323: The Super - This American Life
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00:00 00:00 Transcript Share This American Life Life Partners How to Listen Episodes Recommended About Overview Staff Announcements Fellowships Jobs Music Make Radio On The Road FAQ Submissions Merch Contact Us Our Other Shows Merch Follow Us Life Partners Subscribe to our newsletter Full episode Toggle Audio and Transcript Sync Transcript | Episode #323 | August 25, 2023 323: The Super Note: This American Life is produced for the ear and designed to be heard.
00:00 00:00 文字记录 分享此 美国生活 生活伙伴 如何收听 剧集 推荐 关于 概述 员工公告 奖学金 工作 音乐 在路上制作电台 常见问题解答 提交 商品 联系我们 我们的其他节目 商品 关注我们 生活伙伴 订阅我们的时事通讯 整集 切换音频和文字记录同步 文字记录 | 内容第 323 集 | 2023 年 8 月 25 日 323：超级注：《美国生活》是为耳朵而制作，旨在让人们听到。
If you are able, we strongly encourage you to listen to the audio, which includes emotion and emphasis that's not on the page.
如果可以的话，我们强烈建议您收听音频，其中包括页面上没有的情感和重点。
Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors.
文字记录是使用语音识别软件和人工转录员结合生成的，可能包含错误。
Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print.
请在印刷版引用前检查相应的音频。
Prologue Ira Glass Peter has been on the job for 20 years.
序言 Ira Glass Peter 已经从事这一工作 20 年了。
He's got the uniform.
他有制服。
He's got the office in the basement behind the laundry room.
他的办公室位于洗衣房后面的地下室。
He's got the keys.
他有钥匙。
[JINGLING KEYS] Peter Roach That's a lot of crap on there, but hey.
[JINGLING KEYS] Peter Roach 上面有很多废话，但是嘿。
Let's just count them.
我们来数一下吧。
Peter Roach Let's basically count them.
彼得·罗奇 让我们基本上数一下它们。
Yeah.
是的。
Peter Roach All right, so you got your 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11.
Peter Roach 好吧，你得到了 1、2、3、4、5、6、7、8、9、10、11。
This is a keyring that is so big that it not only has tons of keys, it also has smaller baby key rings-- subsidiary key rings hanging off of it, each with its own keys.
这是一个太大的钥匙圈，不仅有大量的钥匙，还有较小的婴儿钥匙圈——挂在上面的辅助钥匙圈，每个钥匙圈都有自己的钥匙。
And almost none of these keys has any kind of label indicating what it is that it opens.
而且这些钥匙几乎都没有任何类型的标签来表明它打开的是什么。
And have you ever seen a guy carrying this kind of thing, and you've wondered, OK, well, how does he remember which key goes to which lock?
你有没有见过一个人拿着这种东西，你想知道，好吧，他是怎么记住哪把钥匙开哪把锁的？
Oh, wait a second.
哦，等一下。
Peter's nearly done counting.
彼得快数完了。
He actually skipped a lot of keys.
他实际上跳过了很多键。
Anyway, I was saying, if you ever wondered how he remembers which key goes to which thing, Peter says 3/4 of these keys, he has no idea what they're for.
不管怎样，我是说，如果你想知道他是如何记住哪个钥匙对应哪个东西的，彼得说这些钥匙中有 3/4，他不知道它们的用途。
Every time I change a lock or I get a new key to this or that, it just gets added on there.
每次我换一把锁或者拿到一把新钥匙时，它都会被添加到那里。
I never took the time to take the old ones off.
我从来没有花时间把旧的脱下来。
Practical.
实际的。
Above all, Peter is a practical man.
最重要的是，彼得是一个务实的人。
In his line of work, that's essential.
在他的工作中，这是至关重要的。
He's a super, in charge of keeping the elevators humming, and the boiler going, and the roof from leaking, and the sidewalks clean, and 100 other things every single day.
他是一名超级主管，每天负责保持电梯运转、锅炉运转、屋顶不漏水、人行道清洁以及其他 100 件事。
He works at a fancy building on New York's Upper East Side.
他在纽约上东区的一栋豪华建筑里工作。
Or maybe I should say it's a medium-fancy building, fancy enough that Woody Allen and Mayor Giuliani shopped for apartments there, but not fancy enough that they actually moved in.
或者我应该说这是一栋中等高档的建筑，豪华到伍迪·艾伦和市长朱利安尼都在那里购买公寓，但还不够豪华，以至于他们实际上搬进去了。
To hold a job like this for very long, even in a medium-fancy building, you have to sweat the details of everything.
要想长期从事这样的工作，即使是在一栋中等豪华的建筑里，你也必须在每件事的细节上都费尽心思。
My compactor room, a woman could give birth, no infection would set in.
我的压实室里，女人可以生孩子，不会感染。
Come, I'll show you.
来吧，我给你看。
He uses a key from the part of the key chain where he knows what's going on.
他使用钥匙链中他知道发生了什么的部分的钥匙。
And suddenly we're in an immaculate room with concrete floors.
突然间，我们就进入了一个干净的房间，铺有混凝土地板。
Oh my god, it's so wonderful in here.
天哪，这里真是太棒了。
[INHALES] And this is the garbage room.
[吸气]这是垃圾房。
No. You want to go up to the roof and oil the circulation pumps with me?
不，你想和我一起去屋顶给循环泵加油吗？
That really has to be the worst pickup line ever.
这确实是有史以来最糟糕的接送线。
We dropped by the pump room to check some gauges, and then we head back into the elevator and pass one of the doormen who works with Peter.
我们顺便去了泵房检查一些仪表，然后回到电梯，经过了一位与彼得一起工作的门卫。
Martin, your parole officer called.
马丁，你的假释官打来电话了。
Give him a call.
给他打电话。
So can you joke around with the tenants in this building?
那么你能和这栋楼的房客开玩笑吗？
Not like that.
不是那样的。
No, you don't want to go there.
不，你不想去那里。
I'm pretty friendly with some of them, but there's a line.
我对他们中的一些人非常友好，但是有一条线。
Yeah.
是的。
I tell these guys, you've got to keep it short and sweet.
我告诉这些人，你必须保持简短而甜蜜。
Good morning.
早上好。
Good evening.
晚上好。
How about them Knicks?
他们尼克斯队怎么样？
Happy holidays.
节日快乐。
Martin's kind of new.
马丁是个新人。
He wanted to say Happy Hanukkah to a few people.
他想对一些人说光明节快乐。
I said, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. No Merry Christmas, no Happy Hanukkah.
我说，不，不，不，不，不，不，不。没有圣诞快乐，没有光明节快乐。
It's happy holidays.
这是一个快乐的假期。
Oh, but, uh-- I said, no. You're going to miss.
哦，但是，呃——我说，不。你会错过的。
You're going to miss.
你会错过的。
I'm telling you, you're going to miss.
我告诉你，你会错过的。
You're going to throw one the wrong way, and it's going to come back.
如果你以错误的方式扔了一个，它就会回来。
It's delicate, dealing with the tenants-- surprisingly delicate.
与房客打交道是很微妙的——微妙得令人惊讶。
People in the building gossip about him.
大楼里的人都在议论他。
Then he's got his own secret thoughts about them, too.
然后他对它们也有自己的秘密想法。
For today in our program, we have stories of the super.
今天在我们的节目中，我们有关于超级的故事。
He sees everybody come and go.
他看到每个人来来去去。
He knows way more about the tenants than they know about him.
他对房客的了解比他们对他的了解还要多。
I mean, Peter has a security camera, for God's sake.
我的意思是，看在上帝的份上，彼得有一个监控摄像头。
He's on call 24 hours a day.
他一天 24 小时待命。
He's both a figure of authority and kind of an in-house servant.
他既是一个权威人物，又是一个内部仆人。
From WBEZ Chicago is This American Life.
来自 WBEZ 芝加哥的《美国生活》。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Our show today in three acts-- three very dramatic acts, actually, starting-- let's just get right to it-- starting with this one from Jack Hitt.
我们今天的演出分三幕——实际上是三幕非常戏剧性的表演——让我们直接开始吧——从杰克·希特的这一幕开始。
His act is like an epic novel with plot twists, and unforeseen danger, and bizarre coincidences, and unlikely heroes, and even more unlikely bad guys.
他的行为就像一部史诗小说，情节曲折，有不可预见的危险，有离奇的巧合，有不太可能的英雄，也有更不可能的坏人。
Here's Jack.
这是杰克。
During New York City's great crime wave of the 1980s, getting an apartment was simple.
在 20 世纪 80 年代纽约市犯罪大潮期间，获得一套公寓非常简单。
All you had to do was commit a crime.
你所要做的就是犯罪。
We had heard from a friend of a friend that if we went down and gave key money-- that is to say, one month's rent, it was the going fee-- to this superintendent-- that is to say, Bob-- that we would be able to get an apartment.
我们听朋友的朋友说，如果我们下去给这位负责人（也就是鲍勃）交礼金——也就是说，一个月的房租，这是日常费——我们就能租到一套公寓。
This is my friend Kevin.
这是我的朋友凯文。
He and I got our apartments in the same building on 99th Street in the early '80s by bribing the same superintendent, a guy named Bob.
80 年代初，我和他贿赂了同一个负责人鲍勃，在 99 街的同一栋楼里得到了我们的公寓。
These were old beat-up flats with screaming radiators and warped floors and exposed pipes.
这些都是破旧的公寓，散热器发出刺耳的声音，地板扭曲，管道裸露。
A city engineer once inspected the building and declared that it was six stories of dust, held up by 100 years of paint.
一位城市工程师曾经检查过这座建筑，并宣称它是六层楼的灰尘，被 100 年的油漆所支撑。
These were our first New York apartments.
这是我们在纽约的第一套公寓。
We were there to start our lives.
我们在那里开始我们的生活。
New York was all romance, and everything was outsized and outrageous-- the buildings in Midtown, our ambition, the nightlife, and as we quickly discovered, our super, Bob.
纽约充满了浪漫，一切都巨大而令人震惊——中城的建筑、我们的野心、夜生活，以及我们很快发现的，我们的超级鲍勃。
All sorts of things about him were truly spectacular, like, for example, the way he repaired our apartments.
他的各种事情都非常引人注目，例如，他修理我们公寓的方式。
Here's Chris, another tenant in the building.
这是大楼的另一位租户克里斯。
After we got burglarized, Bob put in safety gates for the fire escape, which he welded so that nobody could get in, but you couldn't get out in a fire either.
我们遭到盗窃后，鲍勃在防火梯上安装了安全门，并将其焊接起来，这样就没有人可以进入，但在火灾中你也无法出去。
There was no way to open them.
没有办法打开它们。
He told us that they were installing sliding revolving doors, which he never explained what those were, but I do remember thinking to myself, how can he say they're sliding revolving doors?
他告诉我们他们正在安装滑动旋转门，但他从未解释过那是什么，但我确实记得自己在想，他怎么能说他们是滑动旋转门呢？
But he said it with such a totally straight face.
但他说这话的时候却板着一张脸。
Bob's work habits were a thing of wonder.
鲍勃的工作习惯令人惊奇。
I remember one time, Bob showed up with his assistant, a generally talented guy named Smitty.
我记得有一次，鲍勃和他的助手一起出现，助手是一位很有才华的人，名叫斯密蒂。
My sink was backed up, and Bob started pouring this heavy black liquid from a gallon jug into the standing water.
我的水槽被备份了，鲍勃开始将这种浓稠的黑色液体从一加仑的罐子倒入积水中。
Smitty started backing up, and with experience as my guide, I started backing up, too.
斯密蒂开始备份，以经验为指导，我也开始备份。
"One cup," Smitty yelled, "just one cup." "Shut up," Bob explained.
“一杯，”斯密蒂喊道，“就一杯。” “闭嘴，”鲍勃解释道。
And he emptied the entire jug into the water.
然后他把整个罐子倒进水里。
There were nasty rumblings.
有令人讨厌的隆隆声。
Hot chemical reactions were happening somewhere in the walls.
墙壁某处正在发生炽热的化学反应。
I was very scared.
我很害怕。
And suddenly the doors below the sink where I kept my cleaning stuff, they blew open with an explosion.
突然，我放清洁用品的水槽下面的门突然爆炸了。
And this unspeakable oily sludge poured out across the kitchen floor.
这些难以形容的油腻污泥倾倒在厨房地板上。
Bob was so much more than just a bad handyman.
鲍勃不仅仅是一个糟糕的勤杂工。
Very early on, I began to perceive Bob's talents as a fabulist.
很早就，我开始认识到鲍勃作为寓言家的天赋。
It was really painful to go down and pay the rent every month.
每个月下去交房租真的很痛苦。
You had to give it to him, which meant you had to stand there and listen to 10, 15, 20 minutes of completely insane stories.
你必须把它交给他，这意味着你必须站在那里听 10、15、20 分钟的完全疯狂的故事。
A big running theme was Bob's importance in the world in general, and particularly in Brazil.
一个重要的主题是鲍勃在世界上的重要性，特别是在巴西。
I definitely remember his cattle ranch stories.
我绝对记得他的牧场故事。
This is Anne, another tenant during those early days, and now married to Chris.
这是安妮，早期的另一位房客，现在嫁给了克里斯。
He had seven cattle ranches, four cattle ranches he owned in Brazil, and the seven vineyards he had in Italy.
他拥有七个牧场，其中四个牧场位于巴西，七个葡萄园位于意大利。
Or it might have been seven cattle ranches in Brazil and four vineyards in Italy.
或者可能是巴西的七个牧场和意大利的四个葡萄园。
If you actually took him-- after he left the room and you thought about what he said, you'd think, why is he living here?
如果你真的带了他——在他离开房间之后，你想想他说的话，你会想，他为什么住在这里？
Because he was like basically a king.
因为他基本上就像一个国王。
The village people would just welcome him.
村里的人只会欢迎他。
He claimed that there was a clause in the constitution of Brazil that gave him immunity from any prosecution whatsoever.
他声称巴西宪法中有一项条款赋予他免受任何起诉的豁免权。
And that, in fact, he could, as he put it, go and kill the president of the Brazilian state, and he would still be immune from prosecution.
事实上，正如他所说，他可以去杀死巴西总统，而他仍然可以免受起诉。
Of course, Bob, being Bob, had an explanation for how he went from being a South American cattle baron to a New York City super.
当然，鲍勃，作为鲍勃，对他如何从南美养牛大亨成为纽约市的超级大亨有一个解释。
He had had two heart attacks, and his doctor had-- this is an actual story.
他有过两次心脏病发作，他的医生也有——这是一个真实的故事。
His doctor had prescribed that he gain a lot of weight and move to America.
他的医生建议他增加体重并搬到美国。
So probably the first time in medical history that enormous weight gain was prescribed for a heart condition.
因此，这可能是医学史上第一次针对心脏病开出大幅增加体重的处方。
In his own way, Bob united the building.
鲍勃以自己的方式统一了这座建筑。
All of us, the elderly black businessman, the Puerto Rican grandmother, the handsome Bombay immigrant, me, the Southerner in exile, we all had our favorite Bob stories.
我们所有人，年长的黑人商人，波多黎各的祖母，英俊的孟买移民，我，流亡的南方人，我们都有自己最喜欢的鲍勃故事。
We all did our own impersonations of Bob.
我们都模仿了鲍勃。
It was impossible not to try to out-Bob whoever was talking with an even more outlandish Bob story of your own.
无论鲍勃正在谈论你自己的更离奇的故事，你都不可能不试图超越鲍勃。
We collected and traded Bob stories, comparing versions, analyzing his technique.
我们收集并交换鲍勃的故事，比较版本，分析他的技术。
He was remarkably unfazed by any show of skepticism about his stories.
他对任何对他的故事的怀疑表现出惊人的淡定。
There was the story about how he had once hung a bag of acid from the roof of the building to chase away the various homeless men who would, in those days, often come and congregate by the edge-- the corner of this building.
有一个故事，说他曾经在大楼的屋顶上挂了一袋酸，以赶走当时经常聚集在大楼边缘——角落里的各种无家可归的人。
Bob had supposedly hung a bag of acid from the top that would drip down steadily on them.
据说鲍勃在顶部挂了一袋酸，这些酸会稳定地滴在他们身上。
Now I have no idea how you hang a bag of acid-- how you get the acid in the bag and put that up there.
现在我不知道如何悬挂一袋酸——如何将酸放入袋中并将其放在那里。
That's no small feat in itself.
这本身就是一个不小的壮举。
But of course, the best part is Bob is telling us this story at the very same time that you could lean out of the office where he's talking and see the three or four homeless guys sitting on the corner--
但当然，最好的部分是鲍勃在告诉我们这个故事的同时，你可以从他说话的办公室探出身子，看到三四个无家可归的人坐在角落里——
Sitting right there.
就坐在那儿。
Chris --apparently completely unscarred or bothered by dripping acid.
克里斯——显然完全没有留下疤痕，也没有被滴下的酸所困扰。
The other story that I've always found really captured just sort of like all of Bob's essence for me was when-- every kitchen in this building has these funny, circular fluorescent bulbs, very specialized light bulbs.
我一直发现的另一个故事真正捕捉到了鲍勃对我来说的所有本质，那就是——这栋楼里的每个厨房都有这些有趣的圆形荧光灯泡，非常专业的灯泡。
They're also in the hallways out on the first floor.
它们也在一楼的走廊里。
And mine, after 10 years of noble service, finally burnt out.
而我的，在经历了十年的高贵服务之后，终于被烧毁了。
And I looked at it, and I thought, huh.
我看着它，我想，嗯。
Where do you buy one of those?
你在哪里买其中一件？
So I trotted on down to Bob's office one morning, and I said, Bob, the light bulb in my kitchen has burned out.
所以一天早上我小跑到鲍勃的办公室，我说，鲍勃，我厨房的灯泡烧坏了。
And I'm just wondering, do I buy that and replace it?
我只是想知道，我要买它并更换它吗？
And if so, where do you buy them?
如果是这样，你在哪里购买它们？
Or do you all just replace that for me?
还是你们都帮我替换掉它？
And of course, he went into this total Bob tear.
当然，他也陷入了鲍勃的泪水中。
He was like, yes, that's right.
他说，是的，没错。
You, let me tell you something, mister.
你，让我告诉你一件事，先生。
Don't try to steal one of the light bulbs in the hallway.
不要试图偷走廊里的一个灯泡。
I know what you're thinking.
我知道你在想什么。
But I've booby trapped them.
但我给他们设了陷阱。
And if you climb up there and you try to take the light bulb, it will blow up and shoot the glass in your eyes.
如果你爬到那里并试图拿走灯泡，它就会爆炸并将玻璃射入你的眼睛。
And you will be blind for all time.
而你将永远失明。
Yeah.
是的。
Jack Hitt And I said-- I remember saying, so I take that to mean that I have to buy the bulb myself.
杰克·希特 我说——我记得说过，所以我认为这意味着我必须自己购买灯泡。
The very opposite of Bob was Allan, the landlord.
与鲍勃完全相反的是房东艾伦。
If Bob was larger than life, Allan was smack in the middle, the average percentile.
如果说鲍勃比生命更伟大，那么艾伦就处于中间，即平均百分位。
He had a family.
他有一个家庭。
He lived in White Plains.
他住在怀特普莱恩斯。
I had met his wife.
我见过他的妻子。
Doing business with Allan was a completely routine experience.
与艾伦做生意完全是一种例行公事的经历。
If it was a toilet to be fixed, he'd make sure the crew got there on time and got it done.
如果是要修厕所，他会确保工作人员准时到达那里并将其完成。
Even in our biggest blowouts, he was always reasonable, civil even.
即使在我们最激烈的争吵中，他也总是很讲道理，甚至很有礼貌。
One time, things got a little testy when Allan started neglecting the old Puerto Rican folks in the building.
有一次，当艾伦开始忽视大楼里的波多黎各老人时，事情变得有点紧张。
I'd become friendly with one grandmother, who showed me her tub full of green stagnant bathwater.
我和一位祖母变得很友好，她给我看了她装满绿色死水的浴缸。
Allan and I had some tense words, and I and some others even held meetings to start a rent strike.
我和艾伦发生了一些紧张的言语，我和其他一些人甚至召开了会议，开始罢租。
But in the end, Allan gracefully withdrew, and we all went back to normal business.
但最终，艾伦优雅地退出了，我们都恢复了正常的工作。
Back to Bob-- the inscrutable, endless mystery that was Bob.
回到鲍勃——那个高深莫测、无尽的谜团就是鲍勃。
Fast forward to 1989.
快进到 1989 年。
I'd been in my apartment eight years.
我已经在我的公寓里呆了八年了。
I had a steady job, and I was walking to work one morning.
我有一份稳定的工作，一天早上我步行去上班。
Somewhere along the way, I saw The Daily News blaring the latest tabloid crime story.
一路上，我看到《每日新闻》报道了最新的小报犯罪故事。
Headline, "Terror Landlord." I looked closer and realized it was Allan-- my Allan, the landlord, the nice guy whose kids I knew.
标题是“恐怖地主”。我仔细一看，发现那是艾伦——我的艾伦，房东，我认识他的孩子的好人。
The story was incredible.
这个故事令人难以置信。
He had been arrested for murder for hiring hitmen to kill his brother-in-law, Arthur Katz, in 1980.
1980 年，他因雇佣杀手杀害他的妹夫阿瑟·卡茨 (Arthur Katz) 而因谋杀罪被捕。
And as the story got out, it quickly became clear that Bob was the one who had ratted Allan out.
随着故事的传播，人们很快就发现鲍勃就是出卖艾伦的人。
Allan was found guilty and sentenced to 25 years to life in prison, where he remains today.
艾伦被判有罪并被判处 25 年至终身监禁，至今仍被监禁。
More time passed.
更多的时间过去了。
I got a new apartment in the West Village.
我在西村买了一套新公寓。
Then I got married, had children, and later moved to another state, where Allan and Bob became memories, proof that I lived in New York back when crack was king and the murder rates topped 2,000 a year.
然后我结婚了，生了孩子，后来搬到了另一个州，艾伦和鲍勃在那里成了回忆，证明我住在纽约，当时毒品盛行，谋杀率每年高达 2,000 起。
In the late '90s, almost a decade after I'd last seen Bob or Allan, I was working on an investigative piece about money laundering, and a source at the Treasury Department had suggested I call this really smart prosecutor in New York named John Moscow.
上世纪 90 年代末，也就是我上次见到鲍勃或艾伦近十年后，我正在撰写一篇有关洗钱的调查文章，财政部的一位消息人士建议我给纽约这位非常聪明的检察官起名叫约翰·莫斯科。
So I rang him up and started just yakking, the, way you do.
于是我给他打了电话，开始像你一样嚷嚷。
I asked him if he'd handled financial crime a lot, and he was quick to say that he'd worked homicide in New York back in the '80s, during the crime wave, when crack was king and the murder rates topped 2,000 a year.
我问他是否经常处理金融犯罪，他很快说他早在 80 年代就在纽约从事过凶杀案，当时正值犯罪浪潮，当时毒品盛行，谋杀率每年超过 2,000 起。
Yeah, I said.
是的，我说。
I lived there, too.
我也住在那里。
I told him I was actually involved in one of those tabloid stories, mine involving a landlord who had hired contract killers to murder his brother-in-law and then gets ratted out by the super.
我告诉他，我实际上参与了其中一个小报故事，我的故事涉及一位房东，他雇佣了杀手来谋杀他的妹夫，然后被超级老板出卖了。
There was a peculiar pause on the phone.
电话那头有一阵奇怪的停顿。
Then Moscow said, Allan Stern, West 99th Street?
然后莫斯科说，艾伦·斯特恩，西99街？
I'm the guy who put him behind bars.
我就是把他送进监狱的人
Right away, of course, we started talking about Bob.
当然，我们立刻就开始谈论鲍勃。
I told him the light bulb story.
我给他讲了灯泡的故事。
Moscow had a good laugh.
莫斯科笑得很开心。
And then I went on in the way we residents of 99th Street can do.
然后我继续以我们 99 街居民能做的方式继续。
I finally get to the one about Bob claiming that he had a special exemption from the Brazilian constitution and could murder anyone in Brazil.
我终于谈到鲍勃声称他享有巴西宪法的特殊豁免权，并且可以谋杀巴西的任何人。
Again, there was that odd Moscow pause.
莫斯科再次出现了奇怪的停顿。
And then he said, yeah, the thing is, that one's kind of true.
然后他说，是的，事实是，那是真的。
I asked him, when you were in the military, where were you assigned?
我问他，你当兵的时候，被分配到哪里了？
I was in the military police.
我曾在宪兵部队服役。
Here's John Moscow, describing Bob's testimony on the witness stand.
约翰·莫斯科正在描述鲍勃在证人席上的证词。
And what was your job?
你的工作是什么？
My job was to locate, interrogate, and execute politically unreliable persons.
我的工作是寻找、审问和处决政治上不可靠的人。
Get out of here.
离开这里。
John Moscow Bob had been in the Death Squad in Brazil.
约翰·莫斯科·鲍勃曾在巴西的敢死队服役。
And he was asked, did you kill any people while you were there?
有人问他，你在那里的时候杀过人吗？
Yes.
是的。
Was it more than one?
是不止一个吗？
Yes.
是的。
Was it more than five?
超过五个了吗？
I don't know.
我不知道。
What do you mean, you don't know?
你什么意思，你不知道吗？
Well, if you shoot somebody at long range, and they go down, you don't know if they're dead or wounded.
好吧，如果你远距离射击某人，而他们倒下了，你不知道他们是死是伤。
There comes a point when you realize that beneath all of the fanciful stories, there usually is a substantial amount of truth.
到了某个时刻，你就会意识到，在所有奇幻的故事背后，通常都有大量的真相。
He said he came north for his health and perhaps to protect his heart.
他说他来到北方是为了健康，或许也是为了保护自己的心脏。
But he was thinking about high impact lead poisoning.
但他正在考虑高影响铅中毒。
Apparently, a number of-- now he was in his 20s when he was in the Death Squad.
显然，有很多——现在他20多岁了，当时他还在敢死队里。
And he realized at one point that a substantial number of people in his squad were dead of violent causes, which would be consistent either with their being suicidal in the risks they took or with somebody having a list of the names and where they were located, someone whose relatives had been mishandled.
他一度意识到，他的小队中有相当多的人死于暴力，这要么与他们在冒险中自杀的行为相符，要么与某人掌握了名单和他们的位置、其亲属受到不当处理有关。
So he decided that leaving was good for his health.
因此他认为离开对他的健康有益。
All those crazy Bob stories we swapped for years, who'd have thought that the truth about Bob would be just as crazy?
多年来我们交换了所有那些疯狂的鲍勃故事，谁会想到鲍勃的真相也会同样疯狂？
According to Moscow, not only had Bob been in the Death Squad, but he had been a key figure in the murder of Allan's brother-in-law.
据莫斯科称，鲍勃不仅是敢死队成员，而且还是谋杀艾伦姐夫的关键人物。
Bob was crucial in securing the talents of the two hitmen named Sammy Feet and Crazy Joe.
鲍勃对于确保两位杀手萨米·菲特和疯狂乔的才华发挥了至关重要的作用。
And according to the court documents, Bob was in the boiler room with some of his crew when news of the hit came down.
根据法庭文件，当袭击的消息传来时，鲍勃和他的一些船员正在锅炉房里。
They celebrated with Martini and Rossi.
他们与马蒂尼和罗西一起庆祝。
And things really got going when a portable radio just happened to belt out that Queen song.
当便携式收音机恰好播放出皇后乐队的歌曲时，事情就真正开始了。
You know the one.
你知道那个。
[MUSIC - "ANOTHER ONE BITES THE DUST" BY QUEEN]
[音乐 - 女王的“另一个咬住尘埃”]
The hit was just one of numerous crimes-- brilliant crimes, really-- that Bob and Allan pulled off from that little office.
这次袭击只是鲍勃和艾伦在那个小办公室里犯下的众多罪行之一——确实是出色的罪行。
It turns out that when it comes to crime, Bob was incredibly competent.
事实证明，在犯罪方面，鲍勃的能力令人难以置信。
He and Allan set up dummy construction companies.
他和艾伦成立了虚拟建筑公司。
They defrauded the state with counterfeit charges.
他们以伪造罪名欺骗国家。
To force out one tenant, they rewired the electrical outlets to high voltage lines to fry all the apartment appliances.
为了赶走一名房客，他们将电源插座重新连接到高压线上，以烧毁所有公寓电器。
My favorite was their natural gas scam.
我最喜欢的是他们的天然气骗局。
They put fake cones out on the street and actually jack hammered through the asphalt to a working gas line.
他们把假锥体放在街上，然后用千斤顶锤击穿沥青，连接到工作的天然气管道。
They bypassed the meters and in time, eliminated more than $800,000 of Allan's gas bills.
他们绕过了仪表，及时为艾伦节省了超过 80 万美元的煤气费。
On top of all this, Bob helped the prosecution snare Allan.
除此之外，鲍勃还帮助检方逮捕了艾伦。
Bob tapped Allen's phones.
鲍勃窃听了艾伦的电话。
Bob wore a wire.
鲍勃戴着一根电线。
And in court transcripts, Allan calmly weighs the relative merits of buying off some people versus having them killed.
在法庭笔录中，艾伦冷静地权衡了收买某些人与杀死他们的相对优点。
And this is what really comes across when you talk to Moscow-- just how wrong all of us were at sizing up Bob and Allan.
这就是当你与莫斯科交谈时真正遇到的情况——我们所有人对鲍勃和艾伦的评价是多么错误。
We had 2,200 homicides in New York, as opposed to fewer than 500, which is what we're on for this year.
纽约发生了 2,200 起凶杀案，而今年我们预计发生的凶杀案还不到 500 起。
You had a lot of people talking about killing people.
很多人都在谈论杀人。
There was a certain rationality and cold-bloodedness about this murder that was just plain different.
这起谋杀案有一定的合理性和冷血性，但完全不同。
And I just-- Bob testified under oath at trial.
我刚刚——鲍勃在审判中宣誓作证。
I watched him when he was being cross-examined.
当他接受盘问时，我看着他。
And I don't think I'll ever forget.
我想我永远不会忘记。
Defense counsel asked him, did you torture men or women?
辩护律师问他，你折磨过男人还是女人？
And he said, my specialty was men.
他说，我的专长是男人。
And the way he said it, my blood felt about 10 degrees colder.
他这么一说，我的血液就凉了十度左右。
And there was just absolute-- the courtroom-- everyone was persuaded that he meant it.
法庭上，每个人都相信他是认真的。
So how did Bob, former Brazilian Death Squad officer, rat out Allan?
那么前巴西敢死队军官鲍勃是如何出卖艾伦的呢？
Bob, I think, called tips to report the murder.
我想，鲍勃打电话举报了这起谋杀案。
You mean like the 1-800 number or one of the local crime reporting--
你的意思是 1-800 号码或当地犯罪报告之一 -
[INAUDIBLE] tips or whatever, yeah.
[听不清] 提示或其他什么，是的。
So he calls that.
所以他这么称呼。
And then he goes and makes an appointment and meets with the Major Case Squad.
然后他去预约并与大案组会面。
Allan and his family had discussed selling the building and moving to Florida.
艾伦和他的家人曾讨论过出售该建筑并搬到佛罗里达州。
And in the course of that, Allan had discussed having the president and the vice president of the Tenants Association murdered.
而在这个过程中，艾伦还商议过谋杀租客协会的会长和副会长的事情。
And Bob figured that Allan was going to have these two guys whacked and blame Bob.
鲍勃认为艾伦会痛打这两个人并责怪鲍勃。
What year was this?
这是哪一年的事？
John Moscow This was 1988.
约翰·莫斯科 这是 1988 年。
Now I only bring that up because there was a-- at one point, there was a rent strike that was going to be put together in my building.
现在我提出这一点只是因为有一次，我的大楼将举行租金罢工。
And I was the tenant leader of that.
我是那个租户的领导者。
I mean, was that the rent problem that Allan was upset about?
我的意思是，艾伦感到不安的是房租问题吗？
Wow.
哇。
So Allan might have actually tried to get me whacked.
所以艾伦可能真的想狠狠地打我。
Ultimately, Bob went into the police station and admitted his own role in a murder and thought he was going to prison because his perception at the time was that Allan would cause these murders to take place.
最终，鲍勃走进警察局，承认了自己在谋杀案中所扮演的角色，并认为自己要进监狱，因为他当时的看法是艾伦会导致这些谋杀案的发生。
And so he protected himself by ratting Allan out first.
因此，他首先出卖了艾伦，以此来保护自己。
So Bob turning state's evidence basically saved my life, or the life of the tenant organizers.
所以鲍勃转向国家证据基本上挽救了我的生命，或者租户组织者的生命。
That was Bob's thought.
这是鲍勃的想法。
Jack Hitt I found Bob.
杰克·希特 我找到了鲍勃。
I reached him on the phone, and we had a nice chat.
我通过电话联系到了他，我们聊得很愉快。
He remembers me as the tall blond guy on the first floor.
他记得我是一楼的那个高个子金发男人。
He wanted to talk to me for this story, but his lawyer told him, not today or ever.
他想和我谈谈这个故事，但他的律师告诉他，不是今天，也不是永远。
And then Bob suggested that I not bother to call back.
然后鲍勃建议我不要再回电话了。
I wanted to ask him about the cattle ranches and being written into the constitution and give those stories a fresh listen, knowing what I know now.
我想向他询问有关养牛场以及被写入宪法的情况，并以我现在所知道的方式重新聆听这些故事。
And of course, I wanted to know whether I was the one who was going to get whacked.
当然，我想知道我是否是那个会被殴打的人。
I wasn't the only tenant organizer in the building at the time, but I'll never get that answer now.
当时我不是大楼里唯一的租户组织者，但我现在永远不会得到这个答案。
All I have is another Bob story, full of details I can't confirm, but so delicious that I can't wait to go back to my old pals and tell it to them.
我所拥有的只是另一个鲍勃的故事，充满了我无法确认的细节，但如此精彩，我迫不及待地想回到我的老朋友身边，告诉他们。
So this is one of the lawyers talking to Bob during the trial.
这是审判期间与鲍勃交谈的律师之一。
When you began your testimony on direct yesterday, you told us about your military experience in Brazil.
当你昨天在直播中开始作证时，你向我们讲述了你在巴西的军事经历。
I would like to--
我想——
Chris and Anne live in Queens now.
克里斯和安妮现在住在皇后区。
I read to them the court transcripts that John Moscow had told me about.
我给他们读了约翰·莫斯科告诉我的法庭笔录。
More than one.
不止一个。
Was it more than 10?
超过10个了吗？
More than 10.
超过10个。
All right, let's go on.
好吧，我们继续吧。
Did you torture both men and women?
你折磨过男人和女人吗？
My specialty was men.
我的专长是男人。
Holy [BLEEP].
天哪[哔]。
Anne Was he making this up or--
安妮 这是他编造的还是——
No, OK.
不，好吧。
No, I-- Jack Hitt This is the testimony that-- this is-- I mean, it's under oath.
不，我 - 杰克·希特 这是证词 - 这是 - 我的意思是，这是宣誓的。
Wow.
哇。
Chris You've taken it to a whole new level, sir.
克里斯：先生，您已经把它提升到了一个全新的水平。
Holy [BLEEP].
天哪[哔]。
That is scary.
那太可怕了。
Chris Whoa.
克里斯哇。
But it does make you sort of go back and rethink the whole pattern of exchanges you had with him.
但这确实让你回过头来重新思考你与他的整个交流模式。
I never come in-- like, I never said to myself, there's some reality to who this guy says he is.
我从来没有进来过——就像，我从来没有对自己说过，这个人所说的他是谁，有一定的现实性。
I mean, I used to get furious at him.
我的意思是，我曾经对他很生气。
But to think, oh, I was talking to a murdering torturer--
但想一想，哦，我正在和一个杀人的酷刑者说话——
Yeah, but now it's a different level of toying.
是的，但现在这是一种不同程度的玩弄。
Instead of just being some [BLEEP] it's like he's a professional.
他不仅仅是一个[BLEEP]，而是一个专业人士。
I feel like-- I'm sitting here amazed now that we weren't killed and tortured.
我感觉——我坐在这里很惊讶我们没有被杀害和折磨。
We were only psychologically tortured, but he-- I mean, this could have been a very horrible story.
我们只是在心理上受到折磨，但他——我的意思是，这可能是一个非常可怕的故事。
You know what?
你知道吗？
Our current super is looking much better.
我们现在的超级看起来好多了。
Again, here's Kevin.
再说一次，这是凯文。
Kevin I mean, it's like, talk about the banality of evil.
凯文，我的意思是，这就像谈论邪恶的平庸。
He strikes me as one of these Eichmann type characters, who would, in certain contexts, do completely awful, disgusting things.
他给我的印象是艾希曼类型的人物之一，在某些情况下，他会做出完全可怕、恶心的事情。
And then if removed from them and put in some more m banal surrounding, would settle back and just be a windy superintendent of a building.
然后，如果离开它们并放入一些更平庸的环境中，就会坐下来，只是建筑物的风控管理员。
It was kind of interesting, though.
不过，这有点有趣。
After this was all over, after he had testified and Allan was put away, of course, Allan's daughters, I believe, then owned the buildings.
在这一切结束之后，在他作证并且艾伦被带走之后，当然，我相信艾伦的女儿们就拥有了这些建筑物。
So of course, Bob lost his free apartment and his super's position.
所以，鲍勃当然失去了他的免费公寓和他的超级职位。
And it was almost like he kind of deflated.
他几乎感觉有点泄气了。
Nobody had to talk to him anymore, so he would walk around-- it was almost pathetic.
没有人再和他说话了，所以他就四处走动——这几乎是可悲的。
He'd walk up and down the block and say hi.
他会在街区来回走动并打招呼。
And people would just kind of go by-- nod to him and go by.
人们只是从旁边经过——向他点头示意然后就过去了。
And then after a short time after this, he just wasn't around anymore.
然后不久之后，他就不再出现了。
He was gone.
他走了。
And I have no idea where he went to.
而且我不知道他去了哪里。
Where is he anyway?
他到底在哪儿？
Did you find out anyway?
无论如何，你发现了吗？
He's an elevator inspector in New York City.
他是纽约市的一名电梯检查员。
I found Allan also at his website, allanstern.net.
我也在艾伦的网站 allanstern.net 上找到了他。
He's been appealing his conviction for over 15 years.
15 年来，他一直在对判决提出上诉。
He makes the case that he's innocent.
他证明自己是无辜的。
His argument is that the entire story of Sammy Feet and Crazy Joe and the explanation of the brother-in-law's murder and all the rest of it is hearsay, a grandiose fiction.
他的论点是，萨米脚和疯狂乔的整个故事以及对姐夫被谋杀的解释以及所有其他内容都是道听途说，是宏大的虚构。
In other words, Allan is saying, he can top us all.
换句话说，艾伦是说，他可以超越我们所有人。
That he's the victim of the most outlandish Bob story ever told.
他是有史以来最离奇的鲍勃故事的受害者。
Jack Hitt.
杰克·希特.
He now lives in New Haven in a house, where he is his own super.
他现在住在纽黑文的一所房子里，在那里他是自己的超级主人。
He's also the co-host of the Peabody Award-winning podcast Uncivil.
他还是皮博迪奖获奖播客 Uncivil 的联合主持人。
If you haven't heard it, seriously, give it a try.
如果你还没有听说过，说真的，请尝试一下。
He's currently developing a new podcast.
他目前正在开发一个新的播客。
It's been many years since we first reported this story.
距离我们第一次报道这个故事已经过去很多年了。
In 2014, Allan Stern was released from prison.
2014年，艾伦·斯特恩出狱。
Bob, as far as we can tell, is no longer an elevator inspector for the city of New York.
据我们所知，鲍勃不再是纽约市的电梯检查员。
John Moscow is now practicing criminal law in Manhattan.
约翰·莫斯科现在在曼哈顿从事刑法工作。
Coming up, a super gets a crush.
即将到来，一个超级迷恋。
That's in a minute from Chicago Public Radio, when our program continues.
芝加哥公共广播电台一分钟后我们的节目仍在继续。
It's This American Life.
这就是美国生活。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Each week on our program, we choose a theme and bring you a variety of different kinds of stories on that theme.
在我们的节目中，我们每周都会选择一个主题，并为您带来有关该主题的各种不同类型的故事。
Today's show, The Super.
今天的节目是《超级》。
We've arrived at act two of our show.
我们已经到了演出的第二幕了。
Act Two, Super Duper.
第二幕，超级骗子。
We now move from a story about an East Coast super to a story about a West Coast super, from Alex Blumberg.
现在，我们从一个关于东海岸超级英雄的故事转向亚历克斯·布隆伯格 (Alex Blumberg) 讲述的一个关于西海岸超级英雄的故事。
Josh lives in a Spanish courtyard building in Los Angeles, a city in which even apartment buildings act like they're on TV.
乔什住在洛杉矶的一座西班牙庭院建筑里，在这座城市，连公寓楼都像电视里一样。
It's a little bit like Melrose Place, a lot of communal activity.
这里有点像梅尔罗斯广场，有很多公共活动。
And sort of presiding above it is the super.
在它上面主持的是超级。
He's not really a super like you would have in maybe a larger building or a larger city.
他并不是真正的超级英雄，就像你在更大的建筑或更大的城市中所拥有的那样。
He's--
他是——
A larger city than LA?
比洛杉矶更大的城市？
Josh Bearman All right.
乔什·贝尔曼 好吧。
I guess more like a dense urban city, is what I meant to say.
我想这更像是一个密集的城市，这就是我的意思。
But so he doesn't have, like, a tool belt and show up and fix things.
但他没有工具带，也没有出现并修复问题。
But he'll sort of call the guy who does that.
但他会打电话给这样做的人。
And he takes the rent.
他收取租金。
And he is kind of a solitary guy, for the most part.
在大多数情况下，他是一个孤独的人。
He sort of likes to spend a lot of time reading and stuff.
他有点喜欢花很多时间读书之类的。
So he just kind of like hangs out up there in the building.
所以他就像在大楼里闲逛一样。
Josh and the rest of the tenants in the building like their super, whom we'll call Dave, and hung out with him.
乔什和大楼里的其他租户喜欢他们的超级，我们称之为戴夫，并和他一起出去玩。
At the time of the story, Dave was going through chemotherapy for leukemia.
故事发生时，戴夫正在接受白血病化疗。
And occasionally, he'd call different residents to ask for help with things.
偶尔，他也会打电话给不同的居民寻求帮助。
One Christmas, he contacted Josh.
一年圣诞节，他联系了乔什。
He calls and he says, this really weird thing happened.
他打电话说，发生了一件非常奇怪的事情。
And I came over to his apartment.
我来到了他的公寓。
He had this orchid that was sitting on the table next to him.
他旁边的桌子上放着这朵兰花。
And he said, well, I had this visitor.
他说，好吧，我有这位访客。
And it was a very strange visit.
这是一次非常奇怪的访问。
And he started to tell me that a couple of months ago, in between chemotherapy treatments-- he'd had two chemotherapy treatments.
他开始告诉我，几个月前，在化疗期间，他接受了两次化疗。
And so he was out somewhere, and he was in his Land Cruiser, I think he has.
所以他在外面的某个地方，而且他开着他的陆地巡洋舰，我想他有。
And he was at this gas station, and he sees this woman pulls up in a big black Escalade.
他在这个加油站，看到这个女人开着一辆黑色的凯雷德停了下来。
And she's on the opposite side of the pumps as him.
她和他在水泵的对面。
She was an older woman, but he said very elegant and attractive in the elegant older woman way.
她是个年长的女人，但他以优雅的年长女人的方式说得很优雅，很有魅力。
And she had fancy clothes and, like, furs.
她穿着漂亮的衣服，比如皮草。
And I think he mentioned that she had espadrilles on.
我想他提到她穿着麻底鞋。
And she was in this black Escalade, so she seemed to be classy or something, or well off.
而她开的是这辆黑色凯雷德，所以她看起来很优雅什么的，或者很富有。
And so they're standing there at the pumps, and they start chatting.
于是他们就站在水泵旁，开始聊天。
She initiates conversation with him, and they're getting on very well.
她主动与他交谈，他们相处得很好。
And then he told me that she said something about him being bald, which was from the chemotherapy.
然后他告诉我，她说他因为化疗而秃头。
And she said, are you bald from the chemotherapy?
她说，你化疗秃头了吗？
Or are you just bald because you think it's sexy?
或者你只是因为觉得秃头很性感？
Something like that.
类似的事情。
And he was not offended by that.
他并没有因此被冒犯。
He thought it was kind of like this romantic repartee or something.
他觉得这有点像浪漫的妙语连珠之类的。
And then she gives him a card.
然后她给了他一张卡片。
And the card was sort of like an old style carte de visite that just had her name.
这张卡片有点像老式的拜访卡片，上面只有她的名字。
It wasn't a business card that had a company or information on it.
这不是一张有公司或信息的名片。
It was just sort of like a calling card that you used to leave at the door of Count Vronsky's estate when you would stop by or something.
它有点像一张名片，当你路过渥伦斯基伯爵的庄园门口或其他什么地方时，你会把它留在门口。
And so he remembered thinking that that was kind of a classy touch.
所以他记得当时认为这是一种优雅的感觉。
And very mysterious.
而且非常神秘。
Josh Bearman Very mysterious.
乔什·贝尔曼 非常神秘。
And so then he gave her his information.
然后他就把自己的信息给了她。
And they parted ways.
他们分道扬镳。
Until Christmas, two months after their first meeting at the gas station, when the mysterious lady called out of the blue.
直到圣诞节，他们在加油站第一次见面两个月后，那位神秘女士突然打来电话。
She'd asked how Dave was, and he told her about his recent health problems.
她问戴夫怎么样，他告诉她他最近的健康问题。
An infection from the chemotherapy had turned serious, and he'd spent a couple of weeks in a hospital in a near coma.
化疗引起的感染变得很严重，他在医院里呆了几周，几乎处于昏迷状态。
That's terrible, the lady said.
太可怕了，那位女士说。
Is there anything I can do?
有什么我可以做的吗？
Can I come by and visit?
我可以过来参观吗？
Dave said yes, and so she'd arrived that morning dressed in the same elegant manner as at the gas station, bearing the orchid which Dave now had on his table.
戴夫答应了，于是那天早上她就到了，穿着和在加油站一样优雅的打扮，手里拿着戴夫桌上现在摆着的兰花。
And they'd sat and chatted.
他们坐下来聊天。
Somehow, the topic of fate came up.
不知怎的，命运的话题就出现了。
And that was the point when she said, I know this is kind of a weird time, but I actually have something I wanted to share with you.
就在那时，她说，我知道这是一个奇怪的时刻，但我实际上有一些东西想与你分享。
And he says, what's that?
他说，那是什么？
And she says that she was abroad with this group of investors who had developed this really interesting investment opportunity.
她说她和这群投资者一起在国外开发了这个非常有趣的投资机会。
And she says, I know that this is a weird time.
她说，我知道这是一个奇怪的时刻。
But this is very exciting, so I feel like I should just let you in on this investment opportunity right now.
但这非常令人兴奋，所以我觉得我应该现在就让您参与这个投资机会。
He was a little surprised.
他有些惊讶。
And but he said, oh, all right.
但他说，哦，好吧。
So what's the investment opportunity?
那么投资机会在哪里呢？
And she said, well, I've gotten involved with this very canny group of investors.
她说，好吧，我已经加入了这群非常精明的投资者。
And it seems that they have located this snowman that can bench press 400 pounds.
而且他们似乎已经找到了这个可以卧推400磅的雪人了。
What?
什么？
Josh Bearman Yeah, so-- I said-- so then I'm asking, OK-- well, what do you mean?
乔什·贝尔曼（Josh Bearman）是的，所以——我说——然后我问，好吧——好吧，你是什么意思？
What kind of a snowman?
什么样的雪人？
It's hard to exactly figure out what the proper follow-up question is.
很难准确地弄清楚正确的后续问题是什么。
Yeah.
是的。
And so I said, well, OK, so, like, it's the Abominable Snowman.
所以我说，好吧，所以，就像，这是可恶的雪人。
He's like, no, no, no. She said it's a totally normal snowman with a carrot nose and the coal for the eyes and a top hat and everything.
他就像，不，不，不。她说这是一个完全正常的雪人，有一个胡萝卜鼻子，眼睛是煤炭，还有一顶礼帽等等。
It's just that this snowman can bench press 400 pounds.
只不过这个雪人可以卧推400磅。
And so then-- but so I'm saying, well, OK, but what-- what's the investment opportunity?
那么——但是我想说，好吧，但是——投资机会是什么？
Is he running a hedge fund or what?
他经营一家对冲基金还是什么？
I mean, I don't understand.
我的意思是，我不明白。
And then he said, no. See, what happened is the investors, they've got it all worked out.
然后他说，不。看，发生的事情是投资者，他们已经把一切都解决了。
They're going to put together a variety show with the snowman as the lead act.
他们准备办一档以雪人为主角的综艺节目。
And then they're going to take the snowman show on tour.
然后他们将进行巡回雪人表演。
And so the investment opportunity is the geographic territorial rights to the show.
因此，投资机会就是演出的地理领土权利。
So when the show goes to different states, you get to reap the rewards if you've bought into the rights to the show.
因此，当节目在不同的州上映时，如果您购买了该节目的版权，您就可以获得回报。
So the woman said that she had already-- she got in on the ground floor with this thing.
所以那个女人说她已经——她带着这个东西进了一楼。
And so she got California and Nevada, like the west.
所以她得到了加利福尼亚州和内华达州，就像西部一样。
So he said that the United States was all snapped up.
所以他说美国都被抢购了。
So but now Indonesia is wide open.
所以现在印度尼西亚完全开放了。
For the variety show starring the weightlifting snowman?
为举重雪人主演的综艺节目？
The weightlifting snowman.
举重雪人。
Yeah, so the price for Indonesia's territorial rights to the show, to the snowman show, were not cheap.
是的，所以印度尼西亚获得雪人表演的领土权的价格并不便宜。
It was like $30,000 or something.
好像是 30,000 美元什么的。
OK.
好的。
So what I don't understand, though, is if you actually discovered a snowman that had somehow become animated, it seems like the last sort of thing that you would do is then design a variety show for it.
所以我不明白的是，如果你真的发现了一个以某种方式变得动画的雪人，那么你要做的最后一件事似乎就是为它设计一个综艺节目。
I know.
我知道。
Well, right.
嗯，对。
That is what I was asking him.
这就是我问他的。
I said, well, listen.
我说，好吧，听着。
Wait, hold on a second.
等一下，等一下。
Isn't there going to be-- there's going to be a lot more important things happening than publicity for your variety show.
是不是会有——比你的综艺宣传更重要的事情发生了。
Because the whole world is going to change.
因为整个世界都会改变。
Science will have to readjust everything it's ever known.
科学将不得不重新调整它所知道的一切。
All the various theologians of the world are going to have to deal with the news, like animated snowman world.
世界上所有不同的神学家都将不得不处理新闻，就像动画雪人世界一样。
Right.
正确的。
Josh Bearman They would have to really sort a lot of things out, just even the basic question of, well, how-- did the snowman roll himself up into three balls and find a carrot nose?
乔什·贝尔曼（Josh Bearman）：他们必须真正解决很多问题，甚至是基本问题，即雪人如何将自己卷成三个球并找到胡萝卜鼻子？
And like, how did the investors find the snowman?
比如，投资者是如何找到雪人的？
That's the other thing that I was curious about.
这是我很好奇的另一件事。
Were they driving around the woods and they just saw this snowman lifting logs, and they high-fived each other and said, all right, we've got a variety show?
他们是不是在树林里开车时，看到这个雪人举起木头，然后互相击掌说，好吧，我们有综艺节目？
Like they're in a caravan of black suburbans with their cigars, like, we did it.
就像他们在黑人郊区的大篷车里带着雪茄一样，我们做到了。
The weird thing was even though Dave found the story of a weightlifting snowman just as preposterous as Josh did, he seem somehow persuaded by this mysterious woman.
奇怪的是，尽管戴夫和乔什一样认为举重雪人的故事荒谬，但他似乎被这个神秘的女人说服了。
He said it was hard to explain, but he felt like he'd known her his entire life.
他说这很难解释，但他感觉自己已经认识她一辈子了。
And he looked at life differently now, anyway.
无论如何，他现在对生活的看法也不同了。
He said something about how after-- when you get cancer or something like that, a serious illness, you just start to re-evaluate things.
他说过，当你得了癌症或类似的严重疾病后，你就会开始重新评估事情。
What might have seemed risky beforehand isn't now.
以前看似危险的事情现在却不然了。
And so he said, I kind of just felt like maybe there was a reason to take a risk.
所以他说，我只是觉得也许有理由冒险。
Maybe there's a reason I met the woman at the Shell station, and maybe this is kind of a risk to take.
也许我在壳牌加油站遇见那个女人是有原因的，也许这是一种值得冒的风险。
And then that's basically when he said, so I wrote her a check for $30,000.
然后他基本上就是这么说的，所以我给她写了一张 30,000 美元的支票。
I was alarmed.
我很震惊。
And I was worried that it was a con, and obviously.
我担心这是一个骗局，而且很明显。
Right.
正确的。
Josh Bearman But I kind of actually was a little bit convinced by his whole theory.
乔什·贝尔曼（Josh Bearman） 但我实际上有点相信他的整个理论。
I was thinking like maybe it's not so bad.
我在想也许事情没那么糟糕。
Right.
正确的。
Thinking it's sort of his money and--
认为这是他的钱并且——
Right.
对。
If that's how he is going to sort of embrace life after cancer, then who am I to say?
如果这就是他在癌症后拥抱生活的方式，那么我该说谁呢？
Right.
正确的。
Josh Bearman So I kind of felt like I had to accept that.
乔什·贝尔曼（Josh Bearman）所以我觉得我必须接受这一点。
Over the next year, Josh told the weightlifting snowman story to everybody he could.
在接下来的一年里，乔什向尽可能多的人讲述了举重雪人的故事。
He loved it.
他喜欢它。
And his audiences seemed to love it, too.
他的观众似乎也喜欢它。
At one point, he decided, with Dave's consent, to write it up for a magazine humor section.
有一次，在戴夫的同意下，他决定将其写在杂志幽默版块上。
The final step in publishing it was to have it fact-checked.
发布的最后一步是对其进行事实核查。
And so the magazine called Dave.
所以这本杂志就叫戴夫。
He called me and said, so the magazine's fact-checkers called.
他打电话给我说，于是杂志的事实核查人员就打来了电话。
And I told them what I'm about to tell you, which is that I actually made that whole story up.
我告诉了他们我要告诉你们的事情，那就是整个故事实际上是我编造的。
And there was no lady with the carte de visite or espadrilles or furs or the snowman.
没有一位女士拿着拜访卡、草编鞋、皮草或雪人。
Did you ask him why?
你问他为什么吗？
Josh Bearman He just thought that it would be a story that would amuse me, and he was absolutely correct.
乔什·贝尔曼（Josh Bearman）他只是认为这会是一个让我觉得有趣的故事，他是完全正确的。
I guess he had no idea how successfully that story was going to appeal to me.
我猜他不知道这个故事会多么成功地吸引我。
And so, I mean, I kind of bought it.
所以，我的意思是，我有点买了它。
I mean, the idea of you lived to be in your middle ages, and you kind of never took any risks, and then things get totally-- the perspective refocuses in such a way that a weightlifting snowman makes as much sense as anything else.
我的意思是，你活到了中年，你从不冒任何风险，然后事情就变得完全了——视角重新聚焦，举重雪人和其他任何东西一样有意义。
I kind of like it.
我有点喜欢它。
You kind of like it that he created a world in which it made sense to spend $30,000 on a weightlifting snowman?
你有点喜欢他创造的世界，在这个世界里，花 3 万美元买一个举重雪人是有意义的？
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Alex Blumberg Huh.
亚历克斯·布隆伯格 嗯。
In a weird sense, you were the con.
从某种奇怪的意义上说，你就是骗子。
Yeah, I mean, it was like a double reverse reveal at the end of some movie, where I would have been writing some check for like a million dollars at the end, right?
是的，我的意思是，这就像某部电影结尾处的双重反转揭示，我会在结尾处写一些大约一百万美元的支票，对吧？
Because somehow I got sucked into the whole thing.
因为不知怎的，我被卷入了整件事。
But you did get sucked into it.
但你确实被卷入其中了。
You wanted it so bad.
你太想要它了。
I think part of what I love about it-- and maybe you do, too-- is just sort of the image of the snowman, like this stick-armed, carrot-nosed snowman actually just lying on a weight bench in the middle of the Siberian wood.
我想我喜欢它的部分原因——也许你也喜欢——就是雪人的形象，就像这个长着棍子手臂、胡萝卜鼻子的雪人实际上只是躺在西伯利亚树林中间的举重凳上。
Well, also bench pressing in particular is like, you require a bench.
嗯，尤其是卧推，你需要一张长凳。
So I still don't understand.
所以我还是不明白。
Let's say they found the snowman in the woods, then did he have his own bench?
假设他们在树林里找到了雪人，那么他有自己的长凳吗？
Was it made out of snow?
它是用雪做的吗？
He wasn't doing squats.
他没有做深蹲。
Alex Blumberg talking with Josh Bearman.
亚历克斯·布隆伯格与乔什·贝尔曼交谈。
These days, Alex runs the podcasting company Gimlet Media, the home of Reply All and Heavyweight and The Nod and many other shows.
如今，亚历克斯经营着播客公司 Gimlet Media，该公司是 Reply All、Heavyweight、The Nod 和许多其他节目的所在地。
Josh has been a regular contributor to our show.
乔什一直是我们节目的定期撰稿人。
And these days, he's a producer in the new Apple TV series Little America, which comes out next month.
如今，他是新 Apple TV 系列《小美国》的制片人，该剧将于下个月上映。
Ken Hunter was the super who made up that story about the snowman and who had a real talent for telling outrageous and ridiculous stories.
肯·亨特（Ken Hunter）是编造雪人故事的超级英雄，他在讲述令人震惊和荒谬的故事方面具有真正的天赋。
There's no easy way to say this.
没有简单的方法可以这么说。
He died a few years ago.
他几年前去世了。
Act Three, Please Re-Lease Me.
第三幕，请重新租用我。
That's re-lease me.
那就是重新租给我。
We changed the names of the people in this story to protect the tenants involved.
我们更改了这个故事中人物的名字，以保护相关租户。
Sometimes somebody tells you your future, and you do not want to believe it.
有时有人告诉你你的未来，而你却不愿意相信。
You can't believe it.
你简直不敢相信。
When Dennis was 21, he became the super of this apartment building that his dad owned, a big 100-unit building in what was once a rough neighborhood.
丹尼斯 21 岁时，成为了他父亲拥有的这座公寓楼的管理员，这是一栋拥有 100 个单元的大型建筑，位于曾经的一个破旧街区。
And his dad gave him this warning, father to son, super to super, about the tenants.
他的父亲向他发出了关于房客的警告，父亲对儿子，超级对超级。
They will make a good person bad.
他们会让一个好人变坏。
Maybe you go into the landlording and business and you have good intentions and you're a good person.
也许你从事房东和生意，你有良好的意图，而且你是一个好人。
But people-- the lies they tell you, the tricks they play on you, the damage they do to your property, you will eventually lose that innocence and become a meaner person.
但是人们——他们对你说的谎言，他们对你玩的诡计，他们对你财产的破坏，最终会让你失去纯真，变成一个更卑鄙的人。
I was like, wow.
我当时想，哇。
That kind of sucks.
那种很糟糕。
I hope that never happens to me.
我希望这种事永远不会发生在我身上。
Dennis always figured he'd be a different kind of super than his dad anyway.
丹尼斯一直认为他会成为与他父亲不同的超级人物。
His dad had been a plumber.
他的父亲曾是一名水管工。
Nothing made him happier than fixing the plumbing and the washing machines in the building.
没有什么比修理大楼里的管道和洗衣机更让他高兴的了。
And his dad had some old world ways of doing things.
他的父亲有一些旧世界的做事方式。
If somebody was causing trouble, selling drugs or making a ruckus, he'd pound on doors and get in their face if he had to.
如果有人制造麻烦、贩卖毒品或制造骚乱，必要时他会敲门并当着他们的面。
The neighborhood was slowly improving, but when he first bought the building, people didn't care what the lease said or didn't say, and he had to deal with a lot of things man to man.
街区正在慢慢改善，但当他刚买下这栋楼时，人们并不在乎租约上说了什么或没说什么，很多事情他都得亲自处理。
Dennis, meanwhile, was just out of college.
与此同时，丹尼斯刚刚大学毕业。
His dad had scrimped and sacrificed to put him through Catholic schools, all the way from elementary up through his undergraduate degree.
他的父亲省吃俭用，做出了牺牲，让他在天主教学校就读，从小学到本科。
His mom-- his parents were split up-- his mom had always been a devout Catholic, communion every day.
他的妈妈——他的父母已经分居了——他的妈妈一直是一个虔诚的天主教徒，每天都参加圣餐。
And all that stuff that the Jesuits taught Dennis in school about being a good person, he took it to heart.
耶稣会士在学校里教给丹尼斯的所有关于做一个好人的事情，他都牢记在心。
One of the things that go into the Jesuit University is just like, they want you to be men and women for others.
进入耶稣会大学的事情之一就是，他们希望你成为别人的男人和女人。
Not that everything I did, I tried to live up to that high standard, because I know I couldn't.
并不是说我所做的每一件事都试图达到那个高标准，因为我知道我做不到。
But that was definitely in the back of my head.
但这肯定是在我的脑海里。
Which brings us to our story.
这就引出了我们的故事。
At first, the super job went great.
起初，这项超级工作进展顺利。
People liked Dennis.
人们喜欢丹尼斯。
He got Christmas cards from families in the building.
他从大楼里的家庭那里收到了圣诞贺卡。
But there was this one couple.
但有这样一对夫妇。
They had lived in the building for almost 20 years, since back when his dad first bought the place.
自从他父亲第一次买下这个地方以来，他们已经在这栋楼里住了近 20 年了。
They were long-term tenants.
他们是长期租户。
They were good tenants.
他们是好房客。
They were nice people.
他们都是好人。
In the beginning, it wasn't too much bad you could say about them.
一开始，你可以说它们并不算太糟糕。
And your dad liked them.
你爸爸喜欢它们。
Dennis Yeah, my dad liked them, yeah.
丹尼斯 是的，我爸爸喜欢它们，是的。
He lived below them, actually, so he liked them.
事实上，他住在它们下面，所以他喜欢它们。
Literally lived right below them.
实际上就住在他们下面。
My freshman year of high school, I lived with my father, so I lived below them, too, for a year.
我高中一年级时，我和父亲住在一起，所以我也在他们下面住了一年。
And so I saw them, and they knew who I was.
所以我看到了他们，他们知道我是谁。
I mean, even before that, even before high school, when we were little kids, we'd be running around, playing in the courtyard, hanging from the trees.
我的意思是，甚至在那之前，甚至在高中之前，当我们还是小孩子的时候，我们就会跑来跑去，在院子里玩耍，挂在树上。
But yeah, I mean, they were a regular fixture.
但是，是的，我的意思是，他们是常规赛。
But everything for this couple changed when their daughter died.
但当他们的女儿去世后，这对夫妇的一切都改变了。
The woman quit her job to go to school.
这位女士辞去了工作去上学。
They threw all of their savings into that.
他们把所有积蓄都投入其中。
But she had trouble with the classes, couldn't make the grade.
但她在课程上遇到了麻烦，无法取得成绩。
And things just kept going downhill from there.
从那时起，事情就一直在走下坡路。
She started drinking.
她开始喝酒。
They got behind on their rent.
他们拖欠了房租。
She'd drop off a check to me.
她会给我寄一张支票。
And then a day later or two days later, she'd call me and say, hey, did you deposit that check yet?
然后一天或两天后，她会打电话给我说，嘿，你存入那张支票了吗？
And I was like, no, we haven't deposited it yet.
我当时想，不，我们还没有存入它。
Well, could you tear up that check and let me-- I'll give you another check.
好吧，你能撕掉那张支票，让我——我再给你一张支票吗？
Forget about that check.
忘记那张支票吧。
And so then we'd tear up that check, and she'd bring down another check.
然后我们会撕掉那张支票，她会撕下另一张支票。
And then that check would bounce.
然后这张支票就会被退回。
And I think they got to maybe like $4,000 in the hole.
我认为他们可能需要 4,000 美元。
Oh, wow.
哦，哇。
So they were behind $4,000 in like--
所以他们落后了 4,000 美元——
Like six months.
好像六个月。
Ira Glass Six months, yeah.
艾拉·格拉斯 六个月，是的。
A half year behind.
落后了半年。
I was like, Dad, we got to kick these people out.
我当时想，爸爸，我们必须把这些人赶出去。
We got to get rid of them.
我们必须摆脱他们。
And my dad was very reluctant to do that.
我父亲非常不愿意这样做。
And he was like, work with them.
他说，和他们一起工作。
Work it out.
解决一下。
Work with them.
与他们一起工作。
Now why?
现在为什么？
Like, why?
比如，为什么？
Dennis Well, he knew that her husband had a good job.
丹尼斯 嗯，他知道她丈夫有一份好工作。
And he knew that they had money coming in and that you could get money out of them, basically.
他知道他们有钱进来，基本上你可以从他们那里得到钱。
Oh, I didn't realize that.
哦，我没有意识到这一点。
So it becomes a test of you.
所以它成为对你的考验。
The problem wasn't them.
问题不在于他们。
Because they've got the money.
因为他们有钱。
The problem is you, his son.
问题是你，他的儿子。
Dennis wanted to do right by his dad.
丹尼斯想为他的父亲做正确的事。
He wanted to do a good job.
他想做好工作。
Remember he had never had a job before.
请记住，他以前从未有过工作。
He was still living with his mom, and now he was in charge of his dad's business.
他仍然和妈妈住在一起，现在他负责爸爸的生意。
When it came to this couple, he was just flailing around.
当谈到这对夫妇时，他只是胡闹。
And he wasn't exactly sure how to get money out of them.
而且他不太确定如何从他们身上拿到钱。
But he decided he was going to do it.
但他决定这么做。
And he remembered his Jesuit teachers.
他还记得他的耶稣会老师。
I thought to myself.
我心想。
I'm like, it wasn't my job to ease these people through this or get them through it.
我想，让这些人轻松度过难关或帮助他们度过难关不是我的工作。
But I know that if I was in that situation, if I was down on my luck, that I would want somebody to cut me that break or cut me that slack.
但我知道，如果我处于那种情况，如果我运气不好，我会希望有人能打破我的困境或让我放松。
So he sat down and he created a payment plan for them, a few hundred bucks every paycheck.
于是他坐下来为他们制定了一个付款计划，每张工资几百美元。
But it was incredibly hard to make them stick to it.
但要让他们坚持下去却非常困难。
They had excuses.
他们有借口。
They couldn't do it.
他们做不到。
So he sat them down again, and they made up an agreement.
于是他又让他们坐下来，他们达成了协议。
And this time, they put it in writing.
而这一次，他们以书面形式记录下来。
And then after month upon month of struggle-- it took over a year-- they finally paid it all back.
经过月复一月的奋斗，花了一年多的时间，他们终于还清了一切。
Then things were OK for a while, but slowly but surely, started falling back into their own ways.
然后，有一段时间一切都还好，但慢慢地但肯定地，开始回到自己的轨道。
And basically what I think it was the alcohol, basically.
基本上我认为是酒精。
I remember vividly that she would come down to the laundry room.
我清楚地记得她会来到洗衣房。
The laundry room was just outside the office.
洗衣房就在办公室外面。
And she would go to the vending machine and buy can of pop after can of pop after can of pop.
她会去自动售货机买一罐又一罐的汽水。
And I always thought that was so weird.
我一直觉得这很奇怪。
I was like, why is she buying, like, eight cans of Sprite or Coke when we're right next door to Walgreens, and she can just go buy a 12-pack?
我当时想，为什么她要买八罐雪碧或可乐，而我们就在沃尔格林隔壁，而她可以直接去买 12 罐装？
And I think what it was, was she was just getting Cokes to mix drinks with up in her apartment.
我想那是什么，她只是在她的公寓里买可乐来混合饮料。
I just remembered that being so weird.
我只记得那件事太奇怪了。
So Dennis watched and worried.
所以丹尼斯一边看着一边担心。
He worried a lot.
他很担心。
Anybody who knew Dennis that time would tell you.
当时认识丹尼斯的任何人都会告诉你。
It was all he talked about.
这就是他所说的一切。
He'd go out with his friends, and this is what would be on his mind.
他会和他的朋友出去，这就是他的想法。
What should he do?
他该怎么办？
Was he being a sucker?
他是个傻瓜吗？
What was going on with this couple?
这对夫妻到底是怎么回事？
It was the kind of worrying that you might expect from a family member or something.
这是一种你可能会从家庭成员或其他人那里得到的担忧。
And of course, he was just the super, the property manager.
当然，他只是超级，物业经理。
And things got worse.
事情变得更糟了。
At one point, another tenant found the wife passed out in the hallway of the building, lying there like she was dead, covered in vomit.
有一次，另一名房客发现妻子昏倒在大楼的走廊里，躺在那里，浑身是呕吐物，就像死了一样。
Dennis ran to her side.
丹尼斯跑到她身边。
And I was like, oh my God.
我当时想，天啊。
What's wrong here?
这是怎么回事？
What happened to you?
你怎么了？
And she's just like, [GROANING].
她就像，[呻吟]。
She can't talk to me.
她不能跟我说话。
She can't put a sentence together.
她无法拼出一个句子。
She's just slurring all her words.
她只是在含糊其词。
And so I was like, what do I do?
所以我想，我该怎么办？
I'm like, do I take her to the hospital?
我想，我要带她去医院吗？
Do I call an ambulance?
我要叫救护车吗？
Like, well, what do I do?
就像，好吧，我该怎么办？
And anyway, she's like, I just need to go to bed.
不管怎样，她说，我只需要去睡觉。
And so she was too drunk to basically open her door.
所以她喝得太醉了，根本无法开门。
So I got her into bed.
于是我就把她抱到了床上。
And she's in bed, and she's laying on her back.
她躺在床上，仰面躺着。
And I'm like, I've heard stories.
我想，我听过故事。
Like, this is how Jimi Hendrix died or something like that.
就像吉米·亨德里克斯就是这样死的或者类似的事情。
And I'm like, what if she pukes again?
我想，如果她又吐了怎么办？
Is she going to choke on her puke?
她会被呕吐物噎住吗？
Finally I get a hold of her husband, and he's like, all right, I'll take care of it, I'll take care of it.
最后我联系到了她丈夫，他说，好吧，我会处理的，我会处理的。
But he's at work, and who knows when he's going to get home to take care of this?
但他在工作，谁知道他什么时候才能回家处理这件事呢？
I'm down in the office, I'm trying to do work.
我在办公室里，正在努力工作。
And so I went back up and checked on her a couple of times.
于是我又回去检查了她几次。
And she's sleeping, and she's breathing.
她正在睡觉，她正在呼吸。
And so then I go back down, and I can't get any work done because I was like, God, if this lady dies, I'm never going to forgive myself.
然后我回去了，我无法完成任何工作，因为我想，上帝，如果这位女士死了，我永远不会原谅自己。
I just remember that being a really terrifying experience.
我只记得那是一次非常可怕的经历。
It's so weird because part of it is like, you have this business relationship with these people.
这很奇怪，因为它的一部分就像，你和这些人有这种业务关系。
But you're there in their building.
但你在他们的大楼里。
Like, you're there in their house.
就像，你在他们的房子里。
Like, you own their house, you know?
就像，你拥有他们的房子，你知道吗？
And so it's so personal.
所以它是如此个人化。
Yeah.
是的。
Well, you definitely can't avoid it, so you've lived side by side with them.
好吧，你肯定无法避免，所以你就和他们一起生活了。
It becomes more of a neighbor-to-neighbor relationship.
它变得更像是邻居与邻居的关系。
They were slipping on the rent.
他们的租金不断下滑。
They'd plead with them.
他们会恳求他们。
And it was always something.
它总是有一些东西。
They had to pay other bills.
他们必须支付其他账单。
Christmas or Thanksgiving coming up.
圣诞节或感恩节即将到来。
They asked for extensions.
他们要求延期。
And he was so inside their lives that at one point, he said, sure, they could pay a little later if he could see their tax forms to see what it is that they actually earn.
他如此深入地了解他们的生活，以至于在某一时刻，他说，当然，如果他能看到他们的纳税表格，了解他们的实际收入，他们可以稍后付款。
And they showed him, $50,000 a year, which totally got under his skin.
他们向他展示了每年 5 万美元的收入，这让他非常恼火。
I was like, you know what?
我当时想，你知道吗？
Why can't they pay me?
为什么他们不能付钱给我？
And I started basically putting pen to paper and running some numbers.
我开始基本上用笔在纸上计算一些数字。
And I say to the lady-- I'm like, look.
我对那位女士说——我想，看。
Come down to the office.
到办公室来吧。
Bring your bills, and we'll do a budget.
带上您的账单，我们会做预算。
And I'll show you that you can afford to pay your rent.
我会告诉你你有能力支付房租。
And after we literally picked every little nit picky thing there could be money that they could spend money on, like kitty litter, laundry, transportation to and from work for her husband, we had like $3,000 left over.
当我们真的挑选了每一个挑剔的小东西之后，他们就可以花钱买东西了，比如猫砂、洗衣、她丈夫上下班的交通，我们还剩下大约 3,000 美元。
And I was like, look, you can afford this apartment.
我当时想，看，你买得起这套公寓。
So did that help?
那么这有帮助吗？
Did they end up paying the rent on time for the few months after that?
他们最终按时支付了之后几个月的租金吗？
No, it didn't help.
不，这没有帮助。
Ira Glass Wow, that's quite a lesson right there.
Ira Glass：哇，这真是一个教训。
Yeah.
是的。
It ended up getting really frustrating.
结果变得非常令人沮丧。
And in the end, I was losing my patience, and I was getting really, really mad.
最后，我失去了耐心，我变得非常非常生气。
She started running out of excuses.
她开始没有借口了。
And she'd be like, well, my husband borrowed money from people at work.
她会说，好吧，我丈夫向工作人员借了钱。
And he's got to pay them back.
他必须偿还他们。
And that made me really mad.
这让我真的很生气。
I was like, look.
我当时想，看。
You know what?
你知道吗？
You guys have been taking advantage of me.
你们一直在利用我。
You've been playing me like a fiddle.
你一直像拉小提琴一样玩弄我。
And that's it.
就是这样。
I'm not taking a back seat anymore.
我不会再坐在后座了。
You guys get caught up.
你们被追上了。
You start paying on time, or I'm going to kick you out.
你开始按时付款，否则我会把你踢出去。
And so I was in July and August telling them, like, look.
所以我在七月和八月告诉他们，比如，看。
I don't care if it's Christmas.
我不在乎是否是圣诞节。
I don't care if it's Thanksgiving.
我不在乎是否是感恩节。
I don't care if it's the holidays.
我不在乎是否是假期。
I'm going to kick you out.
我要把你踢出去。
Can I ask what is going to be a really naive question?
我可以问一个非常幼稚的问题吗？
If you have a 100-unit building, like, in reality, how important is it that you get the rent on one unit?
如果您拥有一栋 100 个单元的建筑，就像现实中的那样，获得其中一个单元的租金有多重要？
Well, I guess in the grand scheme of things, it's not going to make you or break you.
好吧，我想从长远来看，它不会成就你，也不会毁掉你。
But I mean, that's the deal.
但我的意思是，事情就是这样。
If you can't afford it, then I tell them, look, if you can't afford it, move to a smaller apartment.
如果你买不起，那么我告诉他们，看，如果你买不起，就搬到一个更小的公寓。
I'll give you a smaller apartment.
我会给你一间小一点的公寓。
But they didn't want to move.
但他们不想动。
They did not want to move.
他们不想动。
By the time Dennis was drawing up a budget for this couple, he'd been at it on and off for six years with them.
当丹尼斯为这对夫妇制定预算时，他已经断断续续地和他们一起工作了六年。
And his feelings would vacillate all over the place.
而他的感情也会到处摇摆不定。
But his dad-- the very man who told him how running a building hardens you-- his dad never wavered in support of the couple.
但他的父亲——就是那个告诉他管理一栋大楼如何让你变得坚强的人——他的父亲从未动摇过对这对夫妇的支持。
My dad and I would have battles.
我和我爸爸会吵架。
Like, we should kick them out.
就像，我们应该把他们踢出去。
We should kick them out.
我们应该把他们赶出去。
My dad would be like, no, I don't want to kick them out.
我爸爸会说，不，我不想把他们赶出去。
I'd be like, look, these people are way behind their rent.
我会想，看，这些人的房租远远落后。
You gotta kick them out.
你得把他们赶出去。
Dad, just get rid of these people.
爸爸，赶紧除掉这些人吧。
And we'd talk, and he'd reminisce about the stories.
我们会聊天，他会回忆起那些故事。
And one of the stories he tells me is that he went to the wake for the child that passed away.
他告诉我的故事之一是他为死去的孩子守灵。
And he said to-- I think it was like the sister of the lady's husband.
他说——我认为这就像那位女士丈夫的妹妹。
He's like, I used to hear the baby crying all night long, just crying and crying and crying.
他就像，我以前整夜都听到婴儿哭，只是哭啊哭啊哭。
And the gentleman's sister is like, well, you're not going to have to hear the baby crying anymore.
这位绅士的妹妹说，好吧，你再也不用听到婴儿的哭声了。
She turned around and walked away from him.
她转身离开了他。
Yeah, my dad didn't mean it like, that kid was keeping me awake all night.
是的，我爸爸不是故意的，那个孩子让我彻夜难眠。
Oh, thank God, now I can sleep.
哦，感谢上帝，现在我可以睡觉了。
He's had kids of his own, and so he might know what it's like to see your kid in pain.
他也有自己的孩子，所以他可能知道看到你的孩子痛苦是什么感觉。
So that, for him, was very, I think, just an emotional bond, where it was like, these people have just been through too much.
所以，我认为，对他来说，这只是一种情感纽带，就像这些人经历了太多。
I can't kick them out.
我不能把他们赶出去。
In the end, he decided to sit down one more time and have a heart-to-heart talk with the couple.
最后，他决定再坐下来和这对夫妇谈一谈。
He told them he knew that they were good people.
他告诉他们，他知道他们都是好人。
They just had a problem and they needed help.
他们只是遇到了问题，需要帮助。
He would wait for the money they owed if the woman would just get help and go to rehab.
如果这位女士能得到帮助并去康复中心，他会等待他们欠下的钱。
If you do this, we'll repaint your apartment.
如果您这样做，我们将重新粉刷您的公寓。
Tell me what colors you want, and when you come back from rehab, we'll have this done for you.
告诉我你想要什么颜色，当你从康复中心回来时，我们会为你做这件事。
She wanted her kitchen painted yellow or something like that.
她希望她的厨房漆成黄色或类似的颜色。
And so she went to rehab.
所以她去了康复中心。
And I have a letter from her from August.
我有一封她八月寄来的信。
OK, why don't you read it?
好吧，你为什么不读一下呢？
Dennis Want me to read it?
丹尼斯 要我读一下吗？
Sure.
当然。
It says, well, I'm incarcerated and writing you from Cell Block C.
上面写着，我被监禁了，正在 C 牢房给你写信。
You have no idea how touched I was by our talk, your caring, and generosity.
你不知道我们的谈话、你的关心和慷慨让我多么感动。
The group here is very nice, as is the facility.
这里的团队非常好，设施也很好。
I'm imagining what our apartment will look like upon my return.
我正在想象我回来后我们的公寓会是什么样子。
I'm so excited.
我太激动了。
I feel part of your family.
我感觉自己是你家庭的一部分。
You are in my prayers, which reminds me-- get your ass to church and make your ma happy.
你在我的祈祷中，这提醒了我——去教堂吧，让你妈妈高兴。
And when you got this letter, did you feel good?
当你收到这封信时，你感觉良好吗？
Yeah, I felt really good.
是的，我感觉非常好。
I was like, oh, this is great.
我当时想，哦，这太棒了。
She's in there, she's getting help.
她在那里，正在寻求帮助。
But then-- I don't know when it was-- a day or two or three later, I'm walking down the courtyard.
但后来——我不知道是什么时候——一天、两天或三天后，我沿着院子走去。
And who do I see coming towards me but her.
除了她之外，我还看到谁朝我走来。
And this was supposed to be a two week or a month long stay.
这本来应该是两周或一个月的停留时间。
I was like, I can't believe it.
我当时想，我简直不敢相信。
Why is she-- and so that was the beginning of the end.
为什么是她——所以这就是结局的开始。
Shortly after that is when I filed the court papers for eviction.
不久之后，我向法庭提交了驱逐文件。
It was just-- it was devastating.
这简直是毁灭性的。
It was like, ugh, you have to stand in front of the judge, looking at this person who I ran up and down the courtyard and maybe they threw the ball to me when I was, like, eight years old.
就像，呃，你必须站在法官面前，看着我在院子里跑来跑去的这个人，也许他们在我八岁的时候把球扔给了我。
And now I'm sitting here in front of the judge, telling them, Your Honor, please remove these people forcibly from the building.
现在我坐在法官面前，告诉他们，法官大人，请强行将这些人赶出大楼。
I'm like, that's what it comes down to.
我想，这就是它的归结。
I have to do what I have to do to win this case.
我必须做我必须做的事情才能赢得这场官司。
I was mad.
我很生气。
I wanted them out.
我想让他们出去。
Definitely.
确实。
Yeah, definitely changed me.
是的，确实改变了我。
Now, I don't like to get personally involved with tenants.
现在，我不喜欢亲自与租户打交道。
Like, it's just too hard.
就像，这太难了。
One time, these two guys moved into a two-bedroom apartment.
有一次，这两个人搬进了一套两居室的公寓。
And they were like, aw, you guys are great.
他们说，噢，你们太棒了。
Why don't you come out and have a beer with us?
你为什么不出来和我们一起喝杯啤酒呢？
I was like, you know what?
我当时想，你知道吗？
I got something to do tonight.
今晚我有事要做。
I'm sorry.
对不起。
Maybe some other time, though.
不过也许其他时间。
I'd really love to get a beer with you.
我真的很想和你一起喝杯啤酒。
But I had no intentions of ever going out for a beer with them.
但我无意和他们一起出去喝啤酒。
I would just-- I don't know-- make up an excuse or avoid it at all costs because, you know, you can't be their friends.
我只是——我不知道——编造借口或不惜一切代价避免，因为，你知道，你不能成为他们的朋友。
What I try and do now is I try to never have to kick somebody out.
我现在所做的就是努力永远不要把某人踢出去。
And the way I do that is by screening and screening and screening.
我这样做的方法就是筛选、筛选、筛选。
But that's the thing that I find interesting about this.
但这就是我觉得有趣的地方。
I never thought about that as like it has anything to do with your feelings.
我从来没有想过这个问题，因为这与你的感受有关。
This goes beyond the business stuff, that you're checking out all their credentials and all that sort of stuff.
这超出了业务范围，你要检查他们所有的凭证和所有类似的东西。
Are you saying it's actually like, it's too emotional?
你说这真的是太情绪化了吗？
Yeah, it really is.
是的，确实如此。
I mean, for example, I do remember somebody coming in and applying for an apartment.
我的意思是，例如，我确实记得有人进来申请公寓。
And they're like, look, my credit's all messed up.
他们就像，看，我的信用全乱了。
I'm going through a divorce.
我正在经历离婚。
And I don't know if my wife messed up my credit.
我不知道我的妻子是否搞砸了我的信用。
And I was like, I don't care.
我当时想，我不在乎。
Maybe that's the truth.
也许这就是事实。
Maybe that guy would have been a fine tenant.
也许那个家伙会是一个很好的房客。
Maybe he would have paid his rent on time.
也许他会按时付房租。
But I just can't take that chance anymore.
但我不能再冒这个机会了。
What would your Jesuit teacher say about that?
你的耶稣会老师对此有何看法？
I don't know.
我不知道。
Maybe they would be disappointed in it.
也许他们会对此感到失望。
And do you care?
你关心吗？
Dennis No. If they're mad about it, I would say, well, the next person who rented that apartment, Father, I did try to treat them justly and fairly and ethically.
丹尼斯 不。如果他们对此感到生气，我会说，好吧，下一个租下那间公寓的人，神父，我确实试图公正、公平和合乎道德地对待他们。
[MUSIC - "WORKING ON THE BUILDING" BY ELVIS PRESLEY]
[音乐 - 猫王埃尔维斯·普雷斯利的《建筑工作》]
Credits Ira Glass Well, our program was produced today by Alex Blumberg and myself, with Diane Cook, Jane Marie, Sarah Koenig, Lisa Pollak, and Nancy Updike.
感谢 Ira Glass 嗯，我们今天的节目是由 Alex Blumberg 和我本人以及 Diane Cook、Jane Marie、Sarah Koenig、Lisa Pollak 和 Nancy Updike 制作的。
Our senior producer for today's show was Julie Snyder.
我们今天节目的高级制片人是朱莉·斯奈德。
Additional production on the rerun of today's show from Jessica Lussenhop, Katherine Rae Mondo, Stowe Nelson, and Matt Tierney.
杰西卡·卢森霍普、凯瑟琳·雷·蒙多、斯托·尼尔森和马特·蒂尔尼对今天节目的重播进行了额外制作。
Peter Roach, the super there that you heard at the very beginning of the show, he retired a few years ago.
彼得·罗奇（Peter Roach），你在节目一开始就听到的超级人物，他几年前退休了。
He now performs in, quote, "every nursing home in Northeast Pennsylvania under the name, 'The Singin' Super.'"
他现在在“宾夕法尼亚州东北部的每家疗养院以‘The Singin’ Super’的名义进行表演。”
Our website, thisamericanlife.org.
我们的网站 thisamericanlife.org。
This American Life is delivered to public radio stations by PRX, the Public Radio Exchange.
《美国生活》由公共广播电台 PRX 向公共广播电台播出。
Thanks, as always, to our program's co-founder, Mr. Torey Malatia, who has this message for any This American Life employee who's listening to the radio right now.
一如既往，感谢我们计划的联合创始人 Torey Malatia 先生，他向所有正在收听广播的《This American Life》员工传达了这一信息。
Don't try to steal one of the light bulbs in the hallway.
不要试图偷走廊里的一个灯泡。
I know what you're thinking, but I've booby trapped them.
我知道你在想什么，但我给他们设了陷阱。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Back next week with more stories of This American Life.
下周我们将带来更多《美国生活》的故事。
This American Life is produced in collaboration with WBEZ Chicago and delivered to stations by PRX The Public Radio Exchange.
《This American Life》与 WBEZ Chicago 合作制作，并由 PRX 公共广播电台传送到各电台。