263: Desperate Measures - This American Life
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00:00 00:00 Transcript Share This American Life Life Partners How to Listen Episodes Recommended About Overview Staff Announcements Fellowships Jobs Music Make Radio On The Road FAQ Submissions Merch Contact Us Our Other Shows Merch Follow Us Life Partners Subscribe to our newsletter Full episode Toggle Audio and Transcript Sync Transcript | Episode #263 | April 16, 2004 263: Desperate Measures Note: This American Life is produced for the ear and designed to be heard.
00:00 00:00 文字记录 分享此 美国生活 生活伙伴 如何收听 剧集 推荐 关于 概述 员工公告 奖学金 工作 音乐 在路上制作电台 常见问题解答 提交 商品 联系我们 我们的其他节目 商品 关注我们 生活伙伴 订阅我们的时事通讯 整集 切换音频和文字记录同步 文字记录 | 内容第 263 集 | 2004 年 4 月 16 日 263：绝望措施 注：《美国生活》是为耳朵而制作的，旨在让人们听到。
If you are able, we strongly encourage you to listen to the audio, which includes emotion and emphasis that's not on the page.
如果可以的话，我们强烈建议您收听音频，其中包括页面上没有的情感和重点。
Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors.
文字记录是使用语音识别软件和人工转录员结合生成的，可能包含错误。
Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print.
请在印刷版引用前检查相应的音频。
Prologue Ira Glass Principal Gartner and Assistant Principal James have tried everything they know how to try.
Prologue Ira Glass 校长 Gartner 和助理校长 James 已经尝试了他们所知道的一切方法。
They've filed paperwork, they've talked to people above them.
他们已经提交了文件，他们已经与他们的上级进行了交谈。
They've gotten the parents from their school to go and stand up at school board meetings.
他们让学校的家长去参加学校董事会会议。
Nothing's worked.
什么都没起作用。
We were told the new school would happen, this is about, six years ago.
我们被告知新学校将会建成，那是大约六年前的事了。
They run a public elementary school in Chicago called the Richard E.
他们在芝加哥经营一所公立小学，名为理查德·E.
Byrd Community Academy.
伯德社区学院。
The school has no lunchroom, no auditorium, no gymnasium.
学校没有餐厅，没有礼堂，没有体育馆。
Even for Chicago, it's pretty bad.
即使对于芝加哥来说，情况也相当糟糕。
Promises were made.
我们做出了承诺。
Land has been cleared.
土地已清理完毕。
A sign has been posted for years and years and years.
一个标志已经张贴了很多年了。
We have gone through planning, right down to picking out tile.
我们已经完成了计划，一直到挑选瓷砖。
And then, it's not happening.
然后，它就没有发生。
There go our bullet hole in the window.
窗户上有我们的弹孔。
There go our missing drinking fountain.
我们失踪的饮水机不见了。
And there go our other bullet hole in the window over there.
那边窗户上还有我们的另一个弹孔。
Caprice, a fifth grader, takes on a tour of what's wrong with the building.
五年级学生卡普里斯参观了这座建筑的问题所在。
Things were going nowhere in the campaign to get a new school until the fifth graders in her class, room 405, got involved this fall.
直到今年秋天，她班级 405 室的五年级学生参与进来，建立新学校的活动一直没有进展。
Among the things that got them maddest about the school was the heating system.
学校最让他们抓狂的事情就是供暖系统。
Here's Davielle.
这是达维埃尔。
At our classroom, I remember once the heat was supposed to be on but we had to put on our hats, our coats, our gloves.
我记得在我们的教室里，有一次应该开暖气，但我们必须戴上帽子、外套和手套。
We put on our gloves, we can't even hardly write, because people have mittens.
我们戴上手套，我们甚至无法写字，因为人们有手套。
You know you can't write with no mittens.
你知道不戴手套就无法写字。
They walk me to the bathrooms.
他们带我去洗手间。
There's no soap, no paper towels, no paper towel dispensers.
没有肥皂，没有纸巾，没有纸巾架。
A door is missing from the stalls.
摊位上缺少一扇门。
We don't have our own privacy.
我们没有自己的隐私。
There aren't any doors on the stalls.
摊位上没有门。
And don't nobody uses the bathroom anymore.
再也没有人使用浴室了。
But--
但是——
So what does everybody do?
那么大家都做什么呢？
You just hold it in?
你只是坚持住吗？
Yeah, mhm.
是的，嗯。
We go take it down to our lunchroom.
我们去把它带到我们的午餐室。
It's a bootleg lunchroom.
这是一家盗版餐厅。
We've got a bootleg lunchroom, because it's a hallway with just tables in it.
我们有一个盗版餐厅，因为它是一个走廊，里面只有桌子。
The bootleg lunchroom features bootleg cafeteria ladies, who look just like any cafeteria ladies anywhere, except they're serving chicken nuggets and corn and milk in the middle of the school hallway.
盗版午餐室里有盗版自助餐厅的女士，她们看起来和任何地方的自助餐厅女士没什么两样，只不过她们在学校走廊中间供应鸡块、玉米和牛奶。
The kids in room 405 decided that they needed a new school back in the fall when their teacher, Brian Schultz, a young idealistic teacher in his second year, decided to try something new, a program called Project Citizen, where the kids would pick some problem in the school or in their neighborhood that they wanted to solve.
秋天，405 室的孩子们决定需要一所新学校，当时他们的老师布莱恩·舒尔茨 (Brian Schultz) 是一位年轻的理想主义老师，二年级的老师决定尝试一些新的东西，一个名为“公民计划”的项目，孩子们可以在这个项目中选择学校或社区中他们想要解决的一些问题。
And then they would solve it together as a class.
然后他们全班一起解决这个问题。
So one day Mr. Schultz stood at the board and had them name possible problems that they could address.
因此有一天，舒尔茨先生站在董事会面前，让他们指出他们可以解决的可能问题。
Some of the problems that they came up with were everything from wanting to clean up litter in the parks to teenage pregnancy to stopping Michael Jackson.
他们提出的一些问题包罗万象，从想要清理公园里的垃圾到少女怀孕，再到阻止迈克尔·杰克逊。
And did you try to get them to just choose one problem?
你是否试图让他们只选择一个问题？
That was the aim, was to pick one problem.
这就是目的，就是挑出一个问题。
And truly I thought that they would pick something like getting mandatory recess every day, or getting a different selection of drinks at lunch.
我确实认为他们会选择每天强制休息，或者在午餐时选择不同的饮料。
But when the kids started naming their problems at their own school, he says, the feeling was so many of these problems could not be solved one by one.
但他说，当孩子们开始在自己的学校说出他们的问题时，他们感觉很多问题无法一一解决。
The only way to get an auditorium or a lunchroom would probably be just to build a whole new school, the one they were supposed to get six years ago, the one whose plans are actually on display in the entryway of this building for them to see as they walk in each morning.
获得礼堂或餐厅的唯一方法可能就是建造一所全新的学校，他们六年前就应该建造的学校，其计划实际上展示在这座大楼的入口处，供他们每天早上走进时看到。
So that's what they decided to go for.
所以他们决定这么做。
They've had politicians visit.
他们有政客来访。
They've written letters to the head of Chicago schools.
他们已经写信给芝加哥学校的校长。
There have been TV crews.
已经有电视台工作人员了。
There's been coverage in the newspapers.
报纸上有报道。
But Byrd sits in the middle of Cabrini-Green, one of the most famous public housing complexes in the country.
但伯德坐落在卡布里尼格林的中间，这是该国最著名的公共住宅区之一。
And the city of Chicago is tearing down the public housing high-rises around the school.
芝加哥市正在拆除学校周围的公共住房高层建筑。
Lots of Cabrini is already gone, replaced with expensive townhomes.
许多卡布里尼已经消失，取而代之的是昂贵的联排别墅。
Assistant Principal James says that maybe the new school will come only when this process is finished.
副校长詹姆斯说，也许只有这个过程完成后，新学校才会建成。
And maybe this is what's happening.
也许这就是正在发生的事情。
Maybe the plan is to let's just stall it, stall it, stall it until the buildings are torn down and the new townhomes are all in place and we get the population we want for the new schools, but not for our students.
也许计划就是让我们拖延，拖延，拖延，直到建筑物被拆除，新的联排别墅全部就位，我们得到了新学校所需的人口，但不是我们的学生。
It'll be for the new residents, because they're going to need a school.
这是为新居民准备的，因为他们需要一所学校。
I think they're going to fix stuff up.
我认为他们会解决问题。
I don't really think they're going to give us a new school.
我真的不认为他们会给我们一所新学校。
Yeah?
是的？
How come?
怎么会？
Davielle Because they're going to build condos over there.
达维埃尔：因为他们要在那里建造公寓。
Because my mama said that when they knock down the projects, all the other people from them move over here, they're trying to make us move from over here.
因为我妈妈说，当他们拆除这些项目时，他们的所有其他人都会搬到这里，他们试图让我们从这里搬走。
The kids are getting some small results.
孩子们正在取得一些小成果。
The school board has finally scheduled some repairs for the building, minor stuff, covering some fluorescent lights, fixing some wiring.
学校董事会最终安排了对大楼进行一些维修，一些小事，覆盖一些荧光灯，修复一些电线。
If they just get repairs and not a whole school, a lot of kids say they're going to be really disappointed.
如果他们只是进行维修而不是整所学校，很多孩子都会说他们会非常失望。
And Principal Gartner is worried about the lesson that they're going to take away from all of this.
Gartner 负责人担心他们将从这一切中吸取教训。
If they don't see things happening, I'm afraid that they're going to say, mm hm, voice all you want, but your voice is a small voice and doesn't matter.
如果他们没有看到事情发生，我担心他们会说，嗯，你想发什么声音就发什么声音，但你的声音很小，没关系。
And this is the problem with the big, desperate, brave attempt to change things.
这就是为改变现状而进行的伟大、绝望、勇敢的尝试所带来的问题。
When you raise the stakes, you either win big or you lose big.
当你提高赌注时，你要么赢大钱，要么输大钱。
And that's what our show is about today.
这就是我们今天节目的主题。
From WBEZ Chicago, it's This American Life, distributed by Public Radio International.
这是来自芝加哥 WBEZ 的《This American Life》，由国际公共广播电台发行。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Today on our program, stories of people stuck in unfixable situations, people who try desperate measures, unusual, inventive, desperate measures.
今天在我们的节目中，讲述了人们陷入无法解决的境地的故事，人们尝试绝望的措施，不寻常的、创造性的、绝望的措施。
We're talking stories of American ingenuity, stories of problem solvers, stories of what this country is all about at some level.
我们谈论的是美国人的聪明才智的故事，问题解决者的故事，以及这个国家在某种程度上的故事。
Act One, Hasta la Vista, Arnie.
第一幕，哈斯塔拉维斯塔，阿尼。
In that act, a patient, a doctor, a problem, and a movie star back when he still made movies.
在那一幕中，一个病人、一个医生、一个问题和一个还在拍电影的电影明星。
Act Two, We Built This City on Rock and Coal.
第二幕，我们在岩石和煤炭上建造了这座城市。
In that act, a small town in Pennsylvania goes for the extreme makeover, decides to get a famous face of a favorite celebrity.
在那一幕中，宾夕法尼亚州的一个小镇进行了彻底的改造，决定买一张最喜欢的名人的著名面孔。
Act Three, The Router Not Taken.
第三幕，路由器未被占领。
A man tries to unload a piece of junk that he bought by selling it on eBay, not by concealing its many terrible qualities, but by bragging about them, which actually, it turns out to work.
一个男人试图卸下他在 eBay 上出售的一件垃圾，不是通过隐藏它的许多可怕品质，而是通过吹嘘它们，事实上，事实证明这是有效的。
Act Four, The Rocks at Rock Bottom.
第四幕，谷底的岩石。
In that act, a guide to how to get over a heartbreak using only your throwing arm.
在那一幕中，指导如何仅使用投掷手臂克服心碎。
Stay with us.
留在我们身边。
Act One, Hasta la Vista, Arnie.
第一幕，哈斯塔拉维斯塔，阿尼。
Scott Miller was not an experienced therapist back when everything you're about to hear took place.
当你将要听到的一切发生时，斯科特·米勒还不是一位经验丰富的治疗师。
He was a beginner, a grad student, starting off at a local psychiatric hospital when this patient came in.
当这位病人进来时，他是一名初学者，一名研究生，刚开始在当地一家精神病医院工作。
A guy who had been doing OK, leading a more or less normal life.
一个一直过得还不错的人，过着或多或少正常的生活。
When one day, the guy snapped.
有一天，那家伙突然爆发了。
He would go on and on babbling about that he was The Terminator.
他会不停地喋喋不休地说他是终结者。
And the big thing was that he had helped a bunch of other patients on this particular ward escape.
最重要的是，他在这次特殊的病房逃生中帮助了许多其他病人。
They'd find them down on level two in obstetrics in there around the ward.
他们会在病房周围的产科二楼找到他们。
And this had happened on more than one occasion.
而且这样的事已经发生过不止一次了。
And they'd get a call, they would bring the people back up to the ward.
他们接到电话后，会把人们带回病房。
And it wasn't too long before he'd be back out.
而且没过多久他就回来了。
So he would stage breakouts?
那么他会进行突破吗？
Scott Miller He did.
斯科特·米勒 他做到了。
He was there to rescue John Connor and had to help those people get off the ward, that they were all being kept there against their will.
他是来营救约翰·康纳的，并且必须帮助那些人离开病房，因为他们都违背自己的意愿被留在那里。
And in fact, he felt also that he was being poisoned by the staff, The commandant, in particular, which I took was the lead psychiatrist on the unit, given drugs that was messing up his software.
事实上，他还觉得自己受到了参谋人员的毒害，尤其是指挥官，我认为他是该部队的首席精神科医生，因为药物扰乱了他的软件。
And was he quoting lines from the movies?
他引用了电影中的台词吗？
Like would--
就像会——
Oh, yes.
哦，是的。
He stayed in character, which is another unusual feature.
他保持了本色，这是另一个不寻常的特征。
Very often clients with this particular condition will go in and out of focus, different kinds of characters.
很多时候，患有这种特殊情况的客户会出现或失去焦点，出现不同类型的角色。
They'll come in and out of their-- they'll remember who they are or what their role in life has been.
他们会记得自己是谁或自己在生活中扮演的角色。
But this guy stayed, and his delusion had fixed features.
但这家伙留下来了，他的妄想也有了固定的特征。
So what did you do?
那么你做了什么？
Scott Miller Well, the staff was just embarrassed, but also upset with this.
斯科特·米勒（Scott Miller）：好吧，工作人员只是感到尴尬，但也对此感到不安。
And they would bring him back and try to have a very rational discussion with this very psychotic man about why he shouldn't be doing this.
他们会把他带回来，并尝试与这个非常精神病的人进行非常理性的讨论，解释为什么他不应该这样做。
And one of the things that often happens is they give him more of the treatment that wasn't working.
经常发生的事情之一是他们给了他更多无效的治疗。
Like, they gave him more of the drug that didn't--
就像，他们给了他更多的药物，但没有——
They give him more of the drugs.
他们给了他更多的药物。
And they tried even more to be rational with him and explain the reasons why he couldn't be escaping from the units, restate who he really was, what his real name was.
他们更加努力地对他保持理性，解释他无法逃离单位的原因，重申他的真实身份，他的真名是什么。
OK.
好的。
So you guys try more drugs, and you try reasoning with him.
所以你们尝试更多的药物，并尝试与他讲道理。
Neither thing works.
两者都不起作用。
No. And here I am a student, so I probably don't know any better.
不。我是一名学生，所以我可能不知道更多。
And I had been to a couple of workshops, and I was intrigued by this man whose name was Milton Erickson, who was kind of this wacky psychiatrist who lived out in the Arizona desert.
我去过几个研讨会，我对这个名叫米尔顿·埃里克森的人很感兴趣，他是一位住在亚利桑那州沙漠中的古怪的精神病学家。
He was famous for treating very difficult clients, and often in very unusual and unorthodox ways.
他以对待非常难相处的客户而闻名，而且常常以非常不寻常和非正统的方式。
And the case that came to my mind, that I am sure I'd heard at this workshop, was of a man in a state hospital-- I believe it was in Michigan-- who believed he was Jesus Christ.
我想到的一个案例，我确信我在这次研讨会上听说过，是一个在州立医院（我相信是在密歇根州）的男人，他相信自己是耶稣基督。
He'd been at the hospital for decades if I'm remembering the story correctly.
如果我没记错的话，他已经在医院呆了几十年了。
And nothing had helped.
但没有任何帮助。
Milton Erickson comes in, learns of this particular case, and invites the man to his office.
米尔顿·埃里克森进来，了解到这个特殊情况，并邀请该人到他的办公室。
Or goes and visits him, I don't recall, and asks him if he is indeed Jesus Christ.
或者去拜访他，我不记得了，并问他是否真的是耶稣基督。
The man says, yes, I am.
男人说，是的，我是。
And Erickson, rather than fighting with him, asks him, I understand that you're a carpenter.
埃里克森没有与他争吵，而是问他，我知道你是一名木匠。
He said, yes, that's true.
他说，是的，确实如此。
And he put him to work building bookshelves at the hospital.
他让他去医院建造书架。
Within a very short period of time, he's out of the hospital, working as a carpenter.
在很短的时间内，他就出院了，成为了一名木匠。
So one day I come in and this young man is now in the seclusion room.
所以有一天我进来时，这个年轻人现在在隐居室里。
So I figured it's escalated even more.
所以我认为事情会进一步升级。
This is a padded room, and they've stripped him down to his skivvies.
这是一间有软垫的房间，他们把他脱得只剩下紧身裤。
And I asked if I could go talk with him.
我问我是否可以去和他谈谈。
They said, OK.
他们说，好吧。
Feel free to go ahead and chat with him, if you'd like.
如果您愿意，请随时与他聊天。
Everything else has failed, but more, they figured there's nothing that I can do.
其他一切都失败了，但更重要的是，他们认为我无能为力。
I'm a student.
我是一名学生。
I'm not going to mess things up terribly.
我不会把事情搞得一团糟。
This is a case that's going to take some time to remit.
这是一个需要一些时间才能处理的案件。
And so I went into the room.
于是我走进了房间。
By the time I had gotten admitted to the locked room, he was sitting on the ground, cross-legged.
当我进入上锁的房间时，他已经盘腿坐在地上。
And I walked in, and I just said, hi, my name is Scott.
我走进去，我只是说，嗨，我叫斯科特。
What can I call you?
我可以叫你什么？
And he says, you can call me The Terminator.
他说，你可以叫我终结者。
And so I stretched out my hand, and I say, I'm very pleased to meet you-- Terminator, or The Terminator?
于是我伸出手，我说，我很高兴见到你——终结者，还是终结者？
He says, you can just call me The Terminator.
他说，你可以叫我终结者。
We keep talking for a while.
我们继续聊了一会儿。
I start to remember this case of Erickson's.
我开始记起埃里克森的这个案例。
And I'm thinking could I develop something similar to that, some way of joining him, some way of being with him?
我在想我是否可以开发出类似的东西，某种方式加入他，某种方式与他在一起？
And I say to him at some point, out of the blue, totally by chance, are you really The Terminator or are you Arnold Schwarzenegger?
我在某个时刻突然、完全偶然地对他说，你真的是终结者还是阿诺·施瓦辛格？
And he stops, and he looks at me, and he says, how did you know?
他停了下来，看着我，说，你怎么知道？
And he kind of smiled.
他微笑着。
And he says, you're the only one that knows this.
他说，你是唯一知道这一点的人。
And I say, thanks for telling me this.
我说，谢谢你告诉我这些。
I said, great.
我说，太好了。
I said, you know I've been watching your-- you're like an American success story.
我说，你知道我一直在关注你的——你就像一个美国的成功故事。
You come over here with nothing.
你来到这里，什么都没有。
You become an icon of weightlifting.
您成为举重的偶像。
You marry a Kennedy.
你嫁给了肯尼迪家族。
My God, I said, it's incredible.
天哪，我说，这太不可思议了。
We're laughing, and carrying on for another, I don't know, 10 minutes, maybe 15 minutes.
我们一边笑，一边继续笑，我不知道，大概是 10 分钟，也许是 15 分钟。
And again, I'm sort of thinking what the next move is here.
再次，我正在思考下一步行动是什么。
And I got an idea.
我有了一个主意。
I said, I have a new role for you to play.
我说，我有一个新的角色让你扮演。
I said, you know The Terminator series, how many really of these can you do?
我说，你知道终结者系列，你到底能做几个？
You really need to think about developing another side, a nuanced kind of role, not just sort of stare into the camera and really just be Arnold.
你真的需要考虑发展另一面，一种微妙的角色，而不仅仅是盯着镜头，真正成为阿诺德。
And his reaction?
他的反应呢？
Scott Miller What's the role?
斯科特·米勒扮演什么角色？
And as soon as he said that, then I thought, OK, the idea seems to be working.
他一这么说，我就想，好吧，这个想法似乎可行。
I said, it's a very different kind of role.
我说，这是一个非常不同的角色。
It's not a role that you've ever played before.
这不是你以前扮演过的角色。
It's not a strong, silent, shoot-em-up kind of type.
这不是一种强大、安静、射击的类型。
It's not action hero.
这不是动作英雄。
Do you think you're capable of it?
你认为你有能力吗？
And he says, oh, I'm very capable.
他说，哦，我很有能力。
And I said, are you sure?
我说，你确定吗？
He says, yes.
他说，是的。
I said, well, you know I'm not-- and he says, come on!
我说，好吧，你知道我不是——他说，来吧！
Tell me what the role is.
告诉我这个角色是什么。
And I said, mental patient.
我说，精神病人。
And in so many words he says, what do I have to do?
他说了这么多话，我该怎么办？
And I said, you have to leave this room.
我说，你必须离开这个房间。
You have to start engaging the people running around here that are pretending to be the staff.
你必须开始吸引那些冒充这里的工作人员的人。
You have to talk to them about your feelings.
你必须和他们谈谈你的感受。
You have to sit in groups.
你们必须分组坐着。
You have to go to arts and crafts class and paint and mold clay and do all the things that they're doing in your arts and crafts class.
你必须去艺术和手工艺课，绘画和塑造粘土，并做他们在艺术和手工艺课上做的所有事情。
And he says, I can do it.
他说，我能做到。
So did he get better?
那么他的病情好转了吗？
Scott Miller Yes.
斯科特·米勒 是的。
He was released I think within about five or six days after that.
我想他在那之后大约五六天内就被释放了。
Over the course of time, he was in role so much that even he didn't seem to be able to tell that he was really Arnold Schwarzenegger.
随着时间的推移，他对角色的适应度如此之高，以至于连他自己似乎都无法看出他真的是阿诺·施瓦辛格。
Right.
正确的。
He was just as willing to see himself as himself at some point.
在某个时刻，他愿意像他自己一样看待自己。
Yeah, it was equally rewarding.
是的，这同样值得。
People got along with him well from that point forward.
从那时起，人们就和他相处得很好。
Oh, it's interesting to think about that in a way, his problem was that he didn't know how to relate to the world.
哦，从某种程度上来说，想想很有趣，他的问题是他不知道如何与世界建立联系。
He had some sort of breakdown, and he didn't know how to relate.
他有点崩溃了，他不知道如何联系。
And so he just chose a way to relate that it was clear how to relate.
所以他只是选择了一种清晰的关联方式。
If he's Arnold Schwarzenegger, if he's The Terminator, it's clear what his role is.
如果他是阿诺·施瓦辛格，如果他是终结者，那么他的角色就很清楚了。
And all he needed for somebody to do was give him a way to think about, no no, here's who you are, and here's how to interact with the world.
他需要有人做的就是给他一种思考的方式，不，不，这就是你是谁，这就是如何与世界互动。
Yeah.
是的。
And let's put a twist on it.
让我们稍微改变一下。
It depends on whose eyes you look through.
这取决于你通过谁的眼睛看。
Maybe the world needed to figure out a way to relate to him, especially the small world in which he was living.
也许这个世界需要找到一种与他建立联系的方式，尤其是他所生活的小世界。
But every day, I'm meeting people.
但每天，我都会遇到人。
And I want to blur the boundaries a bit here between so-called delusional clients and our everyday garden-variety clients who come through the door.
我想稍微模糊一下所谓的妄想客户和我们日常进门的普通客户之间的界限。
They also have views that I sit opposite them and think some days, how the hell could they believe that?
他们还认为，我坐在他们对面，有时会想，他们怎么会相信这一点？
It's so patently absurd.
这显然是荒谬的。
But my job is to somehow understand that perspective and what that leads them to.
但我的工作是以某种方式理解这种观点以及它会导致什么结果。
And that seems to open up a connection that leads to change.
这似乎打开了一种导致变革的联系。
How common is this as a technique to do with very extreme patients, though?
不过，对于非常极端的患者来说，这种技术有多常见？
This idea that you're going to enter their world in this way and enter their fantasy and just suggest a variation on the fantasy?
你将以这种方式进入他们的世界并进入他们的幻想并只是提出幻想的变体？
I think the field would be divided about that.
我认为这个领域对此会有分歧。
We have these notions that psychosis is a biological condition, and talking just really isn't the thing that helps them, they really need the drugs.
我们认为精神病是一种生物学病症，仅仅说话并不能真正帮助他们，他们确实需要药物。
In fact, very often people are advised, you don't actually engage people in conversations about their delusions.
事实上，人们常常被建议，你实际上并没有让人们参与有关他们的妄想的对话。
That might perpetuate them.
这可能会让它们永久存在。
So you want to make sure that you are very rational with them, set limits with them.
所以你要确保你对他们非常理性，对他们设定限制。
And with some clients, that's going to work.
对于一些客户来说，这会起作用。
The question is, you try that approach, it doesn't work, you probably need to try something else.
问题是，你尝试了这种方法，但它不起作用，你可能需要尝试其他方法。
And our research actually says that clinicians frequently don't recognize when a case is failing.
我们的研究实际上表明，临床医生常常意识不到病例何时失败。
Huh.
呵呵。
So what does that mean?
那么这意味着什么呢？
Scott Miller That means they persist in doing more of the same thing that hadn't worked before, either the same class of intervention or type of intervention.
斯科特·米勒（Scott Miller）这意味着他们坚持做更多以前不起作用的相同事情，无论是同一类别的干预还是同一类型的干预。
So if a little medication doesn't work, well, then we'll try a little bit more.
因此，如果一点药物不起作用，那么我们会再尝试一点。
If a little confrontation doesn't work to overcome the client's denial, then by God, we'll put them in a group where 12 people can confront them simultaneously.
如果一点点对抗都无法克服客户的否认，那么上帝啊，我们会把他们分成一个小组，让 12 个人可以同时对抗他们。
And do I understand right?
我理解对吗？
You're saying that with these difficult cases, the problem isn't that people recognize, oh, this one's a stumper, and now I've got to do something different.
你是说，在这些困难的情况下，问题不在于人们认识到，哦，这个是个难题，现在我必须做一些不同的事情。
The problem is that they actually don't recognize I'm failing in what I'm doing.
问题是他们实际上没有意识到我在做的事情上失败了。
I'm just doing it over and over, and it's not getting fixed.
我只是一遍又一遍地这样做，而且没有得到解决。
Yes, very often.
是的，经常。
So it's interesting to me that in mental health, often times when there's a problem, it's the clients who end up somehow blamed.
所以对我来说有趣的是，在心理健康方面，通常当出现问题时，客户最终会以某种方式受到指责。
Scott Miller is a researcher and clinician and co-director of the Institute for the Study of Therapeutic Change.
斯科特·米勒 (Scott Miller) 是一名研究员、临床医生，也是治疗变革研究所的联席主任。
Their website is www.talkingcure.com.
他们的网站是 www.talkingcure.com。
This story is mentioned in the book, The Mummy at the Dining Room Table: Eminent Therapists reveal Their Most Unusual Cases.
《餐桌上的木乃伊：杰出治疗师揭露他们最不寻常的案例》一书中提到了这个故事。
[MUSIC - "PSYCHO THERAPY" BY THE RAMONES]
[音乐 - 雷蒙斯乐队的“心理治疗”]
Act Two, We Built This City on Rock and Coal.
第二幕，我们在岩石和煤炭上建造了这座城市。
So here's a problem that faces the state of Michigan.
这是密歇根州面临的一个问题。
Young people don't want to live there.
年轻人不想住在那里。
And they're fleeing.
他们正在逃跑。
The population of 25 to 34 year olds is half of what might be expected, down 200,000 from what it was just 10 years ago.
25岁至34岁的人口只有预期的一半，比10年前减少了20万。
One study shows Michigan as 47th out of the 50 states in attracting young people.
一项研究显示，密歇根州在吸引年轻人方面在 50 个州中排名第 47 位。
This, of course, is worrisome to the people who run the state.
当然，这令国家治理者感到担忧。
And their diagnosis of the problem is actually kind of interesting.
他们对问题的诊断实际上很有趣。
They believe that young people aren't just leaving the state to get decent jobs elsewhere.
他们相信年轻人离开这个州不仅仅是为了在其他地方找到体面的工作。
They're leaving the state, they believe, because other places are just more interesting, more happening.
他们相信，他们离开这个州是因为其他地方更有趣、更有活力。
And so the Governor of Michigan, Jennifer Granholm, has decided to tackle a part of this problem the government has traditionally neglected.
因此，密歇根州州长詹妮弗·格兰霍姆决定解决政府历来忽视的部分问题。
She wants Michigan to be more cool.
她希望密歇根变得更酷。
And so she's launched what is called the Cool Cities Initiative, which offers grants to Saginaw and Ferndale and Romulus and other cities to quote, "create unique downtown developments where loft housing, art galleries, and technology startups can all share the same historic brick building." You get the idea.
因此，她发起了所谓的“酷城市计划”，向萨吉诺、芬代尔、罗穆卢斯和其他城市提供赠款，“创造独特的市中心开发项目，让阁楼住宅、艺术画廊和科技初创公司都可以共享同一栋历史悠久的砖砌建筑。”你明白了。
Yeah, I don't really think there's anything here for me.
是的，我真的不认为这里有什么适合我的。
I would love to move out of the state.
我很想搬出该州。
Nancy is one of the people who the governor is trying to reach with this program.
南希是州长试图通过该计划接触到的人之一。
She is 18 years old, a freshman at Lansing Community College.
她今年 18 岁，是兰辛社区学院的新生。
She says that when she and her friends talk about the Cool Cities Initiative, they just can't take it seriously.
她说，当她和朋友们谈论“酷城市计划”时，他们只是无法认真对待。
I don't understand how they say a deli and a cafe, an internet cafe or whatever, is going to make this town cool.
我不明白他们怎么说熟食店、咖啡馆、网吧或其他什么东西会让这个小镇变得很酷。
I mean, if this was coming from the youth, and they were knowing-- I wouldn't want to say the youth, because they're not necessarily youth.
我的意思是，如果这是来自年轻人，并且他们知道——我不想说年轻人，因为他们不一定是年轻人。
Is that what you all are calling yourselves these days, the youth?
你们现在就是这么称呼自己的吗，年轻人？
I always refer to myself as the youth, but--
我总是称自己为年轻人，但是——
I'm taking notes here.
我在这里做笔记。
Nancy I mean, really, I kind of almost feel embarrassed for the people putting this out there.
南希，我的意思是，真的，我几乎为那些把这个放在那里的人感到尴尬。
Well, one of the things that your governor says is that a big part of the initiative is getting broadband access everywhere.
好吧，你们的州长说的一件事是，该计划的很大一部分是让宽带接入无处不在。
Do you have--
你有没有——
[LAUGHS] I'm sorry, what?
[笑]对不起，什么？
Ira Glass That's just laughable to you, huh?
艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass）：这对你来说很可笑，是吧？
Why is that funny to you?
为什么你觉得这很有趣？
Nancy Why is it funny to me?
南希 为什么我觉得好笑？
I don't see how the internet's going to make-- I mean, the cities already have broadband internet access.
我不知道互联网将如何发展——我的意思是，城市已经有了宽带互联网接入。
And everybody has a computer in their house.
每个人家里都有一台电脑。
And everybody's-- what you need is all there.
每个人的——你所需要的都在那里。
I just don't see how broadband internet access is going to draw people in.
我只是不明白宽带互联网接入将如何吸引人们。
Do you personally already have broadband internet access?
您个人已经拥有宽带互联网接入吗？
Yes, at my house.
是的，在我家。
Ira Glass Hm.
艾拉·格拉斯 嗯。
And so that's not doing anything to keep you in the state, huh?
所以这并不能让你留在这个州，对吧？
No. Not in the least.
不，一点也不。
I mean, where can't you get it?
我的意思是，哪里买不到？
Let me just read to you a couple of sentences from your governor's state of the state address.
让我给你们读一下你们州长的州演讲中的几句话。
"So the fourth way we will grow the economy is by spurring strong regional economies anchored by cool cities.
“因此，我们发展经济的第四种方式是刺激以时尚城市为基础的强大区域经济。
We can have local commissions on cool.
我们可以在很酷的地方收取佣金。
Government can't create cool.
政府无法创造酷。
But we can and will target existing resources to support local efforts, to have vibrant cities." Do you find it disturbing to hear the governor say the word "cool" so many times?
但我们可以而且将会瞄准现有资源来支持当地的努力，建设充满活力的城市。”听到州长多次提到“酷”这个词，您是否感到不安？
I'm so glad you said that.
我很高兴你这么说。
Yeah.
是的。
Everything is dotted with cool and hip everywhere.
一切都处处点缀着酷炫和时尚。
They just seem so out of touch, almost.
他们看起来几乎完全脱节。
They're speaking about the youth like this different species of-- maybe we can be cool like them.
他们谈论的是像这种不同物种的年轻人——也许我们可以像他们一样酷。
It's like if you came home and your mom decided to redecorate your room so it was cool and hip.
就好像你回到家，你妈妈决定重新装修你的房间，让它变得又酷又时髦。
And she'll do what she thinks you'll like, but your mom doesn't have the same idea of what's cool and hip.
她会做她认为你会喜欢的事情，但你妈妈对于什么是酷又时髦的看法并不相同。
Which brings us to this story, about a town in Eastern Pennsylvania that was in such desperate straits that it took some very unusual measures.
这给我们带来了这个故事，讲述的是宾夕法尼亚州东部的一个小镇，它陷入了绝望的困境，以至于采取了一些非常不寻常的措施。
It didn't just try to bring in broadband internet access.
它不仅仅试图引入宽带互联网接入。
It did what ex-cons do, what aspiring starlets do, what immigrants do, what people in the witness protection program do.
它做了前科犯所做的事、有抱负的新星所做的事、移民所做的事、证人保护计划中的人所做的事。
It changed its name.
它改了名字。
It changed its name to the name of a person, a person who actually never set foot in the town.
它把名字改成了一个人的名字，一个实际上从未踏足小镇的人。
A man named Jim Thorpe.
一个名叫吉姆·索普的人。
One of our producers, Sarah Koenig, visited there recently.
我们的一位制片人 Sarah Koenig 最近访问了那里。
The name change happened 50 years ago.
更名发生在50年前。
But still, if you ask two people here, people who live just down the street from each other, what's the name of their hometown, you can end up in a discussion like this.
但是，如果你问这里的两个住在街上的人，他们的家乡叫什么名字，你可能会以这样的方式进行讨论。
You say to somebody, it's like, I go to meet somebody.
你对某人说，就像是，我去见某人。
I go up the Hazelton River.
我沿着黑泽尔顿河逆流而上。
Where are you from?
你来自哪里？
I'm from Chunk.
我来自春克。
Then they know you're no phony.
然后他们就知道你不是骗子。
And you?
你呢？
And you Craig?
克雷格你呢？
Thorper Oh, I'm from Jim Thorpe.
索珀 哦，我来自吉姆索普。
There's no doubt about it.
毫无疑问。
Born 1959--
1959年出生——
You work at the Jim Thorpe National Bank, for Christ's sake.
天哪，你在吉姆·索普国家银行工作。
But we were one of those places that went from Mauch Chunk National Bank to Jim Thorpe.
但我们是从莫赫琼克国家银行到吉姆索普的地方之一。
We changed our name in honor and respect.
为了荣誉和尊重，我们更名了。
Chunkers are Chunkers and Thorpers are Thorpers.
分块者是分块者，索普者是索普者。
This place had its heyday in the late 1800s, back when it was two towns, one name each, Mauch Chunk and East Mauch Chunk.
这个地方在 1800 年代末达到鼎盛时期，当时有两个城镇，各有一个名字：毛赫昌克 (Mauch Chunk) 和东毛赫昌克 (East Mauch Chunk)。
It got rich off coal, when people started hauling anthracite to market along the canal.
当人们开始沿着运河将无烟煤运往市场时，它就靠煤炭致富了。
They built a railroad, one of the first in America.
他们建造了一条铁路，这是美国第一条铁路。
And by the turn of the 20th century, it claimed to have more millionaires per capita than anywhere else in the country.
到了 20 世纪之交，这里的人均百万富翁人数比全国其他任何地方都多。
Thousands of tourists came here, and checked into one of the nation's biggest hotels, where five presidents stayed.
成千上万的游客来到这里，入住了美国最大的酒店之一，五位总统曾下榻于此。
You could probably get a good view over here.
在这里你也许可以看到很好的景色。
Bob Knappenberger, who's lived here all his life, took me on a tour.
鲍勃·纳彭伯格 (Bob Knappenberger) 一生都住在这里，他带我参观了一番。
We drove to the top of a big hill and looked down on the houses tucked neatly into the valley.
我们开车到了一座大山顶，俯视山谷中整齐排列的房屋。
Now that road coming down there off to your left, see, that's the Asa Packer Mansion.
现在，从你左边那条路下去，看，那就是阿萨·帕克大厦。
And so you were saying they called this the Switzerland--
所以你是说他们称之为瑞士——
Switzerland of America.
美国的瑞士。
If you look down here, you could see why they call it.
如果你往下看，你就会明白他们为什么这么称呼它。
And there was a big restaurant here, right here.
这里有一家大餐厅，就在这里。
You'd come up here and have dinner at night and sit out on the veranda.
晚上你会来这里吃晚饭，然后坐在阳台上。
The bear would be walking right there.
熊会在那里行走。
You'd throw some food out to him.
你会扔一些食物给他。
He tells me Tommy and Jimmy Dorsey got their start playing in the dance hall attached to the dining room.
他告诉我汤米和吉米·多西是在餐厅附属的舞厅里开始演奏的。
It's dilapidated now, the wooden ballroom kind of sagging.
现在已经很破旧了，木质的舞厅有些下垂。
After the Depression and World War II, the coal business started dying here, and a lot of people lost their jobs.
大萧条和第二次世界大战后，这里的煤炭业开始消亡，许多人失业。
And soon the biggest employer, the railroads, started closing too, until they didn't even stop in Mauch Chunk anymore.
很快，最大的雇主——铁路——也开始关闭，直到它们甚至不再在毛赫洪克停留。
People say by the early '50s, at 6:00 AM, you'd see all these cars driving away, taking people to work out of town.
人们说，到了 50 年代初，早上 6:00，你会看到所有这些汽车开走，载着人们去城外工作。
They'd go to Bethlehem to the steel mill, or to factories in Allentown.
他们会去伯利恒的钢铁厂，或者去阿伦敦的工厂。
And this is where a man named Joe Boyle comes in.
这就是一个名叫乔·博伊尔的人登场的时候。
Joe and his father owned the newspaper in town, the Mauch Chunk Times News.
乔和他的父亲拥有镇上的一份报纸《毛赫区块时报新闻》(Mauch Chunk Times News)。
Boyle died in 1992, but he still holds a kind of mythic status here as a tireless town booster who churned out scheme after scheme in the name of progress.
博伊尔于 1992 年去世，但他在这里仍然享有某种神话般的地位，他是一位不知疲倦的城镇推动者，以进步的名义制定了一个又一个计划。
He was ahead of his time.
他领先于他的时代。
He was just so onto the future, one of those very rare people.
他对未来充满信心，是非常罕见的人之一。
Joe could sell us on anything, because we loved that man, admired that man, and he would never lead us astray.
乔可以向我们推销任何东西，因为我们爱那个人，钦佩那个人，他永远不会让我们误入歧途。
Most people liked Joe, but he did have some pretty funny ideas.
大多数人都喜欢乔，但他确实有一些非常有趣的想法。
In 1950, Joe Boyle literally dreamed up a way to save the two towns, to bring in new industry.
1950 年，乔·博伊尔 (Joe Boyle) 梦想着一种拯救这两个城镇、引进新工业的方法。
He woke up at 3:00 AM, he told a reporter, with a crazy idea.
他告诉记者，他凌晨 3:00 就醒了，心里有一个疯狂的想法。
He would ask every man, woman, and child to contribute a nickel a week to a common fund for a period of seven years.
他要求每个男人、女人和儿童每周向共同基金捐献五分钱，为期七年。
That's how long he thought it would take to collect enough money for an industrial building.
他认为这就是筹集足够资金建造一座工业建筑所需的时间。
And then they'd get businessmen to fill it.
然后他们会让商人来填补它。
So people went around with buckets and collected nickels.
于是人们提着水桶到处收集镍币。
They even put a strip of tape along the main road and asked drivers coming into town to stick a nickel on the tape.
他们甚至在主干道上贴了一条胶带，并要求进城的司机在胶带上贴上一枚镍币。
The nickel a week fund started making money, and a story about it ran on the national AP wire, and then got picked up by TV.
每周五分钱的基金开始赚钱，有关它的故事在全国美联社网上播出，然后被电视报道。
It's at this point that the towns happened to cross paths with Jim Thorpe, or at least the body of Jim Thorpe.
就在这个时候，城镇碰巧遇到了吉姆·索普，或者至少是吉姆·索普的尸体。
He had died in 1953.
他于 1953 年去世。
Thorpe, like the Mauch Chunk towns, had been at the height of his glory almost 50 years earlier.
索普和毛赫昌克城镇一样，在大约 50 年前就已经达到了辉煌的顶峰。
He was a Sac and Fox Indian from Oklahoma who became a legendary sports figure.
他是来自俄克拉荷马州的萨克和福克斯印第安人，后来成为传奇的体育人物。
They made a movie about him, Jim Thorpe, All-American.
他们制作了一部关于他的电影，吉姆·索普，全美最佳球员。
Burt Lancaster stars.
伯特·兰卡斯特主演。
Pretty good, Jim.
很好，吉姆。
Very good for a first jump.
非常适合第一次跳跃。
Let's try it again.
让我们再试一次。
Watching Thorpe in succeeding weeks was like watching a magnificent young stallion, untamed and unbroken.
在接下来的几周里看着索普就像看着一匹雄伟的年轻种马，未经驯服，未受摧残。
The film tells how Thorpe won the pentathlon and decathlon in the 1912 Olympics, a feat that's never been repeated.
影片讲述了索普如何在 1912 年奥运会上赢得五项全能和十项全能冠军，这一壮举从未被重复。
And when it was over, the King of Sweden asked to meet Jim Thorpe, to pay personal tribute.
活动结束后，瑞典国王要求会见吉姆·索普，以表达个人敬意。
Sir, you are the greatest athlete in the world.
先生，您是世界上最伟大的运动员。
Thank you, Your Majesty.
谢谢您，陛下。
Sarah Koenig Thorpe was also a football Hall of Famer, a professional baseball player, and a champion in lacrosse, swimming, and skating.
莎拉·科尼格·索普还是橄榄球名人堂成员、职业棒球运动员以及长曲棍球、游泳和滑冰冠军。
He also played hockey, handball, and tennis, boxed, fished, sailed, shot golf, and bowled, and was a great dancer.
他还打曲棍球、手球、网球、拳击、钓鱼、航海、打高尔夫球和保龄球，而且还是一位出色的舞者。
Basically, there wasn't any physical thing he couldn't do.
基本上，没有什么身体上的事情是他做不到的。
But a lot of his life was tragic.
但他的人生很多时候都是悲惨的。
His Olympic medals were stripped from him in 1913, because he had played some baseball for a little money a few years earlier, and he never really got over it.
1913 年，他的奥运会奖牌被剥夺了，因为几年前他曾打过一些棒球，赚了一点钱，但他从未真正走出困境。
He lost a child to polio and drank a lot, fouling up his first two marriages.
他因小儿麻痹症失去了一个孩子，而且酗酒，毁掉了他的前两段婚姻。
And he couldn't seem to hang on to money.
而且他似乎无法保住金钱。
He ended up working sad kinds of jobs, emceeing dance contests, or playing bit parts in movies, or working as a laborer with a pick and shovel.
他最终从事了各种悲伤的工作，主持舞蹈比赛，或者在电影中扮演小角色，或者当一名拿着镐和铲子的工人。
He died in California in his house trailer of a heart attack.
他因心脏病发作在加利福尼亚州的自家拖车中去世。
He was 65.
他 65 岁了。
Patricia, his widow, tried to get his home state of Oklahoma to build a memorial to him.
他的遗孀帕特里夏试图让他的家乡俄克拉荷马州为他建造一座纪念碑。
But the governor eventually vetoed the idea.
但州长最终否决了这个想法。
So she came East looking for help and, by most accounts, money.
因此，她来到东部寻求帮助，而且大多数人认为是为了钱。
She was in Philadelphia when she saw a TV story about a plucky little town nearby that had amassed a small fortune in nickels.
当她在费城时，她看到一个电视故事，讲述的是附近一个勇敢的小镇积累了一笔五分钱的小财富。
Bob Knappenberger was working at the American Hotel at the time.
鲍勃·纳彭伯格当时在美国酒店工作。
Now, this lady had come in.
现在，这位女士进来了。
I'll never forget it.
我永远不会忘记它。
She had come in, and she had a poodle dog in each hand.
她进来了，手里各拿着一只贵宾犬。
And she said to me, young man-- that's exactly what she said.
她对我说，年轻人——这正是她所说的。
I was a young man then, I'm now 78.
那时我还是个年轻人，现在我已经78岁了。
She said, do you have a chamber of commerce?
她说，你们有商会吗？
I says, no we don't.
我说，不，我们不。
But the secretary of our borough is right across the street.
但我们区的秘书就在街对面。
The Acme store used to be right across the street which is now Anne's Early Attic.
Acme 商店曾经位于街对面，现在是 Anne's Early Attic。
Everything used to congregate around the American Hotel there.
一切过去都聚集在美国酒店周围。
Within a few hours, talk was around that it was Mrs. Thorpe here.
几个小时之内，人们就开始议论说是索普夫人来了。
As soon as she got to town, Patricia Thorpe hooked up with newspaperman Joe Boyle.
帕特里夏·索普一到镇上就和新闻记者乔·博伊尔联系上了。
And this was her pitch.
这就是她的推销。
The town would pay her for the right to bury her famous husband, build him a memorial, and change its name to Jim Thorpe, PA.
该镇将向她支付埋葬她著名丈夫的权利，为他建造一座纪念碑，并将其更名为宾夕法尼亚州吉姆·索普。
In exchange, she said, the town would cash in on his name and Mrs. Thorpe's connections.
她说，作为交换，该镇将利用他的名字和索普夫人的关系赚钱。
The head of the NFL was a friend of her husband's.
NFL 的负责人是她丈夫的朋友。
They would set up a national charity foundation in Thorpe's name that she said would raise money for a $10 million heart and cancer research hospital that would be built in town.
他们将以索普的名义成立一个国家慈善基金会，她说该基金会将为在镇上建造一所价值 1000 万美元的心脏病和癌症研究医院筹集资金。
There was talk of establishing the NFL Hall of Fame there, maybe a sporting goods manufacturer, maybe even a motel called Jim Thorpe's Tepees.
有人讨论要在那里建立 NFL 名人堂，也许是一家体育用品制造商，甚至可能是一家名为吉姆·索普圆锥形帐篷的汽车旅馆。
Tourists were sure to come, just like in the old days.
游客们肯定会来，就像以前一样。
Boyle initially thought the idea was preposterous, he said.
博伊尔最初认为这个想法很荒谬，他说。
But it grew on him, as a way for the two towns to unite under this new name.
但他越来越喜欢这个名字，因为这是两个城镇以这个新名字联合起来的一种方式。
He started running stories about it in the newspaper almost every day.
他几乎每天都在报纸上刊登有关此事的报道。
He even printed an architectural sketch of the hospital.
他甚至打印了医院的建筑草图。
The notion started to catch on that the very existence of the towns was at stake.
城镇的生存受到威胁的观念开始流行起来。
On May 17, 1954, a day before the town voted on the name change, Boyle wrote in his column, "the voters will decide whether or not the twin communities will merge and be known as Jim Thorpe, Pennsylvania, or drop into complete oblivion." Again, Bob Knappenberger.
1954 年 5 月 17 日，即该镇对更名进行投票的前一天，博伊尔在他的专栏中写道，“选民将决定这两个社区是合并并更名为宾夕法尼亚州吉姆·索普，还是彻底被遗忘。”又是鲍勃·纳彭伯格。
And were there people who didn't want them joined?
还有人不希望他们加入吗？
The older ones.
年纪大的。
The older ones were, "oh!" But it passed 10 to 1.
年长的人“哦！”但比分是10比1。
And I'll never forget the night of the general election.
我永远不会忘记大选之夜。
I sent a telegram to, well, I don't know how many major newspapers.
我给,呃,我不知道有多少家主要报纸发了一份电报。
That night, I said on the teletype, I said, Mauch Chunk, Pennsylvania is now Jim Thorpe.
那天晚上，我在电传打字机上说，我说，宾夕法尼亚州的莫奇·查克现在是吉姆·索普。
I'll never forget it.
我永远不会忘记它。
Yeah.
是的。
I thought it was great.
我觉得这太棒了。
Believe me, I did.
相信我，我做到了。
I thought it was great.
我觉得这太棒了。
So the body of Jim Thorpe was finally buried.
于是吉姆·索普的尸体终于被埋葬了。
Using $10,000, or 200,000 nickels, they built a red marble mausoleum the size of a large bathtub.
他们用 10,000 美元，即 200,000 镍币，建造了一座大浴缸大小的红色大理石陵墓。
There are carvings of Thorpe throwing a discus and jumping a hurdle, and the words, "sir, you are the greatest athlete in the world." It sits just off the roadside on the outskirts of town.
那里有索普掷铁饼和跨栏的雕刻，还有这样一句话：“先生，您是世界上最伟大的运动员。”它坐落在城镇郊区的路边。
Eydie Lukasavige, a member of the town council, was about 20 at the time.
Eydie Lukasavige 是镇议会成员，当时大约 20 岁。
And she remembers how hopeful everybody was.
她记得每个人都充满希望。
Are you kidding?
你在开玩笑吗？
We thought it was the greatest thing since the coming of-- you know what.
我们认为这是自从——你知道吗——以来最伟大的事情。
It was wonderful.
太棒了。
It was going to do something for the community.
它将为社区做一些事情。
It was going to put us on the map.
它将使我们出现在地图上。
And it just never happened.
但这从未发生过。
And people just stopped talking about it.
人们就不再谈论它了。
But when you bring all this up, they'll say, yeah, remember?
但当你提起这一切时，他们会说，是的，还记得吗？
We were promised this, and we were promised that.
我们被许诺了这个，我们也被许诺了那个。
And what did we get?
我们得到了什么？
We got nothing.
我们什么也没得到。
Nothing.
什么也没有。
Not one new building, not one new business.
不是一栋新建筑，不是一项新业务。
And the Football Hall of Fame?
那么足球名人堂呢？
It went to Canton, Ohio, where it has gotten more than 7 million tourists since it opened in 1963.
它的目的地是俄亥俄州坎顿市，自 1963 年开业以来，已接待了超过 700 万游客。
Some people blame Mrs. Thorpe.
有些人责怪索普夫人。
Other people blame Bert Bell, or the lack of him.
其他人则责怪伯特·贝尔，或者责怪他的缺席。
He was the head of the NFL, and the Chairman of the Jim Thorpe Foundation.
他是 NFL 的负责人，也是吉姆·索普基金会的主席。
And the day he was supposed to go on national television to kick off the fundraising campaign, he was at a Philadelphia Eagles game, and he collapsed and died right on the field.
就在他本应在国家电视台上启动筹款活动的那天，他正在观看费城老鹰队的比赛，他倒在了球场上并死亡。
And that was it.
就是这样。
Nobody took up the cause after that.
此后无人再追究此事。
And people started to get mad.
人们开始生气。
Ray Hills remembers bringing his boy scout troop to town around that time.
雷·希尔斯记得当时他带着他的童子军来到了镇上。
During the course of the weekend, we went down to look at Jim Thorpe's memorial.
周末期间，我们去参观了吉姆·索普的纪念碑。
And I talked to scout troops, because I thought it would be pretty good for the scouts to see.
我和侦察兵部队交谈过，因为我认为这对侦察兵来说是非常好的。
And it was like demolished and had graffiti all over the monument.
而且纪念碑就像被拆毁了一样，到处都是涂鸦。
The marble, you mean, part?
你是说大理石的一部分？
Ray Hills Somebody had come down there with sledgehammers and gave it a work over.
雷希尔斯 有人拿着大锤来到那里，重新检查了一下。
Because all they said they ever had was a dead Indian.
因为他们说他们拥有的只是一个死去的印第安人。
They never got anything from Jim Thorpe's wife, when she said she was going to dedicate a hospital or a library, something of that sort in town.
当吉姆·索普的妻子说她要在镇上捐献一座医院或一座图书馆之类的东西时，他们从未从她那里得到任何东西。
And they never got it, but a dead Indian.
他们从来没有得到过，但得到的是死去的印第安人。
A faction of older residents were so embittered, they started a movement to change the name back to Mauch Chunk.
一群老年居民非常愤怒，他们发起了一场运动，将名字改回毛奇·洪克(Mauch Chunk)。
In 1964, 10 years after the first switch, the town put it to the voters again.
1964 年，也就是第一次转变 10 年后，该镇再次将其交给选民。
They decided to remain Jim Thorpe, but the tally was much, much closer.
他们决定保留吉姆·索普，但结果更加接近。
Things eventually settled down, but the economy kept sliding.
事情最终稳定下来，但经济却持续下滑。
By the 1970s, the beautiful downtown buildings began to fall apart, and shop windows were mostly empty.
到了 20 世纪 70 年代，美丽的市中心建筑开始倒塌，商店橱窗大多空无一人。
Then Thorpe's children hired a lawyer in an effort to disinter his body and bury him in the family plot near Shawnee in Oklahoma, but nothing ever came of that either.
然后索普的孩子们聘请了一名律师，试图挖掘他的尸体并将他埋葬在俄克拉荷马州肖尼附近的家庭土地上，但也没有任何结果。
In a scheme designed-- Sarah Koenig Today, the video for sale in the Mauch Chunk museum refers to the town's name change in a tone that, for a local historical video, seems oddly hostile.
在《Sarah Koenig Today》的一项设计方案中，毛赫昌克博物馆出售的视频提到了该镇的更名，其语气对于当地的历史视频来说似乎充满了奇怪的敌意。
In return, Mrs. Thorpe promised the balance of her husband's estate to build a $10 million, 400-bed hospital.
作为回报，索普夫人承诺用她丈夫的遗产余额建造一所耗资 1000 万美元、拥有 400 个床位的医院。
While this bizarre exchange received nationwide headlines, it did little to change the town.
虽然这次奇怪的交流成为全国头条新闻，但它并没有给这座小镇带来任何改变。
Only controversy resulted from the name change, controversy which haunts the town to this day.
唯一的争议是由更名引起的，直到今天，争议仍然困扰着这个小镇。
I guess maybe we were living in a dream world.
我想也许我们生活在梦想的世界里。
I guess maybe our families were living in a dream world.
我想也许我们的家人生活在一个梦想的世界里。
Eydie Lukasavige, like a lot of people you meet here, thinks the town did right by Jim Thorpe.
艾迪·卢卡萨维格（Eydie Lukasavige）和您在这里遇到的许多人一样，认为吉姆·索普（Jim Thorpe）为这座小镇做的事情是正确的。
But she also thinks the whole scheme was half-baked to begin with.
但她也认为整个计划从一开始就是不成熟的。
Can you imagine that kind of campaign happening now, and people going--
你能想象现在发生这样的活动，人们会——
Never.
从来没有。
Never.
从来没有。
It could never happen now.
现在这永远不可能发生了。
Why?
为什么？
Eydie Lukasavige It could never happen now because I think we're all a little smarter.
Eydie Lukasavige 现在这种情况永远不会发生，因为我认为我们都变得更聪明了。
I don't think we're as gullible as people may have been back then.
我不认为我们像当时的人们那样容易上当受骗。
I think we would do a lot more checking into it to make sure that this is for real.
我认为我们会做更多检查以确保这是真实的。
It's like my getting a letter today telling me that I won $670,000.
就像我今天收到一封信，告诉我我赢得了 670,000 美元。
You know, maybe back in the '50s I might have been gullible enough to believe it, but I wouldn't believe it today.
你知道，也许在 50 年代我可能会很容易相信这一点，但今天我不会相信。
No, I don't think you could sell a bill of goods like that today.
不，我认为你今天不能出售这样的货物清单。
But my children were all very happy with the name of Jim Thorpe.
但我的孩子们都对吉姆·索普这个名字感到非常高兴。
When I'd say to them, oh, I don't know why we give up the name of Mauch Chunk, they'd say, what's the matter with you?
当我对他们说，哦，我不知道为什么我们放弃 Mauch Chunk 这个名字时，他们会说，你怎么了？
Jim Thorpe's a great name.
吉姆·索普是一个伟大的名字。
Well, sure, it's a great name.
嗯，当然，这是一个很棒的名字。
But I couldn't see Lansford changing their name, or Nesquehoning or Coaldale.
但我不认为兰斯福德会改变他们的名字，或者内斯奎霍宁或科尔代尔。
None of those coal mining towns would ever change the names of their towns for nothing.
那些煤矿镇都不会无缘无故地更名。
For nothing.
毫无意义。
You know, you've got to be proud of what you have and work with what you have.
你知道，你必须为你所拥有的感到自豪，并利用你所拥有的去努力。
In the last few years, the town has been doing much better.
近几年来，该镇的情况明显好转。
Jim Thorpe now survives on tourists who come not to see the mausoleum, but to go hiking and whitewater rafting and look at the restored downtown and go to all the nice shops.
吉姆·索普现在靠游客生存，这些游客不是来参观陵墓的，而是去徒步旅行和漂流，看看修复后的市中心并去所有漂亮的商店。
And maybe all of that's possible exactly because Joe Boyle's plan failed and no industry ever came here to spoil the river and surrounding hills.
也许这一切之所以成为可能，正是因为乔·博伊尔的计划失败了，而且没有任何工业来到这里破坏河流和周围的山丘。
Because 50 years after the name change, Jim Thorpe still looks exactly like Mauch Chunk.
因为改名 50 年后，吉姆·索普 (Jim Thorpe) 看起来仍然和莫奇·查克 (Mauch Chunk) 一模一样。
Sarah Koenig is one of the producers of our show.
莎拉·科尼格是我们节目的制片人之一。
[MUSIC - "ISTANBUL (NOT CONSTANTINOPLE)" BY THEY MIGHT BE GIANTS]
[音乐 - “伊斯坦布尔（不是君士坦丁堡）”，他们可能是巨人]
Coming up, an engineer's brain and a broken heart.
接下来，是工程师的大脑和破碎的心。
That's in a minute from Chicago Public Radio and Public Radio International when our program continues.
一分钟后，芝加哥公共广播电台和国际公共广播电台将继续我们的节目。
It's This American Life .
这就是美国生活。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Each week on our program, of course, we choose some theme, bring you a variety of different kinds of stories on that theme.
当然，每周我们的节目都会选择一些主题，为您带来关于该主题的各种不同类型的故事。
Today's show, Desperate Measures, stories of people in impossible situations trying to invent their way out of them.
今天的节目《孤注一掷》讲述了人们在绝境中试图发明出路摆脱困境的故事。
In this, the second half of our show, we have two stories.
在我们节目的后半部分，我们有两个故事。
And I'm not sure if both of these guys are full-time engineers, but they're certainly engineer types, guys who take stuff apart and think it through.
我不确定这两个人是否都是全职工程师，但他们肯定是工程师类型，他们会把东西拆开并仔细思考。
We have now arrived at Act Three of our show.
现在我们已经到了节目的第三幕了。
Act Three, The Router Not Taken.
第三幕，路由器未被占领。
My name is Dave and I put a listing on eBay called Ryobi Router Table, Worthless Junk, No Reserve.
我叫 Dave，我在 eBay 上列出了一个名为 Ryobi Router Table、Worthless Junk、No Reserve 的列表。
Now this story of American ingenuity.
现在这个故事讲述了美国人的聪明才智。
Dave and his wife were expecting a baby.
戴夫和他的妻子正在怀孕。
And he decided to build a crib for the baby.
他决定为婴儿建造一张婴儿床。
So he went to Home Depot, and he bought this machine that would help him do the job.
所以他去了家得宝，买了这台机器来帮助他完成这项工作。
The cheapest model that he could find, since really he had no idea when he would ever want to use the thing again.
他能找到的最便宜的型号，因为他真的不知道什么时候才能再次使用这个东西。
This item is a router table.
这个项目是一个路由器表。
And it essentially is a support for a router.
它本质上是对路由器的支持。
And what this item does is it will take a piece of wood and put a decorative edge on the piece of the wood.
这个项目的作用是，它会取一块木头，并在这块木头上放置一个装饰边缘。
And basically, it just guides you as you're cutting the piece of wood, right?
基本上，它只是在您切割木头时引导您，对吗？
Right.
对。
The table guides you or the wood, depending on what you're trying to do.
桌子引导你或木头，这取决于你想要做什么。
And the router itself, which mounts to the bottom of the table, actually does the work.
安装在桌子底部的路由器本身实际上可以完成这项工作。
So the table's used more for precision-type work.
所以该工作台更多地用于精密型工作。
If you're making pieces that mate together, then you'd want to use the table to make sure that you got everything perfect.
如果您要制作可以配合在一起的部件，那么您需要使用该桌子来确保一切都很完美。
And so that's what it's supposed to do.
这就是它应该做的。
What did this one do?
这个人做了什么？
This one didn't do pretty much anything right.
这个人几乎没有做任何正确的事情。
Basically the table was falling apart, and it caused me a lot of quality problems, I guess, with my work.
基本上桌子已经散架了，我想这给我的工作带来了很多质量问题。
And also, it was pretty much a safety nightmare as well.
而且，这几乎也是一场安全噩梦。
I've got this router bit spinning at 15,000 RPM, and my finger is three inches away from it.
我的路由器钻头以 15,000 RPM 的速度旋转，而我的手指距离它只有三英寸。
And all of a sudden, it decides to move.
突然间，它决定移动。
Because the legs were falling off, I had to wedge it against the wall and jam my knee underneath it and hold it with one hand against the wall, and my knee and the other hand, I was trying to guide the wood.
因为腿要掉下来了，我不得不把它楔在墙上，把膝盖塞在它下面，用一只手靠在墙上，用我的膝盖和另一只手，我试图引导木头。
It wasn't real safe, but I do still have all 10 of my fingers.
虽然不太安全，但我的 10 根手指仍然完好无损。
So you came up with a totally ingenious solution for what to do this.
所以你想出了一个完全巧妙的解决方案来做到这一点。
You basically decided to sell it on eBay.
您基本上决定在 eBay 上出售它。
Can I ask you to read from your listing that was posted on eBay?
我可以请您阅读 eBay 上发布的列表吗？
Sure.
当然。
"This Ryobi router table was the worst thing I've ever spent money on.
“这款 Ryobi 路由器桌是我买过的最糟糕的东西。
Period.
时期。
I've wasted money on a lot of things in my life, women, cars, lots of other things I didn't need.
我在生活中的很多东西上浪费了钱，女人，汽车，还有很多其他我不需要的东西。
You name it.
你说出它的名字。
But I never felt like I totally 100% wasted my money on something until I bought this table.
但在我买了这张桌子之前，我从来没有觉得我在某件事上完全100%浪费了我的钱。
This is the most worthless piece of crap I've ever had the displeasure of working with in my life."
这是我一生中遇到过的最不值钱的垃圾。”
What I love about this is just how completely categorical it is.
我喜欢它的原因在于它的绝对性。
Well, it's kind of an anti-description.
嗯，这是一种反描述。
Most of your descriptions try to tell you how good something is on eBay.
您的大部分描述都试图告诉您 eBay 上的商品有多好。
And then this one I just decided to go the totally opposite way and explain how bad it was.
然后这个我决定采取完全相反的方式并解释它有多么糟糕。
I'm going to ask you to read some of the next paragraph.
我将请您阅读下一段的一些内容。
OK.
好的。
"It comes complete with most of the crappy accessories it came with.
“它配备了大部分附带的蹩脚配件。
An example is the plastic pusher mitre thingy that's so sloppy that I don't understand why they even bothered making it adjustable.
一个例子是塑料推杆斜接装置，它太草率了，我不明白为什么他们还要费心让它可调节。
It's really nice when you're trying to route something at an angle and it slips in the middle of the cut and jerks the work piece right out of your hands and flings it across the room.
当你试图以一定角度对某物进行布线时，它会在切割中间滑动，将工件从你手中猛地甩开，然后将其扔到房间的另一边，这真是太好了。
Or the super anti-precision fence that's almost impossible to adjust and keep in place.
或者是几乎不可能调整和保持到位的超级反精确围栏。
Or the slippery painted surface that wears off, exposing the rough surface that mars the work piece as you slide it over.
或者光滑的油漆表面磨损，暴露出粗糙的表面，当您将工件滑过时会损坏工件。
It does come with a power switch that always worked.
它确实配备了一个始终有效的电源开关。
I'll give it that.
我会给它。
It has a really nice power switch.
它有一个非常好的电源开关。
Some of the other small items got destroyed in a fit of rage one day after fighting it for a couple of hours."
其他一些小物品在与它战斗了几个小时后的一天，在愤怒中被毁掉了。”
Then you go on and you say that the best part of it is that it is a three-legged router table.
然后你继续说它最好的部分是它是一个三腿路由器桌。
Right, right.
对，对。
Well, it became a three-legged after I was trying to route something one day and I noticed that the table was moving.
好吧，有一天，当我试图给某样东西布线时，我注意到桌子在移动，它就变成了三足。
Then well after a few more pieces, I'm in the middle of a cut and the leg just fell off.
然后又做了几块之后，我正处于割伤的中间，腿就掉下来了。
So I had to stop to keep from losing any fingers and I tried to beat the plastic inserts back in.
所以我不得不停下来，以免失去手指，并试图将塑料嵌件敲回去。
When I took the picture, I had the table supported by a beer bottle to keep it from falling over.
拍照时，我用啤酒瓶支撑桌子，防止桌子倒塌。
"This table comes with no warranty from me.
“这张桌子没有我的保证。
I never bothered to try to take it back, even though it was under warranty.
我从来没有费心去尝试把它拿回来，即使它在保修期内。
I was so ticked off that I knew I'd create a scene when I threw it through the front window of Home Depot."
我非常生气，当我把它扔进家得宝的前窗时，我知道我会创造一个场景。”
And then you go on and you explain how to ship it and blah-blah-blah-blah-blah.
然后你继续解释如何运送它，等等等等。
And so it seems like it was the listing when you first sent it out.
所以看起来这就是您第一次发出时的列表。
And then people started writing you.
然后人们开始给你写信。
What kinds of emails were you getting?
您收到了哪些类型的电子邮件？
I was getting all sorts of emails.
我收到了各种各样的电子邮件。
I think to date I've got close to 1,000 emails on this.
我想迄今为止我已经收到了近 1,000 封有关此问题的电子邮件。
But the first ones that came in, I got a lot of requests to shoot it or set it on fire, or make a video of some sort of destruction of the table.
但在第一批进来的时候，我收到了很多要求拍摄它或放火烧它，或者制作一段破坏桌子的视频。
Right.
对。
And why don't you read the addendum that you added in mid-March based on this emails.
您为什么不阅读您在三月中旬根据此电子邮件添加的附录呢？
OK.
好的。
"I received some emails.
“我收到了一些电子邮件。
And yes, I am willing to set it on fire, shoot it full of holes, et cetera, and mail a picture/video to you.
是的，我愿意放火烧它，把它打得满是洞，等等，然后将图片/视频邮寄给你。
If the bid gets high enough to cover my costs, I'll be willing to shoot it full of holes with your choice of the following-- 12-gauge slugs, 00 buck, or a 40-round mag from an AK.
如果出价足够高，足以支付我的成本，我愿意用您选择的以下选项将它打得满是洞：12 号子弹、00 美元或 AK 的 40 发弹匣。
Then I can make a pile of the remains, douse it in gasoline, and light it on fire.
然后我可以把残骸堆成一堆，浇上汽油，然后点燃。
The winning bidder would get pics if they so choose.
如果中标者愿意的话，他们将获得照片。
I could even ship you the charred remains if you like.
如果你愿意的话我什至可以把烧焦的遗骸寄给你。
Hey man, I just hate it.
嘿伙计，我只是讨厌它。
Let me know.
让我知道。
Whatever trips your trigger."
无论什么触发你的扳机。”
And then the next day, apparently in response to other emails, you add the following.
然后第二天，显然是为了回复其他电子邮件，您添加了以下内容。
"Yes, I can drive over it with something.
“是的，我可以用东西开车过去。
I can drive over it with a Massey Ferguson 620-cubic-inch diesel-powered tractor." At this time I only had one bid.
我可以用一辆麦赛福格森 620 立方英寸柴油拖拉机开过去。”此时我只有一个出价。
It was for a penny.
这是为了一分钱。
So I wrote, "again, for Chrissakes, the next bid's $0.02.
所以我写道：“再一次，老天啊，下一个出价是 0.02 美元。
I'm willing to do all this crap for a penny, so the video's got to be worth $5.
我愿意为了一分钱做所有这些废话，所以这个视频必须值 5 美元。
Bid and tell me what you want."
出价并告诉我你想要什么。”
And then the next day, apparently, people are writing you about the bottle.
显然，第二天，人们就写信给你谈论这瓶酒。
So you had to make this addendum.
所以你必须做这个附录。
"For those who are interested, the bottle does carry a $0.10 Michigan deposit, and it's pre-printed for the other standard deposits for other states, which is $0.05.
“对于那些感兴趣的人来说，这瓶酒确实带有密歇根州 0.10 美元的押金，而且还为其他州的其他标准押金预先印好了，即 0.05 美元。
So yeah, it's like a huge bonus, worth hundreds of times what the table is worth."
所以，是的，这就像一笔巨额奖金，价值是桌子价值的数百倍。”
At the time the auction ended, I had about 40,000 views.
拍卖结束时，我的浏览量约为 40,000 次。
And it kept going around.
而且它一直在流传。
I noticed it was up on some message boards on the internet.
我注意到它出现在互联网上的一些留言板上。
As of this morning, I had, I think, 202,000 views.
截至今天早上，我认为已有 202,000 次浏览。
So you have fans.
所以你有粉丝。
Dave Yeah, I've got quite a bit of fan mail.
戴夫：是的，我收到了很多粉丝的来信。
I haven't got any hate mail so far, so that's good.
到目前为止我还没有收到任何仇恨邮件，所以这很好。
But I've had four or five marriage proposals.
但我已经有四五次求婚了。
I hope they're not serious, but--
我希望他们不是认真的，但是——
Wait.
等等。
Are you-- what did they say in the marriage proposals?
你——他们在求婚中说了什么？
It's just kind of really odd.
这真的有点奇怪。
They just said, well, you sound funny, and wow, I want to marry you, and I want to meet you, and so on.
他们只是说，好吧，你听起来很有趣，哇，我想嫁给你，我想见见你，等等。
But I'm married, and happily married, and I have a son.
但我已经结婚了，而且婚姻幸福，还有一个儿子。
So I guess I wasn't real interested in those.
所以我想我对这些并不真正感兴趣。
I'm not so sure I'd be interested otherwise anyway.
无论如何，我不太确定我是否会感兴趣。
So who bought the thing.
那么谁买了这个东西。
Dave Well, a guy bought it.
戴夫 好吧，一个人买了它。
And I didn't hear anything from him for a couple of days.
而且我已经好几天没有收到他的任何消息了。
So I emailed him, and he just responded that he didn't really want the table.
所以我给他发了电子邮件，他只是回复说他并不真正想要这张桌子。
He kind of got caught up in bidding on it.
他有点陷入了竞标之中。
So he just paid me for the table, and that was the end of that.
所以他只是付了我一张桌子的钱，事情就这样结束了。
Wait, wait, wait.
等等，等等，等等。
He didn't want it?
他不想要吗？
He just got caught up in the excitement?
他刚刚还沉浸在兴奋之中吗？
Well, there are a lot of other fictitious or false auctions on eBay.
嗯，eBay 上还有很多其他虚构或虚假的拍卖。
A lot of people will then bid up these things, and nobody's actually serious about completing the transaction, but it's just kind of understood that the transaction's not going to be completed.
然后很多人会竞价这些东西，没有人真正认真地想要完成交易，但人们只是理解交易不会完成。
It's just for entertainment value.
这只是为了娱乐价值。
So he assumed that this was that.
所以他认为就是这样。
And I told him I wasn't really concerned about getting the money.
我告诉他我并不真正关心拿到钱。
But he wanted to pay me for it anyway, because he did win, and he wanted to make sure he got his positive feedback out of the deal.
但无论如何，他想付钱给我，因为他确实赢了，而且他想确保他从这笔交易中得到积极的反馈。
He didn't want you ruining his reputation.
他不想让你毁了他的名声。
I guess.
我猜。
He had a pretty good reputation, just like mine.
他和我一样享有很高的声誉。
So feedback's everything on eBay.
因此，在 eBay 上，反馈就是一切。
Wow.
哇。
I can't believe you actually made money.
我不敢相信你真的赚钱了。
Well, the interesting thing is somebody also Paypaled me $11 to buy myself a six pack of beer because they got so much entertainment out of reading the auction.
有趣的是，有人还付了 11 美元给我，让我给自己买六瓶啤酒，因为他们从阅读拍卖中得到了很多乐趣。
So I've actually made more money than what I sold it for.
所以我实际上赚的钱比我卖的钱还要多。
Dave lives in Ann Arbor.
戴夫住在安娜堡。
He did finish the crib, barely.
他确实勉强完成了婴儿床。
The price he got for his routing table, $26.22.
他的路由表价格为 26.22 美元。
Act Four, The Rocks at Rock Bottom.
第四幕，谷底的岩石。
Well, this is the story of a man who hit rock bottom when he was actually surrounded by a whole lot of rocks, so it's kind of a double rock bottom situation, if you know what I mean.
嗯，这是一个关于一个人跌入谷底的故事，当时他实际上被一大堆岩石包围，所以这是一种双重谷底的情况，如果你明白我的意思的话。
He was living in a small village in Spain at the time, in this kind of formally volcanic area where the mountains meet the sea.
当时他住在西班牙的一个小村庄里，在这个山与海交汇的正式火山地区。
And so on the coast right there, instead of sand, the beaches are made up of slate and of stones.
因此，在海岸上，海滩不是沙子，而是由板岩和石头组成。
Hillary Frank tells the story.
希拉里·弗兰克讲述了这个故事。
Jerry and his wife had split up and he moved to this little village, leaving everything behind, his young son, his home.
杰瑞和他的妻子分手了，他搬到了这个小村庄，留下了一切，他的小儿子，他的家。
He was about as low as he'd ever been.
他的地位几乎是从前最低的。
Thoughts were running around in my head and wouldn't stop.
各种念头在我的脑海里转来转去，根本停不下来。
It was like a broken record.
这就像一张破纪录。
And when I lay down at night and tried to sleep, sometimes the most absolutely ridiculous little thing would be running around in my head and I couldn't divert my attention away from it.
当我晚上躺下并试图入睡时，有时最荒谬的小事会在我的脑海中跑来跑去，而我无法将注意力从它身上移开。
And I found that walking on the beach, hunched over a little bit, looking for flat rocks, picking up a handful, throwing them in the ocean, and the fact of throwing very hard as well, this relaxed me a great deal.
我发现在海滩上行走，稍微弯腰，寻找平坦的岩石，抓起一把，把它们扔进海里，而且扔得非常用力，这让我放松了很多。
Jerry started skipping rocks at the beach five or six times a day for at least a half an hour at a time.
杰瑞开始每天在海滩上跳五六次石头，每次至少半小时。
The bay at this beach was shaped like a U.
这个海滩的海湾呈U形。
Jerry worked on one side of the U and lived on the other.
杰瑞在大学的一侧工作，在另一侧生活。
He had to walk along the shore to get home, and on his way, he'd stop to skip stones.
他必须沿着海岸步行回家，途中他会停下来跳过石头。
Over time, he began walking less and skipping more.
随着时间的推移，他开始减少步行次数，增加跳绳次数。
And one night-- it was during the tourist season, which means that this little bitty village fills up with tourists from all over the world.
有一天晚上，正值旅游旺季，这意味着这个小村庄挤满了来自世界各地的游客。
And right at sundown, it was just gorgeous weather and the bay itself was like glass.
日落时分，天气非常好，海湾本身就像玻璃一样。
And I stopped at the base of the U, which is downtown, so to speak, where the main plaza is.
我在 U 形的底部停了下来，可以说，这里是市中心，主要广场就在那里。
And I was in my own little private world of walking and skipping and the stones just were flying.
我在自己的小私人世界里行走和跳跃，石头在飞舞。
I mean, it was an extraordinary night.
我的意思是，这是一个非凡的夜晚。
I had no peripheral vision at all.
我根本没有余光。
No sound occurred to me.
我没有想到任何声音。
And all of a sudden, the stones were flying out to where the boats were moored.
突然，石块飞向停泊船只的地方。
In fact, I'm talking 120 meters, a long way out there, and it actually hit a couple hulls and all that.
事实上，我说的是 120 米，距离很远，而且它实际上击中了几艘船体等等。
And it just surprised the heck out of me.
这让我大吃一惊。
And at one particular point, a stone just flew and bounced and bounced and bounced and bounced and kept bouncing and kept bouncing and kept bouncing and I'm standing there agape.
在某个特定的时刻，一块石头飞了起来，弹跳，弹跳，弹跳，弹跳，一直弹跳，一直弹跳，一直弹跳，我目瞪口呆地站在那里。
And all of a sudden, when it quit and just sank, there was just this spontaneous burst of cheers and applause, which absolutely startled me.
突然间，当它停止沉没时，突然爆发出一阵自发的欢呼声和掌声，这绝对让我大吃一惊。
And it was like somebody slapped me on the shoulder in a dark room or something.
就像有人在黑暗的房间里拍了拍我的肩膀一样。
I turned around and there must have been 2 or 3 or 400 people about 60, 80 feet behind me in a great big crescent.
我转过身来，一定有 2、3 或 400 个人在我身后大约 60、80 英尺处，形成一个巨大的新月形。
No. No No, not at all.
不，不，不，一点也不。
I didn't have a clue.
我没有任何线索。
Did you turn around and take a bow or something?
你有没有转身鞠躬什么的？
No. No!
不，不！
I was embarrassed.
我很尴尬。
No, I just slinked off down the beach and got out of the way.
不，我只是偷偷溜进海滩，然后躲开。
It was like, whoa.
就像，哇。
Because it was like a very private moment that all of sudden you realize that hi, we're Candid Camera.
因为这就像一个非常私密的时刻，你突然意识到，嗨，我们是 Candid Camera。
So I sort of stumbled down the beach to-- there was a cafe outside.
所以我跌跌撞撞地沿着海滩走到——外面有一家咖啡馆。
And I sat down at one of the tables and ordered a Coke or whatever and realized that I was shaking so bad that I couldn't hold my drink still.
我在其中一张桌子旁坐下，点了一杯可乐或其他什么东西，然后意识到我浑身颤抖得厉害，根本无法保持饮料不动。
Well then I couldn't go anywhere in the village after that because every night I walked and every night I skipped.
好吧，从那以后我就不能去村里的任何地方了，因为每天晚上我都走路，每天晚上我都跳绳。
But I couldn't find a place where I could skip that nobody could see it.
但我找不到一个可以跳过、没人能看到的地方。
Why was it important to you to try and find a private place?
为什么尝试寻找一个私人场所对您来说很重要？
Well because-- I don't know.
嗯，因为——我不知道。
I guess I'm very shy.
我想我很害羞。
And I'm-- that's a good question.
我——这是一个很好的问题。
I suppose that coming out of a depression and sort of a funk in one's life is sort of a private thing.
我想从生活中的抑郁和恐惧中走出来是一件很私人的事情。
I mean we all tend to sort of brush that off, don't we, and put on a smiley face with everyone.
我的意思是，我们都倾向于忽视这一点，不是吗，并对每个人都露出笑脸。
And it was just at this point in my life things weren't OK.
就在我人生的这个阶段，事情并不顺利。
They weren't going well.
他们进展不顺利。
And what was going well, I enjoyed to do, and I enjoyed to do it privately.
进展顺利的事情，我喜欢做，而且我喜欢私下做。
And that was throw rocks at the water.
那就是向水中扔石头。
And I didn't want to share my pain in other words.
换句话说，我不想分享我的痛苦。
And so then I had to make some conscious decisions about was I going to quit skipping because this was not what I had mind.
所以我必须做出一些有意识的决定，我是否要停止跳绳，因为这不是我的想法。
Or do I go theatrical with it?
或者我应该带着它去戏剧化吗？
In other words, [INAUDIBLE]?
换句话说，[听不清]？
What happened was eventually I would be skipping and children, little German and French kids and Spanish kids, they would come up to me in an absolutely orchestrated order almost stand in line and one by one giving the other one time and room, they would come to me.
最终发生的事情是，我会逃课，孩子们，德国小孩子、法国小孩子和西班牙小孩子，他们会以绝对精心安排的顺序向我走来，几乎排成一排，一个接一个地给另一个人时间和空间，他们会来找我。
And they would bring me a stone and ask me to skip it.
他们会给我带来一块石头并要求我跳过它。
Or they would bring me a stone and ask if they could skip it and show them how to hold it or whatever.
或者他们会给我带来一块石头，问他们是否可以跳过它并告诉他们如何握住它或其他什么。
And that went on for a while.
这种情况持续了一段时间。
And then pretty soon the older people started getting in line as well.
很快，老年人也开始排队。
This became a nightly ritual.
这成了每晚的仪式。
And I was now being introduced everywhere in the village as here's the stone skipper.
现在村里到处都有人介绍我，因为这就是石船长。
Over time Jerry learned to enjoy skipping rocks in front of an audience.
随着时间的推移，杰瑞学会了享受在观众面前跳石头的乐趣。
And a few years later when he moved back to Texas, where he's from, he learned that there was actually a Guinness world record for rock skipping, 29 skips.
几年后，当他搬回家乡德克萨斯州时，他得知实际上有一项跳岩吉尼斯世界纪录：29 次跳岩。
Jerry knew he could beat that record.
杰里知道他可以打破这项记录。
And eventually he did with 38 skips.
最终他完成了 38 次跳跃。
Or at least that's all the camera could catch before the rock skipped out of the frame.
或者至少这是在岩石跳出画面之前相机所能捕捉到的全部内容。
Jerry says that back on the night he became the village stone skipper at the beach in Spain, he probably got well over 50 which seems unimaginable.
杰里说，当他成为西班牙海滩上的村石船长的那天晚上，他的体重可能已经超过了 50，这似乎难以想象。
For most people, even getting three skips is tough.
对于大多数人来说，即使跳过三遍也很困难。
Jerry says it's really all about physics.
杰瑞说这实际上都是关于物理的。
That you need to learn to rotate the stone and get it as parallel to the water as possible, while also throwing it down.
你需要学会旋转石头并使其尽可能与水平行，同时将其扔下。
It's just like a basketball or tennis ball or something.
它就像篮球或网球之类的东西。
If you got in a gymnasium and I got one end and you got at the other, and you said throw me the ball, I'd just throw it to you.
如果你进入体育馆，我得到一端，你得到另一端，你说把球扔给我，我就会把它扔给你。
That's one thing.
这是一回事。
Now if you said make it bounce 30 times before it gets to me, I'm going to throw it toward you, but I'm also going to have to throw it down at the floor of the gym pretty hard for it bounce that many times before it gets down there.
现在，如果你说让它弹跳 30 次才到达我身边，我就会把它扔向你，但我也必须非常用力地将它扔到健身房的地板上，因为它在落地之前弹跳了很多次。
Jerry also says the size of the rock is important.
杰瑞还表示，岩石的大小也很重要。
It needs to be almost as big as the palm of your hand and uniformly thick.
它需要几乎与手掌一样大并且厚度均匀。
If somebody said skip an Oreo cookie for 20 times, I couldn't do it because there's not much mass to an Oreo cookie.
如果有人说 20 次不吃奥利奥饼干，我就做不到，因为奥利奥饼干的质量不大。
And I've tried that.
我已经尝试过了。
Well actually, I did a program.
好吧，实际上，我做了一个程序。
They came out and wanted to film me skipping a whole basket full of different things from bagels to cans of tuna.
他们出来想拍我跳过一篮子的镜头，里面装满了从百吉饼到金枪鱼罐头等各种不同的东西。
And by the way, bagels are best skipper in that food group.
顺便说一句，百吉饼是该食物组中最好的队长。
And if it's frozen, I can probably skip it pretty well.
如果它被冻结了，我可能可以很好地跳过它。
So you need to have a decent sized stone and be able to throw it down.
所以你需要有一块大小合适的石头并且能够把它扔下去。
But probably the most important element in getting a stone to skip far is being able to throw it hard, like you would if you were angry.
但让石头跳远的最重要因素可能是能够用力扔它，就像你生气时那样。
And anger, after all, is what made Jerry so good at this sport to begin with.
毕竟，愤怒是杰瑞在这项运动中如此出色的原因。
When I find myself headed down a road of depression or boredom or whatever else, I look for a pond and some flat rocks.
当我发现自己正走在一条沮丧、无聊或其他什么的道路上时，我会寻找一个池塘和一些平坦的岩石。
It was something that worked for me once and it'll work for me again.
它曾经对我有用过，并且会再次对我有用。
It kind of seems like that perfect combination of a kind of aggression and meditation.
这似乎是一种攻击性和冥想的完美结合。
Well, I'll tell you something, Hillary.
好吧，我告诉你一件事，希拉里。
In fact I had four stone skipping events in four consecutive years at one point there.
事实上，我曾连续四年在那里举办过四次跳石比赛。
And during the course of doing these events, I met a wide spectrum of people.
在举办这些活动的过程中，我遇到了各种各样的人。
One in particular was a guy that came up to me and said-- he was from Chicago in fact, by the way-- and he worked with at-risk delinquent children, and had told me this story of how these kids, one of their favorite pastimes was chucking rocks through factory windows from the alleys and all in Chicago.
其中一个特别重要的人来找我说——顺便说一句，他实际上来自芝加哥——他与高危少年犯一起工作，并告诉我这个故事，这些孩子最喜欢的消遣之一就是从芝加哥的小巷和工厂窗户扔石头。
And so instead of round rocks in an alley, he found them flat rocks in a pond, and said it was absolutely phenomenal the effect that skipping stones had on these children.
因此，他在池塘里发现的不是小巷里的圆形石头，而是平坦的石头，并说跳石头对这些孩子的影响绝对是惊人的。
It does seem ideal.
看起来确实很理想。
For all those times you want to punch a wall or a person, just to take a breath, walk to a place where the water lies still, and there's an abundance of flat, smooth rocks.
每当你想打一堵墙或一个人，只是为了喘口气，走到一个水静止的地方，那里有大量平坦、光滑的岩石。
Hillary Frank.
希拉里·弗兰克.
Credits Ira Glass Well, our program was produced today by Sarah Koenig and myself, with Alex Blumberg, Diane Cook, Wendy Dorr, Jane Feltes, and Lisa Pollak, our senior producer, Julie Snyder.
感谢 Ira Glass 嗯，我们的节目今天由 Sarah Koenig 和我自己制作，还有 Alex Blumberg、Diane Cook、Wendy Dorr、Jane Feltes 和 Lisa Pollak，以及我们的高级制作人 Julie Snyder。
Elizabeth Meister runs our website, production help from Todd Bachmann and Kelsey Dilts.
伊丽莎白·梅斯特 (Elizabeth Meister) 运营我们的网站，托德·巴赫曼 (Todd Bachmann) 和凯尔西·迪尔茨 (Kelsey Dilts) 提供制作帮助。
[ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS] Our website, www.thisamericanlife.org, where you can listen to our programs for free or buy CDs of them, or you know you can download audio of our program at audible.com/thisamericanlife, where they have public radio programs, best-selling books, even The New York Times , all at audible.com.
[鸣谢] 我们的网站 www.thisamericanlife.org，您可以免费收听我们的节目或购买其中的 CD，或者您知道您可以在 audible.com/thisamericanlife 下载我们节目的音频，那里有公共广播节目、畅销书，甚至《纽约时报》，所有这些都在 audible.com 上。
This American Life is distributed by Public Radio International.
《美国生活》由国际公共广播电台发行。
[FUNDING CREDITS] WBEZ management oversight by Torey Malatia.
[资金来源] WBEZ 管理由 Torey Malatia 监督。
And he has a secret.
他有一个秘密。
Sh.
什。
You can call me The Terminator.
你可以叫我终结者。
You're the only one that knows this.
你是唯一知道这一点的人。
I'm Ira Glass, back next week with more stories of This American Life.
我是艾拉·格拉斯，下周回来，带来更多《美国生活》的故事。
This American Life is produced in collaboration with WBEZ Chicago and delivered to stations by PRX The Public Radio Exchange.
《This American Life》与 WBEZ Chicago 合作制作，并由 PRX 公共广播电台传送到各电台。