15: Dawn - This American Life

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00:00 00:00 Transcript Share This American Life Life Partners How to Listen Episodes Recommended About Overview Staff Announcements Fellowships Jobs Music Make Radio On The Road FAQ Submissions Merch Contact Us Our Other Shows Merch Follow Us Life Partners Subscribe to our newsletter Full episode Toggle Audio and Transcript Sync Transcript | Episode #15 | October 30, 1998 15: Dawn Note: This American Life is produced for the ear and designed to be heard.

00:00 00:00 文字记录分享此美国生活生活伙伴如何收听剧集推荐关于概述员工公告奖学金工作音乐在路上制作电台常见问题解答提交商品联系我们我们的其他节目商品关注我们生活伙伴订阅我们的时事通讯整集切换音频和文字记录同步文字记录 | 内容第 15 集 | October 30, 1998 15: Dawn Note: This American Life is produced for the ear and designed to be heard.

If you are able, we strongly encourage you to listen to the audio, which includes emotion and emphasis that's not on the page.

如果可以的话，我们强烈建议您收听音频，其中包括页面上没有的情感和重点。

Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors.

文字记录是使用语音识别软件和人工转录员结合生成的，可能包含错误。

Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print.

请在印刷版引用前检查相应的音频。

Prologue Different Voices From PRI, Public Radio International.

序言来自国际公共广播电台 PRI 的不同声音。

From PRI, Public Radio International.

来自国际公共广播电台 PRI。

From PRI, Public Radio International.

来自国际公共广播电台 PRI。

Public Radio.

公共广播电台。

Public Radio International.

国际公共广播电台。

From WBEZ Chicago, it's This American Life .

来自芝加哥 WBEZ 的《This American Life》。

I'm Ira Glass.

我是艾拉·格拉斯。

And I'm here to tell you first today about Mr. Lewis.

And I call him Mr. Lewis because, although I have asked him what his first name is and I found out, like a good journalist, I've never actually heard anybody use his first name.

我称他为刘易斯先生，因为虽然我问过他的名字是什么，但我发现，就像一名优秀的记者一样，我从未真正听到有人使用过他的名字。

So it seems kind of wrong to use it here.

所以在这里使用它似乎有点错误。

Mr. Lewis is the kind of man who has a certain effect on people.

And if you visit the school where he works, James McCosh Elementary, on Chicago's South Side, you can hear what that effect is.

At Halloween, Mr. Lewis helps the kids convert the field house out on the school's parking lot into a two-room haunted house.

It's a low-budget, handmade affair, but done so effectively that when the kindergarten, first grade, and second grade children walk in, they panic with the kind of panic that makes them drop things, that makes them scream and not stop screaming.

这是一个低预算、手工制作的项目，但做得非常有效，以至于当幼儿园、一年级和二年级的孩子走进去时，他们会因为那种惊慌失措而惊慌失措，这种惊慌会让他们丢掉东西，让他们尖叫不停。

They do not notice that the two monsters writhing on top of open graves are really just two sixth graders lying on top of barely disguised ping pong tables.

他们没有注意到，在露天坟墓顶上翻滚的两个怪物实际上只是躺在几乎不加掩饰的乒乓球台上的两个六年级学生。

They do not catch that the undead are wearing Nike cross trainers, or that sometimes, when the monsters flail about, yellow student IDs on neck chains come flopping out.

他们没有注意到这些不死生物穿着耐克全功能训练鞋，或者有时，当这些怪物四处乱窜时，挂在颈链上的黄色学生证就会掉落下来。

I want your brain.

我想要你的大脑。

I want your brain.

我想要你的大脑。

I'm hungry.

我饿了。

This sixth grader extends her arms and sends a bunch of kids running in the other direction.

The older kids play their parts with hilarious abandon, so happy they can't help grinning from ear to ear at moments when they're supposed to be scary.

年长的孩子们以滑稽的放纵方式扮演着自己的角色，当他们应该是可怕的时候，他们会情不自禁地笑得合不拢嘴。

Come on.

快点。

[UNINTELLIGIBLE] Come on.

[无法理解] 来吧。

They won't mess with you.

他们不会惹你的。

Mr. Lewis is with you.

刘易斯先生和你在一起。

Into the fray, in baseball cap and yellow jacket, walks Mr. Lewis.

刘易斯先生戴着棒球帽，穿着黄色夹克，走进了战斗中。

In theory, he's the school disciplinarian, but his reign is one of love more than fear.

Three or four small children grip onto each of his hands, and he walks them past the ping pong table of terror, telling them he'd never let anything bad happen to any of them.

三四个小孩紧紧抓住他的双手，他带着他们走过恐怖的乒乓球桌，告诉他们他永远不会让任何不好的事情发生在他们身上。

Until, suddenly, they bolt for the door.

直到他们突然冲向门口。

My group left me.

我的团队离开了我。

Hey, come on, Mr. Lewis is here.

嘿，快点，刘易斯先生来了。

That group went back out that door.

那群人从那扇门出去了。

He heads off for another group of kids to protect.

他前往保护另一群孩子。

The crowds thin after a while, and the girls on the ping pong table consent to an interview.

过了一会儿，人群渐渐散去，乒乓球台上的女孩们同意接受采访。

One of them is holding forth on the thesis that, sure, a person could look at their outfits as striped referee jerseys, or you could choose to see them as pirate costumes.

其中一个提出了这样的论点：当然，人们可以将他们的服装视为条纹裁判服，或者你可以选择将它们视为海盗服装。

When the other girl volunteers, without any prompting, this--

Mr. Lewis is like a father to all of us at James McCosh School.

刘易斯先生就像詹姆斯·麦科什学校所有人的父亲。

He nice and he fun to be with.

他很好，和他在一起很有趣。

He makes us feel good.

他让我们感觉很好。

He been here for a long time.

他已经在这里呆了很长时间了。

He knows most of our parents that went to this school and he just knows us.

他认识我们大多数上过这所学校的父母，他也认识我们。

When we're sad, sometimes he makes us happy and stuff.

He funny.

他很有趣。

He like the jokester.

他喜欢爱开玩笑的人。

He like to talk about people.

他喜欢谈论人。

They tell me about their favorite activities at McCosh, the Student Leaders of Tomorrow Club, the peer leadership workshops, cheerleading.

他们告诉我他们在麦科什最喜欢的活动、明日学生领袖俱乐部、同伴领导力研讨会、啦啦队。

Mr. Lewis is a big part of all these.

刘易斯先生是这一切的重要组成部分。

It's Mr. Lewis who made the tombstones on their ping pong table that read, "RIP, Cause of death: Gym."

刘易斯先生在他们的乒乓球桌上立了墓碑，上面写着：“安息吧，死因：健身房。”

It's Mr. Lewis who mediates their fights.

刘易斯先生负责调解他们的争吵。

It's Mr. Lewis who really knows them.

真正了解他们的是刘易斯先生。

A month after I record this tape, a child is shot after school on the parking lot just outside this building.

在我录制这盘磁带一个月后，一个孩子放学后在这栋大楼外的停车场被枪杀。

Just a few yards from the ping pong table these girls sit on.

距离这些女孩坐的乒乓球桌只有几码远。

McCosh sits in a neighborhood that has all the problems of any inner city neighborhood, and it's easy to see why the students at McCosh need someone like Mr. Lewis so badly.

麦科什所在的社区存在所有内城社区的所有问题，很容易理解为什么麦科什的学生如此迫切地需要像刘易斯先生这样的人。

And it's easy to imagine these girls, decades from now, remembering Mr. Lewis, talking about him, wondering what became of him.

很容易想象，几十年后，这些女孩还会记得刘易斯先生，谈论他，想知道他后来怎么样了。

All of us have certain figures from our childhood who assume a kind of mythic status later when we remember them.

我们所有人的童年都有一些特定的人物，当我们记起他们时，他们就呈现出一种神话般的地位。

Sometimes they're people who loved us.

有时他们是爱我们的人。

Sometimes they're more disturbing figures.

有时他们是更令人不安的人物。

Well, today, we've devoted much of our show to a story about a man who not only had one of these legendary figures in his childhood, he decided recently he was going to track down the legend, and along the way, stumbled into this kind of odd, epic story.

好吧，今天，我们节目的大部分内容都是关于一个男人的故事，他不仅在童年时期拥有这些传奇人物之一，而且最近他决定要追寻这个传奇人物，一路上，偶然发现了这种奇怪的史诗故事。

It is a story of the Old South, the New South, Chihuahuas, high society manners, homosexuals, and some [UNINTELLIGIBLE] changes in American journalism.

这是一个关于旧南方、新南方、吉娃娃、上流社会礼仪、同性恋以及美国新闻业的一些[难以理解]变化的故事。

Stay with us won't you?

留在我们身边好吗？

OK, I'm going to begin things with this song about respecting those who came before you and influenced you.

[MUSIC - "RHYMIN' ON THE FUNK," DIGITAL UNDERGROUND]

[音乐 - “RHYMIN' ON THE FNK”，数字地下]

Act one.

行动一。

So many stories about childhood are set at the first moment of adolescence, that moment when we first try to cope with the giddy, nauseating fact of what it's going to be like for us as adults.

很多关于童年的故事都发生在青春期的第一时刻，也就是我们第一次尝试应对成年后的令人头晕、恶心的事实的那一刻。

The sixth grade.

六年级。

This is where Jack Hitt's story and his search begin.

这就是杰克·希特的故事和他的搜索开始的地方。

A quick warning before we start.

在我们开始之前快速警告一下。

Parts of this story might not be suitable for younger listeners.

这个故事的某些部分可能不适合年轻的听众。

Most people have a funny little story about finding out where babies come from.

大多数人都有一个关于寻找婴儿来自哪里的有趣的小故事。

I've got one.

我有一个。

My friend Parker Coleman told me about it.

我的朋友帕克科尔曼告诉我这件事。

We were playing in his backyard at this particular time and place.

在这个特定的时间和地点，我们正在他的后院玩耍。

That being 1967 in Charleston, South Carolina.

那是 1967 年的南卡罗来纳州查尔斯顿。

Until then, I knew about the sex act only from cuss words.

在那之前，我只是通过咒骂来了解性行为。

In my mind, it was earthy, nasty, certainly forbidden.

在我看来，这是朴实的、肮脏的、当然是被禁止的。

From the air, I had picked up the idea that sex was something black folks did.

从空中，我了解到性是黑人所做的事。

Maybe whites without the right breeding.

也许是没有正确教养的白人。

Proper people did not really have sex.

正常人并没有真正发生过性行为。

A youthful impression that I've since learned is true.

But when Parker told me that babies and sex were connected my sister Diane was pregnant for the first time.

但当帕克告诉我婴儿和性是有联系的时候，我姐姐黛安第一次怀孕了。

So I punched him in the face, hopped on my bicycle, and sped on home.

But this rather standard tale of sexual awakening occurs within a larger story.

但这个相当标准的性觉醒故事发生在一个更大的故事中。

For me, a much larger story.

对我来说，这是一个更大的故事。

See, in my neighborhood, we lived down the street from a British writer named Gordon Langley Hall.

看，在我家附近，我们住在一位名叫戈登·兰利·霍尔的英国作家的街上。

A slim man who preferred bow ties.

一个喜欢领结的瘦男人。

I remember hearing one day that Gordon had left for a distant hospital-- Johns Hopkins-- and returned fully reconstituted as a woman who now preferred to be known as Dawn Pepita Langley Hall.

我记得有一天听说戈登去了一家遥远的医院——约翰霍普金斯大学——回来后完全改造成一个女人，现在更愿意被称为道恩·佩皮塔·兰利·霍尔。

My new neighbor favored Jackie Kennedy dresses and pillbox hats.

我的新邻居喜欢杰基·肯尼迪的裙子和药盒帽。

Her hair was grown out until it curled at the collar in the fashion of that time.

她的头发留长到领子处卷曲，符合当时的时尚。

She wore lipstick.

她涂了口红。

A modest '60s bosom appeared.

露出了一副朴实的60年代胸怀。

Not long after her operations, she announced her engagement to a handsome shrimper named John-Paul Simmons.

手术后不久，她宣布与一位名叫约翰·保罗·西蒙斯的英俊捕虾者订婚。

John-Paul also worked as Dawn's butler, and John-Paul was also black.

I remember hearing that Dawn's adopted mother, the British film actress Dame Margaret Rutherford, was quoted to the effect that she didn't mind Gordon changing his sex, or Gordon marrying a man of another race, or Gordon marrying into a lower station.

我记得听说道恩的养母，英国电影女演员玛格丽特·卢瑟福夫人，大意是她不介意戈登改变性别，也不介意戈登与另一个种族的男人结婚，也不介意戈登嫁给一个较低的阶层。

But she did wish that the young man was not Baptist.

但她确实希望这个年轻人不是浸信会教徒。

Such anecdotes never seemed to cease, especially after Dawn announced that she was pregnant by John-Paul.

这样的轶事似乎从未停止过，尤其是在道恩宣布她怀上了约翰·保罗之后。

I can remember seeing her a lot during this period, walking down the street, heavy with child.

我记得这段时间经常见到她，带着孩子走在街上。

Everyone said it was a pillow under her dress.

每个人都说这是她衣服下面的一个枕头。

The town began to freak, and properly did so when she returned from the secret birthing-- it was in England-- with a beautiful mulatto baby.

当她秘密分娩——在英国——带着一个漂亮的混血儿婴儿回来时，整个小镇都开始恐慌起来。

Well, that was the last straw for Charleston.

好吧，这是压垮查尔斯顿的最后一根稻草。

Unseen pressures were applied and one day I heard that the house was sold.

无形的压力施加了，有一天我听说房子被卖了。

Almost overnight Dawn disappeared, and almost as quickly, became a bizarre Gothic yarn I told to stunned audiences.

几乎一夜之间，《黎明》就消失了，几乎同样快地，它就变成了我向观众讲述的奇异的哥特式故事。

But over the years, even I no longer believed the story and just quit telling it.

但多年来，连我都不再相信这个故事，也不再讲述它了。

Eventually, one ceased to hear about Dawn at all.

最终，人们再也听不到黎明的消息了。

Now around the time she announced her marriage, I remember being sent to my brother's room.

现在，在她宣布结婚的时候，我记得被送到我哥哥的房间。

Bobby, who was 17, was given the task of setting me straight on the facts of life.

17 岁的鲍比的任务是让我认清生活的真相。

Given what was going on down the street, Bobby had a lot of ground to cover.

考虑到街上发生的事情，鲍比有很多事情要做。

I remember he confirmed Parker Coleman's story.

我记得他证实了帕克·科尔曼的故事。

Then by way of bridging his material to Dawn, he told me what homosexuals were and what they did.

然后，通过将他的材料与黎明联系起来，他告诉我同性恋者是什么以及他们做了什么。

Then he told me about transsexuals with complete details on cutting up the penis and surgically fashioning a vagina.

然后他向我讲述了变性人的故事，并提供了切割阴茎和通过手术塑造阴道的完整细节。

I was 10.

我当时10岁。

Part of what I remember of that era is that the media arrived every time there was a new outrage in the ongoing Dawn saga and that the story went national many times over the next few years.

我对那个时代的部分记忆是，每当黎明传奇中出现新的愤怒时，媒体就会到来，并且这个故事在接下来的几年里多次传遍全国。

I can remember sneaking down to that house, trying to catch a peep of anything through the wrought iron gates.

Dawn.

黎明。

She became my own Boo Radley, a sexual parable, a Zen koan of the bizarre.

她成了我自己的布·拉德利，一个性寓言，一个奇异的禅宗公案。

For me, the mystery of sex still has an overwrought tabloid grandeur to it.

对我来说，性的奥秘仍然带有小报般的夸张色彩。

Almost three decades have passed, and like I said, I've come to doubt the entire Dawn epic cycle.

差不多三十年过去了，就像我说的，我开始怀疑整个黎明史诗周期。

I knew there had to be some truth to it, but I also know that childhood memory is a net, snagging and shaping every little fact and rumor into the stuff of symbolic language.

我知道这一定有一定的道理，但我也知道童年记忆是一张网，将每一个小事实和谣言钩住并塑造成象征性语言的东西。

I assume that there is a little nugget of truth in Dawn, and I wanted to find out what it was.

我认为《黎明》中有一点真相，我想找出它是什么。

So I ran back to mom.

于是我跑回妈妈身边。

She has lived in Charleston all her life.

她一生都住在查尔斯顿。

We poured some iced tea one afternoon and sat at her dining room table.

一天下午，我们倒了一些冰茶，坐在她的餐桌旁。

When Gordon was still a guy-- Jack's Mom Can you say that?

当戈登还是个男人的时候——杰克的妈妈你能这么说吗？

That's my mom whispering.

那是我妈妈的耳语。

You can't really hear her.

你根本听不到她的声音。

What's she saying is, "Can you say that on the radio?" Here, listen again.

她说的是：“你能在广播中这么说吗？”在这里，再听一遍。

When Gordon was still a guy-- Jack's Mom Can you say that?

当戈登还是个男人的时候——杰克的妈妈你能这么说吗？

Yeah, I can say that.

是的，我可以这么说。

When Gordon was still a guy--

当戈登还是个小伙子的时候——

You see, good Charlestonians do not discuss private affairs openly.

你看，好的查尔斯顿人不会公开讨论私人事务。

If at all, we discuss them sotto voce, sometimes literally in a whisper.

This impulse is compounded by the fact that Dawn's story is so over the top that my mom can't really talk about it, even still.

道恩的故事太过夸张，以至于我妈妈至今都无法真正谈论它，这一事实加剧了这种冲动。

Dawn can not be considered seriously.

黎明不能认真考虑。

Dawn can not even be considered.

连黎明都不能考虑。

The very question is preposterous.

这个问题本身就很荒谬。

No, I never really had anything to do with him at all.

不，我和他根本没有任何关系。

Are you kidding?

你在开玩笑吧？

I didn't even hardly speak to him.

我什至几乎没有和他说话。

My goodness, Jack.

天哪，杰克。

I'm sorry, Mom.

对不起，妈妈。

I can't get Mom to really remember much about Dawn.

As we talk, she whispered to me a number of times that she really has nothing to say, would rather not talk about it, and would prefer I turn off the tape recorder.

谈话中，她多次小声对我说，她实在无话可说，宁愿不谈，更希望我关掉录音机。

So I tried to change the subject to the neighborhood we shared with Dawn because it's part of the story.

In the mid '60s, Daddy had moved the family out of the historic part of downtown Charleston, a white neighborhood, into an uptown slum called Ansonborough, predominately black.

六十年代中期，爸爸把一家人从查尔斯顿市中心的历史悠久的白人社区搬到了住宅区一个名为安森伯勒的贫民窟，那里的居民主要是黑人。

The few whites in the area were mainly homosexuals who had moved there, as we did, to buy an antebellum home for cheap and fix it up.

In this context, Gordon was just one of what was known as the "confirmed bachelors" in the 'hood.

He seemed to be very [UNINTELLIGIBLE].

他看起来非常[难以理解]。

He'd written a couple of things that, whether anybody read them or not, I don't know.

But they were written up nicely in the papers.

但它们在报纸上写得很好。

And the people mostly that entertained him were-- he did socialize a little bit with some writers and all.

And a few of the dowagers, so to speak, really had him for entertainment value, and they liked him.

而有几个太后，可以说，还真有他的娱乐价值，很喜欢他。

And then of course, later when they found out about him, they didn't.

They cut him off fast.

他们很快打断了他。

But he was a kind of a semi-sensation for a while around Charleston.

Now what made him sensational?

现在是什么让他轰动一时？

Was it that he was a writer, or that he was flamboyant, or what?

No, he was very different.

不，他非常不同。

And then he had--

然后他——

I mean, did people understand that he was possibly a homosexual?

我的意思是，人们明白他可能是同性恋吗？

No. No, I don't think they-- this was the beginning of a lot of people like that coming to Charleston.

And a lot of them have added a lot to Charleston.

他们中的很多人都为查尔斯顿增添了很多色彩。

After 45 minutes of tea drinking and considering the cultural contributions of homosexuals, mom did remember one story.

喝了 45 分钟的茶后，考虑到同性恋者的文化贡献，妈妈确实想起了一个故事。

It was not about race, or class, or genitals, or sex.

这与种族、阶级、生殖器或性别无关。

But like every Dawn account, it was Gothic, almost supernatural.

但就像《黎明》的每一个故事一样，它是哥特式的，几乎是超自然的。

It concerned Dawn's restored mansion.

这事关道恩修复后的宅邸。

When a friend of your sister's bought the house it was so horrible inside.

当你姐姐的一个朋友买下这栋房子时，里面的情况非常糟糕。

In what way?

以什么方式？

Jack's Mom All of the floors had to be re-sanded and everything.

杰克的妈妈所有的地板和所有东西都必须重新打磨。

It had animals in there.

里面有动物。

They had kept a pig in there.

他们在那里养了一头猪。

That type of thing.

那种事。

Just filthy.

只是肮脏。

Just filthy.

只是肮脏。

He kept a pig in there?

他里面养了一头猪？

Jack's Mom Well, he kept some kind of animals.

杰克的妈妈嗯，他养了某种动物。

Yeah, there was a pig in there.

是的，里面有一头猪。

And there was all kind of animals.

还有各种各样的动物。

Just everything had to be sanded and scoured, and all like that.

所有的东西都必须打磨和擦洗，诸如此类。

That's right, a pig.

没错，是猪。

See, that's how Dawn's stories kind of go.

看，黎明的故事就是这样发展的。

Anyway, Mom did suddenly recall one important detail of Dawn the person.

不管怎样，妈妈确实突然想起了黎明这个人的一个重要细节。

He had piercing brown eyes.

他有一双锐利的棕色眼睛。

I remember, he would look at you, and it would kind of almost be scary, I thought.

我记得，他会看着你，我想这几乎是可怕的。

For you Yankees who have never heard a pure Charleston accent, that's piercing brown eyes.

对于你们这些从未听过纯正查尔斯顿口音的洋基队来说，那是锐利的棕色眼睛。

I remember their haunting quality too.

我也记得他们令人难以忘怀的品质。

And as I talked to people in town, both on and off the radio, it was all they remembered of Dawn, the person.

当我通过广播和电台与镇上的人们交谈时，他们对黎明这个人的记忆就是这样。

Otherwise, the tales sounded like an emerging mythology.

除此之外，这些故事听起来就像是一个新兴的神话。

Cloven-hooved animals, Medusa-like stare.

偶蹄动物，美杜莎般的凝视。

Dawn, a Charleston legend.

黎明，查尔斯顿的传奇人物。

For most of my adult life, especially as I became a reporter, I have also seen the story cycle as a parable of modern journalism, the last stand of an old fashioned media that struggled not to let scandalous claims dictate the headlines.

在我成年后的大部分时间里，尤其是当我成为一名记者后，我也将故事周期视为现代新闻业的寓言，这是老式媒体的最后立场，他们努力不让丑闻占据头条新闻。

In my own personal history, Dawn was the first Lorena Bobbitt, Tonya Harding, or Joey Buttafuoco.

在我个人的历史中，道恩是第一个洛雷娜·博比特、托尼亚·哈丁或乔伊·布塔福科。

I only mention this because my father was the editor of the Afternoon Daily in Charleston, and he never ran a single article about the Dawn scandal.

我之所以提到这一点，是因为我父亲是查尔斯顿《下午日报》的编辑，他从未发表过一篇有关黎明丑闻的文章。

He thought it was all a publicity stunt to sell Gordon's treacly books that had titles like Golden Boats to Burma.

他认为这完全是一种宣传噱头，目的是为了向缅甸出售戈登的甜蜜书籍，这些书籍的标题是《金船》。

My father died before the wedding.

我父亲在婚礼前去世了。

But even afterwards, the local coverage was subdued.

但即便如此，当地的报道仍然很有限。

Dawn's wedding announcement appeared as a filler on the obituary page.

道恩的结婚公告作为讣告页的填充内容出现。

Meanwhile, this was a national story in the tabloids and on television.

与此同时，这是小报和电视上的全国性故事。

Newsweek splashed a full page spread of Dawn's wedding, complete with controversial photos of the interracial couple.

《新闻周刊》用整版报道了道恩的婚礼，并刊登了这对跨种族夫妇颇具争议的照片。

And the New York Daily News ran some classic headlines, "Troth is Stranger Than Fiction," said their first story on the nuptials.

《纽约每日新闻》刊登了一些经典的头条新闻，“特罗斯比小说更陌生”，这是他们关于婚礼的第一篇报道。

In another edition, there is a first person account of the wedding.

在另一个版本中，有一场婚礼的第一人称叙述。

Here, let me read it.

在这里，让我读一下。

"Dawn Pepita Hall, a British born male before a sex change operation last October, changed her name tonight, marrying her former butler, a negro.

“道恩·佩皮塔·霍尔 (Dawn Pepita Hall) 是一位英国出生的男性，去年 10 月接受了变性手术，今晚她改了名字，嫁给了她的前任管家，一位黑人。

Wearing a full-length white gown with a 12 foot train, the thin, brown-haired Miss Hall entered the wedding room in her restored Charleston mansion to the strains of "The Battle Hymn of the Republic" and was married to John-Paul Simmons, 30.

身着长12英尺拖裾的白色长袍，瘦弱的棕色头发的霍尔小姐在《共和国战歌》的旋律中步入她修复后的查尔斯顿宅邸的婚房，与30岁的约翰·保罗·西蒙斯结婚。

25 guests and a handful of newsmen witnessed the 20-minute ceremony, performed by the Reverend William Singleton, a negro who appeared ill at ease."

25 名嘉宾和几位新闻记者见证了由威廉·辛格尔顿牧师主持的长达 20 分钟的仪式，他是一位看上去很不安的黑人。”

That might be my favorite sentence of the Dawn coverage, although this one, also from the same tabloid, is close.

这可能是黎明报道中我最喜欢的一句话，尽管这句话也来自同一家小报，很接近。

Quote, "Miss Hall said the news had not been received so joyfully in Charleston's top society, in which Gordon Langley Hall, the man, once moved freely."

引用：“霍尔小姐说，在查尔斯顿的上流社会，这个消息并没有如此令人高兴，戈登·兰利·霍尔这个男人曾经在这个社会里自由活动。”

The writer of these sentences, it turns out, is an old family friend, Jack Leland.

事实证明，这些句子的作者是一位家庭老友，杰克·利兰。

He worked for my dad as a writer on the paper.

他为我父亲工作，担任报纸撰稿人。

But given the local embargo, and being no fool, Jack started stringing for the Daily News.

但考虑到当地的禁运，杰克也不是傻子，他开始为《每日新闻》做准备。

Jack is now the town elder in Charleston, a famous storyteller and authority.

Everyone knows him, and anyone who writes about Charleston must obtain an audience with Jack.

每个人都认识他，任何写查尔斯顿的人都必须获得杰克的读者。

When V.

当V.

S.

S。

Naipaul wrote his book, A Turn in the South , the entire Charleston chapter is basically a long dinner and late afternoon constitutional with Jack Leland.

奈保尔写了他的书《南方的转折》，整个查尔斯顿章节基本上是与杰克·利兰的一场漫长的晚餐和下午晚些时候的宪法。

These days, Jack has trouble walking.

这些天，杰克走路有困难。

He is living with his daughter, [?

他和他的女儿住在一起，[？

Chivas, ?] way outside of town at a spit of land in the woods.

芝华士，？]在城外树林里的一小块土地上。

[?

[？

Chivas' ?] new house, provided by post hurricane Hugo funds, has stunning views past a yard full of oaks, the obligatory Spanish moss snagging every branch, and then a small creek and a vista of brown green marsh grass out to the horizon.

芝华士的新房子是由飓风雨果基金提供的，穿过满是橡树的院子，每根树枝上都长满了西班牙苔藓，然后是一条小溪和棕绿色沼泽草的远景，一直延伸到地平线，景色令人惊叹。

Jack spends his morning with an attendant in the quiet of the house taking in the view.

杰克和一名服务员一起在房子里安静地欣赏风景，度过了一个早晨。

So I stopped by.

所以我停下来了。

He remembered Gordon.

他记得戈登。

He came down there with a very good recommendation.

他带着非常好的推荐来到那里。

He knew the proper people in New York, and he had written a book, and he had an English accent.

And that was enough to make him the darling of Charleston society for a while.

这足以让他一度成为查尔斯顿上流社会的宠儿。

Until they found out he was a homosexual, then they dropped him.

直到他们发现他是同性恋，才抛弃了他。

Because at that time, being a homosexual wasn't exactly proper in Charleston.

At that time.

当时。

I forgot to ask Jack when it became proper to be a homosexual in Charleston.

Anyway, Jack is the only person I know who attended the famous wedding of Dawn Langley Hall and John-Paul Simmons, at the house on 56 Society Street.

无论如何，杰克是我认识的唯一一个参加过道恩·兰利·霍尔 (Dawn Langley Hall) 和约翰·保罗·西蒙斯 (John-Paul Simmons) 在社会街 56 号房子举行的著名婚礼的人。

It was a farce.

这是一场闹剧。

They were all gathered in the living room, the big living room.

There was a group of people in there, and the bride wasn't present.

那里有一群人，新娘却没有在场。

They had a negro minister who couldn't read the prayer book properly.

And they had a makeshift altar in front of the fireplace.

There was a TV station there.

那里有一个电视台。

And when the bridal party came down the stairs to the tune of "The Battle Hymn of the Republic," which I thought was the beginning of a farce at the moment.

当新娘队伍伴随着《共和国战歌》的曲调走下楼梯时，我认为此刻这是一场闹剧的开始。

They came into the living room and he discovered that he would have his back to the camera.

So he made the preacher turn around and put his back to the camera and let him face the audience.

There were two little babies toting the train.

火车上有两个小婴儿。

He had a regular wedding gown on, with a mantilla on his head over a wig.

And the train was attached to the mantilla in some way and those two little ones, when they went to swing around, were swinging in a wide circle, and almost pulled his wig off.

裙摆以某种方式固定在头巾上，而那两个小家伙，当它们去荡来荡去时，荡了一大圈，差点把他的假发扯下来。

And what happened after the vows were exchanged?

交换誓言后发生了什么？

Were you there for the reception?

您在场参加招待会吗？

It was a wang bang affair with a lot of people, all black.

这是一场王邦事件，有很多人，全是黑人。

Very much all black.

非常全黑。

There were just a few whites.

那里只有几个白人。

Who was there?

谁在那里？

Jack Leland Well, I can't remember the names now.

But there were people who worked in the furniture business.

And that business generally attracted homosexuals.

The furniture business attracted homosexuals?

家具生意吸引同性恋？

In Charleston it did, the antique business.

在查尔斯顿，古董生意确实如此。

Oh, right.

哦，对了。

It turns out Jack was right about homosexuals and antiques.

In the 1960s, there was a well known, though never admitted, gay aristocracy in Charleston, centered in part on antiques, and located in my neighborhood.

20 世纪 60 年代，查尔斯顿有一个众所周知但从未被承认的同性恋贵族，其部分以古董为中心，就在我家附近。

One of those men was [?

其中一名男子是[？

Jay Romp, ?] who's still a family friend.

Jay Romp，？] 他仍然是我们家的朋友。

We spent a lot of time together when I was little.

I can remember as a boy climbing through a dense garden down the street, up a high wall to get onto his balcony.

我记得小时候，我爬过街道上茂密的花园，爬上高墙，到达了他的阳台。

To hang around and crack jokes and gossip with Jay and his hilarious friends.

与杰伊和他搞笑的朋友们一起闲逛、讲笑话、聊八卦。

I don't think I ever walked through his front door.

I thought maybe Jay would remember Dawn, maybe even Gordon, and who they were.

我想杰伊也许会记得道恩，甚至戈登，以及他们是谁。

So I called him up and one warm afternoon, he picked me up in his convertible.

于是我给他打电话，一个温暖的下午，他开着他的敞篷车来接我。

As is still the custom in Charleston, despite all the moral outrage elsewhere, we fixed ourselves what are known locally as travelers.

按照查尔斯顿的习俗，尽管其他地方存在道德上的愤怒，我们还是把自己固定在当地所谓的旅行者身上。

Drinks, that in case the vice squad is listening, we'll describe as [UNINTELLIGIBLE].

喝酒，以防刑警队在听，我们将其描述为[无法理解]。

And we drove uptown to Ansonborough.

我们驱车前往住宅区安森伯勒。

Now that's where you lived.

现在那是你住的地方。

That's where you lived.

那是你住过的地方。

I remember I used to climb in the second story window.

我记得我曾经爬过二楼的窗户。

We've got to go see that gate.

我们得去看看那扇门。

We've got to see the wall, because the other thing is that wall-- Jack, when I think about it, that wall was like 18 feet high.

我们必须看到墙，因为另一件事就是那堵墙——杰克，当我想到这一点时，那堵墙大约有 18 英尺高。

There's monkey blood in you, young'un.

There has got to be to scale those walls, because the banana trees were like 20 feet tall.

必须要爬那些墙，因为香蕉树大约有 20 英尺高。

We took the house-- rather I took it, Edward took it just because he trusted me.

我们拿走了房子——确切地说是我拿走了它，爱德华拿走了它只是因为他信任我。

And I said, it's like the dawn of creations of [?

我说，这就像[？的创作的黎明。

Astier's ?] garden.

阿斯蒂尔的？]花园。

You'll only know that when you hit the back.

只有当你击中背部时你才会知道这一点。

But as I say, to scale that wall would have been a feat, I think.

但正如我所说，我认为攀登那堵墙将是一项壮举。

Even for nine years old, you were then?

即使你才九岁，那时的你也是吗？

I think this is how starved I was for culture, Jay.

我想这就是我对文化的渴望，杰伊。

It has been so long since both of us were in this part of town that we had trouble locating Dawn's infamous house.

我们已经很久没有来到这个城镇了，所以我们很难找到黎明臭名昭著的房子。

No, wait a minute.

不，等一下。

It's this one up here.

就是上面这个。

It's up here.

就在这里。

Two that look alike, yeah.

That's the famous porch.

这就是著名的门廊。

Well, you know the wedding was held, and the music was done by, I believe at that point they called it Victrola.

嗯，你知道婚礼举行了，音乐是由我相信当时他们称之为留声机的。

A well known orchestra, of course, who played-- who knows?

当然，是一个著名的管弦乐队，谁演奏——谁知道呢？

A combination of rap, Japanese, pipe, avant garde music and Charleston spirituals.

I have no earthly idea.

我没有世俗的想法。

But anyway, it was on that porch on the other side of the garden.

但无论如何，它是在花园另一边的门廊上。

And that's where the main wedding was.

You know, when I called Jay, I didn't say, I'm doing a story about gay culture.

你知道，当我打电话给杰伊时，我并没有说，我正在做一个关于同性恋文化的故事。

I said, I'm doing a story about my coming of age in Ansonborough and Dawn.

我说，我正在写一个关于我在安森伯勒和黎明的成年故事。

The truth is, I've known Jay all my life, and we have never discussed his sexual orientation, because people in Charleston see no reason to discuss such things.

事实是，我认识杰伊一生，我们从未讨论过他的性取向，因为查尔斯顿的人们认为没有理由讨论此类事情。

As with my mom, so with me.

And even with Jay.

甚至与杰伊一起。

What would it have been like for-- well, first of all, let me ask you this.

它会是什么样的——好吧，首先，让我问你这个。

Are you gay?

你是同性恋吗？

Because I've never asked you that.

因为我从来没有问过你这个问题。

Well, let's put it as Tennessee Williams said.

I have covered the waterfront.

And the other thing is--

另一件事是——

Such a great Charleston answer.

查尔斯顿的回答真是太棒了。

Indirect, funny, no bad words.

Still, Jay can be wicked, as when he told me about calling his old roommate from those days to help jar his memory.

尽管如此，杰伊还是很邪恶，就像他告诉我打电话给他当年的老室友以帮助唤醒他的记忆一样。

When I was talking to Eddie I said to him, Jack is doing a story on Ansonborough, part of his sexual awakening.

当我和埃迪谈话时，我对他说，杰克正在写一个关于安森伯勒的故事，这是他性觉醒的一部分。

I didn't sleep with Jack, did I?

我没有和杰克上床，是吗？

My mother's going to love that part of the interview.

我妈妈一定会喜欢采访的这一部分。

As Jay and I drove around reminiscing, he told me his version of Gordon's fall from grace.

当杰和我开车回忆时，他告诉我他对戈登失宠的看法。

Now, all my life I had heard that Gordon was ostracized right after the sex change operation became public.

现在，我一生都听说戈登在变性手术公开后立即遭到排斥。

But Jack Leland had said the city shunned him even before that, when they learned he was homosexual.

Now Jay remembers a slightly more extravagant occasion.

现在杰伊记得一个稍微奢侈一点的场合。

She had her dogs make their debut in Charleston, including wearing real cultured pearls.

Get out of here.

离开这里。

I don't remember this story.

我不记得这个故事了。

What's this story?

这是什么故事？

When was this?

这是什么时候的事？

That was even in the paper, please.

甚至报纸上也有这样的内容。

And this was when he was still Gordon Langley.

那是他还是戈登·兰利的时候。

So this is prior to the sex change and prior to the marrying--

所以这是在变性之前和结婚之前——

So he was breaking rules even back when.

所以他当时就违反了规则。

This is what I mean about Dawn.

这就是我对黎明的意思。

Everyone has a story.

每个人都有一个故事。

And here it is 30 years after her sex change operation and I am still hearing fresh, new ones.

And yet, they all fit into the unique genre that is Dawn Langley Hall.

然而，它们都属于黎明兰利厅这一独特的流派。

Later during my stay, I was at a cocktail party with many Charlestonians.

在我逗留期间的晚些时候，我和许多查尔斯顿人一起参加了一个鸡尾酒会。

The dog story would come up from time to time and always slightly different.

狗的故事会时不时地出现，而且总是略有不同。

In one account I heard it was a wedding.

在一个报道中我听说这是一场婚礼。

In another it was Great Danes that were given a debutante party.

But as I moved among the different subcultures of Charleston, these stories provided me with another insight into Dawn.

但当我在查尔斯顿的不同亚文化之间穿梭时，这些故事让我对黎明有了另一种了解。

She was a scandal not only for straight Charlestonians, but for the gay aristocracy as well, two groups who were often hard to distinguish in those days.

她不仅是查尔斯顿异性恋者的丑闻，也是同性恋贵族的丑闻，这两个群体在当时很难区分。

The whole thing was you had to be married.

整件事就是你必须结婚。

So this group I'm talking about who were gay were all married men.

所以我所说的这群同性恋者都是已婚男人。

Most of them, in fact, I would say at this point all of them-- I can't think of one offhand who did not have children.

事实上，他们中的大多数人，我现在想说的是他们中的所有人——我想不出有一个人没有孩子。

I would know these children?

我会认识这些孩子吗？

Jay We went to school with them.

杰伊我们和他们一起上学。

I would know all these children, wouldn't I?

我会认识所有这些孩子，不是吗？

You'd know all these children.

你会认识所有这些孩子。

Actually, Charleston could have almost handled the change, even the black husband to some extent, all of that in time.

It would eventually, I think, have been almost accepted to some extent, like you say.

Are you talking about among the gay culture, or among the culture--

I'm talking about this gay culture who was basically straight.

我说的是同性恋文化，他们基本上是异性恋。

This married gay culture with children.

这种与同性恋文化和孩子的结合。

And I do believe that if it had not been for the publicity, that at some point, probably, yeah.

They would have been accepted.

他们本来会被接受的。

But there was publicity.

但有宣传。

And the gay culture of Charleston felt exposed.

查尔斯顿的同性恋文化感觉暴露无遗。

The way Jay described it, Dawn represented a kind of Gone with the Wind , a closing of an era for his crowd.

Their private, serene Charleston life, married, but gay, with children, would soon end in a noisy media circus of Dawn Langley Hall.

So the homosexual culture really didn't know Dawn either.

Although Jay had one encounter with Dawn, sort of like my mom's.

It was a misty evening when he and a friend had passed her on the street.

She shot them an evil look from those piercing brown eyes.

Very foggy night.

非常有雾的夜晚。

I mean, the whole thing was perfect for the scene.

我的意思是，整个场景非常适合这个场景。

And we had passed Dawn walking the dogs.

我们遛狗时已经过了黎明。

And had gone two or three steps.

并且已经走了两三步。

And suddenly, all the lights in Ansonborough went off at one time.

I mean, street lights, house lights, the whole thing.

我的意思是，路灯、房屋灯，所有的东西。

And we hauled butt then to my house.

然后我们把屁股拖到我家。

I think they were off about 30 or 40 minutes.

我想他们休息了大约 30 或 40 分钟。

We talked the other day.

前几天我们谈过。

We didn't know because we got candles and things and barricaded the door.

我们不知道，因为我们拿了蜡烛和其他东西，并把门堵住了。

But again, Dawn was supposed to have some sort of powers.

但同样，黎明应该拥有某种力量。

That was the other thing.

那是另一回事。

Now wasn't part of the story that the voodoo that she might have had was learned from her husband, right?

现在这不是故事的一部分，她可能拥有的巫术是从她丈夫那里学到的，对吗？

Well, that was the other story then.

好吧，那是另一个故事了。

Naturally, by marrying black, you would have had more, I guess, background with it then, or someone who could really teach you what to do.

当然，我想，通过与黑人结婚，你会有更多的背景，或者有人能真正教你做什么。

A few days after riding with Jay, my brother-in-law and I spent an afternoon, as we often do, hanging out at bookstores.

与杰伊一起骑行几天后，我和姐夫像往常一样在书店闲逛了一个下午。

At one called [?

一次称为 [?

Katie ?] [?

凯蒂？] [？

and ?] [?

和？] [？

Daughter, ?] I turned, look onto a shelf, and there was Dawn Langley Hall, just as I remembered her.

女儿，？]我转身，看向架子，那里是道恩·兰利·霍尔，正如我记忆中的那样。

It was a wedding picture with the cheerful, young John-Paul Simmons at her side.

这是一张结婚照，年轻快乐的约翰·保罗·西蒙斯在她身边。

The title could not have been more apt, Dawn, A Charleston Legend.

这个标题再恰当不过了，《黎明，查尔斯顿传奇》。

She had written it herself and it had just come out.

她自己写的，刚刚出版。

I picked up the book and stared at it incomprehensibly.

我拿起书，不可理解地盯着它。

I hadn't seen her in 30 years.

我已经 30 年没见过她了。

That person used to live here, said the clerk.

“那个人以前住在这里，”店员说。

I know people who knew her.

我认识认识她的人。

The writing in this book is sugary, full of romantic images, wistful goodbyes, big Fabio-like gestures.

这本书的文字很甜蜜，充满了浪漫的画面、渴望的告别、法比奥式的大动作。

Dawn drops names and Florida aphorisms with abandon.

黎明抛弃了名字和佛罗里达格言。

The first line of the book reads, "My good friend, novelist Rita Mae Brown so aptly said, 'If you take a man to Charleston and in three days he does not propose, throw him in the Crape myrtle.'"

这本书的第一行写道：“我的好朋友、小说家丽塔·梅·布朗如此恰当地说，‘如果你带一个男人去查尔斯顿，三天后他没有求婚，就把他扔进紫薇树里。’”

But my biggest discovery while reading the book was the author's bio.

但读这本书时我最大的发现是作者的简历。

I learned that Dawn and I remain neighbors.

我得知道恩和我仍然是邻居。

She lives in Hudson, New York, not far down the road from where I now live.

她住在纽约州哈德逊，离我现在住的地方不远。

So I called her up.

所以我给她打电话。

I didn't tell her immediately I was a Charlestonian, just that I would like to interview her for the radio.

我没有立即告诉她我是查尔斯顿人，只是说我想接受电台采访她。

She said she'd be delighted.

她说她会很高兴。

A few days later, I received a polite note, banged out on an old standard typewriter.

几天后，我收到了一封礼貌的便条，是在一台老式标准打字机上敲出来的。

Let me read it here.

让我在这里读一下。

"Dear Mr. Hitt, I look forward to seeing you on Sunday.

“亲爱的希特先生，我期待着周日见到您。

I am disabled now since a freak accident.

由于一场奇怪的事故，我现在残疾了。

The doctor said I would never walk again, but I am doing so quite well.

医生说我再也不能走路了，但我做得很好。

Am in the middle of moving into a townhouse, which I'm buying.

我正在搬进我要买的联排别墅。

I have lived in this rundown old Dutch house for five years because it was the only place I could find where my dog would be welcome.

我在这座破旧的荷兰老房子里住了五年，因为这是我能找到的唯一欢迎我的狗的地方。

After 10 years, we have my husband home from the mental hospital.

十年后，我们把我丈夫从精神病院带回家。

It is not easy as he hears voices and sometimes talks, shouts, and hollers all night.

这并不容易，因为他整晚都会听到声音，有时还会听到说话、喊叫和喊叫。

So many people do not understand what mental sickness can do to a family until it hits them."

很多人直到精神疾病降临到他们身上时才明白它会给一个家庭带来什么影响。”

The letter is signed rather formally, "With all good wishes.

这封信的署名相当正式：“谨致良好祝愿。

Yours sincerely, Dawn Langley Simmons."

此致，道恩·兰利·西蒙斯。”

Coming up, Jack Hitt's visit with Dawn Langley Simmons.

That's in a minute from Public Radio International, when our program continues.

一分钟后，国际公共广播电台将继续我们的节目。

It's This American Life.

这就是美国生活。

I'm Ira Glass.

我是艾拉·格拉斯。

The deeper Jack Hitt delved into the mystery of Gordon Langley Hall, aka Dawn Langley Hall, aka Dawn Langley Simmons, the more questions opened up.

杰克·希特 (Jack Hitt) 对戈登·兰利·霍尔 (Gordon Langley Hall)（又名道恩·兰利·霍尔 (Dawn Langley Hall)、又名道恩·兰利·西蒙斯 (Dawn Langley Simmons)）的谜团探究得越深入，就越有疑问。

Take, for example, this fairly straightforward clipping from the New York Daily News , November 21, 1968, page four.

以《纽约每日新闻》1968 年 11 月 21 日第四页的这段相当简单的剪报为例。

It announces that Gordon Langley Hall, biographer of Jackie Onassis and Mrs. Lyndon Johnson, has changed his sex.

And then a little ways into this article, it goes to quote from the hospital that performed most of the early sex change operations that were ever performed in this country or anywhere.

然后在这篇文章中，它引用了在这个国家或任何地方进行过的大部分早期变性手术的医院的引述。

Quote, "In Baltimore, a Johns Hopkins spokesman said, in response to a query, 'Miss Hall was a patient.

引用：“在巴尔的摩，约翰·霍普金斯大学的一位发言人在回答询问时说，‘霍尔小姐是一名病人。

Miss Hall underwent surgery.' He would not comment further."

霍尔小姐接受了手术。他不会进一步发表评论。”

When Jack Hitt finally met Dawn, even the nature of this surgery came into question.

Our story continues.

我们的故事还在继续。

On a rainy, cold morning I pulled up to her house.

在一个下着雨、寒冷的早晨，我把车停到了她家。

The only one with a bay window on the street, she had told me.

The image I had was of a mansion, like in Charleston.

我的印象是一座豪宅，就像查尔斯顿一样。

But it turns out her house is near the train station, a vacant street with neglected warehouses.

但事实证明她的房子靠近火车站，一条空荡荡的街道，周围有废弃的仓库。

Even in the morning, a bar down the way was open.

At her door, the brown paint was peeled and cracked.

In the foyer it felt dank.

门厅里感觉潮湿。

The walls were missing chunks of plaster.

墙壁缺少了大块的灰泥。

A dead vacuum cleaner appeared chucked on a heap of trash.

The wooden balustrade led up the stairs where Dawn appeared from a doorway.

木栏杆通向楼梯，黎明从门口出现。

She was small, dressed in a red smock and purple leggings.

Her grey hair was dyed red.

她的灰白头发被染成了红色。

It had three inches of white roots.

它有三英寸长的白色根。

She looked like an old lady, complete with dowager's hump.

And then there were those piercing brown eyes that had not changed in 30 years.

还有那双锐利的棕色眼睛，三十年来从未改变过。

Friend or foe, they queried.

他们问道，是朋友还是敌人。

Inside her house, there were four dogs and five cats racing up and down the wide, last century floorboards.

在她的房子里，有四只狗和五只猫在宽阔的上世纪地板上跑来跑去。

Most of the walls were scratched up.

大部分墙壁都被划伤了。

A slight aroma of ancient urine perfumed the air.

空气中弥漫着淡淡的古代尿液的香气。

A few antiques in need of some work were positioned along the walls, above which hung a gallery of photographs and paintings.

墙上摆放着一些需要修理的古董，上面挂着一个照片和绘画画廊。

As I set up my equipment, a large black man appeared in a doorway in just his underpants.

He quickly closed the saloon style swinging doors, and then leapt into a heap of blankets on a bed.

From time to time, I would hear him softly snoring.

Although I did not see him again, John-Paul's presence never left the room.

Dawn apologized for a hump, which was actually a stoop.

黎明为驼背道歉，这实际上是弯腰。

She slumped in a chair to get comfortable, adjusted her dress, and began at the beginning.

她瘫坐在椅子上，调整好自己的衣服，然后从头开始。

I was born in a country village in England with a country midwife.

我出生在英国的一个乡村，有一位乡村助产士。

And when I was born, the clitoris was so small they couldn't tell if I was a little baby boy or a little girl.

And the law in England was at that time-- it was a very cruel law, which incidentally was changed through my case.

当时英国的法律是——这是一个非常残酷的法律，通过我的案件顺便改变了它。

The law in England at that time was that, when in doubt, the child is just automatically registered as a boy, with dire results.

Now today, if that had happened, the baby is immediately taken to the hospital, and has just a little surgery, and everything is put right.

现在，如果发生了这种情况，孩子会立即被送往医院，只做一个小手术，一切都会好起来的。

In my case, it wasn't.

就我而言，事实并非如此。

And it was very difficult.

这非常困难。

I looked like a little girl.

我看起来像个小女孩。

Then when menstruation started, it was irregular and that, but it was very frightening.

然后来月经的时候，就很不规律，但是很可怕。

So here we are at the most fundamental fact of Dawn's life, and her version is totally different from what I had heard.

现在，我们来到了黎明生活中最基本的事实，而她的版本与我所听到的完全不同。

That there was no sex change operation.

没有做过变性手术。

That she was always a woman, forced to live as a man.

Then she told me that she grew up with her father, who was, in her words, the factotum and chauffeur at writer Vita Sackville-West's famous estate known as Sissinghurst.

然后她告诉我，她是和父亲一起长大的，用她的话来说，父亲是作家维塔·萨克维尔-韦斯特著名的西辛赫斯特庄园的杂役和司机。

Living there, Dawn sometimes saw Virginia Woolf and other literary visitors.

住在那里，道恩有时会见到弗吉尼亚·伍尔夫和其他文学访客。

Then, as the young Gordon, she moved to America to write for a Missouri newspaper.

然后，作为年轻的戈登，她搬到美国为密苏里州的一家报纸撰稿。

But for Dawn, every aspect of her life has a kind of gorgeousity.

但对于黎明来说，她生活的方方面面都有一种华丽。

Every anecdote has a silent movie grand gesture to it, as if it should be punctuated with Greta Garbo sweeping into the room and striking a pose near a piano.

每一个轶事都有无声电影般的宏大姿态，就好像葛丽泰·嘉宝走进房间并在钢琴前摆出姿势一样。

My first job was as a society editor in Nevada, Missouri.

我的第一份工作是在密苏里州内华达州担任社会编辑。

And it was played up in all the national press that I was the first male society editor in the state of Missouri.

所有全国性媒体都大肆宣扬我是密苏里州第一位男性协会编辑。

And all I can say is, oh, well, if only they knew.

我只能说，哦，好吧，如果他们知道就好了。

When I first decided to explore the Dawn cycle, I wanted to discover the true story of her as a person, assuming it would be so much simpler than all the embroidered rumors I'd grown up with.

当我第一次决定探索黎明周期时，我想发现她作为一个人的真实故事，假设它会比我成长过程中的所有绣花谣言简单得多。

Back home, those tales were all about myth, voodoo, the evil eye, pigs.

在家乡，那些故事都是关于神话、巫术、邪眼、猪的。

Instead, Dawn's version would turn out to be more fantastic than anything we Charlestonians had cooked up.

相反，黎明的版本比我们查尔斯顿人编造的任何东西都更精彩。

One story, for example, featured the mafia, a vengeful ex-lover, two chihuahuas, hit men, a $1 million dollar lawsuit, and the Elvis-bashing biographer, Albert Goldman, who once mentioned Dawn in an Esquire article.

例如，其中一个故事的主角是黑手党、复仇心重的前情人、两只吉娃娃、职业杀手、一场价值 100 万美元的诉讼，以及抨击猫王的传记作家阿尔伯特·戈德曼（Albert Goldman），他曾在《时尚先生》的一篇文章中提到过《黎明》。

And he said that Dawn Langley Simmons had two Chihuahuas for bridesmaids at her wedding.

他还说道恩·兰利·西蒙斯在她的婚礼上有两只吉娃娃犬作为伴娘。

Well, I didn't have two Chihuahuas as bridesmaids at my wedding.

嗯，我的婚礼上没有两只吉娃娃狗作为伴娘。

My little maid was married in the house, and she looked after the two Chihuahuas.

我的小女仆在家里结婚了，她照顾着两只吉娃娃狗。

And she brought them down to her wedding on a cushion.

她把它们放在垫子上带到她的婚礼上。

And this was the story.

这就是故事。

So I called Dena Crane, who was my media agent.

于是我给我的媒体经纪人德纳·克兰 (Dena Crane) 打了电话。

And I said, Dena, you call that Albert Goldman, and you tell him I'm suing him for $1 million if he doesn't print a retraction.

我说，德娜，你称他为阿尔伯特·戈德曼，然后你告诉他，如果他不打印撤回声明，我将起诉他，赔偿 100 万美元。

I did not have two chihuahuas as bridesmaids at my wedding.

我的婚礼上没有两只吉娃娃狗作为伴娘。

And so he called up, in turn, Dena.

于是他又打电话给德娜。

He said, you tell Dawn that if she doesn't sue me, I'll tell her who tried to have her killed in Charleston.

他说，你告诉道恩，如果她不起诉我，我会告诉她是谁试图在查尔斯顿杀害她。

And we'll come to that in just a moment.

我们稍后会讨论这个问题。

And he did.

他做到了。

He was investigating the role that the mafia had played in the drug trafficking.

他正在调查黑手党在贩毒中所扮演的角色。

They used the inland waterways and so forth, and the lonely plantations and so forth.

他们使用内陆水道等，以及孤独的种植园等。

And he was told this story in a bar.

他在酒吧里听到了这个故事。

And apparently, this group of old Charleston society people, led by this former lover, had put a contract on my life.

显然，以这位前情人为首的这群查尔斯顿老社会人士，已经与我的生命签订了契约。

And of course, that night I was alone in the house and Natasha was then been born, my daughter.

当然，那天晚上我独自一人在家里，我的女儿娜塔莎出生了。

And I heard a crash upstairs.

我听到楼上有碰撞声。

And I thought the baby had fallen out of her cot.

我以为婴儿是从婴儿床上掉下来的。

I ran upstairs, and there was a man standing over her wearing a ski mask-- a white man-- holding a knife over the baby.

我跑上楼，看到一个戴着滑雪面罩的男人站在她身边——一个白人——拿着一把刀对着婴儿。

He broke my nose.

他打断了我的鼻子。

He crippled this arm, which has never been-- I've been able to use it properly since.

他弄残了这只手臂，但从那以后我就再也无法正常使用它了。

And broke my big toe, beating me up.

And it was a rape thing.

这是一起强奸案。

And then he threw me off the porch.

The porch was three stories up.

门廊有三层楼高。

I was fortunate to land on a lump of sand.

And covered with blood, I crawled in the house.

我满身是血，在屋子里爬行。

And that actually happened.

这确实发生了。

And I was very glad to know.

But now going back to John---

I have to say how strange it was to be sitting there talking to Dawn Langley Hall.

我不得不说，坐在那里与道恩·兰利·霍尔谈话是多么奇怪。

All my life, she was a distant figure.

Even when she was the man or lady walking across the street, she was mainly myth.

即使当她是走过马路的男人或女人时，她也主要是神话。

Seeing her in her house was like sitting next to Hera, wife of Zeus.

在她的房子里看到她就像坐在宙斯的妻子赫拉旁边。

And the odd thing about a radio interview is you have to hold the microphone right in a person's face.

广播采访的奇怪之处在于你必须将麦克风放在一个人的脸上。

I was probably 12 inches from her, a weird zone of intimacy.

我离她大概有 12 英寸，这是一个奇怪的亲密区域。

I could see her pores.

我可以看到她的毛孔。

I could see the few old lady hairs above her lip, the lines in her pancake makeup.

我可以看到她嘴唇上方的几根老太太的头发，还有她薄饼妆上的线条。

I set off on this journey to separate Dawn, the person, from all the stories.

我踏上了这段旅程，将黎明这个人从所有的故事中分离出来。

And while I was sitting there, talking to her, in her house, I realized, I have always wanted to just look at her, the way a 10-year-old boy wants to look at anything new and different, like a car wreck, or people naked through a window, or a dead animal, or a good house fire, or a transsexual.

当我坐在她家里和她说话时，我意识到，我一直只想看着她，就像一个 10 岁男孩想要看任何新的和不同的东西一样，比如一场车祸，或者透过窗户裸体的人，或者一只死去的动物，或者一场大火，或者一个变性人。

When I came home that night, my wife and I sat down to exchange accounts of our day.

那天晚上我回到家后，我和妻子坐下来交换了一天的经历。

Both of us had amazing stories to tell.

Lisa is a med student.

丽莎是一名医学生。

And she told me that in the hospital that very day she had assisted with an operation on a newborn girl.

她告诉我，那天她在医院协助一名新生女婴进行手术。

The affliction is called virilization, and the symptoms are an adrenal abnormality that causes the clitoris to expand to the size of the tip of your thumb and look like a penis.

这种痛苦被称为男性化，症状是肾上腺异常，导致阴蒂扩大到拇指尖的大小，看起来像阴茎。

At the same time, the vaginal lips are fused and swell into what looks like a scrotum.

与此同时，阴道唇融合并膨胀成看起来像阴囊的东西。

These days it is easily corrected with a simple operation.

如今，只需简单的操作即可轻松纠正。

So what if it were all true?

That Dawn was born a girl, and wrongly sexed, as she called it.

So that her life, her awakening, her metamorphosis, even her child, all of that could be biologically possible.

Imagine if the hysteria and outrage that generated the entire Dawn epic cycle just boiled down to all of us reacting like a pack of enraged orangutans at something unfamiliar.

想象一下，如果引发整个黎明史诗循环的歇斯底里和愤怒归结为我们所有人都像一群愤怒的猩猩一样对不熟悉的东西做出反应。

Imagine it.

想象一下。

But I'll be honest, I've told myself these stories so many times, I can not imagine it.

但说实话，这些故事我已经告诉自己很多次了，我无法想象。

But Dawn can.

但黎明可以。

I had a recurring dream in which I saw an old fashioned glass hearse with plumes turning to go into the cemetery.

我做了一个反复出现的梦，梦见一辆带有羽毛的老式玻璃灵车转向进入墓地。

And in the casket was Gordon.

And that was a recurring dream.

And of course, I grew up at Sissinghurst.

And Virginia Woolf had written Orlando , the wonderful story about her friend and lover Vita Sackville-West.

How over the years Orlando had turned from a beautiful young man into a beautiful woman.

And so I felt in my heart that I was the living Orlando.

So here's Dawn Langley Hall, the living Orlando.

And yet, all the outlandish stories of her life are contained within an unexpected concern for propriety.

She married once in 1969.

And long after the publicity faded, she stood with her man through madness and poverty.

She never divorced or remarried, a claim that Newt Gingrich and Rush Limbaugh can not make.

她从未离婚或再婚，这是纽特·金里奇和拉什·林博无法做出的断言。

She dotes on her daughter Natasha and reports to her pew every Sunday at Christ Episcopal Church in Hudson with her two grandchildren in tow.

When you look at the pictures of Gordon, he was dapper, always in a coat and tie, very sharp looking.

Very hip in a way.

在某种程度上非常时髦。

You know, young writer guy.

And yet, Dawn turns into this rather, almost frumpy wife-like woman.

I mean, what's that about?

Well, I wanted to be a wife more than anything.

嗯，我最想成为一个妻子。

You're absolutely correct.

你是完全正确的。

Dawn was proper, the same as her family in England, the same as Charleston society.

Those are the people that I identify with.

I have always put duty first, because that was how I was brought up.

You know, when I was reading your book, you mentioned that your father was a mechanic and your mother-- I guess this was an illegitimate birth, right?

你知道，当我读你的书时，你提到你的父亲是一名机械师，而你的母亲——我想这是一个私生子，对吗？

She was 15.

她15岁。

She was 15 when you were born.

你出生时她15岁。

And yet, given the lineage on both sides, there were all these aristocrats.

Some of them English, some of them Spanish, and so forth and so on.

It's quite a list of contessas and various countesses and so forth.

You know, when I was reading that I kept thinking, it felt like a Dickens novel.

你知道，当我读到它时，我一直在想，这感觉就像狄更斯的小说。

Absolutely.

绝对地。

Jack Hitt I kept expecting at some point, someone's going to come along and discover who Dawn is.

Yeah, absolutely.

是的，绝对是。

Jack Hitt And everything will be OK.

杰克·希特一切都会好起来的。

Is that what's happened?

是这样的事吗？

This came out with-- another fellow author in England wrote and said, I always knew you came from good stock.

这是——另一位英国作家同行写信说，我一直都知道你出身很好。

And it was one of those things.

这就是其中之一。

It has been a long road.

这是一条漫长的路。

Everything has just gone full circle.

一切都回到了原点。

I've done the mansion bit.

我已经完成了豪宅的部分。

I've done the debutante bit.

我已经完成了初次登台的表演。

I've been everything.

我曾经是一切。

Now, give me a little peace.

现在，请给我一点平静。

Let me be me.

让我成为我吧。

Violating any boundary is always difficult.

打破任何界限总是很困难的。

But typically when one does cross forbidden lines-- interracial or interreligious marriage, or announcing that one is gay, or changing one's sex-- at least there is a community waiting for you on the other side.

但通常情况下，当一个人确实跨越了禁止的界限时——跨种族或跨宗教婚姻，或者宣布一个人是同性恋，或者改变一个人的性别——至少会有一个社区在另一边等着你。

But Dawn has crossed so many borders at once that she has slipped into a country where she is the only citizen.

但道恩一下子跨越了如此多的国界，以至于她溜进了一个她是唯一公民的国家。

She is poor, her husband is schizophrenic, her life is fairly harsh, her books overcompensatingly sentimental.

她很穷，她的丈夫患有精神分裂症，她的生活相当艰苦，她的书过于补偿性地感伤。

She speaks a unique language, a kind of Gothic romance.

她说着一种独特的语言，一种哥特式的浪漫。

Even as I sat in her living room-- slightly aromatic from her dogs, her once beautiful antiques aged into ruin-- it was difficult not to feel a real respect for her for roughing it out.

即使我坐在她的客厅里——她的狗散发着淡淡的芳香，她曾经漂亮的古董也随着时间的流逝而变成了废墟——我很难不对她的艰苦奋斗感到真正的敬意。

No one pressured her into the life she chose.

没有人强迫她选择她所选择的生活。

She dwells in her own private Charleston.

她住在自己的私人查尔斯顿。

Now a bona fide dowager, ready to serve tea, hospitable, even brave, but alone.

现在是一位真正的太后，随时准备奉茶，热情好客，甚至勇敢，但孤独。

When I asked her at the end of our interview if she remembered a little red-headed boy who stared into her gates, she allowed that she did.

当我在采访结束时问她是否记得一个红发小男孩盯着她的大门时，她承认她记得。

She said she had quite fond memories of the family down the street.

她说她对街上的一家人有非常美好的回忆。

She chose not to mention the obvious, that my father refused to publish her story in the local paper.

她选择不提显而易见的事情，即我父亲拒绝在当地报纸上发表她的故事。

Instead, like a true Charlestonian, she behaved as if she had stumbled upon an old acquaintance and was simply delighted to be back in touch.

相反，就像一个真正的查尔斯顿人一样，她的表现就好像她偶然发现了一位老熟人，并且很高兴能重新取得联系。

Then, as every Charlestonian I know, including myself, would do, she changed the subject to something more comfortable.

然后，正如我认识的每一个查尔斯顿人，包括我自己，都会做的那样，她把话题换成了更舒服的话题。

A few days later, I received another note that began--

几天后，我收到另一封信，开头是——

"Dear Jack, as you are my red-haired boy at the gate, I think I should call you Jack and not Mr. Hitt." She said that she had bought her new house, a modest two-story place on Hudson's Main Street.

“亲爱的杰克，因为你是我在门口的红发男孩，我想我应该叫你杰克，而不是希特先生。”她说她已经买了新房子，是哈德逊大街上一栋朴素的两层楼房。

It has some age to it, and she hopes to fix it up.

它已经有些年头了，她希望能修复它。

As is the custom in England, she wants to give the house a name.

按照英国的习俗，她想给房子起一个名字。

She's pretty much set on using the title of a book by her old mentor, Vita Sackville-West.

她几乎决定使用她的老导师维塔·萨克维尔-韦斯特所著的一本书的书名。

She wants to call her new house All Passion Spent question mark.

她想给她的新房子起名叫“All Passion Spent”问号。

She invites me to come visit.

她邀请我去拜访。

And then the letter ends casually, "Yours sincerely, Dawn."

然后信的结尾很随意：“此致，道恩。”

[MUSIC - "LA VIE EN ROSE," MARLENE DIETRICH]

[音乐 - “玫瑰人生”，玛琳·迪特里希]

Act two, Dawn of a New Era.

第二幕，新时代的黎明。

Well, up until this point in our program, you've been listening to a story that first aired on our show two and a half years ago.

好吧，直到我们节目的这一点为止，您一直在听两年半前首次在我们的节目中播出的故事。

Since then, a lot has happened.

从那时起，发生了很多事情。

Dawn, incredibly, has moved back to Charleston at the urging of her daughter.

She now lives in an otherwise all black neighborhood in a rundown old house.

She meets with old women, basically has managed to get the life that she wanted as a dowager in Charleston.

她与老妇人见面，基本上已经在查尔斯顿过上了她想要的太后生活。

Dawn's schizophrenic husband, John-Paul, now lives in a mental institution.

道恩患有精神分裂症的丈夫约翰·保罗现在住在精神病院。

And Jack Hitt has stayed in touch, gotten many letters that begin, "My dear red-haired boy." Just this month, he published a story in the magazine GQ about what he's learned since his original report for our program.

杰克·希特一直保持着联系，收到了许多以“我亲爱的红发男孩”开头的信件。 Just this month, he published a story in the magazine GQ about what he's learned since his original report for our program.

He agreed to do a little update with us.

他同意与我们一起进行一些更新。

After I did the initial interview with her two and half years ago for This American Life , she and I maintained a correspondence.

She wrote me pretty much every other day.

她几乎每隔一天就给我写信。

And each of these is a little typewritten letter?

Often a letter, but more often than not, it's an envelope containing clips from the local newspaper that are, in some way, indicative of subjects that she thinks she and I share.

通常是一封信，但更常见的是一个信封，里面装有当地报纸的剪辑，这些剪辑在某种程度上表明了她认为她和我分享的主题。

Like what kind of thing?

Jack Hitt They often have almost metaphysical significance.

For example, one story was about finding some sunken treasure just outside the harbor.

And I couldn't quite figure out what the meaning of it was until I suddenly just sort of stared at the headline where it said, "Old Charleston Continues to Yield its Secrets." And it just suddenly dawned on me that maybe that was the only reason she sent me the piece--

我不太明白它的含义是什么，直到我突然盯着标题，上面写着：“老查尔斯顿继续泄露它的秘密。” And it just suddenly dawned on me that maybe that was the only reason she sent me the piece--

It's like each one is like a little hieroglyph.

就好像每一个都像一个小象形文字。

Right.

正确的。

They're rather cryptic.

I sometimes don't quite understand why I'm getting them.

But anyway, Dawn and I very much stayed in contact.

We've seen each other a bunch of times since then.

从那以后我们已经见过很多次了。

I've met her daughter.

I've met her two grandchildren.

我见过她的两个孙子。

When you followed your story for us, when you did you story for us two and a half years ago, when the story ended, you weren't exactly sure what to believe about her story.

当你为我们讲述你的故事时，当你两年半前为我们讲述你的故事时，当故事结束时，你不太确定该相信她的故事。

And since then, with all this contact with her and meeting her family and spending more time with her, you actually now know what you believe to be the truth.

从那时起，通过与她的所有接触、会见她的家人以及花更多的时间和她在一起，你现在实际上知道你所相信的真相是什么。

Well, I do.

嗯，我愿意。

I do believe that she was born a woman with a defect.

You know, when I first interviewed her for the program, when I came home, you remember, my wife had just participated in this odd little surgery at the local hospital for this problem called virilization.

你知道，当我第一次采访她参加这个节目时，当我回家时，你记得，我的妻子刚刚在当地医院参加了这个奇怪的小手术，解决了这个称为男性化的问题。

And subsequent reporting with a pediatrician named Anjali Jain, taught me that this condition is called hyperplasia.

And that, in fact, it's common enough that every child at birth in this country is screened for it now.

Her description of what she went through, every detail, the sort of biannual menses and lack of breast development and all the various afflictions she talks about through her adolescence and into her adulthood were described exactly that way by Dr. Jain when I interviewed her.

她对自己所经历的一切的描述，每一个细节，一年两次的月经和乳房发育不足，以及她在青春期和成年期所经历的各种痛苦，在我采访她时，贾恩博士都完全是这样描述的。

Plus the fact I interviewed her daughter at length.

再加上我详细采访了她的女儿。

I found when Dawn moved back to Charleston, the daughter was there.

我发现当黎明搬回查尔斯顿时，女儿就在那里。

She's working two jobs.

And I just asked her outright.

我只是直接问她。

There are people who think that your mother is not a woman.

And she explained that she knew in a way that a daughter would know that she was a woman.

Well, she said she took care of her, right?

嗯，她说她照顾她，对吗？

She takes care of her, yeah.

她照顾她，是的。

I mean, Dawn has had a rough time physically for decades.

And the daughter has taken care of her in the way that a nurse would take care of her.

女儿就像护士照顾她一样照顾她。

One of the things that you mentioned in the story is this story that Dawn tells about an attempt on her life and Albert Goldman.

你在故事中提到的一件事是黎明讲述的关于她和阿尔伯特·戈德曼的生命企图的故事。

And in your original story two and a half years ago, you sort of presented it as like look at all the tales around this woman.

在你两年半前的原创故事中，你的呈现就像是看看围绕这个女人的所有故事。

Do you have an opinion now about whether, in fact, those things happened?

您现在对这些事情是否确实发生有什么看法吗？

To listen to Dawn tell a story, I mean I think she mythologizes herself as much as we did.

听黎明讲故事，我的意思是，我认为她和我们一样把自己神话化了。

But to a different end.

I mean, I was amazed that every story she had to tell had very similar themes to them, of a lost aristocrat being denied her due.

我的意思是，我很惊讶她所讲的每个故事都与他们的主题非常相似，一个失落的贵族被剥夺了应有的权利。

And in some way, she is, in real life-- I mean in her childhood, she was the illegitimate offspring of Vita Sackville-West's chauffeur.

在某种程度上，她是，在现实生活中——我是说在她的童年，她是维塔·萨克维尔-韦斯特司机的私生子。

He is shunned by all of these people.

所有这些人都回避他。

She always sees herself as being kept out of her real life, of the life that she was supposed to have lived.

她总是认为自己被排除在现实生活之外，被排除在她应该过的生活之外。

And it's true.

这是真的。

And those themes never escape her telling of almost any story.

这些主题几乎在她讲述的任何故事中都逃不过。

And so when she tells a story of someone breaking into her house and trying to harm her, and beating her, or whatever, I think there is a core of truth to these stories.

因此，当她讲述一个有人闯入她的房子并试图伤害她、殴打她或其他什么的故事时，我认为这些故事有一个核心的真相。

But I think it's very complicated.

但我认为这非常复杂。

I think she has a narrative way of telling her stories that make them seem, I think, preposterous to many people.

我认为她有一种讲述故事的叙事方式，这让很多人觉得这些故事很荒谬。

And that gets to one of the things about this story, which is so tragic.

这就是这个故事的其中一件事，它是如此悲惨。

There are the stories that we tell ourselves about who we are and then there are the stories that other people say about who we are.

有些故事是我们告诉自己关于我们是谁的故事，还有其他人讲述的关于我们是谁的故事。

And if those two things don't match up in large part, you're in for trouble.

如果这两件事在很大程度上不匹配，你就会遇到麻烦。

And that's what happened to her.

这就是她身上发生的事情。

The story that she believed about herself was so radically different from the story that the world believed about her.

她所相信的关于她自己的故事与世人所相信的关于她的故事截然不同。

Right.

正确的。

And realize that the world, from the very beginning, was forcing her to live a myth that she was a man.

并意识到这个世界从一开始就强迫她生活在她是一个男人的神话中。

When, in fact, on some level she was a woman.

事实上，在某种程度上她是一个女人。

In the GQ piece, there is an anecdote I ran across.

在《GQ》的文章中，我看到过一个轶事。

She kept mentioning Carson McCullers, so I went and looked up Carson McCullers' biography.

她一直提到卡森·麦卡勒斯，所以我去查了卡森·麦卡勒斯的传记。

And it turns out that Gordon is mentioned in the book.

事实证明，书中提到了戈登。

And it's a rather eerie scene.

这是一个相当诡异的场景。

There's only one mention of Gordon in the entire biography of Carson McCullers.

卡森·麦卡勒斯的整本传记中只提到戈登一次。

And McCullers comes to Charleston at some point in the early '60s, when Gordon was still very much a guy.

麦卡勒斯在 60 年代初的某个时候来到了查尔斯顿，当时戈登还是个小伙子。

And Gordon, at that point, is a well known novelist and has Carson McCullers in for dinner.

戈登当时是一位著名的小说家，并邀请卡森·麦卡勒斯共进晚餐。

This is right down the street.

这里就在街上。

This is when I'm 10 years old.

这是我10岁的时候。

And so Carson is an older person at that point, and at the end of the party-- hasn't said much the entire evening, but at the end of the party asks Gordon to come sit in a chair in the corner of the room.

所以卡森当时已经是个老人了，在聚会结束时——整个晚上都没有说太多话，但在聚会结束时，卡森请戈登坐在房间角落的椅子上。

And they talk very briefly.

他们的谈话非常简短。

And McCullers' description of this moment is that Gordon sort of talks on and on for a few minutes about this and that.

麦卡勒斯对这一刻的描述是，戈登连续谈论了几分钟这个那个。

And finally, McCullers stops him and touches him on the knee or something and says, "You're really a little girl, aren't you?" And Gordon just sort of nods enigmatically.

最后，麦卡勒斯拦住了他，碰了碰他的膝盖之类的东西，说道：“你真的是个小女孩，不是吗？”戈登只是神秘地点点头。

Jack Hitt is the author of innumerable magazine articles and numerable books.

杰克·希特是无数杂志文章和书籍的作者。

He writes about Dawn in the October 1998 issue of GQ.

他在 1998 年 10 月号的《GQ》杂志上撰写了有关《黎明》的文章。

Well, our program was produced today by Nancy Updike and myself, with Alix Spiegel, Peter Clowney, Dolores Wilber and Julie Snyder.

嗯，我们今天的节目是由南希·厄普代克和我本人以及阿利克斯·斯皮格尔、彼得·克劳尼、多洛雷斯·威尔伯和朱莉·斯奈德共同制作的。

Contributing editors Paul Tough, Jack Hitt, Margy Rochlin and Consigliere Sarah Vowell.

特约编辑 Paul Tough、Jack Hitt、Margy Rochlin 和 Consigliere Sarah Vowell。

Production help from Emi Takahara and [UNINTELLIGIBLE].

Emi Takahara 和 [无法理解] 提供制作帮助。

Music help today from Steve Cushing and [UNINTELLIGIBLE] Rattles.

今天，史蒂夫·库欣 (Steve Cushing) 和[无法辨认]拉特尔斯 (Rattles) 提供音乐帮助。

If you'd like to buy a cassette of this program, call us here at WBEZ in Chicago, 312-832-3380.

如果您想购买该节目的磁带，请致电芝加哥的 WBEZ，电话：312-832-3380。

Our email address, [email protected] .

我们的电子邮件地址，[电子邮件受保护]。

Or you know you can listen to most of our programs for free on the internet at our website, www.thislife.org.

或者您知道您可以在我们的网站 www.thislife.org 上免费收听我们的大部分节目。

That's thislife, one word, no space.

这就是此生，一个字，没有空间。

Thanks to Elizabeth Meister who runs the site.

感谢运营该网站的伊丽莎白·梅斯特 (Elizabeth Meister)。

This American Life if distributed by Public Radio International.

《美国生活》由国际公共广播电台发行。

[FUNDING CREDITS] WBEZ management oversight by Torey Malatia, who attributes our success as a radio program entirely to--

[资金来源] WBEZ 管理由 Torey Malatia 负责监督，他将我们作为广播节目的成功完全归功于——

Voodoo, the evil eye, pigs.

巫毒、邪眼、猪。

Ira Glass I'm Ira Glass, back next week with more stories of This American Life.

艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass）我是艾拉·格拉斯（Ira Glass），下周回来，带来更多《美国生活》的故事。

This American Life is produced in collaboration with WBEZ Chicago and delivered to stations by PRX The Public Radio Exchange.

《This American Life》与 WBEZ Chicago 合作制作，并由 PRX 公共广播电台传送到各电台。