The Riot Report

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: The summer of 1967 was really a crucible.

JELANI COBB，记者：1967 年夏天确实是一个严峻的考验。

You see in city after city, these uprisings—in a broad enough way that it can't be simply dismissed as coincidental.

你会在一个又一个的城市中看到这些起义——其范围足够广泛，不能简单地认为这是巧合。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: Conditions were such in every one of these cities that almost any spark could set them off.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：这些城市的情况都如此，几乎任何火花都可能引爆它们。

JOHN A.

约翰·A.

POWELL, LEGAL HISTORIAN: You had Newark, you had Detroit, you had cities all across the country up in flames…

鲍威尔，法律历史学家：纽瓦克、底特律、全国各地的城市都在燃烧……

people were wondering, can we actually have a country?

人们想知道，我们真的可以拥有一个国家吗？

PRESIDENT JOHNSON continues: the commission will investigate the origins of the recent disorders in our cities.

约翰逊总统继续说道：该委员会将调查我们城市近期骚乱的根源。

It will make recommendations to me, to the Congress, to the state governors and to the mayors for measures to prevent or contain such disasters in the future.

它将向我、国会、州长和市长提出建议，以制定未来预防或遏制此类灾难的措施。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: The commission held 20 days of hearings.

委员会成员弗雷德·哈里斯参议员：委员会举行了为期 20 天的听证会。

We heard from a lot of witnesses.

我们听到了很多目击者的说法。

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: They really were trying to get a baseline of knowledge about why American cities were on fire.

JELANI COBB，记者：他们确实试图了解美国城市为何着火的基本知识。

VESLA WEAVER, POLITICAL SCIENTIST: The Kerner Commission avoided this tendency to listen only to certain sections of society.

政治学家韦斯拉·韦弗（VESLA WEAVER）：克纳委员会避免了这种只听取社会某些群体意见的倾向。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: The commission told the truth, but it was a harsh truth.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯，委员会成员：委员会说的是实话，但这是一个残酷的事实。

Young guy: Buy your books on the Riot commission!

年轻人：在防暴委员会买你的书！

On the Riot commission!

关于防暴委员会！

Reporter: (throughout the neighborhood) more than 2000 copies of the riot report were sold in less than a week

记者：（整个街区）不到一周就售出了2000多份防暴报告

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: It really becomes a centerpiece of conversation.

JELANI COBB，记者：它确实成为了谈话的核心。

You see civic groups, churches, libraries, even police departments buying the book in bulk.

你会看到民间团体、教堂、图书馆，甚至警察部门都在批量购买这本书。

DAVID C.

大卫·C.

CARTER, HISTORIAN: Once it became clear what a political bombshell this might represent, Lyndon Johnson wants to take the legs out from under it.

历史学家卡特：一旦清楚这可能代表着什么样的政治重磅炸弹，林登·约翰逊就想把它的腿从它下面拿出来。

Anyone out at Third Precinct to check condition on Symphony Hall?

有人在第三分局检查交响乐厅的情况吗？

A large crowd gathering.

一大群人聚集。

At 94 7th Avenue, they’re shooting from the roofs.

在第七大道 94 号，他们从屋顶拍摄。

All cars in the Second Precinct, get down around Broad Street-Clay Street Bridge, a white van going to be loaded with ammunition and guns––and colored people.

第二分局的所有汽车都在布罗德街-克莱街桥周围停下来，一辆白色货车将装载弹药和枪支以及有色人种。

That’s at the Clay Street Bridge.

那是在克莱街大桥。

Any First Precinct car can check a man who was shot?

第一分局的任何汽车都可以检查被枪杀的人吗？

He’s laying in the gutter in front of 69 South Orange Avenue.

他躺在南奥兰治大道 69 号前面的排水沟里。

Fifth Precinct car.

第五分局的车。

Shoe store at Bergen and Leonard.

卑尔根和伦纳德的鞋店。

Looting.

抢劫。

Ladies and gentleman, ladies and gentleman, let me have your attention, please.

女士们先生们，女士们先生们，请注意。

Governor Hughes and the Newark city officials have earlier issued a proclamation.

州长休斯和纽瓦克市官员早些时候发布了公告。

There will be a curfew upon pedestrians starting at 11 o’clock.

11点开始将对行人实施宵禁。

Debris, broken glass, all that's left after a night of violent rioting.

瓦砾、碎玻璃，一夜暴力骚乱后留下的一切。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: The civil disorders, violent protests, that erupted in so many of America's cities during the hot summer of 1967 were just sensational frontpage, big-type news, and the same was true on television.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：1967 年炎热的夏天在美国许多城市爆发的内乱和暴力抗议只是耸人听闻的头版新闻，电视上也是如此。

They just dominated the television news: the fires, the looting, the sniping.

他们只是主导了电视新闻：火灾、抢劫、狙击。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: It caused enormous fear and anger, puzzlement.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯，委员会成员：它引起了巨大的恐惧、愤怒和困惑。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: The question was, is this some kind of organized thing?

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：问题是，这是某种有组织的事情吗？

How long is it gonna last?

会持续多久？

What can be done to stop it?

可以采取什么措施来阻止它？

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: : At the height of the Detroit riots, I introduced a resolution in the Senate.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）： 在底特律骚乱最严重的时候，我向参议院提出了一项决议。

I said, we ought to have a blue ribbon citizen's commission to look into these civil disorders––not just on a law and order basis, but getting at deeper causes.

我说，我们应该成立一个蓝丝带公民委员会来调查这些内乱——不仅是在法律和秩序的基础上，而且还要找出更深层次的原因。

That was on July the 25th of 1967.

那是1967年7月25日。

On the 27th, it was announced by the White House that President Johnson was going to have a nationwide telecast.

27日，白宫宣布约翰逊总统将进行全国电视转播。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: : And he called me that evening, not very much before he was to go on the air.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）： 那天晚上，在他要进行广播之前不久，他就给我打电话了。

And he said to me, Fred, I’m going to appoint that commission you’ve been talking about, and I’m going to put you on it.

他对我说，弗雷德，我将任命你一直在谈论的那个委员会，并且我将让你加入。

And I said, well, I’ll do the best I can.

我说，好吧，我会尽力而为。

And he said, another thing, Fred, I want you to remember you’re a Johnson man.

他说，另一件事，弗雷德，我希望你记住你是约翰逊人。

And I said, yes, sir, I am a Johnson man.

我说，是的，先生，我是约翰逊人。

And he said, if you forget it, I’ll take my pocket knife and cut your blank off.

他说，如果你忘记了，我会拿起我的小刀，把你的空白切掉。

He did not say "blank."

他没有说“空白”。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: I think he just wanted to be sure that he would get all the credit for what he had been doing in regard to race and poverty.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：我认为他只是想确保他在种族和贫困问题上所做的一切都会得到所有的赞扬。

And I should say that Lyndon Johnson did more against racism and against poverty than any president before or since, with the sole exception of probably Abraham Lincoln.

我应该说，林登·约翰逊在反对种族主义和消除贫困方面比之前或之后的任何一位总统都做得更多，唯一的例外可能是亚伯拉罕·林肯。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: Johnson took up the mantle of John Kennedy.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯，委员会成员：约翰逊继承了约翰·肯尼迪的衣钵。

President Kennedy had recommended civil rights legislation, but had no chance to pass it.

肯尼迪总统曾建议民权立法，但没有机会通过。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: Johnson made that really a major thing, and I think felt very deeply about it.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：约翰逊使这确实成为一件大事，我认为对此感触很深。

HUNTLEY/BRINKLEY: Lyndon Baines Johnson and the Great Society.

亨特利/布林克利：林登·贝恩斯·约翰逊和伟大社会。

Two weeks before he took the oath of office for the first time as president in his own right, Mr. Johnson spelled out to Congress what he wanted for the Great Society.

在约翰逊首次以自己的名义宣誓就职总统的两周前，他向国会阐明了他对伟大社会的期望。

JOSHUA ZEITZ, WRITER: In the first two or three years of Johnson's administration, owing to large democratic majorities in Congress and, uh, a well of goodwill, uh, following the Kennedy assassination, Johnson was able to pass a sweeping domestic agenda.

作家乔舒亚·蔡茨：在约翰逊执政的头两三年里，由于国会中民主党占多数，以及肯尼迪遇刺后的善意，约翰逊得以通过一项全面的国内议程。

The Civil Rights Act of 1964, which desegregated all public accommodations.

1964 年的《民权法案》取消了所有公共场所的种族隔离。

Passed the Voting Rights Act of 1965, which essentially desegregated the voting process throughout the entire U.S. South.

通过了 1965 年投票权法案，该法案基本上废除了整个美国南部投票过程中的种族隔离。

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: : Johnson also initiated the War on Poverty, and authorizes nearly a billion dollars to specifically target the places and institutions where poverty is created and re-created in education, in employment.

JELANI COBB，记者：约翰逊还发起了反贫困战争，并授权近十亿美元专门针对在教育和就业方面造成和再造成贫困的地方和机构。

It is an actual good faith effort to move the needle some on what American poverty looks like, particularly in disenfranchised communities.

这是一种真正的善意努力，旨在改变美国贫困的面貌，特别是在被剥夺权利的社区。

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: Lyndon Johnson had made the calculation about what investment in civil rights would mean politically.

记者杰拉尼·科布：林登·约翰逊已经计算过民权投资的政治意义。

He is aware that every significant step he takes simultaneously feeds this growing backlash, or what people have called "whitelash," to the civil rights movement.

他意识到，他采取的每一个重大步骤都会同时助长民权运动日益增长的强烈抵制，或者人们所说的“白人抵制”。

The idea that Johnson had set in motion a kind of government overreach.

约翰逊引发了政府的某种越权行为。

JOSHUA ZEITZ, WRITER: : You saw that manifest itself as early as 1964, when Barry Goldwater entered the presidential race and challenged Johnson.

作家约书亚·蔡茨 (Joshua Zeitz)：早在 1964 年，当巴里·戈德华特 (Barry Goldwater) 参加总统竞选并挑战约翰逊时，你就看到了这一点。

It was very clear that he was tapping into a reserve of white anger, a belief that somehow the Great Society and Johnson's civil rights agenda were going to be threatening to their communities, uh, to their jobs and to their safety.

很明显，他正在利用白人的愤怒储备，相信伟大社会和约翰逊的民权议程将以某种方式威胁到他们的社区，呃，威胁到他们的工作和安全。

MICHAEL FLAMM, HISTORIAN: Goldwater is making the argument that the doctrine of non-violent civil disobedience that is promoted by Dr. King and other civil rights leaders is fundamentally encouraging a disrespect for authority and for law.

历史学家迈克尔·弗拉姆：戈德华特认为，金博士和其他民权领袖提倡的非暴力公民不服从原则从根本上鼓励了对权威和法律的不尊重。

VESLA WEAVER, POLITICAL SCIENTIST: This is a claim that had been articulated before.

政治学家 VESLA WEAVER：这是一个以前曾阐述过的主张。

Southern segregationists are famous, in the congressional record and on the floor of Congress, for saying that civil rights agitation is breeding crime.

在国会记录和国会发言中，南方种族隔离主义者因声称民权煽动滋生犯罪而闻名。

So you've got, on the one hand, one of the largest political struggles for racial justice in our nation's history happening.

因此，一方面，我们国家历史上最大的争取种族正义的政治斗争之一正在发生。

And at that time, legislators are actively arguing that we ought to- to treat protestors as ordinary thugs.

当时，立法者正在积极主张我们应该——将抗议者视为普通暴徒。

MICHAEL FLAMM, HISTORIAN: He’s the making the argument that not only has the federal government expanded too much, not only is it spending too many tax dollars on too wide a range of social programs, but those social programs themselves are fueling the troubles that are beginning to appear in America's cities.

历史学家迈克尔·弗拉姆：他提出的论点是，不仅联邦政府扩张过多，不仅在范围广泛的社会项目上花费了太多税款，而且这些社会项目本身正在加剧美国城市中开始出现的问题。

ELIZABETH HINTON, HISTORIAN: In the 1960s, the U.S. begins to witness massive demographic changes that resulted from the Great Migration of rural black Americans in the southern states to northern and western cities.

历史学家伊丽莎白·欣顿：20 世纪 60 年代，美国开始目睹大规模的人口变化，这是由于南部各州的美国农村黑人向北部和西部城市的大迁徙造成的。

Cities were becoming blacker.

城市变得越来越黑。

Washington D.C. had come into a black majority by 1960.

到 1960 年，华盛顿特区黑人已占多数。

In Detroit and Cleveland, black people were edging majorities.

在底特律和克利夫兰，黑人逐渐占多数。

ELIZABETH HINTON, HISTORIAN: This was alarming to federal policymakers because as black populations and cities are growing, there are fewer and fewer jobs.

历史学家伊丽莎白·辛顿：这对联邦政策制定者来说是令人震惊的，因为随着黑人人口和城市的增长，就业机会越来越少。

De-industrialization is already happening.

去工业化已经发生。

VESLA WEAVER, POLITICAL SCIENTIST: For white Americans, there's a sense that society is breaking down.

政治科学家 VESLA WEAVER：对于美国白人来说，有一种社会正在崩溃的感觉。

And it was breaking down.

它正在崩溃。

Black people were saying, like, "Enough!”

黑人说，“够了！”

ELIZABETH HINTON, HISTORIAN: Social scientists and policy makers in the early 1960s start to label black youth as "social dynamite." Given this cocktail of population change and continued inequality, this group of social dynamite, these youth of color, would explode.

历史学家伊丽莎白·欣顿：20 世纪 60 年代初的社会科学家和政策制定者开始将黑人青年贴上“社会炸药”的标签。考虑到人口变化和持续不平等的混合影响，这群社会炸药，这些有色人种的年轻人，将会爆炸。

And that's exactly what happened.

事实正是如此。

JOSHUA ZEITZ, WRITER: Johnson is at his ranch in Texas, and Joe Califano his domestic policy chief, spent two days trying to get the president on the phone and couldn't.

作家约书亚·蔡茨：约翰逊在德克萨斯州的牧场里，他的国内政策负责人乔·卡利法诺花了两天时间试图与总统通电话，但未能成功。

Johnson simply shut down.

约翰逊干脆关闭了。

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: This is just days after he's cashed in all of his political chips to shepherd the Voting Rights Act through Congress.

记者杰拉尼·科布：就在几天前，他兑现了所有政治筹码，以推动国会通过投票权法案。

It's kind of indignation, almost a sense of being slapped in the face.

这是一种愤慨，几乎是一种被打脸的感觉。

JOHN A.

约翰·A.

POWELL, LEGAL HISTORIAN: We just had this, the most massive legislation in U.S. history, certainly since the Civil War, extending the rights to African Americans.

鲍威尔，法律历史学家：我们刚刚通过了这项美国历史上最大规模的立法，当然是自内战以来，将权利扩展到非裔美国人。

Why aren't you happy?

你为什么不高兴？

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: These reporters might as well have been foreign correspondents.

JELANI COBB，记者：这些记者也可能是外国记者。

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: Overwhelmingly white, overwhelmingly male, overwhelmingly middle, upper class.

JELANI COBB，记者：绝大多数是白人，绝大多数是男性，绝大多数是中上层阶级。

They were covering a different nation.

他们报道的是不同的国家。

DAVID CHAMBERS, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: The news coverage was lurid.

委员会执行助理大卫·钱伯斯：新闻报道很耸人听闻。

The tone was, big cities in America are exploding and, um, we should all be afraid

基调是，美国的大城市正在爆炸，嗯，我们都应该感到害怕

ELIZABETH HINTON, HISTORIAN: For Johnson, there's a real fear that this violence is somehow going to undercut the War on Poverty.

历史学家伊丽莎白·辛顿：对于约翰逊来说，真正担心的是这种暴力会以某种方式削弱反贫困战争的力量。

He's put in this position where he's got to maintain his commitment to addressing racial discrimination, but also his commitment to restore law and order.

他被置于这样的位置，他必须继续致力于解决种族歧视问题，同时也必须致力于恢复法律和秩序。

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: On the heels of Watts, Congress passes, by unanimous vote, the Law Enforcement Assistance Act, and that's really the point at which we can mark the beginnings of the War on Crime.

记者杰拉尼·科布：继瓦茨之后，国会一致投票通过了《执法援助法案》，这确实是我们可以标志着打击犯罪战争开始的时刻。

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: In theory, this War on Crime coexists with this War on Poverty, almost as a kind of stick and carrot.

杰拉尼·科布（JELANI COBB），记者：从理论上讲，这场打击犯罪的战争与这场反贫困的战争并存，几乎就像一种大棒和胡萝卜的结合。

And it funnels millions of dollars into increasing numbers of police and experimental crime control projects that were being enacted, by and large, in low-income communities of color.

它还将数百万美元投入到越来越多的警察和实验性犯罪控制项目中，这些项目总体上是在低收入有色人种社区实施的。

VESLA WEAVER, POLITICAL SCIENTIST: This is the first moment that we see the federal government actually sending money to help support crime control.

政治学家韦斯拉·韦弗（VESLA WEAVER）：这是我们第一次看到联邦政府真正拨款帮助支持犯罪控制。

Crime is no longer a state and local issue.

犯罪不再是州和地方的问题。

The federal government's gonna get involved.

联邦政府将会介入。

It's setting up a precedent for ever more investment.

它开创了更多投资的先例。

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: But the War on Crime in no way quelled the uprisings.

JELANI COBB，记者：但是打击犯罪的战争并没有平息起义。

You have even more of those kind of conflicts in 1966.

1966 年此类冲突甚至更多。

Uprisings in 38 American cities––from San Francisco to Providence, Rhode Island.

从旧金山到罗德岛州普罗维登斯，美国 38 个城市发生了起义。

DAVID C.

大卫·C.

CARTER, HISTORIAN: The image of civil rights in many white Americans' minds had been of African Americans beseeching the nation for decent treatment, for equality, asking white America to just accord them their basic humanity.

历史学家卡特：在许多美国白人心目中，民权的形象是非洲裔美国人恳求国家给予他们体面的待遇和平等，要求美国白人给予他们基本的人性。

The images of well-dressed sit-in demonstrators being beaten, being spat upon are so important to understanding white Americans' sympathetic attitudes towards civil rights.

穿着考究的静坐示威者被殴打、被吐口水的画面对于理解美国白人对民权的同情态度非常重要。

DAVID C.

大卫·C.

CARTER, HISTORIAN: And then you see a fundamental transition where media simply can't resist the spectacle of urban disorder.

历史学家卡特：然后你会看到一个根本性的转变，媒体根本无法抗拒城市混乱的景象。

The camera simply cannot look away.

相机根本无法移开视线。

And as much as it unsettles white viewers there's also this sort of fixation.

尽管它让白人观众感到不安，但也有这种固执。

In some ways it's confirming their darkest prejudices about black Americans.

在某些方面，这证实了他们对美国黑人最黑暗的偏见。

Now they're seeing a more menacing face of black America and they emphatically do not like what they're seeing.

现在，他们看到了美国黑人更具威胁性的面孔，并且他们非常不喜欢他们所看到的一切。

MICHAEL FLAMM, HISTORIAN: What you start to see is this phrase "we're rewarding the rioters." We're creating a climate where people understand that through uprisings, through rioting, through looting, they can gain the support of liberals who will then shower communities with new and expensive social programs subsidized by angry and anxious white voters outside of urban America.

历史学家迈克尔·弗拉姆：你开始看到的是这句话“我们正在奖励骚乱者”。我们正在创造一种氛围，让人们明白，通过起义、骚乱、抢劫，他们可以获得自由主义者的支持，然后自由主义者将为社区提供由美国城市以外愤怒和焦虑的白人选民资助的新的、昂贵的社会计划。

JOSHUA ZEITZ, WRITER: The Civil Rights Act of 1964 was fairly uncontroversial in the North.

作家约书亚·蔡茨 (Joshua Zeitz)：1964 年的《民权法案》在北方相当没有争议。

Same with the Voting Rights Act.

与投票权法相同。

Where it got tricky for Johnson was when the administration began to attempt to address systemic racism and systemic inequality outside of the South.

对约翰逊来说，棘手的是当政府开始尝试解决南方以外的系统性种族主义和系统性不平等问题时。

DAVID C.

大卫·C.

CARTER, HISTORIAN: Open Housing pushed all sorts of buttons with white Americans, in the North, in the Midwest, places where whites simply were not accustomed to living in the same geographies with black neighbors.

卡特，历史学家：开放住房对美国白人产生了各种各样的影响，在北部、中西部，这些地方的白人根本不习惯与黑人邻居生活在同一地区。

DAVID C.

大卫·C.

CARTER, HISTORIAN: That is when whites seem to say this far, but no further.

历史学家卡特：此时白人似乎只说了这么多，但没有再进一步。

JOSHUA ZEITZ, WRITER: A lot of that was driven by fear, fear of what they saw in neighborhoods that were predominantly African American.

作家乔舒亚·蔡茨：其中很大一部分是由恐惧驱动的，恐惧他们在以非裔美国人为主的社区所看到的一切。

Those neighborhoods were heavily blighted.

这些街区受到严重破坏。

Those neighborhoods were dangerous.

那些街区很危险。

There was a fair amount of crime.

有相当数量的犯罪行为。

I really envy you out here on the northwest side of the city of Chicago, because you are very, very far removed from the real problems that exist.

我真的很羡慕芝加哥市西北侧的你们，因为你们距离现实存在的问题非常非常远。

You don’t have slums within a block or two of you.

你们的一两个街区内没有贫民窟。

JOSHUA ZEITZ, WRITER: If you're one of these white voters, you're thinking like, I don't want this in my neighborhood.

作家约书亚·蔡茨：如果你是这些白人选民中的一员，你会想，我不希望这种情况出现在我的社区。

You're not seeing what's behind it.

你没有看到它背后的东西。

You just see something that scares you.

你只是看到一些让你害怕的东西。

Every taxpayer in the United States has donated money to these people.

美国的每一个纳税人都为这些人捐了钱。

For what?

为了什么？

We can be sociable with 'em in work.

我们可以在工作中与他们交往。

We can get along with them and joke with them.

我们可以和他们相处，和他们开玩笑。

But when we leave our job, close the door and are on our way home, we want them to go in their direction and we can go in ours.

但当我们离开工作，关上门，走在回家的路上时，我们希望他们朝他们的方向走，我们也可以朝我们的方向走。

JOHN A.

约翰·A.

POWELL, LEGAL HISTORIAN: Whites were saying things like, why can't you wait?

鲍威尔，法律历史学家：白人说的是这样的话，你为什么不能等待？

Even whites who were supportive.

即使是支持的白人。

It's like, we support the idea that blacks need to, to have a different life, but you're pushing too fast.

就像，我们支持黑人需要过不同的生活的想法，但你推进得太快了。

MICHAEL FLAMM, HISTORIAN: In the 1966 election, you now see conservative white politicians across the country sort of borrowing from the Goldwater playbook, and using law and order in races for Congress.

历史学家迈克尔·弗拉姆：在 1966 年的选举中，你现在看到全国各地的保守派白人政客都在借鉴戈德华特的剧本，在国会竞选中利用法律和秩序。

And Democrats in general and liberals in particular suffer serious, serious losses.

民主党人，尤其是自由派人士遭受了严重的损失。

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: If you are a Republican-elected official in 1966, you see this as a mandate to, one, do more of the same, and two, increasingly to roll back the War on Poverty, Great Society initiatives that have been the centerpiece of Lyndon Johnson's presidency.

记者杰拉尼·科布：如果你是 1966 年当选的共和党官员，你会认为这是一项任务，一是做更多同样的事情，二是越来越多地逆转反贫困战争和伟大社会倡议，这些倡议一直是林登·约翰逊总统任期的核心。

MICHAEL FLAMM, HISTORIAN: Johnson is painfully aware that the war in Vietnam is consuming $30 billion a year, while the expenditures on the Great Society are about a billion dollars a year.

历史学家迈克尔·弗拉姆：约翰逊痛苦地意识到，越南战争每年消耗 300 亿美元，而伟大社会的支出每年约为 10 亿美元。

And conservatives in Congress are going after even that small amount.

国会中的保守派甚至也在追求这一点。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: Johnson had said that "We can have guns and butter.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯，委员会成员：约翰逊曾说过，“我们可以拥有枪支和黄油。

We don't have to choose between domestic programs and the war.

我们不必在国内计划和战争之间做出选择。

We can do both." But in 1967, it was becoming increasingly clear that was not true.

我们可以两者兼得。”但到了 1967 年，人们越来越清楚事实并非如此。

Then came these terrible disorders all around the country.

然后全国各地出现了这些可怕的混乱。

JOHN A.

约翰·A.

POWELL, LEGAL HISTORIAN: You had Newark.

鲍威尔，法律历史学家：纽瓦克。

You had Detroit.

你有底特律。

You had cities all across the country up in flames and people were wondering, can we actually have a country?

全国各地的城市都在燃烧，人们想知道，我们真的可以拥有一个国家吗？

JOSHUA ZEITZ, WRITER: Johnson's being faced with a good deal of pressure to do something.

作家约书亚·蔡茨：约翰逊面临着做某事的巨大压力。

But he's really incapable of governing in the way that he had been accustomed to before.

但他确实无法按照他以前习惯的方式执政。

MICHAEL FLAMM, HISTORIAN: Lyndon Johnson is a political animal.

历史学家迈克尔·弗拉姆：林登·约翰逊是一个政治动物。

He understands exactly what is happening.

他清楚地了解正在发生的事情。

He sees the political trap that he is in, and he's desperately trying to find a way out.

他看到了自己所处的政治陷阱，并拼命寻找出路。

STEVEN GILLON, HISTORIAN: Creating a presidential commission was for Johnson the best option, because it allows him to show presidential leadership that he's aware of the disturbances that are taking place, that he's doing something about it, but it also allows him to kick the can down the road.

史蒂文·吉隆，历史学家：对约翰逊来说，成立一个总统委员会是最好的选择，因为这可以让他向总统领导层表明，他已经意识到正在发生的骚乱，并且正在采取行动，但也可以让他把事情搁置一旁。

He can say, well, I've done my part.

他可以说，好吧，我已经尽了我的职责。

I've set up this distinguished commission.

我设立了这个尊贵的委员会。

Let's wait for the recommendations.

让我们一起等待推荐吧。

DAVID CHAMBERS, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: I was in Mississippi doing civil rights work, and I remember watching a black and white television set, and Johnson speaking about this terrible crisis that was occurring in America.

戴维·钱伯斯，委员会执行助理：我当时在密西西比州从事民权工作，我记得看过一台黑白电视，约翰逊谈到了美国正在发生的这场可怕的危机。

And he announced that he was forming this commission.

他宣布他正在组建这个委员会。

We laughed, and we thought, oh my God, you know, commissions are appointed to make problems go away, not to deal with them, right?

我们笑了，心想，天啊，你知道，任命委员会是为了解决问题，而不是为了解决问题，对吗？

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: President Johnson called us together by telegram after he had appointed us.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：约翰逊总统在任命我们之后通过电报将我们召集在一起。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: We met in a cabinet room.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：我们在内阁会议室会面。

He signed the executive order and gave each of us a pen.

他签署了行政命令，并给了我们每人一支笔。

JOHN KOSKINEN, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: The president really was a conciliator who would put a lot of different people from different backgrounds together and say, come let us reason together.

约翰·科斯基宁，委员会执行助理：总统确实是一位调解者，他会将许多来自不同背景的不同人聚集在一起，说，来吧，让我们一起推理。

And they covered the political spectrum.

他们涵盖了政治领域。

STEVEN GILLON, HISTORIAN: They had to have supported some aspect of his Great Society, especially the Civil Rights Act of 64, Voting Rights Act.

史蒂文·吉伦，历史学家：他们必须支持他的伟大社会的某些方面，特别是 64 年民权法案，投票权法案。

Also, just as important, they had to have been supporting the Vietnam War.

此外，同样重要的是，他们必须一直支持越南战争。

He would not appoint anyone who was a skeptic of the Vietnam War.

他不会任命任何对越南战争持怀疑态度的人。

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: It's meant to give him the political leeway to maneuver.

JELANI COBB，记者：这是为了给他政治上的回旋余地。

You anticipate him being able to pull the strings and move this commission in a direction that's most politically beneficial for him.

你预计他能够幕后操纵并推动这个委员会朝着对他最有利的政治方向发展。

DAVID CHAMBERS, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: There were eleven members.

委员会执行助理大卫·钱伯斯：共有 11 名成员。

The chair was Otto Kerner who was Governor of Illinois.

主席是伊利诺伊州州长奥托·克纳 (Otto Kerner)。

PRESIDENT JOHNSON:: I want you to be Vice Chairman, and I don't want you to even consider thinking about it, I just want you to say yes sir.

约翰逊总统：我希望你担任副主席，我什至不希望你考虑考虑这一点，我只想你答应，先生。

JOHN KOSKINEN, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: Lindsay at that time was still a registered Republican.

约翰·科斯基宁，委员会执行助理：林赛当时仍然是一名注册共和党人。

He was a very liberal Republican, back in the old days where there were such things as liberal Republicans.

他是一位非常自由派的共和党人，在过去，还有自由派共和党人。

DAVID CHAMBERS, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: Ed Brooke, the first and the only, then, black senator since Reconstruction; a businessman…

大卫·钱伯斯，委员会执行助理：埃德·布鲁克，重建以来第一位也是唯一一位黑人参议员；一个商人……

DAVID CHAMBERS, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: ...two members of the House, McCulloch and Corman, a Republican and a Democrat; Herb Jenkins, the Chief of Police of Atlanta; the Secretary of Commerce of the state of Kentucky, Katherine Ann Peden; Roy Wilkins, the head of the NAACP; and I.W.

委员会执行助理大卫·钱伯斯：……众议院的两名议员，麦卡洛克和科曼，分别是共和党人和民主党人；赫伯·詹金斯 (Herb Jenkins)，亚特兰大警察局长；肯塔基州商务部长凯瑟琳·安·佩登 (Katherine Ann Peden)；罗伊·威尔金斯，全国有色人种协进会主席；和 I.W.

Abel, the head of the steelworkers.

阿贝尔，钢铁工人的首领。

Many very well known people.

许多非常知名的人。

And establishment people.

和建制派人士。

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: : The only activist voice is that of Roy Wilkins who by the standards of 1967, is a fairly moderate figure.

JELANI COBB，记者： 唯一的积极分子是罗伊·威尔金斯 (Roy Wilkins)，按照 1967 年的标准，他是一个相当温和的人物。

Edward Brooke was the only other Black person on the commission and he was a Republican.

爱德华·布鲁克是该委员会中唯一的其他黑人，他是共和党人。

Time Magazine had given him the really questionable honorific of NASP, or Negro Anglo-Saxon Protestant.

《时代》杂志给了他一个真正值得怀疑的尊称“NASP”，即黑人盎格鲁-撒克逊新教徒。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: People looking at this group, a lot of people thought that nothing really was going to come of it.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：人们看着这个团体，很多人认为它不会有任何结果。

And that had been true of a lot of commissions.

许多委托都是如此。

But I think Johnson really wanted a deep and full report.

但我认为约翰逊确实想要一份深入而完整的报告。

As he said, answer three questions.

正如他所说，回答三个问题。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: Johnson said Charlie Schultze, the budget director here, will take care of whatever your needs are to do what needs to be done.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯，委员会成员：约翰逊说，这里的预算主任查理·舒尔茨将满足您的任何需求，以完成需要做的事情。

In effect, money won’t be any problem for you.

事实上，钱对你来说不是什么问题。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: I didn't know John Lindsay earlier.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：我之前并不认识约翰·林赛。

But in our first meeting, John spoke out about how important he thought it was that we not just deal with the question of law and order, but that we get at deeper causes.

但在我们的第一次会面中，约翰谈到了他认为我们不仅要处理法律和秩序问题，而且要找到更深层次的原因是多么重要。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: I, from earliest time, was very interested in the plight of poor people.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：我从一开始就对穷人的困境非常感兴趣。

I grew up in a little town in Oklahoma.

我在俄克拉荷马州的一个小镇长大。

I started to work in the fields when I was five years old.

我五岁的时候就开始下地干活。

We lived in an area where Comanche Indians were all amongst us and that, I think, had some effect on me.

我们住在一个科曼奇印第安人居住的地区，我认为这对我产生了一些影响。

No Negroes lived in my town and, at one time, I think were prevented from doing so.

我的城镇里没有黑人居住，我认为曾经一度被阻止这样做。

But I knew how they were treated generally.

但我知道他们一般受到怎样的对待。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: John Lindsay was probably more knowledgeable about these issues than anybody in America at that time.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：约翰·林赛可能比当时美国的任何人都更了解这些问题。

He was living with this problem as a big-city mayor.

作为大城市的市长，他一直面临着这个问题。

He saw the desperate conditions in which so many black people lived.

他看到了许多黑人生活在绝望的条件下。

And I was convinced from the very first moment he spoke that he and I were on the same wavelength exactly.

从他说话的第一刻起，我就确信他和我的想法完全一致。

STEVEN GILLON, HISTORIAN: That first day, the very first meeting, it’s clear John Lindsay and Fred Harris wanted to push the committee into dealing with the root causes of racial unrest, which they believed was poverty and a sense of powerlessness.

史蒂文·吉隆，历史学家：第一天，第一次会议，很明显约翰·林赛和弗雷德·哈里斯希望推动委员会解决种族骚乱的根源，他们认为这是贫困和无力感。

Tex Thornton sees the commission's purpose solely to help law enforcement to crush future uprisings.

特克斯·桑顿认为该委员会的目的只是帮助执法部门镇压未来的起义。

And in every debate, just about those two on opposite sides.

在每次辩论中，都是关于那两个对立的人。

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: : This is not the group of people that you would generally expect to be a kind of fount of wisdom on a subject as intractable as race.

JELANI COBB，记者：：这群人并不是你通常所期望的在种族这样棘手的问题上的智慧源泉。

And that is the foremost challenge that confronts them the minute they walk through the door.

这是他们踏进大门那一刻面临的最重要的挑战。

What can they possibly say that can, one, lend insight into questions of race, and two, be instructive as to how the society can move forward?

他们能说些什么，一是可以深入了解种族问题，二是可以对社会如何向前发展具有指导意义？

JOHN A.

约翰·A.

POWELL, LEGAL HISTORIAN: "Outside agitator" was the phrase that people use in the South.

法律历史学家鲍威尔：“外部煽动者”是南方人使用的短语。

Whenever anything happened that people didn't like, "this couldn't be our Negroes.

每当发生人们不喜欢的事情时，“这不可能是我们的黑人。

These must be outside agitators ‘cause our Negroes wouldn't behave this way." And in the North, it went one step further.

这些肯定是外部煽动者，因为我们的黑人不会这样做。”而在北方，情况又更进一步。

It was to say that communists were behind it.

也就是说，背后有共产党人支持。

DAVID C.

大卫·C.

CARTER, HISTORIAN: Surely, blacks of their own accord wouldn't be torching their own neighborhoods, so there must be some hidden hand here.

历史学家卡特：当然，黑人不会自愿放火烧毁自己的社区，所以这里肯定有一些幕后黑手。

MICHAEL FLAMM, HISTORIAN: The face of the civil rights movement has changed by the summer of 1967.

历史学家迈克尔·弗拉姆：到 1967 年夏天，民权运动的面貌发生了变化。

MICHAEL FLAMM, HISTORIAN: Dr. King remains the preeminent leader, but there is a sense among white Americans that Dr. King is no longer in charge.

历史学家迈克尔·弗拉姆：金博士仍然是杰出的领导人，但美国白人有一种感觉，金博士不再负责。

DAVID BOESEL, COMMISSION STAFFER: Of course it alarms white people, it alarmed the government.

委员会工作人员大卫·博塞尔：当然，这让白人感到震惊，也让政府感到震惊。

The FBI was all over these guys.

联邦调查局一直在关注这些人。

KHALIL GIBRAN MUHAMMAD, HISTORIAN: Running the Federal Bureau of Investigation, J.

KHALIL GIBRAN MUHAMMAD，历史学家：管理联邦调查局，J.

Edgar Hoover had been a key opponent of civil rights, had collapsed civil rights with communism.

埃德加·胡佛一直是民权的主要反对者，他用共产主义瓦解了民权。

He understood that any form of civil rights did pose, to some degree, a legitimate, uh, challenge to the way the nation functioned.

他明白，任何形式的公民权利确实在某种程度上对国家运作方式构成了合法的、呃、挑战。

Black people had literally been raw material for wealth creation.

黑人实际上是创造财富的原材料。

And so Hoover’s holding the line against the threat of black people being at the vanguard of a communist takeover of the United States.

因此，胡佛坚守阵线，抵御黑人成为共产主义接管美国先锋队的威胁。

DAVID C.

大卫·C.

CARTER, HISTORIAN: Hoover is consistently playing up these possibilities, sending wildly inaccurate, unvetted, raw intelligence information to the White House.

历史学家卡特：胡佛一直在强调这些可能性，向白宫发送极其不准确、未经审查的原始情报信息。

Because where there's smoke, there must be some fire.

因为哪里有烟，哪里就一定有火。

STEVEN GILLON, HISTORIAN: This issue of conspiracy was very important to the commission.

史蒂文·吉伦，历史学家：这个阴谋问题对委员会来说非常重要。

STEVEN GILLON, HISTORIAN: Their first major witness was J.

历史学家史蒂文·吉伦：他们的第一位主要证人是 J.

Edgar Hoover.

埃德加·胡佛.

He puts all of these charts up around the room.

他把所有这些图表都放在房间里。

And shows you know, Stokely Carmichael was in Maryland on this day and the next day there was a disturbance.

并表明您知道，斯托克利·卡迈克尔这一天在马里兰州，第二天就发生了骚乱。

He's trying to create a connection between these advocates of Black Power and the racial unrest.

他试图在这些黑人权力的倡导者和种族骚乱之间建立联系。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: If you pressed him, J.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯，委员会成员：如果你向他施压，J.

Edgar Hoover, he said, "No, there was not any national conspiracy behind the riots." But then he talked about outside agitators and so forth and really made you think, and made Lyndon Johnson think that there was a conspiracy.

埃德加·胡佛，他说，“不，骚乱背后没有任何国家阴谋。”但后来他谈到外部煽动者等等，确实让人深思，让林登·约翰逊认为有一个阴谋。

MICHAEL FLAMM, HISTORIAN: Johnson believes Hoover and listens to Hoover.

历史学家迈克尔·弗拉姆：约翰逊相信胡佛并听取胡佛的意见。

They are neighbors in Washington.

他们是华盛顿的邻居。

Johnson is also extraordinarily thin-skinned.

约翰逊脸皮也特别薄。

He takes criticism really, really personally.

他非常非常重视批评。

He is attracted to the idea that the only reason all of this violence is taking place is because people are being provoked, incited, and agitated.

他被这样的观点所吸引：所有这些暴力事件发生的唯一原因是人们受到挑衅、煽动和煽动。

ELIZABETH HINTON, HISTORIAN: If the rebellions were about underlying racial inequalities, then that was an indictment of the War on Poverty.

历史学家伊丽莎白·辛顿：如果叛乱是关于潜在的种族不平等，那么那就是对反贫困战争的控诉。

Perhaps it hadn't gone far enough.

也许还不够远。

Perhaps it wasn't sufficient to address historical racism and inequality.

也许这还不足以解决历史上的种族主义和不平等问题。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: The commission held a long series of hearings about civil disturbances and violent protests.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯，委员会成员：该委员会就内乱和暴力抗议举行了一系列长时间的听证会。

Twenty days of hearings.

听证会持续二十天。

We heard from a lot of witnesses.

我们听到了很多目击者的说法。

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: The commission called upon people who had varying perspectives and insights into the pertinent questions of race.

记者杰拉尼·科布：该委员会呼吁对相关种族问题有不同观点和见解的人们。

Historians, sociologists, economists, law enforcement figures, activists.

历史学家、社会学家、经济学家、执法人员、活动家。

And they really were trying to get a kind of baseline of knowledge about why American cities were on fire.

他们确实试图了解美国城市为何着火的基本知识。

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: One of the witnesses, the renowned Black psychologist Kenneth Clark, voiced a real degree of skepticism about what they were doing.

记者杰拉尼·科布：其中一位目击者、著名黑人心理学家肯尼思·克拉克对他们的所作所为表示了真正的怀疑。

He ticks off all of the inquiries that have happened in response to other uprisings––1935, 1943, 1965––and says, "Each of them produced a report.

他列出了针对其他起义（1935 年、1943 年、1965 年）进行的所有调查，并说：“他们每个人都提出了一份报告。

None of those reports actually made any difference," and raises the question about whether this inquiry will make any difference either.

这些报告实际上都没有产生任何影响”，并提出了这项调查是否会产生任何影响的问题。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: The president told us to state the facts.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯，委员会成员：总统告诉我们要陈述事实。

And one of the facts that we said straight out was that there was a great deal of overreaction by the police and by the National Guard.

我们直截了当地说的事实之一是，警察和国民警卫队反应过度。

The great majority of people who were killed were black people.

绝大多数被杀的人是黑人。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: We looked, for example, at sniping reports.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯，委员会成员：例如，我们查看了狙击报告。

KHALIL GIBRAN MUHAMMAD, HISTORIAN: There was a consistent refrain that a sniper was shooting at or had shot law enforcement or members of the National Guard or fire departments.

历史学家哈利勒·纪伯伦·穆罕默德：人们一致认为，一名狙击手正在向执法人员或国民警卫队或消防部门的成员开枪，或者已经向他们开枪。

No one to this day will ever know in all instances what did happen or didn't happen.

直到今天，没有人能够知道所有情况下发生了什么或没有发生什么。

What we do know is that a lot of the instances of the shooting or deaths of members of the National Guard, of the fire department, the police were by friendly fire.

我们所知道的是，国民警卫队、消防部门和警察的许多枪击或死亡事件都是被友军误伤的。

That being said, it didn't really matter.

话虽如此，这并不重要。

The notion of a fictionalized, larger-than-life sniper problem meant that law enforcement could use the most aggressive, militarized weaponry and tactics to put down their own citizens.

虚构的、具有传奇色彩的狙击手问题的概念意味着执法部门可以使用最具侵略性、军事化的武器和战术来镇压自己的公民。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: When we could trace down a sniper incident report, here’s the kind of thing we found.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯，委员会成员：当我们追踪狙击手事件报告时，我们发现了这样的事情。

A young National Guard guy with live ammunition was stationed under a streetlight.

一名携带实弹的年轻国民警卫队士兵驻扎在路灯下。

And he was scared to death in this black neighborhood.

他在这个黑人社区里被吓得要死。

High rise apartment nearby.

附近的高层公寓。

And he shot out the streetlight.

他射灭了路灯。

And that gave rise to all sorts of reports, everywhere, on the radio and everywhere else, there’s snipers.

这引起了各种各样的报道，到处都有狙击手，无论是广播还是其他地方。

They pulled up some kind of vehicle with a machine gun on it and sprayed that apartment.

他们开来某种装有机枪的车辆，向那间公寓喷洒水剂。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: As a result of what we thought was an overreaction by the National Guard, virtually all of whom were white and young, with no training whatsoever of how to deal with any civil disturbances, I suggested we make an announcement early, separate from our final report, calling for integration of the National Guard.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：由于我们认为国民警卫队反应过度，他们几乎都是白人和年轻人，没有接受过如何应对任何内乱的任何培训，因此我建议我们在最终报告之外尽早发布公告，呼吁整合国民警卫队。

STEVEN GILLON, HISTORIAN: African Americans made up less than 2% of National Guard members.

历史学家史蒂文·吉伦：非洲裔美国人在国民警卫队成员中所占比例不到 2%。

Lindsay and Harris both thought that it was important to make that statement.

林赛和哈里斯都认为发表这一声明很重要。

Tex Thornton doesn't want to do it.

特克斯·桑顿不想这么做。

This is the first big battle.

这是第一场大战。

And Tex Thornton argues vehemently against the commission making any kind of a statement.

特克斯·桑顿强烈反对委员会发表任何形式的声明。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: We were such different people, and there were a lot of different views and a lot of argument from the first.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：我们是非常不同的人，从一开始就有很多不同的观点和很多争论。

I worried that we wouldn't be able to come up with a good report.

我担心我们无法拿出一份好的报告。

So I made a deal with a publisher to write a book myself.

所以我和一家出版商达成协议，自己写一本书。

VESLA WEAVER, POLITICAL SCIENTIST: The Kerner Commission avoided this tendency to listen only to certain sections of society.

政治学家韦斯拉·韦弗（VESLA WEAVER）：克纳委员会避免了这种只听取社会某些群体意见的倾向。

And they go out and they scour trying to understand the patterns and the common features and what it is that people are saying.

他们出去搜寻，试图了解其中的模式、共同特征以及人们在说什么。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: In Milwaukee, I spent a morning in a Black barbershop.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：在密尔沃基，我在一家黑人理发店度过了一个早上。

Young men coming in, 25 to 30.

进来的年轻人，25岁到30岁。

And the first question I asked each of them as they came into the barbershop puzzled them, and I finally figured out why.

当他们走进理发店时，我问他们的第一个问题让他们感到困惑，我终于明白了原因。

My question was, "Is there greater discrimination here in, uh, Milwaukee than where you came from in Jackson or—or Memphis or wherever?" And the reason it puzzled 'em was, as I found out in Milwaukee, they didn't see any white people.

我的问题是，“呃，密尔沃基这里的歧视是否比你来自的杰克逊或孟菲斯或其他地方更严重？”让他们感到困惑的原因是，正如我在密尔沃基发现的那样，他们没有看到任何白人。

There was more segregation in Milwaukee—that's a northern city—than those southern cities that they'd come from.

密尔沃基是一个北方城市，与他们来自的南方城市相比，种族隔离更加严重。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: And to see the terrible conditions: three and four families living in a one-family house; grocery store with day-old bread and wilted vegetables; criminally inferior schools.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：看到了可怕的条件：三四个家庭住在一栋独栋房子里；杂货店出售一天的面包和枯萎的蔬菜；刑事劣等学校。

There wasn’t any transportation system.

没有任何交通系统。

The jobs had left moved out to the suburbs or had disappeared altogether.

剩下的工作岗位要么搬到了郊区，要么完全消失了。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: In Cincinnati, John Lindsay and I ran onto some young men that were shooting craps on the street, in broad daylight.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：在辛辛那提，约翰·林赛和我遇到了一些年轻人，他们光天化日之下在街上投掷骰子。

When they found out we were from Washington, they all, just in a chorus almost, said, "Jobs, baby.

当他们发现我们来自华盛顿时，他们几乎异口同声地说：“乔布斯，宝贝。

We need jobs, baby."

我们需要工作，宝贝。”

JOHN KOSKINEN, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: It was an eye-opener.

委员会执行助理约翰·科斯基宁：这令人大开眼界。

These weren't outsiders, these weren't conspirators, these weren't political radicals.

他们不是局外人，他们不是阴谋家，他们不是政治激进分子。

These were people who had legitimate and great, long-standing grievances about the nature of their life and the limited opportunities they were provided.

这些人对自己的生活本质以及所获得的有限机会怀有合理的、巨大的、长期的不满。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: It really put faces on these problems.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：这确实让这些问题有了面子。

And I know that it had the same effect on other members of the commission.

我知道这对委员会的其他成员也有同样的影响。

Tex Thornton said himself, after going out to riot cities and talking to people there, I have moved about 90 degrees to the left.

特克斯·桑顿（Tex Thornton）自己说，在前往骚乱城市并与那里的人们交谈之后，我已经向左移动了大约 90 度。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: We also had these copious reports from our survey teams.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：我们还收到了调查团队提供的大量报告。

STEVEN GILLON, HISTORIAN: The commission staff included social scientists who were in Washington at the headquarters.

史蒂文·吉伦，历史学家：委员会工作人员包括华盛顿总部的社会科学家。

DAVID CHAMBERS, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: And the commission sent out these teams of six people to twenty-three cities to learn exactly what had happened.

委员会执行助理大卫·钱伯斯：委员会派出了六人小组前往 23 个城市，以了解到底发生了什么。

VESLA WEAVER, POLITICAL SCIENTIST: They do an extraordinary field investigation.

政治学家 VESLA WEAVER：他们进行了非凡的实地调查。

They interviewed business leaders, civic leaders, on down to black police officers.

他们采访了商界领袖、公民领袖，甚至黑人警察。

They sat in people's living rooms and barber shops.

他们坐在人们的客厅和理发店里。

They heard their stories.

他们听到了他们的故事。

DAVID BOESEL, COMMISSION STAFFER: I was one of four analysts in charge of conducting analyses of those reports.

委员会工作人员戴维·博塞尔（DAVID BOESEL）：我是负责对这些报告进行分析的四名分析师之一。

There were mountains of material that we had to go through––news reports, some FBI reports, boxes and piles of documents.

我们必须浏览大量的材料——新闻报道、一些联邦调查局的报告、盒子和成堆的文件。

Our job was to take that information and all the statistics that we could find, put them together in an analysis that answered the question, why did it happen?

我们的工作是获取这些信息和我们能找到的所有统计数据，将它们放在一起进行分析，以回答这个问题：为什么会发生这种情况？

JOHN KOSKINEN, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: After having done that through about fifteen cities, a common pattern began to emerge, which was, these were people protesting.

约翰·科斯基宁，委员会执行助理：在大约十五个城市这样做之后，一个共同的模式开始出现，那就是，这些都是人们在抗议。

DAVID BOESEL, COMMISSION STAFFER: In the South, you had the Jim Crow system, organized legal segregation.

委员会工作人员大卫·博塞尔：在南方，有吉姆·克劳制度，有组织的合法种族隔离。

There were lines that you couldn't cross.

有些界限是你无法跨越的。

If you crossed them, you knew what the consequences would be.

如果你跨越了它们，你知道后果会是什么。

So it was possible to use civil disobedience tactics to move toward a goal.

因此，可以使用公民不服从策略来实现目标。

In the North, the causes of oppression and disadvantage were more opaque.

在北方，压迫和不利的原因更加不透明。

You were a lot freer in many ways, but one thing that you couldn't do was move out of your constricted neighborhood, your ghetto.

你在很多方面都自由得多，但你不能做的一件事就是搬出你狭窄的社区，你的贫民窟。

JOSHUA ZEITZ, WRITER: The six million African Americans who've moved north since World War I find that they're facing a wall of opposition.

作家约书亚·蔡茨：自第一次世界大战以来北上的六百万非裔美国人发现他们面临着反对之墙。

Unions discriminate against them.

工会歧视他们。

They're not able to get the same high paying high benefits union jobs that many white people did.

他们无法像许多白人那样获得高薪高福利的工会工作。

Realtors and home sellers are discriminating against them.

房地产经纪人和房屋卖家歧视他们。

They're consigned to some of the worst rental properties in cities.

他们被托付给城市中一些最差的出租房。

JOSHUA ZEITZ, WRITER: The federal government underwrote the suburbanization of America through agencies that insured mortgages.

作家约书亚·蔡茨：联邦政府通过为抵押贷款提供保险的机构为美国郊区化提供了保障。

It did so through the GI Bill of Rights.

它通过《退伍军人权利法案》做到了这一点。

But African Americans who were helping to fund these programs through their taxes did not get to take part in them because of discrimination among realtors and home sellers.

但由于房地产经纪人和房屋卖家之间的歧视，通过税收帮助资助这些计划的非裔美国人并没有参与其中。

DAVID BOESEL, COMMISSION STAFFER: You had a generation of young people, politically conscious.

戴维·博塞尔（DAVID BOESEL），委员会工作人员：你们这一代年轻人具有政治意识。

Black Power and black nationalism were in the air at the time.

当时空气中弥漫着黑人权力和黑人民族主义。

They rejected the gradualism of traditional civil rights organizations.

他们拒绝传统民权组织的渐进主义。

They wanted control, control of their own communities.

他们想要控制，控制他们自己的社区。

They wanted action.

他们想要采取行动。

There were long histories of efforts by black leaders to pressure city governments to address a wide variety of problems.

长期以来，黑人领袖一直努力向市政府施压，要求其解决各种各样的问题。

But it never resulted in much.

但它从来没有产生太大的结果。

They're gonna have to find some other way to bring about change.

他们必须找到其他方法来带来改变。

Not going through the system anymore, but turning out in the streets.

不再通过系统，而是在街上出现。

ELIZABETH HINTON, HISTORIAN: Many of the young people who participated had spent their childhoods witnessing the civil rights movement unfold.

历史学家伊丽莎白·辛顿：许多参与其中的年轻人都在童年时期目睹了民权运动的展开。

Yet they were still living with roaches and rats running around.

然而他们仍然生活在蟑螂和老鼠四处乱窜的环境中。

In public schools that didn't have up-to-date books or resources.

在没有最新书籍或资源的公立学校。

When nonviolent direct action protests haven't worked to change your conditions, then the next step is violent, direct action.

当非暴力直接行动抗议无法改变你的处境时，下一步就是暴力、直接行动。

JOHN A.

约翰·A.

POWELL, LEGAL HISTORIAN: The word riot has a connotation to it.

鲍威尔，法律历史学家：“骚乱”这个词有其内涵。

The idea of riot being people destroying property, almost irrational.

暴乱是人们破坏财产的想法几乎是不合理的。

It doesn't suggest there's any underlying cause other than bad actors, if you will.

如果你愿意的话，这并不表明除了不良行为者之外还有任何根本原因。

But I was back in Detroit visiting my parents.

但我回到底特律看望我的父母。

Detroit was burning.

底特律正在燃烧。

And I remember someone pointing, I think it was an M-16, at me, and saying "go back where you were." I was just pissed at America.

我记得有人指着我，我想那是一架 M-16，然后说：“回到你原来的地方去。”我只是对美国感到愤怒。

That James Brown song comes to mind.

我想起了詹姆斯·布朗的那首歌。

We'd rather die on our feet than keep living on our knees.

我们宁愿站着死，也不愿跪着生。

And to me, I felt that way, I felt like, okay, yeah, there's a risk involved, but we gotta do something.

对我来说，我有这种感觉，我觉得，好吧，是的，存在风险，但我们必须做点什么。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: Conditions were such in every one of these cities, that almost any spark could set them off, and the sparks we found were the police department.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：这些城市的情况都是如此，几乎任何火花都可能引爆它们，而我们发现的火花就是警察局。

KHALIL GIBRAN MUHAMMAD, HISTORIAN: For African American migrants who began to leave the South in first thousands and then tens of thousands, and over time, hundreds of thousands, they were leaving the South one step ahead, often, of racial terrors, whether it came from a southern sheriff or a lynch mob.

历史学家哈利勒·纪伯伦·穆罕默德：对于刚开始离开南方的非裔美国移民来说，最初是数千人，后来是数万人，随着时间的推移，达到数十万人，他们通常比种族恐怖先一步离开南方，无论这种恐怖来自南方警长还是私刑暴徒。

And they came to these northern cities in hopes the freedom they found there would provide safety and security, in addition to economic mobility.

他们来到这些北方城市，希望在那里找到的自由除了经济流动性之外还能提供安全和保障。

Too often, what they found, however, was that the police, by and large, were there to protect the interest of white residents.

然而，他们经常发现警察总体上是为了保护白人居民的利益。

KHALIL GIBRAN MUHAMMAD, HISTORIAN: When I was researching black people moving into New York City in the 1930s, one of the things that surprised me was the number of complaints from white residents about black children playing on playgrounds with their white children, and they wanted the city administrators to use the police to keep those black kids off those playgrounds.

哈利勒·纪伯伦·穆罕默德，历史学家：当我研究 20 世纪 30 年代搬入纽约市的黑人时，令我惊讶的事情之一是白人居民对黑人儿童与白人孩子在操场上玩耍的投诉数量，他们希望城市管理者使用警察来阻止这些黑人孩子进入这些操场。

This is the kind of pressure that police officers are not only getting, but they're responding to, they're doing this work.

警察不仅受到这种压力，而且他们正在应对这种压力，他们正在做这项工作。

KHALIL GIBRAN MUHAMMAD, HISTORIAN: The white community treats every black person on their block, in their store, on their playground as a would-be suspect.

哈利勒·纪伯伦·穆罕默德，历史学家：白人社区将他们街区、商店、操场上的每一个黑人都视为潜在嫌疑人。

Rhetoric around black criminality was the most elastic and most durable way of justifying segregation.

关于黑人犯罪的言论是证明种族隔离最有弹性和最持久的方式。

KHALIL GIBRAN MUHAMMAD, HISTORIAN: Police behave differently essentially interrogating black people at every turn.

哈利勒·纪伯伦·穆罕默德，历史学家：警察的行为有所不同，本质上是在每个环节审问黑人。

KHALIL GIBRAN MUHAMMAD, HISTORIAN: Setting up virtual checkpoints on the borders of these communities, doing hostile drives through black neighborhoods, as a show of force for black people to so-called stay in their place.

历史学家哈利勒·纪伯伦·穆罕默德：在这些社区的边界设立虚拟检查站，在黑人社区进行敌对驱车，以展示黑人所谓的“留在自己的地方”的武力。

They're policing the boundaries of black life.

他们正在维护黑人生活的界限。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: Very often, African Americans in these central cities, the contact with the police––that was the only contact they had with the government.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：对于这些中心城市的非裔美国人来说，与警察的接触通常是他们与政府的唯一接触。

And that was a contact which was really very, very dangerous for them.

那次接触对他们来说真的非常非常危险。

Police brutality was a real thing.

警察的暴力执法是真实存在的。

But on top of that, there was really no kind of procedure for grievance or for complaints.

但最重要的是，实际上没有任何申诉或投诉的程序。

That, I think, is a perfect situation waiting for an explosion.

我认为，这是一个等待爆炸的完美情况。

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: So when you see legislation like the Law Enforcement Assistance Act coming out in 1965, it effectively pours gasoline on the very problem that is at the core of these uprisings in the first place.

JELANI COBB，记者：因此，当你看到 1965 年颁布的《执法援助法》等立法时，它首先有效地解决了这些起义的核心问题。

ELIZABETH HINTON, HISTORIAN: As rebellion escalates, we see a real merger happening between social welfare programs, programs specifically targeting black youth and police programs, crime control programs that are also targeting black youth.

历史学家伊丽莎白·辛顿：随着叛乱升级，我们看到社会福利计划、专门针对黑人青年的计划和警察计划、也针对黑人青年的犯罪控制计划之间正在发生真正的合并。

Police officers are running after-school recreation programs.

警察正在开展课后娱乐活动。

Police started giving toys and delivering turkeys to families on Thanksgiving, and to essentially cast a layer of surveillance.

警方开始在感恩节向家庭赠送玩具和火鸡，并实质上进行一层监视。

KHALIL GIBRAN MUHAMMAD, HISTORIAN: It was about making sure that you could identify people in the black community who posed a potential threat to the neighboring white communities, taking down the names of potential delinquents.

历史学家哈利勒·纪伯伦·穆罕默德：这是为了确保能够识别黑人社区中对邻近白人社区构成潜在威胁的人，记下潜在违法者的名字。

ELIZABETH HINTON, HISTORIAN: The police also supported tactical patrol units who walked the streets in order to prevent crime before it occurred.

历史学家伊丽莎白·辛顿：警方还支持在街道上巡逻的战术巡逻队，以预防犯罪发生。

Essentially subjecting people of color to a set of laws that people in middle-class suburban and white communities would never be subjected to.

本质上是让有色人种遵守一套中产阶级郊区和白人社区的人永远不会遵守的法律。

JOHN A.

约翰·A.

POWELL, LEGAL HISTORIAN: They would actually stop people for bumping the tires against the curb when they're parking, spitting.

鲍威尔，法律历史学家：他们实际上会阻止人们停车时将轮胎撞到路边、随地吐痰。

Part of it is sending a message.

其中一部分是发送消息。

It’s sending a message that we're in control.

它传递出这样的信息：我们掌控一切。

You're supposed to be afraid of us.

你应该害怕我们。

And we can stop you for any reason.

我们可以以任何理由阻止你。

DAVID BOESEL, COMMISSION STAFFER: They're out on the street all the time.

DAVID BOESEL，委员会工作人员：他们一直在街上。

There are these young people on the street.

街上有这些年轻人。

The police are trying to keep them moving, keep them off balance by all of these harassing tactics––stop and frisk, make arbitrary arrests and then they'd be released without charges.

警方正试图通过所有这些骚扰策略让他们保持移动，让他们失去平衡——拦截搜身，任意逮捕，然后他们会在没有指控的情况下被释放。

There's this constant conflict, constant daily, rubbing conflict, between police and young people in the streets.

警察和街头年轻人之间每天都在发生持续不断的摩擦冲突。

DAVID BOESEL, COMMISSION STAFFER: There often comes a conspicuous incident of police brutality, an outrageous act by police.

委员会工作人员大卫·博塞尔（DAVID BOESEL）：经常会发生引人注目的警察暴力事件，这是警察的令人愤慨的行为。

In Detroit, it was a raid on an after-hours social club.

在底特律，这是对一家下班后社交俱乐部的突袭。

People were partying to celebrate the return of one veteran from Vietnam and console another guy who was gonna head to Vietnam.

人们举办派对庆祝一名越南退伍军人归来，并安慰另一名即将前往越南的人。

In Newark, it was the beating of a cab driver.

在纽瓦克，这是一名出租车司机被殴打的事件。

KHALIL GIBRAN MUHAMMAD, HISTORIAN: When residents observe what's happening they decide enough is enough.

历史学家哈利勒·纪伯伦·穆罕默德：当居民观察到正在发生的事情时，他们认为已经受够了。

Time and time again somewhere in that story is this moment of exchange, this interaction between a white police officer and a black person.

这个故事中的某个地方一次又一次地出现了白人警察和黑人之间的交流时刻。

JOSHUA ZEITZ, WRITER: There was an endless cycle, a wave of urban violence followed by calls for law and order.

作家约书亚·蔡茨：这是一个无休止的循环，一波城市暴力随之而来，随之而来的是对法律和秩序的呼声。

Law and order would then express itself in a heavy-handed way.

法律和秩序将以严厉的方式表达出来。

And this was often the spark behind the next wave of violence.

这往往是下一波暴力浪潮背后的导火索。

ELIZABETH HINTON, HISTORIAN: When Detroit and Newark erupt in ‘67, two years into the War on Crime that should have been taken as a moment for policy makers to rethink these strategies.

历史学家伊丽莎白·欣顿 (Elizabeth Hinton)：当 67 年底特律和纽瓦克爆发时，也就是打击犯罪战争两年后，政策制定者应该重新考虑这些策略。

But policymakers responded by militarizing police, so that when and if rebellion comes police departments will be ready to suppress the disorder on their own.

但政策制定者的回应是使警察军事化，这样，当叛乱发生时，警察部门将准备好自行镇压骚乱。

ELIZABETH HINTON, HISTORIAN: We begin to see local police getting armored tanks, getting M-1 and M-14 carbine rifles, using helicopters, all techniques and devices that had been used in Vietnam.

历史学家伊丽莎白·辛顿：我们开始看到当地警察配备了装甲坦克，配备了 M-1 和 M-14 卡宾枪，使用了直升机，以及所有在越南使用过的技术和设备。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: We very much were opposed to the military giving military hardware and vehicles to the police.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：我们非常反对军方向警察提供军事装备和车辆。

We thought that the police ought to be civilians.

我们认为警察应该是平民。

They should look like and be a part of the communities where they served.

他们应该看起来像他们所服务的社区，并成为他们服务的社区的一部分。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: Lyndon Johnson himself once had said, "If I were one of these people and mistreated the way some of them are by the police, I might pick up a gun myself." Later on, I'm sure he was sorry he had said that.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯，委员会成员：林登·约翰逊本人曾经说过，“如果我是这些人中的一员，并像他们中的一些人那样受到警察的虐待，我可能会自己拿起枪。”后来，我确信他对自己说过的话感到抱歉。

But that's the way we felt.

但这就是我们的感受。

DAVID C.

大卫·C.

CARTER, HISTORIAN: Absent the conflict in Southeast Asia, Lyndon Johnson would go down as an extraordinarily gifted leader.

历史学家卡特：如果没有东南亚冲突，林登·约翰逊将作为一位极具天赋的领导人而名垂青史。

But Vietnam is the albatross that will always hang over Lyndon Johnson's legacy

但越南是永远笼罩在林登·约翰逊政治遗产上的沉重负担

JOSHUA ZEITZ, WRITER: As he began to lose the hearts and minds of young people, of people on college campuses, as, as the war became a divisive factor in American life he was loathe to admit how deeply involved the United States was in Vietnam.

作家约书亚·蔡茨：当他开始失去年轻人、大学校园里人们的心和思想时，随着战争成为美国生活中的一个分裂因素，他不愿承认美国在越南的卷入有多么深。

JOSHUA ZEITZ, WRITER: He remembered other Democratic presidents who saw their domestic policy ambitions cut short by wars that ultimately made it impossible for them to continue to pursue those goals.

作家约书亚·蔡茨：他记得其他民主党总统，他们的国内政策雄心被战争打断，最终使他们不可能继续追求这些目标。

He didn't want that to happen to the Great Society.

他不希望伟大社会发生这样的事。

MICHAEL FLAMM, HISTORIAN: Johnson is also hoping desperately that the Kerner Commission will acknowledge that his Great Society is actually making a difference and improving the lives of black Americans across the country.

历史学家迈克尔·弗拉姆：约翰逊还迫切希望克纳委员会承认他的伟大社会实际上正在发挥作用并改善全国黑人的生活。

But the Kerner Commission quickly becomes a runaway commission.

但克纳委员会很快就变成了一个失控的委员会。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: Johnson was getting all the time inside reports, some from some of the members of the commission itself, who thought that John Lindsay and I were going too far.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯，委员会成员：约翰逊一直在收到内部报告，其中一些来自委员会本身的一些成员，他们认为约翰·林赛和我做得太过分了。

And that we were going to recommend huge new federal programs and not put any money figures on ‘em.

我们将推荐庞大的新联邦计划，但不会在其中投入任何资金数字。

And that angered him a great deal, I was later to find out.

后来我才发现，这让他非常愤怒。

DAVID C.

大卫·C.

CARTER, HISTORIAN: That's when Lyndon Johnson becomes acutely aware of what a political bombshell this might represent.

历史学家卡特：就在那时，林登·约翰逊敏锐地意识到这可能代表着什么样的政治重磅炸弹。

And as soon as the Kerner Commission becomes perceived as a potential threat to him politically, I think he wants to take the legs out from under it.

一旦克纳委员会被视为在政治上对他构成潜在威胁，我认为他就想摆脱它。

JOHN KOSKINEN, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: My assumption was this was a national crisis, this was the federal government.

约翰·科斯基宁，委员会执行助理：我的假设是，这是一场国家危机，这是联邦政府的危机。

Money was not gonna be the problem.

钱不是问题。

JOHN KOSKINEN, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: My role on the commission was to be the assistant to Victor Palmieri, the deputy executive director, who was responsible for the day-to-day operations.

约翰·科斯基宁，委员会执行助理：我在委员会的职责是担任副执行主任维克多·帕尔米耶里的助理，负责日常运营。

In early December, we're invited to the White House to meet with Charlie Schultze, who was then the director of the Bureau of the Budget, who had the task of informing us that we were gonna have to close the commission down as quickly as we could.

12 月初，我们受邀前往白宫会见时任预算局局长的查理·舒尔茨 (Charlie Schultze)，他的任务是通知我们必须尽快关闭该委员会。

Victor and I, a couple weeks before Christmas, had to have a meeting with, by then, 200 members of our staff to advise them that most of them were not gonna be on the payroll after January 1st.

圣诞节前几周，维克多和我必须与 200 名员工开会，告知他们，1 月 1 日之后，他们中的大多数人将不再受薪。

DAVID CHAMBERS, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: David Ginsburg, for whom I worked, was the director.

大卫·钱伯斯，委员会执行助理：我为之工作的大卫·金斯堡是主任。

He tried very much to protect Johnson, even though he knew the truth, by saying that the commission's work was so important that we were going to get out a report months, months earlier in order to have our views before the American people, before the hot weather of the next summer.

他非常努力地保护约翰逊，尽管他知道真相，他说委员会的工作非常重要，我们要提前几个月、几个月发布一份报告，以便在明年夏天炎热天气之前向美国人民表达我们的观点。

Well, that was baloney.

好吧，那是胡说八道。

JOHN KOSKINEN, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: : What we had to do was start drafting.

约翰·科斯基宁（JOHN KOSKINEN），委员会执行助理：我们要做的就是开始起草。

We had eight or ten different people, some people working on the introduction, others working on various programmatic sections, and all of that had to be put into readable form within a matter of days.

我们有八到十个不同的人，一些人负责介绍，其他人负责各个程序部分，所有这些都必须在几天内变成可读的形式。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: David Ginsburg and Vic Palmieri were primarily responsible for writing these drafts.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯，委员会成员：大卫·金斯伯格和维克·帕尔米耶里主要负责撰写这些草案。

And we discussed, and then actually voted, on each draft.

我们对每个草案进行了讨论，然后进行了实际投票。

All of us were people of very strong opinions, and so our meetings were quite contentious.

我们都是意见非常强烈的人，所以我们的会议颇有争议。

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: The commissioners argued over the significance of social conditions in creating the uprisings, how forcefully to condemn the police, how strongly to support open housing.

杰拉尼·科布（JELANI COBB），记者：委员们就社会条件在引发起义中的重要性、如何强烈谴责警察、如何强烈支持开放住房等问题进行了争论。

And as each of those is resolved, it sends the commission further down the path toward its ultimate conclusions.

当这些问题得到解决后，委员会就会进一步走向最终结论。

DAVID CHAMBERS, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: Probably the most significant chapter was the fourth chapter.

委员会执行助理戴维·钱伯斯：最重要的一章可能是第四章。

That was drafted by David Ginsburg himself after sensing a consensus among the commissioners that the central theme of the report should be the impacts of white racism on black people.

该报告是由大卫·金斯伯格本人起草的，他感觉到委员们达成了共识，即报告的中心主题应该是白人种族主义对黑人的影响。

And that was the subject of a whole day's commissioner's meeting.

这就是专员会议一整天的主题。

I remember the commission spending well over an hour haggling over two sentences.

我记得委员会花了一个多小时就两句话讨价还价。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: I thought, and so did John Lindsay, that it was highly important to use the word "racism." To say "white racism." We thought we really needed to shock people by the use of that term.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：我认为，约翰·林赛也认为，使用“种族主义”一词非常重要。说“白人种族主义”。我们认为我们确实需要通过使用这个术语来震惊人们。

And to get people to have, make people have to think about that and talk about it, and size up history in terms of racism as it had existed from the first.

为了让人们拥有这一点，让人们必须思考它并谈论它，并从种族主义的角度来衡量历史，因为它从一开始就存在。

We also wanted to say to young black people, particularly, you’re not crazy.

我们还特别想对年轻的黑人说，你们没有疯。

There is systematic racism that you’re a victim of.

您是系统性种族主义的受害者。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: The word "racism" didn't sit well with some members of the commission Some thought it was too harsh, that we ought to use softer words like "intolerance" or "discrimination" or whatever.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯，委员会成员：“种族主义”这个词让委员会的一些成员感到不舒服，有些人认为这个词太严厉了，我们应该使用“不宽容”或“歧视”等更温和的词。

And we had a vote.

我们进行了投票。

It was a six-to-five vote within the commission in favor of saying "racism."

委员会内以六比五的投票赞成使用“种族主义”一词。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: On a lot of tough questions, we voted six to five.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：在很多棘手问题上，我们以六比五的投票结果。

But when we got down to the final report, we eventually adopted it unanimously.

但当我们认真讨论最终报告时，我们最终一致通过了它。

David Ginsburg said once that this is the only unanimous report that was adopted by a vote of six to five.

大卫·金斯伯格曾表示，这是唯一一份以六比五的票数获得一致通过的报告。

There was a lot of compromise involved.

其中涉及很多妥协。

We thought, if we can’t come together, there’s no hope the country can.

我们认为，如果我们不能团结起来，这个国家就没有希望。

DAVID CHAMBERS, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: Only if those who were most conservative on the commission endorsed the strong findings that we had made would it have an effect on white America in general.

大卫·钱伯斯，委员会执行助理：只有当委员会中最保守的人认可我们所做的强有力的调查结果时，它才会对美国白人产生总体影响。

And the report was written for white America.

这份报告是为美国白人写的。

Black people didn't need to be told that racism was a central problem in their lives.

黑人不需要被告知种族主义是他们生活中的一个核心问题。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: We had, well in advance, decided that we wanted to try to get this out popularly to as many people as possible.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：我们很早就决定要尝试向尽可能多的人宣传这一点。

And David Ginsburg, our executive director, was very prescient about this.

我们的执行董事大卫·金斯伯格对此很有先见之明。

And so made arrangements with Bantam Press that as we finished one chapter, we would turn that over, so that they could get it out exactly when the report was finished.

因此，我们与班塔姆出版社做出了安排，当我们完成一章时，我们会将其移交，以便他们可以在报告完成时准确地将其发布。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: The other thing we did was to put the report out with an embargo for the AMs on the morning of March 3rd.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：我们做的另一件事是在 3 月 3 日上午发布报告，并对 AM 进行禁运。

We wanted time to background the reporters, journalists, and opinion leaders.

我们需要时间了解记者和意见领袖的背景。

But Alan Spivak, our press secretary, got word from a Washington Post reporter that the Washington Post had a copy of the summary of the report and they intended to turn it loose for February 29.

但我们的新闻秘书艾伦·斯皮瓦克 (Alan Spivak) 从《华盛顿邮报》记者那里得到消息称，《华盛顿邮报》拥有该报告摘要的副本，他们打算在 2 月 29 日将其发布。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: So David Ginsburg talked to Ben Bradlee of the Post, said to him, if you do this, we are going to turn loose the summary ourselves.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：大卫·金斯伯格与《华盛顿邮报》的本·布拉德利进行了交谈，对他说，如果你这样做，我们将自己发布摘要。

So that you won’t have an exclusive on it.

这样你就不会拥有它的独家权利。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: There was just chaos.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：当时一片混乱。

Reporters here, they’re looking at all this and don’t have time to digest it.

记者们，他们正在看着这一切，没有时间去消化。

I got a call from an AP reporter who said, "I have a 30-minute deadline.

我接到美联社记者的电话，他说：“我有 30 分钟的截止日期。

Can you sort of capsulize the report for me?"

你能为我概括一下这份报告吗？”

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: The headlines were very shocking headlines, particularly if you had not thought about this before or known anything about it, as most people didn’t know much about it.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯，委员会成员：这些头条新闻非常令人震惊，特别是如果您之前没有考虑过这个问题或对此一无所知，因为大多数人对此了解不多。

The headlines were something like, "White Racism Cause of Black Riots, Commission Says."

头条新闻类似于“委员会称白人种族主义导致黑人骚乱”。

Good evening.

晚上好。

This is Harry Reasoner.

这是哈利·里森纳。

For the last few days, this country has lived under indictment, a charge of white racism, national in scale, terrible in its effects.

在过去的几天里，这个国家一直受到起诉，被指控为全国性的白人种族主义，其影响非常可怕。

The evidence to support that charge has now been presented, more than 1,400 pages of testimony, findings, conclusions, the full text of a report released just last night.

支持这一指控的证据现已出示，包括 1,400 多页的证词、调查结果、结论以及昨晚刚刚发布的报告全文。

JOHN KOSKINEN, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: You had to really be hibernating somewhere, not to see the media coverage in the press and on television.

约翰·科斯基宁，委员会执行助理：你必须真正在某个地方冬眠，而不是看到媒体和电视上的媒体报道。

But if you wanted to know more in detail, the fact that you could go to a store and buy the paperback allowed a million and a half people within a month to have the actual report in their hand.

但如果你想了解更多细节，你可以去商店购买平装本，一个月内就有一百五十万人拿到了实际的报告。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: We said that white racism has created these black ghettos, as we said in those days, and it's white racism that sustains it.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯，委员会成员：我们说过，正如我们当时所说，白人种族主义创造了这些黑人贫民窟，而白人种族主义则维持着这些贫民窟。

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: This is shocking to the sensibilities in 1968.

JELANI COBB，记者：这对于 1968 年的人们来说是令人震惊的。

There had been large-scale studies that indicted American racism prior to this.

在此之前已经有大规模的研究指责美国的种族主义。

W.

W.

E.

E.

B.

B.

Du Bois had done one, um, you know, nearly seventy years earlier.

杜波依斯在大约七十年前就做过这样的事。

What we had not seen was this kind of argument being echoed in the highest echelons of American power.

我们没有看到这种论点在美国权力最高层中得到回应。

DAVID CHAMBERS, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: Nowhere in the report, do they exactly define what they mean.

委员会执行助理大卫·钱伯斯：在报告中，他们没有准确定义其含义。

But it was very important to the commission that people in the United States understand that more was going on than that just some of us individuals didn't like black people.

但对委员会来说非常重要的是，美国人民了解正在发生的事情不仅仅是我们中的一些人不喜欢黑人。

It was that the kind of change that was necessary involved the changing of whole institutions.

必要的变革涉及整个机构的变革。

JOSHUA ZEITZ, WRITER: You're looking at a report that's basically identifying a whole range of public and private actors who have been responsible for perpetuating racism, from the banks to the mortgage providers and the realtors, to public and private sector unions, to municipal police forces and municipal governments more broadly.

作家乔舒亚·蔡茨：您现在看到的一份报告基本上确定了一系列对种族主义长期存在负有责任的公共和私人行为者，从银行到抵押贷款提供者和房地产经纪人，到公共和私营部门工会，再到更广泛的市警察部队和市政府。

JOSHUA ZEITZ, WRITER: This is the first time you had the government saying these problems are systemic.

作家约书亚·蔡茨：这是政府第一次说这些问题是系统性的。

Certain people have benefited from the system, certain people have perpetuated the system, and other people have been disadvantaged.

某些人从该制度中受益，某些人使该制度永久化，而其他人则处于不利地位。

And to fix it, we are probably going to have to rebalance the books.

为了解决这个问题，我们可能需要重新平衡账簿。

JOHN A.

约翰·A.

POWELL, LEGAL HISTORIAN: Whites were saying things like, what's wrong with the Negro in the country, what's wrong with black people in the country?

鲍威尔，法律历史学家：白人在说这样的话，这个国家的黑人出了什么问题，这个国家的黑人出了什么问题？

How do we fix them?

我们如何修复它们？

What the Kerner Commission did was say, mmmmm it's not, the problem is not so much with them.

克纳委员会所做的是说，嗯，不是的，问题不在于他们。

The problem is with us.

问题出在我们身上。

Here in the populous Central Ward, a Negro district, the special commission's report was greeted as an acknowledgement of what Negroes themselves have been saying in Newark for several years.

在人口稠密的中央区（黑人区），特别委员会的报告受到欢迎，被认为是对黑人自己多年来在纽瓦克所说的话的认可。

VESLA WEAVER, POLITICAL SCIENTIST: The Kerner Commission united the political and economic abandonment of a group of people with the cause of American democracy.

政治学家韦斯拉·韦弗（VESLA WEAVER）：克纳委员会将一群人在政治和经济上的放弃与美国民主事业结合起来。

They say this forthrightly.

他们直言不讳地说这句话。

They say, our collective future is in peril.

他们说，我们的集体未来正处于危险之中。

JOHN A.

约翰·A.

POWELL, LEGAL HISTORIAN: The Kerner Commission comes down and says we don't have to be two Americas.

鲍威尔，法律历史学家：克纳委员会下来表示我们不必成为两个美洲。

We can't be two Americas.

我们不能成为两个美洲。

We can fix this, but first of all, we have to acknowledge it.

我们可以解决这个问题，但首先我们必须承认这一点。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: We called for massive new federal programs, jobs in particular, but also in education and in housing and in transportation, and we called for changes in the media, and in police.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：我们呼吁实施大规模的新联邦计划，特别是就业机会，而且还包括教育、住房和交通方面的计划，我们还呼吁媒体和警察方面进行变革。

An integrated police force is a must, says the commission, a visible symbol for the ghetto that the police are not just the agents of repression put there by the white majority.

该委员会表示，一支综合警察部队是必须的，这对贫民窟来说是一个明显的象征，表明警察不仅仅是白人多数派在那里镇压的代理人。

[TKR_2080}

[TKR_2080}

ELIZABETH HINTON, HISTORIAN: The commission suggested all sorts of measures to promote police-community relations, to increase trust between residents and police, and to kind of scale back some of the more aggressive enforcement approaches that had led to the rebellions in the first place.

历史学家伊丽莎白·辛顿：该委员会建议采取各种措施来促进警察与社区的关系，增加居民和警察之间的信任，并减少一些最初导致叛乱的更激进的执法措施。

ELIZABETH HINTON, HISTORIAN: The Kerner Commission recognized that the War on Poverty had not gone far enough, that what was needed was a massive structural transformation to address the underlying causes of the rebellions.

历史学家伊丽莎白·辛顿：克纳委员会认识到，反贫困战争还远远不够，需要进行大规模的结构转型，以解决叛乱的根本原因。

The report in many ways is a really bold and exciting vision, uh, for what U.S. domestic policy could be.

这份报告在很多方面对于美国国内政策的前景来说都是一个非常大胆和令人兴奋的愿景。

JOHN A.

约翰·A.

POWELL, LEGAL HISTORIAN: It was a New York Times bestseller.

鲍威尔，法律历史学家：这是《纽约时报》的畅销书。

And it's a tome.

这是一本大部头书。

It's not light reading, it's not a comic book, so there was interest.

这不是轻松阅读，也不是漫画书，所以引起了兴趣。

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: It really becomes a centerpiece of conversation.

JELANI COBB，记者：它确实成为了谈话的核心。

You see civic groups, churches, libraries, even police departments buying the book in bulk.

你会看到民间团体、教堂、图书馆，甚至警察部门都在批量购买这本书。

At one point, Marlon Brando, who was then an A-list figure in Hollywood, made the rounds on talk shows, carrying a copy of the Kerner Commission Report with him.

马龙·白兰度（Marlon Brando）当时是好莱坞一线明星，曾一度随身携带一份《克纳委员会报告》（Kerner Commission Report）出现在脱口秀节目中。

DAVID CHAMBERS, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: When the report was issued, Johnson already had a good sense of what was in it.

委员会执行助理大卫·钱伯斯：当报告发布时，约翰逊已经对报告的内容有了很好的了解。

His reaction was the most negative of any president who ever received a report from a commission he'd created.

他的反应是所有收到他所创建的委员会的报告的总统中最消极的。

He refused to accept a copy.

他拒绝接受副本。

He refused to thank the commissioners.

他拒绝感谢委员们。

He refused to hold what had already become a custom, receiving it from them and thanking them for it, maybe having everybody appear on the White House lawn.

他拒绝保留已经成为惯例的习惯，从他们那里接受并感谢他们，也许让每个人都出现在白宫草坪上。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: We didn't really think about whether Lyndon Johnson would like what we said or found or recommended.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：我们并没有真正考虑过林登·约翰逊是否会喜欢我们所说、发现或建议的内容。

He said, "Find the truth and express it in your report." That's what we did.

他说：“找到真相并在报告中表达出来。”这就是我们所做的。

And we were really disappointed, surprised, that he rejected it.

他拒绝了，我们真的很失望、惊讶。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: Johnson was just in a mess.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯，委员会成员：约翰逊一团糟。

The Tet Offensive had happened in January of that year.

春节攻势发生于当年一月。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: There were increasing demonstrations all around the country and right outside the White House with people saying, "LBJ, how many kids did you kill today?" His own popularity had sunk to 36 percent.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：全国各地以及白宫外的示威活动越来越多，人们说：“林登·约翰逊，你今天杀了多少孩子？”他自己的支持率已经跌至 36%。

JOSHUA ZEITZ, WRITER: So it's bad enough that it's a presidential commission and it's Johnson's presidential commission, but it's also populated with leading white, liberal politicians who are effectively telling white America, you're responsible for the racism.

作家约书亚·蔡茨：所以这已经够糟糕了，这是一个总统委员会，而且是约翰逊的总统委员会，但它也由白人自由派政客组成，他们有效地告诉美国白人，你要为种族主义负责。

You're responsible for the violence.

你应对暴力负责。

You're responsible for what you see on TV.

你要对你在电视上看到的内容负责。

And this is in the lead up to the 1968 elections.

这是 1968 年选举之前的事。

JOSHUA ZEITZ, WRITER: Johnson was already conducting a fair amount of public polling.

作家约书亚·蔡茨：约翰逊已经进行了大量的公众民意调查。

Richard Scammon, who was his pollster, looked at the electorate and came back to him and said, the median voter in 1968 is un-young, un-black, and un-poor.

他的民意调查专家理查德·斯卡蒙（Richard Scammon）观察了选民，然后回去找他说，1968 年的选民中位数不年轻，不黑人，也不穷。

And it fundamentally created a political problem for Johnson.

这从根本上给约翰逊带来了一个政治问题。

STEVEN GILLON, HISTORIAN: The great irony of the Kerner Commission is that Johnson sets it up as a way of building support for his presidency.

史蒂文·吉伦，历史学家：克纳委员会的最大讽刺之处在于，约翰逊将其设立为为其总统任期赢得支持的一种方式。

But in the end, it puts him in an impossible position.

但最终，这让他陷入了一个不可能的境地。

He can't accept the recommendations without alienating the conservative members of Congress.

他不能在不疏远国会保守派议员的情况下接受这些建议。

He also can't criticize it without alienating liberals.

他也不能在不疏远自由主义者的情况下批评它。

He can’t please anyone.

他无法取悦任何人。

JOSHUA ZEITZ, WRITER: There was also a sense that he had run out of steam and run out of capital.

作家约书亚·蔡茨：还有一种感觉，他已经失去了动力和资金。

He liked being president to do things and it was by no means clear that, were he able to eke out another term, he'd be able to expand on the Great Society or build bigger domestic policy programs.

他喜欢当总统做事，但目前还不清楚的是，如果他能够连任，他是否能够扩大伟大社会或制定更大的国内政策计划。

In all likelihood, he would've had to just continue what he was doing, which was managing an unruly nation at home and a war that seemed impossible to get out of abroad.

很可能，他将不得不继续他正在做的事情，即在国内管理一个不守规矩的国家，在国外管理一场似乎无法摆脱的战争。

DAVID C.

大卫·C.

CARTER, HISTORIAN: I think Johnson sort of felt, increasingly, where are my allies?

历史学家卡特：我认为约翰逊越来越感觉到我的盟友在哪里？

people are failing to appreciate that in fact I did do more for this country than many other presidents.

人们没有意识到，事实上我为这个国家所做的事情比许多其他总统都多。

DAVID C.

大卫·C.

CARTER, HISTORIAN: So many Americans felt this sense of our last best hope for the prospects of nonviolence has been taken away from us.

历史学家卡特：许多美国人感到我们对非暴力前景最后的最大希望已经离我们而去。

In the aftermath of King's assassination, when you see a replay of the kind of violence that had taken place in the summer of 1967, it feels as though the Kerner Commission’s prophecies are simply being fulfilled.

金被刺杀后，当你看到 1967 年夏天发生的暴力事件重演时，感觉好像克纳委员会的预言正在应验。

ELIZABETH HINTON, HISTORIAN: At least a hundred cities erupted in the days and weeks after.

历史学家伊丽莎白·辛顿：在接下来的几天和几周内，至少有一百座城市发生了火山爆发。

Martin Luther King, the king of love, the king of nonviolence and peace, for him to get assassinated really made the entire future of black Americans seem as uncertain as ever.

马丁·路德·金，爱之王，非暴力与和平之王，他的遇刺确实让整个美国黑人的未来显得一如既往的不确定。

MICHAEL FLAMM, HISTORIAN: The country is truly in flames.

历史学家迈克尔·弗拉姆：这个国家确实处于战火之中。

The U.S. military has to send thousands and thousands of troops to the capitol to protect Congress and the White House.

美国军方必须派遣数千名士兵前往国会大厦以保护国会和白宫。

You have angry and fearful members of Congress pleading with Johnson to issue, shoot-to-kill orders to the U.S. soldiers who are in Washington, D.C.

愤怒而恐惧的国会议员恳求约翰逊向华盛顿特区的美国士兵发出枪杀命令。

DAVID CHAMBERS, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: We were all, all of us extremely depressed about the assassination that had just occurred, but I also felt, well, this is, of course, exactly what you expect.

戴维·钱伯斯，委员会执行助理：我们所有人都对刚刚发生的暗杀事件感到非常沮丧，但我也觉得，这当然正是你所期望的。

Right?

正确的？

And later that night, I went downtown, and as we turned off of 14th Street we were looking straight ahead at a tank coming toward us.

那天晚上晚些时候，我去了市中心，当我们驶出第 14 街时，我们直视前方，一辆坦克朝我们驶来。

And I remember thinking this just can't be the America that we live in.

我记得我当时想这不可能是我们生活的美国。

STEVEN GILLON, HISTORIAN: Liberals in Congress had been trying to pass the Fair Housing Act for years.

史蒂文·吉伦，历史学家：国会中的自由派多年来一直试图通过《公平住房法案》。

But in the wake of the King assassination and in light of the report's recommendations there's new momentum.

但在国王遇刺之后，根据报告的建议，出现了新的势头。

So if there's one significant piece of legislation that is the direct result of the Kerner Commission, it's the Fair Housing Act of 1968.

因此，如果说有一项重要立法是克纳委员会直接制定的，那就是 1968 年的《公平住房法案》。

DAVID C.

大卫·C.

CARTER, HISTORIAN: But those who know the Fair Housing Act of 1968 well, know that it is at best a toothless attempt to deal with the worst aspects of housing discrimination.

历史学家卡特：但是那些熟知 1968 年《公平住房法案》的人都知道，该法案充其量只是解决住房歧视最严重方面的一次徒劳尝试。

It doesn't begin to address the fundamental things that are keeping blacks from being able to break out of what someone called an encircling noose, these white suburbs around black inner-city areas.

它并没有开始解决阻止黑人摆脱所谓的“绞索”的基本问题，即黑人市中心地区周围的白人郊区。

It’s too little and too late.

太少了，也太晚了。

DAVID CHAMBERS, COMMISSION EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT: When I ask myself what the commissioners thought would be the impact of the report and whether it would produce the kind of change that they were calling for, I suspect very few of them were naive enough to believe that "well, goodbye racism.

大卫·钱伯斯，委员会执行助理：当我问自己委员们认为该报告会产生什么影响以及它是否会产生他们所呼吁的那种变革时，我怀疑他们中很少有人天真地相信“好吧，再见种族主义。

We're gonna have a new world here." I think they just hoped it would be a small nudge in the right direction.

我们将在这里拥有一个新世界。”我认为他们只是希望这将是朝着正确方向的一个小小的推动。

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: : The report did have its impacts here and there.

JELANI COBB，记者： ：该报告确实产生了一定的影响。

For instance, the commission had critiqued the media saying they tended to look at these issues through the eyes of white men.

例如，该委员会批评媒体，称他们倾向于通过白人的视角来看待这些问题。

And you did see news organizations diversifying their ranks.

你确实看到新闻机构的队伍更加多元化。

They did pledge to cover urban issues with more nuance, and more balance.

他们确实承诺以更细致、更平衡的方式报道城市问题。

But by and large the political and moral will that the report had hoped to summon, i- it doesn't really come to pass.

但总的来说，该报告希望唤起的政治和道德意愿并没有真正实现。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: Virtually all of my mail was really mean and hate mail.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：实际上我所有的邮件都非常刻薄和令人讨厌。

But a lot of people were kind of puzzled, sort of like my dad.

但很多人都有点困惑，就像我父亲一样。

The way he heard the Kerner Report was, "Mr. Harris, out of the goodness of your heart, you ought to pay more taxes to help poor black people who are rioting in Detroit." He said this to me, he said, the hell with that.

他听到《克纳报告》的方式是：“哈里斯先生，出于你内心的善良，你应该缴纳更多的税来帮助底特律发生骚乱的贫穷黑人。”他对我说了这句话，他说，见鬼去吧。

I’m having a hard enough time myself.

我自己也过得很艰难。

I’m already paying too much tax, and not getting anything for it.

我已经缴纳了太多税，却没有得到任何好处。

And that, that was true.

那是真的。

MICHAEL FLAMM, HISTORIAN: Law and order broadly defined becomes the most pressing, most powerful political issue for white voters in America by early 1968.

历史学家迈克尔·弗拉姆：到 1968 年初，广义的法律和秩序成为美国白人选民最紧迫、最强大的政治问题。

urban unrest is the number one concern.

城市骚乱是首要问题。

The sale of firearms has doubled in the last year.

去年枪支销量翻了一番。

The tension of Negro disillusionment is in the air.

空气中弥漫着黑人幻灭的紧张气氛。

And so is white anxiety, with both sides fearing an incident that will escalate.

白人的焦虑也是如此，双方都担心事件会升级。

Why buy it?

为什么要买它？

Because I want to be able to shoot through a car at somebody if they bomb my house.

因为如果有人轰炸我的房子，我希望能够通过汽车向他们开枪。

I'm going to be prepared.

我要做好准备。

I got food, I got water.

我有食物，我有水。

Right now, I got about 150 rounds of shells.

现在，我大约有150发炮弹。

My whole neighborhood's that way.

我的整个街区都是这样。

JOHN A.

约翰·A.

POWELL, LEGAL HISTORIAN: Very little in history is inevitable.

鲍威尔，法律历史学家：历史上几乎没有什么是不可避免的。

It's important to remember, because sometimes, in our more cynical states, we think nothing matters and it's all gonna be bad.

记住这一点很重要，因为有时，在我们更加愤世嫉俗的状态下，我们认为一切都不重要，一切都会很糟糕。

And actually we don't know how it's gonna matter, but it matters.

事实上我们不知道这有什么关系，但它很重要。

JOHN A.

约翰·A.

POWELL, LEGAL HISTORIAN: I think Robert Kennedy really cared about the country.

鲍威尔，法律历史学家：我认为罗伯特·肯尼迪真的很关心这个国家。

And increasingly to him that included marginalized people, including African Americans.

对他来说，越来越多的人包括边缘化人群，包括非裔美国人。

[CROWD] RFK!

[人群] RFK！

RFK!

射频K！

RFK!

射频K！

[gunshots, screams].

[枪声，尖叫声]。

[REPORTER] Why don’t you think there’s a future?

【记者】为什么你觉得没有未来？

JOHN A.

约翰·A.

POWELL, LEGAL HISTORIAN: I have to believe, maybe 'cuz I wanna believe, that if, um, Kennedy had lived, uh, the Kerner Commission would've lived and the country would be in such a different place.

鲍威尔，法律历史学家：我必须相信，也许是因为我想相信，如果，呃，肯尼迪还活着，呃，克纳委员会就会活着，这个国家就会处于如此不同的境地。

But instead Nixon comes along and says, we're not doing this.

但尼克松却出来说，我们不会这样做。

STEVEN GILLON, HISTORIAN: Richard Nixon repeats all the things that the conservatives were saying about the Kerner Commission Report.

史蒂文·吉伦，历史学家：理查德·尼克松重复了保守派关于克纳委员会报告的所有言论。

That it seems to reward rioters, that there needs to be a greater emphasis on law and order.

它似乎奖励了骚乱者，需要更加重视法律和秩序。

And that becomes the central theme of his, of his campaign in 1968, was law and order.

法律与秩序成为他 1968 年竞选活动的中心主题。

[NIXON CAMPAIGN AD] Let us recognize that the first civil right of every American is to be free from domestic violence.

[尼克松竞选广告] 让我们认识到，每个美国人的首要公民权利是免受家庭暴力。

DAVID C.

大卫·C.

CARTER, HISTORIAN: Richard Nixon will very skillfully tap into this sense of what about the non protestors?

历史学家卡特：理查德·尼克松将非常巧妙地利用这种非抗议者的感觉？

We've lost sight of the fact that many Americans still see America as a land of opportunity.

我们忽视了这样一个事实：许多美国人仍然将美国视为一片充满机遇的土地。

Why all this focus on unhappy people demanding things and worse, burning things down to further their agenda.

为什么这一切都集中在不快乐的人身上，他们要求一些东西，更糟糕的是，为了推进他们的议程而烧毁东西。

This is not the American way.

这不是美国的方式。

ELIZABETH HINTON, HISTORIAN: Lyndon Johnson had introduced a new punitive element in national policy.

历史学家伊丽莎白·辛顿：林登·约翰逊在国家政策中引入了新的惩罚性因素。

Of course, Johnson did this alongside his ambitious social welfare program.

当然，约翰逊在这样做的同时还制定了雄心勃勃的社会福利计划。

But when Richard Nixon took office, he abandoned the social welfare part and really seized on the punitive elements of the Great Society and expanded them.

但理查德·尼克松上台后，放弃了社会福利部分，真正抓住了大社会的惩罚性成分，并将其扩大。

ELIZABETH HINTON, HISTORIAN: So we begin to see even more aggressive policing tactics being embraced by national policy makers.

历史学家伊丽莎白·辛顿：因此，我们开始看到国家政策制定者采用更加激进的警务策略。

We begin to see more draconian laws and sentencing provisions being enacted.

我们开始看到更多严厉的法律和量刑条款被颁布。

And the carceral state continued to expand.

监禁状态继续扩大。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: The disturbances unfortunately had a short term effect, if you were going to demagogue about it and was very helpful to Nixon.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯，委员会成员：不幸的是，如果你要煽动骚乱，那么骚乱会产生短期影响，并且对尼克松非常有帮助。

And to other conservative politicians since then.

以及此后的其他保守派政治家。

We began to turn backwards on desegregation and on virtually everything else.

我们开始在废除种族隔离和几乎所有其他事情上倒退。

DAVID BOESEL, COMMISSION STAFFER: There was a long period of, social conservatism after the riots, prompted by the riots.

委员会工作人员戴维·博塞尔（DAVID BOESEL）：在骚乱之后，由于骚乱引发了很长一段时期的社会保守主义。

They issued in a racially conservative political era in which law and order and repression pretty much prevailed, and that suited most of the white citizenry of the country.

它们是在一个种族保守的政治时代发布的，在这个时代，法律、秩序和镇压几乎盛行，这适合该国大多数白人公民。

KHALIL GIBRAN MUHAMMAD, HISTORIAN: : I've talked to a lot of people about this and heard, consistently heard, people my age, early fifties say, you know, I grew up in the suburbs of Detroit.

哈利勒·纪伯伦·穆罕默德，历史学家：我和很多人谈过这个问题，并且一直听到，与我同龄、五十岁出头的人说，你知道，我在底特律郊区长大。

My parents always said, you can't go to Detroit.

我父母总是说，你不能去底特律。

It's not safe.

这不安全。

Which was just code word for saying black people live there.

这只是暗语，表示黑人居住在那里。

The ghetto was reinforced.

贫民窟得到了加固。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: : The commission told the truth, but it was a harsh truth.

委员会成员、参议员弗雷德·哈里斯：委员会说的是实话，但这是一个残酷的事实。

The Secretary of Labor back then said, you can capsulize the commission’s report in the words of that great American philosopher, Pogo, who said, "We have met the enemy and he is us."

当时的劳工部长说，你可以用美国伟大哲学家波戈的话来概括委员会的报告，他说：“我们遇到了敌人，他就是我们。”

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: My service on the Kerner Commission and the advocacy which followed it in a way kind of ruined me as a senator.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯，委员会成员：我在克纳委员会的服务以及随后的倡导在某种程度上毁了我作为参议员的地位。

Hubert Humphrey was vice president when I became a senator at age 33 and he said that compromise is the essence of the operations of a legislative body.

当我 33 岁成为参议员时，休伯特·汉弗莱 (Hubert Humphrey) 担任副总统，他说妥协是立法机构运作的本质。

He said, I don’t mean compromise on principle, but I mean on how we do it or how much we do this year.

他说，我不是说原则上妥协，而是说我们怎么做，或者今年做了多少。

And I came to a time after the Kerner Report that I, I just …

在《克纳报告》发布之后，我、我只是……

I couldn’t compromise.

我不能妥协。

I knew that’s what we had been doing and that that had got us in the mess we’re in.

我知道这就是我们一直在做的事情，这让我们陷入了困境。

SENATOR FRED HARRIS, COMMISSION MEMBER: We had people around the Senate, even, who said, "Well, black people in America are much better off than they are anywhere else in the world," you know, in Zambia or somewhere.

参议员弗雷德·哈里斯（委员会成员）：甚至参议院里也有人说，“嗯，美国的黑人比世界上其他任何地方的黑人都要好得多，”你知道，在赞比亚或其他地方。

And the answer to that is, these are Americans.

答案是，这些人都是美国人。

They're not in Africa.

他们不在非洲。

And they're not trying to tear down the system; they want to be a, a part of it.

他们并不想摧毁这个系统；他们只是想摧毁这个系统。他们想成为其中的一部分。

They're trying to get the country to do what it says it believes in, they're try– trying to make democracy work.

他们试图让这个国家按照它所说的那样去做，他们正在努力让民主发挥作用。

JELANI COBB, JOURNALIST: My first serious engagement with the Kerner Report was in 1992, in the aftermath of the Rodney King uprisings in Los Angeles.

JELANI COBB，记者：我第一次认真接触《克纳报告》是在 1992 年，当时洛杉矶罗德尼·金起义之后。

And you heard the word Kerner again and again and again.

你一遍又一遍地听到“克纳”这个词。

And it has remained this touchstone, you know, this vitally important document that unfortunately has retained its relevance over the span of history.

你知道，这份极其重要的文件一直是试金石，不幸的是，它在整个历史过程中仍然保持着相关性。

The Kerner Commission did not deign to take the easy way out.

克纳委员会并不打算走捷径。

They told the nation what exactly the problem was, even if it meant that no one was going to listen to them.

他们告诉全国问题到底是什么，即使这意味着没有人会听他们的。

Charisma, crisis, and the battle to lead New York through its most turbulent years.

魅力、危机以及带领纽约度过最动荡岁月的战斗。

When US inner cities erupted in violence in 1967, LBJ created a commission to investigate.

1967 年，当美国内城区爆发暴力事件时，林登·约翰逊成立了一个委员会进行调查。

LBJ tried to torpedo the official Kerner Commission record.

林登·约翰逊试图破坏克纳委员会的官方记录。

Instead it became a bestseller.

相反，它成为了畅销书。

There are over 300 PBS Stations across the country, with many sharing history right from their own backyard.

全国有 300 多个 PBS 电视台，其中许多电视台都在自家后院分享历史。

Check out more stories of racial injustice and resilence from Ohio, North Carolina, New York, California, Minnesota, Alabama and Wisconsin.

查看来自俄亥俄州、北卡罗来纳州、纽约州、加利福尼亚州、明尼苏达州、阿拉巴马州和威斯康星州的更多关于种族不公正和韧性的故事。

What do a long list of iconic and controversial historical events have in common?

一长串标志性且有争议的历史事件有什么共同点？

They all got the presidential commission treatment.

他们都得到了总统委员会的待遇。

When the city of Detroit went up in flames in 1967, it was the most deadly civil uprising of the century.

1967 年底特律市起火，这是本世纪最致命的民间起义。