235: The Balloon Goes Up - This American Life
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00:00 00:00 Transcript Share This American Life Life Partners How to Listen Episodes Recommended About Overview Staff Announcements Fellowships Jobs Music Make Radio On The Road FAQ Submissions Merch Contact Us Our Other Shows Merch Follow Us Life Partners Subscribe to our newsletter Full episode Toggle Audio and Transcript Sync Transcript | Episode #235 | March 21, 2003 235: The Balloon Goes Up Note: This American Life is produced for the ear and designed to be heard.
00:00 00:00 文字记录 分享此 美国生活 生活伙伴 如何收听 剧集 推荐 关于 概述 员工公告 奖学金 工作 音乐 在路上制作电台 常见问题解答 提交 商品 联系我们 我们的其他节目 商品 关注我们 生活伙伴 订阅我们的时事通讯 整集 切换音频和文字记录同步 文字记录 | 内容第 235 集 | 2003 年 3 月 21 日 235：气球升起 注意：《美国生活》是为耳朵而制作的，旨在让人们听到。
If you are able, we strongly encourage you to listen to the audio, which includes emotion and emphasis that's not on the page.
如果可以的话，我们强烈建议您收听音频，其中包括页面上没有的情感和重点。
Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors.
文字记录是使用语音识别软件和人工转录员结合生成的，可能包含错误。
Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print.
请在印刷版引用前检查相应的音频。
Prologue Ira Glass Anthony Swofford was an infantryman in the Marines back during the 1991 Gulf War.
序幕 Ira Glass 安东尼·斯沃福德 (Anthony Swofford) 是 1991 年海湾战争期间海军陆战队的一名步兵。
And we asked him to watch the television coverage for us once this war got under way and tell us his impressions.
我们请他为我们观看战争爆发后的电视报道，并告诉我们他的印象。
Oh I'm thinking it's strange to be in my living room this time.
哦，我觉得这次在我的客厅里很奇怪。
And this morning there was the first scenes of the oil well fires burning as some Marines are up near them.
今天早上，当一些海军陆战队员在油井附近时，出现了油井火灾的第一幕。
And that brought the whole scene pretty close to me.
这让整个场景离我很近。
For a civilian watching this coverage today, I have to say, I feel like, oh, I'm right there.
对于今天观看此报道的平民来说，我不得不说，我感觉，哦，我就在那里。
It feels so real.
感觉很真实。
For you watching this coverage, does it all seemed fantastically fake?
对于观看此报道的您来说，这一切看起来是不是非常虚假？
Yeah, it does.
是的，确实如此。
It feels made up and scripted.
感觉是编造和脚本化的。
Now you brought along a recording of some of the things you taped off TV.
现在你带来了一些你从电视上录下来的东西的录音。
Let's just play one of those.
我们就玩其中的一个吧。
There's this one great scene of the wild man on CNN who-- he's moving with the seventh cavalry, and he's talking about "great waves of steel crushing the Iraqis."
CNN 上有一个关于野人的精彩场景，他正在与第七骑兵队一起前进，他正在谈论“巨大的钢铁浪潮碾压伊拉克人”。
You don't sleep.
你不睡觉。
You really don't sleep out here.
你真的不在这里睡觉。
Of course you're on an adrenaline high.
当然，你的肾上腺素很高。
But racing across the desert, you know that you're traveling toward the jaws of what could be a major military battle.
但在穿越沙漠的过程中，你知道自己正驶向一场重大军事战斗的入口。
He's dramatically narrating what currently from the video is a totally un-dramatic and incredibly common event, which is vehicles moving across the desert.
他戏剧性地讲述了视频中目前完全没有戏剧性且极其常见的事件，即车辆穿越沙漠。
But he's projecting this romantic vision of what the battle will be.
但他对这场战斗的前景充满了浪漫的想象。
Then the army is going to kill them.
然后军队就会杀掉他们。
Their goal is to find the enemy, grab him by the nose they say.
他们的目标是找到敌人，他们说抓住他的鼻子。
And this is according to one senior officer, after grabbing him by the nose, we don't let the Iraqis go anywhere.
据一位高级军官说，在抓住他的鼻子之后，我们不会让伊拉克人去任何地方。
The seventh cavalry's mission is to find the Iraqis and to persuade them to give up.
第七骑兵队的任务是寻找伊拉克人并说服他们放弃。
And if they don't give up, then they will be pounded, according to the officers we're travelling with.
据与我们同行的警官说，如果他们不放弃，就会遭到殴打。
Just because the tanks are barreling across the desert on their way to Baghdad, that doesn't mean that they're going to roll over and grab the enemy by the nose.
坦克在前往巴格达的途中疾驰穿过沙漠，并不意味着他们会翻车并抓住敌人的鼻子。
This would be an example of one of those moments that you find to be completely fake.
这将是你发现完全虚假的那些时刻之一的例子。
Yeah completely fake.
是的，完全是假的。
Ira Glass By the way this is This American Life from WBEZ Chicago, distributed by Public Radio International.
Ira Glass 顺便说一句，这是芝加哥 WBEZ 的《美国生活》，由国际公共广播电台发行。
This guy Anthony Swofford has been on our program before, reading from his memoir about fighting in the Persian gulf war, which is called Jarhead .
这个人安东尼·斯沃福德（Anthony Swofford）以前曾参加过我们的节目，阅读他关于波斯湾战争的回忆录，该回忆录被称为《锅盖头》（Jarhead）。
He says he finds it hard to watch the coverage of this war now.
他说他现在很难再看到这场战争的报道了。
He thinks it's fine for camera crews to go out with the soldiers and all, but he says that to him, it just seems voyeuristic in this way that just gives him the creeps.
他认为摄制组和士兵们一起出去很好，但他说，对他来说，这种方式似乎是偷窥狂，让他感到毛骨悚然。
In battle, he says, you're completely naked in this way.
他说，在战斗中，你是完全赤裸的。
It's so extreme.
太极端了。
And he says the cameras can't really capture what it's like to be there anyway.
他说摄像机无论如何也无法真正捕捉到那里的情况。
The missing element thus far is fear and the unknown.
到目前为止，缺少的元素是恐惧和未知。
Everything seems certain when there's a camera filming this.
当有摄像机拍摄这一切时，一切似乎都是确定的。
You've written about how you and the other Marines during the Persian Gulf War who you were with were told to say pretty much next to nothing to reporters.
您曾写过您和其他海军陆战队员在海湾战争期间如何被告知对记者几乎什么也不说。
Keep everything positive.
保持一切积极的态度。
You were given little scripts to say.
给你的剧本很少。
When you watch the interviews that are now being broadcast on TV, do you feel like you're seeing soldiers spinning the way that you were trained to?
当您观看电视上正在播放的采访时，您是否感觉看到士兵们按照您接受的训练方式旋转？
Oh I'm certain of it.
哦，我确定。
What's coming out of their mouths is scripted.
从他们嘴里说出来的话都是有剧本的。
And it's what they're asked to say.
这就是他们被要求说的话。
And it's also part of what they're asked to believe, and they believe some of it.
这也是他们被要求相信的一部分，而他们也相信其中的一部分。
But--
但是——
Can you think of any particular moment where you've seen somebody talking and you thought, yeah, that's right.
你能想到任何一个特定的时刻，当你看到有人说话时，你会想，是的，那是对的。
That's just the line we give them.
这就是我们给他们的路线。
Yeah, well this morning there was an embed sitting with a Marine.
是的，今天早上有一名埋葬者和一名海军陆战队员坐在一起。
And they were a forward force that had had nine gas calls over the evening.
他们是一支前锋部队，当晚接到了九次毒气警报。
And having nine false gas calls is incredibly frustrating, and it pisses you off.
九次错误的气体报警是令人难以置信的沮丧，它会让你生气。
And you're cussing.
而你却在咒骂。
You're saying who's that idiot who called gas again?
你是说那个又叫煤气的白痴是谁？
I'm tired of putting this thing on.
我厌倦了戴上这个东西。
Calling gas meaning somebody said gas is incoming and so put on your gas gear.
打电话给煤气意味着有人说煤气进来了，所以穿上你的煤气装置。
Yeah, gas is incoming.
是的，煤气进来了。
So the reporter asked the young marine that.
于是记者向这位年轻的海军陆战队员询问了这一点。
"How are you feeling?
“你感觉怎么样？
We've put our gas masks on nine times now?
我们已经戴了九次防毒面具了？
How does this make you feel?
这让你感觉如何？
And the young guy said, "It's just what we do.
年轻人说：“这就是我们所做的。
We put our gas masks on." That's all he's going to give.
我们戴上防毒面具。”这就是他所能给予的。
He's not going to say, "Oh this sucks man.
他不会说：“哦，这太糟糕了，伙计。
I'm tired of putting this thing on."
我厌倦了戴上这个东西。”
Well today on our radio program, as bombs go off and soldiers are on the move, we have stories about this war that's just starting.
今天，在我们的广播节目中，随着炸弹爆炸和士兵出动，我们讲述了这场刚刚开始的战争的故事。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Our program today in six acts.
我们今天的节目有六幕。
David Sedaris files for us from Paris.
大卫·塞达里斯 (David Sedaris) 从巴黎为我们报到。
Sarah Vowell tells the story of the first time that the United States went overseas and attacked a country that had not attacked us first, a country where 100 years later, things are still pretty dreadful.
莎拉·沃威尔（Sarah Vowell）讲述了美国第一次出海攻击一个没有首先攻击我们的国家的故事，这个国家100年后的情况仍然相当可怕。
In preparation for today's show, we gave out audio recorders to a few soldiers who are part of the invasion force going into Iraq.
为了准备今天的节目，我们向一些进入伊拉克的入侵部队的士兵分发了录音机。
We probably will not get the recordings back and on the air for you for a few months.
我们可能在几个月内不会为您取回并播放录音。
But we do have one first person account of what's happening, an email from one soldier.
但我们确实有关于正在发生的事情的第一人称描述，一封来自一名士兵的电子邮件。
Plus other stores trying to make sense of what is happening right now.
还有其他商店试图了解目前正在发生的事情。
Stay with us.
留在我们身边。
Act One, Bombs Over Baghdad.
第一幕，巴格达上空的炸弹。
When it comes to the massive bombing of Baghdad that has started, all of us following the news heard from the US military.
当谈到已经开始的对巴格达的大规模轰炸时，我们所有人都在关注从美军那里听到的消息。
We've heard from reporters in Baghdad.
我们收到了巴格达记者的来信。
But a while back I spoke with an Iraqi named Issam Shukri, who lived in Baghdad during the first Persian Gulf War.
但不久前，我采访了一位名叫伊萨姆·舒克里（Issam Shukri）的伊拉克人，他在第一次波斯湾战争期间住在巴格达。
And he talked about what it was like to despise Saddam Hussein, but also not be so crazy about getting bombed by the United States.
他谈到了鄙视萨达姆·侯赛因，但又不那么疯狂地遭受美国轰炸的感觉。
He remembers clearly how he learned that war had started back then.
他清楚地记得当时他是如何得知战争已经开始的。
Me and my wife used to work in two different rooms in the same building.
我和我的妻子曾经在同一栋大楼的两个不同房间工作。
And she always listened to a Kuwaiti station, the national Kuwaiti station, because it has some more fun songs and mixture of songs and stuff like that.
她总是听科威特电台，科威特国家电台，因为它有一些更有趣的歌曲以及歌曲之类的混合体。
But anyway, so she was trying to find that station but she couldn't.
但无论如何，她试图找到那个车站，但找不到。
And she said, "Issam, it seems there is something wrong with the radio.
她说：“伊萨姆，收音机好像有问题。
I can't find that station." So I start to flip through the stations, and I put it on our Baghdad station.
我找不到那个电台。”于是我开始翻阅电台，然后把它放在我们的巴格达电台上。
And boy, I started to hear the marches and the military music.
天哪，我开始听到进行曲和军乐。
Did that automatically mean you knew that there was trouble?
这是否自动意味着您知道有麻烦了？
Yes, that was the government's announcement in music to times of trouble.
是的，这就是政府在困难时期用音乐宣布的。
I heard about the invasion by dashing out to the street.
我冲到街上听说了入侵的消息。
And I said, what happened?
我说，发生了什么事？
And people in a lower voice, "Well Saddam invaded Kuwait.
人们低声说道：“萨达姆入侵了科威特。
And he's calling people to go and fight over there at the front." And I sort of stroked my head, and I said, not again.
他正在号召人们去前线战斗。”我摸了摸我的头，然后说，不要再这样了。
In that war of course, an incredibly bloody war, estimates of the dead range up to 1.5 million.
当然，在那场战争中，这是一场极其血腥的战争，估计死亡人数高达 150 万人。
Iraq used chemical weapons in the war.
伊拉克在战争中使用了化学武器。
Could you talk about what it felt like to know that you were being called up again to fight in this conflict for somebody who you didn't support?
您能谈谈当您再次被征召为您不支持的人参加这场冲突时的感受吗？
Well, I don't know.
嗯，我不知道。
Ira, it's the most individualistic as well as a collective miserable experience you will ever have.
艾拉，这是你所经历过的最个人主义也是最集体的悲惨经历。
Because you are facing actually not one enemy.
因为你面对的敌人其实不是一个。
You are facing two enemies: one in your back, and one in your face.
你面临着两个敌人：一个在你的背后，一个在你的脸上。
And when you turn to run away, you see the back enemy trying to shoot you.
当你转身逃跑时，你看到后面的敌人正试图向你开枪。
That is your-- Issam Shukri That is the government of Iraq, right.
那是你的——Issam Shukri 那是伊拉克政府，对吧。
I couldn't picture myself putting on the same uniform and fighting for a bloody regime again.
我无法想象自己再次穿上同样的制服，为血腥政权而战。
So that was my feeling.
这就是我的感觉。
And the next day, I had to go to that military center and join the forces.
第二天，我必须去那个军事中心参军。
But as I was an architect, I was actually allocated to the back of the front, inside the city of Baghdad.
但由于我是一名建筑师，所以我实际上被分配到巴格达市内的前部后面。
Oh, so you were very lucky?
哦，那么你很幸运吗？
Issam Shukri I was actually.
事实上，伊萨姆·舒克里（Issam Shukri）就是我。
But some of my classmates were sent to out to the front.
但我的一些同学被派往前线。
And some of them faced their deaths there.
其中一些人在那里面临死亡。
They were killed.
他们被杀了。
Did they have the same kinds of feelings about Saddam that you did, that they didn't like the regime?
他们对萨达姆是否有和你一样的感觉，即他们不喜欢这个政权？
Talk about the air strikes.
谈论空袭。
Could you talk about what that was like?
你能谈谈那是什么样的吗？
You were in Baghdad when the US started its 38 day air campaign against Iraq.
当美国开始对伊拉克进行为期 38 天的空袭时，您正在巴格达。
Right.
对。
I was in my home with my wife and my three year old son.
我和妻子以及三岁的儿子在家里。
And I was renovating my house.
我正在装修我的房子。
I was like two years, three years married to my wife.
我和我妻子结婚已经两年、三年了。
And I was dividing my family home into two little homes.
我把我的家分成了两个小房子。
One is for my sister, and one is for my family.
一份是给我妹妹的，一份是给我家人的。
And as a show of emotional support, we all slept-- we had mattresses on the floor in my living room, which had doors open because I was renovating at the time.
为了表达情感上的支持，我们都睡觉了——我们客厅的地板上铺着床垫，客厅的门开着，因为我当时正在装修。
I've brought a lot of paint to paint my living room.
我带了很多油漆来粉刷我的客厅。
So anyway, we slept on that night, and the night of the 17 of January, in my living room.
所以无论如何，那天晚上，以及 1 月 17 日晚上，我们都睡在我的客厅里。
And we kissed each other, and we fell asleep.
我们互相亲吻，然后就睡着了。
And exactly at 2:00 AM, we all woke up and the ground was shaking violently.
就在凌晨 2:00，我们都醒了，地面剧烈震动。
And it was like a deep, deep echo happening coming down from the ground.
就像从地面传来深深的回声一样。
And the streetlights were on at the time.
而且当时路灯还亮着。
And in five minutes, all the lights were out.
五分钟后，所有的灯都灭了。
And at that minute, we were certain that this is the war, and we're back again.
在那一刻，我们确信这就是战争，我们又回来了。
We are facing death all over again.
我们再次面临死亡。
I personally, Ira, I'm not ashamed of this.
就我个人而言，艾拉，我并不为此感到羞耻。
I started to shake.
我开始发抖。
My hands couldn't hold anything.
我的双手无法握住任何东西。
I grabbed my--
我抓住了我的——
Take a second.
等一下。
Issam Shukri I grabbed my little kid, and he was crying.
Issam Shukri 我抓住了我的小孩，他在哭。
He didn't know what was happening.
他不知道发生了什么事。
I remember my son when he heard the B52 over his head.
我记得我的儿子听到头顶上传来 B52 的声音。
I put my hand on his heart, and I felt his heart bumping like crazy.
我把手放在他的心脏上，我感觉到他的心脏疯狂地跳动。
And ironically, again I went to the washroom like five, six times in five minutes.
讽刺的是，我在五分钟内又去了洗手间五六次。
You know when you have this stress?
你知道你什么时候有这种压力吗？
I needed to go to the washroom.
我需要去洗手间。
As mundane as this is, but I need to tell the Americans about it.
尽管这很平常，但我需要告诉美国人。
The fear is very, very frightening when you're expecting your death.
当你等待死亡时，恐惧是非常非常可怕的。
It's much more frightening when it happens suddenly, if you're asleep or if you're embarking on your work or whatever.
当它突然发生时，如果你睡着了或者你正在开始工作或其他什么，那就更可怕了。
But when you're expecting it minute by minute, and second by second sometimes, it becomes like torture.
但当你一分一秒、一秒一秒地期待着它时，它就变成了一种折磨。
So we were literally tortured.
所以我们确实受到了折磨。
And we started to wonder with the streets.
我们开始对街道感到好奇。
I looked around in my neighborhood-- and by the way our neighborhood looks pretty much like any American or Canadian neighborhood: row houses or individual homes with front yards and very nicely done.
我环顾四周——顺便说一下，我们的社区看起来很像美国或加拿大的社区：排屋或带有前院的独立住宅，而且装修得非常好。
And people that have the same qualities of life.
以及具有相同生活品质的人。
The difference is that they live in constant fear.
不同的是，他们生活在持续的恐惧之中。
And you were with your three year old boy.
你和你三岁的儿子在一起。
Right, and well actually, I was very worried about this guy because he was very young.
是的，事实上，我非常担心这个人，因为他很年轻。
And when fear-- when you start your life by experiencing fear and bombing, it would leave scars in your soul for the rest of your life.
当恐惧——当你通过经历恐惧和轰炸来开始你的生活时，它会在你的灵魂中留下终生的伤疤。
And I think he's fine now, but he kept asking me, "Why are they doing this to us?
我认为他现在很好，但他一直问我，“他们为什么要这样对我们？
What have we done?" And I couldn't find the right answer because he was very young at the time.
我们做了什么？”我找不到正确的答案，因为他当时还很年轻。
I couldn't go into deep political analysis of what's going on.
我无法对正在发生的事情进行深入的政治分析。
But I told him, "There is a bad guy who did something wrong.
但我告诉他：“有一个坏人做了错事。
And there are some judges of the world who wanted to take the law in their hands.
世界上有一些法官想要将法律掌握在自己手中。
And then they came and punished him." And then I stopped for one second.
然后他们来惩罚他。”然后我停了下来。
But then he said, "But they are punishing us.
但随后他说：“但他们正在惩罚我们。
But we are scared.
但我们很害怕。
He's not scared."
他并不害怕。”
Did he ask why are they bombing all of us if they're just trying to get this bad man?
他有没有问过，如果他们只是想抓住这个坏人，为什么要轰炸我们所有人？
Well Ira, I didn't try to justify what the American forces were doing, to tell you the truth.
好吧，艾拉，我并没有试图为美军的所作所为辩护，告诉你真相。
I'm not going to polish my words.
我不会润色我的话。
I told him that-- after days and days of bombing, I first told him that, "Well there are some judges who are going to catch this man.
我告诉他——经过几天又几天的轰炸，我首先告诉他，“有些法官会抓住这个人。
And he's an outlaw, and they're going to put him in jail." I tried to make things like a story to his age.
他是个亡命之徒，他们要把他关进监狱。”我试图把事情写成适合他这个年龄的故事。
And then after that, I started to feel frustrated myself because I saw people slaughtered in front of my eyes.
从那以后，我自己开始感到沮丧，因为我看到人们在我眼前被屠杀。
And Saddam comes out on the screen laughing with his ugly, ugly face.
萨达姆出现在屏幕上，脸上露出丑陋的笑容。
So I started to tell him, "Well those judges are sometimes more severe, and sometimes they hit hard.
所以我开始告诉他，“那些法官有时更严厉，有时他们的打击也更严厉。
The people themselves will suffer some injuries, but again, that's OK.
人们自己会受到一些伤害，但那也没关系。
Probably in the end they will catch him." But it never happened.
也许最终他们会抓住他。”但这从未发生。
And neither in Iraq nor in Afghanistan, nor anywhere in the world.
无论是在伊拉克、阿富汗还是世界任何地方。
Was there a part of you which hoped that the Americans would succeed and liberate Iraq from Saddam Hussein.
你们中是否有人希望美国人能够成功并将伊拉克从萨达姆·侯赛因手中解放出来？
To tell you the truth, I hoped for that.
说实话，我也这么希望。
I hoped for that.
我希望如此。
But I felt deep, deep in heart that they're not going to catch this person.
但我内心深处感到他们不会抓住这个人。
I've always doubted that, and not only me.
我一直怀疑这一点，而且不仅仅是我。
All the people in Iraq doubted that because there's always history that tells you lessons.
所有伊拉克人民都对此表示怀疑，因为历史总有教训。
And there is the fresh memory when Saddam bombed chemically, used the chemical weapons against Halabcha, which is a northern, very, very peaceful city in 1988, and killed 5,000 people in two hours.
1988年，萨达姆对哈拉布恰（Halabcha）进行化学轰炸，使用化学武器，在两个小时内杀死了5,000人，这是一个非常非常和平的北方城市，人们对此记忆犹新。
Nobody in the West raised a finger.
西方没有人举起一根手指头。
Nobody called him a terrorist.
没有人称他为恐怖分子。
Nobody called him a tyrant.
没有人称他为暴君。
But when he touched a state that is a strong ally to the West, a state that's very rich in oil, everybody-- So we didn't really trust the West.
但是，当他接触到一个西方强大盟友的国家、一个石油资源非常丰富的国家时，每个人——所以我们并不真正信任西方。
It's a feeling that those people do not care about other nations.
感觉这些人不关心其他国家。
And what did you think about the United States at that time?
您当时对美国有何看法？
Did you hate the United States for the bombing?
你是否因为美国的爆炸事件而憎恨美国？
Did you feel a mix of feelings about it because you hoped that they would come in?
你是否因为希望他们进来而感到五味杂陈？
I didn't like the United States as a government, as a military force, not the people.
我不喜欢美国的政府、军事力量，而不是人民。
I saw cruise missiles falling on buildings, but some of these buildings were inhabited by civilians.
我看到巡航导弹落在建筑物上，但其中一些建筑物中有平民居住。
So I do not hate.
所以我不讨厌。
I do not hate.
我不讨厌。
I don't like to use this word, but I was mad.
我不喜欢用这个词，但我很生气。
I was angry at the United States government because it uses a lot of force, a lot of force, inhuman force to punish very poor people.
我对美国政府感到愤怒，因为它使用大量武力，大量武力，非人道的武力来惩罚非常贫穷的人。
And were you also angry at Saddam for putting you all in this position?
你们是否也对萨达姆让你们陷入这样的境地感到愤怒？
Oh, in that respect, we hated Saddam.
哦，在这方面，我们讨厌萨达姆。
I would definitely use that word.
我肯定会用这个词。
Issam Shukri is watching the war from his home in Toronto, where he lives and works as an architect.
伊萨姆·舒克里 (Issam Shukri) 正在多伦多的家中观看战争，他在那里生活和工作，是一名建筑师。
He has two sisters, four aunts and uncles and many nieces and nephews in Baghdad.
他在巴格达有两个姐妹、四个阿姨和叔叔以及许多侄女和侄子。
He last talked with them all a few days ago.
他最后一次与他们交谈是在几天前。
He hasn't been able to reach them since because the phones have been bad.
从那以后他就一直无法联系到他们，因为电话坏了。
He doesn't know how they're doing.
他不知道他们怎么样了。
Act Two.
第二幕。
Over the last few weeks, our program has been in contact with a number of American soldiers in this war.
在过去的几周里，我们的节目与这场战争中的一些美国士兵取得了联系。
One of the ones who expressed an interest in giving an account of what is happening to him is first lieutenant Tice Ridley.
泰斯·里德利中尉是表示有兴趣讲述发生在他身上的事情的人之一。
He's been in the army for seven years.
他参军已有七年了。
He's 30 years old.
他今年 30 岁了。
He's the one we're able to put on the air this week because he's the one who's continued to have access to email.
他是我们本周能够播出的人，因为他是那个继续有权访问电子邮件的人。
He's someone whose job is to deal with the press.
他的工作就是与媒体打交道。
He's a public relations officer at the Coalition Press Information Center in Kuwait City.
他是科威特城联盟新闻信息中心的公共关系官员。
What you're about to hear are taken from the emails that he has sent to friends and family, and emails he has sent to our program.
您将要听到的内容取自他发送给朋友和家人的电子邮件以及他发送给我们计划的电子邮件。
We asked him to stay away from the official army stories that he deals with in his job and just talk about what it's like to be there.
我们要求他远离他在工作中处理的官方军队故事，只谈论在那里的感觉。
His emails are read for us by actor Tom Wright.
他的电子邮件由演员汤姆·赖特（Tom Wright）为我们朗读。
February 27, 2003.
2003 年 2 月 27 日。
Dear friends and family.
亲爱的朋友和家人。
Last night we arrived in Kuwait City, which is nine hours ahead of you guys so I'm actually living in the future.
昨晚我们到达科威特城，比你们早了九个小时，所以我实际上生活在未来。
If you want to know what happens, just let me know.
如果你想知道会发生什么，请告诉我。
When we got off the plane, it still looked a lot like Texas, but there was no mistaking where we were.
当我们下飞机时，它看起来仍然很像德克萨斯州，但我们没有弄错我们在哪里。
There were soldiers with weapons everywhere.
到处都是拿着武器的士兵。
The buses we rode from the airport in had curtains covering all the windows to prevent sniper fire.
我们从机场乘坐的巴士的所有窗户都装有窗帘，以防止狙击手开火。
And we were escorted by soldiers with fully loaded, crew-served weapons, really big guns mounted on their vehicles.
护送我们的是士兵，他们携带满载的、由机组人员操作的武器，他们的车辆上安装着真正的大枪。
Sniper fire is common here.
狙击手开火在这里很常见。
On our first night, my vehicle broke down during a convoy, and the security force with those big guns was unable to turn around to assist my driver, a 19 year old private, and me.
在我们的第一个晚上，我的车在车队中抛锚了，携带大枪的安全部队无法转身帮助我的司机（一名 19 岁的二等兵）和我。
We'd been briefed on what to do, but the plan failed because security was unable to stop or turn around right away.
我们已被告知要做什么，但计划失败了，因为保安无法立即停止或转身。
We were sitting there alone, in a foreign land with street signs in Arabic, not knowing whom to trust.
我们独自坐在异国他乡，街道上有阿拉伯语的标志，不知道该相信谁。
What do you do?
你做什么？
After assessing the situation, it was my decision to keep moving no matter how slow.
在评估了情况后，我决定无论多慢都要继续前进。
I didn't want us to appear to be an easy sniper target.
我不想让我们看起来很容易成为狙击手的目标。
After about 15 minutes, but what seemed like an eternity, the security force was able to turn around and catch up with us, prepare the vehicle and guide us back into the convoy.
大约 15 分钟后，安全部队终于转身追上我们，准备车辆并引导我们回到车队。
After we'd been returned to our comfort zone with the rest of our convoy, I asked my driver if he had been scared.
当我们和车队的其他成员回到舒适区后，我问司机是否感到害怕。
And initially, he said no. He then asked me if I had been afraid.
最初，他拒绝了。然后他问我是否害怕。
I replied, "Yeah, I was scared as hell." I told him that scared is good, as long as you don't let panic set in, because fear will keep you alert and alive.
我回答说：“是啊，我真的很害怕。”我告诉他，只要你不让惊慌发作，害怕是好的，因为恐惧会让你保持警觉和活力。
I saw that in some movie somewhere, but I think it's true.
我在某部电影中看到过，但我认为这是真的。
The private then told me that he had been afraid but didn't want me to know.
然后那个二等兵告诉我，他很害怕，但不想让我知道。
I would go to war with a solider like that any day.
我随时都会与这样的士兵一起参战。
Oh wait, we're already here.
哦等等，我们已经到了。
Friday, March 7, 2003.
2003 年 3 月 7 日星期五。
Around 5:00, Murphy showed his ugly little head and the phone started ringing.
5:00左右，墨菲露出了他那丑陋的小脑袋，电话铃声开始响起。
A soldier was injured pretty badly in an accident, and I got the message.
一名士兵在一次事故中受了重伤，我得到了消息。
It's not the first time I've gotten a message of this nature, but it was the first time I looked at the name.
这不是我第一次收到这种性质的消息，但这是我第一次看到这个名字。
That made a world of difference.
这让世界变得不同。
It was no one I knew, but looking at a name and a hometown personalized it.
这不是我认识的人，但看着一个名字和一个家乡，它就个性化了。
That is something I have to learn to deal with.
这是我必须学会处理的事情。
Monday, March 17, 2003.
2003 年 3 月 17 日星期一。
I met Ted Koppel the other day.
前几天我遇到了特德·科佩尔。
Nice guy, little worn-looking though.
小伙子不错，就是看上去有点憔悴。
I told him to have his people call my people and maybe, just maybe, we could do lunch after the war.
我告诉他让他的人打电话给我的人，也许，只是也许，我们可以在战后共进午餐。
Yesterday I was interviewed by Jay Levine of Channel 2, Chicago.
昨天我接受了芝加哥第二频道的杰·莱文的采访。
That was cool.
太酷了。
I've received email from some of you saying that you saw the interview.
我收到了一些人发来的电子邮件，表示您已看过采访。
He asked me how I felt about the protesters and political debate.
他问我对抗议者和政治辩论有何看法。
What I really wanted to say was, "Those [BLEEP] need to go to Saddam Hussein's house and try their protesting in front of one of his billion dollar palaces.
我真正想说的是，“那些[BLEEP]需要去萨达姆·侯赛因的家，并在他价值数十亿美元的宫殿之一前尝试抗议。
Or maybe they can go sing Kumbaya with the bastard.
或者也许他们可以和那个混蛋一起唱《Kumbaya》。
And just maybe he'll stop mass murdering, invading his neighbors and gassing people.
也许他会停止大规模谋杀、入侵邻居和用毒气毒死人们。
As far as the political debate goes, I think those countries that keep saying more time don't have soldiers sitting in the desert longing to be with their families.
就政治辩论而言，我认为那些一直说需要更多时间的国家没有士兵坐在沙漠中渴望与家人团聚。
Not that we're war mongers, but most of us didn't give up our lives so that we could come to the desert to play dominoes.
并不是说我们是战争贩子，而是我们大多数人都没有放弃自己的生命来沙漠玩多米诺骨牌。
Hell, I don't even know how to play freaking dominoes.
天哪，我什至不知道如何玩该死的多米诺骨牌。
However, while wearing the uniform, I represent the United States Army, so I had to keep it professional and say, "I really don't think about it much." With that in mind, I must say farewell my friends.
然而，当我穿着制服时，我代表的是美国陆军，所以我必须保持专业，并说：“我真的没有想太多。”考虑到这一点，我必须向我的朋友们告别了。
Please think about these things as you form your opinions on this possible war.
当您对这场可能的战争形成看法时，请考虑这些事情。
We see a lot of protest on the news here, but if you see someone protesting, ask them if they know the history.
我们在这里的新闻中看到很多抗议活动，但是如果您看到有人抗议，请询问他们是否了解历史。
And if so, why aren't they protesting Saddam Hussein?
如果是这样，他们为什么不抗议萨达姆·侯赛因？
Love you all, Tice.
爱你们所有人，泰斯。
PS, if you haven't done already, I would fill up my gas tank today if I were you.
PS，如果你还没有这样做的话，如果我是你，我今天就会加满油箱。
Tuesday, March 18, 2003.
2003 年 3 月 18 日星期二。
A little over 24 hours ago, President George W.
24 小时前，乔治·W·布什 (George W.
Bush gave a powerful speech, and we all wondered if the wait was over.
布什发表了一场强有力的演讲，我们都想知道等待是否结束了。
48 hours was his answer, and I actually breathed a sigh of relief.
48小时是他的答复，我居然松了一口气。
This is my first war, and in my inexperience, I thought that as soon as the President left the podium, planes would start flying overhead and the war would have begun.
这是我第一次参加战争，由于我缺乏经验，我以为总统一离开讲台，飞机就会开始从头顶飞过，战争就会开始。
He gave them 48 hours.
他给了他们48小时。
Thursday, March 20, 2003.
2003 年 3 月 20 日，星期四。
It is now 2:55 on the morning of March 20.
现在是3月20日凌晨2点55分。
The 48 hour deadline is up in one hour and five minutes, and all's quiet.
48 小时的截止日期还有 1 小时 5 分钟就到了，一切都很平静。
One of the first things I was told as I started my shift was that Iraq had placed artillery pieces along the border with Kuwait within striking distance of us.
当我开始值班时，我被告知的第一件事就是伊拉克在与科威特的边境沿线部署了大炮，距离我们很近。
This was a definite concern of ours, and you could see by the mood that it was at the back of everyone's mind.
这确实是我们关心的问题，从大家的心情就可以看出，这是每个人都关心的问题。
The initial fear is of a direct hit, but even if we didn't get hit directly, the chemical vapors might drift our way.
最初的恐惧是直接击中，但即使我们没有被直接击中，化学蒸气也可能会向我们飘来。
Tracy and I read from the Bible together every night.
特蕾西和我每晚都一起读圣经。
We also take turns reading the 91st Psalm to each other.
我们还轮流互相朗诵第 91 篇诗篇。
That's a long story.
这是一个很长的故事。
But a unit from World War Two read that psalm every day together, and while all the other units around them were being wiped out, none of them got a scratch.
但第二次世界大战期间的一支部队每天都在一起朗读这首诗篇，而当他们周围的所有其他部队都被消灭时，他们却没有一个受到擦伤。
At approximately 22:00, Tracy came down for our nightly reading of the 91st Psalm.
大约 22:00，特雷西下来参加我们每晚朗诵的《诗篇》第 91 篇。
As I reentered the office, there was a flurry of phone calls.
当我回到办公室时，一阵电话铃声响起。
We found out that the artillery pieces that were within range of us had been destroyed by coalition air forces.
我们发现，我们射程内的火炮已经被联军空军摧毁了。
The Air Force officer that happened to be in the section at the time yelled, "The Air Force is always saving you guy's asses." The information was soon confirmed, and we breathed a sigh of relief.
当时恰好在该部门的空军军官喊道：“空军总是在救你们的屁股。”消息很快得到证实，我们松了一口气。
Also, we heard that 17 Iraqi soldiers had turned themselves in.
另外，我们听说有17名伊拉克士兵已经自首。
We were trying to get confirmation.
我们试图得到确认。
My first thought was, 17 down and only 400,000 to go.
我的第一个想法是，落后 17 场，只剩下 40 万了。
Tom Wright, reading the letters of first lieutenant Tice Ridley in Kuwait City.
汤姆·赖特 (Tom Wright) 在科威特城阅读泰斯·里德利 (Tice Ridley) 中尉的信件。
Coming up, David Sedaris reports from France, Sarah Vowell, and some lessons of war from thousands of years ago.
接下来，大卫·塞达里斯 (David Sedaris) 从法国报道莎拉·沃威尔 (Sarah Vowell)，以及数千年前战争的一些教训。
How people thought about war back then, how we might think about it now.
当时人们如何看待战争，我们现在也会如何看待它。
That's in a minute, from Chicago Public Radio and Public Radio International when our program continues.
稍后，芝加哥公共广播电台和国际公共广播电台将继续我们的节目。
It's This American Life .
这就是美国生活。
I'm Ira Glass.
我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Today's program, The Balloon Goes Up, stories about this new war with Iraq.
今天的节目《气球升起》讲述了这场新的伊拉克战争的故事。
Much of Europe and the Arab world still oppose this war.
欧洲和阿拉伯世界的大部分地区仍然反对这场战争。
Protests continue.
抗议活动仍在继续。
Is the world just going to hate the United States now in some way we've never seen before in our lifetimes?
世界现在会以我们一生中从未见过的方式憎恨美国吗？
Well, writer David Sedaris lives in one of the countries that oppose military action most fiercely, France.
作家大卫·塞达里斯生活在最强烈反对军事行动的国家之一——法国。
He says the answer to that question is complicated.
他说这个问题的答案很复杂。
For the past several weeks, I've been been getting these late night calls.
在过去的几周里，我一直接到深夜的电话。
The phone rings, and when I answer the person on the other end will say, "Thank God, are you all right?" I wonder how they knew I had the radio perched on the lip of the bathtub, and then I'll realize that they're talking about the French American thing, which is a lot nastier in the United States than it is here.
电话铃响了，当我接听时，电话那头的人会说：“谢天谢地，你还好吗？”我想知道他们怎么知道我把收音机放在浴缸的边缘，然后我就会意识到他们正在谈论法裔美国人的事情，这在美国比在这里要肮脏得多。
The assumption is that, mirroring the cafeteria in the US House of Representatives, France has banished the word "American," retitling videos to read "Liberty Gigolo" or "Freedom Graffiti." But that's not the case.
人们的假设是，与美国众议院的自助餐厅一样，法国已经取消了“美国”一词，将视频的标题重新命名为“自由舞男”或“自由涂鸦”。但事实并非如此。
Neither are radio stations hiring bulldozers to flatten hamburgers and low-fat muffins and pictures of the American president.
广播电台也没有雇佣推土机来压平汉堡包、低脂松饼和美国总统的照片。
The French people I know are saddened by the name calling, but not enough to touch a muffin or a hamburger, much less a picture of George Bush.
我认识的法国人对这种辱骂感到悲伤，但还不足以触摸松饼或汉堡，更不用说乔治·布什的照片了。
On September 11, 2001, Jacques Chirac announced that we are all Americans.
2001年9月11日，雅克·希拉克宣布我们都是美国人。
A year and a half later, things have changed.
一年半后，情况发生了变化。
Chirac threatened to use his UN veto, and the Bush administration announced that it could no longer take this country seriously.
希拉克威胁要使用他的联合国否决权，布什政府宣布不能再认真对待这个国家。
But how seriously did the current administration ever take France?
但现任政府到底有多认真对待法国呢？
While the Clinton ambassador was engaged and well regarded, Bush appointed a former fast food processor who does not even speak the language.
尽管克林顿大使积极参与并受到好评，但布什却任命了一位甚至不会说这种语言的前快餐加工商。
Bush doesn't come to France to talk with Chirac.
布什来法国并不是为了与希拉克会谈。
He goes to England to talk about Chirac.
他去英国谈论希拉克。
And every time he opens his mouth, he makes it just that much harder to hold your head up.
每次他张开嘴，你就更难抬起头来。
While in the United States, the President might make his own kind of sense, to most of the outside world he sounds like a bully and a braggart.
在美国，总统可能会表达自己的观点，但对大多数外界来说，他听起来像是一个恶霸和吹牛者。
Here is a man who actually failed to win a popularity contest against Saddam Hussein.
这是一个实际上未能赢得与萨达姆·侯赛因的人气竞赛的人。
And that's Europe's fault?
这就是欧洲的错吗？
I'm told that France is dangerous now, that Americans are being spat upon.
有人告诉我，法国现在很危险，美国人正在被吐口水。
But neither me nor my friends have experienced any hostility whatsoever.
但我和我的朋友都没有经历过任何敌意。
Talk to a French person about the war, and they'll say that while they dislike the current administration, they understand there's a difference between the American people and the American President.
与法国人谈论战争，他们会说，虽然他们不喜欢现任政府，但他们明白美国人民和美国总统之间存在差异。
Six Feet Under they love, Tony Blair they grudgingly respect, but George Bush, that's another matter.
他们爱《六尺之下》，勉强尊重托尼·布莱尔，但乔治·布什，那就是另一回事了。
If I did not share their view, I suppose there might be some discussion, but I can't imagine that it would result in saliva.
如果我不同意他们的观点，我想可能会有一些讨论，但我无法想象这会导致口水。
I have an American friend who speaks French perfectly and leads tours of Paris.
我有一位美国朋友，他法语说得很好，还带导游游览巴黎。
As late as February, her spring schedule was packed.
直到二月，她的春季日程都排得满满的。
Then one by one, all of her upcoming parties phoned to cancel saying it just didn't seem safe.
然后，她即将参加的所有聚会都一一打电话取消，说这似乎不安全。
The only exception was a man from Wyoming, who said he would come as long as my friend could arrange for an armed bodyguard who would accompany him and his family everywhere they went.
唯一的例外是来自怀俄明州的一名男子，他说只要我的朋友能安排一名武装保镖，他就会来，无论他们走到哪里，他都会陪伴在他和他的家人身边。
My friend explained that guns were not really allowed in the Louvre.
我的朋友解释说，卢浮宫实际上是不允许携带枪支的。
And after expressing shock, the man canceled.
在表达了震惊之后，该男子取消了。
I know Americans who have taken to identifying themselves as Canadians, but I'm always afraid that if I try it myself, the other person will have family there and ask me what part of Canada I'm from.
我知道有些美国人已经开始将自己视为加拿大人，但我总是担心，如果我自己尝试这样做，另一个人会在那里有家人并问我来自加拿大的哪个地区。
There is nothing more pathetic than being ashamed of where you come from.
没有什么比为自己的出身感到羞耻更可悲的了。
I know this.
我知道这一点。
Still, I look at the American President raising his fist on the front page of Le Monde , and I find myself wondering, is Sacajawea a province?
尽管如此，当我看到美国总统在《世界报》头版举起拳头时，我发现自己在想，萨卡贾维亚是一个省吗？
What about Mandingo?
曼丁哥呢？
David Sedaris is the author of several books, including one about his life in France titled Me Talk Pretty One Day .
大卫·塞达里斯 (David Sedaris) 是多本书籍的作者，其中一本讲述他在法国的生活，名为《Me Talk Pretty One Day》。
Act Four, Fighting The Previous War.
第四幕，对抗之前的战争。
Sarah Vowell has this story about the first time the United States attacked a country that had not attacked us.
莎拉·沃威尔（Sarah Vowell）讲了一个关于美国第一次攻击一个没有攻击过我们的国家的故事。
The first time we invaded a country for the purposes of regime change, which was widely seen as an idealistic act freeing an oppressed people.
我们第一次以政权更迭为目的入侵一个国家，这被广泛视为解放被压迫人民的理想主义行为。
Here she is.
她在这里。
The congressman from New York said that the United States was right to invade another country in order to "correct the intolerable evils and set up in their place the institutions of enlightened government." The President, who believed we were entrusted with this war by the providence of God, said "It is not a trust we sought.
这位来自纽约的国会议员表示，美国入侵另一个国家是正确的，目的是“纠正无法容忍的罪恶，并在其所在地建立开明的政府机构”。总统相信我们是上帝托付这场战争的，他说：“这不是我们寻求的信任。
It is a trust from which we will not flinch." An American citizen living in Europe among Europeans opposed to America going to war wrote home that, "it is a worthy thing to fight for one's freedom.
这是我们不会退缩的信任。”一位生活在欧洲、与反对美国参战的欧洲人一起生活的美国公民写信回家说：“为自己的自由而战是一件值得的事情。
It is another sight finer to fight for another man's."
为另一个人而战是另一种美好的景象。”
The President was William McKinley, the American citizen, Mark Twain, and the congressman was speaking at the turn of the 20th century and not the 21st.
总统是威廉·麦金利，美国公民是马克·吐温，国会议员是在 20 世纪初而不是 21 世纪发表讲话。
These were the country's good intentions in our first attempt at regime change, the Spanish American War.
这些都是该国在我们第一次政权更迭尝试——美西战争中的良好意愿。
As the United States embarks on Operation Iraqi Freedom, it's worth looking back on the role we played in creating that bastion of 20th century democracy known as Cuba.
当美国开始实施伊拉克自由行动时，有必要回顾一下我们在创建古巴这个 20 世纪民主堡垒中所扮演的角色。
American do-gooders fought to liberate the oppressed people of Cuba from the tyranny of Spain.
美国的行善者为将受压迫的古巴人民从西班牙的暴政下解放出来而奋斗。
And what can we learn?
我们能学到什么？
For starters, the war itself is a snap.
首先，战争本身是小事一桩。
It's when the guns get put away and the ink pens come out that the real headaches begin.
当枪被收起来、墨水笔出来时，真正令人头疼的事情才开始。
The Cuban people suffered at the hands of the Spanish in the 1890s, especially those who were rounded up into concentration camps.
1890年代，古巴人民在西班牙人的手中遭受苦难，特别是那些被关进集中营的人。
American newspapers sensationalized Spanish atrocities, stirring up an idealistic fad for Cuba libre on the part of the American people.
美国报纸对西班牙的暴行进行了耸人听闻的报道，激起了美国人民对自由古巴的理想主义热潮。
The clincher, the hard proof of Spanish evil-doing, was one of those acts that in retrospect might not have happened at all.
最关键的一点是，西班牙的恶行的确凿证据，而现在回想起来，这些行为可能根本就不会发生。
Historians still disagree.
历史学家仍然不同意。
On February 15, 1898, the American battleship, The Maine, exploded in Havana harbor, killing 254 men.
1898年2月15日，美国战列舰缅因号在哈瓦那港发生爆炸，造成254人死亡。
Remember the Maine?
还记得缅因州吗？
War boosters accused the Spanish of bombing the ship and shrieked for a declaration of war.
战争支持者指责西班牙人轰炸了这艘船，并呼吁宣战。
In fact, the evidence was inconclusive then and remains so today.
事实上，当时的证据尚无定论，今天仍然如此。
Some historians believe it may have been a freak accident, a coal fire that ignited explosives on board the ship.
一些历史学家认为这可能是一次反常事故，一场煤火点燃了船上的炸药。
Just like today, President McKinley had to squeak around that pesky provision in the Constitution that says Congress shall declare war.
就像今天一样，麦金莱总统不得不回避宪法中规定国会宣战的讨厌条款。
Congress didn't actually approve the war until it was already under way, but still, it's nice to be asked.
直到战争开始之前，国会才真正批准战争，但仍然很高兴被问到。
Then, as now, optional wars are fought because there are people in the government who really, really want to fight them.
那时，就像现在一样，人们会选择打仗，因为政府里有人真的非常想打仗。
The Paul Wolfowitz of the McKinley administration was the assistant secretary of the Navy, one Theodore Roosevelt.
麦金莱政府的保罗·沃尔福威茨是海军助理部长，相当于西奥多·罗斯福。
He was part of a group of young wonks from various branches of the government who had been arguing that it was in the American interest to wrench Cuba from the clutches of Spain.
他是来自政府各个部门的一群年轻书呆子的一员，他们一直主张将古巴从西班牙手中夺回符合美国的利益。
They feared what would happen if the iffy Cuban rebels governed themselves.
他们担心如果不稳定的古巴叛乱分子自行统治会发生什么。
They wanted American companies to get a piece of the Cuban sugar business.
他们希望美国公司能够从古巴糖业中分得一杯羹。
And they thought Cuba would be a handy base of operations from which to get cracking on a canal they hoped to one day build in Central America.
他们认为古巴将成为一个便利的行动基地，他们希望有一天能够在中美洲修建一条运河。
Roosevelt wanted all those things, but more than anything, he wanted to fight.
罗斯福想要所有这些，但最重要的是，他想要战斗。
He wanted to wear an outfit, I mean uniform.
他想穿一套衣服，我是说制服。
He wanted to use one of his favorite words, adventure.
他想用他最喜欢的词之一：冒险。
And he wanted these things so badly that once the US declared war on Spain, he resigned as assistant secretary of the Navy, ordered himself a custom-tailored uniform from Brooks Brothers and volunteered to fight as a comparatively lowly lieutenant colonel with the first US volunteer cavalry.
他非常想要这些东西，以至于美国对西班牙宣战后，他辞去了海军助理部长的职务，从布鲁克斯兄弟公司为自己订购了一套定制制服，并自愿以相对较低的中校身份与第一批美国志愿骑兵一起作战。
He helped assemble this ragtag regiment of cowboys, Indians, Ivy League graduates, one genuine Dodge City Marshal and a Jew nicknamed Porkchop.
他帮助组建了一支由牛仔、印第安人、常春藤盟校毕业生、一名真正的道奇城元帅和一名绰号为“猪排”的犹太人组成的乌合之众军团。
They came to be known as The Rough Riders.
他们后来被称为“野蛮骑士”。
Roosevelt described them as "men in whose veins the blood stirred with the same impulse which once sent the Vikings oversea."
罗斯福将他们描述为“血管里流淌着与曾经将维京人送出海外的冲动相同的血液的人”。
And how did our Vikings fare?
我们的维京人表现如何？
The war was over in four short months.
战争在短短四个月内就结束了。
America's first time out in interventionist warfare with the aim of regime change was seen as such a success it became known as The Splendid Little War.
美国第一次以政权更迭为目的的干预战争被认为是一次成功，被称为“辉煌的小战争”。
Success, hell, if Teddy Roosevelt is to be believed, it was downright fun.
成功了，见鬼，如果泰迪·罗斯福可信的话，那真是太有趣了。
In his memoir of his Rough Riders days, he can't stop using the word "delighted."
在他的《Rough Riders》回忆录中，他不停地使用“高兴”这个词。
All fine until the war ended.
一切都很好，直到战争结束。
The very fact that we call it the Spanish American War hints that Cuban sovereignty was a fairly low priority for the McKinley administration.
我们称之为美西战争这一事实本身就暗示，对于麦金莱政府来说，古巴主权的优先级相当低。
As the Cuban revolutionary hero Jose Marti worried, "Once the United States is in Cuba, who will drive them out?" After the United States signed a treaty with Spain in 1898, we occupied Cuba for the next five years.
正如古巴革命英雄何塞·马蒂所担心的那样，“美国一旦进入古巴，谁会把他们赶出去呢？” 1898年美国与西班牙签署条约后，我们在接下来的五年内占领了古巴。
In 1902, Cuba became nominally independent thanks to an American act of Congress.
1902年，由于美国国会法案，古巴名义上独立。
It was called the Platt amendment, but a better name for it might have been "Buenos Dias Fidel."
它被称为普拉特修正案，但更好的名称可能是“Buenos Dias Fidel”。
It kept Cuba under US protection and gave us the right to intervene in Cuban affairs, which we did for the next half century, re-occupying the country every few years and propping up a series of dictators, crooks and boobs.
它使古巴处于美国的保护之下，并赋予我们干预古巴事务的权利，我们在接下来的半个世纪里一直这样做，每隔几年就重新占领这个国家，并扶植一系列独裁者、骗子和骗子。
The last one, a sergeant named Batista, was one of the monsters created in part by American military aid.
最后一个是一位名叫巴蒂斯塔的中士，他是部分由美国军事援助创造的怪物之一。
When the revolution came in 1959, all American businesses in Cuba were nationalized without compensation.
1959 年革命爆发时，所有在古巴的美国企业都被无偿国有化。
"Yankee," said Castro, "go home.
“美国佬，”卡斯特罗说，“回家吧。
And oh, by the way, how do you like them missiles?" Which is to say our clunky post-war policy after the Spanish American War actually led the world to the brink of nuclear annihilation in 1962.
哦，顺便问一下，你觉得这些导弹怎么样？”也就是说，我们在美西战争后笨拙的战后政策实际上导致世界在1962年濒临核毁灭的边缘。
And a hundred five years later, Cuba still isn't free.
一百五年后，古巴仍然没有自由。
But back at the beginning of the Spanish American War, like at the beginning of this war, Americans understood that their country's role in the world was changing for good.
但早在美西战争开始时，就像这场战争开始时一样，美国人就明白他们的国家在世界上的角色正在永远改变。
Immediately after, we fought a not-so-splendid war to take over the Philippines that dragged on for years.
紧接着，我们为夺取菲律宾而打了一场不那么精彩的战争，这场战争拖了好几年。
Theodore Roosevelt became a national hero thanks to his Rough Rider exploits and was President by 1901.
西奥多·罗斯福 (Theodore Roosevelt) 因其在“野蛮骑士”中的功绩而成为民族英雄，并于 1901 年就任总统。
He built the Panama Canal, brokered a peace treaty between Russia and Japan, secured Moroccan independence and sent the great white fleet of the US Navy on tour around the globe to show the world that the US was now a power to contend with.
他修建了巴拿马运河，斡旋了俄罗斯和日本之间的和平条约，确保了摩洛哥的独立，并派遣美国海军的白色舰队进行全球巡演，向世界表明美国现在是一个可以与之抗衡的力量。
Before long, we were in World War I and the whole country was humming the tune "Over There."
不久之后，我们就陷入了第一次世界大战，整个国家都在哼唱“那边”的曲调。
Finally, there's one more side effect of America's first attempt at regime change.
最后，美国第一次尝试政权更迭还有一个副作用。
The Platt amendment, signed by President McKinley in 1901, required the Cubans to lease land to the US Navy.
麦金莱总统于 1901 年签署的普拉特修正案要求古巴向美国海军租赁土地。
That base at Guantanamo Bay is currently the home of several hundred Taliban and other prisoners of the War On Terror.
关塔那摩湾基地目前关押着数百名塔利班和其他反恐战争囚犯。
I like to believe that if Saddam Hussein is captured, he'll be put in a brig on the USS Theodore Roosevelt and taken to await trial in a cell at Guantanamo Bay.
我愿意相信，如果萨达姆·侯赛因被捕，他将被关进西奥多·罗斯福号航空母舰的双桅船，并在关塔那摩湾的牢房里等待审判。
Sarah Vowell is author of The Partly Cloudy Patriot and a regular contributor to our program.
莎拉·沃威尔 (Sarah Vowell) 是《部分多云的爱国者》一书的作者，也是我们项目的定期撰稿人。
[MUSIC - "THE GULF WAR SONG" BY MOXY FURVOUS]
[音乐 - MOXY FURVOUS 的《海湾战争之歌》]
Act Five, What Peacetime Forgets About Wartime.
第五幕，和平时期忘记战时的事情。
In a weekly paper here in Chicago a few years back, The Chicago Reader , a writer named Lee Sandlin wrote a story about what it is that makes wartime different.
几年前，在芝加哥的一份周报《芝加哥读者》中，一位名叫李·桑德林的作家写了一篇关于战时为何不同的故事。
About the particular psychology of being at war, the things that a country goes through in war that it does not experience any other time.
关于战争中的特殊心理，一个国家在战争中经历的事情是在其他时候没有经历过的。
It was a massive historical article.
这是一篇篇幅巨大的历史文章。
Here's an excerpt, which we ran a few years back but seemed appropriate this weekend.
这是我们几年前的摘录，但这个周末似乎很合适。
It's read for us by Matt Malloy.
马特·马洛伊为我们朗读了这本书。
Back when the forest still stretched in an unbroken expanse from Scandinavia to the Urals, the Vikings who inhabited its northernmost reaches wrote down their own stories about war.
当森林仍然从斯堪的纳维亚半岛一直延伸到乌拉尔山脉时，居住在森林最北端的维京人就写下了他们自己的战争故事。
Their legends may have been garish fantasies, cursed rings and enchanted gold and dragon slayers, but when they wrote about battle, they were unsparingly exact.
他们的传说可能是花哨的幻想、被诅咒的戒指、魔法黄金和屠龙者，但当他们写下战斗时，他们却毫不留情地准确。
Their sagas still offer the subtlest and most rigorous accounts of the unique psychology of combat.
他们的传奇故事仍然对独特的战斗心理提供了最微妙和最严格的描述。
They knew that the experience of being on a battlefield is fundamentally different from everything else in life.
他们知道，在战场上的经历与生活中的其他一切有着根本的不同。
It simply can't be described with ordinary words so they devised a specialized vocabulary to handle it.
它根本无法用普通词语来描述，因此他们设计了专门的词汇来处理它。
Some of their terms will do perfectly well for a world war fought 1,000 years later.
其中一些术语非常适合 1000 年后的世界大战。
The Vikings knew, for instance, that prolonged exposure to combat can goad some men into a state of uncontrolled, psychic fury.
例如，维京人知道，长时间暴露在战斗中可能会让一些人陷入一种不受控制的精神愤怒状态。
They might be the most placid men in the world in peacetime, but on the battlefield they begin to act with the most inexplicable and gratuitous cruelty.
在和平时期，他们可能是世界上最平静的人，但在战场上，他们开始表现出最莫名其妙、最无端的残忍。
They become convinced that they're invincible, above all rules and restraints, literally transformed into supermen and werewolves.
他们坚信自己是无敌的，超越了所有的规则和限制，简直变成了超人和狼人。
The Vikings called such men berserkers.
维京人称这些人为狂战士。
World War II was filled with instances of ordinary soldiers giving in to berserker behavior.
第二次世界大战中充斥着普通士兵屈服于狂暴行为的例子。
In battle after battle, soldiers on all sides were observed killing wantonly and indiscriminately, defying all orders to stop in a kind of collective blood rage.
在一次又一次的战斗中，各方士兵不分青红皂白地肆意杀戮，不顾一切停止命令，表现出一种集体的血腥愤怒。
They were found in every army, even among those that emphasized discipline and humane conduct.
他们存在于每支军队中，甚至是那些强调纪律和人道行为的军队中。
American Marines in the Pacific became notorious for their berserker mentality, particularly their profound lack of interest in taking prisoners.
太平洋上的美国海军陆战队因其狂暴的心态而臭名昭著，尤其是他们对俘虏毫无兴趣。
In his memoir, a Marine named Eugene Sledge describes once seeing another Marine in a classic berserker state urinating into the open mouth of a dead Japanese soldier.
一位名叫尤金·斯莱奇（Eugene Sledge）的海军陆战队员在他的回忆录中描述，有一次看到另一名海军陆战队员处于典型的狂暴状态，向一名死去的日本士兵张开的嘴里撒尿。
Another Viking term was fay.
另一个维京术语是 fay。
People now understand it to mean effeminate.
现在人们将其理解为女性化的意思。
Previously it meant odd, and before that, uncanny, fairy-like.
以前它的意思是奇怪的，而在此之前，它的意思是不可思议的、仙女般的。
That was back when fairyland was the most sinister place people could imagine.
那时候仙境是人们所能想象到的最险恶的地方。
The old Norse word meant doomed.
古挪威语这个词的意思是注定的。
It was used to refer to an eerie mood that would come over people in battle, a kind of transcendent despair.
它用来指在战斗中人们会出现的一种怪异的情绪，一种超然的绝望。
The state was described vividly by an American reporter, Tom Lee, in the midst of the desperate battle of Peleliu in the South Pacific.
美国记者汤姆·李（Tom Lee）生动地描述了南太平洋贝里琉岛孤注一掷的战斗中的情况。
"He felt something inside of himself, some instinctive psychic urge to keep himself alive, finally collapse at the sight of one more dead soldier in the ruins of a tropical jungle." Lee wrote, "He seemed so quiet and empty and past all the small things a man could love or hate.
“他内心深处有某种感觉，一种想要让自己活下去的本能的精神冲动，最终在热带丛林废墟中看到又一名死去的士兵时崩溃了。”李写道：“他看起来如此安静、空虚，超越了一个人可能爱或恨的所有小事。
I suddenly knew I no longer had to defend my beating heart against the stillness of death.
我突然意识到我不再需要在死亡的寂静中捍卫我跳动的心脏。
There was no defense."
没有任何防御。”
"There was no defense." That's fay.
“没有任何防御。”那是费伊。
People go through battle willing the bullet to miss, the shelling to stop, the heart to go on beating.
人们经历过战斗，愿意子弹打偏，炮击停止，心脏继续跳动。
And then they feel something in their soul surrender.
然后他们感到灵魂中有些东西投降了。
And they give in to everything they'd been most afraid of.
他们屈服于他们最害怕的一切。
It's like a glimpse of eternity.
这就像永恒的一瞥。
Whether the battle is lost or won, it will never end.
无论这场战斗是输是赢，都不会结束。
It has wholly taken over the soul.
它已经完全占据了灵魂。
Sometimes, men say afterward that the most terrifying moment of any battle is seeing a fay look on the faces of the soldiers standing next to them.
有时候，人们事后会说，任何一场战斗中最可怕的时刻就是看到站在他们旁边的士兵脸上露出怪异的表情。
Fayness might also explain the deepest mystery of the war, why the surrender everybody expected never came.
费尼斯或许还能解释这场战争最深奥的谜团，即为什么每个人都期待的投降从未到来。
The Germans and Japanese refused to surrender even though they knew the war was lost.
德国人和日本人尽管知道战争已经失败，但仍拒绝投降。
Not until the last days of the war did either government even consider a negotiated settlement, not until they had absolutely nothing left to negotiate with.
直到战争的最后几天，两国政府才考虑通过谈判解决问题，直到他们完全没有什么可谈判的余地。
But then that's the point, a rational calculation of the odds is a calculation via the logic of peace.
但这就是重点，对赔率的理性计算是通过和平逻辑进行的计算。
War has a different logic.
战争有不同的逻辑。
A kind of vast fayness can infect a military bureaucracy when it's losing a war, a collective slippage of the sense of objective truth in the face of approaching disaster.
当军事官僚输掉一场战争时，一种巨大的狂妄可能会感染它，在面对即将到来的灾难时，客观真理感会集体滑落。
In the later years of World War II, the bureaucracies of the Axis behind the lines gradually retreated into a dreamy, paper war where they were on the brink of a triumphant reversal of fortune.
第二次世界大战后期，轴心国的官僚机构在幕后逐渐退入一场梦幻般的纸面战争，他们正处于命运逆转的边缘。
Not everybody succumbed to these fantasies, but those who understood how hopeless the situation really was also knew that defeat would mean accountability.
并不是每个人都屈服于这些幻想，但那些了解情况实际上是多么绝望的人也知道失败意味着责任。
And they had a reasonably good idea of what would happen to them if they were ever forced to answer for what they'd done.
他们非常清楚，如果他们被迫为自己的所作所为负责，他们会发生什么。
This is the dreadful logic that comes to control a lot of wars.
这就是控制许多战争的可怕逻辑。
The American Civil War is another example.
美国内战是另一个例子。
The losers prolong their agony as much as possible because they're convinced the alternative is worse.
失败者尽可能延长他们的痛苦，因为他们相信其他选择更糟糕。
Meanwhile, the winners, who might earlier have accepted a compromise peace, become so maddened by the refusal of their enemies to stop fighting that they see no reason to settle for anything less than absolute victory.
与此同时，胜利者原本可能会接受妥协的和平，但他们却因敌人拒绝停止战斗而变得如此疯狂，以至于他们认为除了绝对胜利之外没有理由满足于任何事情。
In this sense, the later course of World War II was typical.
从这个意义上说，二战后期的进程具有典型性。
It kept on escalating no matter what the strategic situation was.
无论战略形势如何，它都会不断升级。
And it grew progressively more violent and uncontrollable long after the outcome was a foregone conclusion.
在结果已成定局很久之后，事情变得越来越暴力和无法控制。
The difference was that no other war had ever had such deep reserves of violence to draw upon
不同之处在于，没有任何其他战争拥有如此深厚的暴力储备可供利用
The Vikings would have understood all this.
维京人会理解这一切。
They didn't have a word for the prolongation of war long past any rational goal.
他们没有表示战争的延长远远超出了任何理性目标。
They just knew that that's what always happened.
他们只知道这就是经常发生的事情。
It's the subject of their longest and greatest saga, the Brennu-Njals saga, or the saga of Njal burned alive.
这是他们最长、最伟大的传奇故事——布伦努-尼亚尔斯传奇，或者说尼亚尔被活活烧死的传奇故事的主题。
The saga describes a trivial feud in back-country Iceland that keeps escalating for reasons nobody can understand or resolve until it engulfs the whole of northern Europe.
这个传奇故事描述了冰岛偏远地区的一场微不足道的争斗，由于无人能理解或解决的原因，这场争斗不断升级，直到席卷整个北欧。
Provocation after fresh provocation, peace conference after failed peace conference, it has its own momentum, like a hurricane of carnage.
一次又一次的挑衅，一次又一次失败的和平会议，它有自己的势头，就像一场屠杀的飓风。
For the Vikings, this was the essence of war.
对于维京人来说，这就是战争的本质。
It's a mystery that comes out of nowhere and grows for reasons nobody can control until it shakes the whole world apart.
这是一个不知从何而来的谜团，并且由于无人能控制的原因而不断扩大，直到它震撼了整个世界。
This was the course of World War II from the fall of 1944 on.
这就是 1944 年秋天以来第二次世界大战的进程。
After the Allies at last acknowledged that despite the decisive victories of the previous summer, the Axis was never going to surrender.
盟军最终承认，尽管去年夏天取得了决定性的胜利，但轴心国永远不会投降。
That was when the Allies changed their strategy.
就在那时，盟军改变了策略。
They set out to make an Axis surrender irrelevant.
他们着手让轴心国投降变得无关紧要。
From that winter into the next spring, the civilians of Germany and Japan were helpless before a new Allied campaign of systematic aerial bombardment.
从那年冬天到第二年春天，德国和日本的平民在盟军新一轮系统性的空中轰炸面前束手无策。
The air forces and air defense systems of the Axis were in ruins by then.
那时轴心国的空军和防空系统已是一片废墟。
Allied planes flew where they pleased, day or night, 500 at a time, then 1,000 at a time, indiscriminately dumping avalanches of bombs on every city and town in Axis territory that had a military installation or a railroad yard or a factory.
盟军飞机不分昼夜地飞向他们喜欢的地方，一次500架，然后一次1000架，不分青红皂白地向轴心国领土上拥有军事设施、铁路站或工厂的每个城镇投掷大量炸弹。
There was no precedent, even in this war, for the destruction on so ferocious a scale.
即使在这场战争中，破坏如此严重的规模也是史无前例的。
It was the largest berserker rage in history.
这是历史上最大规模的狂暴之怒。
The Allies routinely dropped incendiary bombs in such great numbers that they created firestorms in cities throughout the Axis countries.
盟军经常投掷大量燃烧弹，导致轴心国的城市引发大火。
These weren't simply large fires.
这些不仅仅是大火。
A true firestorm is a freak event, where a large central core of flame heats up explosively to more than 1,500 degrees and everything within it goes up by spontaneous combustion.
真正的火灾风暴是一种反常事件，其中巨大的中央火焰核心会爆炸性地加热到 1,500 度以上，并且其中的所有物体都会因自燃而上升。
Buildings erupt, the water boils out of rivers and canals, the asphalt on the pavement ignites.
建筑物爆发，河流和运河中的水沸腾，人行道上的沥青着火。
Immense intake vortices spring up around the core and begin sucking in oxygen from the surrounding atmosphere at hurricane speeds.
巨大的进气漩涡在核心周围产生，并开始以飓风的速度从周围的大气中吸入氧气。
The Allied raids reduced cities in minutes to miles of smoldering debris.
盟军的袭击在几分钟内将城市变成了数英里的阴燃废墟。
Hundreds of thousands of people were killed, about 20% of them children.
数十万人被杀，其中约20%是儿童。
Tens of thousands suffocated because in the area around a fire storm, there's no oxygen left to breathe.
数万人因火灾风暴周围地区没有氧气可供呼吸而窒息。
Out of idle curiosity, I've have been asking friends, people my age and younger, what they know about war.
出于好奇，我一直在询问朋友们，包括我的同龄人和比我年轻的人，他们对战争了解多少。
War stories they've heard from their families, facts they've learned in school, stray images that may have stuck with them from old TV documentaries.
他们从家人那里听到的战争故事，在学校学到的事实，以及旧电视纪录片中可能留下的零散图像。
I wasn't interested in the fine points of strategy, but the key events, the biggest moments, the things people at the time had thought would live on as long as there was anybody around to remember the past.
我对战略的细节不感兴趣，但对关键事件、最重要的时刻、当时人们认为只要有人记得过去就会继续存在的事情感兴趣。
To give everybody a big enough target, I asked about World War II.
为了给大家一个足够大的目标，我问了第二次世界大战。
I figured people had to know the basics.
我认为人们必须了解基础知识。
World War II isn't exactly easy to miss.
第二次世界大战并不容易被错过。
It was the largest war ever fought, the largest single event in history.
这是有史以来规模最大的战争，也是历史上规模最大的单一事件。
So what did the people I asked know about the war?
那么我询问的人对这场战争了解多少？
Nobody could tell me the first thing about it.
没有人能告诉我关于它的第一件事。
Once they got past who won, they almost drew a blank.
当他们弄清楚谁获胜后，他们几乎一片空白。
All they knew were those big, totemic names, Pearl Harbor, D-Day, Auschwitz , Hiroshima.
他们只知道那些大的、图腾般的名字：珍珠港、诺曼底登陆、奥斯维辛、广岛。
The rest was gone.
其余的都消失了。
Kasserine, Leyte Gulf, Corregidor, Falaise, the Ardennes didn't provoke a glimmer of recognition.
卡塞林、莱特湾、科雷希多、法莱斯、阿登地区都没有引起一丝认可。
They might as well have been off-ramps on some exotic interstate.
他们也可能是在某个异国情调的州际公路上的出口匝道。
What had happened, for instance, at one of the war's biggest battles, the Battle of Midway?
例如，战争中最大的战役之一——中途岛海战——发生了什么？
"It was in the Pacific.
“那是在太平洋。
There was something about aircraft carriers.
有一些关于航空母舰的事情。
Wasn't there a movie about it?" A couple of people were even surprised to hear that Midway Airport in Chicago was named after the battle, though they'd walked past the ugly commemorative sculpture in the concourse so many times.
不是有电影讲过这个吗？”一些人甚至惊讶地听说芝加哥中途机场是以这场战役命名的，尽管他们已经多次路过大厅里丑陋的纪念雕塑。
All in all, this was a dispiriting exercise.
总而言之，这是一次令人沮丧的练习。
The astonishing events of that morning at Midway, the quote "fatal five minutes on which the war and the fate of the world had hung," had been reduced to a plaque nobody reads at an airport with a vaguely puzzling name midway between Chicago and nowhere at all.
那天早上在中途岛发生的令人震惊的事件，“战争和世界命运悬而未决的致命五分钟”，已经被简化为一块牌匾，在芝加哥和任何地方之间的机场上没有人读到一个模糊的令人费解的名字。
Is it that the war was 50 years ago and nobody cares anymore about what happened in the past?
难道战争已经过去50年了，没有人再关心过去发生的事情了吗？
Maybe so, but I think what my little survey really demonstrates is how vast the gap is between the experience of war and the experience of peace.
也许是这样，但我认为我的小调查真正表明的是战争经历与和平经历之间有多么巨大的差距。
And there's another and simpler reason the war has been forgotten.
战争被遗忘还有另一个更简单的原因。
People wanted to forget it.
人们想忘记它。
It had gone on for so many years, had destroyed so much, had killed so many.
它已经持续了很多年，摧毁了很多东西，杀死了很多人。
Most US casualties were in the final year of fighting.
大多数美军伤亡是在战斗的最后一年发生的。
When it came to an end, people were glad to be rid of everything about it.
当它结束时，人们很高兴摆脱了它的一切。
That was what surprised commentators about the public reaction in America and Europe when the news broke that Germany and then Japan had at last surrendered.
当德国和日本最终投降的消息传出时，美国和欧洲公众的反应令评论家感到惊讶。
In the wild celebrations that followed, nobody crowed, "Our enemies are destroyed." Nobody even yelled, "We've won." What they all said instead was, "The war is over." That was the message that flashed around the world in the summer of 1945.
在随后的疯狂庆祝活动中，没有人欢呼“我们的敌人被消灭了”。甚至没有人喊出“我们赢了”。相反，他们都说：“战争结束了。”这就是 1945 年夏天传遍全世界的信息。
"The war is over.
“战争结束了。
The war is over."
战争结束了。”
Matt Malloy, reading an article by Lee Sandlin that appeared in The Chicago Reader.
马特·马洛伊（Matt Malloy）正在阅读李·桑德林（Lee Sandlin）发表在《芝加哥读者》上的文章。
[MUSIC - "REMEMBER PEARL HARBOR" BY SAMMY KAYE AND HIS ORCHESTRA WITH THE GLEE CLUB]
[音乐 - Sammy KAYE 和他的管弦乐团与欢乐合唱团的《记住珍珠港》]
Act Six.
第六幕。
Now this story from a preventive act of war committed 3,200 years ago in modern day Turkey, not far from Iraq.
这个故事发生在 3200 年前发生在距离伊拉克不远的现代土耳其的一场预防性战争中。
Or anyway that's how the story goes.
或者无论如何，故事就是这样发展的。
After the Trojan War, this bloody, ten year war that left Troy devastated, the Greeks, who won that war, felt that they could not leave Troy unless they killed all the children of the King.
特洛伊战争结束后，这场血腥的十年战争让特洛伊满目疮痍，赢得这场战争的希腊人感到，除非杀死国王所有的孩子，否则他们无法离开特洛伊。
They assumed that one of his kids might some day grow up to lead the Trojans in a war of revenge against them.
他们认为他的一个孩子有一天可能长大后领导特洛伊人对他们进行一场复仇战争。
One little grandson was still left, maybe three or four years old.
还剩下一个小孙子，大概三四岁了。
And one of the Greeks, Ulysses, goes to the boy's mom to talk her into handing him over so that neither country will have to face another war.
其中一位希腊人尤利西斯去找男孩的妈妈，说服她把他交出来，这样两个国家就不必再面临另一场战争了。
Needless to say, she's not too keen on that idea.
不用说，她不太热衷于这个想法。
Mary Zimmerman is a Chicago director.
玛丽·齐默尔曼是一位芝加哥导演。
She won the MacArthur Genius Grant.
她获得了麦克阿瑟天才奖。
She won last year's Tony for Best Director.
她赢得了去年的托尼奖最佳导演奖。
And she's now directing the play The Trojan Women , written 2,000 years ago, telling this story.
她现在正在导演2000年前写的戏剧《特洛伊妇女》，讲述这个故事。
She says that from the play's opening, it's hard not to think about very recent events.
她说，从剧一开始，就很难不去思考最近发生的事件。
It starts out with language that recalls our own ground zero really, really closely.
它以非常非常密切地回忆起我们自己的归零地的语言开始。
And so we have this profound identification with the victims in the play to begin with.
因此，我们一开始就对剧中的受害者产生了深刻的认同。
But then, when the aggressors come on, their language sounds so much like the language of our own administration that this strange flip happens.
但随后，当侵略者出现时，他们的语言听起来非常像我们自己政府的语言，以至于发生了这种奇怪的转变。
But at the beginning, Hecuba is lying in this pile of rubble and she says-- and this is the really killer part to me-- "Never did we imagine the ground we stood on would give away, shudder, gape open and swallow all we had and were.
但一开始，赫卡芭躺在这堆瓦砾中，她说——这对我来说是真正致命的部分——“我们从来没有想象过我们所站的地面会泄露、颤抖、张开并吞噬我们拥有的一切。
We supposed that gods had built the city.
我们认为神建造了这座城市。
We believed ourselves to be safe.
我们相信自己是安全的。
Nothing is safe for sure but ruin itself.
除了毁灭自己之外，没有什么是绝对安全的。
In billows of black smoke, the sky is obliterated.
滚滚黑烟之中，天空被淹没。
Daylight itself is in mourning.
白天本身就处于哀悼之中。
The air is thick with ashes and a foul smell like that of cooking meat, except we know it's human flesh, and gag and try to hold our breath."
空气中弥漫着浓浓的灰烬和一股像煮肉一样的恶臭，只是我们知道那是人肉，我们会作呕并试图屏住呼吸。”
And then Ulysses comes on from the other side.
然后尤利西斯从另一边上来。
And he's there on a mission to basically kill a little boy who the Greeks don't want to grow up and become a leader who will start a war against them.
他的任务是杀死一个希腊人不想长大的小男孩，并成为一个对他们发动战争的领导人。
So he's on this sort of preventive war mission.
所以他正在执行这种预防性战争任务。
And when he shows up, he's using language like, "You have to give him over to us.
当他出现时，他会使用这样的语言：“你必须把他交给我们。
He threatens the peace.
他威胁和平。
His life is a danger.
他的生命有危险。
We cannot allow it to continue to undermine the entire region's collective security."
我们不能允许它继续破坏整个地区的集体安全。”
Yes, it very clearly is a preemptive strike.
是的，这很明显是先发制人的打击。
I have to say reading the text of this, what's most striking is how sad Ulysses is to have to do it.
我不得不说，读完这篇文章，最引人注目的是尤利西斯不得不这样做是多么悲伤。
He's the one who has to go out and get the kid from the kid's mother.
他是那个必须出去把孩子从孩子母亲那里接回来的人。
He is sad.
他很伤心。
He knows it's a disgusting job he has.
他知道他的工作很恶心。
But he knows he has to do it, and he's done it before.
但他知道他必须这么做，而且他以前就这么做过。
He knows it's his lot.
他知道这是他的命运。
The war machine is rolling over him as it's rolling over everyone else and forcing him into being this kind of person.
战争机器碾压着他，就像碾压着其他人一样，迫使他成为这样的人。
It's interesting.
这很有趣。
As the whole discussion goes on when finally she gives the boy over to him, and then says goodbye to him, she pretty much admits that he's right.
随着整个讨论的继续，当她最终把男孩交给他，然后向他道别时，她几乎承认他是对的。
Yeah, she does.
是的，她确实如此。
Ira Glass That if he left her [INAUDIBLE]
Ira Glass 如果他离开她[听不清]
--complex about the play and what the Greeks understood about war is that it doesn't end.
——这部剧的复杂之处在于，希腊人对战争的理解是战争不会结束。
And I feel that although Andromache really does hope that the little boy could grow up--
而且我觉得虽然安德洛玛刻很希望这个小男孩能够长大——
And lead them to victory.
并带领他们走向胜利。
Mary Zimmerman And lead them to victory.
玛丽·齐默尔曼 并带领他们走向胜利。
She also makes the argument, admittedly to try and save his life, look, his spirit is broken.
她也提出了论点，坦言要尽力挽救他的生命，看起来，他的精神已经崩溃了。
"In a lifetime," she says, "could he rebuild, rearm?
“在有生之年，”她说，“他能重建、重新武装吗？
He's seen his father dragged through the dust.
他亲眼目睹父亲被拖过尘土。
What kind of spirit do you think this little boy has?"
你觉得这小子有什么精神？”
So this goes on, this discussion.
所以这个讨论还在继续。
The play proceeds.
戏继续进行。
And then when the Greeks finally kill the little boy-- one of the things that's interesting reading it is that they are just as wrecked about it as the Trojans.
然后，当希腊人最终杀死了这个小男孩时，有趣的一件事是，他们和特洛伊人一样对此感到震惊。
So let me ask you to read the speech.
那么我请你们读一下演讲稿。
A messenger comes in, reports on what has happened.
一名使者进来，报告所发生的事情。
"Through the crowd Ulysses makes his way, leading by the hand the boy who follows in confidence.
“尤利西斯穿过人群，牵着男孩的手，信心十足地跟在后面。
The crowd is hushed, solemn, and here and there one can see tears that fall from brimming eyes.
人群鸦雀无声，肃穆，时不时地可以看到泪水从眼眶中滑落。
Ulysses recites the prayers Calcus instructed, summoning gods to witness what is being done.
尤利西斯背诵卡尔库斯指示的祈祷文，召唤诸神来见证正在发生的事情。
But the boy, knowing what then must come, of his own free will departs from the script to take command himself and steps abruptly out and over and into thin air to fall and plunge in an instant down through the delicate surface of the Earth to rejoin Priam in the gloomy kingdom below."
但男孩知道接下来会发生什么，他自愿地脱离了剧本，亲自指挥，突然走出去，进入稀薄的空气，瞬间坠落，穿过地球脆弱的表面，在下面阴暗的王国里与普里阿摩斯重聚。”
The messenger goes on, "After the boy had fallen, the throng of Greeks still weeping for what had been done in their name, turned to Achilles' tomb by Roecian waters, with what thoughts who can say?
使者继续说道：“男孩倒下后，一大群希腊人仍在为以他们的名义所做的事情哭泣，他们转向罗伊西亚水域的阿喀琉斯坟墓，谁能说出他们的想法呢？
The future threat, if ever there was a threat, had disappeared.
未来的威胁，如果有的话，也已经消失了。
Would another death propitiate the whims or offend the gods as it would seem to offend any sane person watching?
如果再有一次死亡，会不会像冒犯任何一个理智的旁观者那样，安抚心血来潮或冒犯众神呢？
Greeks and Trojans weep together, appalled as the blood soaks into the thirsty earth that drinks the copious gore until it is gone.
希腊人和特洛伊人一起哭泣，当鲜血渗入干渴的大地，大地吸收着大量的血肉直至消失时，他们感到震惊。
Thus was the rite performed.
仪式就这样进行了。
Mary Zimmerman.
玛丽·齐默尔曼。
Her production of The Trojan Woman opens at The Goodman Theatre in Chicago in April.
她制作的《特洛伊女人》将于四月在芝加哥古德曼剧院上演。
Our program was produced today by Wendy Dorr and myself, with Alex Blumberg, Diane Cook and Starlee Kine.
今天我们的节目由温迪·多尔和我本人、亚历克斯·布隆伯格、黛安·库克和斯塔莉·凯恩共同制作。
Production help from Todd Bachmann and Katy Adone.
托德·巴赫曼 (Todd Bachmann) 和凯蒂·阿多恩 (Katy Adone) 为制作提供帮助。
[ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS] This American Life is distributed by Public Radio International.
[致谢]《美国生活》由国际公共广播电台发行。
WBEZ management oversight by Torey Malatia, who wondered--
托里·马拉蒂亚 (Torey Malatia) 负责 WBEZ 的管理监督，他想知道——
Is Sacajawea a province?
萨卡贾维亚是一个省吗？
Ira Glass I'm Ira Glass.
艾拉·格拉斯 我是艾拉·格拉斯。
Back next week with more stories from This American Life.
下周我们将带来《美国生活》的更多故事。
What about Mandingo?
曼丁哥呢？
Announcer PRI, Public Radio International.
国际公共广播电台 PRI 播音员。
This American Life is produced in collaboration with WBEZ Chicago and delivered to stations by PRX The Public Radio Exchange.
《This American Life》与 WBEZ Chicago 合作制作，并由 PRX 公共广播电台传送到各电台。