her.
委托他处理此案三天后，我收到一条消息，说他找到了她。
I called him back.
我给他回了电话。
I called her this morning early, roughly around 7:30.
我今天早上很早就给她打电话，大约7点30分左右。
I said, good morning, I'd to introduce myself.
我说，早上好，我先自我介绍一下。
I said, my name is so and so, and I'm a licensed private investigator in New York, and I'm looking for someone that used to live in Cincinnati and went to a particular school there.
我说，我的名字叫某某，我是纽约的一名有执照的私家侦探，我正在寻找曾经住在辛辛那提并在那里的一所特定学校上学的人。
And her name at the time was Susan Jordan.
她当时的名字叫苏珊乔丹。
And she said, that's me.
她说，那就是我。
And I said, OK.
我说，好吧。
And I said, do you know anybody named Alex Blumberg?
我说，你认识一个叫亚历克斯·布隆伯格的人吗？
And right away, she-- yeah, I babysat for him.
很快，她——是的，我照顾他。
And the interesting part about the whole thing is she definitely likes you, remembers you, and she's going to call you.
整件事最有趣的部分是她肯定喜欢你，记得你，而且她会给你打电话。
This is Alex Blumberg.
这是亚历克斯·布隆伯格。
Susan Jordan Hi, Alex.
苏珊乔丹嗨，亚历克斯。
How you doing?
你好吗？
I'm doing OK.
我还好。
How are you?
你好吗？
Susan Jordan Fine.
苏珊·乔丹 很好。
Did you get my email?
你收到我的电子邮件了吗？
I got your email, yeah.
我收到你的电子邮件了，是的。
Susan Jordan Oh, OK.
苏珊·乔丹 哦，好的。
And I called you at work, and then I realized that I'd also gotten this number from the private investigator.
我在工作时给你打电话，然后我意识到我也是从私家侦探那里得到这个号码的。
Susan and I talked for over three hours on the phone, catching up, comparing notes.
苏珊和我在电话里聊了三个多小时，互相聊聊，交换意见。
She asked about my sister and kids that used to live on the street and our old family dog.
她询问了我姐姐和以前住在街上的孩子们以及我们家里的老狗的情况。
How are you doing?
你好吗？
Alex Blumberg I'm doing OK.
亚历克斯·布隆伯格 我很好。
It was amazing how much she remembered and how much we remembered in common, even small incidents like the time that we were stopped at the traffic light and I stared too long at the guy on the motorcycle.
令人惊奇的是，她记得那么多，我们记得那么多共同点，甚至是一些小事，比如我们在红绿灯前停下来，我盯着摩托车上的那个人看了太久。
I think I remember that.
我想我记得那件事。
Was it on Erie Avenue?
是在伊利大道吗？
Probably.
大概。
Probably.
大概。
And he said, did he say something to you?
他说，他对你说了些什么吗？
And I said, no, he didn't say anything to me.
我说，不，他什么也没对我说。
And you said, he said something to you, didn't he?
你说，他对你说了些什么，不是吗？
And you were about to get out of the car and kick that guy's ass, I'm sure.
我敢肯定，你正要下车去踢那家伙的屁股。
I think I can remember your face.
我想我能记住你的脸。
I think you were sitting very still with your hands in your lap.
我想你一动不动地坐着，双手放在腿上。
Were you afraid?
你害怕吗？
I was terrified.
我很害怕。
Yeah.
是的。
I didn't know that he would notice me exactly.
我不知道他会注意到我。
But, uh--
但是，呃——
Well, don't worry.
好吧，别担心。
I would have taken him out.
我会带他出去的。
I had no fear, I'm telling you.
我告诉你，我没有恐惧。
Do you remember a time-- it was, like, maybe six or seven or eight years after you babysat us.
你还记得有一次吗——大概是在你照顾我们六、七、八年后。
And I was working--
而我当时正在工作——
Yeah, I remember.
是的，我记得。
I guess you-- were you bagging my groceries, but I didn't recognize you?
我猜你是在给我装杂货，但我没认出你来？
I don't-- Susan Jordan And then you told me who you were, and then I did.
我不——苏珊·乔丹 然后你告诉我你是谁，然后我就这么做了。
Oh my god.
我的天啊。
I did warp you.
我确实扭曲了你。
Do people still call you that?
人们还这样称呼你吗？
No. Susan got married when she was still in college and went to work for the phone company as a repair person.
没有。苏珊还在上大学的时候就结婚了，并到电话公司当维修工。
She spent the next 20 years or so hanging from a telephone pole, she said.
她说，在接下来的 20 年左右的时间里，她一直吊在电线杆上。
She hated it, but the money was good.
她讨厌这样，但钱很好。
Around the time her first marriage ended, she finally got up the courage to quit and find work using her degree.
在她第一次婚姻结束时，她终于鼓起勇气辞职并利用自己的学位找到工作。
She now teaches at a special school for mentally ill children.
她现在在一所专门为精神病儿童开设的学校任教。
She lives in Florida with her second husband, and she seems happy.
她和第二任丈夫住在佛罗里达州，她看起来很幸福。
Of course, when you dive back into the past like this, you find how partial and incomplete your memory is.
当然，当你这样回到过去时，你会发现你的记忆是多么片面和不完整。
First there are the facts you get wrong.
首先是你弄错的事实。
Turns out Susan had been a college freshman when she babysat us, not in high school like I thought.
事实证明，苏珊在照顾我们时还是一名大学新生，而不是像我想象的那样在高中。
My sister remembered she'd ridden a motorcycle.
我姐姐记得她骑过摩托车。
Also not true.
也不是真的。
And the guy who she got in the fight with over the cats, who in my mind was her hairy '70s boyfriend, turned out to be her roommate's boyfriend.
那个和她因为猫吵架的人，在我看来是她毛茸茸的 70 年代男友，结果却是她室友的男朋友。
But besides the facts you change, there are the facts you completely omit.
但除了你改变的事实之外，还有一些你完全忽略的事实。
That fight over the cats, Susan had forgotten totally that I'd been there.
那场关于猫的争斗，苏珊完全忘记了我曾在那里。
And it was a little strange because my presence was the only thing she'd forgotten.
这有点奇怪，因为我的存在是她唯一忘记的。
Other details she remembered fine, even the names of the cats themselves.
其他细节她都记得清清楚楚，甚至包括猫本身的名字。
Possom and Tom.
波索姆和汤姆.
We were hillbillies, remember?
我们是乡下人，还记得吗？
But I can't imagine what I took you over there for.
但我无法想象我带你去那里的目的是什么。
I'm sure it was for-- you know, I think we were just running errands.
我确信这是为了——你知道，我想我们只是去办事。
You're so lucky.
你真幸运。
Alex Blumberg It's funny, because I remember these very particular incidents, and that was one of them.
亚历克斯·布隆伯格（Alex Blumberg）这很有趣，因为我记得这些非常特殊的事件，而这就是其中之一。
And probably the reason I remember it is because it seemed very significant to you.
我之所以记得它，可能是因为它对你来说非常重要。
I think I sensed as a kid that it was really upsetting to you because I think I felt at that time that you didn't really have very many people in your life at that point who you could trust.
我想我小时候就感觉到这真的让你感到不安，因为我想我当时觉得你的生活中没有太多可以信任的人。
Oh, I didn't have hardly anybody.
哦，我几乎没有人。
My whole family moved out of town.
我全家搬出了城。
I had no family at all.
我根本就没有家人。
Let's see, I moved out the day I graduated from high school, and I was 17 because I started a year early.
让我们想想，我高中毕业那天就搬了出去，当时我 17 岁，因为我提前一年开始了生活。
I just wanted out.
我只是想出去。
And see, I had found out that I got the scholarship.
看，我发现我获得了奖学金。
I packed up that night.
那天晚上我就收拾好了行李。
Because my family was dysfunctional.
因为我的家庭功能失调。
But my mom-- it was pretty bad.
但我妈妈——那真是太糟糕了。
The girl that I lived with-- at that time, she was taking a lot of drugs.
和我住在一起的那个女孩，当时她吸食了大量的毒品。
And her boyfriend.
还有她的男朋友。
And every time I would come home, they would always try to get me to take drugs with them or something.
每次我回家，他们总是试图让我随身携带毒品或其他东西。
And I really didn't do it much at all.
而我真的没有做太多事情。
And it was tough to come home.
回家很困难。
And I guess I must have been suffering a little bit.
我想我一定受了一点苦。
I really missed my little brothers and my little sister.
我真的很想念我的弟弟和妹妹。
And they were gone.
然后他们就走了。
And I was, I guess, maybe trying to substitute.
我想，我可能正在尝试替代。
I think maybe that's one of the reasons that I remember that we remember you so fondly, though, because I think it worked both ways.
我想也许这就是我记得我们如此深情地记住你的原因之一，因为我认为这是双向的。
I think that we felt-- if that did make you feel closer to us, I think that we responded.
我认为我们感觉到——如果这确实让您感觉与我们更亲近，我认为我们做出了回应。
Well, I was desperately-- I guess I was looking for a family, really.
嗯，我当时非常绝望——我想我真的是在寻找一个家庭。
But I mean, if only you knew, you probably wouldn't have hired me.
但我的意思是，如果你知道的话，你可能就不会雇用我了。
But, I mean, people are complicated.
但是，我的意思是，人是复杂的。
Now, what I really wanted to do was spend more time with your mom and dad.
现在，我真正想做的是花更多的时间和你的爸爸妈妈在一起。
But I was terrified.
但我很害怕。
I mean, I just couldn't do it.
我的意思是，我就是做不到。
I was too shy.
我太害羞了。
So a lot of times, it was-- I thought they were asking me to stay longer and talk, and I would just run out.
所以很多时候，我以为他们是要我多呆一会儿说话，而我就会跑出去。
I'm sure they were.
我确信他们是。
Susan Jordan And they probably thought, what's wrong with her?
苏珊乔丹 他们可能会想，她怎么了？
But I just couldn't do it.
但我就是做不到。
So you sort of talk to us instead, it sounds like.
所以听起来你好像是在和我们说话。
Yes.
是的。
I was comfortable around kids because I had kids in my family.
我在孩子们身边感到很舒服，因为我家里有孩子。
Every time the subject of her hard times came up, I hear a subtle hesitancy in Susan's voice.
每当谈到她的艰难时刻时，我都会从苏珊的声音中听到一丝微妙的犹豫。
At first I thought it was embarrassment, but that wasn't it exactly.
起初我以为这是尴尬，但事实并非如此。
It wasn't until we had been talking for hours that I realized what it was.
直到我们聊了几个小时我才意识到那是什么。
She was waiting for the other shoe to drop.
她正在等待另一只鞋落地。
She hadn't forgotten that her past had happened.
她没有忘记，她的过去已经发生了。
She'd just forgotten that I'd witnessed part of it.
她只是忘记了我亲眼目睹了其中的一部分。
And her fear, it became clear, the one that had been gnawing at her our entire conversation, was that I was calling to say she had damaged me by exposing me to it.
很明显，在我们整个谈话中，她的恐惧一直困扰着她，那就是我打电话说她让我暴露在这种情况下，伤害了我。
I don't think I was too kind back then, because there was a lot of turmoil in my life and in my family.
我不认为我当时太善良了，因为我的生活和家庭有很多动荡。
And that's what my fear is, that I might have had some kind of negative impact on people.
这就是我担心的，我可能会对人们产生某种负面影响。
And I know probably I did on a couple people, but they were my age.
我知道我可能对几个人做过，但他们和我年纪相仿。
But you just want to remember, yeah, I was a babysitter.
但你只想记住，是的，我是一名保姆。
The kids love me.
孩子们爱我。
Blah, blah, blah.
巴拉，巴拉，巴拉。
But I would be devastated if I heard anything different.
但如果我听到任何不同的声音，我会感到震惊。
There are parts of your past you don't want to go back to, parts of yourself you don't want to go back to.
过去的某些部分是您不想回到的，您自己的某些部分是您不想回到的。
And for Susan Jordan, the year of her life that I remember is a year she'd just as soon forget.
对于苏珊·乔丹来说，我记得的她生命中的一年也是她很快就会忘记的一年。
And it turns out, I had also done my best to forget what I was like that year.
事实证明，我也已经尽力去忘记当年的自己了。
I didn't think of myself this way at all, but Susan Jordan reminded me, in the gentlest terms possible, when I was nine, I was anxious and bookish.
我根本不这么认为自己，但苏珊·乔丹用最温和的语言提醒我，当我九岁的时候，我很焦虑，也很书生气。
I was kind of uptight.
我有点紧张。
Not to seem as an insult, but I just kept thinking, these kids don't know how to play.
不想显得侮辱，但我只是一直在想，这些孩子不知道怎么玩。
When I went to your rooms, it didn't seem like you had a whole lot of toys.
当我去你的房间时，你似乎没有很多玩具。
I hope I've got this right, but it just seems like there were mostly books and more educational things.
我希望我是对的，但似乎主要是书籍和更多的教育性的东西。
I mean, I remember you had planets in your room and a chemistry set.
我的意思是，我记得你的房间里有行星和一套化学装置。
And I didn't remember that Kate had hardly any dolls.
我不记得凯特几乎没有洋娃娃。
You didn't seem quite as playful as other kids that I had babysat.
你看起来不像我照顾的其他孩子那么顽皮。
Just more serious in general.
总体来说比较严重。
So mainly, I think that's what I did, was try to play.
所以主要是，我认为这就是我所做的，就是尝试演奏。
Perhaps the most amazing thing about this whole story is how little our memories had deceived us about each other, even if they had deceived us about ourselves.
也许整个故事中最令人惊奇的事情是，我们的记忆几乎没有欺骗我们彼此，即使它们欺骗了我们自己。
As Susan said at one point, each of us remembered what we needed to about the other.
正如苏珊曾经说过的那样，我们每个人都记得我们需要了解对方的什么。
I needed to remember the part of Susan that she doesn't think about much, her toughness in the face of hardship.
我需要记住苏珊不思考太多的部分，以及她面对困难时的坚韧。
She said she mostly remembered a side of my family that I just take for granted-- that it was calm in our house, that there were books, there wasn't much fighting.
她说她最记得的是我家的一面，我认为这是理所当然的——我们家里很平静，有书，没有太多的争吵。
It was the first time in my life where I had ever seen that people lived differently than the way I lived.
这是我一生中第一次看到人们的生活方式与我的生活方式不同。
And that's what I decided I wanted for myself.
这就是我决定我自己想要的。
You can try to return to childhood by looking at photos or visiting the old neighborhood or listening to recordings.
你可以通过看照片、参观老邻居、听录音等方式尝试回到童年。
Or you can find someone who knew you back then, someone you haven't seen since.
或者您可以找到当时认识您的人，但此后您就再也没有见过。
They still carry within themselves a picture of you that's unclouded by the years in between.
他们身上仍然保留着一张你的照片，没有被岁月所遮蔽。
They'll remember you better than you remember yourself.
他们会比你记得自己更记得你。
And you can do the same thing for them.
你也可以为他们做同样的事情。
Alex Blumberg.
亚历克斯·布隆伯格。
He did that story back when he was a producer here at our show.
当他担任我们节目的制片人时，他就讲过这个故事。
Now he runs a podcasting company called Gimlet Media, and he's the host of the podcast Without Fail.
现在他经营着一家名为 Gimlet Media 的播客公司，并且是播客 Without Fail 的主持人。
[MUSIC PLAYING - "BROOKLYN ROADS" BY NEIL DIAMOND]
[音乐播放 - 尼尔·戴蒙德的《布鲁克林路》]
Act Two: Punk In A Grey Flannel Suit Ira Glass Act 2, Punk In a Gray Flannel Suit.
第二幕：穿着灰色法兰绒西装的朋克 艾拉·格拉斯 第二幕，穿着灰色法兰绒西装的朋克。
For a long time, David Philp was the president of a mortgage brokerage firm in Beverly Hills.
大卫·菲尔普（David Philp）曾长期担任比佛利山庄一家抵押贷款经纪公司的总裁。
As you might imagine, in Beverly Hills, they handle rather large mortgages.
正如您可能想象的那样，在比佛利山庄，他们处理相当大的抵押贷款。
He dresses in beautiful clothes.
他穿着漂亮的衣服。
He's clean cut.
他的轮廓很干净。
But back in the 1970s, in England, where he grew up, he was in a punk band called the Automatics.
但早在 20 世纪 70 年代，在他长大的英国，他就加入了一支名为“Automatics”的朋克乐队。
They were never really a big commercial success, but they were respected and known in the history of punk by people who care about that kind of thing.
他们从来没有真正取得过巨大的商业成功，但他们在朋克的历史上受到了关心此类事情的人们的尊重和了解。
And a few years back, through an odd series of connections, he ended up revisiting his teenage years for the first time by going back on tour in a version of his band in Japan.
几年前，通过一系列奇怪的联系，他最终第一次重温了自己的青少年时代，随自己乐队的一个版本在日本进行了巡演。
Here's how something like that happens.
类似的事情是这样发生的。
I mentioned it to a client.
我向一位客户提到过。
And I said, well, you know, I played in a punk group when I was a kid.
我说，嗯，你知道，我小时候参加过一个朋克乐队。
And he said, oh, really?
他说，哦，真的吗？
And he's interested.
他很感兴趣。
And the next day, he sent me a copy of an eBay auction and said, is this you?
第二天，他给我发了一份 eBay 拍卖的副本，并说，这是你吗？
And I sort of-- so, it was.
我有点——所以，确实如此。
And I watched this auction.
我观看了这次拍卖。
And I watched this price shoot through the roof.
我看着这个价格飞涨。
And then I began to realize, wait a minute.
然后我开始意识到，等一下。
I'm collectible.
我是有收藏价值的
Let's get down to brass tacks here.
让我们开始讨论正题吧。
How much were you guys?
你们当时多少钱？
I think that one actually went at $48.
我认为其中一件的实际售价为 48 美元。
I particularly liked looking at all those sort of other groups that were going at $0.25.
我特别喜欢看那些价格为 0.25 美元的其他团体。
You know, music business offerings along punk lines that I thought, what a load of old nonsense, at the time.
你知道，当时我认为沿着朋克风格的音乐商业产品是一堆老废话。
And it was good to see that their records weren't valued years later.
很高兴看到他们的记录几年后没有得到重视。
I mean, it was--
我的意思是，那是——
Wow.
哇。
That history came out on the right side.
这段历史是正确的。
Yes.
是的。
That there is a sort of Darwinism in record collecting.
记录收集中有一种达尔文主义。
What happened next?
接下来发生了什么？
David Philp I went to go and see Ricky, the drummer.
大卫·菲尔普 我去看鼓手瑞奇。
And Ricky collected everything.
瑞奇收集了一切。
And he very kindly lent me these two scrapbooks.
他非常好心地借给我这两本剪贴簿。
So I took pictures and things out of there.
所以我在那里拍了照片和东西。
I just put it up on a-- had a friend put it up on a website.
我只是把它放在一个——让一个朋友把它放在一个网站上。
And then I got an email from Fi-Fi in Japan saying, oh, I play in a Japanese punk rock band, and--
然后我收到一封来自日本 Fi-Fi 的电子邮件，内容是，哦，我在日本朋克摇滚乐队中演奏，而且——
Fi-Fi's a name of a person?
Fi-Fi 是一个人的名字吗？
David Philp Yes.
大卫·菲尔普 是的。
And your record changed my life.
你的记录改变了我的生活。
And he found out through the website that there was an unreleased album.
而且他通过网站发现还有一张未发行的专辑。
So he asked if he could put me in touch with Toshio Iijima of Base Records.
于是他问是否可以帮我联系 Base Records 的 Toshio Iijima。
We struck up a deal.
我们达成了协议。
And then they said, well, would you come over here and play some gigs to, you know, promote?
然后他们说，好吧，你能来这里做一些演出来宣传吗？
So you go to tour.
那你就去旅游吧。
How old are you at that point?
那时你多大了？
45.
45.
Ira Glass 45 years old.
艾拉·格拉斯 45 岁。
A little bit of gray hair coming in, perhaps?
也许会长出一点白发？
A little bit of gray hair coming in.
一点点白发开始出现。
And I really wasn't sure whether I'd still be able to do it, because I hadn't played those songs in 22 years.
我真的不确定我是否还能做到这一点，因为我已经 22 年没有播放过这些歌曲了。
Not in my shower, not to anyone.
不在我的淋浴间，也不对任何人。
I mean, prior to being married-- I mean, I remember dating women for a year who never knew that I played, had ever played.
我的意思是，在结婚之前——我的意思是，我记得和女人约会了一年，她们从来不知道我打球，曾经打过球。
It wouldn't even come up?
甚至都不会出现吗？
David Philp It wouldn't come up, really.
大卫·菲尔普：这不会出现，真的。
I mean, I'd have a guitar hanging around, but lots of other guys did too.
我的意思是，我身边挂着一把吉他，但很多其他人也这样做。
Would you ever pick up the guitar and play for yourself?
你会拿起吉他自己弹奏吗？
Yes.
是的。
I wrote a lot of songs for my dog during this period.
这段时间我为我的狗写了很多歌曲。
"We're Going to the Park" was a big favorite.
“我们去公园”是最受欢迎的。
To be followed by that hit, "Who's a Good Boy?"
接下来是热门歌曲“谁是好男孩？”
It is.
这是。
David Philp [PANTING] (SINGING) What a, what a good boy!
大卫·菲尔普 [气喘吁吁]（唱歌）多好的一个好孩子！
So we went over there, what, October 6.
所以我们去了那里，什么，10 月 6 日。
I took my wife, which possibly was a miscalculation.
我带走了我的妻子，这可能是一个误判。
No, it was a good thing to take my wife, because--
不，带走我的妻子是件好事，因为——
You were approached by dozens of teenage girls?
有几十个十几岁的女孩接近过你吗？
So what happened the first night you went onstage?
那么你上台的第一个晚上发生了什么？
Well, there was just the announcement, the light, and sort of a moment's silence, which lasted forever.
嗯，只有公告、灯光和短暂的沉默，这种沉默一直持续到永远。
And then sort of out at the back, I heard the opening riff of "When the Tanks Roll Over Poland." And there was just this whole ignition of energy from the club, in front.
然后在后面，我听到了“当坦克滚过波兰时”的开场即兴重复。前面的俱乐部充满了能量。
And all these kids just started going mad.
所有这些孩子都开始发疯。
And it just clicked right in.
它就这样点击进去了。
It felt like I was in an Automatics cover band or something like that, because it was so long ago I didn't feel that association as the writer, though-- because I wrote the material and all that.
感觉就像我在自动翻唱乐队或类似的乐队中，因为那是很久以前的事了，但我并没有感觉到作为作家的那种联系——因为我写了材料和所有这些。
I didn't have that association as the writer anymore.
我不再有作为作家的那种联系了。
See, but I would wonder if, as you sing the songs, the conviction of the writing returns to you and you remember all of the feelings of it.
瞧，但我想知道，当你唱这些歌曲时，写作的信念是否会回到你身上，你是否还记得它的所有感受。
Did that happen?
有这样的事发生吗？
There's a muscle memory that was there.
那里有肌肉记忆。
You know, the movements are all locked in the lyric and the beat and the parts.
你知道，动作都被锁定在歌词、节拍和声部中。
And as I played them, they all started to come out.
当我演奏它们时，它们都开始出现。
And it was just like a sort of-- like being a marionette or something.
这就像一种——就像是一个木偶什么的。
Here you punch the air.
在这里你打空气。
There you sort of bring it, remind the drummer to come down.
你把它带到那里，提醒鼓手下来。
And there you point at the guitarist for the solo.
然后你指着独奏的吉他手。
Had you've forgotten the thrill of being onstage?
你是否已经忘记了站在舞台上的兴奋？
Yes, I'd forgotten what it was to have the audience right there.
是的，我忘记了观众就在那里是什么感觉。
Before this, had you ever performed a punk show sober?
在此之前，你曾清醒地表演过朋克表演吗？
Never.
绝不。
Well, unless I was taking the antibiotics.
好吧，除非我服用抗生素。
Not unless I--
不会，除非我——
There's so much information contained in such a brief sentence.
如此简短的一句话，蕴含着如此多的信息。
No, it actually was one of the great paradoxes, really, I suppose, that it was great to do it sober.
不，这实际上是最大的悖论之一，真的，我想，清醒地做这件事真是太好了。
Were there moments onstage where you felt your age, where you just thought, oh, hey?
在舞台上是否有一些时刻让你感觉到自己的年龄，你只是想，哦，嘿？
Towards the end, you really feel yourself.
到最后，你才真正感受到自己。
Because it's like a sauna up there.
因为那里就像桑拿房一样。
I mean, there's so much energy going around, and it's louder than bombs.
我的意思是，周围有如此多的能量，而且比炸弹的声音还大。
So your wife had never seen you do this before.
所以你的妻子以前从未见过你这样做。
There must have been a part of you which felt so pleased that she could see it.
你一定有一部分因为她能看到它而感到非常高兴。
Yes.
是的。
I felt kind of like I'd become this other person.
我感觉自己好像变成了另外一个人。
And when I was over there, my life over here seemed to have a sort of almost dreamlike substance.
当我在那里的时候，我在这里的生活似乎有一种近乎梦幻的实质。
And then, of course, as soon as I got back, the events in October in Japan just began to assume that sort of mantle of dream.
当然，我一回来，十月在日本发生的事件就开始披上那种梦想的外衣。
I did three shows-- two in Tokyo and one in Kyoto.
我做了三场演出——两场在东京，一场在京都。
And all three, just great?
这三个都很棒吗？
David Philp All three sold out.
大卫·菲尔普 三张都卖完了。
In Kyoto, we set a club record for the largest attendance ever.
在京都，我们创下了俱乐部有史以来出席人数最多的记录。
And it was so packed we couldn't actually get off stage.
现场太拥挤了，我们实际上无法下台。
The only way out was over.
唯一的出路已经结束了。
I had to sling myself over the audience, and they carried me on their hands back through the crowd and gently deposited me at the stage door.
我不得不把自己吊到观众席上，他们用手背着我穿过人群，轻轻地将我放在舞台门口。
So this is your last gig?
所以这是你最后一次演出了？
That was your last gig?
那是你最后一次演出吗？
Yes.
是的。
Ira Glass And it ended with the entire audience lifting you up and passing you bodily out and gently depositing you out of the club?
艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass） 最后，整个观众把你举起来，把你的身体传出去，然后轻轻地把你送出俱乐部？
Well, not out of the club but to the stage door, yes.
嗯，不是走出俱乐部，而是到舞台门口，是的。
It was amazing.
太棒了。
I don't think I've ever really been lifted by a mob of teenagers and people in their 20s.
我认为我从来没有真正被一群青少年和 20 多岁的人所鼓舞过。
What exactly is that like?
那到底是什么样的？
Well, in Kyoto I felt pretty good about it.
嗯，在京都我感觉还不错。
I'm not sure how I would have felt about it in London in 1977 where the scene was incredibly violent.
我不确定 1977 年在伦敦我会作何感想，当时的场景极其暴力。
Whenever you played, you were just as likely to get beaten up as you were to get paid.
每当你玩游戏时，你被殴打的可能性就和你获得报酬的可能性一样。
Describe what it was like to come back after the tour.
描述一下旅行结束后回来的感觉。
It was hard for me to get motivated again to do my business after the tour.
巡演结束后，我很难再次有动力去做我的生意。
It just wasn't as thrilling as being on a stage in front of cheering--
只是没有在舞台上欢呼雀跃那么激动——
Well, not many things are.
好吧，很多事情都不是。
And it's a bit like-- you know, my dad's generation.
这有点像——你知道，我父亲那一代。
You know, after sort of growing up as a kid, being fired on in World War II and all that kind of stuff.
你知道，在小时候长大，在第二次世界大战中被炮火袭击以及诸如此类的事情之后。
It was kind of hard getting it up for working in the shipping industry again.
再次在航运业工作有点困难。
Shortly after I got back, Steve Lillywhite was in town.
我回来后不久，史蒂夫·利利怀特就到了城里。
And that is?
那是？
David Philp He was the original producer.
大卫·菲尔普 (David Philp) 他是原制片人。
And he was also my roommate at the time that all the Automatics stuff was going on.
当时他也是我的室友，当时所有的自动装置的事情都在进行。
And now he's incredibly successful.
现在他取得了令人难以置信的成功。
He does U2, Dave Matthews, and all that stuff.
他负责 U2、Dave Matthews 以及所有类似的事情。
And anyway, he was in town, he had some time.
不管怎样，他在城里，他有一些时间。
And so we hung out together for a couple of days.
于是我们一起出去玩了几天。
And Hunter was off.
亨特下场了。
Hunter, your wife.
亨特，你的妻子。
David Philp Yes.
大卫·菲尔普 是的。
Hunter, my wife.
亨特，我的妻子。
So we got to hang out.
所以我们必须出去玩。
And we talked a little about the old days.
我们聊了一些过去的事。
And he told me, you know, Big Paul from Specs does catering.
他告诉我，你知道，Specs 的 Big Paul 是做餐饮的。
And Nigel from the members is in Australia now.
成员们的奈杰尔现在在澳大利亚。
And Walter from the Heartbreakers, he's a stockbroker in Manhattan.
还有来自《Heartbreakers》的沃尔特，他是曼哈顿的一名股票经纪人。
So I think I got to see, we don't get what we deserve.
所以我想我必须看到，我们没有得到我们应得的。
We get what we get.
我们得到我们得到的。
And we have to be OK with that.
我们必须接受这一点。
David Philp, lead singer of the Automatics.
大卫·菲尔普（David Philp），自动乐队主唱。
David is still writing music.
大卫仍在创作音乐。
He's released several albums since we first did this interview a few years back.
自从几年前我们第一次接受采访以来，他已经发行了几张专辑。
A couple of those new songs even became number one hits on the UK charts.
其中几首新歌甚至成为英国排行榜上的第一名。
His latest album, West of Wherever, comes out in November.
他的最新专辑《West ofWherever》将于 11 月发行。
Coming up, a fascinating day in the life of a future prime minister, maybe.
也许，即将到来的是未来首相一生中迷人的一天。
That's in a minute from Chicago Public Radio when our program continues.
芝加哥公共广播电台一分钟后我们的节目仍在继续。
It's This American Life.
这就是美国生活。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Each week on our program, of course, we choose some theme, bring you different kinds of stories on that theme.
当然，每周我们的节目都会选择一些主题，为您带来有关该主题的不同类型的故事。
Today's show, "Return to Childhood," stories of people revisiting the past, what they find there, what they do not find there.
今天的节目“回到童年”讲述了人们重温过去的故事，他们在那里发现了什么，在那里找不到什么。
We first aired today's show a few years back.
几年前我们首次播出今天的节目。
We've arrived at Act 3 of our show.
我们已经到了节目的第三幕了。
Act 3, Ariel Sharon, Shimon Peres, David Ben Gurion, and Me.
第三幕，阿里尔·沙龙、西蒙·佩雷斯、大卫·本·古里安和我。
Sometimes when we revisit our childhood, it is not very pleasant what we find.
有时候，当我们回顾童年时，我们发现并不是很愉快。
Take, for example, our next guest.
以我们的下一位客人为例。
When he was a teenager, he started reading the biography of David Ben Gurion, the first prime minister of Israel.
当他十几岁的时候，他开始阅读以色列第一任总理大卫·本·古里安的传记。
And one of the things that he learned is that all of his life, David Ben Gurion kept a diary.
他学到的一件事是，大卫·本·古里安一生都在写日记。
And the whole package seemed like a good idea-- the job, the diary.
整个计划看起来都是个好主意——工作、日记。
"December 3, 1986, Wednesday.
“1986 年 12 月 3 日，星期三。
Another fascinating day in the life of Adam Davidson.
亚当·戴维森生命中又一个迷人的一天。
I have a math test tomorrow.
我明天有数学考试。
I'm going to school early to tutor a girl in my class for the aforementioned test.
我要早点去学校辅导班上的一个女孩进行上述考试。
"My math class, a joint pre-calculus and calculus class, consists mainly of seniors not especially interested in learning.
“我的数学课是微积分预科和微积分联合课，主要由对学习不是特别感兴趣的高年级学生组成。
I guess that I'm the, quote, class expert, unquote, in that I always do the math problems which no one else can.
我想我是，引用，课堂专家，不引用，因为我总是做其他人做不到的数学问题。
And for this, I'm disliked.
为此，我不喜欢。
I guess that because I apply myself, think clearly, and do a little work as well as some intelligence helping out, I am a geek.
我想，因为我专注、清晰思考、做了一些工作以及一些智力帮助，所以我是一个极客。
In truth, I am far from it."
事实上，我离它还很远。”
When you first read that to yourself, when you first saw it, your reaction was?
当你第一次读到它时，当你第一次看到它时，你的反应是？
It was pure horror.
这纯粹是恐怖。
Ira Glass Recently, Adam Davidson, an occasional contributor to our program, found his old high school diaries.
艾拉·格拉斯 (Ira Glass) 最近，我们项目的临时撰稿人亚当·戴维森 (Adam Davidson) 发现了他以前的高中日记。
Adam's mom is Israeli.
亚当的妈妈是以色列人。
His dad is American.
他的父亲是美国人。
Adam grew up in New York.
亚当在纽约长大。
Well, his body was in New York.
嗯，他的尸体在纽约。
His brain, as the diaries reveal, was somewhere else entirely.
正如日记所揭示的那样，他的大脑完全在其他地方。
I remember when I was writing it, I remember very clearly-- although I don't say this in the diary-- that it was very clear to me that this was the diary of the future prime minister of Israel, me, that I would one day be prime minister, and it would be very important for history, for people to know the deep thoughts of a young Zionist as he prepared his way to lead his nation.
我记得当我写这篇文章时，我记得很清楚——尽管我没有在日记中这么说——我很清楚这是以色列未来总理的日记，我，有一天我会成为总理，这对历史非常重要，让人们了解一位年轻的犹太复国主义者在准备领导他的国家时的深刻思想。
Now, our regular listeners here on This American Life might remember that you've been on our program describing your experience in Israeli army summer camp.
现在，我们《美国生活》的常客可能还记得您在我们的节目中描述了您在以色列军队夏令营的经历。
That was right before I started writing this diary.
那是在我开始写这篇日记之前。
Read me another.
给我读另一个。
Adam Davidson Sure.
亚当·戴维森 当然。
Let's see.
让我们看看。
"There's so much wrong with Jews and Israel that I'm going to have a job ahead of me.
“犹太人和以色列存在太多问题，我将面临一份工作。
One thing is the lack of any strong Jewish identity among most Jews.
一件事是大多数犹太人缺乏强烈的犹太身份。
This attitude sickens me.
这种态度让我感到恶心。
"You Jews of the world, stop worrying about money and well-being.
“全世界的犹太人，不要再担心金钱和福祉了。
I do not know what exactly I'll do.
我不知道我到底要做什么。
But if this situation continues when I'm a bit older, then watch out, world Jewry, here comes Adam." And "Watch out, world Jewry, here comes Adam" was all in capital letters.
但如果这种情况在我长大一点后继续下去，那么请小心，世界犹太人，亚当来了。” “小心，世界犹太人，亚当来了”全部是大写字母。
It's interesting that you actually are addressing a readership.
有趣的是，你实际上是在向读者讲话。
I know.
我知道。
I know.
我知道。
That's what's kind of amazing.
这就是令人惊奇的地方。
Right.
正确的。
Yeah.
是的。
The Jews of the world will one day read this book and will say, if he knew this at 16, how could I be living so badly?
世界上的犹太人有一天会读到这本书，并会说，如果他在 16 岁时就知道这一点，我怎么会过得这么糟糕？
Can I ask you to just read one of the passages where you talk about Israel?
我可以请你读一下你谈论以色列的段落吗？
Sure.
当然。
Let's see.
让我们来看看。
I mean, I have this thing from January 4, 1987.
我的意思是，我有 1987 年 1 月 4 日的这件事。
"I memorized 'The Hope,' 'Hatikvah,'" which is the Israeli National anthem, "a few minutes ago.
“几分钟前，我记住了以色列国歌《希望》、《Hatikvah》。
That will help me in Israel." And I find that really amazing that here I am, the future prime minister of Israel, and one of the things I need-- oh God, I need to know the national anthem.
这对我在以色列有帮助。”我发现我在这里，以色列未来的总理，这真是太神奇了，我需要的东西之一——天啊，我需要知道国歌。
I'll probably be called upon to recite that at some point.
我可能会在某个时候被要求背诵这句话。
There will be a ballgame or something where you just stand up and sing it.
会有一场球赛或其他你站起来唱歌的活动。
Right, exactly.
对，完全正确。
"January 14, 1987.
“1987 年 1 月 14 日。
Wednesday.
星期三。
I'm getting more and more angered by the effects of Arab propaganda.
我对阿拉伯宣传的影响越来越愤怒。
They blame the Jews for everything.
他们把一切都归咎于犹太人。
And the world, including Jews, go along with it.
包括犹太人在内的世界也纷纷附和。
Entirely ridiculous."
完全荒谬。”
I mean, I really thought this was a testament for the ages.
我的意思是，我真的认为这是多年来的证明。
I really thought that this writing was powerful and persuasive, and anyone who would read it would immediately become a Zionist.
我真的认为这篇文章很有说服力，很有说服力，任何读过它的人都会立即成为犹太复国主义者。
At 16, I had such an inflated sense of myself.
16岁时，我的自我意识是如此膨胀。
There was so much going on in my life then that I can remember, and I wasn't recording it.
当时我的生活中发生了很多事情，我都记得，但我没有记录下来。
Instead, I was creating this ridiculous fantasy of, you know, I'm not just a 16-year-old kid who's having crushes and a hopeless geek who can't get a girl to kiss him and being scared and confused about growing old.
相反，我正在创造这种荒谬的幻想，你知道，我不仅仅是一个迷恋的 16 岁孩子，一个无法让女孩亲吻他的绝望的极客，一个对变老感到恐惧和困惑的人。
I'm the future prime minister of Israel, and everything goes through that.
我是以色列未来的总理，一切都会经历这个过程。
But I don't know.
但我不知道。
I mean, just--
我的意思是，只是——
But maybe keeping a diary where one tells the truth, maybe that's a luxury of being a certain kind of person in a certain kind of situation.
但也许写日记，说出真相，也许这是在某种情况下成为某种人的一种奢侈。
Maybe other people in another kind of situation need to actually make up a little fantasy.
也许处于另一种情况的其他人实际上需要编造一些幻想。
Yeah.
是的。
I think I didn't have much angst about being the future prime minister of Israel.
我想我对于成为以色列未来的总理并没有太多的焦虑。
I was very calm and confident and comfortable with it.
我对此非常平静、自信和舒服。
And I had so much angst about every other aspect of my life.
我对生活的其他方面都感到非常焦虑。
And so I now see it as just kind of-- maybe it was a good solution.
所以我现在认为这可能是一个很好的解决方案。
It was a good way to deal with what I was going through, to have this space where I could just be one of the greats.
这是处理我正在经历的事情的好方法，拥有这个空间，让我可以成为伟大的人之一。
I wonder what the 16-year-old Adam Davidson would feel in knowing that finally an audience of a million people was getting some of the reading from this diary.
我想知道 16 岁的亚当·戴维森 (Adam Davidson) 知道一百万人的读者终于能从这本日记中读到一些内容时会有什么感受。
I think this would feel so small to that 16-year-old.
我想对于那个16岁的孩子来说这会感觉太渺小了。
This would feel so nothing.
这样感觉就没什么了。
I mean, I remember I was very disappointed and very sad about my parents.
我的意思是，我记得我对我的父母感到非常失望和悲伤。
I mean, I was reading biographies, of course, of all the prime ministers of Israel.
我的意思是，我当然正在阅读以色列所有总理的传记。
And I would just think about my parents and just think, how do you wake up every day knowing that your actions won't affect millions of people?
我只会想到我的父母，然后想，你如何每天醒来都知道你的行为不会影响数百万人？
Like, how is that enough motivation just to have your petty little craft and your petty little family and your small little apartment?
就像，仅仅拥有你的小手艺、你的小家庭和你的小公寓，这足够的动力吗？
You know, it just seemed pathetic.
你知道，这看起来很可悲。
And I mean, they have the kind of life that, I mean, basically I want my for myself.
我的意思是，他们的生活基本上是我想要的。
What you're saying, though, is that the 16-year-old you would be cringing at your 30-year-old version, just as your 30-year-old version is cringing at the 16.
不过，你所说的是，16 岁的你会对 30 岁的版本感到畏缩，就像你 30 岁的版本会对 16 岁的版本感到畏缩一样。
Yeah, that's very true.
是的，确实如此。
Yeah, he would be very, very disgusted if he heard this radio piece.
是的，如果他听到这个广播节目，他会非常非常厌恶。
It would seem like I had settled in a pathetic way.
看来我已经以一种可悲的方式安顿下来了。
Adam Davidson.
亚当·戴维森.
These days, he's a staff writer for The New Yorker.
如今，他是《纽约客》的特约撰稿人。
Act 4, When We Were Angels.
第四幕，当我们还是天使时。
This story originally came to us from a graduate student.
这个故事最初是由一位研究生告诉我们的。
Hillary Frank was studying drawing at the New York Academy of Art, and she mailed our radio show a story that she wanted to get onto the program.
希拉里·弗兰克正在纽约艺术学院学习绘画，她向我们的广播节目邮寄了一个她想加入该节目的故事。
And what she had done is that she had recorded the interviews using her little microcassette answering machine.
她所做的是用她的小型微型录音答录机记录了采访。
And then to edit the quotes that she had gotten, what she would do is that she would record by dubbing and recording onto her shiny red boombox.
然后，为了编辑她收到的引语，她要做的就是通过配音和录制到她闪亮的红色音箱上来进行录制。
It was crude, yes, but the story sounded remarkably like a story from This American Life.
是的，这很粗糙，但这个故事听起来非常像《美国生活》中的故事。
Now, for one reason or another and time considerations, that unsolicited story never made it onto the radio.
现在，出于某种原因和时间考虑，这个不请自来的故事从未出现在广播中。
For this week's show, however, we had her put together another story using that same style which we added music to here at the radio station to make it fully sound like a story on our show.
然而，在本周的节目中，我们让她使用相同的风格整理了另一个故事，我们在广播电台添加了音乐，使其听起来完全像我们节目中的故事。
It's a story about an incident that happened to her back when she was an undergraduate.
这是一个发生在她本科时背上的事件的故事。
Tufts University is a pretty straight place.
塔夫茨大学是一个非常直接的地方。
Entertainment for most people means fraternity keggers.
对于大多数人来说，娱乐意味着兄弟会聚会。
It's not the sort of place you'd expect people to watch a guy sitting on another guy's shoulders pretending to be a giant.
这不是那种你会期望人们看到一个人坐在另一个人的肩膀上假装巨人的地方。
It happened by accident in 1994.
事情发生在1994年的一次偶然中。
My friend Scott was the top half.
我的朋友斯科特是上半部分。
It was the beginning of the school year, and we were kind of bored one night.
那是学年的开始，有一天晚上我们有点无聊。
And we decided to go up to the quad.
我们决定去四方院。
And I guess basically Jeff got up on someone's back, and he started yelling and screaming about how giant he was, and how magnificent he was.
我想杰夫基本上是站在某人的背上，然后他开始大喊大叫，说他有多么巨大，他有多么伟大。
And I think actually right after that I might have gotten on someone's back and said, yeah, I am also giant.
我想实际上在那之后我可能会站在某人的背上说，是的，我也是巨人。
And I guess that really struck a chord in me.
我想这确实引起了我的共鸣。
I thought that was pretty amusing.
我觉得这很有趣。
I guess I thought a lot about it.
我想我想了很多。
It actually did start me thinking along a particular path.
它确实让我开始沿着一条特定的道路思考。
Scott talked about the idea one night in the dining hall.
一天晚上，斯科特在餐厅里谈到了这个想法。
The next day, on the way to class, he saw signs all over campus that said in bold print, "I am nine feet tall.
第二天，在去上课的路上，他看到校园里到处都是标语，上面用粗体字写着：“我身高九英尺。
Come see Giant Man, 8:00 PM on the quad."
晚上 8:00 在广场上来看巨人。”
Scott had no idea who put them up.
斯科特不知道是谁放的。
He learned later that the signs were posted by a guy who had overheard him talking at dinner.
后来他了解到，这些标语是由一个无意中听到他在晚餐时说话的人张贴的。
Scott decided he would go to the quad at the specified time and undertake the challenge.
斯科特决定在指定时间前往四方场地接受挑战。
To pull this off, he would need to create a character and a costume for the giant.
为了实现这一目标，他需要为巨人创造一个角色和一套服装。
He gave Giant Man a booming voice.
他给巨人人发出洪亮的声音。
I don't even know exactly.
我什至不太清楚。
It was something like, you know, behold!
就像，你知道，看哪！
I am Giant!
我是巨人！
Just this-- not even loud but just kind of weird and suggesting man-ness in some vague way.
就是这样——甚至声音不大，但有点奇怪，以某种模糊的方式暗示着男子气概。
You know?
你知道？
I don't know.
我不知道。
Scott asked his tallest friend, Podo, to ask as Giant Man's legs.
斯科特请他最高的朋友波多询问巨人的腿。
They grabbed some props before heading up to the quad-- a blanket to wrap around their middle to hide Podo, a long wooden staff, and a black curly wig, like the guys in Kiss.
他们在前往四方场地之前拿了一些道具——一条毯子，用来围住中间以隐藏波多，一根长木杖，还有一顶黑色卷发假发，就像《吻》中的人一样。
We picked out a point in the bushes, Podo and I, and we kind of really couldn't see what was going on out on the quad.
波多和我在灌木丛中选了一个点，我们真的看不到四边形上发生了什么。
And so the time came, and I got on his shoulders, basically, and tied the blanket around my waist, and we walked out.
时间到了，我基本上站在他的肩膀上，把毯子系在我的腰上，然后我们走了出去。
And I remember there just being maybe 10 people, 15 people.
我记得大概只有 10 个人、15 个人。
And I remember them being way on the other side and sort of running.
我记得他们在另一边，正在奔跑。
And what was so ridiculous about it was, there was just a handful of people.
可笑的是，这里只有寥寥几人。
And they were so spread out, but they were all sort of coming towards me.
他们分散得很远，但都在向我这边过来。
It was like, what the hell am I doing here?
就像，我到底在这里做什么？
He decided to plan another Giant Man appearance the following week.
他决定计划在下周再次亮相巨人人。
They posted more signs and told everyone they knew, go see Giant Man, it'll blow your mind.
他们张贴了更多标语，并告诉他们认识的每个人，去看巨人，这会让你大吃一惊。
Word spread quickly, and amazingly they were able to keep it secret that they themselves were Giant Man.
消息很快传开，令人惊讶的是他们能够保守自己是巨人的秘密。
Most students believed there was an actual nine-foot man come to Tufts for some mysterious reason.
大多数学生相信有一个真正的九英尺高的男人出于某种神秘的原因来到塔夫茨。
I was friends with these guys, and I didn't even know yet.
我和这些人是朋友，我什至还不知道。
At the next appearance, almost 200 people were waiting for Giant Man and chanting his name.
在下一次出现时，近200人正在等待巨人人并呼喊着他的名字。
It was like a political rally.
这就像一场政治集会。
Some of them carried signs that said things like, "We love you, Giant Man," "Why are you here," "Save us from ourselves, Giant Man," "Nine Feet of Lovin'," and "Giant freak, go home."
其中一些人举着标语，上面写着“我们爱你，巨人”、“你为什么在这里”、“救救我们，巨人”、“九英尺的爱”和“巨人怪物，回家吧”。
Giant Man made his way onto the quad, and the crowd went wild.
巨人走进了广场，人群疯狂了。
People came rushing out of their dorms to see what was going on.
人们纷纷从宿舍里跑出来，想看看发生了什么事。
When Giant Man reached his fans, he made a small speech.
当巨人人到达他的粉丝面前时，他发表了简短的讲话。
"I am giant," he boomed.
“我是巨人，”他大声说道。
"I am huge, and I have brought you butterscotch." He then threw cellophane-wrapped butterscotch to the crowd, and they dove for it.
“我很大，我给你带来了奶油糖果。”然后，他向人群扔了玻璃纸包裹的奶油糖果，他们纷纷扑向它。
On the walk up, I just stopped in the bookstore and saw some candy.
在路上，我在书店停下来，看到了一些糖果。
And I was starting to think, what was the most ridiculous candy that nobody ever ate?
我开始思考，没有人吃过的最可笑的糖果是什么？
And there was butterscotch there and some kind of cellophane wrapper.
那里有奶油糖果和某种玻璃纸包装纸。
It looked like nobody was eating it.
看起来好像没人吃。
Butterscotch became Giant Man's trademark treat.
奶油糖果成为巨人的标志性美食。
When he ran out of things to say, he would revert to throwing candy.
当他无话可说时，他就会转而扔糖果。
The fact of the matter is, Giant Man had very little to tell the Tufts community other than, "My strength is amazing, my girth is enormous, and my height is unequaled." He would brag like this for only two or three minutes and then retreat back to the bushes.
事实上，巨人除了“我的力量惊人，我的腰围巨大，我的身高无与伦比”之外，几乎没有什么可告诉塔夫茨社区的。他只会这样吹牛两三分钟，然后就退到灌木丛里。
The problem was Podo would get really tired really quickly.
问题是波多很快就会感到疲倦。
Like, he walked out really fast, like he almost was running out.
他走出去的速度非常快，就像他快要跑完了一样。
And he got really tired and didn't even know where he was going.
他真的很累，甚至不知道自己要去哪里。
And he kind of just-- I mean, it must have looked absolutely idiotic.
他有点——我的意思是，这看起来绝对是愚蠢的。
So he couldn't see?
所以他看不见？
Scott Yeah.
斯科特 是的。
I mean, his eyes were covered.
我的意思是，他的眼睛被遮住了。
I remember, I would sit on his head and I would put both my hands on his head, kind of give him direction by maybe forcing his head in a certain direction.
我记得，我会坐在他的头上，双手放在他的头上，通过强迫他的头朝某个方向来给他指明方向。
Giant Man became a phenomenon.
巨人成为一种现象。
Enthusiasts wore "I Love Giant Man" T-shirts, which had silhouettes of a huge man with a bulging middle.
爱好者们穿着“我爱巨人”T恤，上面有一个腰部凸起的巨大男人的轮廓。
There was once a parade across canvas with noisemakers and a trumpet to greet him.
有一次，有人在画布上游行，带着噪音制造者和喇叭来迎接他。
Another time there were torch jugglers and bodyguards.
还有一次，还有火炬杂耍者和保镖。
Letters were written to the student newspaper, pro and con Giant Man.
人们给学生报纸写了信，赞成和反对巨人。
Teachers were mentioning Giant Man in class.
老师们在课堂上提到了巨人。
There was a discussion in an ethics course in which people who hadn't seen Giant Man argued about whether or not we were exploiting a freak of nature.
在道德课程中，没有见过巨人的人们争论我们是否在利用自然的畸形现象。
I remember, I was out there.
我记得，我当时就在外面。
There was this guy that I kind of vaguely knew who was there with a bunch of his buddies.
有一个我隐约认识的人，他和他的一群朋友在那儿。
I guess we were from the same fraternity or something.
我猜我们是来自同一个兄弟会之类的。
And they were jumping around and stuff.
他们到处跳来跳去。
And they're saying, yeah, we're going to take Giant Man down.
他们说，是的，我们要打倒巨人。
When I went out there, I was talking for a little while.
当我出去的时候，我聊了一会儿。
And I saw him.
我看到了他。
He was sort of right behind me, or they were coming up from the side, him and his buddies.
他就在我身后，或者说他和他的伙伴们从旁边走来。
And I remember him just sort of coming up and starting to pull on my sheet and stuff.
我记得他刚刚走过来，开始拉我的床单之类的东西。
And one of them tried to push me.
其中一个人试图推我。
And Podo, who could barely stand as it was, after walking out there and with me on his shoulders, he was sort of shaking a little bit and managed to stay on his feet.
波多几乎无法站立，走出去后，我站在他的肩膀上，他有点发抖，但还是设法站了起来。
I remember just sort of offering them butterscotch and just screaming about how much I loved them.
我记得我只是给他们提供奶油糖果，然后尖叫着表达我有多爱他们。
And they just kind of took off, and it was over.
他们就这样起飞了，一切就结束了。
Do you think that if Giant Man had been an actual political cause that you would have gotten such a big turnout and there would have been such a big deal about it?
你认为如果巨人人是一个真正的政治事业，你会得到如此大的投票率并且会有如此大的事情吗？
Yeah, I doubt that.
是的，我对此表示怀疑。
I mean, if there was really-- that's one of the things I think that was a big draw about it was that, you know, it didn't have any meaning.
我的意思是，如果真的有的话，我认为它最吸引人的地方之一就是，你知道，它没有任何意义。
And for whatever reason, people were really drawn to that.
不管出于什么原因，人们确实被它所吸引。
I mean, if it had meaning or was trying to pitch some ideas or something, it would kind of seem less real, I think.
我的意思是，如果它有意义或试图提出一些想法或其他东西，我认为它会显得不那么真实。
I mean, there was really something fundamentally interesting and truthful about Giant Man, I guess.
我的意思是，我想，巨人确实有一些本质上有趣和真实的东西。
I mean, there is something that people are drawn to, to that absurdity, for whatever reason.
我的意思是，无论出于何种原因，人们都会被某种东西、那种荒谬所吸引。
By the end, Giant Man's following had grown to about 350 people.
到最后，巨人人的追随者已经增加到大约350人。
I don't think any of us have had any experience like it since.
我认为从那以后我们中没有人有过类似的经历。
When you're a student, it still feels like something exciting might happen at any moment.
当你还是一名学生时，你仍然会感觉随时可能发生令人兴奋的事情。
Life feels full of all this potential.
生活充满了所有这些潜力。
But when you get out of school, that potential just doesn't seem to be there.
但当你离开学校时，这种潜力似乎就不存在了。
What do you do now?
你现在做什么？
Scott Well, I'm an engineer.
斯科特：嗯，我是一名工程师。
What kind of engineer?
什么样的工程师？
Scott A computer engineer, designing computer circuits and things like that.
斯科特 一名计算机工程师，设计计算机电路等。
And do you have Giant Man-like experiences today?
今天你有巨人般的经历吗？
No. I mean, not really.
不，我的意思是，不是真的。
I'm not parading around talking about my magnificence.
我不会到处炫耀我的辉煌。
There's actually a recording of Giant Man's final public appearance.
实际上有巨人最后一次公开露面的录音。
There was a band called the Electric Fun Machine that dedicated a song to him, and he appeared with them at a concert on the quad.
有一支名为“Electric Fun Machine”的乐队专门为他献了一首歌，他和他们一起出现在广场的一场音乐会上。
Students of Tufts, fear me not!
塔夫茨大学的学生们，不要害怕我！
For I am the benevolent Giant Man!
因为我是仁慈的巨人！
I have come to show love!
我是来秀恩爱的！
As a symbol of my benevolence, I shall once again shower you with--
作为我仁慈的象征，我将再次向你洒下——
And then, Giant Man threw butterscotch candy.
然后，巨人扔了奶油糖果。
Hillary Frank.
希拉里·弗兰克.
In the years since she first did this story for us, she has created many radio stories and a podcast called The Longest Shortest Time, which is about parenting.
自从她第一次为我们创作这个故事以来，她创作了许多广播故事和一个名为“最长最短时间”的播客，这是关于育儿的。
Her most recent book is Weird Parenting Wins.
她的最新著作是《奇怪的育儿胜利》。
[MUSIC PLAYING - "SEPTEMBER SONG" BY BRYAN FERRY]
[音乐播放 - BRYAN FERRY 的《九月之歌》]
Well, today's program was produced by Jonathan Goldstein and myself with Alex Blumberg, Starlee Kine, Erin Yanke, and Annie Baxter, and mixed by Jared Ford and Catherine Raimondo.
今天的节目由乔纳森·戈尔茨坦和我本人以及亚历克斯·布伦伯格、斯塔莉·凯恩、艾琳·扬克和安妮·巴克斯特制作，并由贾里德·福特和凯瑟琳·雷蒙多混音。
Senior producer of today's show was Julie Snyder.
今天节目的高级制片人是朱莉·斯奈德。
Our technical director is Matt Tierney.
我们的技术总监是马特·蒂尔尼。
Production help from Anna Martin.
安娜·马丁的制作帮助。
Musical help today from Mr. John Connor.
今天约翰·康纳先生提供音乐帮助。
Special thanks today to Lawrench Weschler, Lacey Kine, Craig Danwire, and Anaheed Alani.
今天特别感谢 Lawrench Weschler、Lacey Kine、Craig Danwire 和 Anaheed Alani。
This American Life is distributed by PRX, the Public Radio Exchange.
《美国生活》由公共广播电台 PRX 发行。
Thanks, as always, to our program's co-founder, Mr. Torey Malatia.
一如既往地感谢我们项目的联合创始人 Torey Malatia 先生。
You know, he's been rereading the Bible and talking about it with me in the break room.
你知道，他一直在重读圣经，并在休息室和我谈论它。
I don't know about his interpretation of the Bible.
我不知道他对圣经的解释如何。
Like, OK.
就像，好吧。
God creates two people to live in the Garden of Eden.
上帝创造了两个人住在伊甸园里。
I really don't think he says--
我真的不认为他说——
Watch out, world Jewry.
小心，世界犹太人。
Here comes Adam.
亚当来了。
I'm Ira Glass, back next week with more stories of This American Life.
我是艾拉·格拉斯，下周回来，带来更多《美国生活》的故事。
This American Life This American Life is produced in collaboration with WBEZ Chicago and delivered to stations by PRX The Public Radio Exchange.
This American Life This American Life 与 WBEZ Chicago 合作制作，并由 PRX 公共广播电台传送到各电台。